Violation Tickets

[nanci2539]

My neighbor told me that she and her husband were in Spanish Springs listening to the music in the square in their golf cart The couple next to them were drinking wine and beer (in their golf cart). A police officer came over and handed them a ticket for public drinking. He explained that sitting in a vehicle even a non moving vehicle with an open alchololic beverage is a violation. The couple was so shocked they couldn't speak.

Now if they were standing next to their golf cart or on a sidewalk in the square drinking, that's not against the law!

Is this something that's been going on for awhile or is it a new policy. I know if you have open alcohol in a car and you're stopped for any reason, you can be ticketed for that but we always thought the squares were exempt from this.

[skyguy79]

My neighbor told me that she and her husband were in Spanish Springs listening to the music in the square in their golf cart The couple next to them were drinking wine and beer (in their golf cart). A police officer came over and handed them a ticket for public drinking. He explained that sitting in a vehicle even a non moving vehicle with an open alchololic beverage is a violation. The couple was so shocked they couldn't speak.

Now if they were standing next to their golf cart or on a sidewalk in the square drinking, that's not against the law!

Is this something that's been going on for awhile or is it a new policy. I know if you have open alcohol in a car and you're stopped for any reason, you can be ticketed for that but we always thought the squares were exempt from this.I can't say say this particular case, but I have heard of people being charged with driving under the influence in similar situations. Aside from that, I did have one motorist ask me at work if he could be arrested for driving under the influence while on his front porch drinking a beer. In my position (MV Enforcement Supervisor) I had to hold back the urge to bust out laughing at the guy! :loco:

[ajbrown]

I sure hope there is more to the story, as why an officer would do this fails my common sense test. On a night where we do not feel like staying at the square Linda and I enjoy parking at the square and having a beverage in our cart while listening to the band.

From my experience the officer would be pretty busy if they handed out a ticket to anyone sitting in a parking space at the square enjoying the band and an alcoholic beverage.

Maybe I am wrong again....

[graciegirl]

Maybe they have been experiencing a lot of broken gate arms around eight or nine at night. Sometimes caused by twofers at the squares?

[Jim 9922]

If I remember correctly, the cops wrote a whole bunch of tickets for open drinking in parked golf carts a couple of years ago. Must be budget shortfall time again and quick revenues have to be raised! Or maybe its ticket quota time again.
Too bad the cops don't go after the loud mufflers, rolling stop sign violations, excessive speeding on Moris Blvd, drunk drivers etc. But that would be too hard, those people are moving.
Lets work on enforcing real safety issues, not enforcing the letter of the law.

[memason]

I sure hope there is more to the story, as why an officer would do this fails my common sense test. On a night where we do not feel like staying at the square Linda and I enjoy parking at the square and having a beverage in our cart while listening to the band.

From my experience the officer would be pretty busy if they handed out a ticket to anyone sitting in a parking space at the square enjoying the band and an alcoholic beverage.

Maybe I am wrong again....


AJ.... I agree with the common sense test. It could very well be a true story, but I'm always cautious when a post starts; "My neighbor told me..."

Just my thinking...I've been wrong before :p

[nitehawk]

I would think that a open container ticket is an individual ticket, and made out to whoever had the open container - for a cop to walk over and hand them a ticket does make sense "A police officer came over and handed them a ticket for public drinking."

[railroadman]

This is a prime example why, in todays economy, local police do very little patrolling.

Patrolling does not pay anything!

[Regor]

I know if you have open alcohol in a car and you're stopped for any reason, you can be ticketed for that but we always thought the squares were exempt from this.

LMAO! That is funny! Exempt! This really isn't Disney World! Those are public roads!

[red tail]

LMAO! That is funny! Exempt! This really isn't Disney World! Those are public roads!

i thought the squares were private property

[Tbugs]

The streets are public property and therefore, laws must be obeyed.

[logdog]

I believe the question was whether or not the squires were private property and by extension whether the parking area around the squire was private property. If the cart in question was parked in the squire parking spot and not on the public road, is the citation valid? If the squires are not private property, then everyone drinking an adult beverage anywhere in and around the squires could be cited for public drinking or open container. I'm not a cop or lawyer, just asking a question.

[red tail]

The streets are public property and therefore, laws must be obeyed.

is that an opinion or a fact?

[skip0358]

Then why when there is a parade or chili cookoff or a show of some sort when the tables and chairs are set up for the event is it legal. Last time I looked they were in the street?

[DENNIS G]

They have been doing that in Spanish springs for 8 years that we have been here. We were friends of one of the Lady Lake officers, he says they consider an open container in a cart the same as a vehicle. You are presumptive if sitting in the cart or vehicle drinking, and they can write tickets. Saw it happen numerous times over there. Haven't seen it yet at Lake Sumter, but hardly ever see an officer patroling, maybe a quick trip around the square.

[paulandjean]

Seems awhile back,someone said to me,If you are drinking at the square in your cart,make sure you take the keys out of the ignition.Something about the drinking and driving laws.

[Bogie Shooter]

I believe the question was whether or not the squires were private property and by extension whether the parking area around the squire was private property. If the cart in question was parked in the squire parking spot and not on the public road, is the citation valid? If the squires are not private property, then everyone drinking an adult beverage anywhere in and around the squires could be cited for public drinking or open container. I'm not a cop or lawyer, just asking a question.

Would that be the squares?

[Pturner]

Is SS in Lake County? Lake County must be low on dough.

I think they followed the letter but not the "spirit" (:rolleyes:) of the law.

[Raymond]

I believe the question was whether or not the squires were private property and by extension whether the parking area around the squire was private property. If the cart in question was parked in the squire parking spot and not on the public road, is the citation valid?

Yes, it is valid Fl. Statutes 316.1936. This apply's also for DUI on private property, Fl Statutes 316.193

[handyman]

Does that mean you can not have beer on the golf courses?and if not, what is the difference

[logdog]

Would that be the squares?

Sorry, squares would be correct. I blame an over reliance on spel-chek. Plus I was drinking at the time of the post (but not at the square).

[handyman]

Were the people being loud?This would have a bearing on how I would feel about this case,I mean if the people were just sitting and enjoying themselves.But if not then I think I'm going to have to take this into consideration before I commit...............

[graciegirl]

Does that mean you can not have beer on the golf courses?and if not, what is the difference

Well...I may be blonde but I know this...The difference between beer on the golf course and no beer on the golf course is several strokes and much less distance and not good directionality.

[skyguy79]

Sorry, squares would be correct. I blame an over reliance on spel-chek. Plus I was drinking at the time of the post (but not at the square).I caught the error too, but I just ignored it thinking you were fanticizing or day dreaming that you were a prince back in the days of King Arthur and his round table! :icon_bored:

[EdV]

Seems awhile back,someone said to me,If you are drinking at the square in your cart,make sure you take the keys out of the ignition.Something about the drinking and driving laws.


Yes, Florida Statute 316.1936. refers to an open container of an alcoholic beverage while operating a vehicle in the state. My understand is that your are considered to be operating a vehicle if the keys are in the ignition, even if the motor is turned off.

So perhaps the solution is to remove the keys before opening or purchasing libation at the squares and discarding the containers before driving off.

[ajbrown]

Yes, Florida Statute 316.1936. refers to an open container of an alcoholic beverage while operating a vehicle in the state. My understand is that your are considered to be operating a vehicle if the keys are in the ignition, even if the motor is turned off.

So perhaps the solution is to remove the keys before opening or purchasing libation at the squares and discarding the containers before driving off.

I stand by my initial reaction in post #3, but if we do pursue this for discussion sake over coffee which is fun; I ponder if a golf cart is a motor vehicle at all under the law? Unless they were in an LSV (maybe they were??) I think the golf cart is more like a bicycle than a motor vehicle in the eyes of the law.

Alan is no lawyer, just chatting over :beer3:, oh sorry, wrong icon, :mornincoffee:.

[redwitch]

If a golf cart is considered to be in the same class as a bike, then the ticket would be appropriate -- you can get a DUI for riding a bike intoxicated. If you sit (well, stand with bottom resting on the seat) on your bike with an open container, you can be cited.

This may well be a money maker for Lake County but the reality is there is too much drinking and driving in golf carts and the results are not always pretty. Wish people could understand that drinking and driving don't mix and that's true whether it's a car, a golf cart, a bike, whatever. If you're going to be in a moving contraption, drink responsibly. If it takes ticketing people sitting in their golf carts drinking to remind people that drinking laws apply to golf carts just as they do to cars, then ticket away.

We may not like all laws and there are ways to change laws but if you choose to break a law, don't whine when it costs you. As I've admitted, I'm a speeder. I do get pulled over. I don't try to talk my way out of a ticket. Most times I'm lucky and only get a warning. When I do get a ticket, I thank the officer for being polite and doing his/her job, pay the fine and go on my way. I know when I'm breaking the law and, if I don't, then maybe I should find out what the law is rather than blaming the officer who does know the law or crying that the city is only making money and my illegality is harmless.

[ssmith]

Wow Red! You mean you are an adult and are willing to take responsibility for your actions! I knew I admired you! So many think they are a victim or should not have to take the consequences of their actions... Nice post.

[downeaster]

If a golf cart is considered to be in the same class as a bike, then the ticket would be appropriate -- you can get a DUI for riding a bike intoxicated. If you sit (well, stand with bottom resting on the seat) on your bike with an open container, you can be cited.

This may well be a money maker for Lake County but the reality is there is too much drinking and driving in golf carts and the results are not always pretty. Wish people could understand that drinking and driving don't mix and that's true whether it's a car, a golf cart, a bike, whatever. If you're going to be in a moving contraption, drink responsibly. If it takes ticketing people sitting in their golf carts drinking to remind people that drinking laws apply to golf carts just as they do to cars, then ticket away.

We may not like all laws and there are ways to change laws but if you choose to break a law, don't whine when it costs you. As I've admitted, I'm a speeder. I do get pulled over. I don't try to talk my way out of a ticket. Most times I'm lucky and only get a warning. When I do get a ticket, I thank the officer for being polite and doing his/her job, pay the fine and go on my way. I know when I'm breaking the law and, if I don't, then maybe I should find out what the law is rather than blaming the officer who does know the law or crying that the city is only making money and my illegality is harmless.

Well said, Red. I like and admire your attitude.

[graciegirl]

If a golf cart is considered to be in the same class as a bike, then the ticket would be appropriate -- you can get a DUI for riding a bike intoxicated. If you sit (well, stand with bottom resting on the seat) on your bike with an open container, you can be cited.

This may well be a money maker for Lake County but the reality is there is too much drinking and driving in golf carts and the results are not always pretty. Wish people could understand that drinking and driving don't mix and that's true whether it's a car, a golf cart, a bike, whatever. If you're going to be in a moving contraption, drink responsibly. If it takes ticketing people sitting in their golf carts drinking to remind people that drinking laws apply to golf carts just as they do to cars, then ticket away.

We may not like all laws and there are ways to change laws but if you choose to break a law, don't whine when it costs you. As I've admitted, I'm a speeder. I do get pulled over. I don't try to talk my way out of a ticket. Most times I'm lucky and only get a warning. When I do get a ticket, I thank the officer for being polite and doing his/her job, pay the fine and go on my way. I know when I'm breaking the law and, if I don't, then maybe I should find out what the law is rather than blaming the officer who does know the law or crying that the city is only making money and my illegality is harmless.

Well said, Red!! (Sometimes I wonder how many people who have had serious problems with drinking and driving are now driving golf carts, thinking it is not as dangerous)

[PylutDood]

..how many police officers do NOT really know the law. There are Local, municipal, county, State and Federal Statutes and many overlap. Many times an officer will cite a statute that is "Close" to what the violation is and the statute will be interpreted in the "Field" to "Fit" the case (violation) and not followed to the letter.

So, is public drinking in the Squares pretty much a common and accepted practice? If allowed?...by who? TV?, Driving a Golf Car on a (so called) public street certainly seems to be.

Florida Statutes, as well as local, almost everywhere, state that it is a violation to operate a golf Car on a public street. So...I'am convinced there is some kind of "Exemption" coming into play here. The question is...where do the limits of the exemption (considering there is an exemption) extend to? The curb...the sidewalk? Or...no further than the railing along the outside patio of the vendor that you purchased the drink from?

Also...by legal definition a "Vehicle" in the State of Florida is defined as a motorized vehicle that is Registered, Tagged, insured and certified (usually by the manufacturer) legal to operate on public roadways.

As I see it, a golf car is not.

To what degree is "Public Drinking" a violation? Is it a felony, misdemeanor, or a local code violation? Excatly WHAT statute was cited as reference? It must be noted on the citation of violation.

If it were me in this circumstance, I would be looking into it further and doing some research and perhaps a court date before a judge would be in order. At the worst it may cost you a few extra bucks in court costs and at best you may be able to have the case dismissed entirely.

I would at least TRY !!! Any "Drinking" violation on your record could trigger warning flags in a lot of places (Auto, health insurance companies, employement background checks, driver license renewals, etc). It could be interpreted that you may have a "problem".

