Why do we become so intolerant as we age?

[redwitch]

I've noticed this here and throughout TV. I hate when people start name-calling or denigrating someone because someone has a different viewpoint. I always thought that as people age, they would become more tolerant of others. They've made mistakes and should understand others will, too. They did stupid things when young and should help youth grow, not condemn youth for growing up and being different. I don't get it.

It seems that some think that getting old gives them the right to be downright rude. They're mean to store clerks. They yell at someone who gets in their way or goes too slow for their tastes. I don't get it.

I have Asperger's (high-functioning autism). I have a tendency to blurt out what I think but I do try to not be hateful or hurtful. I don't judge you for having different political views than I do. I do judge your words and actions. If you accuse someone of "pandering" because they have a different opinion than you, you lose my respect. If you can't understand that even a professional can muck up a song out of nerves, you appear to have a mean streak. If you berate the checker at the grocery store for not being to accept your coupon, you appear overbearing and rude. If you honk because someone isn't moving fast enough for you, you appear arrogant and impatient. If you put down teens because they hang around the Squares in groups, don't dress like you think they should, play music you don't like, then you appear small-minded.

Why is it so hard to let others be different from you as you age? So what if I don't share your political viewpoint? So what if I like happen to like rap music and you don't? So what if someone isn't as fast as you? Why is it okay for you to say what you think and feel, but not someone else? What happened to respect, tolerance? I really don't get it.

[graciegirl]

that this problem is because we build our life to suit us and surround ourselves with people and places that fit in. For instance if we are church goers, we see a lot of like minded people on a regular basis. If we are active in a political party, than of course we have those folks who agree with us.

We begin to believe that most people are on the same wave lengths as us and another thing that makes us intolerant of situations that young people are more tolerant of is that we see the same mistakes being made year after year and decade after decade. We sort of say to ourselves, I think I know how THIS is going to turn out.

The young are full of hope and dreams and will wade in to almost impossible situations hoping to make them better. Most of us have done that and maybe did change the world too, but many of us have seen that the problems we wish we could solve are about the same. Young people think that we might be able to establish peace in the world. We have seen this is NOT the case and we are pretty sure who is causing the problems. (We may not agree with each other on that, but we are pretty sure, none the less)

We have thought it through, time and time again and we have made up our minds that some groups of folks just aren't doing it right.

It never, EVER occurs to any of us that WE might be wrong.

[redwitch]

But why does that give us the right to be rude, mean-spirited, downright beligerent?

Gracie, a lot of what you say makes sense and helps me to understand it a little, but it really saddens me that we're that way. I still think we should be more accepting, tolerant instead of closing up and shutting down the way so many of us do. (Glad there are folks like you who do let others think and feel differently. It would be a truly awful world without you and your kind.)

[pooh]

Today's Non Sequitur from the comics......

http://www.gocomics.com/nonsequitur/

[Avista]

I've noticed this here and throughout TV. I hate when people start name-calling or denigrating someone because someone has a different viewpoint. I always thought that as people age, they would become more tolerant of others. They've made mistakes and should understand others will, too. They did stupid things when young and should help youth grow, not condemn youth for growing up and being different. I don't get it.



It seems that some think that getting old gives them the right to be downright rude. They're mean to store clerks. They yell at someone who gets in their way or goes too slow for their tastes. I don't get it.

I have Asperger's (high-functioning autism). I have a tendency to blurt out what I think but I do try to not be hateful or hurtful. I don't judge you for having different political views than I do. I do judge your words and actions. If you accuse someone of "pandering" because they have a different opinion than you, you lose my respect. If you can't understand that even a professional can muck up a song out of nerves, you appear to have a mean streak. If you berate the checker at the grocery store for not being to accept your coupon, you appear overbearing and rude. If you honk because someone isn't moving fast enough for you, you appear arrogant and impatient. If you put down teens because they hang around the Squares in groups, don't dress like you think they should, play music you don't like, then you appear small-minded.

Why is it so hard to let others be different from you as you age? So what if I don't share your political viewpoint? So what if I like happen to like rap music and you don't? So what if someone isn't as fast as you? Why is it okay for you to say what you think and feel, but not someone else? What happened to respect, tolerance? I really don't get it.

Well said, Red!:thumbup:

[lightworker888]

I figure that as long as anyone sees life as black/white, right.wrong, they will always think of others as us/them. If we keep our ideas categorized in boxes then it does make life and our responses easier and as we get older, perhaps this process makes our daily living easier in some respects. We don't have to "decide" or "think about" what drives our choices.

The word "tolerance" is often used in these kinds of discussions, and I guess that is a first step, but it feels to me like tolerating is really just "putting up with" which really doesn't get us out of the us/them paradigm.

If we could move to a paradigm that saw us all as equal at the core, with each of us expressing ourselves in our own unique way, perhaps we could appreciate each person as the unique expression of human being that s/he is. And I think that at our core, on some level, we probably all think we are doing that....well perhaps not all LOL.

I'll get off my soap box now before this gets too heavy. Good qustion, Redwitch and thanks for asking and giving me something to consider, especially when I watch the young people in positions of authority......who seem to be getting younger daily.

LW888

[jebartle]

:1rotfl::clap2::1rotfl:


Today's Non Sequitur from the comics......

http://www.gocomics.com/nonsequitur/

[jebartle]

I would only add that sometimes geography might answer this conundrum..
Lack of tolerance and patience due to a faster pace of life style brings out the beast in some of us (Not an excuse just an opinion)....An overused cliche, but "Life is short", why not stop and smell the roses and be a good boy and girl, who knows maybe a random act of kindness might infect this "frumpy" old fart and metamorphose into a "Gracie-girl"...We can only hope!





I figure that as long as anyone sees life as black/white, right.wrong, they will always think of others as us/them. If we keep our ideas categorized in boxes then it does make life and our responses easier and as we get older, perhaps this process makes our daily living easier in some respects. We don't have to "decide" or "think about" what drives our choices.

The word "tolerance" is often used in these kinds of discussions, and I guess that is a first step, but it feels to me like tolerating is really just "putting up with" which really doesn't get us out of the us/them paradigm.

