Underground Dog Fences

[Tbugs]

I just read the POA paper that was delivered on my driveway. On page 13, a letter to the editor states the concerns of a person who went for a walk and saw 2 dogs in the yard who were barking at the people walking by the yard. The dogs did not come out of the yard because they most likely had the underground dog fencing around the yard. The writer stated he did not believe dogs should be left outside in the yard.

The response from the POA newletter was that they forwarded the question to Diane Tucker, District Operations Manager, who oversees deed compliance and her response was: "The Restrictive Covenants state the pet(s) must be kept on a leash. We would be happy to have our Deed Compliance Officer talk with the property owner if you provide us with an address."

Basically, this is saying that even though you have underground fencing, the dogs have to be leashed. Does this sound correct? I always thought that if dogs were not allowed out of your yard, they were allowed to be unleashed.

[MikeH]

What is it about this sentence that is not understandable? "The Restrictive Covenants state the pet(s) must be kept on a leash."

[JSR22]

There would not be any purpose for underground fences if dogs need to be leashed on their property. The reason for underground fences are for the dogs to be unleashed on their property.

[Mark1130]

So this means that if I have a CYV with a fence I still cannot let my dog out without a leash?

[bike42]

Here's the exact wording (Sumter County): "Birds, fish, dogs and cats shall be permitted, with a maximum of two (2) pets per Homesite. Each Owner shall be personally responsible for damage caused to dedicated or reserved areas by any such pet and shall be responsible to immediately remove and dispose of any excrement of such pet and shall be responsible to keep such pet on a leash."

Since the leash statement is part of the sentence about dedicated or reserved areas, EITHER they need to be kept on leash while in those dedicated or reserved (public) areas OR they need to be on leash at all times, including in the house. Fish on leashes too. I think Ms. Tucker might want to check with a lawyer before she sends out the deed restriction police.

[K9-Lovers]

I love foreign films. No, this is not a hijack. There is a Korean film that is just wonderful, "Spring, Summer, Fall, Winter . . . And Spring". You don't have to know how to speak Korean, or read subtitles, because there is very little dialogue in this flick. One of the lessons to be learned by the main character is demonstrated by him putting a leash on a fish. YES! He ties a string around a fish, and ties the end to a rock. Now the poor fish is tethered. He feels guilty and returns to the pond, but the fish is already dead. His punishment (by his Buddhist Monk teacher) is to tether a large rock to himself with a rope. He wears this for some time.

Interesting movie. I watched it over 2 years ago, and still think about it occasionally.

Anyway, please don't put leashes on your fishes.

Here is a link to the movie trailer, which shows the leash on the fish. You have to get past a "Platoon" movie advertisement first.

http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi2441412889/

[Barefoot]

I'll leash my dogs on my property where they're confined by invisible fencing. No problem. But first, I want The Villages to leash the golf course alligators.

[graciegirl]

There are some people that do not like dogs and/or are afraid of them.

That is probably the reason for the original letter.

Wouldn't you hate to have to be the one who had to answer her and represent The Villages? Legally? What if the power went out? I'd hate to try to answer that letter.

Dogs may bark at you when they are in their yard with an invisible fence. They may think they are protecting their yard. People who don't like dogs are always not going to like dogs.

I like dogs. A LOT.

We have two cats.

I am Aunt to a dog named Lexi.

I really LOVE dogs.

[Tbugs]

Do the deed restrictions mean that dogs must be on a leash even though the yard has invisible fences? I would hate to see someone go to the expense of having an invisible fence installed and then find out they can be cited for having an unleashed dog in their yard that someone thinks might attack while they are walking on the street by that yard.

[Gerald]

It seems to me. That there is only a problem if the dog leaves the owners property. Since an electric fence could lose its power I can see why there might be a fear that the dog might run out and do whatever outside the owners property. Also since we can not fence in most of the properties with a physical fence that the dog can not get by I can understand the problem. Someone told me you could put in a small physical fenced in dog run on your property say on the side of the house. If that is true would that solve the problem for everyone. Just wondering at this point

[DonH57]

From restrictions I read there can be no physical fencing or visable containment means on any property of any construction. I'm only boggled by the start of this post as to what occurred originally. I'll read it again.

