Recreation Dept seeks National Accreditatio

[DeafDeaf]

It was shocked to read an article found on The Villages Homeowners Association Voice, September 2011, page 9 "Recreation Department seeks National Accreditation."

I am Deaf and live in The Villages, Florida since 2007. I am frustrated not being able to participate in any of 1800 programs the Villages Recreation Department offers to us, the Villagers, because I cannot understand the instructor or speaker without the interpreter for the deaf. This recreation department still refuses our requests for sign language interpreters many times - thus creating barriers for all the Deaf persons living at The Villages. There are times, when this issue was brought up about making programs accessible for the Deaf as defined by Americans with Disability Act (ADA), The Villages have not or refused to address them for those non-governmental programs on their own premises. They claim that their premises are physically accessible, but not communication accessible for the Villagers with hearing loss and those whose hearing ability is reduced due to age. I wrote to the National Parks and Recreation Association, that unless, The Villages Recreation Department reconsider on making its programs accessible for the Deaf, they should turn down TVRD's application to become one of the qualifying applicants for the Agency Accreditation

[ceejay]

I'm just curious...what, exactly, would The Villages and the The Recreation Department have to do in order to meet your criteria?

[angiefox10]

I don't live in The Villages so I will be honest to say that I don't know much about this. But I was under the impression the "programs" that you refer to are all done by people who had an interest and volunteer their time to facilitate them and not actually Villages programs.

My question is... What programs would you like to participate in that you can't because you can't hear?

And.... Is there someone who can go with you to those programs to sign for you? I have friends who can't hear who read lips. Is that something you would consider?

I'm just thinking there could be work arounds for you so you can enjoy these programs.

[NJblue]

Of the existing accredited programs, how many make their programs communications accessible and what do they do to do this?

[rjm1cc]

We all have various disabilityes that we have to deal with, but I do not think the answer is to ask others to provide services just in case we maybe at their event and need special assistance. I think in the case of the recreation department you shoud hire your own interperter and take that person to the events that you need the help.

[DeafDeaf]

Regarding the programs offered via VRD, including the non-government gatherings, clubs, classes, etc., the VRD, according to the Title II of ADA, is responsible to provide reasonable accommodations to people with disabilities, regardless whether it is volunteer-supported program or not, because they are held on the premises of the Villages Community Development Districts (recreation centers, schools, and public places). VCDD has responded that their lawyer gave the opinion that VCDD/VRD is not responsible for providing effective communication needs for those non-government programs on their own premises. If their buildings are accessible for those with physical handicaps, why cannot they recognize those whose physical handicaps does include the hearing disabilities because loss of hearing is also physical. Lipreading is not 100% effective because it is not more visual than the signing hands/fingers. Those Villagers who are deaf do need the qualified interpreters in order to have effective communication in any program like other people who are normal.

[ilovetv]

Since when should the community provide a Personal Assistant for every kind of disability that people have here?

Many people advertise for and hire a person to help them around the house, go shopping for them, drive them where they need to go, do the housework, etc.

It seems like it's a personal responsibility to either find a volunteer deaf interpreter, or hire one for a few hours a week.

[Pturner]

Regarding the programs offered via VRD, including the non-government gatherings, clubs, classes, etc., the VRD, according to the Title II of ADA, is responsible to provide reasonable accommodations to people with disabilities, regardless whether it is volunteer-supported program or not, because they are held on the premises of the Villages Community Development Districts (recreation centers, schools, and public places). VCDD has responded that their lawyer gave the opinion that VCDD/VRD is not responsible for providing effective communication needs for those non-government programs on their own premises. If their buildings are accessible for those with physical handicaps, why cannot they recognize those whose physical handicaps does include the hearing disabilities because loss of hearing is also physical. Lipreading is not 100% effective because it is not more visual than the signing hands/fingers. Those Villagers who are deaf do need the qualified interpreters in order to have effective communication in any program like other people who are normal.

Hi DeafDeaf,
Could you share what you feel the Rec. Department must do to meet your criteria?

[villagegolfer]

Since when should the community provide a Personal Assistant for every kind of disability that people have here?

Many people advertise for and hire a person to help them around the house, go shopping for them, drive them where they need to go, do the housework, etc.

It seems like it's a personal responsibility to either find a volunteer deaf interpreter, or hire one for a few hours a week.

Agree 100%.

[bike42]

To me this seems like a perfect volunteer opportunity. Surely there are many people in TV who know sign language and who would be happy to place themselves on call for activities that require an interpreter, such as meetings, plays, classes and so forth. When a hearing-impaired person wishes to participate they could let this volunteer list know that they need an interpreter for a specific event. The volunteers could be coordinated by the Recreation Department, the Lifelong Learning College, or some other existing organization.

This approach would be much more in the spirit of TV than demanding paid interpreters at every event.

