Resident pays $8500 and loses it to vendor on The Square

[Irishmen]

A homeowner on Little Mountain Loop in The Village of Duvall paid thousands to have natural grass removed and artificial grass and rock installed in front yard and now The Villages are making them take it out. They have lost thousands of dollars to Pooters. Company called Pooters who has a tent on The Square on Market nights deceived them that this was OK. Homeowner didn't verify Pooters was telling them the truth and collected money knowing it was against deed restrictions. How can The Villages allow this vendor to continue to operate on the Square in this manner? Taking advantage of Senior Citizens no matter should not be permitted. Yes it is ultimately the homeowners responsibility but How many other homeowners are being deceived by Pooters? Pooters operates on directly managed property by the Entertainment Division under the umbrella of The Villages Community District. According to a friend of the homeowner Pooters even had some official looking document from the State stating artificial grass is OK so I don't blame the homeowner I blame Pooters. It's a shame The Villages continue 100% blaming the homeowner. How can The Villages let this continue. Pooters was well
aware of the deed restrictions. It's up to us Villagers to watch our own backs. Any credible landscape company will advise the homeowner to get approval from Architectual Review.

[graciegirl]

They taught this to us in grade school....You can do anything with permission.

Here in The Villages it means..... Ask the Architectural Review Board first.

I feel for this homeowner and I do blame this company, but all this stress could have been averted if the homeowner had cleared it first.

[Virginians]

Always wondered if this had ever been done and if The Villages would approve it. For $8500.00 I bet it looked better than many of the weed infested yards that seem to be allowed. I saw one the other that had not been cut all year.

[Pturner]

Yes, it is the homeowner's responsibility. But shame on the company. Has the homeowner sought any relief from the company? If so and did not get satisfaction, Irishman, please ask the homeowner to report this to Seniors Against Crime, and to the Florida Attorney General- Consumer Protection Division.

It wouldn't hurt to share the info with the Sumter County Commissioners and inquire whether an investigation might be done with the possibly of not to renew the offending company's business license. At least make them aware. If nothing else, if they hear from more ripped off consumers, they might be compelled to run the company out of dodge.

Predator contractors do so much damage to so many people. We need to push back hard. We need to stop letting them get away with it.

Hey Irishman, get the homeowner to do this, and we'll make you an honorary member of the Girl's Posse.

[graciegirl]

Yes, it is the homeowner's responsibility. But shame on the company. Has the homeowner sought any relief from the company? If so and did not get satisfaction, Irishman, please ask the homeowner to report this to Seniors Against Crime, and to the Florida Attorney General- Consumer Protection Division.

It wouldn't hurt to share the info with the Sumter County Commissioners and inquire whether an investigation might be done with the possibly of not to renew the offending company's business license. At least make them aware. If nothing else, if they hear from more ripped off consumers, they might be compelled to run the company out of dodge.

Predator contractors do so much damage to so many people. We need to push back hard. We need to stop letting them get away with it.

Hey Irishman, get the homeowner to do this, and we'll make you an honorary member of the Girl's Posse.

What kinda name is Pooters anyway? Sounds nasty to me. I think we should round up the girls and make a little visit.

[Bosoxfan]

I feel bad for these folks being taken. I couldn't imagine losing $8500 so that's why I would have done alot of research before getting something like this done. Jees I put up a $300 flagpole but before I did I went thru the approval by the arc . Doesn't everyone know that anytime you're going to change the outside appearance of your house or property there are cahnnels you have to go through.Expensive lesson.

[renielarson]

I'd join your posse on that visit to Pooters.

I hold The Villages somewhat responsible because they are leasing the space to Pooters which, in my opinion, would condone what Pooters markets...Architectural Review Board or not. IMHO, if The Villages okays Pooters to sell their goods on The Square then that would be an endorsement of approval. At least that is what I'd think.

[Larry Wilson]

In a patio villa neighborhood I know, every kind of yard is being allowed. Ever since the water restrictions, they have allowed all kinds of maintenance free yards. Designer stones, cement, artificial turf and one guy I know even has shredded tires.
The Villages hasn't said anything about any of them. Course no one has complained either.

[Irishmen]

Always wondered if this had ever been done and if The Villages would approve it. For $8500.00 I bet it looked better than many of the weed infested yards that seem to be allowed. I saw one the other that had not been cut all year.

Actually drive by and see yourself. It's a disaster. Looks like it was rolled out and left. There are ridges where the pieces were just laid on top of each other causing ridges. Pooters told the homeowner the lines would eventually go away. What a scam!

[skip0358]

Maybe a peaceful protest in front of the pooters tent is in order. I'm sure that would get the point across and the word out!!

[ssmith]

Could this be taken to a local television station and posted there....or Seniors against Crime. It isn't exactly a crime, I guess. in terms of the law, but it sure is a crime morally!!!!

[bkcunningham1]

Actually drive by and see yourself. It's a disaster. Looks like it was rolled out and left. There are ridges where the pieces were just laid on top of each other causing ridges. Pooters told the homeowner the lines would eventually go away. What a scam!

Good morning Irishmen. I've seen the display and talked to the people at the booth on Market Night at the square. I am curious if the homeowner was told to take up the artificial turf because of what you describe above or if it isn't allowed under any circumstance?

Regardless, it is a shame that someone is going to lose money on something they thought was going to benefit them and their property.

[The Villager II]

what a mess. I would sure be horified to see my neighbor put in artificial grass, pink birds, purple shutters etc. etc. as I like the fact that we all blend into one similar look.

On the other hand, what a shame for a vendor to do what I am sure he knows gos against the rules of the villages.

I vote for taking it out and reinstalling grass or even weeds rather than artificial grass.

:spoken:

[Russ_Boston]

One thing is for sure. If that homeowner had been a member of TOTV they would have saved themselves a lot of headaches and money. Even before I lived there I knew EVERYTHING has to be approved by the ARC ahead of time.

[Freeda]

It is very sad to hear someone having such a loss as this. I suggest that the homeowner file a dispute with their bank or credit card company (since there may be time limits on making a claim), however the payment was made, and also with the vendor, if they haven't already (the first post made me think that talking with the seller had already been tried, but if not this should of course be done) asking for a refund based on the poor result as described above; plus the vendor's knowledge, if it can be proven, that the artificial turf would violate deed restrictions at the buyer's location. Even though the buyer should have checked and would have learned of the deed restriction, if the vendor actually had knowledge of it, they would have also realized that the buyer was acting without this knowledge, and under general contract law a contract can be void or voidable under a theory along the lines of 'impossibility (of the intended benefit, I.e., the artificial turf) for intended use', particularly where one of the parties was acting with knowledge of the 'impossibility'; or possibly under some type of a 'mistake' theory. I didn't specialize in contract law nor did I practice in Florida, but these general theories probably would apply in some form in most if not all states; and so lastly, I would also find an attorney if the dispute isn't resolved quickly. And take photos.

[Bryan]

Pooters Ponds & Pressure-Crete LLC is actually a member of the Better Business Bureau with an A+ rating and only one complaint on file. Perhaps a complaint to the BBB would be in order also.

[Russ_Boston]

Do we even know for sure that Pooters hasn't offered to make it right? I know that Pooters was mentioned by the poster, in negative manner, a few times prior to this post so this was not news to them. As always, it's nice to be informed but this forum is information only don't take what any of us say as gospel until you check it out yourselves.

