FL now officially a Third World Country ending Modern childhood vaccines

[CoachKandSportsguy]

FL reverses mandate for childhood vaccines to attend public schools.

Do the med DRs here agree with the decision? I don't

Florida working to end all vaccine mandates: DeSantis and Ladapo – NBC 6 South Florida (https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/florida-working-to-end-all-vaccine-mandates-desantis-and-ladapo-announce/3686373/)

yes, pediatricians will recommend it, but the crazy anti vaxxers will decline and put lots of children at risk. . and will this then put elderly at risk?

[Aces4]

FL reverses mandate for childhood vaccines to attend public schools.

Do the med DRs here agree with the decision? I don't

Florida working to end all vaccine mandates: DeSantis and Ladapo – NBC 6 South Florida (https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/florida-working-to-end-all-vaccine-mandates-desantis-and-ladapo-announce/3686373/)

yes, pediatricians will recommend it, but the crazy anti vaxxers will decline and put lots of children at risk. . and will this then put elderly at risk?

Not commenting on the choice factor yet but I don't see how this would put the elderly at risk, they are supposedly vaccinated and are, therefore, impervious.

[Bill14564]

Not commenting on the choice factor yet but I don't see how this would put the elderly at risk, they are supposedly vaccinated and are, therefore, impervious.

Not impervious, just better protected and protection can be insufficient or even fail.

Multilayer protection means you wear your seatbelt AND drive safely. You take the vaccines to protect yourself AND rely on others to take the vaccines to reduce the risk for everyone.

[Caymus]

I have not researched it, but how many vaccines did someone born in the late 1950's receive. I remember eating a sugar cube for polio, a shot for smallpox and years later one for tetanus.

Were their others at that time?

[Papa_lecki]

They are not ending childhood vaccines, they are allowing parents (not the government) to decide what vaccines are best for their children.

[Normal]

FL reverses mandate for childhood vaccines to attend public schools.

Do the med DRs here agree with the decision? I don't

Florida working to end all vaccine mandates: DeSantis and Ladapo – NBC 6 South Florida (https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/florida-working-to-end-all-vaccine-mandates-desantis-and-ladapo-announce/3686373/)

yes, pediatricians will recommend it, but the crazy anti vaxxers will decline and put lots of children at risk. . and will this then put elderly at risk?

You haven’t a clue about “third world countries “. I’ve lived in a few and we are far and away superior to that status. In fact we are far and away better than any European nation. Just because vaccine mandates have been removed, or that parent’s can now file for an exemptions, doesn’t mean we will ever be that third world country.

It must be fun telling other people what they have to do with their bodies .

[bopat]

Vaccines protect you, not others. Go get yourself boosted.

[Bill14564]

They are not ending childhood vaccines, they are allowing parents (not the government) to decide what vaccines are best for their children.

That path leads to some dangerous destinations.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I got my smallpox, polio, and DTP shots all when I was a baby or a toddler, depending on the recommendation. The DTP was eventually phased out and the Tdap replaced it in 1991. I came down with a case of chicken pox, so I never had to worry about getting the vaccine for that. My sister had the mumps and I was exposed and didn't get sick, so we assume I'm immune. But later in life I did get the MMR shot "just in case." It didn't exist when I was born. Once the Shingrix vaccine became available for me when I turned 50 I got the 2-dose shot, and also started getting a yearly flu shot. Now I also get whatever new COVID shot is provided from year to year.

So whatever some parents choose to reject for their children, is their problem when things go wrong. I'm protected. I think anyone whose child /cannot/ be vaccinated due to medical issues, should sue the State of Florida if their kid gets sick as a result of the deniers being given permission to reject science.

[Bill14564]

You haven’t a clue about “third world countries “. I’ve lived in a few and we are far and away superior to that status. In fact we are far and away better than any European nation. Just because vaccine mandates have been removed, or that parent’s can now file for an exemptions, doesn’t mean we will ever be that third world country.

It must be fun telling other people what they have to do with their bodies .

Just because you run with scissors doesn't mean you'll trip and fall and stab yourself but it is sure to increase the odds.

[ThirdOfFive]

I have not researched it, but how many vaccines did someone born in the late 1950's receive. I remember eating a sugar cube for polio, a shot for smallpox and years later one for tetanus.

