The Super Bowl will not be broadcast in Native 4K

[retiredguy123]

Again this year, the Super Bowl will be broadcast in 1080p using 4K (2160p) upscaling. So, the picture quality will be basically the same as if you watched it in 1080p on a 4K TV with 4K upscaling. Bummer.

[Snakster66]

Again this year, the Super Bowl will be broadcast in 1080p using 4K (2160p) upscaling. So, the picture quality will be basically the same as if you watched it in 1080p on a 4K TV with 4K upscaling. Bummer.

It really is something. 4k TVs have been sold now for years amd years and there remains a dearth of actual true 4k content. This is why I find it amusing that for the last couple of years they have started selling 8k TVs. Absent some very specialized (and extremeley limited) content, there is absolutly nthing to watch in 8k.

Add the insult that what 4k content there MAY be available, some providers (I'm looking at you youtube TV) charge a premium to access it. It is no small fee and they have very little 4k content that they actually provide.

[jrref]

This is the way it is right now unfortunately. Many ask why do they upscale when most 4K TVs upscale? The reason is although most 4K TVs upscale, the TV's upscalling capability will vary. The more expensive the TV the better the upscalling capabilities. When the network upscales, your TV will have nothing or very little picture processing to do so everyone get's a "good" 4k image no matter which TV they have. They use this as an way to present the best possible video for those who are aware and to get you to pay extra for a special event like this. Just adds the the excitement.

Now, the next issue is although they are sending you a 4K video signal, do you have an app either on your TV or Streamer that can play the 4K video? Is the app you are using capable of 4K and are you paying for the 4K service if that's an option?

I saw this:
>>>>>
CBS says Paramount+ will offer a 1080p HD feed, but not 4K. This will certainly be a better picture than what most local CBS affiliates will provide, but it’s not 4K. (CBS affiliates broadcast live sports in 1080i HD, which is not as sharp and vivid as 1080p HD.)

That means the Super Bowl will only be available in 4K on special 4K channels provided by pay TV services such as DIRECTV, DIRECTV Stream, Optimum, Comcast, YouTube TV and Dish.
<<<<<
And note, you need the premium 4k paid service to see 4K on YouTubeTV which many don't subscribe to.

Because 4K resolution takes up so much more bandwidth than 720 or 1080P even though it's compressed, it's going to be a while before the technology is deployed to be more common place.

[Bill14564]

Again this year, the Super Bowl will be broadcast in 1080p using 4K (2160p) upscaling. So, the picture quality will be basically the same as if you watched it in 1080p on a 4K TV with 4K upscaling. Bummer.

If I read it correctly, it will be broadcast as a 4K signal.

What you seem to be saying is that the camera capturing the image will have 1080 resolution and the picture will then be upscaled to 4K before being broadcast.

I don't know if my TV will upscale a 1080 broadcast. My firestick and TV can display a 4K broadcast just as it can display a 1080 or 720 broadcast but I don't know that it has the capability to upscale from the lower resolution.

Chances are that TVs in most people's homes do not have the processing power to perform the same quality of upscaling as the broadcasters do. I can show a 1080 broadcast on a 70" screen. You can upscale that 1080 broadcast to 4K resolution on your 70" screen. The broadcasters (Fox in this case) will likely have processing equipment much more powerful than what is in your TV and can produce a better 4K signal from the 1080 camera than your TV could.

But since I have YouTubeTV and don't pay extra for 4K, none of this will affect my viewing.

[biker1]

If your TV is a 4K TV then it has an upscaler and will upscale any non-4K signal.

Your assumption that the networks have better 1080p to 4K upscaling capability than most TVs is probably a good one.

If you sit far enough from your TV, you probably can't tell the difference between a 1080p signal upscaled to 4K by your TV and a 4K signal upscaled by the network and then received by your TV.

If I read it correctly, it will be broadcast as a 4K signal.

What you seem to be saying is that the camera capturing the image will have 1080 resolution and the picture will then be upscaled to 4K before being broadcast.