If we could move to a paradigm that saw us all as equal at the core, with each of us expressing ourselves in our own unique way, perhaps we could appreciate each person as the unique expression of human being that s/he is. And I think that at our core, on some level, we probably all think we are doing that....well perhaps not all LOL.

I'll get off my soap box now before this gets too heavy. Good qustion, Redwitch and thanks for asking and giving me something to consider, especially when I watch the young people in positions of authority......who seem to be getting younger daily.

LW888

[Uptown Girl]

Pooh,
That cartoon really made my day!
Personally, my journey has been about learning to allow people to think, do and be, even if I think it's ass backward. I used spend a lot of energy attempting to EDUCATE them, soothe them, HEAL them somehow. (in my foolish youth) In later years tried to learn to simply TOLERATE them, (worked for them but not me, my solar plexis was in havoc most often!)
Now I realize that my personal harmonics are more important to me and more worthy of my time and attention than dealing with THEIR dramas, so I turn my attention and energy to thoughts and things that please, and surprisingly, I encounter less and less of that disharmony. People who behave badly seem to gravitate somewhere else.... not in my experience.

The contrast has served to show me what I want in my daily life. May sound like I'm putting my head in the sand, but I keep remembering that all have free will and I realized if my free will is to be happy, who am I to tell someone they can't have the free will to be miserable?
I just choose not to 'dance' with them.
So, be of good cheer. Your happiness is your own, unless you give it away.

[bluedog103]

Red there seem to be alot of angry people here. I've noticed it too many times.
If you start a conversation people are usually friendly and polite but other times it seems that by their actions and even the expressions on their faces many people have alot on their minds. Perhaps it's the aging process we're all going through, maybe it's physical ailments that are unseen. In any case, in this place of near paradise, you'd think the populace would be happy. Unfortunately that isn't the case for too many people. Too bad. This is about as good as it's going to get.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

.......So what if I like happen to like rap music and you don't?........

Wow! I didn't know you liked rap music, red!! :shocked: :icon_wink:

Good post - and many good replies by others. I wish I had the answer(s).

I've got my opinions/thoughts/insights/perspectives/etc. on things - everyone does. But I'll never force them on anybody. And most of the time, I'll never really voice them. Those who know me well have insight on those types of things without ever having directly discussed them. You pick up on things just by being around a person enough. Sure, I'll offer them as input and hope they're interpreted as such. But I'll usually distance myself from people who are generally negative or continually overly opinionated (to the point that discussions of any depth can wind up as arguments). I guess I'm not cut out to be much of a debater!! :) To quote Rodney King: ".....can we all get along?" That's what I usually try to do.

Bill

[Jhooman]

Good morning friends in The Villages.

Here I sit in my lovely home that is on the market, hopefully it sells quickly so I can join you in The Villages. Here comes another Californian.

Redwitch I love your posts. You show compassion, understanding, tolerance and non judgment in your posts and I thank you.

In Jan I turned 60 and for some reason I experienced much reflection of my life and the lives of those I have encountered currently and from the past. This past year has been a difficult year for our family. My little grandson was born prematurely, had a hole in his heart, spent the first six weeks of his life in ICU, had his first open heart surgery at four weeks of age. When the little guy was eight months old he had his second open heart to repair the hole in his heart. Needless to say it has been a heck of a year. My ex husband who is Muslim, leftists, arrogant, chauvinist, opinionated and just darn different was in the picture during our grandsons surgical procedures. Obviously not my favorite person on this earth. However, he has his good points, hard worker, tax payer, loves his child and grandson.

There were times that my ex shared his political views, I knew that he was feeling scared and insecure about his grandson being hospitalized, talking politics was easy for him to feel empowered in a situation that he had no power. What I do when I encounter difficult people who are intolerant, bitter, angry, controllers or just miserable humans. I thank my lucky stars that I'm not them and hopefully I can use them as an example of what I don't want to be. I'm not perfect either folks.

They say as we grow older the road becomes more narrow. It's my opinion the road broadens, I have been given so many choices and an abundant life. I want to think outside the box, I want to feel and experience this marvelous life on earth.

With our decision to move to Florida, many people have been negative about our move. I find their judgment entertaining and comical. Im just amazed by their negativity and their need to place their value of life on me. I simply ignore their opinions and roll my eyes sometimes internally and externally. I'm so excited about my broad highway of life. I'm looking forward to playing golf, dancing in the squares with abandon, water volleyball and making new friends in The Villages.

I'm off this morning to watch my little grandson in his music class. I'm going to be a one year old too.

[lightworker888]

That's the way it works. When you move in harmony, harmony becomes the way of your world and the ones that are not in that "song" seem to go elsewhere. They are in their own "song" and have their own "harmonics" with them. That's a great metaphor and really explains "The Law of Attraction" which has become more mainstream of late. Sounds like our "songs" are in harmony. Maybe there is a bigger choir out there than we know in TV. Maybe we should start a club LOL. In fact I believe that there are a few already going that are singing the same tune or something similar. But enough of this singing, I'm looking forward to the dancing when I get back in April!

LW888

[redwitch]

Thank you all for your replies. I can't say I quite understand, yet, but it's given me some food for thought.

I'm one of those who has to state her opinion. Couldn't stop myself if I tried. It is a part of me, my core nature. I don't try to shove it in someone's face, I just let you know what I think. (Don't ever ask me if I like what you're wearing -- if I don't, I will tell you.)

Sometimes it is hard to live in a community where I see and hear people call others a name because their opinion is different. I'll be the one in the middle butting in and trying to stop the namecalling. I HATE it!!!! I hate blatent rudeness. I hate when someone acts like they're better than someone else because they think they have more. I LOATHE bullies in all forms.

I love TOTV and the people here. However, when people start getting mean, I don't get it. I used to enjoy the Political Forum. We'd get our viewpoints out with a lot of humor and fun thrown in. Then, it just became mean. The comments against Obama were over the top. The remarks against Palin made little sense. I left that forum and have not missed it. Occasionally, someone forgets these forums are not the political forum and acts as if it is. The namecalling starts. The pettiness is non-stop. The meanness is painful.

I love TV, the generosity of the people here, the willingness to laugh at one self, all of it. But, I've seen some of the meanest people I've ever been around here. If you don't agree with their religious, political, social beliefs, you're absolute slime and they let you know it. I find these people to be very small and I truly feel sorry for them, but I don't understand them at all.

