China Economy with Tariffs

[MorTech]

China cannot survive as a prosperous country without the *HUGE* USA consumer market. It is difficult to understand what they are doing as it appears to go beyond just "saving face".

Mercantilism works until it doesn't.

China (Xi) is in real trouble it seems. This tariff battle will be interesting. It will be very disruptive for awhile.

[Taltarzac725]

China cannot survive as a prosperous country without the *HUGE* USA consumer market. It is difficult to understand what they are doing as it appears to go beyond just "saving face".

Mercantilism works until it doesn't.

China (Xi) is in real trouble it seems. This tariff battle will be interesting. It will be very disruptive for awhile.

There was a former Professor who would come to the dog park near the Villages. He had taught English to a number of very bright Chinese students in various Chinese cities for a number of years. I got the impression from him that China was rather diverse in ethnic and religious groups. They are an incredibly strong country having been invaded a number of times and had a lot of civil wars. They will not back down easily. And are historically very used to suffering. And there still seems to be a certain willingness to sacrifice lifes.

On another note, the Professor liked to talk about the toilets over there and the very strange things he would sometimes eat in different parts of China. It would be a tough people who have to squat to poop and pee into a hole on the floor.

[Whatnext]

China cannot survive as a prosperous country without the *HUGE* USA consumer market. It is difficult to understand what they are doing as it appears to go beyond just "saving face".

Mercantilism works until it doesn't.

China (Xi) is in real trouble it seems. This tariff battle will be interesting. It will be very disruptive for awhile.
The question is: Can US survive in the short term without Chinese imports?

Chinese exports to the United States in 2024 accounted for 14.7% of its total exports. Still leaves them a healthy market.

[dewilson58]

The question is: Can US survive in the short term without Chinese imports?


Yes

The question is, do people want to stop purchasing the crap.

I quit years ago.

[Taltarzac725]

There was a former Professor who would come to the dog park near the Villages. He had taught English to a number of very bright Chinese students in various Chinese cities for a number of years. I got the impression from him that China was rather diverse in ethnic and religious groups. They are an incredibly strong country having been invaded a number of times and had a lot of civil wars. They will not back down easily. And are historically very used to suffering. And there still seems to be a certain willingness to sacrifice lifes.

On another note, the Professor liked to talk about the toilets over there and the very strange things he would sometimes eat in different parts of China. It would be a tough people who have to squat to poop and pee into a hole on the floor.

The Professor was very concerned about the human rights of the Uyghurs in China. They were in the news on-and-off.

[Topspinmo]

China cannot survive as a prosperous country without the *HUGE* USA consumer market. It is difficult to understand what they are doing as it appears to go beyond just "saving face".

Mercantilism works until it doesn't.

China (Xi) is in real trouble it seems. This tariff battle will be interesting. It will be very disruptive for awhile.

China elites don’t care about working population just like North Korea. They won’t suffer one bit. They got us over barrel and had over barrel for 30 plus years being the don’t recognize any international patent or trade marks laws. They brought most of the So called elected colleges in this country and seed students over here to steal take anything back to China.they know or elites can be easily manipulated.

[Topspinmo]

The Professor was very concerned about the human rights of the Uyghurs in China. They were in the news on-and-off.

Not concerned enough to stop and leave, thats’ problem they know the west is weak.

[jimjamuser]

China cannot survive as a prosperous country without the *HUGE* USA consumer market. It is difficult to understand what they are doing as it appears to go beyond just "saving face".

Mercantilism works until it doesn't.

China (Xi) is in real trouble it seems. This tariff battle will be interesting. It will be very disruptive for awhile.
The US, at 15%, is China's largest trading partner. They are probably rapidly looking for OTHER customers.

[Taltarzac725]

Not concerned enough to stop and leave, thats’ problem they know the west is weak.

The Professor was here when the Uyghurs were having problems and there are millions of these in China.

[fdpaq0580]

The US, at 15%, is China's largest trading partner. They are probably rapidly looking for OTHER customers.