Were their others at that time?
Born 1948: Polio vax about 1955, Smallpox about the same time (maybe a couple of years later) and maybe tetanus. I do recall tetanus boosters as an adult so the original must have been given at some time or other.

Other than that...nada. I remember at about age 9 or so (happened earlier too from what I heard), if one kid came down with measles, or mumps, or chicken pox, the other parents in the community would bring their kids around to be exposed, the hard logic behind the practice being that those diseases, being "one and done", having the kids get it at a time of their parents' choosing just made things easier for everyone. We kids didn't mind: mumps was uncomfortable for a few days (I recall the horror stories about mumps "going down"...(didn't realize what that meant until years after I had them). Chicken pox was nothing: maybe three sores and that was it. Measles likewise, though mom insisted that the kid(s) with the measles had to be in bed with the lights off for a couple of days. Any one of the three meant a few days off from school so it was sort of like a vacation.

Funny. I don't remember, or even remember hearing, about a kid getting really sick or dying from any of those diseases. They were just a minor part of growing up.

Which is why I agree with making vaccinations optional. The State arbitrarily going the in loco parentis route is tantamount to saying not only that the parents don't have the brains to act in the best interest of their child, but that the state does. I haven't seen much evidence of that.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

You haven’t a clue about “third world countries “. I’ve lived in a few and we are far and away superior to that status. In fact we are far and away better than any European nation. Just because vaccine mandates have been removed, or that parent’s can now file for an exemptions, doesn’t mean we will ever be that third world country.

It must be fun telling other people what they have to do with their bodies .

So then you're pro-choice. I approve of that opinion.

[BrianL99]

The State arbitrarily going the in loco parentis route is tantamount to saying not only that the parents don't have the brains to act in the best interest of their child, but that the state does. I haven't seen much evidence of that.

You can't get a driver's license without taking a test.

From what I've seen out there in the world, there are plenty of parents who shouldn't have a Driver's License and surely shouldn't be allowed to have children.

The evidence on both sides of the argument is questionable.

[Normal]

Analytically, it’s like a famous person claiming everyone should go green, then hopping in their own private jet to pump millions of pounds of carbon into our atmosphere for just their benefit and traveling on to their next engagement. “Do as I say, not as I do.”

[kingofbeer]

They are not ending childhood vaccines, they are allowing parents (not the government) to decide what vaccines are best for their children.
I wonder if the children of DeSantis are vaccinated. Many unvaccinated children in Florida will die. Should I be concerned about this? I suspect that teachers will file lawsuits to prevent this to happen.

[Taltarzac725]

Diseases spread when people who have them infect you. I would go with established science as to whether or not I trust parents to make the best choice for other people in schools, restaurants, museums, concert halls, churches, stores, gyms, skating rinks, roller rinks, airports, airplanes, buses, cars, bathrooms, brothels, amusement parks, fairs, stadiums, dog parks, gun ranges, zoos, pools, pickleball courts, tennis courts, Disney World, and whatever I forgot. Oh, forgot one of the most important for teens--prom sites.


I put in brothels as I recall a wrestling coach in Reno, Nevada got into trouble when he took his winning team to Mustang Ranch for a reward for their winning. The ladies at brothels probably are very up-to-date on their vaccinations. Las Vegas gets an awful lot of visitors as do the Florida theme parks. Probably some of the same ones.

[Bill14564]

Analytically, it’s like a famous person claiming everyone should go green, then hopping in their own private jet to pump millions of pounds of carbon into our atmosphere for just their benefit and traveling on to their next engagement. “Do as I say, not as I do.”

You have that exactly backwards.

You have people who have been protected all their lives now deciding that stepping on a rusty nail is no big deal. (or taking a risk with measles, polio, mumps, .....). "Don't do as I have done, go play Russian Roulette."

[fdpaq0580]

Just because you run with scissors doesn't mean you'll trip and fall and stab yourself but it is sure to increase the odds.

The possibility is also there that you could trip and fall and stab someone else. This is why vaccines help not only the vaccinated but others they come in contact with.

[Normal]

Many unvaccinated children in Florida will die

Just a little over the top on that one. Why not say millions or even billions? Many will die not wearing seatbelts too.

[fdpaq0580]

Vaccines protect you, not others. Go get yourself boosted.

If you get vaccinated, you are less likely to get the disease and, therefore, less likely to infect others.

[fdpaq0580]

I have not researched it, but how many vaccines did someone born in the late 1950's receive. I remember eating a sugar cube for polio, a shot for smallpox and years later one for tetanus.