I try to let my world grow. It was always a very black and white world (Aspies are that way -- there's right and there's not right and you have to correct the not right.) I'm learning there are grays everywhere. I can't say that I embrace the grays, but at least I understand they exist.

And, Bill, yes, I like rap. Actually, I love rap. When Jess was about 12, she got into emo music. I don't handle emotions well (again, an Aspie trait) and I found the music to be poppish, syrupy drivel. To get her away from it, I introduced her to rap. I taught her the history of the music; what the lyrics meant, the good and the bad of those lyric;, where a curse word was used to be effective and have meaning, where it was used just because the rapper could. I also love jazz, classical, tenors singing opera and I used to love the oldies, but TV OD'd me on that one. My favorite music is blues.

I have people in TV I consider my friends. I accept them as they are -- my sweet, innocent angel lover; my angry, hurt ex-military wife; my "leader of the pack" (always giving, always accepting, always kind); my man-hunting, goofy buddy; my friend who thinks God is the answer to all problems and tries to steer everyone to her church; my buddy who truly accepts everyone into his group and has the patience of at least 3 saints with Ghandi thrown in for good measure; even my ultra-conservative neighbor with the heart of gold. I don't try to change them. I accept and love them for who they are. So, if I can do it with a true affliction that makes it even harder for me to understand emotions, why is it so hard for a "normal" to accept others without being mean? See, I still don't get it. lol

[Another 65er]

Regardless of our age, we tend to judge ourselves by our intentions and we judge others by their actions.

Once we realize that, we becoe more thoughtful and tolerant.

[pooh]

You are a caring person, Red and an asset to TOTV, your friends, your family, The Villages... :)

[downeaster]

I think the road to rudeness starts out at an early age. As we get older we get bolder and maybe think we can push people around a little. Those people we push usually are waiters, waitresses, grocery store cashiers, airline ticket agents, etc.
I have, on occasion and in the past, been rude. I have also been the victim of rudeness. Some of the same people I mention above can be rude. When they are I simply say" are you always this churlish or have I done something to offend you?". Another response is give them a big smile and thank them for their help and wish them a nice day.
As to my rudeness, I have learned to hold my tongue. Sometimes dealing with a
rep on the phone after a long list of robotic menu selections I tend to be a little testy. I explain to the rep I may be frustrated but I am sure he/she can solve my problem.
I also believe rudeness breeds rudeness. That is borne out on this forum.

[jebartle]

"atta girl" for giving us all thoughts to ponder....I would LOVE for the political forum to read this....We are all just mere mortals with a great opportunity to make our golden years the BEST

[rjm1cc]

I hope they are forgetting their manors as they get older. But then maybe they never had them. I agree with the idea behind your post that people should be civil to each other and enjoy different points of view.
The only reason I can see a change in what we say as we age is that we are more financially independent. For example you take a part time job because you want to be out meeting people and not that you need the money. Then you boss tells you that you have to do ABC in your job and you think that is unprofessional. At this stage of live you can politely tell the boss why you disagree and if you can not resolve then you can simply give notice and resign. Still no need for name calling etc.

[chuckster]

Always enjoy your posts Red as well as Gracie's. You are both sensitive to others and "down to earth".

My philosophy has always been to treat others as I would like to be treated, with patience, kindness, understanding and a smile. That's not to say that I have never been tested but it has made my life enjoyable.

[TrudyM]

I think that there may be as many causes for rudeness as there are people:
A main one - I agree with downeaster – prejudice (and any assumption of superiority based on casual contact is a form of prejudice) starts early and hate is like a cancer it grows and feeds itself, and those infected in youth can be completely consumed by the time they reach village age. My mama use to say people rarely change they just get more so..
It is not just the villages in the past couple of years people seem to have gotten rude or at the least self-absorbed to the point of rudeness.
I think a possible cause is fear and frustration; that leads to an overall grumpy bad tempered state that I am seeing allot of in the past couple of years. The world is changing so fast and people feel that nothing is safe, sure or predictable. This is in my opinion creating a nervous, scared, feeling in allot of people. They see pensions go away, the value of what they worked hard for diminish. I haven’t met anyone who feels that their job is secure, not even those at the top of their profession earning good money. If it isn’t affecting them directly, it probably has some close friend or family member. I believe it is this “who knows what tomorrow will bring” nothing is for sure feeling that is affecting a lot of people at the core. When people are scared they get defensive and mean. They think -It isn’t my fault I did everything right so it must be someone else’s fault- that someone else being anyone they don’t identify with.

Maybe the Seattle drizzle is just making me maudlin.

[Whalen]

TrudyM,

I have to agree with your Mama.

"My mama use to say people rarely change they just get more so.."

I really don't think people "become" rude, they were always rude.
Age simply gives them license to be more so.

[redwitch]

It's not the rudeness per se that bothers me. It's the absolute lack of tolerance for those that think, feel or act differently. I really don't get why it is that way. It would seem that it would be the exact opposite -- the older we get, the more accepting of others we get -- rather than the way it is.

Are we so afraid of change as we age? It is really because we've seen it happen over and over? I don't know. I just know that calling someone a name because they disagree with you is wrong. When you get upset because someone's nerves made them forget a line in a song just doesn't feel right to me. There just have been a lot of mean-spirited replies lately -- both here and in real life.

I just hope and pray I never get that way -- heck, I'm bad enough in my own way without having age make me worse.

[billethkid]

to be given for being rude.
As has been said already it is not a function of age.
And once again as usual the majority that are not rude are scooped up in the always generalized category.
Reality? Some people are rude...most are not....some of those rude people are "old(er)"....most elders are not!

How about the rudeness of SOME younger people? I personally believe they far out number the some older people.....since they start out with a base persona of believing rude = cool....which it does not.

btk

[graciegirl]

I think that a person is born with a certain personality. A person born truly shy never completely feels 100 percent comfortable in a social situation.

I think that some people are born seeing the glass half empty and I would like for them to keep away from me.

Life is pretty equal in dealing out trials and tribulations, worries and heartbreaks and some people can continue after they have been hit with them better than others.

I do feel if you were blessed with parents who taught you nice manners and politeness is just learning to think of others first and behave kindly, if you were taught that, than you have learned to hold your tongue and learned that people are not interested in you for very long if you are dour and grumpy and judgmental and picky and out for a fight all of the time.