[ajbrown]

I want to be clear, none of my posts are defending anyone for OUI. The discussion of this thread for me was about folks sitting comfortably in their cart on a warm evening listening to a band at the square while having AN alcoholic beverage and being fined for that.

Meanwhile someone siting in a chair in front of the cart has had four martinis and does not get a fine? Still does not pass the common sense test.

That is why I wonder if there is not more to the story, e.g., officer watched person drink many drinks and witnessed erratic behavior.

[LittleDog]

I was talking to a friend yesterday and mentioned this about being cited for drinking in a golf cart. He said if the key was in the ignition than you can be cited. I was wondering whether you can be cited if the key was not in the ignition? Anyone know.

John

[skyguy79]

I was talking to a friend yesterday and mentioned this about being cited for drinking in a golf cart. He said if the key was in the ignition than you can be cited. I was wondering whether you can be cited if the key was not in the ignition? Anyone know.

JohnIMHO, the situation you describe would be at the disgression of the officer present based on what he observes. Many have been charged on presumptive evidence with court findings going in either direction. As for me, if I had any doubt what-so-ever as to the potential outcome of having or consuming alchoholic drinks while in the golf cart, I would just sit in the cart and enjoy the concert with soft drinks only. If for any reason I just couldn't do that, then I think we all know, without saying what one of my two possible problems might be!

[rubicon]

They have been doing that in Spanish springs for 8 years that we have been here. We were friends of one of the Lady Lake officers, he says they consider an open container in a cart the same as a vehicle. You are presumptive if sitting in the cart or vehicle drinking, and they can write tickets. Saw it happen numerous times over there. Haven't seen it yet at Lake Sumter, but hardly ever see an officer patroling, maybe a quick trip around the square.

There is a thread with a listing of Bashing police enforcment or something to that effect. i left a post there. Perhaps members here ought to visit that thread too because the majority view is that only whiners complain about getting tickets. Wow afraid to drive the streets the cartpaths and now sitting in my cart at the square. so much as Florida's Friendliest City

[rubicon]

Its called Police Bashing Forum

[GeorgeT]

There is a thread with a listing of Bashing police enforcment or something to that effect. i left a post there. Perhaps members here ought to visit that thread too because the majority view is that only whiners complain about getting tickets. Wow afraid to drive the streets the cartpaths and now sitting in my cart at the square. so much as Florida's Friendliest City

Are you saying to be Florida's friendliest city you have to be allowed to drive your cart drunk?

[Sail41]

Why can't the PD post the laws in the paper for all to read and end any confusion?

[BigLew]

i thought the squares were private property

the squares yes, the roads no. sitting in the cart is sitting in the street not ON the square :rant-rave:

[BigLew]

There is a thread with a listing of Bashing police enforcment or something to that effect. i left a post there. Perhaps members here ought to visit that thread too because the majority view is that only whiners complain about getting tickets. Wow afraid to drive the streets the cartpaths and now sitting in my cart at the square. so much as Florida's Friendliest City

that should slow down cops giving tickets! :girlneener:

[hrp01]

The truth is that Sumter county Sheriff and Lady Lake Police have been "heavy handed" in the enforcement of minor infractions..I,personally have not been victim, but I know of others that have..I have witnessed arrogance by some officers and what I perceive as disdain for the senior community here..

The tax base here is greater than the entire county of sumter at least,and we have become easy targets..Come on, 18 in a 15 mph cart path, golf cart speed traps, this is just petty..If you look at some of the fines involved it really is cash to the abusers of power...You'd think, that with the conservative political base here,and the fact we have a prominent Florida politician in residence,that this perception could be corrected, by doing real police work..,There is a huge crystal meth problem in the areaa surrounding Lady Lake,just look at the reports of raided labs recently...We had six individuals participate in a torture murder just at our western boundary..These are examples of recent,local crimes reported..And this requires real police work...Not the golf cart commandos...

For the record,my family is heavily involved in law enforcement and are consumate professionals in their work..They have had some real laughs (at our expense) over some of the reported incidents that have taken place with our local public service agencies...My perception of local law enforcement, is that they have grown lazy, and are now biting the hand that feeds them...

[rubicon]

Are you saying to be Florida's friendliest city you have to be allowed to drive your cart drunk?

George T...No As an ex-officer you are making some assumption. these folks are parked at the square with an open container, that's all so far. You don't know if they are drunk? And since they are not driving they yet have been driving drunk. And you don't know who will ultimately drive that cart to its next destination. A friendly cop in Florida's Friendliest City might have a nice chat with these folks to assess the situation rather than just issuing a ticket as was explained in an earlier post.

George I recognize the difficult job police officer have but sometimes they just create their own dilemmas

[downeaster]

I would like to pose a few questions.

Where does it say golf cart paths have a 15MPH limit? (BTW, I don't believe the police have jurisdiction on golf cart paths.)

Did someone actually get a ticket for going 18MPH on a golf path?

Where are or where were golf cart speed traps?

If an officer observes a violation is he/she supposed to turn a blind eye?

Are not golf carts limited to "not capable" of speeds in excess of 20MPH?

[duffysmom]

The latest POA newspaper had an article on Cart Safety and reported at the May AAC meeting, Chairman Bell advised, "I will make a statement that was made to me, 'we have had ten people die in golf cart accidents in the last five years'." Personally, I do not want to be on the road with anyone who is impaired; it doesn't matter whether it's an automobile or cart DO NOT DRINK AND DRIVE.:swear: It's a no brainer.

[GeorgeT]

George T...No As an ex-officer you are making some assumption. these folks are parked at the square with an open container, that's all so far. You don't know if they are drunk? And since they are not driving they yet have been driving drunk. And you don't know who will ultimately drive that cart to its next destination. A friendly cop in Florida's Friendliest City might have a nice chat with these folks to assess the situation rather than just issuing a ticket as was explained in an earlier post.

George I recognize the difficult job police officer have but sometimes they just create their own dilemmas

Who said I was an ex officer? I'm not. You think that for TV to be a friendly community the police need to let us drive around or sit parked with an open container. This is your quote below. You don't mention an open container but that's what we're talking about here.

"Wow afraid to drive the streets the cartpaths and now sitting in my cart at the square. so much as Florida's Friendliest City"

[handyman]

were all ten of these people intoxicated?Were all of these accidents caused by intoxicated golf cart drivers?just askin

[Tbugs]

Downeaster -

The cart paths are multi-modal trails. They are for golf carts, bikes, walking, jogging, skating, unicycling, etc. They are not for cars or motorcycles. Police do not monitor or have jurisdiction on these trails. Golf carts are limited to 20 mph but no tickets are issued for speeding on the trails.

On the streets, carts are still limited to 20 mph. I believe, not sure though, that "Street Legal" carts which have a license plate for Florida can do 25 mph. Quite a few people have the gear ratios changed on their carts so they can do a lot faster than 20 mph. This is illegal and will cost you big fines if caught speeding in the street.

[skip0358]

were all ten of these people intoxicated?Were all of these accidents caused by intoxicated golf cart drivers?just askin

A lot of times people assume accidents & alcohol go hand in hand. That's not usually the case. Just ride around see how many people here are talking on the phone, driving faster then they should be in some areas,checking out the scenery,chatting with the person next to them or just plain daydreaming. The other day while heading up town two golf carts in a hurry pulled out in front of this car. Thank goodness the car driver was alert or there would have been 2 more GC wrecks. What's the hurry. I'm not saying accidents don't happen with alcohol involved I've seen plenty of both retired with 42 years in the fire service. Lets all be safe and responsible.

[Barefoot]

The Villages, and the Town Squares, seem to have some very unique "rules". You can shop on vendor night with a drink in your hand. You can wait for a restaurant reservation, and sit outside enjoying a drink from the inside bar. You can walk on the boardwalk with a drink in your hand. If you order a bottle of wine in a restaurant and drink half of it, the wait staff will tell you to take the bottle home with you. You can watch the sun set at Sunset Point on the Bridge, and have cocktails.

I'm very surprised that they would ticket someone at SS sitting in their golfcart enjoying a beverage. Perhaps some of these things aren't legal, but it sure seems that they are, based on four years of observation. Clarification is definitely required on this subject.

[downeaster]

Downeaster -

The cart paths are multi-modal trails. They are for golf carts, bikes, walking, jogging, skating, unicycling, etc. They are not for cars or motorcycles. Police do not monitor or have jurisdiction on these trails. Golf carts are limited to 20 mph but no tickets are issued for speeding on the trails.

On the streets, carts are still limited to 20 mph. I believe, not sure though, that "Street Legal" carts which have a license plate for Florida can do 25 mph. Quite a few people have the gear ratios changed on their carts so they can do a lot faster than 20 mph. This is illegal and will cost you big fines if caught speeding in the street.

I am aware of the above. The post to which I was referring used the term "cart path". Cart paths are on golf courses and only golf traffic is permitted on them.

I would like to add to the section I highlighted. Not only can it cost big fines. They can require the offender to restore the cart to original manufacturers' specs.

Last, but not least, is insurance coverage. By tampering with the vehicle to make it capable of speeds exceeding 20MPH, they may have voided their insurance coverage. In the event of an accident, regardless of fault, the claims adjuster is going to discover the vehicle is not really a golf cart and coverage may be denied.

With all of the pitfalls of exceeding 20MPH, I can not understand why people do it.

[Tbugs]

Barefoot, you are absolutely right. Something just does not make sense. There are a couple of possibilities.

1) It really did not happen. The initial post says that a neighbor told someone that a couple next to them got ticketed. Well, as we all know, things do get mixed up when handed down second and third hand.

2) If it did happen - the legal technicality might be the keys were in the switch. Stupid technicality, I know, but it makes it a legal infraction to have an open container in a vehicle either moving or stopped with keys in the switch. Just remove the key and you are safe.

Downeaster made a couple of excellent remarks about the costs of upgrading the speed of your cart - especially the insurance one.

[rubicon]

The truth is that Sumter county Sheriff and Lady Lake Police have been "heavy handed" in the enforcement of minor infractions..I,personally have not been victim, but I know of others that have..I have witnessed arrogance by some officers and what I perceive as disdain for the senior community here..

The tax base here is greater than the entire county of sumter at least,and we have become easy targets..Come on, 18 in a 15 mph cart path, golf cart speed traps, this is just petty..If you look at some of the fines involved it really is cash to the abusers of power...You'd think, that with the conservative political base here,and the fact we have a prominent Florida politician in residence,that this perception could be corrected, by doing real police work..,There is a huge crystal meth problem in the areaa surrounding Lady Lake,just look at the reports of raided labs recently...We had six individuals participate in a torture murder just at our western boundary..These are examples of recent,local crimes reported..And this requires real police work...Not the golf cart commandos...

For the record,my family is heavily involved in law enforcement and are consumate professionals in their work..They have had some real laughs (at our expense) over some of the reported incidents that have taken place with our local public service agencies...My perception of local law enforcement, is that they have grown lazy, and are now biting the hand that feeds them...

Thank you, I thought I was only me noticed. This cash cow mentality is prevalent throughout TV and beyond. I actually had one contractor tell me that he resented people moving in the area but it was putting his kids through school. I did not help contribute to his kids college fund and hired another contractor..

Two years ago when down at the square I watched a guy try and kid with one of the cops. It was innocent funny and respectful but th cop appear not to have a sense of humor and quickly his words and body actions told me he was geting angry but this guy wasn't seeing this so I nudged the guy and told him he might want to keep moving. clearly the cop had not shown he hd a sense of humor.

[GeorgeT]

Barefoot, you are absolutely right. Something just does not make sense. There are a couple of possibilities.

1) It really did not happen. The initial post says that a neighbor told someone that a couple next to them got ticketed. Well, as we all know, things do get mixed up when handed down second and third hand.

2) If it did happen - the legal technicality might be the keys were in the switch. Stupid technicality, I know, but it makes it a legal infraction to have an open container in a vehicle either moving or stopped with keys in the switch. Just remove the key and you are safe.

Downeaster made a couple of excellent remarks about the costs of upgrading the speed of your cart - especially the insurance one.

I noticed an ad on this site that claims they can increase the speed of your cart. Hmmmmmmmmmm.

[2BNTV]

The Villages, and the Town Squares, seem to have some very unique "rules". You can shop on vendor night with a drink in your hand. You can wait for a restaurant reservation, and sit outside enjoying a drink from the inside bar. You can walk on the boardwalk with a drink in your hand. If you order a bottle of wine in a restaurant and drink half of it, the wait staff will tell you to take the bottle home with you. You can watch the sun set at Sunset Point on the Bridge, and have cocktails.

I'm very surprised that they would ticket someone at SS sitting in their golfcart enjoying a beverage. Perhaps some of these things aren't legal, but it sure seems that they are, based on four years of observation. Clarification is definitely required on this subject.

Barefoot, you are absolutely right. Something just does not make sense. There are a couple of possibilities.

1) It really did not happen. The initial post says that a neighbor told someone that a couple next to them got ticketed. Well, as we all know, things do get mixed up when handed down second and third hand.

2) If it did happen - the legal technicality might be the keys were in the switch. Stupid technicality, I know, but it makes it a legal infraction to have an open container in a vehicle either moving or stopped with keys in the switch. Just remove the key and you are safe.