Were their others at that time?

I'm sure there were. Knowledge expands with time. Medical knowledge improves with time. Ignorance and fear (and selfishness) are reasons people avoid vaccines. Jmho.

[Taltarzac725]

It does sound like a celebration of stupidity. Except in this case it might result in more people dying because you insisted on being stupid.

[fdpaq0580]

You can't get a driver's license without taking a test.

From what I've seen out there in the world, there are plenty of parents who shouldn't have a Driver's License and surely shouldn't be allowed to have children.

Agree!

[Bill14564]

Just a little over the top on that one. Why not say millions or even billions? Many will die not wearing seatbelts too.

Not over the top at all.

Millions or even billions would be over the top, particularly since the population of the entire US is less than one billion.

"Many will die not wearing seatbelts too." So are you arguing *for* vaccinations to help save lives or are you arguing that seatbelts should not be mandatory even though they are proven to save lives?

[fdpaq0580]

Analytically, it’s like a famous person claiming everyone should go green, then hopping in their own private jet to pump millions of pounds of carbon into our atmosphere for just their benefit and traveling on to their next engagement. “Do as I say, not as I do.”

What is the "it's" in your statement?

[Topspinmo]

That path leads to some dangerous destinations.

For ones not vaccinated? If not then why get vaccinated if not going to protect you? Covid vaccines are prime example now with all deaths possible side effect even years after vaccine. As with most vaccines only small percentage has major problems. Some don’t want take the risk just like whether get lightning rods or not? weight the risk factor? I also notice children seem to have a lot more health problems nowadays? Whether if from side effects of vaccines or not something causing this?

[Topspinmo]

Diseases spread when people who have them infect you. I would go with established science as to whether or not I trust parents to make the best choice for other people in schools, restaurants, museums, concert halls, churches, stores, gyms, skating rinks, roller rinks, airports, airplanes, buses, cars, bathrooms, brothels, amusement parks, fairs, stadiums, dog parks, gun ranges, zoos, pools, pickleball courts, tennis courts, Disney World, and whatever I forgot. Oh, forgot one of the most important for teens--prom sites.


I put in brothels as I recall a wrestling coach in Reno, Nevada got into trouble when he took his winning team to Mustang Ranch for a reward for their winning. The ladies at brothels probably are very up-to-date on their vaccinations. Las Vegas gets an awful lot of visitors as do the Florida theme parks. Probably some of the same ones.

Doesn’t the vaccinated have protection? If not why? Measles was eradicated in US. Why all sudden pop back up and why wasn’t vaccinated protected? two sides to every coin?

[Topspinmo]

Not over the top at all.

Millions or even billions would be over the top, particularly since the population of the entire US is less than one billion.

"Many will die not wearing seatbelts too." So are you arguing *for* vaccinations to help save lives or are you arguing that seatbelts should not be mandatory even though they are proven to save lives?

Mandatory anything not going to be 100%.

[Bill14564]

Mandatory anything not going to be 100%.

Voluntary anything will be even less.

[Velvet]

As a previous school teacher, I would say, it is a possible disaster to allow an unvaccinated child among other unvaccinated children. The ones vaccinated should be (somewhat) protected. I understand the desire to save money at all costs to distribute it where it is deemed better served. I think taking it out on children is not a good idea. As for parental decision. Yes, most parents want the best for their children, and I respect that. But what about the children of ignorant parents? Do we protect the innocent children or the right of the ignorant parent to possibly hurt their child and other children?

[jimhoward]

If almost everyone else gets vaccinated, then you or your child do not have to get vaccinated because the disease won't spread.

Many parents will find it in their interest to skip the vaccine avoiding any cost or possible risks.....banking on everybody else being vaccinated. But, if too many make that choice the disease will spread.

[Velvet]

I can see families with young children leaving Florida in the future. (Should bring our school taxes down.) We, oldies, are usually well vaccinated. Won’t make much difference for us, one way or another.

[mraines]

FL reverses mandate for childhood vaccines to attend public schools.

Do the med DRs here agree with the decision? I don't

Florida working to end all vaccine mandates: DeSantis and Ladapo – NBC 6 South Florida (https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/florida-working-to-end-all-vaccine-mandates-desantis-and-ladapo-announce/3686373/)

yes, pediatricians will recommend it, but the crazy anti vaxxers will decline and put lots of children at risk. . and will this then put elderly at risk?
I had schoolmates and family members who suffered through polio. Is this what we want? Do we want to kill, blind and maim our children so you can be "free"? I think this is the most foolish thing this state has done.