But...sometimes you just have to get a group of girls together and beat the livin' crap outa somebody. It works for me.:D

[JenAjd]

Environment....the people we grow up with is where we learn or manners or lack there-of. There "might" be an attitude also of entitlement...or a "me first" mentality and "I don't want you to get more than me!" I believe it has to do with the character of a person. Kindness is the opposite and if you have it, it will flow out of you.
Just my opinion!!!
As someone else stated here...my mother also used to tell us kids that our "negative" behaviors will just grow worse with age so be aware of that and nip it in the bud now while you're young and "CULTIVATE" a better attitude or behavior!! It is so true. For instance I see in the elderly sometimes "outspokedness"...and some of that comes from NOT having a "filture" (another person whose close) who might put their hand out and say "that isn't appropriate". I see grown people who may not quite be elderly expressing themselves in ways that to me is totally embarrassing....profanity, gestures, abruptness and worse. It really reminds me of toddlers in a nursery except maybe they don't yet know how to swear but hitting and screaming and plopping on the floor would be a reflection of this. Adults that react in this manner are just doing what was modeled to them.

[duffysmom]

But...sometimes you just have to get a group of girls together and beat the livin' crap outa somebody. It works for me.:D

GG you are so funny and loving. Maybe you should consider giving a seminar on being kind and considerate. Not only have you opened you heart to everyone, you open you lovely home.

I believe what old Abe said, you are only as happy as you make up your mind to be. Actually I'm constantly amazed at how giving TV'ers are and see very few mean spirited people. Sometimes people are grumpy:grumpy: but so what, I haven't walked in their shoes, I'm too busy being grateful for my shoes. I've found that I'm powerless over people; actually the only power I possess is over my own attitude. I find tremendous freedom in this knowledge.

[Irish Rover]

Red, you have been on this site for a long time as I have I. I think you have seen the posts that basically say "my age entitles me to be rude and have the opinion I want to have because of my age - rude or otherwise". You have been a strong voice of reason as has " Village kahuna" who I haven't seen for a long time. The postings on this site have really changed over the years as have the people in TV. Try to get through an intersection or in or out of a parking space - wow. Go to a store and get beat up oin the check out line - it's different. I still love the place but I only have to hang in for three months at a time. I'll get berbally beay up for this response but so be it.
Irish:thumbup:

[skyguy79]

But...sometimes you just have to get a group of girls together and beat the livin' crap outa somebody. It works for me.:DYou looking for any male volunteers Gracie? :1rotfl:

[Pturner]

GG you are so funny and loving. Maybe you should consider giving a seminar on being kind and considerate. Not only have you opened you heart to everyone, you open you lovely home.

I believe what old Abe said, you are only as happy as you make up your mind to be. Actually I'm constantly amazed at how giving TV'ers are and see very few mean spirited people. Sometimes people are grumpy:grumpy: but so what, I haven't walked in their shoes, I'm too busy being grateful for my shoes. I've found that I'm powerless over people; actually the only power I possess is over my own attitude. I find tremendous freedom in this knowledge.

Well said. All of it. About Gracie. About how giving TV'ers are. About the grumps and meanies still being few and far between here. About happiness being a choice.

Happiness, kindness and respect for others are gifts we give to both ourselves and others. We need to...

"Just remember, in the winter, far beneath the bitter snow, lies the seed that with the sun's love, in the Spring,

becomes the rose"!

[K9-Lovers]

When you don't feel physically well, you might be grumpy.
When you don't feel emotionally well, you may lash out at others.
When you don't feel spiritually well, you are never satisfied.
If you don't feel mentally well, your moods can be exceptionally unpredictable.

So when I encounter grumps, meanies, indifference, intolerance or purposeful rudeness, then I assume one of the above applies. In these cases, I try my best to be extra sensitive, caring and calm. Either it works or not. When not, at least I didn't add to that person's burden.

[skyguy79]

When you don't feel physically well, you might be grumpy.
When you don't feel emotionally well, you may lash out at others.
When you don't feel spiritually well, you are never satisfied.
If you don't feel mentally well, your moods can be exceptionally unpredictable.

So when I encounter grumps, meanies, indifference, intolerance or purposeful rudeness, then I assume one of the above applies. In these cases, I try my best to be extra sensitive, caring and calm. Either it works or not. When not, at least I didn't add to that person's burden.K9, the four points you've made is exactly what I was trying to convey in another thread a few days ago which later proved to be an exercise in futility. The only real difference is that you stated it more elequently that I ever could. A poster asked this question: "So why is their (the grumps) bad behavior to be tolerated and accepted?" When I answered... well, just read my answer and the reaction for yourself to find out what I'm talking about by clicking this link... #45 (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/showpost.php?p=328256&postcount=45)

[Uptown Girl]

I mentioned this topic to my Hubby and he simply said,
"Why would you want to give unpleasant people free rent in your head?"
(He's my Hero.)

[Jhooman]

I mentioned this topic to my Hubby and he simply said,
"Why would you want to give unpleasant people free rent in your head?"
(He's my Hero.)
Fabulous concept. Thank you!

[pooh]

I mentioned this topic to my Hubby and he simply said,
"Why would you want to give unpleasant people free rent in your head?"
(He's my Hero.)

That's great and something to remember! Thank hubby for me.

[graciegirl]

I love you dearly P.







Since that stopped the dialogue...


I will again ask.

Why do we become more intolerant as we age?

[Vinny]

I've noticed this here and throughout TV. I hate when people start name-calling or denigrating someone because someone has a different viewpoint. I always thought that as people age, they would become more tolerant of others. They've made mistakes and should understand others will, too. They did stupid things when young and should help youth grow, not condemn youth for growing up and being different. I don't get it.

It seems that some think that getting old gives them the right to be downright rude. They're mean to store clerks. They yell at someone who gets in their way or goes too slow for their tastes. I don't get it.