[Chi-Town]

Maybe the solution is to put a few putting green cups around the yard. Pooters told me that their putting greens are Villages approved. Guaranteed that any neighbor that thought that an astro turf lawn was unsightly would reconsider with an open invitation.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

In a patio villa neighborhood I know, every kind of yard is being allowed. .....

Larry, did you mean CYV neighborhoods, not patio villas?

Bill :)

[drdodge]

I drove by that house this AM didn't think it looked that bad. I would hire a good lawyer and fight it
drd

[Schaumburger]

One thing is for sure. If that homeowner had been a member of TOTV they would have saved themselves a lot of headaches and money. Even before I lived there I knew EVERYTHING has to be approved by the ARC ahead of time.

This is why reading and posting on TOTV is so valuable for TV wannabees, new owners and long-time owners. Not knowing the rules can cost you $$.

[Larry Wilson]

I was talking about a patio villa"s neighborhood that has been around since 2004. It is just south of 466 and I can't think of the name right now. We have friends there. Like I said, maybe patio villas have different rules but they have EVERYTHING for their front lawns.
You would think CYV villas would be even more lenient because you really don't see their lawns.
Maybe someone complained.
It seems the Villages pretty much leave the settled neighborhoods alone unless someone complains. At least that has been our experience.

[brostholder]

I'm afraid I'm not getting it. If Pooters has a booth at the squares on market night, it is hard to imagine that they do not know that their product requires arc approval. If they do know their product requires arc approval then they should tell prospective customers. If the arc has approved their product in the past, then why couldn't the homeowners been granted a "post-installation" approval and perhaps pay a small fine for not having it pre-approved. The only reason I could think of for not allowing a post approval is that the product is approvable in some settings but not in others.

[Freeda]

I'm afraid I'm not getting it. If Pooters has a booth at the squares on market night, it is hard to imagine that they do not know that their product requires arc approval. If they do know their product requires arc approval then they should tell prospective customers. If the arc has approved their product in the past, then why couldn't the homeowners been granted a "post-installation" approval and perhaps pay a small fine for not having it pre-approved. The only reason I could think of for not allowing a post approval is that the product is approvable in some settings but not in others.

Good point. Another thing to do is to look at the exact wording of the deed restriction for that neighborhood to see if there is any ambiguity or room for interpretation that might give the homeowner any chance of keeping the artificial turf; or, if the language is clearcut, check on whether a variance has been granted in other similar situations, or even if not, they could try to get a variance approved (probably doubtful that such a variance would be approved if it is disallowed in the restrictions). Plus, if the appearance of how the turf was laid is bad, as described above, it would probably still have to be fixed somehow, if that is even possible to do; and would be another reason, irrespective of the restriction, that the homeowner may be able to get a refund plus the cost of restoring the lawn. Also, if the language is clearcut that artificial turf is not allowed, then that would help in the homeowner's claim against the vendor, if it is shown that the vendor knew of the restriction, as was stated above. Either way, knowing the exact language of the restriction for that specific neighborhood, since some restrictions vary from neighborhood to neighborhood, is important.

I just hope something works out for these people; after all, they are Villagers. Even given that, as all of us recognize, they should have, without question, read the restrictions or checked before having this work done, that's such a large loss; not to mention what it will cost to remove it and resod. Since they were dealing with a vendor at the square, that they may have seen as being under some degree of endorsement of The Villages, I can see how such a misjudgment on some people's part could have occurred in not checking it out further themselves. Not everyone acts the same way, or with the same level of sophistication, in situations like this; and in The Villages, right or wrong, people sometimes are trusting and don't apply the same 'real world' practices because of the atmosphere of friendliness here. (I'm not saying that that is always excusable; but in some situations it is more understandable than in others). Even though it was their 'fault', technically, I just hate to see people have to pay such a huge price for this 'lesson', especially given that the circumstances do create some equities in their favor, and that I hope will result in the vendor working something out with these people.

As mentioned on here, what an eyeopener for me and for others.

[Irishmen]

There is no ambiguity in this matter and the deed restrictions are clear on how much natural sod a homeowner must keep. We looked into it a while back because we had rentals that were not being being maintained by a lawn service while we were back up North. We had 3 companies come out and give us quotes. 2 out of 3 advised us to seek arch approval first because they understood it was not allowed. The 3rd was Pooters and his attitude was like Let the villages try to stop me. The other 2 companies are corporately structured and practices good business while Pooters works off the back of truck with no means of accountability. We were told putting greens are allowed but we couldn't put them in the front. We have seen artificial lawns in AZ and Nevada and even Australia and they are beautifully done. This yard is a disaster. The Villages have been consistent in this enforcement. Don't you think if this product was approved, you would see more of it? You can bet after thus incident, approval has been sent back 10 years. Do you think T&D concrete would put a pool in a front yard? You bet they wouldn't. They work in this community and care about the residents. We are the accountability in this case. Deed restrictions are for good reason even if we don't always agree with them.

[zcaveman]

According to my deed restrictions:

2.7 Each home and homestead must contain a concrete driveway, the lawn must be sodded, and a lamppost erected in the front yard of each Homesite. To qualify as sodded, at least 51% of the yard visible from all adjacent roadways and golf courses mist be sodded.

That means to me grass and not artificial turf.

I agree that Pooter should have known but it is the ultimate responsibility to check with the Architectural Review Board or be guaranteed from the installer that they will contact the Architectural Review Board with the necessary paperwork.

I always do my own paperwork with the Architectural Review Board to make sure that it is done properly. It does not take that much time.

[Pturner]

I'd join your posse on that visit to Pooters.

I hold The Villages somewhat responsible because they are leasing the space to Pooters which, in my opinion, would condone what Pooters markets...Architectural Review Board or not. IMHO, if The Villages okays Pooters to sell their goods on The Square then that would be an endorsement of approval. At least that is what I'd think.

Yea. Welcome to the Posse!

:boxing2:

[Regor]

I know Pooter as a friend. He has treated his customers very well. This so called posse, should get all the facts, before jumping the gun. Sounds like a lynch mob to me. That is his last name, so the idiot on this board that is taking jabs at a persons name, better have a perfect name like what? Smith?

Do we (The Villagers) lynch someone prior to hearing both sides of the story? Your talking about destroying someones business, that has served hundreds of villagers well! Who really is at fault? I've tried to contact Pooter and invite him to this forum, but being a young, family orientated business person, he is probably with his kids and wife, not knowing this lynch mob is brewing!

[graciegirl]

I know Pooter as a friend. He has treated his customers very well. This so called posse, should get all the facts, before jumping the gun. Sounds like a lynch mob to me. That is his last name, so the idiot on this board that is taking jabs at a persons name, better have a perfect name like what? Smith?

Do we (The Villagers) lynch someone prior to hearing both sides of the story? Your talking about destroying someones business, that has served hundreds of villagers well! Who really is at fault? I've tried to contact Pooter and invite him to this forum, but being a young, family orientated business person, he is probably with his kids and wife, not knowing this lynch mob is brewing!

Whoa there. It is me you are calling an idiot and making jabs at his name as you call it was in fun...as the girls posse is a just a silly fabrication too. I apologize for kidding about someone's name. But if you read carefully, most of these posts were reacting to the information supplied. When things are reported sometimes errors are made.

There is no lynch mob and people here were responding to what they THOUGHT from the information presented... was an injustice. I think it would be wise for your friend to tell his side of what happened.