[mraines]

They are not ending childhood vaccines, they are allowing parents (not the government) to decide what vaccines are best for their children.

And those that choose not to vaccinate their children put themselves and others at risk. Foolish.

[mraines]

You haven’t a clue about “third world countries “. I’ve lived in a few and we are far and away superior to that status. In fact we are far and away better than any European nation. Just because vaccine mandates have been removed, or that parent’s can now file for an exemptions, doesn’t mean we will ever be that third world country.

It must be fun telling other people what they have to do with their bodies .
What other people do or do not do with their bodies affects others. Please stay away from me if you don't get Covid vaccines. We are well on our way to being a third world country.

[Bogie Shooter]

For ones not vaccinated? If not then why get vaccinated if not going to protect you? Covid vaccines are prime example now with all deaths possible side effect even years after vaccine. As with most vaccines only small percentage has major problems. Some don’t want take the risk just like whether get lightning rods or not? weight the risk factor? I also notice children seem to have a lot more health problems nowadays? Whether if from side effects of vaccines or not something causing this?

Is this based on waiting room head counts or something else

[ThirdOfFive]

You haven’t a clue about “third world countries “. I’ve lived in a few and we are far and away superior to that status. In fact we are far and away better than any European nation. Just because vaccine mandates have been removed, or that parent’s can now file for an exemptions, doesn’t mean we will ever be that third world country.

It must be fun telling other people what they have to do with their bodies .

GREAT post. I ran it by my wife, who was born and raised in a third-world country in SE Asia (Thailand), and she got quite a chuckle out of it. She also agrees 100%. People who have not experienced exactly what that means (and I don't mean as a tourist) simply have no clue.

Some of the things she talks about beggar the imagination: like when she got meningitis as a very young girl and her father carried her over ten miles to the only hospital in the area as there was no transportation available. About having no indoor plumbing--or outdoor plumbing: when the urge struck you headed out to the rice paddies and did your business there. About being essentially abandoned as a young child after her mother divorced her father and having to live with her aunt and grandmother who were dirt-poor even by the standards of that time and place. About getting up at 3:00 AM and having to grind rice into flour on a stone mill so her aunt and grandmother could cook the desserts for sale that was the family's only source of income. About getting a job tying re-bar on a construction project in the middle of summer--age 13--so she could afford a school uniform. About being too poor to have a lunch to take to school so she'd "study" in the library while the other kids ate. About the time both her grandmother and her aunt got sick and she had to stay home to take care of them--at six years old. About many other things.

I've spent extended time there with my in-laws and have seen firsthand where she was raised, as well as how a lot of people live particularly in Isaan (NE Thailand) where a primary source of protein are insects. Things are better now, but not all that much for some people. You are totally right. Being poor in America actually reflects a life style that would be the lap of luxury in a great many third-world countries.

[mraines]

Born 1948: Polio vax about 1955, Smallpox about the same time (maybe a couple of years later) and maybe tetanus. I do recall tetanus boosters as an adult so the original must have been given at some time or other.

Other than that...nada. I remember at about age 9 or so (happened earlier too from what I heard), if one kid came down with measles, or mumps, or chicken pox, the other parents in the community would bring their kids around to be exposed, the hard logic behind the practice being that those diseases, being "one and done", having the kids get it at a time of their parents' choosing just made things easier for everyone. We kids didn't mind: mumps was uncomfortable for a few days (I recall the horror stories about mumps "going down"...(didn't realize what that meant until years after I had them). Chicken pox was nothing: maybe three sores and that was it. Measles likewise, though mom insisted that the kid(s) with the measles had to be in bed with the lights off for a couple of days. Any one of the three meant a few days off from school so it was sort of like a vacation.

Funny. I don't remember, or even remember hearing, about a kid getting really sick or dying from any of those diseases. They were just a minor part of growing up.

Which is why I agree with making vaccinations optional. The State arbitrarily going the in loco parentis route is tantamount to saying not only that the parents don't have the brains to act in the best interest of their child, but that the state does. I haven't seen much evidence of that.
Well, I was born in 1947. I had classmates and family members who had been crippled by polio. I was lucky that I was not. I don't want to see it come back and that will happen if parents don't vaccinate their kids.