I'm guessing they will find them.
And us? We just wanna P O everyone to show how tough we are. Problem is that they all know that we are a sheep in wolf's clothing. Friends and enemies. O M G (Oh My Goodness)

[Whatnext]

I would also add that the American market only represents 2% of China's GDP.
America is a lucrative market, and one the Chinese would hate to lose, but in the overall picture, they would survive if they lost it.
It's the penguins I feel sorry for. Where are they going to find the extra cash? .

[Arctic Fox]

China has always taken a long term view

There might be a little short term pain for them from temporarily losing sales to the USA, but in the long run it will look like a blip on a steadily rising line

We are addicted to cheap products from them and flip-flopping tariffs are not going to change that

[rustyp]

Yes

The question is, do people want to stop purchasing the crap.

I quit years ago.

When was the last time you purchased a battery ? Any kind of battery.

[dewilson58]

When was the last time you purchased a battery ? Any kind of battery.

Sorry I don't have in my diary the last purchase date.

Eveready and Energizer do manufacture in the USA and it's indicated on the packaging.
(they also make them in china.................jus look at the label)

:loco::loco::loco::loco:

[Normal]

It’s a curious relationship we have with Australia and Chinese imports. They too are trying to get away from importing garbage from China.

[rustyp]

Sorry I don't have in my diary the last purchase date.

Eveready and Energizer do manufacture in the USA and it's indicated on the packaging.
(they also make them in china.................jus look at the label)

:loco::loco::loco::loco:

And you looked at the label !:boom

next step - "JUS" look at Google ?

[Topspinmo]

China has always taken a long term view

There might be a little short term pain for them from temporarily losing sales to the USA, but in the long run it will look like a blip on a steadily rising line

We are addicted to cheap products from them and flip-flopping tariffs are not going to change that

Average consumers have no choice do to companies left decades ago with no penalties for near slave labor. As long as their pockets are lined they don’t care if China copied produce and sells it to world at 1/5 or more price as long as their pockets get filled.

[Caymus]

I doubt that anybody ever knows the true state of their economy. They devalue their currency routinely. Are they still building "Ghost Cities"?

[fdpaq0580]

Yes

The question is, do people want to stop purchasing the crap.

I quit years ago.

WOW! Impressive! And tracking down not only the lists of ingredients and their suppliers of each and every source of raw materials? Amazing! And to be absolutely certain that nothing you purchase flows cash back to China, do you even make sure the equipment, tools and tech of the companies you purchas from and the products are not from China? in whole or in part?
The mind boggles!

[Normal]

Average consumers have no choice do to companies left decades ago with no penalties for near slave labor. As long as their pockets are lined they don’t care if China copied produce and sells it to world at 1/5 or more price as long as their pockets get filled.

Buying Chinese goods is purchasing slave labor. Often work done here is the same. You are buying something maintained, made or built by illegal workers. The contractor or boss pays the workers 20- 50 bucks a day and pockets the rest made off their sweat. He or she is just stealing from them because of course they still charge the going rate for a job.

Many Chinese work for their 3 bucks an hour and their oligarchs and government just pocket the rest for themselves. It’s slavery, abuse and wrong in both cases.

[dewilson58]

WOW! Impressive! And tracking down not only the lists of ingredients and their suppliers of each and every source of raw materials? Amazing! And to be absolutely certain that nothing you purchase flows cash back to China, do you even make sure the equipment, tools and tech of the companies you purchas from and the products are not from China? in whole or in part?
The mind boggles!

Not impressive, I rely on labels. Probably not 100% accurate, but I've made a significant reduction.

Can't stand the idea of sending my money there, supporting their "government".

[fdpaq0580]

I doubt that anybody ever knows the true state of their economy. They devalue their currency routinely. Are they still building "Ghost Cities"?