[DeafDeaf]

Please do not use the improper term - hearing impaired (or impairment). If I tell people that I am hearing impaired, they think something is wrong with me. However, if I tell people I am deaf, they say nothing is wrong with me except that I can't hear!

By law, no qualified individual with a disability shall, by reason of such disability, be excluded from participation in or be denied the benefits of the services, programs, or activities of a public entity , or be subjected to discrimination by any such entity.

There are no volunteers because interpreters spent money to obtain the proper trainings, to take examinations, and to pay for licenses, which may amount to several thousand dollars. Unqualified volunteers will not perform effectively, accurately and impartially both receptively and expressively, using any specialized vocabulary necessary for effective communication! In other words, would you accept the volunteer doctor without the proper licenses?

[eweissenbach]

Please do not use the improper term - hearing impaired (or impairment). If I tell people that I am hearing impaired, they think something is wrong with me. However, if I tell people I am deaf, they say nothing is wrong with me except that I can't hear!

By law, no qualified individual with a disability shall, by reason of such disability, be excluded from participation in or be denied the benefits of the services, programs, or activities of a public entity , or be subjected to discrimination by any such entity.

There are no volunteers because interpreters spent money to obtain the proper trainings, to take examinations, and to pay for licenses, which may amount to several thousand dollars. Unqualified volunteers will not perform effectively, accurately and impartially both receptively and expressively, using any specialized vocabulary necessary for effective communication! In other words, would you accept the volunteer doctor without the proper licenses?

I am hearing impaired - I have profound hearing loss in my left ear and wear a hearing aid. I can function fairly normally, but in noisy circumstances I struggle to make out any one voice or conversation. I say all this to say that I feel empathy for you but I, in no way, am as handicapped by my situation as you are in yours. What occurs to me is that, while I understand your frustration, and the real need for assistance, I wonder how many others are in your shoes? If there are a very few people who need this assistance, it may be financially or physically impractical to provide signers for the 100s or 1000s of courses offered. Like most people who don't face these problems, I haven't really thought through it and don't know what the solution could or should be.

[ilovetv]

Please do not use the improper term - hearing impaired (or impairment). If I tell people that I am hearing impaired, they think something is wrong with me. However, if I tell people I am deaf, they say nothing is wrong with me except that I can't hear!

By law, no qualified individual with a disability shall, by reason of such disability, be excluded from participation in or be denied the benefits of the services, programs, or activities of a public entity , or be subjected to discrimination by any such entity.

There are no volunteers because interpreters spent money to obtain the proper trainings, to take examinations, and to pay for licenses, which may amount to several thousand dollars. Unqualified volunteers will not perform effectively, accurately and impartially both receptively and expressively, using any specialized vocabulary necessary for effective communication! In other words, would you accept the volunteer doctor without the proper licenses?

Comparing RECREATION Dept. activities/offerings to a MEDICAL doctor's assessment and treatment is an entirely different level of need!

Taking recreation classes to learn pickleball, dancing or arts/crafts is hardly the same level of importance as a medical doctor consult.

On that note, who interprets for you when you go to the doctor's office?

[DeafDeaf]

Sorry that you all have incorrect views of people who are Deaf or Hard of Hearing.

First of all, the volunteers are not trained to provide effective communications for Deaf people. It is hard to find the qualified volunteer interpreters! If you know someone, please provide the contact information to me.

Secondly, when there is much vebral communicaiton in any recreation class or course, it will be the same level of importance as a medical doctor consultation or attorney conversation. All doctors, attorneys, colleges, governments hire qualified interpreters for their customers! Why not the Recreation Department!

It is a sad day for Deaf Villagers that the Recreation Department receives the accreditation from National Park and Recreation Association.

[GaDawg]

To me this seems like a perfect volunteer opportunity. Surely there are many people in TV who know sign language and who would be happy to place themselves on call for activities that require an interpreter, such as meetings, plays, classes and so forth. When a hearing-impaired person wishes to participate they could let this volunteer list know that they need an interpreter for a specific event. The volunteers could be coordinated by the Recreation Department, the Lifelong Learning College, or some other existing organization.

This approach would be much more in the spirit of TV than demanding paid interpreters at every event.

Good points Bike. Those seem like reasonable accommodations to me, but then, I am not Deaf. I am still curious as to what DeafDeaf feels is a "reasonable accommodation" for the Rec Dep. to provide, and how he sees his responsibility for his own disability accommodations. I have a nephew who has CP and at times I am frustrated about the "reasonable accommodations" he is provided, but with my sister's help he gets along nicely.

