Villages Golf Courses

[Warren Kiefer]

Of 21 local championship type golf courses reviewed in March, the top six most expensive for a Villager to play are all in the Villages?? This is not Harold Schwartz's vision of what he wanted the Villages to be at all.

[gage405]

Simple answer....Greed has taken over.

[memason]

Not sure about the greed .... ???? Fees to play in TV are certainly more modest that I was accustomed to paying up north and certainly a far cry from what I had to pay in Europe, last year.

Not sure...maybe it's just me.

[aln]

I tried Scotsdale in Jan-Mar..... anything close to what we have in Mallory, Cane, Palmer, Lopez or Havana et al was at least $75 and more typically $150 a round.
I tried the barrier islands off South Carolina.... The Ocean Course in 1995 was $300+
In Wisc in the summer a relatively good 'county' course will cost $40-$50 and semi private courses are $60+. The Kohler courses are well in the hundreds.

Four months of prime time here the rates barely rival those prices and after May 1 through Jan 1 it's very reasonable and hopefully this summer like the last couple years you can plan all the 'champ' courses for SIX dollars after 5.

Not to mention Schwartz' idea of free golf is still there all year on the exec courses!

Works for me
:thumbup:

[Bosoxfan]

I tried Scotsdale in Jan-Mar..... anything close to what we have in Mallory, Cane, Palmer, Lopez or Havana et al was at least $75 and more typically $150 a round.
I tried the barrier islands off South Carolina.... The Ocean Course in 1995 was $300+
In Wisc in the summer a relatively good 'county' course will cost $40-$50 and semi private courses are $60+. The Kohler courses are well in the hundreds.

Four months of prime time here the rates barely rival those prices and after May 1 through Jan 1 it's very reasonable and hopefully this summer like the last couple years you can plan all the 'champ' courses for SIX dollars after 5.

Not to mention Schwartz' idea of free golf is still there all year on the exec courses!

Works for me
:thumbup:


Well said. Anything close to Palmer up in massachusetts or New Hampshire is at least $75...most ovr $100.


gage 405...Simple answer greed has taken over!!


The word greed here really irritates me.I wish I could meet the morse family and personally thank them for affording me the chance to live this lifestyle!Please someone tell me of a place where a guy ,who was middle class all his life, can live the lifestyle afforded me here!

THANK YOU HAROLD SCHWARTZ FOR HAVING THIS VISION & FOR THE REST OF YOUR FAMILY MOVING FORWARD !!!:bowdown::a040::pepper2::MOJE_whot:

[golfnut]

Warren, I'd be interested in reading the review, do you have a link....gn

[golf2140]

Well said. Anything close to Palmer up in massachusetts or New Hampshire is at least $75...most ovr $100.


gage 405...Simple answer greed has taken over!!


The word greed here really irritates me.I wish I could meet the morse family and personally thank them for affording me the chance to live this lifestyle!Please someone tell me of a place where a guy ,who was middle class all his life, can live the lifestyle afforded me here!

THANK YOU HAROLD SCHWARTZ FOR HAVING THIS VISION & FOR THE REST OF YOUR FAMILY MOVING FORWARD !!!:bowdown::a040::pepper2::MOJE_whot:


I agree 100%

:BigApplause:

[graciegirl]

Of 21 local championship type golf courses reviewed in March, the top six most expensive for a Villager to play are all in the Villages?? This is not Harold Schwartz's vision of what he wanted the Villages to be at all.

I'd like to read the review too.

Welcome Warren.

You are new here on the forum. Have you lived in The Villages for some time to bring up Harold Schwartz's vision? I am sure he was a good person and a people person, and he had a great plan but his son and grandchildren seem to be the people with the vision that created this place as it exists today.

It is MUCH more expensive to play golf on courses that are comparable back in my home state. Not to mention the HUGE fees to join country clubs and the fact that you have a certain minimum to pay monthly at the country club restaurant and that isn't cheap either.

It is pretty wonderful for someone like us who have had to pay a lot more for golf for a lifetime.

[Ohiogirl]

Don't forget that there is no cart fee to use your cart on the championship courses, and the yearly or semi-annual trail fee for a household on the executive courses is a steal!

[ajdeck]

Well said. Anything close to Palmer up in massachusetts or New Hampshire is at least $75...most ovr $100.


gage 405...Simple answer greed has taken over!!


The word greed here really irritates me.I wish I could meet the morse family and personally thank them for affording me the chance to live this lifestyle!Please someone tell me of a place where a guy ,who was middle class all his life, can live the lifestyle afforded me here!

THANK YOU HAROLD SCHWARTZ FOR HAVING THIS VISION & FOR THE REST OF YOUR FAMILY MOVING FORWARD !!!:bowdown::a040::pepper2::MOJE_whot:



I also agree 100%, don't really see "greed" here.