I don't know, but a simple look at the populace could be a hint. If everybody seems happy, healthy, feel safe and secure, with good medical care, good educational opportunities, good jobs and has no worries about retirement, buying a home and they are content and at peace. That makes me think their economy is probably pretty good.
If, on the other hand, the poor, old, I'll are worried wondering where or if food, care, help is going to disappear, or the middle class are worried about their companies and jobs could be wiped out, savings stole, investments eaten up due to lack of stability in their country where even millionaires and billionaires can be destroyed on a whim. That country's economy is, imo, pretty shaky.
Then, again, we could just check the standard economic indicators. They have been pretty reliable.

[fdpaq0580]

Not impressive, I rely on labels. Probably not 100% accurate, but I've made a significant reduction.

Can't stand the idea of sending my money there, supporting their "government".

Still impressed. I'm like you. Not a fan of any oppressive regime. I do what I can, but reality and practicality sometimes get in the way.

[bopat]

China seems to have one advantage, they're cheap. But the quality....usually totally crap. Just try using tools from harbor freight for more than one job, they disintegrate as you use them! Not the same as craftsman tools from decades ago, I have a bunch of those, still work great!

[MorTech]

The US, at 15%, is China's largest trading partner. They are probably rapidly looking for OTHER customers.

Yes but almost all other customers are fellow Mercantilist (aka, Fascist) high-tariff export states. It is just laughable that EU and China want closer trade since both are Mercantalist and China supports Russia...Same with Canada which is just another British colony. The CCP is communist in name only...They went from Communism to Mercantilism/Fascism when Mao died.

The USA tariff threats are going to force Mercantilist countries into becoming open and free capitalist markets with more production/consumption balance like the USA. China has a big problem with RMB capital controls and huge debt that they just can't win.

Interesting seems like an understatement.

[Jensor17]

China cannot survive as a prosperous country without the *HUGE* USA consumer market. It is difficult to understand what they are doing as it appears to go beyond just "saving face".

Mercantilism works until it doesn't.

China (Xi) is in real trouble it seems. This tariff battle will be interesting. It will be very disruptive for awhile.

They will back down if Trump refuses. China needs USA BUSINESS. we need tiny things from them like parts for toilet repair or appliance repair. TROUBLE IS THERE GOODS ARE INCONSISTENT AND MADE TO BREAK DOWN . example the toilet bowl float I had three different sizes for the exact same item for my toilet. You could order parts for a washing machine with one item number and get three different sizes. Their clothing is cut very small. For instance TEMU sells stuff in American women sizes that wouldn’t fit a 12 year old.skinny girl !

[SoCalGal]

Yes. The question is, do people want to stop purchasing the crap. I quit years ago.

Remember the positive propaganda the government used to turn out?

"Only you can prevent forest fires."
"Don't be a litterbug."
"This is your brain. This is your brain on drugs."

The government needs to churn out PSAs [public service announcement] to encourage Americans to buy American.

"Keep jobs at home—buy American!"
"Made in the USA: Your choice, our future."
"Support your neighbor—pick American-made!"
"Buy local, build America strong."
"American hands, American brands—choose wisely!"

It's time Americans stood up for themselves and kicked China to the curb, starting with confiscating American farmland purchased by the Chinese. Approximately 350,000 to 400,000 acres of U.S. farmland is owned by Chinese entities, sometimes tied to the Chinese Communist Party, up 82% over 3 years.

While it's true that Canada and European countries own far more, they don't target farmland near U.S. military bases as China does.

Understanding China's Farmland Ownership Near US Military Bases (https://www.mrctv.org/blog/nick-kangadis/dr-phil-tells-joe-rogan-chinese-owned-us-farmland-around-us-military)

[Rocksnap]

Remember the positive propaganda the government used to turn out?

"Only you can prevent forest fires."
"Don't be a litterbug."
"This is your brain. This is your brain on drugs."

The government needs to churn out PSAs [public service announcement] to encourage Americans to buy American.

