Mail Order Gun Permits

[Guest]

An article in today's Daily Sun stated that the mail order concealed weapon permit industry has flourished in Philadelphia. It seems that even though Philadelphia applicants are rejected for concealed weapon permits in Philly, they can apply in Florida and get the permit by mail order. Pennsylavania and Florida have a reciprocal agreement to respect each other's gun licenses.

Increasingly, Philadelphia police are discovering suspects arrested have Florida concealed weapon permits.

Minor brushes with the law or chracter issues are not considerations for rejecting a permit in Florida. The key is that the applicant has not been convicted of a felony. A cottage industry has sprung up in Philadelphia to ease the application and approval process for obtaining a Florida gun permit.

Kind of gives you that warm and fuzzy feeling that Florida is arming criminals in 31 other states with their lax requirements for concealed gun permits, doesn't it? Basically, you could liken this to "doctor shopping" when addicts go from doctor to doctor to see which Pill Mill will give them their prescription for drugs. Well, the "gun license shopping" ends up in the Gun License Mill - FLORIDA!

[Guest]

I say we mandate that every citizen must own a hand gun. If they cannot afford it we will give them a loan for one. That way we would all be equal and more polite to each other. Yes, a chicken in every pot and a gun in every hand.:clap2:

[Guest]

isn't the criminal element creative or is it smarter. This event goes in the same book of records a prison inmates with no income what soever placing phony IRS returns and getting on the average $5000 per return.

Reflects the caliber (pun intended) of "law"makers.

btk

[Guest]

I have long felt that only residents of the state should be granted a CCW by their home state and then recognized by other states. Only two states allow out of state residents licenses, Flordia and Nevada.

I also believe that the training necessary to get a concealed carry is way to easy in most states. The average citizen needs more than a couple hours of gun safety training and then to fire a couple shots on the range and call that training enough to be granted a license to carry. Then the vast majority never do any other shooting or if they do they go to the range, set targets up at 25 yards and take their time aiming and are proud of the groups they shoot. We in the training industry call those folks targets. :MOJE_whot: When you teach yourself to shoot like that, by the time you draw, aim and get ready to shot, you are shot and the bad guy is gone.:spoken:

[Guest]

Figmo is right "on target" with his post.

I believe I will write a letter to Ricky Scott and ask him why Florida allows non-residents of Florida to receive a Florida concealed weapon permit. I have no problem with legal residents that check out with the requirements of ccw permits having one. I think it is ridiculous to carry while in The Villages, but that is my opinion.

[Guest]

buggyone, any place that you go that has this sign, "FIREARMS NOT PERMITED", stay away from.

Those places are know as "target rich enviroments." Crazies and those that just want to hurt people know that all the "law abiding" citizens will be unarmed and only they, the criminal and crazy, will have a weapon.

If you where a store own would you want:

1. 12 people you know nothing about coming into your store maybe maybe not carrying firearms;

or

2. 12 people who have had a background check, training and licensed to carry come into your store.

Just wondering.

[Guest]

Well, Figmo, some of those places include schools, churches, police stations, and bars.

I like to go to church, I do volunteer work at the Sheriff's office, and I have been known to go to a bar. My wife does volunteer work at a school.

Should I stay away from those places?

I see no reason for Florida to allow out-of-state residents to get a Florida CCW permit - and I see you agree.

If I were a Philadelphia store owner and 12 people carrying a concealed weapon with a Florida permit came into my store - I would be very worried.

We have no arguement.

[Guest]

I say we mandate that every citizen must own a hand gun. If they cannot afford it we will give them a loan for one. That way we would all be equal and more polite to each other. Yes, a chicken in every pot and a gun in every hand.:clap2:

How about a gun in the hand of every chicken.

[Guest]

Villager II, now you know that chicken's don't have fingers. LOL

Buggie, yes you are right. If I lived in PA and 12 PA'ans came in with FL permits, I would be concerned. Would I be concerned in 12 PA'ans came in with PA permits? Nope.

An example of a good training program is New Mexico, where, Oh, My Goodness, open carry is allowed, and it is not unusual to see folks shopping wearing iron. Seems that no one really cares. The training program in NM is 15 hours, 12 class room with 2 hours on nothing but the law concerning concealed carry, and 3 hours on the range. But still we could not get concealed carriers to come shoot with us to get some idea of what it is like shooitng under stress. Whole different ball game when I put you under stress and make you shoot.

Do they need to change the rules here, maybe, but then again its all about the money that the state gets from issuing licenses. So until the state gets well, money wise, nothing will change.