I don't know if my TV will upscale a 1080 broadcast. My firestick and TV can display a 4K broadcast just as it can display a 1080 or 720 broadcast but I don't know that it has the capability to upscale from the lower resolution.

Chances are that TVs in most people's homes do not have the processing power to perform the same quality of upscaling as the broadcasters do. I can show a 1080 broadcast on a 70" screen. You can upscale that 1080 broadcast to 4K resolution on your 70" screen. The broadcasters (Fox in this case) will likely have processing equipment much more powerful than what is in your TV and can produce a better 4K signal from the 1080 camera than your TV could.

But since I have YouTubeTV and don't pay extra for 4K, none of this will affect my viewing.

[justjim]

Our tv is the old plasma. Has a great picture and it’s 15 years old. Yep, cost much more than the best of the new sets.? “If it’s not broke no need to upgrade IMH0”! But to each their own.

[kingofbeer]

Our tv is the old plasma. Has a great picture and it’s 15 years old. Yep, cost much more than the best of the new sets.? “If it’s not broke no need to upgrade IMH0”! But to each their own.
"Fox, which is broadcasting the Super Bowl on Sunday, February 9, 2025, at 6:30 p.m. ET, will stream a free 4K feed of the game on its free ads-supported streaming service, Tubi."

[jrref]

"Fox, which is broadcasting the Super Bowl on Sunday, February 9, 2025, at 6:30 p.m. ET, will stream a free 4K feed of the game on its free ads-supported streaming service, Tubi."

I just saw this! Tubi is where I’m watching the Super Bowl in 4k 👍

[GoRedSox!]

"Fox, which is broadcasting the Super Bowl on Sunday, February 9, 2025, at 6:30 p.m. ET, will stream a free 4K feed of the game on its free ads-supported streaming service, Tubi." This is where I intend to watch the game. I can't get 4k because YouTubeTV charges extra for that and I don't pay for that add-on. But Fox is trying to draw attention to Tubi, and putting the 4k feed there and so I can bypass YouTube TV and hopefully the picture will be better. I don't know enough about the feeds to know if Tubi is a native 4k or an upscaled 4k, but it should be better than YouTubeTV.

[retiredguy123]

This is where I intend to watch the game. I can't get 4k because YouTubeTV charges extra for that and I don't pay for that add-on. But Fox is trying to draw attention to Tubi, and putting the 4k feed there and so I can bypass YouTube TV and hopefully the picture will be better. I don't know enough about the feeds to know if Tubi is a native 4k or an upscaled 4k, but it should be better than YouTubeTV.
As I understand it, Fox will produce the only native signal, which will be 1080, and they will upscale it to 4K. Tubi cannot have a native 4K signal unless they use their own cameras to record the game live, which will not happen.

[Bill14564]

As I understand it, Fox will produce the only native signal, which will be 1080, and they will upscale it to 4K. Tubi cannot have a native 4K signal unless they use their own cameras to record the game live, which will not happen.

A 1080 signal upscaled to 4K will be a 4K signal when you receive it. It will be indistinguishable from "native" 4K when it enters your home.

[Topspinmo]

At my age I don’t really care cause I can’t see that good anyway. I brought expensive TV’s in pass and to me makes no difference and they don’t last as long anyway. I do know on thing I will Never buy LG product. But that me. Why you ask? Had large TVs in pass that was 3 to 4K price tag blew out 3 months after 2 years limited (very limited) warranty expired. Plus had several neighbors expensive LG refrigerators compressors go out less than 3 years with other problems also.

[Snakster66]

Our tv is the old plasma. Has a great picture and it’s 15 years old. Yep, cost much more than the best of the new sets.? “If it’s not broke no need to upgrade IMH0”! But to each their own.

100%. Plasmas are great

[biker1]

If you like it then hold onto it as plasma sets haven't been made in almost a decade.

Our tv is the old plasma. Has a great picture and it’s 15 years old. Yep, cost much more than the best of the new sets.? “If it’s not broke no need to upgrade IMH0”! But to each their own.