"Keep jobs at home—buy American!"
"Made in the USA: Your choice, our future."
"Support your neighbor—pick American-made!"
"Buy local, build America strong."
"American hands, American brands—choose wisely!"

It's time Americans stood up for themselves and kicked China to the curb, starting with confiscating American farmland purchased by the Chinese. Approximately 350,000 to 400,000 acres of U.S. farmland is owned by Chinese entities, sometimes tied to the Chinese Communist Party, up 82% over 3 years.

While it's true that Canada and European countries own far more, they don't target farmland near U.S. military bases as China does.

Understanding China's Farmland Ownership Near US Military Bases (https://www.mrctv.org/blog/nick-kangadis/dr-phil-tells-joe-rogan-chinese-owned-us-farmland-around-us-military)

Trouble is, our elected officials have been selling out the U.S. for decades. I’m no economics major, but I’ve been screaming about all our manufacturing jobs being sent over to China. All or our POTUS have done so, for decades. Up till recently, as we know. So how can this humble guy with an average education have figured all this out, long ago? It’s not rocket science, that’s how. Trust no one, question everything!

[skarra]

Trouble is, our elected officials have been selling out the U.S. for decades. I’m no economics major, but I’ve been screaming about all our manufacturing jobs being sent over to China. All or our POTUS have done so, for decades. Up till recently, as we know. So how can this humble guy with an average education have figured all this out, long ago? It’s not rocket science, that’s how. Trust no one, question everything!


We're addicted to cheap stuff.

Bring back those cheap, "slave-labor" jobs is going to make us great again (?)

We're the richest people in the world, so really - what is the problem - we want more??

We have damaged relations with every country in the world so far this year. We have given China a gift in all the soft power they now have. The U.S can no longer be counted on, and new relationships will be built without us. We will continue to build walls, and they will be building bridges.

We're in a very bad place right now. It's not clear that US democracy will survive.

[rustyp]

I looked up every major purchase I made over $25 in 2024 from Amazon. I compared the price today. On average over 10% increase. Very few items had the price remain the same. Underwear - exact same brand. Same vendor.etc. + 34%.

[TheSerg]

There was a former Professor who would come to the dog park near the Villages. He had taught English to a number of very bright Chinese students in various Chinese cities for a number of years. I got the impression from him that China was rather diverse in ethnic and religious groups. They are an incredibly strong country having been invaded a number of times and had a lot of civil wars. They will not back down easily. And are historically very used to suffering. And there still seems to be a certain willingness to sacrifice lifes.

On another note, the Professor liked to talk about the toilets over there and the very strange things he would sometimes eat in different parts of China. It would be a tough people who have to squat to poop and pee into a hole on the floor.


I wholeheartedly agree, you cannot under the Chinese people.

[Caymus]

We're addicted to cheap stuff.

Bring back those cheap, "slave-labor" jobs is going to make us great again (?)

We're the richest people in the world, so really - what is the problem - we want more??

We have damaged relations with every country in the world so far this year. We have given China a gift in all the soft power they now have. The U.S can no longer be counted on, and new relationships will be built without us. We will continue to build walls, and they will be building bridges.

We're in a very bad place right now. It's not clear that US democracy will survive.

...and how many legal citizens and leaving for better countries????

[mraines]

There was a former Professor who would come to the dog park near the Villages. He had taught English to a number of very bright Chinese students in various Chinese cities for a number of years. I got the impression from him that China was rather diverse in ethnic and religious groups. They are an incredibly strong country having been invaded a number of times and had a lot of civil wars. They will not back down easily. And are historically very used to suffering. And there still seems to be a certain willingness to sacrifice lifes.

On another note, the Professor liked to talk about the toilets over there and the very strange things he would sometimes eat in different parts of China. It would be a tough people who have to squat to poop and pee into a hole on the floor.

That is the way that many people go in various parts of the world. It is the natural way. I remember a visit to Paris and in the restroom was a beautifully tiled area with a hole in the ground for a "toilet".