[bluedog103]

It seems to me. That there is only a problem if the dog leaves the owners property. Since an electric fence could lose its power I can see why there might be a fear that the dog might run out and do whatever outside the owners property. Also since we can not fence in most of the properties with a physical fence that the dog can not get by I can understand the problem. Someone told me you could put in a small physical fenced in dog run on your property say on the side of the house. If that is true would that solve the problem for everyone. Just wondering at this point


What if the leash breaks, what if it slips out of the person's hand, what if the dog walker falls and drops the leash, what if the dog barks even when on the leash, what if the person complaining is afraid the dog will pull free, what if...what if...what if....
If the dog stays in its yard, there is no problem.

[tony]

I think I would contend the invisible fence is, in fact, a leash. Dog are trained not to go beyond a certain boundary, and after a while if power is removed, the dog stays inside the boundary.

Friends of mine have it and I have seen that demonstrated.

That's just my view, from the outside looking in.

Some people would rather see fences permitted and have their neighbors own an invisible dog.

:)

[billnterri]

Tony is right. Our dog was trained to know where the boundaries are and she won't go near them. She doesn't know if the power is on or not, if the collar battery is dead or not, or if the system is unplugged (My husband likes to use that outlet for some reason and often fails to re-plug the invisible fence). I'm sure there is a slight possibility that a dog could get out, but again, at what point do we stop with the "what if's"?

[DonH57]

We had a failure of our invisable fence due to a line breakage about 8 months ago. It was repaired 2 weeks after the audible alarm signalled a problem. Our dog has been on the system since he was a puppy 4 years ago. He did'nt try to break thru and he actually never goes to the borders of our yard. He knows what that warning tone means.

[Pturner]

Here's the exact wording (Sumter County): "Birds, fish, dogs and cats shall be permitted, with a maximum of two (2) pets per Homesite. Each Owner shall be personally responsible for damage caused to dedicated or reserved areas by any such pet and shall be responsible to immediately remove and dispose of any excrement of such pet and shall be responsible to keep such pet on a leash."

Since the leash statement is part of the sentence about dedicated or reserved areas, EITHER they need to be kept on leash while in those dedicated or reserved (public) areas OR they need to be on leash at all times, including in the house. Fish on leashes too. I think Ms. Tucker might want to check with a lawyer before she sends out the deed restriction police.

Bike42, excellent observation for what it's worth. You are right! As the statement is written, either pets need to be leashed only in dedicated or reserve areas or they need to be leashed at all times, including in the house. Good catch!

That's too funny.

[philnpat]

When we had an invisible fence for our dog, she would run and bark at people walking by the house. I can understand the concern of walkers especially if they weren't dog lovers. To lessen their fears, we put small flags along the front boundry informing them that our dog was contained by the invisible fence. A few even encouraged her to cross the line...but...she knew her boundries.

[JSR22]

I think a lot of the dog issues would disappear if TV started building designer homes with courtyards.

[bike42]

Bike42, excellent observation for what it's worth. You are right! As the statement is written, either pets need to be leashed only in dedicated or reserve areas or they need to be leashed at all times, including in the house. Good catch!

That's too funny.

I wrote a letter-to-the-editors of POA, asking the same question (a little more politely), and requesting clarification from Ms. Tucker.

[SALYBOW]

It seems to me. That there is only a problem if the dog leaves the owners property. Since an electric fence could lose its power I can see why there might be a fear that the dog might run out and do whatever outside the owners property. Also since we can not fence in most of the properties with a physical fence that the dog can not get by I can understand the problem. Someone told me you could put in a small physical fenced in dog run on your property say on the side of the house. If that is true would that solve the problem for everyone. Just wondering at this point
I had an electric fence up North. Once the dog knows the limits it no longer needs the collar to stop short of the shock zone. Ergo, if the power goes out, the dog won't realize it and will stop short of a shock anyway.