Downeaster made a couple of excellent remarks about the costs of upgrading the speed of your cart - especially the insurance one.

I totally agree with barefoot that clarifiication is needed on this subject.

Tbugs - I agree that "something does not make sense".

When determining who's telling the truth in her court cases, Judy Judy always says that "if something does not make sense, then it's not true".

[rubicon]

Yes, clarification is needed. Was the ticket a motor vehicle violation or a general civil violation? DUI/open container or public drinking? The original post says public drinking. If that is so (public drinking), all of the discussion about keys in the ignition and stuff like that is totally irrelevant.

I don't know if the laws have changed since those experiences I mentioned in my prior post. If they are the same, you cannot drink on public property. The streets are public property. It might very well be illegal to take a drink and cross the street from a restaurant over to the square. I know it was very illegal to cross the street with a drink during the Daytona Turkey Run. You had to finish you drink and buy another one on the other side of the street to keep it legal. Or you could cheat and pour your beer from a clear beer cup into a colored soda cup and hope for the best. In many areas with alcohol restrictions (public drinking), beer is sold in clear cups and soda in solid color cups to make it somewhat obvious whether there was a violation. Of course, carrying a classic red and white Budweiser can was just asking for trouble. You can't even pretend that is merely apple juice.

The fact that the golf carts were parked in all probability means they were in a public area. See the property lines in the picture below. All of the slanted parking spaces around the square are public property, not private.

Given a choice between a civil violation and a motor vehicle violation, I would guess public drinking would be preferable to one involving a motor vehicle.

http://i54.tinypic.com/2qc00zs.jpg


I usually don't go to the town squares and when I do I don't drink. so tis whole exercise is a waste of time for me. I just think cops are angels with badges and guns protecting the masses.

[memason]

Personally, I don't think I want any clarifications about the laws for drinking, while sitting in golf carts...on the squares or anywhere else. I suspect it is not legal to walk around with open containers, as we do. I have never lived in a US city where you were allowed to walk around the streets drinking wine, beer, vodka...you name it. I believe it is a "tolerated" practice in TV and only in TV.

From my perspective, in this instance, ignorance is truly bliss.

Just saying....

[handyman]

The Villages, and the Town Squares, seem to have some very unique "rules". You can shop on vendor night with a drink in your hand. You can wait for a restaurant reservation, and sit outside enjoying a drink from the inside bar. You can walk on the boardwalk with a drink in your hand. If you order a bottle of wine in a restaurant and drink half of it, the wait staff will tell you to take the bottle home with you. You can watch the sun set at Sunset Point on the Bridge, and have cocktails.

I'm very surprised that they would ticket someone at SS sitting in their golfcart enjoying a beverage. Perhaps some of these things aren't legal, but it sure seems that they are, based on four years of observation. Clarification is definitely required on this subject.

Thank you Barefoot I think many others have lost the the original context of this thread,it's not about speeding,hot rod carts,it is about,IS it leagal to sit in your golf cart and sip a bottle of wine at the squares ,if it is not then it should be posted, although me and sweety would have missed one of our most memorable evenings sipping wine,listeng to great music,talking to wonderful people and deciding we wanted to spend the rest of our lives there.....................ps, I am not a drunk ,I am an adult!!
!

[golf2140]

I sent an e-mail to the Police Chief on this issue. If I receive a reply, it will be shared. :wine:

[red tail]

I sent an e-mail to the Police Chief on this issue. If I receive a reply, it will be shared. :wine:

i sure hope the 'goody two shoes' dont ruin a good thing !

[Chi-Town]

Thank you, I thought I was only me noticed. This cash cow mentality is prevalent throughout TV and beyond. I actually had one contractor tell me that he resented people moving in the area but it was putting his kids through school. I did not help contribute to his kids college fund and hired another contractor..

Two years ago when down at the square I watched a guy try and kid with one of the cops. It was innocent funny and respectful but th cop appear not to have a sense of humor and quickly his words and body actions told me he was geting angry but this guy wasn't seeing this so I nudged the guy and told him he might want to keep moving. clearly the cop had not shown he hd a sense of humor.
There is no doubt that we are "cash cows" to the surrounding populace. And there is a mentality that we f*rts on carts as we are called are looked upon as interlopers for whatever reason be it a few rotten apples or darn yankee rooted feelings. But we do a lot of good for the surrounding communities. Not just business opportunities and employment but charity for the underpriveleged. So I look past the negative and realize that little will change. We know that we are good people from all over the U.S. and that we are doing our best to be good citizens and enjoy ourselves at the same time. As far as the police are concerned they should realize how good it is to have us as the population that they watch over. This should be imparted from the Chief on down. Or maybe the developer should remind them where their loyalties lie. Hey, if it's minor give a warning, if they don't like a drink at the square tell them to dump it. Second time and you're in trouble.

[rubicon]

There is no doubt that we are "cash cows" to the surrounding populace. And there is a mentality that we f*rts on carts as we are called are looked upon as interlopers for whatever reason be it a few rotten apples or darn yankee rooted feelings. But we do a lot of good for the surrounding communities. Not just business opportunities and employment but charity for the underpriveleged. So I look past the negative and realize that little will change. We know that we are good people from all over the U.S. and that we are doing our best to be good citizens and enjoy ourselves at the same time. As far as the police are concerned they should realize how good it is to have us as the population that they watch over. This should be imparted from the Chief on down. Or maybe the developer should remind them where their loyalties lie. Hey, if it's minor give a warning, if they don't like a drink at the square tell them to dump it. Second time and you're in trouble.

Well said, well balanced......................

[hrp01]

I have personally seen the current speed signs(monitored by Sumter's finest) in place on the path on 466 between Morse and Buena Vista...Today Sumter's finest was out in an unmarked car, busting Grannies on Buena Vista in yet another speed trap with unmarked cars...Again I witnessed it first hand..So much for rules and assumptions..I'd like to say,"c;mon
Barn, put the bullet back in your pocket and try some real police work for a change".

[Pturner]

I have personally seen the current speed signs(monitored by Sumter's finest) in place on the path on 466 between Morse and Buena Vista...Today Sumter's finest was out in an unmarked car, busting Grannies on Buena Vista in yet another speed trap with unmarked cars...Again I witnessed it first hand..So much for rules and assumptions..I'd like to say,"c;mon
Barn, put the bullet back in your pocket and try some real police work for a change".

Sorry, I don't understand. Are you saying you saw cart drivers on the cart path ticketed for speeding?

[hrp01]

No...I did see it monitored though...Today i witnessed barn writing up granny on Buena Vista .. In an unmarked car....The poor lady was scared out of her wits..I drove by three times and she was held there for over a half hour...very nice huh..I have also witnessed speed traps set up on Churchill Downs and they were checking carts too...seems we are a little "over protected" but really just here for their milking at will...

[Pturner]

The Villages, and the Town Squares, seem to have some very unique "rules". You can shop on vendor night with a drink in your hand. You can wait for a restaurant reservation, and sit outside enjoying a drink from the inside bar. You can walk on the boardwalk with a drink in your hand. If you order a bottle of wine in a restaurant and drink half of it, the wait staff will tell you to take the bottle home with you. You can watch the sun set at Sunset Point on the Bridge, and have cocktails.

I'm very surprised that they would ticket someone at SS sitting in their golfcart enjoying a beverage. Perhaps some of these things aren't legal, but it sure seems that they are, based on four years of observation. Clarification is definitely required on this subject.

Excellent points. Outdoor vendors sell alcoholic drinks on the square. So it must be legal to possess a drink on the square that was purchased from the vendor. Right? Maybe technically it becomes illegal to have said drink in your hand only if you step off the curb from the interior of the square.

Are the sidewalks outside the shops and restaurants on the square private property? If so, maybe you can carry a drink onto the sidewalk and if you walk across the street to the interior of the square the drink only remains illegal until you get to the other side.

That would answer a riddle that has remained unsolved for thousands of years!

Why did the chicken cross the road? :024:

Seriously, this issue is confusing.

[r_foye]

No...I did see it monitored though...Today i witnessed barn writing up granny on Buena Vista .. In an unmarked car....The poor lady was scared out of her wits..I drove by three times and she was held there for over a half hour...very nice huh..I have also witnessed speed traps set up on Churchill Downs and they were checking carts too...seems we are a little "over protected" but really just here for their milking at will...

Having lived here a few months now, I love the sense of entitlement so many Villagers seem to have. The old, "Im a taxpayer, I pay their salaries, they should be out busting the real criminals and leave us alone" mentality. Its never that they were speeding, or drinking and driving, or a myriad of other violations, they were targeted because they have money, or the police have a quota, or they are generating revenue, blah, blah, blah...The old lady probably deserved the ticket so give it a rest...The police are supposed to just look the other way because shes old? How do you know Granny Clampett doesnt already have a dozen violations on her driving record? Do you even know what she did? Oh sorry, my bad, we are entitled, I just havent lived here long enough get into the spirit yet...

[hrp01]

One of sumter's finest speaks out...that's what i have been saying about disdain for the residents...thank you as you have proved the point very well...

[skip0358]

Regarding the original post as I asked earlier and it becomes confussing. When we have parades, chili cookoffs,St Pats Parties,tree lightings people are allowed to do what ever. So it's alright then but not to just sit and listen to music. An open container is an open container. If the line at the booth is to long and you go to Red Sauce or Urban and get a drink in a to go cup once you step off the curb and go to listen to music your guilty if there's a function it's OK. People can be very confused and an explanation of the rule is required. I'm not talking about drinking and driving only about the square area as what the original post was about.

[golf2140]

bump

[Russ_Boston]

Anyone who can't see the hypocrisy in this is just not thinking.

So let me get this straight. If I bring a chair to the square, place it on the sidewalk next to my cart and consume 4 beers over the course of 2 hours (I will not be over the legal .08 limit in my experience) I can get back into my cart and drive happily home without incurring any violation.

BUT...

If i instead drink 1 beer in my cart that is not moving and maybe I'm even in the passenger seat and maybe with the keys in the ignition I can be cited.

Anyone who thinks this is right just because the 'letter' of the law is followed is just not the type of person I want to hang with.

And police wonder why they get bashed in forums like this. PLEASE!

Enforcing that 'law' makes no sense whatsoever except raising the town coffers.

[rubicon]

What this thread and two other similar threads have shown me is that the police departments in these parts need to work on their public relations

[superbat]

I was a foreman of a grand jury in NY a few years ago. We were given the history of our legal system which included DUI by the District Attorney.

He told us the reason the police will give a ticket to a driver that is sleeping in a car that has been drinking (booze on this or her breath, as well as seen drinking in the car) is to protect the police agency and others.

It seems that an officer did not give a ticket or arrest a guy who had been drinking and was “sleeping it off“ in his car, the officer just told him to sleep it off before driving home. The fellow, a few minutes later started driving and caused an accident that killed another person. He was over the limit and was then charged with DUI. When the family of the person that was killed found out that the first officer did not take him in they sued the police agency and won a large settlement. That is how our legal system works like it or not.

As a result of that case, at least in NY, officers are instructed to give a ticket when the officer sees someone breaking the drinking law or arrest the person who over the limit to protect the police agency as well as others.

The law in Florida includes golf carts.

[Bogie Shooter]

I was a foreman of a grand jury in NY a few years ago. We were given the history of our legal system which included DUI by the District Attorney.

He told us the reason the police will give a ticket to a driver that is sleeping in a car that has been drinking (booze on this or her breath, as well as seen drinking in the car) is to protect the police agency and others.

It seems that an officer did not give a ticket or arrest a guy who had been drinking and was “sleeping it off“ in his car, the officer just told him to sleep it off before driving home. The fellow, a few minutes later started driving and caused an accident that killed another person. He was over the limit and was then charged with DUI. When the family of the person that was killed found out that the first officer did not take him in they sued the police agency and won a large settlement. That is how our legal system works like it or not.

As a result of that case, at least in NY, officers are instructed to give a ticket when the officer sees someone breaking the drinking law or arrest the person who over the limit to protect the police agency as well as others.

The law in Florida includes golf carts.

..........and recumbent bicycles.:beer3:

[Russ_Boston]

I was a foreman of a grand jury in NY a few years ago. We were given the history of our legal system which included DUI by the District Attorney.

He told us the reason the police will give a ticket to a driver that is sleeping in a car that has been drinking (booze on this or her breath, as well as seen drinking in the car) is to protect the police agency and others.

It seems that an officer did not give a ticket or arrest a guy who had been drinking and was “sleeping it off“ in his car, the officer just told him to sleep it off before driving home. The fellow, a few minutes later started driving and caused an accident that killed another person. He was over the limit and was then charged with DUI. When the family of the person that was killed found out that the first officer did not take him in they sued the police agency and won a large settlement. That is how our legal system works like it or not.

As a result of that case, at least in NY, officers are instructed to give a ticket when the officer sees someone breaking the drinking law or arrest the person who over the limit to protect the police agency as well as others.

The law in Florida includes golf carts.

Please don't confuse the topic of this thread with driving under the influence or even potential DUI. No one will question that.