[biker1]

Maybe, it depends on visual acuity issues. For example, the size of the TV and how far you are sitting from it. Beyond a certain distance from the TV, you will not be able to discern the differences. However, a properly prepared, true 4K source has more information than a 1080p source upscaled to 4K. If you sat close enough to the TV you could see it. Say a couple of feet; where most of us don't sit ;-) This will be more of an issue when we all have 120" TVs, which may be sooner than you think.

A 1080 signal upscaled to 4K will be a 4K signal when you receive it. It will be indistinguishable from "native" 4K when it enters your home.

[Bill14564]

Maybe, it depends on visual acuity issues. For example, the size of the TV and how far you are sitting from it. Beyond a certain distance from the TV, you will not be able to discern the differences. However, a properly prepared, true 4K source has more information than a 1080p source upscaled to 4K. If you sat close enough to the TV you could see it. Say a couple of feet; where most of us don't sit ;-)

Sorry, wasn’t what I was getting at.

The quality of the picture, the information it contains will be less. The 4K signal itself, the rate, the structure, what the decoder inside the television cares about, will be a 4K signal.


The broadcast will transmit a native 4K signal. The signal being received at the television will be a native 4K signal. The image may be a 1080 image which was upscaled to a 4K image but that 4K image will be carried on a native 4K signal.

And yes, most people won’t see the difference between 1080 and 4K and really won’t see the difference when the 1080 image has been enhanced/upscaled to 4K.

[biker1]

Yes, I now understand where you were coming from, thanks.

Sorry, wasn’t what I was getting at.

The quality of the picture, the information it contains will be less. The 4K signal itself, the rate, the structure, what the decoder inside the television cares about, will be a 4K signal.


The broadcast will transmit a native 4K signal. The signal being received at the television will be a native 4K signal. The image may be a 1080 image which was upscaled to a 4K image but that 4K image will be carried on a native 4K signal.

And yes, most people won’t see the difference between 1080 and 4K and really won’t see the difference when the 1080 image has been enhanced/upscaled to 4K.

[Jerry101]

… for the love of God … it’s a football game!!! 🐣

[retiredguy123]

… for the love of God … it’s a football game!!! 🐣
I don't think anyone will argue that it is not a football game. But it is also one of the most watched TV shows of the year. It seems like they would use the latest cameras and broadcast technology.

[retiredguy123]

A 1080 signal upscaled to 4K will be a 4K signal when you receive it. It will be indistinguishable from "native" 4K when it enters your home.
Although you may be correct that "I" may not be able to see the difference, if you Google "native 4K vs upscaled 4K", almost every TV expert says that the native 4K signal produces a higher quality screen image than an upscaled 4K signal.

[Bill14564]

Although you may be correct that "I" may not be able to see the difference, if you Google "native 4K vs upscaled 4K", almost every TV expert says that the native 4K signal produces a higher quality screen image than an upscaled 4K signal.

You are arguing a different thing. You are using "signal" to mean content. I am using signal to mean the way the data is structured as it comes into your home.

I don't think anyone would argue that content captured on a 4K camera will produce a better screen image that content captured on a 1080 camera.

The upcoming superbowl might be captured on a 1080 camera but the 4K broadcast from Fox/Tubi will be transported on a 4K signal, exactly the same signal it would be transported on if it was captured on a 4K camera.

[retiredguy123]

You are arguing a different thing. You are using "signal" to mean content. I am using signal to mean the way the data is structured as it comes into your home.

I don't think anyone would argue that content captured on a 4K camera will produce a better screen image that content captured on a 1080 camera.