Thanks also to the family.
aj

[dgammon6]

Ditto Bosoxfan.

[Mikeod]

The championship greens fees are set to make the courses self-sustaining. Remember, there is no initiation fee, no monthly minimum in the dining room/bar, and no trail fee to use your own cart on the course. All those add up.

In SoCal, courses like those here would all be twice what we pay plus a cart fee/trail fee.

I don't see greed either when it comes to the golf fees.

[nitehawk]

Of 21 local championship type golf courses reviewed in March, the top six most expensive for a Villager to play are all in the Villages?? This is not Harold Schwartz's vision of what he wanted the Villages to be at all.
I see this is only your second post---
If you have some more cool aid == those numbers will look different. If you do not have a golf cart then add another $8 ( i think that the rental fee for a golf cart ) to the green fees when playing in the villages. then add another $8b( per month ) for the right to book a tee time online. Then be ready to wait until 12 midnight to book a time, if you want to play in the morning. You have to try and beat the regulars who book for large groups and know the system. I may be wrong on some of these statements as i do not play much golf and am not familiar with the tee time system. It is probably more expensive to play in Hawaii although i have never been there. Maybe its because they dont have frost or a lack of water so there courses are in better shape and charge more. Maybe its more expensive to play in Europe as the American dollar is not worth what the euro is. Maybe it more expensive to play up north as they only have a few months to make money as do to weather. Maybe its more expensive to play at a country club where everyone who is a member make mega bucks and can afford to play at a well manicured course that does not get the traffic that the villages course get

[ajbrown]

Of 21 local championship type golf courses reviewed in March, the top six most expensive for a Villager to play are all in the Villages?? This is not Harold Schwartz's vision of what he wanted the Villages to be at all.

I could not find that article by googling, so if you have a reference I would love to see the details.

Let me preface this by saying I almost exclusively golf at courses inside TV. I love packing a few beverages and a sandwich, putting on my "spikes" in the garage and driving to the course in my golf cart. I truly love being in TV and the golf is a big reason.

That said, it is hard for me to argue that TV courses are not a bit more expensive than other local courses, e.g. Eagle Ridge, Stonecrest, Stone Creek and others folks post about all of the time. To compare costs to anywhere else in the US is apples and oranges for me. As a consumer, I am more than willing to pay that difference for the convenience.

Do I think the higher cost is greed? No. I think it is a price based on supply and demand to maintain the courses for the year. If it was greed the prices would be pushed up until play went down during the winter. As someone that loves the convenience I mentioned above I am not sure where my breaking point for price would be before I went outside. On the other hand here comes May, I can play Palmer after 11 AM for $15'ish (I say ish as I do not remember actual cost) :thumbup:

[actor]

Simple answer....Greed has taken over.

you show your bias with a post like that.

[nkrifats]

I could not find that article by googling, so if you have a reference I would love to see the details.

Let me preface this by saying I almost exclusively golf at courses inside TV. I love packing a few beverages and a sandwich, putting on my "spikes" in the garage and driving to the course in my golf cart. I truly love being in TV and the golf is a big reason.

That said, it is hard for me to argue that TV courses are not a bit more expensive than other local courses, e.g. Eagle Ridge, Stonecrest, Stone Creek and others folks post about all of the time. To compare costs to anywhere else in the US is apples and oranges for me. As a consumer, I am more than willing to pay that difference for the convenience.

Do I think the higher cost is greed? No. I think it is a price based on supply and demand to maintain the courses for the year. If it was greed the prices would be pushed up until play went down during the winter. As someone that loves the convenience I mentioned above I am not sure where my breaking point for price would be before I went outside. On the other hand here comes May, I can play Palmer after 11 AM for $15'ish (I say ish as I do not remember actual cost) :thumbup:

I have to agree with AJ and Bosox

[Taj44]

For us, it comes to about the same as what we paid in New York, although there we could play unlimited golf, up to a point. There were always tournements going on, etc., that closed the course on certain days, so it did come out fairly even. I think the membership rates there are around $2000/year, which up there is less than 6 months of actual golfing because of the weather. Here in TV we spend around $5K/year; we play on average around 2 - 3 times per week. We really don't want to play any more than that because we have so many other activities. But, frankly, our course up north was in much better condition than many of the championship courses here. Right now, there are only a handful that are in really nice shape. The others are so-so at best. You do pay for convenience.