[Taj44]

I think we, as non-deaf persons, are looking at things from the perspective of those who can hear, not from the perspective of someone who has to struggle with deafness on a day-to-day basis. And under the ADA, the need and requirement for public accomodation is much more stringent than it used to be when we were growing up. I don't have the answers, and I don't know what is required under law, but I agree that it would be a perfect volunteer opportunity at the very least. Besides deaf people, we do have many people who are hearing impaired due to old age. It seems logical that there should be some accommodation for them. At what venues, and to what extent, I don't know, but I think it should be part of the conversation. We are past the time when you can just say "no" and kind of brush it under the rug. If a few people were trained for signing, for example, then placed on call as volunteers for the recreation department, would that not be the beginning of a solution?

[graciegirl]

I have a friend who takes lessons in The American Sign Language every week at the Fairways Christian Church. She doesn't have any deaf people in her family. I am not sure why she is learning it but I only have good suspicions about her. She is such a love.

I think that the American Disabilites Act has improved things mightily. You realize that when you travel in Europe and the rest of the world.

As we age and we lose some of our abilities we understand more how it is to be challenged in our mobility, sight and hearing.

We all should do what we can to help each other and we should all do what we can to help ourselves. Just like always. You cannot legislate morality. And laws and rules can't fix everything. A kind heart and helping hands go a long way and a great determination to get through things helps too.

[bkcunningham1]

Are you saying you want a person with National Interpreter Certification at each of The Villages' recreation centers for every class or activity taking place in these centers? Or just when it is requested? I'm not sure I'm grasping the whole meaning of your complaint. What specific activities have you been excluded from because of your deafness?

[rockyisle]

I am also hearing impaired. I have an implant in one ear and wear a hearing aid in the other. So, I think I understand some of your frustrations.

Now that you've made us aware of the issue, why not take this moment to create a club for the Hearing Impaired and Deaf. (Please don't discriminate against those of us who still have some hearing, but do have similar issues in noisy environments)... You just might find that some of "us" would love to learn Sign Language to assist those who cannot hear. And with a growing population of people with a variety of skills and professions, I would bet you'd find many Licensed Interpreters to accompany you to the classes you'd like to attend.

I envision this club where anyone with a desire to be a "hearing" buddy to those who want to attend classes and clubs would accompany that person - for free.

Rather than demanding an accommodation that would be impossible to fulfill, create your own positive destiny by stepping up and making a new reality for you and for others who share the need. Have you placed a request in the Volunteer section of the Daily Sun? Called a reporter to raise awareness of the needs?

I wish you all the best. It's tough for all of us as we grow older to handle our limitations. You could be the change agent for many.

[Bogie Shooter]

Now, this poster makes sense. Very good idea!

[quirky3]

I have a friend who takes lessons in The American Sign Language every week at the Fairways Christian Church. She doesn't have any deaf people in her family. I am not sure why she is learning it but I only have good suspicions about her. She is such a love.

I think that the American Disabilites Act has improved things mightily. You realize that when you travel in Europe and the rest of the world.

As we age and we lose some of our abilities we understand more how it is to be challenged in our mobility, sight and hearing.

We all should do what we can to help each other and we should all do what we can to help ourselves. Just like always. You cannot legislate morality. And laws and rules can't fix everything. A kind heart and helping hands go a long way and a great determination to get through things helps too.

I love your perspective on this, Gracie!! Thank you!

[Doodlegirl]

the Accreditation of the Recreation Department is an awesome achievement.
People have come to The Villages by appointment and observed the programs and the intent, and the conclusion has been reached that the Rec Dept. meets the benchmarks for a program which meets the needs of most of the participant group. Can we say that TV is all things to all people? No, certainly not, and to Deafdeaf, it is not. However, for those recreational activities such as swimming or pickleball or bocce, he is enabled as a player and the opportunities are abundant. Polo, a boat trip, the arts...so much is still accessible. For times he must rely only on the modality of hearing (lectures, classes), he has not found a ready source of support. A club is a wonderful idea, therefore.

I do not know under which school DeafDeaf was taught, however, I'm guessing that he/she was probably of the age when sign language and lip reading and speaking by the deaf was caught in a tumultuous time, an example of that would be the term, American Sign. Technologies were late coming to now elder deaf and hearing impaired. Having taught and worked with deaf and hearing impaired children the issues facing the deaf
in this Country are substantial, and theorists have argued this subject since
early in the twentieth century. Participation, however, in physical activities
afforded by the Rec program here and elsewhere, very positive. I cannot
think of a better place for my adult elderly deaf friends, teachers, and mentors should they be thinking of a lifestyle such as afforded by TV.

That said, I am full of sadness for so much of what all of us can hear, yet
reticent that there is much cacophony of sound I would like not to hear.
Today their are computers which translate the spoken word to written language. If DeafDeaf wants to encourage others, it should be, and we
should be with him, to have or make access to those possible at the Rec
Centers and the Life Long Learning College on an as needed basis. Even a
funding drive if he feels it would be appropriate. I would also think, the former
grant writers among us could put one together to 'purchase' ten such computers to be stored at the places most accessible.