[Pturner]

Whoa there. It is me you are calling an idiot and making jabs at his name as you call it was in fun...as the girls posse is a just a silly fabrication too. I apologize for kidding about someone's name. But if you read carefully, most of these posts were reacting to the information supplied. When things are reported sometimes errors are made.

There is no lynch mob and people here were responding to what they THOUGHT from the information presented... was an injustice. I think it would be wise for your friend to tell his side of what happened.

Eeek. I hope nobody thought we actually went around beating the crap out of people. :faint:

[angiefox10]

Eeek. I hope nobody thought we actually went around beating the crap out of people. :faint:


No... But it is a funny visual!!!! :a040::boxing2::a040:

[graciegirl]

Eeek. I hope nobody thought we actually went around beating the crap out of people. :faint:


HOWEVER......some folks are gettin' on my nerves............

[Irishmen]

I know Pooter as a friend. He has treated his customers very well. This so called posse, should get all the facts, before jumping the gun. Sounds like a lynch mob to me. That is his last name, so the idiot on this board that is taking jabs at a persons name, better have a perfect name like what? Smith?

Do we (The Villagers) lynch someone prior to hearing both sides of the story? Your talking about destroying someones business, that has served hundreds of villagers well! Who really is at fault? I've tried to contact Pooter and invite him to this forum, but being a young, family orientated business person, he is probably with his kids and wife, not knowing this lynch mob is brewing!
Pooters is not his first or last name. It's a business entity. This is all about business. This is all about putting a unsuspecting Village resident in harms way. We invite any response from Pooters. However I doubt we"ll here from him because the facts stated throughout this thread are correct.
1. He knows the deed restrictions but chose to do the project anyway for a huge amount of money in the thousands. Even if the homeowner said, hey Pooters we got approval, he still should have known and requested to see said approval. Credible business do not do something that they know is not right no matter how much money is at stake.
2. He is on Village managed property under supervision of the Entertainment Division who are managed by the VCDD. By participating in Market Nights available to Village residents and others from outside the community he is purposefully misrepresenting a recent legislative act regarding Florida Friendly landscapes. Artificial grass is not listed. The list is
available at arch review.
3. Having said the above, you don't overlap pieces of carpet on top of each other and tell the homeowner this ridge will eventually go away. If this was done in your home you would have a fit. He seems trustworthy but this is disarming to a homeowner. I understand there is a home on Whispering way who did a putting green and it looks the same as Little Mountain Loop.
4. Once again it's nothing personal. It's business and we are protecting others from this
happening to them at great expense. Heck, I think Pooters is hilarious when I've seen him stand one one leg with his eyes closed and try to make a putt.
We wish Pooters the best of luck in all he does as long as he abides by all rules, restrictions and the like. Thus is strictly business.

3.
3

[bkcunningham1]

Is the problem with the appearance of the artificial turf or that the turf must be taken up because of restrictions in TV?

[Irishmen]

Is the problem with the appearance of the artificial turf or that the turf must be taken up because of restrictions in TV?
It is both....somebody posted the deed restriction above. However, lets say that years down the road artificial grass eventually gets approved in place of natural sod, I'm 100% sure in this instance of a horrible job, The Villages would make the homeowner either take it out or have it installed professionally. You see selling houses is King for the Developer and others. How hard would it be to sell a home in that area with that yard looking like it does. It aint gonna happen. The neighbothood is in a uproar as it is. It's a moot point though. Its coming out either the homwowner pays thousands again or The Villages will do it for them imposing fines and liens on the property.

[Russ_Boston]

Now I'm real curious to see who's lying!

Is it his last name as REGOR says or a business entity and not his last name as Irishmen says? Someone is right and someone is lying. Who shall it be!

This should be interesting. And you guys wonder why we say we don't trust some of the info here on TOTV?

[Irishmen]

His name is on his business card and like somebody said above, look at the Better Busines Bureau and his real name is listed. Apparently he is known for ponds and concrete stained driveways. The BBB site has no mention of artificial grass at this time. They say do a good job and the customer will tell 3 people about you however do a horrible job and that number goes to 10.

[English Ivy]

If you look at their website http://www.pooters.net/, it states they are a family owned and operated business named with their child's nickname.

I also see on their website they accept MC and Visa. If the homeowners in question used a credit card as their method of payment they may have some recourse through the credit card company.

It's too bad this happened but it's ultimately the homeowner's responsibility to make sure anything done to the outside of their home complies with all the covanents and restrictions they agreed to abide by when they purchased the home. Unfortunately there are too many homeowners who don't have a clue as to what is in their deed restrictions or think it doesn't apply to them.

Also, if the installation job was as bad as has been stated, why did they pay for it?

[Irishmen]

If you look at their website http://www.pooters.net/, it states they are a family owned and operated business named with their child's nickname.

I also see on their website they accept MC and Visa. If the homeowners in question used a credit card as their method of payment they may have some recourse through the credit card company.

It's too bad this happened but it's ultimately the homeowner's responsibility to make sure anything done to the outside of their home complies with all the covanents and restrictions they agreed to abide by when they purchased the home. Unfortunately there are too many homeowners who don't have a clue as to what is in their deed restrictions or think it doesn't apply to them.

Also, if the installation job was as bad as has been stated, why did they pay for it?
they were duped by Pooters saying that the ridges and gaps would go away. It is a blatant deception by Pooters which really focuses on his character. Its common sense How can one overlap pieces of carpet causing unsightly ridges and humps and then tell the homeowner these would go away. Remember, most of us have been successful in life surrounding and working with and for honorable people. We move to our retirement home and have to be aware we are like sheep ready to be singled out by the lions. The lions get a few of us but if we stick together, we can be a awesome force to deal with.

[graciegirl]

Irishmen. May I ask, Is this happening to YOU or to a friend of yours?

There is no question in my mind that it is an infringement on deed restrictions and will have to be removed. No one gets around that here.

[Irishmen]

Irishmen. May I ask, Is this happening to YOU or to a friend of yours?

There is no question in my mind that it is an infringement on deed restrictions and will have to be removed. No one gets around that here.
Hey Gracie, I came close to doing the same but my sixth sense took over. We were at Cane Garden and my friend who lives in Duvall told me about the plight of their neighbor. I knew who did the job before he even said it. Not related to this case is the homeowner who had these locals in a pick up truck knock on their door to trim trees. One of guys fell breaking arms and some ribs. They are suing the homeowner insurance company as they had no insurance. Homeowner should have checked and verified insurance before starring job on his property. We must get the word out to protect our neighborhoods. These cases of being taken advantage are all over the place. How about the 83 year old couple paying $4000 for a filter which can be bought at Lowes for $119.00. We have to get word
out to protect the herd. Going back to original The Villages continue to hold Pooters harmless in this matter which really ticks me off.

[graciegirl]

Forgive me for being so dense. If the contract was between the homeowner and this company why does The Villages have any way to find them harmful or harmless?

Oh you mean they allow them to sell on the square?

[Russ_Boston]

A couple of things:

As I said earlier Irishmen mentioned a negative review of Pooters this past May so he/she knew something and to be wary of them.

I guess Regor was the one who was lying. Note to self: remember that.

[Blackie]

This is a very unfortunate situation for the homeowner.

First of all the homeowner signed for the covenants and must have known about the Architectural Review Board. The landscaping change they made is very radical, so surely the homeowners must have talked to other people about the change - neighbors or vendors or The Villages.