I have Asperger's (high-functioning autism). I have a tendency to blurt out what I think but I do try to not be hateful or hurtful. I don't judge you for having different political views than I do. I do judge your words and actions. If you accuse someone of "pandering" because they have a different opinion than you, you lose my respect. If you can't understand that even a professional can muck up a song out of nerves, you appear to have a mean streak. If you berate the checker at the grocery store for not being to accept your coupon, you appear overbearing and rude. If you honk because someone isn't moving fast enough for you, you appear arrogant and impatient. If you put down teens because they hang around the Squares in groups, don't dress like you think they should, play music you don't like, then you appear small-minded.

Why is it so hard to let others be different from you as you age? So what if I don't share your political viewpoint? So what if I like happen to like rap music and you don't? So what if someone isn't as fast as you? Why is it okay for you to say what you think and feel, but not someone else? What happened to respect, tolerance? I really don't get it.

Gosh, I really hate posts like this. :jester:

[K9-Lovers]

When you don't feel physically well, you might be grumpy.
When you don't feel emotionally well, you may lash out at others.
When you don't feel spiritually well, you are never satisfied.
If you don't feel mentally well, your moods can be exceptionally unpredictable.

So when I encounter grumps, meanies, indifference, intolerance or purposeful rudeness, then I assume one of the above applies. In these cases, I try my best to be extra sensitive, caring and calm. Either it works or not. When not, at least I didn't add to that person's burden.

Gracie and Red,

I think some people become more intolerant as they age because it is likely that they don't feel well physically, emotionally, spiritually, or mentally. They've lived long enough to endure the bumps, jabs, punches and slaps life sometimes doles out, and so some older people are "injured". When you don't feel well, you may respond in a negative way.

Others have not endured as many hard times, and those folks behave in a more positive manner.

And, I agree with you that being optimistic or pessimistic is an in-born trait. So it comes down to the age-old debate = nature vs nurture.

Either
- you are born with a positive nature and stay that way no matter what (nature), or,
- You used to be more positive but life beat you down, (nurture) or,
- You were always a negative thinker, don't realize it, and don't know how to be or act any other way (nature),
- You were born a pessimist but learned how to look on the bright side (nurture).

To me, the question is: How do we choose to respond when someone is intolerant?

[barb1191]

To me, the question is: How do we choose to respond when someone is intolerant?

Any emotional response would be giving too much power to the intolerant one in which they knowingly control your feelings.

Simply nod yes or no with no reaction to the intolerant one leaves them powerless over you.

It's called self-control and is all powerful.

[2BNTV]

I've noticed this here and throughout TV. I hate when people start name-calling or denigrating someone because someone has a different viewpoint. I always thought that as people age, they would become more tolerant of others. They've made mistakes and should understand others will, too. They did stupid things when young and should help youth grow, not condemn youth for growing up and being different. I don't get it.

It seems that some think that getting old gives them the right to be downright rude. They're mean to store clerks. They yell at someone who gets in their way or goes too slow for their tastes. I don't get it.

I have Asperger's (high-functioning autism). I have a tendency to blurt out what I think but I do try to not be hateful or hurtful. I don't judge you for having different political views than I do. I do judge your words and actions. If you accuse someone of "pandering" because they have a different opinion than you, you lose my respect. If you can't understand that even a professional can muck up a song out of nerves, you appear to have a mean streak. If you berate the checker at the grocery store for not being to accept your coupon, you appear overbearing and rude. If you honk because someone isn't moving fast enough for you, you appear arrogant and impatient. If you put down teens because they hang around the Squares in groups, don't dress like you think they should, play music you don't like, then you appear small-minded.

Why is it so hard to let others be different from you as you age? So what if I don't share your political viewpoint? So what if I like happen to like rap music and you don't? So what if someone isn't as fast as you? Why is it okay for you to say what you think and feel, but not someone else? What happened to respect, tolerance? I really don't get it.

I will attempt an answer based on my experience with intolerance.
1. I don't think intolerance has anything to do with age in some cases as my father was intolerant starting in his thirties and forties. His way or the highway.
2. As we age, intolerance may creep in because we don't feel well.
3. Life has not turned out to our complete satisfaction.
4. We think that we have done everything and know exactly where we stand to the exclusion of others.
5. Our world has gotten smaller due to the lack of options.
6. The world is moving at too fast a pace and it's scary for some people.
7. We see things in black and white with no shades of gray.
8. We tend to dwell on our own perspective and not be open minded for other people's opinions.
9. When we have solved of our big problems, we tend to think of how we should fix other peoples mistakes, (our point of view).
10. The pace of stressful events happening is causing a lack of respect and consideration that was very prevalent many years ago.

In a perfect world, we would all agree to disagree and enjoy each others company. My mother always said, "it doesn't cost anything to be nice".

I'm not going to make another person problem my problem assuming they are arrogant or rude. Don't let anybody rent space in your head.

I hope this helps. I'm off my soapbox.

[graciegirl]

I will attempt an answer based on my experience with intolerance.
1. I don't think intolerance has anything to do with age in some cases as my father was intolerant starting in his thirties and forties. His way or the highway.
2. As we age, intolerance may creep in because we don't feel well.
3. Life has not turned out to our complete satisfaction.
4. We think that we have done everything and know exactly where we stand to the exclusion of others.
5. Our world has gotten smaller due to the lack of options.
6. The world is moving at too fast a pace and it's scary for some people.
7. We see things in black and white with no shades of gray.
8. We tend to dwell on our own perspective and not be open minded for other people's opinions.
9. When we have solved of our big problems, we tend to think of how we should fix other peoples mistakes, (our point of view).
10. The pace of stressful events happening is causing a lack of respect and consideration that was very prevalent many years ago.

In a perfect world, we would all agree to disagree and enjoy each others company. My mother always said, "it doesn't cost anything to be nice".

I'm not going to make another person problem my problem assuming they are arrogant or rude. Don't let anybody rent space in your head.

I hope this helps. I'm off my soapbox.

A considered post that shows that you are not the center of your own universe.

I REALLY hope you will be my friend.

[barb1191]

I'm not going to make another person problem my problem assuming they are arrogant or rude. Don't let anybody rent space in your head.

I hope this helps. I'm off my soapbox.

KUDOS to you!!! :eclipsee_gold_cup: I love your comments, especially "Don't let anybody rent space in your head." So well put, and so very wise. Never heard it before, but it will become unforgetable to me.