[ilovetv]

There are good ideas above, such as forming a club or support group that endeavors to train and provide assistance on an as-needed basis.

As for wanting the accreditation to be blocked and denied, that is another matter and attitude with which I disagree. There are many sports and activities here in which many of us are physically "disabled" from learning and doing. We can't do everything that is made accessible to us here.

We do what we can, and as I said in an earlier post, there are ads in the papers every day placed by disabled or elderly people who need a paid personal assistant to do the essential things in life for them.

Who pays? is the matter at hand and I'm pretty sure there are limits on how much everyone wants to pay for the amenities fee that provides all the recreation offerings here.

[DeafDeaf]

To me this seems like a perfect volunteer opportunity. Surely there are many people in TV who know sign language and who would be happy to place themselves on call for activities that require an interpreter, such as meetings, plays, classes and so forth. When a hearing-impaired person wishes to participate they could let this volunteer list know that they need an interpreter for a specific event. The volunteers could be coordinated by the Recreation Department, the Lifelong Learning College, or some other existing organization.

This approach would be much more in the spirit of TV than demanding paid interpreters at every event.
Hi, Dr. Gabe Mirkin

Remember you had paid interpreters for your deaf patients because they acted professionally and necessary for you to communicate effectively with your patients. Don't you agree?

By the way, Volunteer ASL interpreters sometimes lack commitment. They may not take a great deal of responsibility upon themselves to provide quality interpreting. We, people who are DEAF, had used volunteer interpreters and still do complain when the quality of the translation we receive is questionable.

The obvious primary advantage of volunteer interpreters is the money saved by the District government, as these volunteer interpreters are not paid. Also, however, it may be extremely difficult to locate volunteer interpreters to continue the whole time of any program.

It is important to remember that hiring a volunteer interpreter does not necessarily guarantee quality and effectiveness of communication.

Paid ASL Interpreters keep taking continuing education courses to improve their competency of providing translation professionally. The profession of interpreting will never be recognized as a truely skilled profession if people offer their services for free. Doctors charge, contractors charge, landscapers charge...........these are all chosen occupations that require specific skills and training. No other profession does gratis work. An interpreter, who does gratis work could have it on their heart from God to do this; or they could be unskilled and are trying to get their foot in the door. I recommend that they receive the hourly rate that is your areas average. If they are employed full time as an interpreter elsewhere, that place of employment should be compensating them for their education and certification expenses.

[DeafDeaf]

the Accreditation of the Recreation Department is an awesome achievement.
People have come to The Villages by appointment and observed the programs and the intent, and the conclusion has been reached that the Rec Dept. meets the benchmarks for a program which meets the needs of most of the participant group. Can we say that TV is all things to all people? No, certainly not, and to Deafdeaf, it is not. However, for those recreational activities such as swimming or pickleball or bocce, he is enabled as a player and the opportunities are abundant. Polo, a boat trip, the arts...so much is still accessible. For times he must rely only on the modality of hearing (lectures, classes), he has not found a ready source of support. A club is a wonderful idea, therefore.

I do not know under which school DeafDeaf was taught, however, I'm guessing that he/she was probably of the age when sign language and lip reading and speaking by the deaf was caught in a tumultuous time, an example of that would be the term, American Sign. Technologies were late coming to now elder deaf and hearing impaired. Having taught and worked with deaf and hearing impaired children the issues facing the deaf
in this Country are substantial, and theorists have argued this subject since
early in the twentieth century. Participation, however, in physical activities
afforded by the Rec program here and elsewhere, very positive. I cannot
think of a better place for my adult elderly deaf friends, teachers, and mentors should they be thinking of a lifestyle such as afforded by TV.

That said, I am full of sadness for so much of what all of us can hear, yet
reticent that there is much cacophony of sound I would like not to hear.
Today their are computers which translate the spoken word to written language. If DeafDeaf wants to encourage others, it should be, and we
should be with him, to have or make access to those possible at the Rec
Centers and the Life Long Learning College on an as needed basis. Even a
funding drive if he feels it would be appropriate. I would also think, the former
grant writers among us could put one together to 'purchase' ten such computers to be stored at the places most accessible.
For Doodlegirl, I did learn to read lips while I was young. I am still a good lipreader and am very highly educated, however, I admit that I learn much more via ASL language visually and pursued further to higher education (several colleges) via ASL than lipreading. I am a very successful deaf entreprenuer and am involved in many deaf advocacy tasks. I had used volunteer and pro bono interpreters - was not satisified with their poor quality of intepreting - that is why I am not keen to see volunteer interpreters in TV.

The issue is AUDISM ( look up in Google) and it is self-explanatory.