That said the vendor has served The Villages since 1999 so likely knows the covenant restrictions and any morally responsible company would tell the homeowner that the change would not be allowed.

I wonder if this homeowner has met with the vendor and attempted to get some relief (refund) from him?

A situation like this could do this vendor a great deal of harm if he does nothing to help. His website shows a BBB logo so the homeowner could file a complaint there, as well as with The Villages. Then there is always Small Claims Court if the claim amount fits the Sumter County parameters.

Details of all Florida Business entities, Corporations, LLC's etc can be looked up at

www.sunbiz.org.

This search will show the principals and registered agent's names and addresses.

[marybb]

What kinda name is Pooters anyway? Sounds nasty to me. I think we should round up the girls and make a little visit.


Count me in !

[Irishmen]

Power to the people and TOTV

[drdodge]

I talked to the owner of Pooters at the square tonight and he told me that the owner told him to go ahead an install the artifiicialal grass that everything was ok
drd

[POOTERS]

ok. I hope everyone is comfortable because this might take a few minutes of your time up. I am the owner and operator of Pooters. And yes, that is the nickname of our son. However please dont be rude to others since alot of people just simple refer to us by that nickname. It is a common misconception that it is our last name and we have never corrected anyone and will answer to it if called. Anyway, I dont know why Irishmen apparently has it out for myself and my business but I would be more then happy to tell what happened. When the Florida legislature recently changed and added the Florida friendly provision we were called by a friend and told about it. in simply terms it states that an HOA cannot turn down a Florida friendly or water conservation landscape. No, artificial turf is not Florida friendly but it does fall under the water conservation part. That is what both a manufacturer of turf and a lawyer told us. That being said, we started offering the turf as an option instead of just doing putting greens. We were recommended by the landscaper to the homeowner once they found out that they wanted to remove the grub infested grass and put turf in. So we met with the the homeowners to give a bid. While there we measured everything out and tried to come up with several options for coverage of the grassy areas that would be a suitable cost for the homeowner. Once we agreed upon what was to be done. The homeowner stated that they had contracted to have the landscaping done and that they were going to go to the ARC review for her so since she already had the house plans for the main landscaping that the turf would need to be included with her submittle, since we do not do any ARC review submittles as per our contract. That has to be done by the homeowner is always that information we were given. The landscaper was contacted and asked to include the necessary information and she agreed. We set a date a couple of weeks out so as to leave sufficient time for approvals and the main landscaping to be done. When we called to check in with the homeowner prior to installation, she said that the landscapers were installing their part at that time. now this is that part that I will claim fault in. We assumed that since the landscaping was being installed and when we asked the landscaper she said that everything was ok, we took her at her word and then proceeded with the job. The job was done and the homeonwer was happy. No, there is not any ridges or overlapping. Dont know what some of the other posts are refering to but yes there is a seam. That seam is what will take time and weather to disguise. It already looks better then when installed. but I will admit that "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" and what looks good to some may notlook good to others. So I will not argue that some people might not like to see the seam. There is actually 4 or 5 seams on the entire job, and there is only one that apparently some people are offended by.
Anyway, once the homeowner received a notification from the Villages, they contacted us and we contacted several people to question the reasoning. We were told that there was apparently NEVER any ARC review submittly for anypart of the landscaping or turf, and that the homeowner needed to do that. So I met with the homeowner provided samples and anything else that I could to them to help them at that point. And then we waited to hear back from the homewner as to what the ARC review board had to say. Apparently the homeonwers could not get ahold of the landscaper to get the necessary lists from them and ended up having to go out of town. So while gone they received a phone call from the Villages and set up an appointment once they returned home to meet what I thought was the board. The homeowner contacted us and we went with them to the meeting with samples and scientific data with regards to the drainage amounts of the turf(which we were told was the reason they didn't like the turf, ITS INABILLITY TO DRAIN SUFFICIENTLY, do you think 315+/- gallons an hour is sufficient?) as well of pictures of yards in the Villages were FULL yards had been done with multiple colored landscaping rock(also not a FLorida Friendly landscaping materials)(But does fall under the water conservation part). We knew nothing of the individual deeds that homeowners agreed to, but knew that Not all yards ( and I mean ranch homes) have sod. Supposably turf is not an approved material unless it is used for small putting greens in the rear of homes. (EVEn though I have seen some in the front yards) and NO we did not do the installs... Finally, I guess I would just like to let everyone know that we are actively trying to find a buyer for the turf in the yard. And are trying to help this homeowner out.
Also, yes, we may be a small company but we have our own crew of local people whom all take pride in what they do for a living. We have NEVER knowingly or with any intention given out false information to a detriment to our customers. We recognize that you can't make everyone happy but we try too. And we also acknowledge that not every contractor/business out there has good intentions but we have proudly served that Villagers since 1999. And will continue too for as long as they allow us to.

thank you for reading this and giving us the oppurtunity to correct the misconceptions that some had with regards to us taking advantage of someone. I will admit that supoporting each other is a wonderful thing, and being able to openly listen to both sides of the story is in my book even better.

And special thanks to our friend that told us about this post/blog tonight so that we could have a chance to comment. We didn't know anything about this site until tonight at the square, and would not have posted anything wioth regards to questions and answers if not for them.

As for Irishmen, I do not know how we have affended you, but we apologize if we did. I saw that you posted a comment in May with regards to a estimate we gave you, but I am glad that you were helped with your needs even if it wasn't through our company. Although, I have to say that we have never had the attitude you stated with regards to the villages, I have worked out there as both an a/c tech with a local company and then as a business owner myself, I respect the people, employees, and the entity of The Villages.

Thank you everyone-
The owners of Pooters

[nitehawk]

Potters -- If I were on a jury and that was your "summation" ------------- Guilty as charged

[villages07]

Pooters....thanks for taking the time to explain.

Hindsight is 20/20 and the homeowner is ultimately responsible for authorizing the work to proceed, but..... something as radical as putting artificial turf in an entire front yard should have set off some bells and alarms. You, as a contractor, probably should have checked with the Villages ARC/Deed Compliance folks on a matter of general principle to see if this type of project would be acceptable before you ever offered it as a service.

Personally, I agree with the covenants and think the turf yard looks out of place in a 'natural' grass designer neighborhood.

[Irishmen]

First of all Pooter we on this forum have nothing against you or your company. This is not personal. It's business. This forum is for residents and others to express ideas and tell about experiences good or bad so others may either benefit from the good or be saved from having huge costly mistakes. You have a great personality and Would enjoy having a beer or two with you. However, once you plant your flag, you open yourself to any criticism or praise due you.