Thanks 2BNTV for sharing......b

[manaboutown]

When I was in my early twenties I took a job with the US government in Washington, D.C. As I settled in and started getting to know my co-workers I noticed one fellow in particular, an "older man", probably at least 55, had a nice smile on his face, always greeted me cheerfully and seemed to be a quite happy person. As I got to know him I found out he had been an attorney in private practice but for some reason about which I did not inquire had given it up to work for the government for a lot less income (and no doubt a lot less stress). I asked him how he could be so happy having stepped down in status and income (not using those words) and he told me that when he was my age he had observed that older people fell into two groups, happy ones and unhappy ones, and that he had decided to join the happy group. I have never forgotten his revelation, am grateful for it and try to follow it in my life. I try to be cheerful, tolerant and accepting of others in every way: the young, the middle aged and the elderly. Many seniors have over the years become quite fixed in their opinions and beliefs. Some are essentially saying "Don't confuse me with the facts. I have already made up my mind." I treat that mindset as their problem and either ignore them or get away from them as soon as I can.

Since I slowed down myself workwise and started to travel, I have met and spent time with the locals in several different cultures, including areas which were bubbling with unrest such as Thailaind during their demonstrations and Egypt not long ago. I have found that almost everyone I talked to was a decent human being deep inside. They did live under different political systems, some of which were working fairly well and some of which were not. Most of them had accepted their lot in life and were reasonably content. Some had deep political convictions. Some did not. Some were quite happy such as the cheerful older coworker I was fortunate to encounter as a young man. Other were quite unhappy. Some were open to hearing about my beliefs. Others were not. That is probably the case everywhere, perhaps moreso among older people.

[uujudy]

Manabout, I totally agree with you about "happy" and "unhappy" people. :thumbup: Every now and then (even in The Villages!) I'll run into somebody I think of as a "joysucker" -- you know the type. They'll walk into a room (or onto a golf course) and just suck all the joy out of it. I'm not talking about people who are having a particularly difficult time, and are in need of our love and compassion. I'm talking about the people who just seem to be incredibly angry about everything, all the time.

This next part may seem to be off topic, but bear with me for a minute. I had to visit the urgent care facility a few weeks ago. In the waiting room they had Fox news (with sound!). In the examination rooms they also had a TV with Fox news (with sound!) I was curious about having tv's in the examination rooms, because the blood pressure person watched it while she pumped up my blood pressure cuff. (Pay attention to me!) The program that was on was a controversial one (Glenn Beck), so I thought hmmm... If you like this program, you'll get excited and your blood pressure will go up, and if you don't like this program, you'll get excited and your blood pressure will go up... My blood pressure was the highest it's ever been! :22yikes: The doctor said it was caused by the Sudafed, but I'm not so sure.

And on that note, I debated about sharing this link I found. It is not meant to be political. I found it to be interesting, and maybe some of you will, too. Please, folks, don't get angry with me. I'm just sharing what I found: http://www.frumforum.com/fox-geezer-syndrome

Do you really think watching television can change us from being happy people to being unhappy people? :shrug:

[pooh]

Do you really think watching television can change us from being happy people to being unhappy people? :shrug:

I do think that watching some television programs, especially the 24 hour news networks can alter our feelings. The continual message of bad events, feelings, disasters has to have some impact on what we're feeling.
In the evenings, as the day draws to a close, I much prefer to watch something that will make me laugh or smile....and the 24 hour news networks go on only when world events have taken a turn for the worse. (I agree it's annoying to have FOX news or CNN or Headline News on in the waiting rooms, they can drive one's blood pressure up a good number of points!.... ;)

[eweissenbach]

My parents taught me to respect other people's opinions, even those that differed from mine, and try to find areas of agreement and commonality. That I should empathize with people who are of different persuasions and try to understand what in their lives makes them feel, think, or act the way they do. One story that I think illustrates the way I was brought up; I was about 10 years old and President Eisenhower was on the television, giving a speech. I was talking to someone else and said out loud - "He's an idiot" - referring to someone else we were talking about. My mother overheard me and thought I was saying that about the president, and gave me a stern lecture, saying that he was the president and should always be shown the proper respect, and never called names. Now I was well aware that my mother was a dyed in the wool Roosevelt democrat, and it struck me at the time, and has stayed with me to this day, that she was defending the honor of a president with whom she disagreed and opposed. I am glad I had the parental guidance that I had and wish more people had had the same.

[bandsdavis]

It's not the rudeness per se that bothers me. It's the absolute lack of tolerance for those that think, feel or act differently. I really don't get why it is that way. It would seem that it would be the exact opposite -- the older we get, the more accepting of others we get -- rather than the way it is.

Are we so afraid of change as we age? It is really because we've seen it happen over and over? I don't know. I just know that calling someone a name because they disagree with you is wrong. When you get upset because someone's nerves made them forget a line in a song just doesn't feel right to me. There just have been a lot of mean-spirited replies lately -- both here and in real life.

I just hope and pray I never get that way -- heck, I'm bad enough in my own way without having age make me worse.

Red, my old marketing professor told me many years ago that "An opinion firmly held is more important than facts any day." I think a lot of intolerance comes from people who hold opinions that they believe are facts. It is sometimes the expression of these "facts" around others who hold other "facts" equally as firmly that leads to negative feelings and intolerance. Many factors that others have mentioned can be the causes of this problem, but the problem is increased when we become older and have more and more of these "facts" in our minds.

B.

[eweissenbach]

Red, my old marketing professor told me many years ago that "An opinion firmly held is more important than facts any day." I think a lot of intolerance comes from people who hold opinions that they believe are facts. It is sometimes the expression of these "facts" around others who hold other "facts" equally as firmly that leads to negative feelings and intolerance. Many factors that others have mentioned can be the causes of this problem, but the problem is increased when we become older and have more and more of these "facts" in our minds.

B.

As a wise man once said...."Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, however no one is entitled to their own facts."

[redwitch]

Ed, sounds like your mother and my father were raised by the same people. Like your mother, my dad was a true-blue Democrat (even in a very Republican County). Like your mother, he was not a fan of Eisenhower, even though Dad was 100% pro military (he really thought Stevenson was THE MAN!). My brother once called Ike a few choice names (forget what they were, but I know they weren't good). Dad sat him down and gave him a heck of a lecture on respecting the rank and the title, regardless of personal opinions. He also talked to him about respecting a man for his actions, that personal integrity was far more important than personal wealth. I overheard every word and it has stuck with me my entire life. (Thanks for a reminding me of a great memory!)