[scroll]

I pay between 8k and 10k a year up north to play golf on a private course. Only 300 members so course is always in better shape than any course down here. I can play at 7:30 every Saturday and when ever I want to during the week. I pay about 1/4 to 1/3 down here and the value is great. The courses are more like public courses up north and compare to them in condition. Playing in TV is like playing public golf elsewhere. MHO

[gary42651]

I keep hearing about how hard it is sometimes, to get a tee time in the Villages. I created a monster, my wife never played golf until she came to the Villages, now she is hooked, being retired I don`t care what time I golf, and my wife has found open tee times, and we have golfed 38 days in a row. Thank god she is off visiting her daughter, now I can rest, I am still shocked on how cheap it is to play in the Villages.

[Jhooman]

I keep hearing about how hard it is sometimes, to get a tee time in the Villages. I created a monster, my wife never played golf until she came to the Villages, now she is hooked, being retired I don`t care what time I golf, and my wife has found open tee times, and we have golfed 38 days in a row. Thank god she is off visiting her daughter, now I can rest, I am still shocked on how cheap it is to play in the Villages.

Gary

Your a great husband.:BigApplause:

[katezbox]

I could not find that article by googling, so if you have a reference I would love to see the details.

Let me preface this by saying I almost exclusively golf at courses inside TV. I love packing a few beverages and a sandwich, putting on my "spikes" in the garage and driving to the course in my golf cart. I truly love being in TV and the golf is a big reason.

That said, it is hard for me to argue that TV courses are not a bit more expensive than other local courses, e.g. Eagle Ridge, Stonecrest, Stone Creek and others folks post about all of the time. To compare costs to anywhere else in the US is apples and oranges for me. As a consumer, I am more than willing to pay that difference for the convenience.

Do I think the higher cost is greed? No. I think it is a price based on supply and demand to maintain the courses for the year. If it was greed the prices would be pushed up until play went down during the winter. As someone that loves the convenience I mentioned above I am not sure where my breaking point for price would be before I went outside. On the other hand here comes May, I can play Palmer after 11 AM for $15'ish (I say ish as I do not remember actual cost) :thumbup:

I agree AJ - and no one here mentions the cost of the executive courses - which (if you walk them ) are FREE!!!

I also am willing to pay for the convenience. I work full time and want to get out on the course on weekends and have a cocktail on my lanai after... I don't want to be driving to another course etc. I guess I may feel differently about this when i retire.

The Morse family is not perfect. They may be greedy. But I still thank them for their vision that was started by Mr. Schwartz... and carried on..

[downeaster]

Of 21 local championship type golf courses reviewed in March, the top six most expensive for a Villager to play are all in the Villages?? This is not Harold Schwartz's vision of what he wanted the Villages to be at all.

I believe Mr. Shwartz's plan for free golf for life was based on executive courses. Subsequently it was determined there were some golfers wanting something more challenging. The decision was to add 18 hole courses but with greens fees, as our favorable amenity fees could not support those types of courses.

I look at it as being the best of both worlds. I play the executive courses exclusively but some of my friends prefer the 18 hole layout and seem quite happy with their choice. Some find The Villages championship courses to their liking and others prefer to play outside courses.

My guess is the Developer's decision to add championship courses was based on sound business sense. Some prefer to call it greed but I call it seizing an opportunity. It is also practical use of open areas.

[graciegirl]

I believe Mr. Shwartz's plan for free golf for life was based on executive courses. Subsequently it was determined there were some golfers wanting something more challenging. The decision was to add 18 hole courses but with greens fees, as our favorable amenity fees could not support those types of courses.

I look at it as being the best of both worlds. I play the executive courses exclusively but some of my friends prefer the 18 hole layout and seem quite happy with their choice. Some find The Villages championship courses to their liking and others prefer to play outside courses.

My guess is the Developer's decision to add championship courses was based on sound business sense. Some prefer to call it greed but I call it seizing an opportunity. It is also practical use of open areas.

AND beautiful use of open areas.

[buckscounty]

I would love to thank the Villages for the golf courses. I have stay all over Florida and these prices are great.

[schotzyb]

The only course I have problems here in The Villages with as far as green fees go is Palmer. I know it is the premier course here but to me it is just not worth the difference in cost to play it versus Glenview or Lopez.

[gary42651]

I know that alot of people do not like the cost of greens fee at Palmer Legends, but the course is one of the best in the area, and I was told that $10 of every greens fee goes to the Arnold Palmers Children/Womens hospital in Orlando.

[Russ_Boston]

I was told that $10 of every greens fee goes to the Arnold Palmers Children/Womens hospital in Orlando.

First I've heard of that - anyone else confirm?

[schotzyb]

I know that alot of people do not like the cost of greens fee at Palmer Legends, but the course is one of the best in the area, and I was told that $10 of every greens fee goes to the Arnold Palmers Children/Womens hospital in Orlando.