Back in May, We met you on the Square in Lake Sumter. Remember, standing on one foot like a pelican and closing your eyes and trying to make a putt? It was entertaining. We commend you for coming here to give your side.
You must also remember when I asked you about artificial grass and if The Villages approved, you put your arm around me and said" Yes I have state law that says they cant say no and With a little nudging The Villages will approve especially if you did the job.
So as I do with everything, I started doing research. I spent hours on the Internet and on the phone asking questions. I had seen this product in AZ, Vegas, California, and even Austalia. It always looked good. Heck it took me 2months to decide on a flat screen. It drives my wife nuts.
In this process, I had 2 other companies from Orlando come up and they both told me artificial grass was not allowed in front yards because deed restrictions prohibited it. I thought How could a guy being in business since 1999 in The Villages say yes but 2 companies from outside the area say no? That was first red flag. The second was these companies had references in The Villages and was glad to provide them. You said because of privacy issues, you couldn't tell provide any reference for artificial grass or putting greens.
So I didnt take the word of a mfg or lawyer, I went diectly to The Villages and there was no ambiguity in this matter. No But Pooters said I could. They said Putting Greens are allowed but only in back. Hmmmmm.
So I get back in Mid August and a golfing buddy of mine who lives In Duval says artificial grass must be approved cause we have a neighbor who has it. He knew I would be interested. I was thrilled and excited and looking foward into getting rid of our crappy grass.
I drive over to Little Mountain Loop and was horrified. This yard was terrible and I hadnt seen or from any pictures of yards done with these unsightly ridges and lines. I was thinking mfg defect so I had another friend who owns the largest office maintenance company in NYC go back over there. What he found and took pictures of was disturbing news to me. This carpet was overlapped with other carpet and just nailed down. No attempt to seam properly. I have close-up pictures if I can figure out How to post them that shows grass laying on top of other grass. Not beside each other but on top. All the pieces are like that. You say the homewoner was happy but once they know the real details I bet their going to be furious. They just believed your explanation. Pooter its obvious that either you don't know what your doing when it comes to grass or putting greens or you don't care about the homeowner. Pavers you are the best. Grass no. Pictures are the smoking gun.
So your blatant deception to the unsuspecting homeowner about "it will take time and weather to disguise" is a complete falsehood. The unsightly appearance is there forever. How on one hand can you say the carpet has a 10 year warranty against UV fade and on the other hand say weathering will make the ridges go away. Do you see why we are upset? I will post these pictures as soon as I can figure how to transfer from the phone.
To further the issue, the neighbor next door comes out and says The Villages is making them take the grass out. Are you kidding me? Who did the job and the neighbor says a company called Pooters. They didnt say so and so landsacaping. They said you. I suddenly remember our conversation and couldn't stay on the sidelines as there probably were more homeowners put in this position by Pooters. Unbelievable.
Any credible company knows that they can submit a signed arc review with all the details for the homeowner and even pick up the approval for the homeowner so your comment that is further red flags on what is going on here. The homewoner is the only one that can submit. Really? You have been in The Villages since 1999?You knew it was wrong but did it anyway. You assisted in this homeowner demise although we recognize the homeowner must take resposibility as well.

Maybe what we should do is have the homeowner come on here as well.

What is the right thing to do?
Give the homeowner back the money you assisted in deceivingly taken because you knew better and to take up the carpet at no expense to homeowner. You cant look the other way in this matter.
We forgive and we can all learn from this process. However, Don't put this all on the landscaper or the homowner.
Do the right thing Pooter. It will pay dividends down the road if you make it right.
Once again your a great guy and understand your a family man running a small business. Wish you the best of luck.

[Russ_Boston]

First my apologies to Regor since he/she must have been mislead by Pooters that it was their last name. (Although Regor says it was a friend so not so sure why a friend wouldn't know the truth).

And for any company doing landscape work of ANY type in the Villages to not know that something this different would need ARC approval is beyond belief. I'm glad that they are trying to rectify but this must be a nightmare for the homeowner. I would doubt that any of the over 10 thousand viewers to TOTV would ever trust this company at this point. In today's connected world (Facebook, twitter, TOTV) you have to know that word gets around.

Pooter - If I were you I would go out of my way to not only remove the offending turf (at any cost to you) but also to hire (at your cost again) a zero use landscape specialist for the homeowner to get them to the lowest environmental cost of their yard as was their desire. Heck you have $8500 to use for this purpose.

[POOTERS]

While I admit that ignorarance is not an excuse. I will say that we had already seen other peoples yards with turf in them. Had spoken with homeowners and unfortunately was going off the assumption that Village owners had already had this done before and that the landscaper had it approved. We dont just work in the villages and every area is different. But please be sure that we are trying to help this homeowner out and not everyone who does work for people in the villages is out to take advantage of homeowners. Yes this is a learning experience but we don't like it when people aren't happy. As I said before. We don't just work in the villages and we are allowed to use this product else where apparently. But as a contractor we have to be able to trust that other people are doing what they say they will do and that the homeowners know there individual deeds. That being said. This homeowner was like us and was under the assumption that everything was ok and approved.

[Irishmen]

First my apologies to Regor since he/she must have been mislead by Pooters that it was their last name. (Although Regor says it was a friend so not so sure why a friend wouldn't know the truth).

And for any company doing landscape work of ANY type in the Villages to not know that something this different would need ARC approval is beyond belief. I'm glad that they are trying to rectify but this must be a nightmare for the homeowner. I would doubt that any of the over 10 thousand viewers to TOTV would ever trust this company at this point. In today's connected world (Facebook, twitter, TOTV) you have to know that word gets around.

Pooter - If I were you I would go out of my way to not only remove the offending turf (at any cost to you) but also to hire (at your cost again) a zero use landscape specialist for the homeowner to get them to the lowest environmental cost of their yard as was their desire. Heck you have $8500 to use for this purpose.
I would say since the homeowner had crummy grass in the first place and most likely would have had to replace it, the homeowner should pay to have new sod installed. Pooter should also deduct from any refund cost of removing original sod since the homeowner would have had to do that anyway.
On a side note, we know a CYV friend who wanted to extend his Lanai all the way to the fence not observing a setback. T&D Concrete would not honor homeowner wishes to ignore setback rules.

[Regor]

I called Pooter a friend because he is a friend. I know him, talk to him once or twice a week, know something about his family and what he does for fun. I assumed the name Pooter was his nickname or something. But the point is, the statement that graciegirl made about a name "Sounding nasty", was in my mind in bad taste.

Russ made the statement "Heck you have $8500 to use for this purpose", I would imagine that out of that $8500, that Pooter had expenses for stuff like the turf, wages, equipment, etc.

[POOTERS]

Ok. I am not going to and have no wish to argue with anyone. I only posted a response so that concerned friends and neighbors would know that we are not a fly by night company. We ate still here and doing what we can for the homeowner. We just wanted to let people know that as in any business we have had complaints and we do everything to rectify the problems. I love my job and going what I do for a living. The people experience alone has made me a better person. I have been here since 1999. And plan to continue being here. We are and will work with the homeowner. We haven't ignored this issue. But please respect that the only reason I said anything is that the Lynchmob and misinformation was more then I was going to ignore. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. And I understand that, would never disagree that youbhave a right to post your opinions on how you feel about things. Just please let us do what we can for the homeowner and not crucify us in the mean time. Thank you.

[Snowbirdtobe]

If the homeowner went to Home Depot and got a roadside crew to do the job then the homeowner would be entirely responsible.
The homeowner went to supposed experts to have the work done and was screwed by these experts.
Washing your hands and trying to shift the responsibility to others will only cause more negative comments to be posted on the internet.
Long rambling and disjointed justifications will increase the interest in the thread.
Get some marketing advice from an internet expert on how to address a marketing disaster on the internet.
A unique name will make the search easier to see the online reputation that you have acquired.
If Florida friendly landscaping allows turf than let the the process go forward with the deed compliance people and have the turf industry support both of you through the court process. There are 40,000 homes in TV that are potential customers.

[paulandjean]

Good luck Pooters, Seems you have explained to my satisfaction. Did not see that you did anything wrong.There are far to many people here who jump at first reaction.Sometimes act like first-graders,name calling and all.I have no problem.