[mraines]

Born 1948: Polio vax about 1955, Smallpox about the same time (maybe a couple of years later) and maybe tetanus. I do recall tetanus boosters as an adult so the original must have been given at some time or other.

Other than that...nada. I remember at about age 9 or so (happened earlier too from what I heard), if one kid came down with measles, or mumps, or chicken pox, the other parents in the community would bring their kids around to be exposed, the hard logic behind the practice being that those diseases, being "one and done", having the kids get it at a time of their parents' choosing just made things easier for everyone. We kids didn't mind: mumps was uncomfortable for a few days (I recall the horror stories about mumps "going down"...(didn't realize what that meant until years after I had them). Chicken pox was nothing: maybe three sores and that was it. Measles likewise, though mom insisted that the kid(s) with the measles had to be in bed with the lights off for a couple of days. Any one of the three meant a few days off from school so it was sort of like a vacation.

Funny. I don't remember, or even remember hearing, about a kid getting really sick or dying from any of those diseases. They were just a minor part of growing up.

Which is why I agree with making vaccinations optional. The State arbitrarily going the in loco parentis route is tantamount to saying not only that the parents don't have the brains to act in the best interest of their child, but that the state does. I haven't seen much evidence of that.
I don't know how old you are but maybe you don't remember because the vaccines pretty much eliminated them.

[fdpaq0580]

I had schoolmates and family members who suffered through polio. Is this what we want? Do we want to kill, blind and maim our children so you can be "free"? I think this is the most foolish thing this state has done.

Certainly one of many foolish things.

[Whatnext]

It's bad enough with the Christian names some parents bless/blight their children with, now the same people get to decide which illness their progeny can avoid or catch.
What could go wrong?

[shut the front door]

FL reverses mandate for childhood vaccines to attend public schools.

Do the med DRs here agree with the decision? I don't

Florida working to end all vaccine mandates: DeSantis and Ladapo – NBC 6 South Florida (https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/florida-working-to-end-all-vaccine-mandates-desantis-and-ladapo-announce/3686373/)

yes, pediatricians will recommend it, but the crazy anti vaxxers will decline and put lots of children at risk. . and will this then put elderly at risk?

Can you link the source that said "Florida is ending modern childhood vaccines"?
Because that is patently false. But spreading fear and panic will certainly get you a lot of replies. Just like the spoon fed masses.

[Whatnext]

Can you link the source that said "Florida is ending modern childhood vaccines"?
Because that is patently false. But spreading fear and panic will certainly get you a lot of replies. Just like the spoon fed masses.

If you click on the OP, the link is there.

[blueash]

You asked for the opinion of doctors on this site. The stupidity and frankly malevolence of this recommendation astounds me. The anti-science conspiracy mongering leaders may not live long enough to see the results of their terrible policies but our nation will suffer.

Vaccines, clean water, sewers, drug testing for safety and efficacy, anti-smoking messaging have all produced overwhelmingly beneficial results for us. So because some people deny science, despise universities and a broad and deep education, and believe that what is on you-tube or tic toc has equal merit to what comes out of Harvard or Duke or the NIH or the NEJM we are at this crossroad.

So many of you posting here have no understanding of how vaccines work, how they benefit both the recipient and the community, and how high the risk is of these diseases returning with a vengeance.

This is not just a choice of parents doing what they think is best. Parents who spend hours on conspiracy websites, watching lying TV networks, and being influenced by demagoguery are not in the best position. Should we start selling lead paint again? Should we get rid of air pollution controls so we can all breathe filthy air? Do we allow smoking on airplanes and restaurants? Do we tell manufacturers that seat belts and air bags must be optional for car buyers? Do we get rid of CPS and tell parents it is ok to beat your kids because it is in the Bible and that's how my grandparents did it?

You know what is going to happen when measles returns. It won't just kill some kids, it will permanently damage others. And the government and health insurance will pick up the cost.. thus everyone. And when Rubella returns and we have damaged newborns.. and when Hemophilus and Pneumococcal meningitis liquify babies' brains you can thank your GOP leaders for their ignorant leadership. When epiglottitis chokes your grandson to death so quickly they don't make it to the hospital for anything but an autopsy, send a nice note to DeSantis.

I have seen these diseases disappear in my career thanks to universal vaccination requirements.