[Guest]

What's needed is a National Permit. Then you only get one and only if you meet all requirements.

[Guest]

I listened to VP Biden tell us what will happen if they don't pass the President's Bill. If they don't pass it, I think the VP makes a VERY good case for a National Concealed Weapons Carry Permit. Anytime, any state, anywhere. (If of course you have the training and background check). I think I have the right to protect myself and my family from the rapes and murders the VP is warning us about.

Remember, when seconds count, the police are just minutes away

[Guest]

Yeah Jim, there are rapes and murders going on in Hadley. One murder in The Villages in 5 years. That was due to a live-in daughter who was mixed up with drug dealers and she told them there were drugs in the family house.

No need to carry a weapon in The Villages. Just more of a possibility for something to go wrong.

[Guest]

What's needed is a National Permit. Then you only get one and only if you meet all requirements.

Agreed but the states are probably make good money off of the issuing of permits.

[Guest]

using the arguments or positions taken regarding why a concealed weapons permit is not needed in TV....then why do you have home owners insurance? Health care insurance? Any insurance of any kind?

Just in case right? Something you gladly pay for and provide at considerable cost year after year HOPING it will never be needed. Personal protection...eh?

Those of us permitted and trained to carry and use a concealed weapon do so with the same intents as ANY other insurance. And like all the other insurances, it does not matter where one lives...TV or any where else. Same logic. Same principal. Same intents!!!

btk

[Guest]

using the arguments or positions taken regarding why a concealed weapons permit is not needed in TV....then why do you have home owners insurance? Health care insurance? Any insurance of any kind?

Just in case right? Something you gladly pay for and provide at considerable cost year after year HOPING it will never be needed. Personal protection...eh?

Those of us permitted and trained to carry and use a concealed weapon do so with the same intents as ANY other insurance. And like all the other insurances, it does not matter where one lives...TV or any where else. Same logic. Same principal. Same intents!!!

btk

Logic? principal? When talking to a liberal, you will have to do better then that.

[Guest]

Are you actually saying you are in fear for your life when walking in The Villages that you are going to need a pistol? I walk my dog on the streets after midnight and feel 100% safe. I feel 100% safe at the town squares. I honestly have never felt the need to carry a pistol in The Villages. It is your right to do so - if you have a permit and do not go into a bar - so go right ahead and do so. Personally, I think it is ridiculous, but that is your right to do so.

[Guest]

What's needed is a National Permit. Then you only get one and only if you meet all requirements.

What would be the requirements? What kind of training would be needed? Just wondering how you would work this program. The vast majority of armed police officers can not shoot and you would expect something different from the average civilian. Those of us that are trainers and train and shoot competitively are in the minority of shooters.

The CCW permit from your home state should be treated the same way your driver's license is, recognized and honored by every state.

I still think that it is best left up to the states on what kind of training each State decides will be needed for issuance of a CCW for that's States citizens. Either good or indifferent training, it is not for the Federal Government to decide. Could even be a violation of State's Rights and no matter how I personally feel, the Fed's need to stay out of State's business.

Personally I feel that if you are going to carry you need to, at a minimum shoot at least quarterly under stress, so you will have some idea of how to react under a stressful situation. Otherwise you will make a really good target.

[Guest]

Well, Figmo, you make about the most sense of the folks who carry weapons and post here.

The CCW permit could be honored like a driver's license but don't forget that you have to apply for a state driver's license after becoming a resident of that state within a short period of time. I think Florida has a 30 day time period for obtaining a Florida driver's license - it might be somewhat more but no more than 90 days.

I believe requalification with shooting skills should be mandated for the CCW permits on a regular basis - and under stressful situations like you said.

[Guest]

"Are you actually saying you are in fear for your life when walking in The Villages that you are going to need a pistol?"

Of course not and you know it. Seems there is a consistency of thought when what ever is the subject to some folks position. If not for it, then chastise in any manner possible. Very consistent!!

btk

[Guest]

buggyone, I believe that it was my statement that you should have to be a resident of the state to get that state's CCW.

Why did you say, "about the most sense" instead of "the most sense?" I know several TVers who carry and do the same training that I do, thru competitive shooting. Besides you can sit beside me, talk to me and never realize that I am carrying, that is why it is called a concealed weapon. Since I very seldom drink alcohol you will never know if I am armed or not since my drinks of choice are Ice Tea and soda.