[2BNTV]

A considered post that shows that you are not the center of your own universe.

I REALLY hope you will be my friend.

Sorry I couldn't respond sooner as they expect me to do work while I'm at work. LOL

I am honored to be your friend by your invitation a while back. Hopefully, I will meet you and your family when I am in TV permanetly.

I try to be considerate of other people and post my statements in a generic way so anyone does not feel I am attacking them.

I think if people had a serious problem in their life to deal with and wanted someone to have compassion for their problems they might have more compassion for other people and why they do what they do in their problems.

In New York, we use to say that "good people can spot good people a mile away".

Life is too short to be too little.

[2BNTV]

I remember Dale Carnegie writting in "How to Win Friends and Influence People" that you will see more smiling faces in the rice paddys of a poor nation than on Wall Street".

People are as happy as they make up their minds to be. Abraham Lincoln
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
You can get a much better personal response from listening and saying you understand than telling someone how they can live their life better.

IMHO - You can't tell anyone something but you can inform them.

[katezbox]

Thank you all for your replies. I can't say I quite understand, yet, but it's given me some food for thought.

I'm one of those who has to state her opinion. Couldn't stop myself if I tried. It is a part of me, my core nature. I don't try to shove it in someone's face, I just let you know what I think. (Don't ever ask me if I like what you're wearing -- if I don't, I will tell you.)

Sometimes it is hard to live in a community where I see and hear people call others a name because their opinion is different. I'll be the one in the middle butting in and trying to stop the namecalling. I HATE it!!!! I hate blatent rudeness. I hate when someone acts like they're better than someone else because they think they have more. I LOATHE bullies in all forms.

I love TOTV and the people here. However, when people start getting mean, I don't get it. I used to enjoy the Political Forum. We'd get our viewpoints out with a lot of humor and fun thrown in. Then, it just became mean. The comments against Obama were over the top. The remarks against Palin made little sense. I left that forum and have not missed it. Occasionally, someone forgets these forums are not the political forum and acts as if it is. The namecalling starts. The pettiness is non-stop. The meanness is painful.

I love TV, the generosity of the people here, the willingness to laugh at one self, all of it. But, I've seen some of the meanest people I've ever been around here. If you don't agree with their religious, political, social beliefs, you're absolute slime and they let you know it. I find these people to be very small and I truly feel sorry for them, but I don't understand them at all.

I try to let my world grow. It was always a very black and white world (Aspies are that way -- there's right and there's not right and you have to correct the not right.) I'm learning there are grays everywhere. I can't say that I embrace the grays, but at least I understand they exist.

And, Bill, yes, I like rap. Actually, I love rap. When Jess was about 12, she got into emo music. I don't handle emotions well (again, an Aspie trait) and I found the music to be poppish, syrupy drivel. To get her away from it, I introduced her to rap. I taught her the history of the music; what the lyrics meant, the good and the bad of those lyric;, where a curse word was used to be effective and have meaning, where it was used just because the rapper could. I also love jazz, classical, tenors singing opera and I used to love the oldies, but TV OD'd me on that one. My favorite music is blues.

I have people in TV I consider my friends. I accept them as they are -- my sweet, innocent angel lover; my angry, hurt ex-military wife; my "leader of the pack" (always giving, always accepting, always kind); my man-hunting, goofy buddy; my friend who thinks God is the answer to all problems and tries to steer everyone to her church; my buddy who truly accepts everyone into his group and has the patience of at least 3 saints with Ghandi thrown in for good measure; even my ultra-conservative neighbor with the heart of gold. I don't try to change them. I accept and love them for who they are. So, if I can do it with a true affliction that makes it even harder for me to understand emotions, why is it so hard for a "normal" to accept others without being mean? See, I still don't get it. lol

Wonderful post!

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by redwitch
Thank you all for your replies. I can't say I quite understand, yet, but it's given me some food for thought.

I'm one of those who has to state her opinion. Couldn't stop myself if I tried. It is a part of me, my core nature. I don't try to shove it in someone's face, I just let you know what I think. (Don't ever ask me if I like what you're wearing -- if I don't, I will tell you.)

Sometimes it is hard to live in a community where I see and hear people call others a name because their opinion is different. I'll be the one in the middle butting in and trying to stop the namecalling. I HATE it!!!! I hate blatent rudeness. I hate when someone acts like they're better than someone else because they think they have more. I LOATHE bullies in all forms.

I love TOTV and the people here. However, when people start getting mean, I don't get it. I used to enjoy the Political Forum. We'd get our viewpoints out with a lot of humor and fun thrown in. Then, it just became mean. The comments against Obama were over the top. The remarks against Palin made little sense. I left that forum and have not missed it. Occasionally, someone forgets these forums are not the political forum and acts as if it is. The namecalling starts. The pettiness is non-stop. The meanness is painful.

I love TV, the generosity of the people here, the willingness to laugh at one self, all of it. But, I've seen some of the meanest people I've ever been around here. If you don't agree with their religious, political, social beliefs, you're absolute slime and they let you know it. I find these people to be very small and I truly feel sorry for them, but I don't understand them at all.

I try to let my world grow. It was always a very black and white world (Aspies are that way -- there's right and there's not right and you have to correct the not right.) I'm learning there are grays everywhere. I can't say that I embrace the grays, but at least I understand they exist.

And, Bill, yes, I like rap. Actually, I love rap. When Jess was about 12, she got into emo music. I don't handle emotions well (again, an Aspie trait) and I found the music to be poppish, syrupy drivel. To get her away from it, I introduced her to rap. I taught her the history of the music; what the lyrics meant, the good and the bad of those lyric;, where a curse word was used to be effective and have meaning, where it was used just because the rapper could. I also love jazz, classical, tenors singing opera and I used to love the oldies, but TV OD'd me on that one. My favorite music is blues.