The upcoming superbowl might be captured on a 1080 camera but the 4K broadcast from Fox/Tubi will be transported on a 4K signal, exactly the same signal it would be transported on if it was captured on a 4K camera.
Not correct. The signal that Fox will produce will be an upscaled version of 4K, which will be made by interpolating the 1080 data and it will not be an exact reproduction of the live game. Almost every TV expert will tell you the signal produced by a native 4K signal is superior to an upscaled version of 4K, and definitely not the exact same signal. Here is just one expert opinion among many:

"Native 4K" refers to video content that was originally shot and produced in 4K resolution, while "upscaled 4K" means a lower resolution video (like 1080p) has been digitally enhanced to appear as 4K, resulting in a less detailed image even though the displayed resolution is the same; essentially, native 4K is considered significantly superior to upscaled 4K as it contains more inherent detail."

[Bill14564]

Not correct. The signal that Fox will produce will be an upscaled version of 4K, which will be made by interpolating the 1080 data and it will not be an exact reproduction of the live game. Almost every TV expert will tell you the signal produced by a native 4K signal is superior to an upscaled version of 4K, and definitely not the exact same signal. Here is just one expert opinion among many:

"Native 4K" refers to video content that was originally shot and produced in 4K resolution, while "upscaled 4K" means a lower resolution video (like 1080p) has been digitally enhanced to appear as 4K, resulting in a less detailed image even though the displayed resolution is the same; essentially, native 4K is considered significantly superior to upscaled 4K as it contains more inherent detail."

I've explained this four times now but you refuse to understand. Everyone else is tired of reading about it.

[retiredguy123]

I've explained this four times now but you refuse to understand. Everyone else is tired of reading about it.
I do understand it. Broadcasters use upscaled 4K as a cheap substitute for the real thing.

[jrref]

I do understand it. Broadcasters use upscaled 4K as a cheap substitute for the real thing.

The problem is with the cameras they use. The 4K high resolution camera are incredibly expensive and with technology today, they are not going to broadcast or stream in that resolution so you will see very little content at native 4K. Also, the facility, like the superbowl stadium probably has all 1080P camera and the associated infrastructure.

[retiredguy123]

The problem is with the cameras they use. The 4K high resolution camera are incredibly expensive and with technology today, they are not going to broadcast or stream in that resolution so you will see very little content at native 4K. Also, the facility, like the superbowl stadium probably has all 1080P camera and the associated infrastructure.
So, native 4K is the latest technology, but it is too expensive to use. Sad. One question I do have is, if you have an 8K TV, is the upscaled 8K picture better than the upscaled 4K picture?

[jrref]

So, native 4K is the latest technology, but it is too expensive to use. Sad. One question I do have is, if you have an 8K TV, is the upscaled 8K picture better than the upscaled 4K picture?

Not really which is why 8K TV has stalled. There is very little 8K content. But 8K TVs tend to have the best picture processing electronics which may make the picture quality "look" better.

[kkingston57]

Again this year, the Super Bowl will be broadcast in 1080p using 4K (2160p) upscaling. So, the picture quality will be basically the same as if you watched it in 1080p on a 4K TV with 4K upscaling. Bummer.

Bummer? Sarcasm? 99% of the people probably can not discern the difference. When HD TV;s 1s came out bought one for my father. Went to his house and noted that he was using the non HD channels. He claimed that they were OK. Showed him the difference and he claimed he did not see the difference. He was 80. We just bought an OLED TV. Straight on picture is very close to non OLED, Big difference is when watching it from an angle. In meantime demand for tickets at game have gone down. Another rapper as the half time show. Pass

[kkingston57]

100%. Plasmas are great

Had a plasma for 10+ years and loved it. Nothing close to them until OLED came out. THey are a little more expensive($1500 Sony 65) than others. Best picture for a person who sees the TV from an angle

[retiredguy123]

Had a plasma for 10+ years and loved it. Nothing close to them until OLED came out. THey are a little more expensive($1500 Sony 65) than others. Best picture for a person who sees the TV from an angle
I think that plasma TVs have become essentially obsolete because they cost more to make, they are heavier, and the picture is not as bright as an LED backlit screen. OLED TVs produce the best picture, but you need to be careful of screen burn-in, especially if you watch the same channel with a logo for hours at a time.