[graciegirl]

Most contractors who get top commendations from posters here on TOTV repeatedly, are those landscapers and builders who know the deed restrictions and make the application to the Architectural Review Committee themselves.

I think that Pooters should refund the money, take up the turf and start over, thereby gaining a ton of good will on this very important forum.

And that is only my opinion...... Which because I am old and stubborn, I am entitled to and if someone gives me a better argument...which could happen, I will change my mind...because I am also a woman.

[EdV]

.....If Florida friendly landscaping allows turf than let the the process go forward with the deed compliance people and have the turf industry support both of you through the court process. There are 40,000 homes in TV that are potential customers....

According to this article (http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ep440) The Florida-Friendly Landscaping™ Program does not consider artificial turf to be a Florida-Friendly product.

[buggyone]

Couple of things here:

The folks who contracted with Pooters definitely should have read their deed and covenants to know they had to get ARC approval before starting the project. Before forking over $8500, get it in writing the project is approved!!

However, Pooters seems to be negligent, too, IF they said the ARC approval was not needed. I would take that with a grain of salt. It is not Pooters responsibility to obtain the approval. It is the responsibility of the homeowner.

If the Homeowner has proof Pooters said it was not necessary, take the case to Small Claims Court.

At least, the Homeowner should print off this long list of replies and take it to Pooters and explain how Pooters now has a big blemish because of this action. Some sort of refund could remedy that blemish to a degree?

[larbar]

I am the homeowner in question and I would like to clarify somethings. We are in talks with Pooters to resolve this issue. Pooters has been very cooperative with us and we thank you for your concern for us, but feel that we will be able to resolve this situation with Pooters to the satisfaction of both parties. Please do not bad mouth Pooters. This is their livelihood and we don't want them to be hurt. Again we will hopefully rectify this matter on Sunday when we meet with Clint & Kelly. I will post the results of our meeting.

[StarbuckSammy]

Pooters is a reputable company. Both parties were wrong in this instance. I think they will both resolve it. To say that since Pooters has a tent a the square and thus is The Villages fault is just plain stupid. If I buy a purse at Town SQ and it tears...is that Morse's problem...or The Villages? How about a bad pizza....the real estate is owned by the developer...should it be their problem? Of course not.
And some of these amateur legal opinions on this thread are a joke....
Pooters has been in The Villages for over ten succesful years....and yes the company was named after his son's nickname. Some of the commentators on this thread should be ashamed of themselves....rude, ignorant comments.

[iaudit]

I am the homeowner in question and I would like to clarify somethings. We are in talks with Pooters to resolve this issue. Pooters has been very cooperative with us and we thank you for your concern for us, but feel that we will be able to resolve this situation with Pooters to the satisfaction of both parties. Please do not bad mouth Pooters. This is their livelihood and we don't want them to be hurt. Again we will hopefully rectify this matter on Sunday when we meet with Clint & Kelly. I will post the results of our meeting.

Maybe we could get these two to run for Congress and represent this area. Amazing what cooperation can do from both sides.

[Larry Wilson]

Pooters has been in The Villages for over ten succesful years....and yes the company was named after his son's nickname. Some of the commentators on this thread should be ashamed of themselves....rude, ignorant comments.

Thanks for saying it.

[Snowbirdtobe]

When you engage a business to do some work you don't expect issues.
We had a citrus tree installed and the nursery called dig safe to have our lawn marked before they dug the hole. I would have just started digging.
I would expect a builder or landscaper to ensure they had all the permits before starting a job. Seniors tend to be victimized and we all should watch out for each other.

As far as rude remarks made about the name pooter do a google search and see that they were PG compared to the urban dictionary returns.

[Pturner]

I am the homeowner in question and I would like to clarify somethings. We are in talks with Pooters to resolve this issue. Pooters has been very cooperative with us and we thank you for your concern for us, but feel that we will be able to resolve this situation with Pooters to the satisfaction of both parties. Please do not bad mouth Pooters. This is their livelihood and we don't want them to be hurt. Again we will hopefully rectify this matter on Sunday when we meet with Clint & Kelly. I will post the results of our meeting.

Thanks for the update. Best of luck on Sunday and please let us know how it goes.

[Irishmen]

Yes glad this is coming to a end for you larbar. Let us know How things work out.

[mgm4444]

I'm in the minority here, as well. (don't bother me none) - I believe Pooters made an honest mistake and lesson learned. And I really believe the customer will come back on here and report their satisfaction.

What did I learn about this entire thread? That I probably will never possess the character Pooters has. I would have lambasted every last one of you talking about me that way, if I thought I was innocent, but made a mistake; but Pooters came on here, explained his company name very nicely, asked to please not be rude, apologized upfront for possibly offending someone and offered his story. Then, to top everything off, the customer comes on and has only nice things to say about him, has been working with them since this whole thing happened and please don't ruin his reputation. That, to me, says a great deal about the man. He didn't run away. He didn't shrug his shoulders. He didn't tell anyone to take a hike. Those are the kinds of people that don't care about other people. He made it his business to get online and explain. Before anyone told him "to do the right thing" he was taking care of business behind the scenes to make that happen. What's going to matter in the end? What's going to matter at those pearly gates is how you treated people when they were mean to you (YES, you were mean); staying calm when a gang of people are against you; eloquently explaining the circumstances.

Naive? Maybe. But, I'd rather give someone like Pooters another chance, especially the way he has conducted himself on this forum.

You, sir - are a gentleman in my eyes.

God Bless.




Pooters is a reputable company. Both parties were wrong in this instance. I think they will both resolve it. To say that since Pooters has a tent a the square and thus is The Villages fault is just plain stupid. If I buy a purse at Town SQ and it tears...is that Morse's problem...or The Villages? How about a bad pizza....the real estate is owned by the developer...should it be their problem? Of course not.
And some of these amateur legal opinions on this thread are a joke....
Pooters has been in The Villages for over ten succesful years....and yes the company was named after his son's nickname. Some of the commentators on this thread should be ashamed of themselves....rude, ignorant comments.

[nitehawk]

I for one would never do business with Pooters - that be said - good luck for those of you who feel Pooters made a mistake. --- More kool-aide mom
If this had happened to me, i would be at the square every night Pooters were there, with a sign stating my feeling

[Russ_Boston]

For what it's worth both pool companies that I'm working with thus far on my project have said that they will take care of the ARC approval. this is also true of the one landscaper to finish the project. So from my only knowledge of this type of project thus far the contractor can (I assume since they said so) take care of the ARC paperwork etc. Is this the norm? And if so then why wouldn't Pooters have done that?

[larbar]

Again, I am the homeowner in question and told everyone that I would report back today after our meeting with Pooters. I am glad to report that we have come to an agreement with them. They are going to resod, at their expense, so that everyone will be happy and The Villages will no longer be unhappy with my yard. I know that everyone is going to ask, but the other details of this meeting, as to refunds or reimbursement, etc., we are not going to broadcast. Just please let it be known that we are happy and satisfied with the outcome. Thank you all for your concern, and again, please dont be mean to Pooters, this was a learning experience for us all. I am glad that they were willing to stand by there services and not turn their backs. I would highly receommend Pooters, they are a company with integrity.

[herbaru]

Again, I am the homeowner in question and told everyone that I would report back today after our meeting with Pooters. I am glad to report that we have come to an agreement with them. They are going to resod, at their expense, so that everyone will be happy and The Villages will no longer be unhappy with my yard. I know that everyone is going to ask, but the other details of this meeting, as to refunds or reimbursement, etc., we are not going to broadcast. Just please let it be known that we are happy and satisfied with the outcome. Thank you all for your concern, and again, please dont be mean to Pooters, this was a learning experience for us all. I am glad that they were willing to stand by there services and not turn their backs. I would highly receommend Pooters, they are a company with integrity.