I have carried a firearm in an official capacity most of my adult life, starting at the age of 18, when I joined the Military. Other then my vacation time in RVN I have only had to draw my firearm once as a civilian law enforcement officer, did not have to use it, and never as a CCW holder. I hope that I never do. I still train, keep up my practice with my carry firearm, just like I keep auto, home, and life insurance up todate. Never know when I will need it, and hope everyday that I never need any of them.

[Guest]

Everyone that has a driver's liscense didn't take the same test or was required to meet the same requirements, yet they can drive in all 50 states and most everyother country.

Why not have a National Carry Permit?

Just because they have a liscense doesn't mean they can drive or should be driving. But they do. Driver's are not tested every four/six years because it would melt down the system trying to complete all the tests.

What does it take to transfer a DL from one state to another? An eye test? It's been while for me so I'm not too sure. But it isn't much.

If you have accidents, do they stop you from driving? Yes, but not after the first 1XXX accidents.

As for safety, yes TV is safe and we feel safe. So did those 8 people sitting in a beauty salon in Calf. What about the people killed sitting in a McDonalds? Did they think it could happen to them? Bottom line is, it can happen anywhere. My two cents.

[Guest]

Everyone that has a driver's liscense didn't take the same test or was required to meet the same requirements, yet they can drive in all 50 states and most everyother country.

Why not have a National Carry Permit?

Just because they have a liscense doesn't mean they can drive or should be driving. But they do. Driver's are not tested every four/six years because it would melt down the system trying to complete all the tests.

What does it take to transfer a DL from one state to another? An eye test? It's been while for me so I'm not too sure. But it isn't much.

If you have accidents, do they stop you from driving? Yes, but not after the first 1XXX accidents.

As for safety, yes TV is safe and we feel safe. So did those 8 people sitting in a beauty salon in Calf. What about the people killed sitting in a McDonalds? Did they think it could happen to them? Bottom line is, it can happen anywhere. My two cents.

Well, Jim - you have kind of answered a few of your own questions regarding a National Carry Permit.

1. If you have accidents, do they stop you from driving? Jim, do you think that accidents with firearms should be treated the same way as car accidents? Wow, I hope not - and I am sure you do not feel that way.

2. Just because someone has a driver's license doesn't mean they can drive or should drive. Do you feel that way about a permit to carry pistols? I am sure you do not feel that way, either.

3. The Villages is safe but let's not forget a shooting in a McDonald's or a beauty parlor. Jim, do you honestly feel that is a possibility here? Another poster was telling the forum he believes home invasion is a good possibility here in The Villages and he answers the door with a drawn pistol every time. Personally, I feel that is ridiculous - but each to their own, I guess.

I was at Lake Sumter Landing this evening enjoying the crowds of people, the golf carts, the cars, Rocky and the Rollers, and there was not a speck of trouble anywhere I could see. No reason to be scared, Jim, no one is out to hurt you. Come out and enjoy life in The Villages.

[Guest]

don't forget to leave room for the "war" story aspect to what some would have us believe....answering the door with gun drawn....now that is impressive either way i.e. true or false...but hardly believable...but then again......

btk

[Guest]

buggyone, cars kill way more people than guns do.

Food for thought:

Myth: Guns are not a good deterrent to crime

Fact: Guns prevent an estimated 2.5 million crimes a year, or 6,849 every day. Often the gun is never fired and no blood (including the criminal’s) is shed.

Fact: It seems to be slowing down property crime (especially burglaries).

Fact: Every day, 550 rapes, 1,100 murders, and 5,200 other violent crimes are prevented just by showing a gun. In less than 0.9% of these instances is the gun ever actually fired.

http://www.GunFacts.info will give you lots of information on media myths of firearm ownership.

[Guest]

WOW Figmo Bohica! Those are impressive statistics. While I support the right to bears arms, I have never really looked into this kind of information. Thanks for your post. :coolsmiley:

[Guest]

the statement that guns kill people is as credible as saying the eraser on a pencil is responsible for misspelled words!

btk

[Guest]

billethkid, right you are. People kill people no matter what means they use, but guns seem to have become an object that most are concerned about.

If you really want to see what gun control (people control) does check the crime levels in Austrailia and the UK. Up, Up and Away they go.

[Guest]

This posting was not about gun control. It was asking why a non-resident of Florida should be able to receive a Florida concealed carry permit - and by mail order, too.

My point was only to say that a CCW permit from Florida should only be for Florida residents.

Requalification firing and stressful situation firing should be included as well for obtaining and renewing the CCW permit.