This topic talks about having one or two drinks in your stationary golf cart while listening to music at the square and getting a citation while at the same time you could legally do this just by standing outside your cart on the sidewalk. I would think that even the patrolman giving the ticket must feel guilty doing this. If not they should have their conscience evaluated!

This citation doesn't stop anyone from drinking at the square and then driving home drunk. To me handing out these citations is indefensible. Common sense needs to prevail at some point. This is another one of our semi-annual debates on 'letter of the law' vs. 'spirit of the law'.

PS> please cite the Florida law that includes non-registered golf carts. I'd like to read it but could not find it. I assume you found it since you stated it as fact. Thanks.

[ajbrown]

:wave:Please don't confuse the topic of this thread with driving under the influence or even potential DUI. No one will question that.

This topic talks about having one or two drinks in your stationary golf cart while listening to music at the square and getting a citation while at the same time you could legally do this just by standing outside your cart on the sidewalk. I would think that even the patrolman giving the ticket must feel guilty doing this. If not they should have their conscience evaluated!

This citation doesn't stop anyone from drinking at the square and then driving home drunk. To me handing out these citations is indefensible. Common sense needs to prevail at some point. This is another one of our semi-annual debates on 'letter of the law' vs. 'spirit of the law'.

PS> please cite the Florida law that includes non-registered golf carts. I'd like to read it but could not find it. I assume you found it since you stated it as fact. Thanks.

I tried to say what Russ said in my earlier posts, but did so much less elegantly. To be clear I strongly agree with the guy who hails from Norton, MA and The Villages :wave: .

[superbat]

Russ, I can not cite the law. I based it on the first post the reason the officer issued the ticket. It is 2nd hand information

[Russ_Boston]

Russ, I can not cite the law. I based it on the first post the reason the officer issued the ticket. It is 2nd hand information

No problem - you are probably correct. I tried to find the law but the one I found just says 'motor vehicles'. I guess that includes golf carts. I've yet to find the actual Florida law.

[Russ_Boston]

:wave:

I tried to say what Russ said in my earlier posts, but did so much less elegantly. To be clear I strongly agree with the guy who hails from Norton, MA and The Villages :wave: .

I'm tired of all this "isn't Russ wonderful crap". If he was such a great guy then why...

oh wait, that's me - As Rosana Dana said "Never Mind!" :)

[2BNTV]

Yes, it is valid Fl. Statutes 316.1936. This apply's also for DUI on private property, Fl Statutes 316.193

Russ - FYI From an earlier poster.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

No problem - you are probably correct. I tried to find the law but the one I found just says 'motor vehicles'. I guess that includes golf carts. I've yet to find the actual Florida law.

Have fun finding the definition/clarification of what constitutes a "motor vehicle"!

If FL's statute is anything like OH's regarding the definition of a "motor vehicle", it would not include golf carts. From OH's perspective, they consider a motor vehicle to be something that's a titled unit for usage on public roads or waterways - cars, trucks, motorcycles, RVs, boats, and such. Thus, even though golf carts are approved in TV for usage on the roadways, they are not titled vehicles. I would assume LSVs would fall under that category, though, as they are titled.

I had to plow through OH's stuff on that exact topic ("What is considered to be a motor vehicle?") a number of years back for my business - needed to determine it specifically as it impacted collection of sales taxes for me regarding services rendered to "motor vehicles". It was a bit frustrating to find the right person in the right department in the right.......anyways, I eventually got it all straight! WHEW!

Again, that's how it works in OH. I'd have to think FL would be awfully similar.

Bill :)

[Russ_Boston]

Russ - FYI From an earlier poster.

Thanks

[skip0358]

The law states 316.1936 states in a vehicle.If the container is open it must be locked up in a trunk or locked glove box.Also goes on to state that it is unlawful and punishable as provided for any person to posses an alcoholic beverage while seated in or on a motor vehicle. By definition a motor vehicle is any vehicle with wheels and a motor that doesn't run on rails. I don't agree but I didn't right it. Also in reading on line local law can make it stricter and the penalty is fine, jail time or both. Can also cost 3 points on your liscense

[Regor]

I have always said....Don't do the crime, if you can't do the time. Simple, know the laws and abide with them. Don't like them?, go through the process that it would take to change them. I don't sit at the squares with a beer on the cart but have been known to have one while driving home from the course. I get caught.. no one to blame but myself! It's the law! Sit in a motor vehicle with an open container, busted! Simple!

[Raymond]

Have fun finding the definition/clarification of what constitutes a "motor vehicle"!



By definition a motor vehicle is any vehicle with wheels and a motor that doesn't run on rails.
During the 2002 legislative session, however, the Legislature amended the definition of "motor vehicle," effective July 1, 2002. Section 67 of Chapter 02-20, Laws of Florida, amends section 316.003(21) to define "motor vehicle" as "[a]ny self-propelled vehicle not operated upon rails or guideway, but not including any bicycle, motorized scooter, electric personal assistive mobility device, or moped."

I have always said....Don't do the crime, if you can't do the time. Simple, know the laws and abide with them. Don't like them?, go through the process that it would take to change them. I don't sit at the squares with a beer on the cart but have been known to have one while driving home from the course. I get caught.. no one to blame but myself! It's the law! Sit in a motor vehicle with an open container, busted! Simple!Thank you. :wave:

[robertj1954]

i thought the squares were private property

The roadways are not private property.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

During the 2002 legislative session, however, the Legislature amended the definition of "motor vehicle," effective July 1, 2002. Section 67 of Chapter 02-20, Laws of Florida, amends section 316.003(21) to define "motor vehicle" as "[a]ny self-propelled vehicle not operated upon rails or guideway, but not including any bicycle, motorized scooter, electric personal assistive mobility device, or moped." ..............


Thanks for the clarification!! :wave:

Bill :)

[Talk Host]

I'm wondering (the law notwithstanding), does anybody think it's okay to drink alcoholic beverages while seated at the steering wheel of a golf cart?

[cabo35]

I'm wondering (the law notwithstanding), does anybody think it's okay to drink alcoholic beverages while seated at the steering wheel of a golf cart?

Interesting point. I'd have the same comfort level if I saw my Continental pilot enjoy a couple of pops behind the controls before the flight...........or worse......during it. :22yikes:

[red tail]

I'm wondering (the law notwithstanding), does anybody think it's okay to drink alcoholic beverages while seated at the steering wheel of a golf cart?

i dont see anything wrong with it. in fact i do it!

[Raymond]

i dont see anything wrong with it. in fact i do it!

With all do respect, does that mean you don't care about the law or do you just think golf cards and you are above the law?

Here something to read:

The research, triggered by doctors at the University of Alabama at Birmingham after treating several serious golf cart related accidents, studied emergency room databases from 2002 to 2005. Results suggest that during that time span, about 48,000 golf cart accidents took place nationwide, injuring roughly 1,000 Americans a month. Research also revealed that an estimated 50% of the accidents happened on the golf course, while the other half generally occurred at homes, on streets and other public property. Young males between the ages of 10 and 19, as well as men 80 and up, were found to have the highest injury rates in these accidents. For those accidents on the golf course, it is speculated that alcohol often plays a primary factor in the cause of collisions.
http://www.tampastpetersburginjurylawyer.com/2009/07/scary-statistics-in-golf-cart.html

Alcohol related accidents are on the rise, doesn't matter if with a car or a golf card. And everybody with alcohol behind the wheel should go to jail. I don't care about the convenient of peoples above the law; it is to protect the other innocent people from drunken driving peoples.

[red tail]

With all do respect, does that mean you don't care about the law or do you just think golf cards and you are above the law?

Here something to read:

The research, triggered by doctors at the University of Alabama at Birmingham after treating several serious golf cart related accidents, studied emergency room databases from 2002 to 2005. Results suggest that during that time span, about 48,000 golf cart accidents took place nationwide, injuring roughly 1,000 Americans a month. Research also revealed that an estimated 50% of the accidents happened on the golf course, while the other half generally occurred at homes, on streets and other public property. Young males between the ages of 10 and 19, as well as men 80 and up, were found to have the highest injury rates in these accidents. For those accidents on the golf course, it is speculated that alcohol often plays a primary factor in the cause of collisions.
http://www.tampastpetersburginjurylawyer.com/2009/07/scary-statistics-in-golf-cart.html

Alcohol related accidents are on the rise, doesn't matter if with a car or a golf card. And everybody with alcohol behind the wheel should go to jail. I don't care about the convenient of peoples above the law; it is to protect the other innocent people from drunken driving peoples.

1. you need to use spell check.
2. i was just answering th's question.

[GeorgeT]

I'm wondering (the law notwithstanding), does anybody think it's okay to drink alcoholic beverages while seated at the steering wheel of a golf cart?

Isn't that what the original post is all about??? It says that there was a couple in the cart that were given the violation. You have to assume that one of them was behind the wheel.

[GeorgeT]

1. you need to use spell check.
2. i was just answering th's question.

Red Tail

1: Spell check would not have picked up the errors and who cares? This isn't about correct English or spelling errors. Not everyone has your level of expertise.

2: Raymond was simply responding to your answer.

[Russ_Boston]

Isn't that what the original post is all about??? It says that there was a couple in the cart that were given the violation. You have to assume that one of them was behind the wheel.

I assume TH meant behind the wheel while driving? Right?

I have no problem with giving the citations now that I know. But until this thread I would never have thought that they'd give you one at the squares while your cart is parked and you are just using it as a seat.

But I won't use it now with any drinks in hand.

TOTV is great for this type of info.

[rubicon]

With all do respect, does that mean you don't care about the law or do you just think golf cards and you are above the law?

Here something to read:

The research, triggered by doctors at the University of Alabama at Birmingham after treating several serious golf cart related accidents, studied emergency room databases from 2002 to 2005. Results suggest that during that time span, about 48,000 golf cart accidents took place nationwide, injuring roughly 1,000 Americans a month. Research also revealed that an estimated 50% of the accidents happened on the golf course, while the other half generally occurred at homes, on streets and other public property. Young males between the ages of 10 and 19, as well as men 80 and up, were found to have the highest injury rates in these accidents. For those accidents on the golf course, it is speculated that alcohol often plays a primary factor in the cause of collisions.
http://www.tampastpetersburginjurylawyer.com/2009/07/scary-statistics-in-golf-cart.html

Alcohol related accidents are on the rise, doesn't matter if with a car or a golf card. And everybody with alcohol behind the wheel should go to jail. I don't care about the convenient of peoples above the law; it is to protect the other innocent people from drunken driving peoples.

If you did a search for ATV's, pleasure boats automobiles, planes, trains, etc
you would get the same sort of statistics. There seems to be some sort of contradiction. Cited are florida Statute defining a golf cart as a motor vehicle, yet we are told that if speeding (i.e. going over 19.9 mph) is prima facie evidenced that a golf cart once categorized as not being a motor vehicle is now a motor vehicle and hence you are fined $250 plus the cost to ave a mechanic changes to prevent said golf cart from reaching speeds above the 19.9. This is because we have no posted speed limits for golf carts on cartpaths and hence an officer can't give you a ticket for speeding.

As to the original post in this thread the information provided was that two people were sitting in their cart with open containers at LSL. Following that original post members have shared information they believed relevent to this thread. The focus to all of this should be "what is the difference between sitting in your cart with an open container and/or sitting at a table or on the curb with an open container. It is a common practice for many residents to drive their carts to the square and utilizing them as a place to sit and enjoy the activities perhaps because thee is little or no seating available or perhaps because of choice. Unless and until someone provides information that these residents were doing more than just that I am left with the impression that it may not be advisable to drink at the squares. This then begs the question as to why the district/Developer would allow eateries/ vendors to sell alcohol? As stated earlier it also is confusing as to what "status" Florida Law really views golf carts to be defined.

I would welcome further clarification of the opinions rendered here

[Talk Host]

I assume TH meant behind the wheel while driving? Right?


.


No, I was talking about either "sitting still" or "driving." If you are seated behind the wheel and it's your cart and you are not at home, then it follows that you will turn the key and drive it home.

Has any member of this board ever had anybody say to them, "I'm too drunk to drive my cart home, here take my keys and drive me home."

A couple of years ago, my wife and I along with our daughter and her family were walking to our car at Spanish Springs. We saw a woman so drunk that she couldn't stand up. Her legs were like rubber bands. She had yet another drink in her hand. She stumbled into her cart and off she went. Best part of this......her husband was with her. He got into the passenger side and rode with her.

[Golf-Tinker]

The original post stated that the ticketing supposedly occurred at Spanish Springs. I don't believe the original poster ever verified the accuracy of the tale. Did it happen? I don't know. Could it happen? Possibly. Do a google search for "open container" statutes and ordinances. I found an interesting one: with reference to drinking while playing golf. A private golf course that is licensed to sell spirits is considered to be a public course for the purposes of the "open container" law.