Good news, thanks for sharing.

[CaptJohn]

For what it's worth both pool companies that I'm working with thus far on my project have said that they will take care of the ARC approval. this is also true of the one landscaper to finish the project. So from my only knowledge of this type of project thus far the contractor can (I assume since they said so) take care of the ARC paperwork etc. Is this the norm? And if so then why wouldn't Pooters have done that?

I thought I would share some thoughts from my experience that might help someone in the future. This will apply to newbies and oldies alike! Save some money, do it right.
======
As a former Chairman for several years of an Architectural Review Committee of an island community, I can tell you the most important thing to remember is that the homeowner is always responsible for the actions on the property. I would suggest that if you're a new owner to be sure and obtain your subdivision restrictions at the closing and then BE SURE TO READ THEM. If you're a long time owner, read them!

In most cases, they will list things you can and cannot do but the part many miss is that just because something specific is not named does not mean you can avoid the permitting process. People often try to skirt the process but it always catches up in the end. If you have any questions, call the ARC for clarification. They will usually try to help if you approach them before a project rather than trying to fix a problem after. When in doubt, ask!

Another thing is to NOT trust your contractor if he says he's obtained a permit as part of the particular project you've hired him to do or if he says a permit is not needed. If he says it's included and he will obtain the permit, insist you see the APPROVED permit BEFORE you let him start work. They (the bad ones) are usually in a hurry to finish a job and get paid and don't want to wait for the permitting process. Yes, I know there are good ones who do it right and they're much appreciated. Better yet, get the permit yourself and you'll know it's OK.
ARC are usually hard working and under appreciated and catch a lot of flack from novices who are not familiar with the process. Just do your due diligence. When in doubt, ask the ARC.

That committee is the reason TV remains such a nice place that is so desirable.
======
Found this since posting: https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/...ad.php?t=44389

[angiefox10]

I have since contacted Pooters to do some work for me. He tried to explain the mix up to me but to be honest I didn't care as he and the owner had worked it out. As with most of you we have been in business for years and know that sometimes things do happen. You do what you can to make it right and make the customer happy. It seems by the posting here that Pooters has done that!

Now.... Back to my story. While I was talking to the owner of Pooters about my work, he showed me pictures of the property he did for the people this thread is about. WOW!!!! Honestly, it was beautiful! I could see the seam that was being discussed and was already aware the grass will do that until all the "grass" comes up and blends in!

I can see why The Villages wouldn't want it on someone's property. It makes all the other lawns look like crap!

[Irishmen]

Angie Fox Will you enlighten us How you knew the grass would come up already? Is that a line Pooter ran by you as welll? I mean How can 2 pieces of carpet be overlapped on top of each other and "the grass will come up" through that. Seems like Pooter would have posted pictures himself or the Homeowner of that lawn if there was as beautiful as you say. It must have been another job somewhere else somebody else did he was showing you. We went to the Fall Home and Garden Show in Orlando and there were Fake grass vendors and not one said you should see where the 2 pieces join. Pooter is slick as they come.

PS looks the BBB now has complaint against Pooters this year before this incident. Also read someone else on here had some issues.

[angiefox10]

Angie Fox Will you enlighten us How you knew the grass would come up already? Is that a line Pooter ran by you as welll? I mean How can 2 pieces of carpet be overlapped on top of each other and "the grass will come up" through that. Seems like Pooter would have posted pictures himself or the Homeowner of that lawn if there was as beautiful as you say. It must have been another job somewhere else somebody else did he was showing you. We went to the Fall Home and Garden Show in Orlando and there were Fake grass vendors and not one said you should see where the 2 pieces join. Pooter is slick as they come.

PS looks the BBB now has complaint against Pooters this year before this incident. Also read someone else on here had some issues.

No.... actually, when the post about Pooters came out it gave me the idea of putting a patch in my birdcage. So, I went out and researched it. That's where I found that in large amounts it may be mashed down in different ways and need to come up over time.

Honestly, I didn't see it in the pictures. I don't know that it was the same yard. I couldn't see in the picture what was described in TOTV and I told him that. He kept trying to show it to me. I still didn't see it.

I am going to hire him. I will take pictures and let you know how I like him. I don't know him and since the was trying to hard to tell me what the poster was refering to even thought I couldn't see it.... It doesn't seem too "slick" to me. *shrug*

I would also add that the person who had the work done was happy with Pooters. I can't get excited about what a third party thinks! As I remember Pooters was working with his customer to make it right before this post even came up.

I've heard he's been around for a long time and I think if he had one complaint that's pretty good. I know of many good companies that have many more complaints. You just can't please everyone. I mean.... even in this forum people come out with a complaint when just about everyone else will come on and argue that it's the BEST place in town.

All of this being said... Has he done work for you?

[Russ_Boston]

Another thing is to NOT trust your contractor if he says he's obtained a permit as part of the particular project you've hired him to do or if he says a permit is not needed. If he says it's included and he will obtain the permit, insist you see the APPROVED permit BEFORE you let him start work.

Agree completely. My point was that the contractor can file the paperwork and do the legwork. Then you can verify the results. I was just wondering why the vendor didn't start the process with the ARC. My pool vendor (All seasons) made sure that it was the very first thing done before they went ahead with any other permits etc. In his words "You don't want to commit any cash before we have approval".

[Irishmen]

Great point Russ. It just doesn't add up does it.? Even the vendors from Orlanado know about the deed restriction.

Angiefox, Not to beat a dead horse but what about happened to us can be found in this thread. He counted on us not to verify.

Along with no money up front, Always get quotes from others. He counts on you not to know better. There is a company under landscaping in The Daily Sun who does fake grass. I heard that company is very reasonable in their pricing.

There are a lot of great tips on this site. Power of TOTV.

[angiefox10]

First the person who hired Pooters doesn't appear to have a problem with them. It was a third party who started this thread and even then, the person who hired Pooters has come on a few times to say they are happy with Pooters.

Pooters explains the mix up and takes responsibility for not checking on the permits before he started work.

Pooters has been in business for many years and been in BBB since 2004 with one complaint. That being said, according to BBB "BBB found business made good faith effort to resolve complaint but customer not satisfied with business response (1)" (http://www.bbb.org/central-florida/business-reviews/pavers-interlocking/pooters-ponds-and-pressure-krete-in-leesburg-fl-13006983/complaints#)

BBB gives Pooters an A+ rating.

I haven't heard from anyone who has had work done by Pooters who is unhappy with the work and the people on this page who appear to want to destroy his business have never used them and some have never heard of them.

What I have learned about artificial turf by going online is that it comes in rolls, has to be raked to try to get it up and sometimes will show a difference where the seam is until the turf comes up. Pooters tried to show me the seam. To him it was obvious. Honestly, I couldn't see it! I'm not kidding... This "slick" salesman kept pointing to the picture trying to show me where the problem was. When I said I couldn't see it, he brought out another picture. REALLY???? Shady? *shakes head*

I am going to hire him. I will let you know if I am unhappy with his work. So far, I'm very happy with how he handles problems after they happen. I know that not everything goes right all the time. What I want to know is how a company handles it after the fact. So far as I can see.... A+

[angiefox10]

Angiefox, Not to beat a dead horse but what about happened to us can be found in this thread. He counted on us not to verify.