I have people in TV I consider my friends. I accept them as they are -- my sweet, innocent angel lover; my angry, hurt ex-military wife; my "leader of the pack" (always giving, always accepting, always kind); my man-hunting, goofy buddy; my friend who thinks God is the answer to all problems and tries to steer everyone to her church; my buddy who truly accepts everyone into his group and has the patience of at least 3 saints with Ghandi thrown in for good measure; even my ultra-conservative neighbor with the heart of gold. I don't try to change them. I accept and love them for who they are. So, if I can do it with a true affliction that makes it even harder for me to understand emotions, why is it so hard for a "normal" to accept others without being mean? See, I still don't get it. lol

Wonderful post!


I tried to copy Red's post with Kate's agreement...above (Wonderful post!)

I treasure you more every day, Red...and as always Kate, I love your attitude!!

[thistrucksforyou]

]i've noticed this here and throughout tv. I hate when people start name-calling or denigrating someone because someone has a different viewpoint. I always thought that as people age, they would become more tolerant of others. They've made mistakes and should understand others will, too. They did stupid things when young and should help youth grow, not condemn youth for growing up and being different. I don't get it.

It seems that some think that getting old gives them the right to be downright rude. They're mean to store clerks. They yell at someone who gets in their way or goes too slow for their tastes. I don't get it.

I have asperger's (high-functioning autism). I have a tendency to blurt out what i think but i do try to not be hateful or hurtful. I don't judge you for having different political views than i do. I do judge your words and actions. If you accuse someone of "pandering" because they have a different opinion than you, you lose my respect. If you can't understand that even a professional can muck up a song out of nerves, you appear to have a mean streak. If you berate the checker at the grocery store for not being to accept your coupon, you appear overbearing and rude. If you honk because someone isn't moving fast enough for you, you appear arrogant and impatient. If you put down teens because they hang around the squares in groups, don't dress like you think they should, play music you don't like, then you appear small-minded.

Why is it so hard to let others be different from you as you age? So what if i don't share your political viewpoint? So what if i like happen to like rap music and you don't? So what if someone isn't as fast as you? Why is it okay for you to say what you think and feel, but not someone else? What happened to respect, tolerance? I really don't get it.


113

[Challenger]

Originally Posted by redwitch
Thank you all for your replies. I can't say I quite understand, yet, but it's given me some food for thought.

I'm one of those who has to state her opinion. Couldn't stop myself if I tried. It is a part of me, my core nature. I don't try to shove it in someone's face, I just let you know what I think. (Don't ever ask me if I like what you're wearing -- if I don't, I will tell you.)

Sometimes it is hard to live in a community where I see and hear people call others a name because their opinion is different. I'll be the one in the middle butting in and trying to stop the namecalling. I HATE it!!!! I hate blatent rudeness. I hate when someone acts like they're better than someone else because they think they have more. I LOATHE bullies in all forms.

I love TOTV and the people here. However, when people start getting mean, I don't get it. I used to enjoy the Political Forum. We'd get our viewpoints out with a lot of humor and fun thrown in. Then, it just became mean. The comments against Obama were over the top. The remarks against Palin made little sense. I left that forum and have not missed it. Occasionally, someone forgets these forums are not the political forum and acts as if it is. The namecalling starts. The pettiness is non-stop. The meanness is painful.

I love TV, the generosity of the people here, the willingness to laugh at one self, all of it. But, I've seen some of the meanest people I've ever been around here. If you don't agree with their religious, political, social beliefs, you're absolute slime and they let you know it. I find these people to be very small and I truly feel sorry for them, but I don't understand them at all.

I try to let my world grow. It was always a very black and white world (Aspies are that way -- there's right and there's not right and you have to correct the not right.) I'm learning there are grays everywhere. I can't say that I embrace the grays, but at least I understand they exist.

And, Bill, yes, I like rap. Actually, I love rap. When Jess was about 12, she got into emo music. I don't handle emotions well (again, an Aspie trait) and I found the music to be poppish, syrupy drivel. To get her away from it, I introduced her to rap. I taught her the history of the music; what the lyrics meant, the good and the bad of those lyric;, where a curse word was used to be effective and have meaning, where it was used just because the rapper could. I also love jazz, classical, tenors singing opera and I used to love the oldies, but TV OD'd me on that one. My favorite music is blues.

I have people in TV I consider my friends. I accept them as they are -- my sweet, innocent angel lover; my angry, hurt ex-military wife; my "leader of the pack" (always giving, always accepting, always kind); my man-hunting, goofy buddy; my friend who thinks God is the answer to all problems and tries to steer everyone to her church; my buddy who truly accepts everyone into his group and has the patience of at least 3 saints with Ghandi thrown in for good measure; even my ultra-conservative neighbor with the heart of gold. I don't try to change them. I accept and love them for who they are. So, if I can do it with a true affliction that makes it even harder for me to understand emotions, why is it so hard for a "normal" to accept others without being mean? See, I still don't get it. lol

Wonderful post!


I tried to copy Red's post with Kate's agreement...above (Wonderful post!)

I treasure you more every day, Red...and as always Kate, I love your attitude!!

Wish I had said that!

[Russ_Boston]

Red - never knew you had Aspergers.

I think you see the "get off my front yard, you young whipper snappers!" attitude more on a relatively anonymous forum like TOTV than you do in person.

My attitude has always been that we can only live for today and go forward. But many people as they age need to feel that things were "better in the day". It's part of life and aging called the reflective period. I personally don't mind it as long as it doesn't become mean spirited.

If you go back into the archives of TOTV you can find articles about such things as: Why don't men remove their hats in a restaurant, don't they have an manners; Rap music sucks; They don't make good movies anymore; etc. etc.

I just think things change, not better, nor worse. Just change.

[graciegirl]

[quote=Russ_Boston;331205]Red - never knew you had Aspergers.

I think you see the "get off my front yard, you young whipper snappers!" attitude more on a relatively anonymous forum like TOTV than you do in person.

My attitude has always been that we can only live for today and go forward. But many people as they age need to feel that things were "better in the day". It's part of life and aging called the reflective period. I personally don't mind it as long as it doesn't become mean spirited.

If you go back into the archives of TOTV you can find articles about such things as: Why don't men remove their hats in a restaurant, don't they have an manners; Rap music sucks; They don't make good movies anymore; etc. etc.

I just think things change, not better, nor worse. Just change.


I try to think that this day holds the opportunity to be the best one in my life.

[Russ_Boston]

I try to think that this day holds the opportunity to be the best one in my life.

Nice!