[PennBF]

First: If it is 10AM in the morning and you are having a beer or cocktail as you read this then "you have a problem".
Second: If the lawn chair had wheels and could go 15+ MPH then yes the person should be ticketed if they are drinking in the chair.
I completely agree that if someone is in a cart, drinking alcohol then yes
they should be ticketed and it should be significant to make sure they get the message that a golf cart can put another person or cart in danger just like a car, motocycle, motoscooter, and a lot of etc.'s.
If the only way a person can enjoy their life in a "golf cart" is by druging themselves and then driving they should be arrested. It should not be
relevant whether the County is trying to raise revenue, etc. If this is a
crime, (which it is) then it should be enforced.!!!
I also saw a cart this morning with a man allowing what looked like a 6 or 7
year old drive a cart.
I guess there are no limits to the idiots among our society. :spoken:

[bluedog103]

First: If it is 10AM in the morning and you are having a beer or cocktail as you read this then "you have a problem".
Second: If the lawn chair had wheels and could go 15+ MPH then yes the person should be ticketed if they are drinking in the chair.
I completely agree that if someone is in a cart, drinking alcohol then yes
they should be ticketed and it should be significant to make sure they get the message that a golf cart can put another person or cart in danger just like a car, motocycle, motoscooter, and a lot of etc.'s.
If the only way a person can enjoy their life in a "golf cart" is by druging themselves and then driving they should be arrested. It should not be
relevant whether the County is trying to raise revenue, etc. If this is a
crime, (which it is) then it should be enforced.!!!
I also saw a cart this morning with a man allowing what looked like a 6 or 7
year old drive a cart.
I guess there are no limits to the idiots among our society. :spoken:

Funny post. I'm not sure if you were serious or poking fun at other posts in this thread.
If 10 A.M. is inappropriate for a cocktail how does 11 A.M. sound? No? How about 1:15 P.M.? 2:00 P.M.? There must be a decent opening time but when?
The original post said nothing about driving, it was about someone using their cart as a seat. Had they sat a few feet away in a folding chair with a beer or a cocktail that would have been fine. Then they could get back into their cart and legally drive home, provided they were under the limit for D.U.I. Like it or not, an adult can have a drink or two and still legally drive. Your own opposition to alcohol is just that, your opposition. Not good, not bad, not right, not wrong, just your's.
Was the man who allowed a child to drive a cart holding an adult beverage in his hand? I agree that this is a serious offense if it really happened but there is nothing in your post that suggests that alcohol is in any way involved.

[dillywho]

First: If it is 10AM in the morning and you are having a beer or cocktail as you read this then "you have a problem".
Second: If the lawn chair had wheels and could go 15+ MPH then yes the person should be ticketed if they are drinking in the chair.
I completely agree that if someone is in a cart, drinking alcohol then yes
they should be ticketed and it should be significant to make sure they get the message that a golf cart can put another person or cart in danger just like a car, motocycle, motoscooter, and a lot of etc.'s.
If the only way a person can enjoy their life in a "golf cart" is by druging themselves and then driving they should be arrested. It should not be
relevant whether the County is trying to raise revenue, etc. If this is a
crime, (which it is) then it should be enforced.!!!
I also saw a cart this morning with a man allowing what looked like a 6 or 7
year old drive a cart.
I guess there are no limits to the idiots among our society. :spoken:

Assuming you have friends/relatives that drink, would it be right for that person (or you) to be ticketed for an open container in that cart just because they saw you at the square and sat down in your cart with you to chat for a minute or two and just happen to have a drink in hand? How is that putting someone else in danger (or themselves or you)? As for anyone drinking in the morning, people who work the midnight shift typically drink at 10 in the morning because that is their "evening". How does that mean they have a problem....or anyone else for that matter. The guy who only drinks at home at 11 p.m. could be the one with the problem for all anyone knows.

Please don't be so intolerant of others. It isn't kind.

[ajbrown]

The original post said nothing about driving, it was about someone using their cart as a seat. Had they sat a few feet away in a folding chair with a beer or a cocktail that would have been fine.

No matter how many times a poster states this the next post is about DUI in a golf car :icon_bored:

Most of the posters have been to the square, before this thread did anyone even consider there could be a problem having an adult beverage parked at the square using your golf car to relax in? It would never have dawned on me. There are people all over town square carrying adult beverages. Some sitting on square, some walking across the street to restaurants, groups of carts parked at the square tailgating. How could any rational person know sitting quietly at the square in your golf car with your window down and feet up having an adult beverage would be ticketed? If it were me I would have been in shock if an officer handed me a ticket.

I'm wondering (the law notwithstanding), does anybody think it's okay to drink alcoholic beverages while seated at the steering wheel of a golf cart?

If you mean a beverage or two and I will not be over the legal limit to drive, then I honeslty do believe it is OK.

[handyman]

If it's ten A.M. and I choose to have a beer and

it bothers you then I believe that you are the one with a problem

[Russ_Boston]

No, I was talking about either "sitting still" or "driving." If you are seated behind the wheel and it's your cart and you are not at home, then it follows that you will turn the key and drive it home.

Has any member of this board ever had anybody say to them, "I'm too drunk to drive my cart home, here take my keys and drive me home."

A couple of years ago, my wife and I along with our daughter and her family were walking to our car at Spanish Springs. We saw a woman so drunk that she couldn't stand up. Her legs were like rubber bands. She had yet another drink in her hand. She stumbled into her cart and off she went. Best part of this......her husband was with her. He got into the passenger side and rode with her.

This thread isn't about driving the cart home drunk. It's about whether the police should hassle people for breaking the 'letter' of the law by having a container in a still cart. People could still drive home drunk if the were the driver, got out of their cart to drink, and then got back into their cart to drive home. Let's stay on point.

[skip0358]

No matter how many times a poster states this the next post is about DUI in a golf car :icon_bored:

Most of the posters have been to the square, before this thread did anyone even consider there could be a problem having an adult beverage parked at the square using your golf car to relax in? It would never have dawned on me. There are people all over town square carrying adult beverages. Some sitting on square, some walking across the street to restaurants, groups of carts parked at the square tailgating. How could any rational person know sitting quietly at the square in your golf car with your window down and feet up having an adult beverage would be ticketed? If it were me I would have been in shock if an officer handed me a ticket.


If you mean a beverage or two and I will not be over the legal limit to drive, then I honeslty do believe it is OK.


I agree 100%. I would have never expected it at all. I have a 4 seater and we've backed in and sat in the back seats to listen to the music and yes had an open container. What makes it confusing as I stated earlier is that when there's some type of event it must be allowed because nobody gets a ticket then.

[Talk Host]

Let's stay on point.

It is on point. Open container laws were enacted because the consumption inside a vehicle predisposes the consumer to drunk driving. They didn't issue the violation because somebody was drinking in public, they issued it because it was in a vehicle which, in all likelihood will be headed out to the road.

As someone pointed out, would you want to see your airline pilot have a quick one before he takes off?

It's all the same, sitting still or driving. It's right on point.

[memason]

I still question whether this even happened... ... Heard it from a friend, who heard it from a friend, who heard it from another...

Me thinks not!

[rubicon]

I believe it happened but there may be exenuating circimstances that the observer/explainer was not aware. My interest in this thread is to discover what truly happened. It is one thing to issue a ticket to people who are DUI and quite another to do so for someone whose only act was having an open container. Question: How many people leave the town squares drunk? How many residents even drink an alcoholic beverage, other than a glass of wine at dinner?

[Talk Host]

That's strange, because the original post said:


Believe me, they were given a ticket for "open container." Or, maybe they were drunk and got a ticket for being drunk in public.

[Russ_Boston]

It is on point. Open container laws were enacted because the consumption inside a vehicle predisposes the consumer to drunk driving. They didn't issue the violation because somebody was drinking in public, they issued it because it was in a vehicle which, in all likelihood will be headed out to the road.

As someone pointed out, would you want to see your airline pilot have a quick one before he takes off?

It's all the same, sitting still or driving. It's right on point.

You really think it's the same? So in your mind it's OK if the person moves out of his cart by 3 feet and drinks with all the intention of getting back into the cart? This discussion is about whether the police should make it a point to give people citations for sitting in their cart. Not for driving the cart with an open container. Giving a citation to someone sitting at the square is just plain 'looking for things to do by the officer' in my opinion.

What's the upshot? People bring a lawn chair and sit 3 feet away. Great use of time by our paid public officials!

[Talk Host]

This discussion is about whether the police should make it a point to give people citations for sitting in their cart. !

Yep! That's the violation, sitting or driving, open container is open container. Using your logic then, if a cop stops a guy on the highway and he's got an open whiskey bottle in his lap, his argument could be, "hey Mr. Policeman, I'm stopped on the side of the road, I'm not moving, you can't give me a ticket."

But then, If I said the sky was blue, you would disagree with me.

[red tail]

k just enjoying lifeQUOTE=Talk Host;361696]Yep! That's the violation, sitting or driving, open container is open container. Using your logic then, if a cop stops a guy on the highway and he's got an open whiskey bottle in his lap, his argument could be, "hey Mr. Policeman, I'm stopped on the side of the road, I'm not moving, you can't give me a ticket."

But then, If I said the sky was blue, you would disagree with me.[/QUOTE]

you are tainted because youre a former leo...what russ is saying is he 'we' enjoy sitting at the square with a drink... not drunk just enjoying life. i know there is no way im going to get through to you because you have that authoritative mindset! life is good so we enjoy it doing no harm to anyone but maybe our livers.

[Talk Host]

you are tainted because youre a former leo...what russ is saying is he 'we' enjoy sitting at the square with a drink... not drunk just enjoying life. i know there is no way im going to get through to you because you have that authoritative mindset! life is good so we enjoy it doing no harm to anyone but maybe our livers.

Should each person be permitted to determine what his or her own prosecutable level is, or should we all obey the laws. Just asking.

I personally appreciate the "authoritative mindset" of the men and women who keep me safe. But that's just me, I guess.

[cabo35]

Should each person be permitted to determine what his or her own prosecutable level is, or should we all obey the laws. Just asking.

I personally appreciate the "authoritative mindset" of the men and women who keep me safe. But that's just me, I guess.

Amen brother, for sure it's not just you.

[GeorgeT]

Yep! That's the violation, sitting or driving, open container is open container. Using your logic then, if a cop stops a guy on the highway and he's got an open whiskey bottle in his lap, his argument could be, "hey Mr. Policeman, I'm stopped on the side of the road, I'm not moving, you can't give me a ticket."

But then, If I said the sky was blue, you would disagree with me.

I'm confused?? Did the cop stop the guy or was the guy already stopped??

[Russ_Boston]

Yep! That's the violation, sitting or driving, open container is open container. Using your logic then, if a cop stops a guy on the highway and he's got an open whiskey bottle in his lap, his argument could be, "hey Mr. Policeman, I'm stopped on the side of the road, I'm not moving, you can't give me a ticket."

But then, If I said the sky was blue, you would disagree with me.

We all know what the violation is. We can read.

The question is do YOU think it is a proper use of patrolman's time to issue these citations at the Villages squares? Is this really the type of law enforcement that has any desired effect? What does it do? Next time people will just get out of their cart and drink the same amount.

FYI My sky is gray today:)

[rubicon]

I'm confused?? Did the cop stop the guy or was the guy already stopped??

GeorgeT it apparently doesn't matter according to talk host who was a former LEO an "open container" by any other name is still an "open container" and your guilty as charged.. According to the original post the people issued a ticket were parked in the town square sitting in their golfcart with open containers. What the rest of us are trying to figure out is the difference between sitting in a chair and listening to music vis a vis sitting in the cart?

Apparently it is possible for a sober resident who was sitting in his cart to be issued a ticket. On the other hand there could be aperson who sat all night at katie Bells and is now smashed driving home in a cart, auto or on a bike with no violations....What a country!

[Bill-n-Brillo]

Boy howdy - sure am glad I quit drinking years ago!! :wave:

Bill :)

[Talk Host]

GeorgeT it apparently doesn't matter according to talk host who was a former LEO an "open container" by any other name is still an "open container" and your guilty as charged..

Interesting how some folks like to demonize current and past law enforcement officers. Makes you wonder why they are so defensive against the police.

[handyman]

Lookin forword to meetin'ya Russ,you make a whole lot more since, then some of these other nice people who I am sure have their own personel reasons for disliking the people that can drink responsibly

[thistrucksforyou]

:a20::loco:Well...I may be blonde but I know this...The difference between beer on the golf course and no beer on the golf course is several strokes and much less distance and not good directionality.

[Russ_Boston]

Lookin forword to meetin'ya Russ,you make a whole lot more since, then some of these other nice people who I am sure have their own personel reasons for disliking the people that can drink responsibly

Thanks but it's not really their feeling towards drinking. Some of the people on this forum are very strict letter of the law people. They don't believe in common sense law enforcement that actually serves a purpose and uses our tax dollars wisely. For example I would think that the local police (assuming that they do indeed hand out tickets to people sitting in their cart at the square drinking) would be better served by informing the good folks of TV that yes indeed we will have to ticket you insist on doing it. After all the police must enforce the laws. But they do have the latitude to issue warnings and I think most of us had no idea that you couldn't do this since we see it every single night at the squares. Maybe even a small ad campaign.

And after people read this you're going to get responses like "maybe we should have the police take out a full page ad telling people they can't kill other people". I have found in life that there is no way to talk to people about common sense - you either have it or you don't! It can't be taught.