OK... Now you are hitting on something. What happened to you? From my understanding, this was a neighbor.

[angiefox10]

And... who is the other company for which you speak?

[Irishmen]

Mrs. Pooter? Just kidding. Im away from the paper. It was under landscaping.

[angiefox10]

Mrs. Pooter? Just kidding. Im away from the paper. It was under landscaping.


Mrs. Pooter??? :a20:

[Irishmen]

AngieFox Good to see you laughing. Best wishes for a Happy Thanksgiving!

[angiefox10]

AngieFox Good to see you laughing. Best wishes for a Happy Thanksgiving!


You as well!:wave:

[trichard]

Who in their right mind would ever think about making such a drastic change to their yard without getting approval from the Arc. Board? Take responsibility for your actions. It seems that everyone wants to blame someone else.

[faithfull]

I'd join your posse on that visit to Pooters.

I hold The Villages somewhat responsible because they are leasing the space to Pooters which, in my opinion, would condone what Pooters markets...Architectural Review Board or not. IMHO, if The Villages okays Pooters to sell their goods on The Square then that would be an endorsement of approval. At least that is what I'd think.

so true, good point hopefully some relief in loss.

[tommy steam]

Contractors, Before you do any work inTV for anyone, make sure all your information is up to date and you know about the Villages zoneing codes. If you are not knowledgeable about whats going on inTV and its creates a problem for the homeowner,you wil be ROASTED on this site, and your bussiness will suffer, and maby never really come back. Just saying....:popcorn:

[PennBF]

We almost had a problem. We contracted for about $9,000 in Landscaping and the day before they were to start someone mentioned the "Architectural Board" and the need for approval. I mentioned it to the Landscaper and they said don't worry about it..we will get it after were done. I told them no way
I wanted to be sure it would be approved BEFORE they started and told them to forget the next day until I received approval. I pulled the layout of our property, went to the Board with the landscapers layout plans and they approved and we said OK go ahead. It would have been easy to say OK I trust the landscaper and then have to change or remove. I like what Pres. Regan use to say "verify"!!:popcorn:

[Happinow]

Something you all didn't know. You pay to get an AAA rating from the BBB. I think it's like 400.00. We know business people in our area who have done it. It means NOTHING! It's just another way for the government to make money. Be ware.....

[villager]

Any reputable company that does work in The Villages that changes the look of the outside of the house knows architectural approval is required. In fact, many of them will submit the paperwork to the architectural review board on behalf of the homeowner. However, ultimately, it is the homeowner's responsibility to get the approval.

[nitehawk]

Something you all didn't know. You pay to get an AAA rating from the BBB. I think it's like 400.00. We know business people in our area who have done it. It means NOTHING! It's just another way for the government to make money. Be ware.....

Something you all didn't know. Quote from Wikipedia- "Although it has "Bureau" in its title, the Better Business Bureau is not affiliated with federal, state, or local government, and has no direct affiliation with any consumer protection government authority. The BBB, as a privately held corporation, has no governmental authority over businesses."

[lovsthosebigdogs]

what kinda name is pooters anyway? Sounds nasty to me. I think we should round up the girls and make a little visit.

lol!!

[angiefox10]

Again, I am the homeowner in question and told everyone that I would report back today after our meeting with Pooters. I am glad to report that we have come to an agreement with them. They are going to resod, at their expense, so that everyone will be happy and The Villages will no longer be unhappy with my yard. I know that everyone is going to ask, but the other details of this meeting, as to refunds or reimbursement, etc., we are not going to broadcast. Just please let it be known that we are happy and satisfied with the outcome. Thank you all for your concern, and again, please dont be mean to Pooters, this was a learning experience for us all. I am glad that they were willing to stand by there services and not turn their backs. I would highly receommend Pooters, they are a company with integrity.

While you are hating on a company that you have not done business with.... you might want to read the comment made by the homeowner this thread is about.

Understand this was started by a neighbor who appears to have a problem with Pooters.

Because of the way Pooters handled this situation, I am doing business with Pooters, and so far I couldn't be happier! I will give you all a full report when we have completed the contract, but to date..... This company has already gone above and beyond what any other company would do.

Now I understand why larbar was so defensive of Pooters!

I would be more concerned about the companies who did a job wrong and didn't finish it. I think you may want to go back to those threads. Because as far as I can see.... Pooters made this one right.

Oh well.... carry on............. :popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[Russ_Boston]

Something you all didn't know. You pay to get an AAA rating from the BBB. I think it's like 400.00. We know business people in our area who have done it. It means NOTHING! It's just another way for the government to make money. Be ware.....

The BBB is not a government agency.

(From their site:

Where does the BBB get its operating funds?
BBBs are organized as nonprofit corporations and financed by membership dues or subscriptions paid by responsible business and professional firms in the community. Reputable firms are solicited for membership to maintain and expand services provided by the BBB. )



I'm not saying that people can't be 'bought' but I wouldn't think it was widespread.

[BOMBERO]

While you are hating on a company that you have not done business with.... you might want to read the comment made by the homeowner this thread is about.

Understand this was started by a neighbor who appears to have a problem with Pooters.

Because of the way Pooters handled this situation, I am doing business with Pooters, and so far I couldn't be happier! I will give you all a full report when we have completed the contract, but to date..... This company has already gone above and beyond what any other company would do.

Now I understand why larbar was so defensive of Pooters!

I would be more concerned about the companies who did a job wrong and didn't finish it. I think you may want to go back to those threads. Because as far as I can see.... Pooters made this one right.

Oh well.... carry on............. :popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

Good post... no I take that back - GREAT POST!:coolsmiley:

I would also like to ask "Faithfull" - What was the purpose of picking this scab?:ohdear:

[faithfull]

How and why are they allowed to be on square? I thought contractors where not invited. Only crafts and handmade. Maybe they are part of the Villages??? I have heard many complaints with this company why are they still having this stage.??? If they have nothing to do with Village.

[Russ_Boston]

How and why are they allowed to be on square? I thought contractors where not invited. Only crafts and handmade. Maybe they are part of the Villages??? I have heard many complaints with this company why are they still having this stage.??? If they have nothing to do with Village.

To my knowledge all the vendors at the squares on M-Th are independent vendors who pay for their space on the square. My neighbor used Pooters for his pavers and was very happy.

[Bogie Shooter]

How and why are they allowed to be on square? I thought contractors where not invited. Only crafts and handmade. Maybe they are part of the Villages??? I have heard many complaints with this company why are they still having this stage.??? If they have nothing to do with Village.

There are 97 posts before yours...............surely your answers lie in there somewhere.

[graciegirl]

Something you all didn't know. You pay to get an AAA rating from the BBB. I think it's like 400.00. We know business people in our area who have done it. It means NOTHING! It's just another way for the government to make money. Be ware.....

The BBB isn't a government agency.

[bluedog103]

How and why are they allowed to be on square? I thought contractors where not invited. Only crafts and handmade.
Why in the world would you think that?

[Mallory]

Why was this thread brought back to life?

[CarGuys]

It was all taken care of by Pooters? Ask before you build or remodel or landscape.

:read:

[Moderator]

Why was this thread brought back to life?


Good question... This particular issue seems to have been resolved. Any new issues can be addressed by starting a new thread.

This thread will be closed.


Moderator