I am only going by a friend's word that works there and she stated that she has never heard of any of the green fees money going to the hospital. If so I would not feel so bad about playing it but I can't see playing it during the winter months at the higher rate. I do play it in the summer when the rates are lower.

[hedoman]

Yes the extra fee on Palmer goes into the Palmer Foundation which funds many community services in the Orlando Area.

[scroll]

That portion above the normal fee should be tax deductible for all that play as a charitable contribution. Much like a donation in which you receive back enumeration where the portion above the fair market value of the services or gift is tax deductible. I am sure the foundation is a 501 c exempt organization.

[Russ_Boston]

That portion above the normal fee should be tax deductible for all that play as a charitable contribution. Much like a donation in which you receive back enumeration where the portion above the fair market value of the services or gift is tax deductible. I am sure the foundation is a 501 c exempt organization.

Not so sure - i.e. buying girl scout cookies is not deductible (unless the cookies are donated back to the troop). This assumes that the price paid is fair market value.

I think Palmer should advertise this more.

[graciegirl]

Not so sure - i.e. buying girl scout cookies is not deductible (unless the cookies are donated back to the troop). This assumes that the price paid is fair market value.

I think Palmer should advertise this more.

If this is true it is nice.

If it isn't the Morses are gonna be SOBs.

I think the price is fair for Palmer.

[ajbrown]

Yes the extra fee on Palmer goes into the Palmer Foundation which funds many community services in the Orlando Area.

How did you find this information? I have heard a few "Village rumors" on this subject and always wondered the real facts.

Thanks

[graciegirl]

How did you find this information? I have heard a few "Village rumors" on this subject and always wondered the real facts.

Thanks

I heard that the money goes to Arnold Palmer for the licensing rights...now whether it is five dollars or five percent, I didn't hear and this is ONLY a rumor.

Licensing rights happen everywhere.

Rumors, even good ones like this happen everywhere.

It really makes no difference. It is the price of an 18 hole round on a decent course.

[schotzyb]

If this is true it is nice.

If it isn't the Morses are gonna be SOBs.

I think the price is fair for Palmer.

I am sorry but I disagree about it being a fair price for Palmer. Of course it is just my opinion and also the opinion of the other 15 guys in our Friday group. We just don't see a $10 improvement in it versus Glenview or Lopez. We played Lopez today and it was in great shape

[Taj44]

I haven't played Palmer lately so can't compare, but I do agree that Lopez and Glenview have been in wonderful shape. I wish they would spend the money or do what they have to to get the other courses in such good shape. Shotzyb, I agree that Palmer probably is not worth the extra $10 they charge priority members. It can't be that much nicer.

I drove by Mallory today, and it looked pretty dried out. Havana has been nice, but last week it too was dry and hard. I'm playing there tomorrow so will post my opinion.

[Pturner]

Of 21 local championship type golf courses reviewed in March, the top six most expensive for a Villager to play are all in the Villages?? This is not Harold Schwartz's vision of what he wanted the Villages to be at all.

Hi Warren,
Welcome to TOTV! I would also like a link to the review you saw, if you don't mind sharing.

To me, the golf fees in TV seem reasonable. They are higher during snowbird season but dirt cheap in summer. Did the review factor in the cost of cart rentals outside TV, where Villagers could not use their own carts? Also, did compare rates year-round, or just winter rates?

Thanks for the info.

[LittleDog]

Played Tierra today and the course was in wonderful shape. There was grass on the fairways and the greens were in great shape. :BigApplause:

John

[ajbrown]

Palmer is only $9 more than GV, NL and only $8 more than Havana, does that help :D??

This is the first year I can remember where I have played Palmer more in high season. Like others I typically pass on the uptick in price. When I judge a course, I get extremely excited about green quality, i.e., speed and trueness. TV is not a place you can typically get excited about green speed in the winter, not complaining just my opinion.

This year the times I have played Palmer they were as close to "tournament greens" I have played in TV. They have a good speed and they are true. I may be evil but to watch the face of an xx handicap (handicap omitted so as not to offend) rolll a downhill/side hill putt at Palmer by the hole as far as the original putt is quite entertaining :evil6:. To me it is worth the extra $9 twice a month or so to putt these greens. They are close to the way greens get at my home course in MA after the spring aeration fills in.....

I played Glenview and OB last week, Lopez yesterday; no doubt they are in great shape this year, but the greens are by my estimation 2 feet slower than Palmer. I do not carry a stimp meter, just a guess....

Looking forward to Tierra tomorrow. One of these days I am going to break my handicap there :grumpy:

[waterman1952]

FYI: It's snowing here in MA so I really wouldn't mind paying a premium right now, even if it was a lousy course! They were just starting to open too.