[graciegirl]

Boy howdy - sure am glad I quit drinking years ago!! :wave:

Bill :)

ummm Bill? I believe that is a direct quote from me.

I am too, by the way. I never could get the hang of it.

I enjoy watching other people and pouring drinks for them.

I have far fewer headaches. And even a couple of people think I am fun...(If I pay them to say it)

[r_foye]

A Villagers definintion of the "The spirit of the law.": Anytime you cite one of us and we don't agree with the law then you have violated the spirit of the law. In the Villages ignorance of the law IS an excuse because normal laws don't apply to us. Any and all tickets should be fully explained in a community wide meeting or a full paged newspaper ad. If you do violate "the spirit of the law" as defined by us Villagers, then you obvioulsy have no common sense and are just a badge heavy tool who has nothing better to do than hassle us fine folk who pay your salary.

[hrp01]

more of that disdain for the senior residents huh?..If we excercize common sense and question our keepers then we are "rebels without a cause"

[Russ_Boston]

Any and all tickets should be fully explained in a community wide meeting or a full paged newspaper ad. If you do violate "the spirit of the law" as defined by us Villagers, then you obvioulsy have no common sense and are just a badge heavy tool who has nothing better to do than hassle us fine folk who pay your salary.

Jeez, Did I call that or what? I should go out and play the lottery today.

A little community outreach goes a long way.

[Talk Host]

I wonder if the people who allegedly got the ticket:

Were warned ahead of time, but didn't comply
Were showing signs of intoxication
Were observed making numerous trips to the bar
Were observed mixing more than a few drinks of their own
Were consuming whiskey on the rocks
Were cited only after they started their cart and began to move
Were being warned, but were belligerent to the officer

I also wonder why they were the only poor innocents who were targeted by the nasty old authoritarian minded cops.

[nitehawk]

My neighbor told me that she and her husband were in Spanish Springs listening to the music in the square in their golf cart The couple next to them were drinking wine and beer (in their golf cart). A police officer came over and handed them a ticket for public drinking. He explained that sitting in a vehicle even a non moving vehicle with an open alchololic beverage is a violation. The couple was so shocked they couldn't speak.

Now if they were standing next to their golf cart or on a sidewalk in the square drinking, that's not against the law!

Is this something that's been going on for awhile or is it a new policy. I know if you have open alcohol in a car and you're stopped for any reason, you can be ticketed for that but we always thought the squares were exempt from this.
Once again we get into - "my neighbor said" - but I did not see. Where did this thread get to a violation for drinking in a golf cart -- The first statement was we heard from a neighbor "A police officer came over and handed them a ticket for public drinking." A violation for public drinking or open container -- has to be written to the person who violated the law -- not like a parking ticket a policeman does not walk over and hand a ticket to some one sitting in a golf cart. Who does he make it out to??? -- the blue golf cart in SS north side IFO ice cream store. tickets made out to a person (even parking tickets) has a place where you put the violation code number that has been violated. what section of the law was violated weather it is traffic - failure to comply -- or whatever . Just look at the ticket and i am sure it will tell you what it was written for -- if there was such a ticket i am still up in the air about that - just produce the ticket and them argue about the law that was violated

[golf2140]

With the information that I supplied to the Police Department, they were unable to find any such citation. I will be in contact with them on Monday morning to give any added info that I can. To many folks are jumping into the fire, not knowing all the facts. :jester:

[golf2140]

Just wondering, which police department? Lady Lake, Lake County Sheriff, or some other agency?

Get the wrong agency and they'll never find anything. Based on the original post saying Spanish Springs, I'd think it would probably be Lady Lake police. Who normally patrols Spanish Springs? But who even knows if the location was accurate.

Yes, I did make contact with Lady Lake Police Department. Also note, no further info from the original poster.

[Raymond]

They don't believe in common sense law enforcement that actually serves a purpose and uses our tax dollars wisely. For example I would think that the local police (assuming that they do indeed hand out tickets to people sitting in their cart at the square drinking) would be better served by informing the good folks of TV that yes indeed we will have to ticket you insist on doing it. After all the police must enforce the laws. But they do have the latitude to issue warnings and I think most of us had no idea that you couldn't do this since we see it every single night at the squares. Maybe even a small ad campaign.


Should this suggestion only apply to the Villages square or also to Ocala Square, Inverness Square, Miami Plaza, Fort Lauderdale Square end endless more squares? Or should we add in the Florida Statutes an exception especially for Villages Square area with Golf Cart?

[Raymond]

who I am sure have their own personel reasons for disliking the people that can drink responsibly

Sorry Sir, but every drink behind the wheels, doesn't matter if golf cart or car, is one drink too much. And this is not a responible behavier. Just my two cent.

[memason]

For the third time, I will say that it's my belief that no ticket was even issued...

But, this thread reminds me of growing up in Kentucky, years ago. Every Sunday, my parents would drag me to church. I'll not mention the denomination, but we lived in the bible belt. There were lots and lots of rules and if you broke any of the rules, you were going straight to hell. Ironically, the rules were for everything enjoyable to anyone...no smoking, no drinking, no dancing, no music, no singing, ...I'm not sure how anyone had children, cause that was... Oh well, you get the picture.

I don't like all the rules and certainly don't want to know the official answer to some of the questions posed on this thread. Like having drink sitting in my cart or crossing the street at the square with a glass of wine, etc....

We should just lighten up, enjoy life and not worry so much if someone gets away with breaking a rule.

Just saying....

[red tail]

For the third time, I will say that it's my belief that no ticket was even issued...

But, this thread reminds me of growing up in Kentucky, years ago. Every Sunday, my parents would drag me to church. I'll not mention the denomination, but we lived in the bible belt. There were lots and lots of rules and if you broke any of the rules, you were going straight to hell. Ironically, the rules were for everything enjoyable to anyone...no smoking, no drinking, no dancing, no music, no singing, ...I'm not sure how anyone had children, cause that was... Oh well, you get the picture.

I don't like all the rules and certainly don't want to know the official answer to some of the questions posed on this thread. Like having drink sitting in my cart or crossing the street at the square with a glass of wine, etc....

We should just lighten up, enjoy life and not worry so much if someone gets away with breaking a rule.

Just saying....

well said memason...i agree completely!

[GeorgeT]

For the third time, I will say that it's my belief that no ticket was even issued...

But, this thread reminds me of growing up in Kentucky, years ago. Every Sunday, my parents would drag me to church. I'll not mention the denomination, but we lived in the bible belt. There were lots and lots of rules and if you broke any of the rules, you were going straight to hell. Ironically, the rules were for everything enjoyable to anyone...no smoking, no drinking, no dancing, no music, no singing, ...I'm not sure how anyone had children, cause that was... Oh well, you get the picture.

I don't like all the rules and certainly don't want to know the official answer to some of the questions posed on this thread. Like having drink sitting in my cart or crossing the street at the square with a glass of wine, etc....

We should just lighten up, enjoy life and not worry so much if someone gets away with breaking a rule.

Just saying....

I'll drink to that......and I'll do it in my cart at the square!:beer3:

[Raymond]

For the third time, I will say that it's my belief that no ticket was even issued...

But, this thread reminds me of growing up in Kentucky, years ago. Every Sunday, my parents would drag me to church. I'll not mention the denomination, but we lived in the bible belt. There were lots and lots of rules and if you broke any of the rules, you were going straight to hell. Ironically, the rules were for everything enjoyable to anyone...no smoking, no drinking, no dancing, no music, no singing, ...I'm not sure how anyone had children, cause that was... Oh well, you get the picture.

I don't like all the rules and certainly don't want to know the official answer to some of the questions posed on this thread. Like having drink sitting in my cart or crossing the street at the square with a glass of wine, etc....

We should just lighten up, enjoy life and not worry so much if someone gets away with breaking a rule.

Just saying....Sounds good, honestly. But this need to be changed by the law and not the law bypassed from the people driving a golf cart and living in the Villages.

[rubicon]

Well after fourteen pages of discussion on this issue I am convinced that the only solution to all of this is to declare Prohibtion in all three counties that encompass The Villages. Beside it is more benefiting for seniors to travel down to the town square for some lemonade or a root beer....

PS Talk Hos I would never demonize LOE. wha I said all along is that like any profession or trade there are always some bad apples. Much of this thread has been mischaracterized in that manner and that is not what folks mean or are saying

[dillywho]

I would still like to know how someone who is not driving, will not be driving, but is drinking while sitting on/in your cart, is a danger to anyone on the roads? Some of these posts seem to be from people that don't like drinking, period.

[paulandjean]

I really do not care about a solution. When we get a clear answer,let me know. I will be at Lake Sumter Landing in my cart having a beer. Ps. Do you really think I care.

[GeorgeT]

I'll drink to that......and I'll do it in my cart at the square!:beer3:

Even better I'll open it at Sumter Landing and finish it in Spanish Springs!

[Larry Wilson]

Sure wish nanci would post again and give more details.

[rubicon]

Even better I'll open it at Sumter Landing and finish it in Spanish Springs!

I like your spirit....and will tost to that

[Bill-n-Brillo]

ummm Bill? I believe that is a direct quote from me.

I am too, by the way. I never could get the hang of it.

I enjoy watching other people and pouring drinks for them.

I have far fewer headaches. And even a couple of people think I am fun...(If I pay them to say it)

Gracie, you ARE fun! (and you know where to send the check.......) :1rotfl:

Bill :wave:

[handyman]

I am sorry that I stated my mind,but to avoid further controversy,I think all the well meaning folks that have been involved in this thread should just shut it down before we let a small infraction cause a big difference in the way life is lived in paradise:wave:

[hrp01]

The reason for "shutting it down" would be to avoid the truth perhaps...We wouldn't want it to get out that "paradise" does have problems and is not quite the Utopia put forth by the powers to be...That being said,in the big picture,this is utopian and I can think of nothing better..That does not mean there is no room for improvement...It's a great place,with diverse opinions,and only a " few badge heavy abusers of power"...The policy is all that needs to be addressed and a grass roots level (not through the media) attempt by local gendarmes to improve there likeability,and perhaps demonstrate a little respect for the hand that feeds them...They in turn will gain the respect their profession so justly deserves...jmho

[PennBF]

It is a shame that a number of residents have not experienced or been
involved in terrible vehicle accidents because of the drug alcohol. If
you are sitting in you car along a highway and have an open container
you will be ticketed.
Driving a golf cart, and it is a fair conclusion that if you are in a cart you
will be driving it, and if you are drinking alcohol it is safe to assume that some of your judgement is impaired, and if you are driving it home or to another
square it is statistically reasonable that you are at a higher risk of an accident and could/would put someone else health and well being at risk. Conclusion: By drinking the driver is putting others at risk who do not use the drug alcohol. Yep, tickets should be given out and the consequesnce pretty strong to stop the practice. :wine:

[jackz]

[QUOTE=PennBF;362106]It is a shame that a number of residents have not experienced or been
involved in terrible vehicle accidents because of the drug alcohol.

It is a shame????

[memason]

It is a shame that a number of residents have not experienced or been
involved in terrible vehicle accidents because of the drug alcohol. If
you are sitting in you car along a highway and have an open container
you will be ticketed.
Driving a golf cart, and it is a fair conclusion that if you are in a cart you
will be driving it, and if you are drinking alcohol it is safe to assume that some of your judgement is impaired, and if you are driving it home or to another
square it is statistically reasonable that you are at a higher risk of an accident and could/would put someone else health and well being at risk. Conclusion: By drinking the driver is putting others at risk who do not use the drug alcohol. Yep, tickets should be given out and the consequesnce pretty strong to stop the practice. :wine:

You're joking, right? It's a shame??

You sure you didn't go to my church?

[hrp01]

"its a shame"....Darn,that sounds like a pretty sick response to me...

[skyguy79]

It is a shame that a number of residents have not experienced or been involved in terrible vehicle accidents because of the drug alcohol. Poor choice of words Penn. I know what you're trying to say, but the way you stated it leaves it open to interput that you want people to have experienced or been involved in accidents. You might want to clearify what you meant!

[Golf-Tinker]

Good people, could we please retire this thread now?

[Pturner]

Wow, this is right up there with roundabouts and dog poop.

... Which is pretty funny because, as Memason said, it probably never really happened. :beer3:

[rubicon]

Yes it did. Yes it did. Yes it did.:loco:

[golf2140]

Today I spoke with an official with the Lady Lake Police Department. No citation was given out for this issue as described by nanci. He did stress that it is illegal to have an open container while in a vehicle, yes golf carts are vehicles. As to the public consumption while in the area of the squares, a permit is issued for this activity. let's put this thread to bed as another Village hoax. It also shows how we Villagers jump to conclusions!!!!

[PennBF]

I think most people understand that if they had viewed a terrible accident because of the drug alcohol they would have a much greater appreciation
as to how much danger it creates when anyone drives any vehicle under the influence. Just observe the "2 for 1" line in the squares and realize a number of these will be driving golf carts home.
There is no threat when anyone wants to drink and not get behing the wheel of a car, golf cart, boat, etc.etc. Unfortunately there are too many who drink and then drive. It is a "Shame"...