[ladydoc]

As I have said before, it might keep your dog in, but it does not keep other dogs out. I saw a dog running free on our LSP and more then one poster talked about seeing coyotes. That was enough for me to decide against the invisible fence. But then, I am a very overly complusive person when it comes to my 4 legged kids.

[bluedog103]

As I have said before, it might keep your dog in, but it does not keep other dogs out. I saw a dog running free on our LSP and more then one poster talked about seeing coyotes. That was enough for me to decide against the invisible fence. But then, I am a very overly complusive person when it comes to my 4 legged kids.

We'd better get out there and hook those coyotes to leashes. If anyone is terrified of my shih-tzu in her own yard, they'll **** if they see a coyote roaming free.

[The Great Fumar]

There would not be any purpose for underground fences if dogs need to be leashed on their property. The reason for underground fences are for the dogs to be unleashed on their property.

Personally I would rather see underground dogs for underground fences, Just a personal preference !!!:girlneener:

[swimdawg]

I am Aunt to a dog named Lexi.

I really LOVE dogs.

Is Lexi a dawg or a dog? Just curious.

[bike42]

I just read the POA paper that was delivered on my driveway. On page 13, a letter to the editor states the concerns of a person who went for a walk and saw 2 dogs in the yard who were barking at the people walking by the yard. The dogs did not come out of the yard because they most likely had the underground dog fencing around the yard. The writer stated he did not believe dogs should be left outside in the yard.

The response from the POA newletter was that they forwarded the question to Diane Tucker, District Operations Manager, who oversees deed compliance and her response was: "The Restrictive Covenants state the pet(s) must be kept on a leash. We would be happy to have our Deed Compliance Officer talk with the property owner if you provide us with an address."

Basically, this is saying that even though you have underground fencing, the dogs have to be leashed. Does this sound correct? I always thought that if dogs were not allowed out of your yard, they were allowed to be unleashed.

Pages 14-15-16 of the July POA Bulletin give Diane Tucker's response, which I THINK says the District has no jurisdiction over dogs off leash ON your property because that is not "use or appearance of 'real property'". All three counties' leash laws require dogs to be on leashes when off your property (we knew that).

I take this to mean that invisible fences are OK and dogs do not need to be on leash if they are contained on your own property.

What do you think?

If you don't have a copy, you can download the POA bulletin at http://www.poa4us.org/bulletins_files/bulletin201107.pdf

[ladydoc]

Pages 14-15-16 of the July POA Bulletin give Diane Tucker's response, which I THINK says the District has no jurisdiction over dogs off leash ON your property because that is not "use or appearance of 'real property'". All three counties' leash laws require dogs to be on leashes when off your property (we knew that).

I take this to mean that invisible fences are OK and dogs do not need to be on leash if they are contained on your own property.

What do you think?

If you don't have a copy, you can download the POA bulletin at http://www.poa4us.org/bulletins_files/bulletin201107.pdf

That would seem to be perfectly reasonable, logical and correct. So it is probably wrong. NO, just kidding. Why go through the expense of an underground fence if you have to keep your furry kid on leash? I do not intend to keep the kids on a leash in our fenced courtyard...

[Tbugs]

Sounds like common sense prevails on both the invisible fences and the courtyard villas for dogs.

Did anyone see the television clip or read the article in the Daily Sun of the 12 foot alligator coming into someone's backyard in Melbourne, Florida, and attacking their 110 pound dog? The alligator was roaming around due to the drought, they said. The CYV would have been safer than the invisible fence for that dog!!

[dpingram]

I have used invisible fencing for my dogs for the the last 27 years. The most important feature of the invisible fencing is the proper training of your dog. Most people are in a hurry and do not take the time for this training.
A couple of points concerning invisible fencing:
1. My system has a battery backup. If the power goes off, the battery takes over.
2. If there is a break in the wire, there is an audible signal.
3. If the collar needs to be recharged, there is an audible signal.