[golf2140]

bump

[GeorgeT]

bump

In your last post you suggested the we put this thread to bed and then you bump it? What gives?

[skyguy79]

http://th302.photobucket.com/albums/nn105/Zeyahl/Smiley%20Faces/th_ditto_copy.gif

Could it be that Golf got busy putting stickers on his/her golf balls after the first post then forgot about the first post by the time he/she finished?

[cabo35]

If you do violate "the spirit of the law" as defined by us Villagers, then you obvioulsy have no common sense and are just a badge heavy tool who has nothing better to do than hassle us fine folk who pay your salary.

Many sunrises and sunsets ago, as a young police officer, I remember the frequent protest of those who were cited for an assortment of infractions. It usually, as indicated above, involved a reference to who pays your salary. An old timer told me that when I was confronted with that line...to reach into my pocket for loose change not to exceed 50 cents and hand it to the violator. Follow-up with a brief, polite explanation that you are refunding what the offender contributed toward your salary. Today in The Villages, there are 80,000 residents. Average police salary maybe 30-40K....you do the math. When I hear in any context about "badge heavy tools" and the "folks who pay your salary", it brings back memories and a smile. Thank you.

A follow-up line by the miscreant might be, "Give me your name and badge number...I'm calling your chief." I would graciously comply and request that they also let the chief know what a good job I'm doing. Funny thing.......I was never called into the chief's office for a dress down. Years later, when I was the police chief, my "street" experience with handling complaints against police officers was a real asset in how I resolved them.

Another frequent disgruntled motorist retort was "Do you know who I am. I'll have your job." This usually came from some "connected" politician or political hack. My response was usually a polite smile and an explanation of how the violator could have my job. I would first explain that he would have to take a competitive exam with a thousand other candidates. Then he would have to pass a grueling physical. If he remained successful he would be required to complete six months of classroom and physical training usually run by those who served as USMC DI's. He would also have to complete the course on dealing with irate citizens. If he passed all that and was appointed, he might be lucky enough to get me as his FTO (Field Training Officer) for 3-6 months. Subject to my signing off on his performance and comprehension of the law and his job......he could have my job. Not once was I ever called on the carpet for being a smart ass cop. I probably would have plead guilty.

Tip for Villagers. Seriously, the hardest summons to write is to the driver that looks you in the eye and says "I know I was wrong", whatever you write me for, I know you're just doing your job and it's not personal." In most cases, not all, a warning would suffice.

Discretion on the issuance of summonses is built into the law. It would be impossible to enforce every law on the books equally without the discretion component. Accordingly, law enforcement generally administers "selective enforcement" to address emergent problems and circumstances. With limited resources, police administrators deploy their assets by prioritizing public safety needs. The needs are dynamic and in constant flux. Accordingly priorities are not constant and may change from month to month or even day to day. I do not know if this is relevant to the thread topic but, professionally...it's plausible.

Have a good day in the Villages.

[EdV]

In your last post you suggested the we put this thread to bed and then you bump it? What gives?

It was Golf-Tinker that suggested closing the thread.

[downeaster]

Many sunrises and sunsets ago, as a young police officer, I remember the frequent protest of those who were cited for an assortment of infractions. It usually, as indicated above, involved a reference to who pays your salary. An old timer told me that when I was confronted with that line...to reach into my pocket for loose change not to exceed 50 cents and hand it to the violator. Follow-up with a brief, polite explanation that you are refunding what the offender contributed toward your salary. Today in The Villages, there are 80,000 residents. Average police salary maybe 30-40K....you do the math. When I hear in any context about "badge heavy tools" and the "folks who pay your salary", it brings back memories and a smile. Thank you.

A follow-up line by the miscreant might be, "Give me your name and badge number...I'm calling your chief." I would graciously comply and request that they also let the chief know what a good job I'm doing. Funny thing.......I was never called into the chief's office for a dress down. Years later, when I was the police chief, my "street" experience with handling complaints against police officers was a real asset in how I resolved them.

Another frequent disgruntled motorist retort was "Do you know who I am. I'll have your job." This usually came from some "connected" politician or political hack. My response was usually a polite smile and an explanation of how the violator could have my job. I would first explain that he would have to take a competitive exam with a thousand other candidates. Then he would have to pass a grueling physical. If he remained successful he would be required to complete six months of classroom and physical training usually run by those who served as USMC DI's. He would also have to complete the course on dealing with irate citizens. If he passed all that and was appointed, he might be lucky enough to get me as his FTO (Field Training Officer) for 3-6 months. Subject to my signing off on his performance and comprehension of the law and his job......he could have my job. Not once was I ever called on the carpet for being a smart ass cop. I probably would have plead guilty.

Tip for Villagers. Seriously, the hardest summons to write is to the driver that looks you in the eye and says "I know I was wrong", whatever you write me for, I know you're just doing your job and it's not personal." In most cases, not all, a warning would suffice.

Discretion on the issuance of summonses is built into the law. It would be impossible to enforce every law on the books equally without the discretion component. Accordingly, law enforcement generally administers "selective enforcement" to address emergent problems and circumstances. With limited resources, police administrators deploy their assets by prioritizing public safety needs. The needs are dynamic and in constant flux. Accordingly priorities are not constant and may change from month to month or even day to day. I do not know if this is relevant to the thread topic but, professionally...it's plausible.

Have a good day in the Villages.

I like what you said, cabo.

[skyguy79]

Many sunrises and sunsets ago, as a young police officer, I remember the frequent protest of those who were cited for an assortment of infractions. It usually, as indicated above, involved a reference to who pays your salary. An old timer told me that when I was confronted with that line...to reach into my pocket for loose change not to exceed 50 cents and hand it to the violator. Follow-up with a brief, polite explanation that you are refunding what the offender contributed toward your salary. Today in The Villages, there are 80,000 residents. Average police salary maybe 30-40K....you do the math. When I hear in any context about "badge heavy tools" and the "folks who pay your salary", it brings back memories and a smile. Thank you.

A follow-up line by the miscreant might be, "Give me your name and badge number...I'm calling your chief." I would graciously comply and request that they also let the chief know what a good job I'm doing. Funny thing.......I was never called into the chief's office for a dress down. Years later, when I was the police chief, my "street" experience with handling complaints against police officers was a real asset in how I resolved them.

Another frequent disgruntled motorist retort was "Do you know who I am. I'll have your job." This usually came from some "connected" politician or political hack. My response was usually a polite smile and an explanation of how the violator could have my job. I would first explain that he would have to take a competitive exam with a thousand other candidates. Then he would have to pass a grueling physical. If he remained successful he would be required to complete six months of classroom and physical training usually run by those who served as USMC DI's. He would also have to complete the course on dealing with irate citizens. If he passed all that and was appointed, he might be lucky enough to get me as his FTO (Field Training Officer) for 3-6 months. Subject to my signing off on his performance and comprehension of the law and his job......he could have my job. Not once was I ever called on the carpet for being a smart ass cop. I probably would have plead guilty.

Tip for Villagers. Seriously, the hardest summons to write is to the driver that looks you in the eye and says "I know I was wrong", whatever you write me for, I know you're just doing your job and it's not personal." In most cases, not all, a warning would suffice.

Discretion on the issuance of summonses is built into the law. It would be impossible to enforce every law on the books equally without the discretion component. Accordingly, law enforcement generally administers "selective enforcement" to address emergent problems and circumstances. With limited resources, police administrators deploy their assets by prioritizing public safety needs. The needs are dynamic and in constant flux. Accordingly priorities are not constant and may change from month to month or even day to day. I do not know if this is relevant to the thread topic but, professionally...it's plausible.

Have a good day in the Villages.Cabo, I agree with what you've stated 120% and in part it hits home.

About 33 years ago I was hired as an enforcement supervisor with the NYS Dept. of Motor Vehicles and held the position for 23 years during which time the duties expanded to triple from where they started from. It was administrative enforcement and not line enforcement. Through those years I too got those rediculous lines thrown at me like I pay your salary, you have no idea who your dealing with etc. I didn't throw lines back at such statements about the salary, but thought to myself "Hey, I pay my salary too" or ""So your responsible for my being underpaid" or "So give me a raise, I've earned it and deserve it" and some that I've long forgotten about. If I would reveal their names, you'd also be surprised at some of the people I've dealt with who had problems with their licenses; you'd probably recognize one or more of them.

Anyway, what I'm getting at is one of the things you mentioned... giving a refund of change $ to people who say they pay your salary. I wished I had heard of that. What a great idea! I just might of used that if I had thought about it. I can just imagine the looks on their faces now if I had done that!

Also I'd like to tell you something regarding not giving a hard time to an officer who's about to give you a ticket. About 14 years ago I was stopped by a New York State Trooper and for the first and only time in my life I was given a summons for a moving violation, a speeding ticket. Just before the Trooper handed me the ticket I said to him... "I can't really complain about getting this ticket since it's the first time I've gotten one in 34 years of driving." He responded by saying "I wish I could have said the same!" and we both laughed. He then handed me the ticket and we both went on our way.

So in conclusion let me say, thank you for serving us in the capacity you have as an enforcement officer and if you're a veteran... ditto that!

http://th96.photobucket.com/albums/l164/vkmir/th_smiley-thankyou.gif

[GeorgeT]

It was Golf-Tinker that suggested closing the thread.

It was both.

[skyguy79]

let's put this thread to bed as another Village hoax.

bump

It was Golf-Tinker that suggested closing the thread.

It was both.Although both made the suggestion, the comment was only directed at golf2140's comments and not Golf-Tinker's!

[Golf-Tinker]

Get another life people.

[rubicon]

Many sunrises and sunsets ago, as a young police officer, I remember the frequent protest of those who were cited for an assortment of infractions. It usually, as indicated above, involved a reference to who pays your salary. An old timer told me that when I was confronted with that line...to reach into my pocket for loose change not to exceed 50 cents and hand it to the violator. Follow-up with a brief, polite explanation that you are refunding what the offender contributed toward your salary. Today in The Villages, there are 80,000 residents. Average police salary maybe 30-40K....you do the math. When I hear in any context about "badge heavy tools" and the "folks who pay your salary", it brings back memories and a smile. Thank you.

A follow-up line by the miscreant might be, "Give me your name and badge number...I'm calling your chief." I would graciously comply and request that they also let the chief know what a good job I'm doing. Funny thing.......I was never called into the chief's office for a dress down. Years later, when I was the police chief, my "street" experience with handling complaints against police officers was a real asset in how I resolved them.

Another frequent disgruntled motorist retort was "Do you know who I am. I'll have your job." This usually came from some "connected" politician or political hack. My response was usually a polite smile and an explanation of how the violator could have my job. I would first explain that he would have to take a competitive exam with a thousand other candidates. Then he would have to pass a grueling physical. If he remained successful he would be required to complete six months of classroom and physical training usually run by those who served as USMC DI's. He would also have to complete the course on dealing with irate citizens. If he passed all that and was appointed, he might be lucky enough to get me as his FTO (Field Training Officer) for 3-6 months. Subject to my signing off on his performance and comprehension of the law and his job......he could have my job. Not once was I ever called on the carpet for being a smart ass cop. I probably would have plead guilty.

Tip for Villagers. Seriously, the hardest summons to write is to the driver that looks you in the eye and says "I know I was wrong", whatever you write me for, I know you're just doing your job and it's not personal." In most cases, not all, a warning would suffice.

Discretion on the issuance of summonses is built into the law. It would be impossible to enforce every law on the books equally without the discretion component. Accordingly, law enforcement generally administers "selective enforcement" to address emergent problems and circumstances. With limited resources, police administrators deploy their assets by prioritizing public safety needs. The needs are dynamic and in constant flux. Accordingly priorities are not constant and may change from month to month or even day to day. I do not know if this is relevant to the thread topic but, professionally...it's plausible.

Have a good day in the Villages.

Cabo 35.....you made my point. first, I appraoched disgruntled customersin the same manner as you did with violators. so it was a natural that I would train my subordinates in the same way. If I found an employee who continually displayed "being as subtle as a train wreck" I let them go.

I have said all along in this thread and similar threads that its not the ticket or the mehtod of operation as much as it is the lack of puiblic relation skills devoid in an officer. Yet you will not get an enorcement officer to admit an officer is out ofline because perhaps they can't or maybe because they won't.

Succintly stated, I have witnessed officers who are "as subtle as a train wreck." and I had to appoint an attorney to defend them in a court of law .

[Russ_Boston]

Today I spoke with an official with the Lady Lake Police Department. No citation was given out for this issue as described by nanci. He did stress that it is illegal to have an open container while in a vehicle, yes golf carts are vehicles. As to the public consumption while in the area of the squares, a permit is issued for this activity. let's put this thread to bed as another Village hoax. It also shows how we Villagers jump to conclusions!!!!

What conclusion? That it is illegal to have an open container in the golf cart as mentioned? The fact that maybe it didn't happen as suggested in no way takes away from the debate. In fact the idea that they (Lady Lake) say it is illegal but don't write citations for it sits on the side of us that think they should use common sense. Which I guess they do if they don't actually issue the citations.

What this thread did do is show how public forums are used by those that just want to get their thoughts out there even if they are not actually addressing the topic of the thread. We had people talking about the dangers of drunk driving (it's bad? really? thanks for letting me know!)

But in the end I did learn that even though Lady Lake may not ticket for it - I won't sit in the cart to drink. I'll bring a chair and sit 5 inches in front of it!

[golf2140]

What conclusion? That it is illegal to have an open container in the golf cart as mentioned? The fact that maybe it didn't happen as suggested in no way takes away from the debate. In fact the idea that they (Lady Lake) say it is illegal but don't write citations for it sits on the side of us that think they should use common sense. Which I guess they do if they don't actually issue the citations.

What this thread did do is show how public forums are used by those that just want to get their thoughts out there even if they are not actually addressing the topic of the thread. We had people talking about the dangers of drunk driving (it's bad? really? thanks for letting me know!)

But in the end I did learn that even though Lady Lake may not ticket for it - I won't sit in the cart to drink. I'll bring a chair and sit 5 inches in front of it!

Russ,

Where did you read that Lady Lake PD doesn't give citations for open containers in carts. My post was concerning this incident. :doh:

[kandj]

Russ,

Where did you read that Lady Lake PD doesn't give citations for open containers in carts. My post was concerning this incident. :doh:

You need to read Russ' comments more carefully! He stated that he would NOT sit in his cart, but bring a lawn chair and sit 5 inch!s in front of his cart.

However, the originator of this post did NOT get a citation for an open container while in a motor vehicle. They got it for public drinking. I think we need to get some CLEAR statements of these restrictions from the LLPD and have them posted so folks know where they stand (or more importantly where they SHOULDN'T stand) with an open container in hand.

[golf2140]

You need to read Russ' comments more carefully! He stated that he would NOT sit in his cart, but bring a lawn chair and sit 5 inch!s in front of his cart.

However, the originator of this post did NOT get a citation for an open container while in a motor vehicle. They got it for public drinking. I think we need to get some CLEAR statements of these restrictions from the LLPD and have them posted so folks know where they stand (or more importantly where they SHOULDN'T stand) with an open container in hand.

you may want to reread his post:doh:

[dillywho]

My neighbor told me that she and her husband were in Spanish Springs listening to the music in the square in their golf cart The couple next to them were drinking wine and beer (in their golf cart). A police officer came over and handed them a ticket for public drinking. He explained that sitting in a vehicle even a non moving vehicle with an open alchololic beverage is a violation..........

Looks like the ticket and the explanation didn't match up.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

:popcorn:

Bill :wave:

[Talk Host]

DIE, DIE,DIE Get another life people.

Yikes, what's this about? Flashback to high school.:yuck:

Any wonder we need cops in The Villages?

[ssmith]

I at first wondered about the die, die, die but hopefully the poster was talking about this thread....not that I want it to die....but hopefully the poster was not wishing ill to people.

[memason]

Get another life people.

Well, for a thread that you want so desperately to DIE, you have kept it alive with your posts. Not once, but twice!

My recommendation: When you see the thread title "Violation Tickets", DO NOT CLICK ON IT!

ha ha... I knew those years in tech support would come in handy some day... :loco:

[Russ_Boston]

Russ,

Where did you read that Lady Lake PD doesn't give citations for open containers in carts. My post was concerning this incident. :doh:

I don't understand how you found about this particular incident since you didn't know the date or the whole name of the person. That's why I assumed they answered you generically that they don't give tickets for this. How did you ask them about the original incident without this info? And why would they answer a stranger anyway?

But all that is secondary. We can still have the debate about whether they should or not. Let's just not move into the drunk driving is dangerous territory (duh!). (I'm not talking about your posts).

[redwitch]

LOL Mike (never a good thing to let someone like me know that you are a serious techie as opposed to just a tinkerer -- I may be whining for help soon hehe).

As to this thread, I'm not convinced I want to see it die. It brings up some very valid issues re drinking in a golf cart. I really don't care if the neighbor actually saw someone get a ticket for sitting in a cart and drinking. I care that people don't view golf carts as vehicles and can't seem to understand that drinking and driving don't mix, regardless of the mode of transportation.

I care that people see this as simply as a way for a town to make money, not as the preventative measure it is. They can't do a darn thing about people at the squares walking around and drinking, but they can if you're on the street. Yet, when people break this simple law and get a warning or a ticket, the first thing they do is scream they were doing nothing wrong. Sorry, it is against the law. It really is that simple.

Yes, TV is seen as a cash cow. Deservedly so. We pay the most taxes. There are jobs created because of TV. We provide entertainment. And so on and so forth. Without TV, this area would be nothing but a farm community with the towns suffering even higher unemployment, poor schools, bad roads, etc. However, that doesn't make Villagers exempt from the law. Believe it or not, I do know of Lady Lake officers who have ticketed and even arrested people in the town of Lady Lake for open containers in a parked vehicle. I even have heard (can't state as fact, though) of a bicyclist getting a DUI for drinking while on his bike in Summerfield. As I said, if I get pulled over for breaking a moving violation, I thank the officer for doing his job. I was in the wrong, not he. Some things in life should be argued and fought for, some things should not. An officer trying to get a message across about golf carts being vehicles and that driving a cart and drinking don't mix should be met with a hearty thank you, not complaints. (And why is it assumed he was anything but courteous when he gave this warning or handed out the citation?)

[paulandjean]

I see nothing wrong with having a beer and then driving your golf cart.Remember it is not against the law to drink and drive,if you are under the limit.You know of the people who have a glass of wine for dinner,same thing.

[Challenger]

LOL Mike (never a good thing to let someone like me know that you are a serious techie as opposed to just a tinkerer -- I may be whining for help soon hehe).

As to this thread, I'm not convinced I want to see it die. It brings up some very valid issues re drinking in a golf cart. I really don't care if the neighbor actually saw someone get a ticket for sitting in a cart and drinking. I care that people don't view golf carts as vehicles and can't seem to understand that drinking and driving don't mix, regardless of the mode of transportation.

I care that people see this as simply as a way for a town to make money, not as the preventative measure it is. They can't do a darn thing about people at the squares walking around and drinking, but they can if you're on the street. Yet, when people break this simple law and get a warning or a ticket, the first thing they do is scream they were doing nothing wrong. Sorry, it is against the law. It really is that simple.

Yes, TV is seen as a cash cow. Deservedly so. We pay the most taxes. There are jobs created because of TV. We provide entertainment. And so on and so forth. Without TV, this area would be nothing but a farm community with the towns suffering even higher unemployment, poor schools, bad roads, etc. However, that doesn't make Villagers exempt from the law. Believe it or not, I do know of Lady Lake officers who have ticketed and even arrested people in the town of Lady Lake for open containers in a parked vehicle. I even have heard (can't state as fact, though) of a bicyclist getting a DUI for drinking while on his bike in Summerfield. As I said, if I get pulled over for breaking a moving violation, I thank the officer for doing his job. I was in the wrong, not he. Some things in life should be argued and fought for, some things should not. An officer trying to get a message across about golf carts being vehicles and that driving a cart and drinking don't mix should be met with a hearty thank you, not complaints. (And why is it assumed he was anything but courteous when he gave this warning or handed out the citation?)

Well stated

[Russ_Boston]

Red - Respectfully, I don't need a reminder about the dangers of driving while intoxicated (in any moving vehicle). But the vast, vast majority of us (who have an alcohol drink) have 1 or 2 drinks and then get home in some moving vehicle. We are not intoxicated or even near the limit. I still don't like the idea of getting a citation in a parked cart on the square while you could sit 5 inches in front of the cart with no citation. Not one single responder on this site has said it's OK to get drunk and drive - not one. This isn't a referendum on drunk driving.

PS > because of this thread I have purchased and will use my fold up chairs in the square. Save me some cash!

[graciegirl]

Red - Respectfully, I don't need a reminder about the dangers of driving while intoxicated (in any moving vehicle). But the vast, vast majority of us (who have an alcohol drink) have 1 or 2 drinks and then get home in some moving vehicle. We are not intoxicated or even near the limit. I still don't like the idea of getting a citation in a parked cart on the square while you could sit 5 inches in front of the cart with no citation. Not one single responder on this site has said it's OK to get drunk and drive - not one. This isn't a referendum on drunk driving.

PS > because of this thread I have purchased and will use my fold up chairs in the square. Save me some cash!

Well, don't come cryin' to me, when someone sits on your folding chair when you get up to pee..... Or SAVES it by chaining it to the next five.:shrug:

[skip0358]

Well, don't come cryin' to me, when someone sits on your folding chair when you get up to pee..... Or SAVES it by chaining it to the next five.:shrug:

Well it's funny you say that. Wife and I went to dinner and parked by the square,. When we came out someone had enjoyed our golf cart front seat and left there almost empty cups in the cup holders

[Russ_Boston]

Well, don't come cryin' to me, when someone sits on your folding chair when you get up to pee..... Or SAVES it by chaining it to the next five.:shrug:

Good point - Maybe I can chain it to my golf cart. But would that mean it is now part of the cart? Inquiring minds need to know.

Or I guess I could just drink water:)

[skyguy79]

Good point - Maybe I can chain it to my golf cart. But would that mean it is now part of the cart? Inquiring minds need to know.

Or I guess I could just drink water:)Russ, if you chain your chair to the golf cart, then it's part of the golf cart. However, if you chain your golf cart to the chair, then the golf cart is part of the chair and you can then enjoy a drink in the golf cart. :wave:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y299/AryannaR/334415447416.gif
What's your excuse!

[Raymond]

Red - Respectfully, I don't need a reminder about the dangers of driving while intoxicated (in any moving vehicle). But the vast, vast majority of us (who have an alcohol drink) have 1 or 2 drinks and then get home in some moving vehicle. We are not intoxicated or even near the limit.
With all due respect, with 2 glasses wine you are intoxicated and near or cloth to the limit. And we talk about the legal limit. But what is about the personal Limit?
With two drinks the driving skills are affected, that is for sure. In addition, the people from the villages are not more in age of 20 or so. When you hit a certain age, reaction, vision, everything goes slower. It is the life. When you have 2 or more drinks in addition, this could be a bad mix.
Drinking and driving should be a no go for everyone.
PS: Impaired driving applies to all vehicles.

[2BNTV]

Well, don't come cryin' to me, when someone sits on your folding chair when you get up to pee..... Or SAVES it by chaining it to the next five.:shrug:

Gracie:

One fanny in seat equals reserved. :)

I'm sorry, I must in the wrong thread. :confused:

[Russ_Boston]

With all due respect, with 2 glasses wine you are intoxicated and near or cloth to the limit.

With all due respect you need to read some science. According to the chart in my link it would take me 4 drinks in the first hour to reach the limit (i.e. the body generally removes about 1 drink per hour from the system as specified in the article and I weigh about 200lbs).

I found a good primer on the subject: http://chavesdwiprogram.us/pdf/Effects%20of%20Alcohol%20Intoxication.pdf

But I'm not here to say that any level of drinking and driving is OK. I understand that any amount of alcohol can have different effects on different people (weight, age, food consumption, past damage etc.). Heck, I am a Registered Nurse.

In the future I'll let my non-drinking wife drive the golf cart home, even though I seldom have more than 1 drink at the squares. Even the AMA says you could benefit from 1 glass of wine per day:)

Again - this thread is about whether they should give citations to people sitting in carts at the square - not whether they should drive home or not. We ALL understand you shouldn't drink and drive.

[PennBF]

Did you know that the effects of alcohol is the same as "embalming fluid".
Given this it may be an advantage as it could be asserted that in the case
of The Villages the drinking is just expediting the expected end result.:jester:

[Raymond]

With all due respect you need to read some science. According to the chart in my link it would take me 4 drinks in the first hour to reach the limit (i.e. the body generally removes about 1 drink per hour from the system as specified in the article and I weigh about 200lbs).

I found a good primer on the subject: http://chavesdwiprogram.us/pdf/Effects%20of%20Alcohol%20Intoxication.pdf

But I'm not here to say that any level of drinking and driving is OK. I understand that any amount of alcohol can have different effects on different people (weight, age, food consumption, past damage etc.). Yes, and No. You are absolutely right that it depends on body weight, condition, food, age....and many things more. Also a lot of elderly people take medications which affect the driving ability as well. The problem is, no one says I could be too drunk. Everybody is under the impression, I can still drive, i feel good.

Heck, I am a Registered Nurse.I am a much better mix, I am a LEO and my wife sells beer. :D

In the future I'll let my non-drinking wife drive the golf cart home, even though I seldom have more than 1 drink at the squares.Good choice.

Even the AMA says you could benefit from 1 glass of wine per day:)But not the DMV....:D

Again - this thread is about whether they should give citations to people sitting in carts at the square - not whether they should drive home or not. We ALL understand you shouldn't drink and drive.

And this is up to the LEO. He have the right to do it and it is his or her decision if they let you go. So be nice to all law enforcement officers and make sure, they get a pay raise. :wave:

[Russ_Boston]

Good post Raymond.

[paulandjean]

Be nice to law enforcement yes, pay raise,I say No.

[red tail]

Be nice to law enforcement yes, pay raise,I say No.

pay raise only if you work untill age 65 and no double dipping