As I stated, proper training is essential.
We recently moved in and will wait until landscaping etc.. is done before installing the invisible fencing. Since, my dogs have been fully trained they are aware of the significance of the flags. So, I put up the flags to aquaint them with the boundaries. They will not go anywhere near the flags, even when the cow behind us moos. I even put a toy they wanted in the yard of the empty house behind me to test their reaction. They just stood there and stared at the toy until I retrieved it for them. All this and the wire is not in the ground and they do not have on collars.

4. For the safety of my pets, they would not be left out at night or when we were not at home.
5. Because the front lawn areas are small, my dogs are confined to the rear and side rea sections of the yard.

[marianne237]

We live across a very busy street from neighbors who put invisible fencing up for their dogs. We also watched as one of the dogs jumped over the barrier and chased a golf cart down the street. So glad it wasn't our dog.

[bluedog103]

We live across a very busy street from neighbors who put invisible fencing up for their dogs. We also watched as one of the dogs jumped over the barrier and chased a golf cart down the street. So glad it wasn't our dog.
As Dpingram said, training is essential, there is no substitute.

[Jim Straz]

Like my Uncle Tony said, 'you can never win an argument with an ignorant person'. Reminds me of the people who buy the house next to the airport and then complain about all the noise. A rule is a rule and it was there before you came.

[bike42]

Like my Uncle Tony said, 'you can never win an argument with an ignorant person'. Reminds me of the people who buy the house next to the airport and then complain about all the noise. A rule is a rule and it was there before you came.

Which rule are you talking about here?

[bluedog103]

Which rule are you talking about here?
Bike, I had the same question. :loco:

[bike42]

Here's the definitive answer to the question about whether invisible dog fences are permitted in TV, and whether they are considered to be "restraint" (i.e., same as having your dog on a leash) -- from Diane Tucker, in the "Our Place" column 12/22/11:

"“Are invisible fences allowed?” The answer is yes. While the deed restrictions do not allow fences, the invisible fence (also called a pet fence) is underground and is considered a pet restraint."

[brostholder]

Let me start by saying that I love dogs and that my wife and I have been "transporters" for a number of different rescue organizations over the years. But if I am out walking and I see your dog furiously growling and running at me, I have no idea if that dog is going to stop at the edge of the owners property, or continue on.

[drdodge]

In districts 1 thru 5 they do not enforce the leash law. In today's recreation news on page two there is an article that says'When the Board of Supervisors for district1-5 and village center adopted their rule to enforce certain external deed restrictions, this specific restriction was not adopted as part of the rule.
drd

[bike42]

All dog control issues are under the jurisdiction of each county's animal control office. If you have a complaint about barking or off leash animals, or find a lost animal and so forth, call your county animal control. TV will refer you to them if you call them first.

[MCCoene]

If you read today paper, Thursday, 12/22, in the Recreation News, page 2, there is a paragraph by Diane Tucker near the end of her article that reads:

"Another question we receive is, "Are invisible fences allowed?". The answer is Yes. While the deed restrictions do not allow fences, the invisible fence (also called a pet fence) is underground and is considered a pet restraint.

This should answer the question

[John_W]

I often ride my bike around Odessa Circle since it circles the villas in which I live and about ten laps makes a nice workout and it's all residential, very little traffic. Otherwise I would have to go out on St. Charles and ride in the golf cart lane and mix in with much heavier traffic.

One owner on Odessa Circle has probably the tallest dog I've ever seen. It's a black and white Dalmatian that must weigh 200 pounds, it's huge. What's scary is the dog is usually standing in the driveway a couple of days a week and even though I had seen the 'Invisible Fence' truck in front of the home a couple of months ago, it creeps me out everytime I ride by. I can only imagine someone else going by and not knowing that. To me, the invisible fence has a purpose, but it's far from the perfect solution.