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View Full Version : The Deficit Reduction Logjam


Guest
10-22-2011, 02:35 PM
As the Supercommittee meets, the line is already in the sand.

As he continues to push for any parts of the Jobs Bill he can get, the President has publicly pledged he will veto any plan which does not raise some new tax revenue from "those who can most afford it".

The Republicans continue to insist they will solidly oppose any deficit reduction legislation which includes any additional tax revenue.

I can understand why the President has taken his stand. It has to do with the facts stated below, as well as the severe criticism from his own supporters that he has been too compromising in the unsuccessful effort to get support for legislative efforts from moderates of both parties.

What I can't understand is why the Republicans still steadfastly hold their position. About 70% of Americans support some form of tax increase on "those who can most afford it" as a necessary ingredient of deficit reduction.
According to the Social Security Administration, in just two years there has been an 18% increase in the number of people making more than $1 million, while 50% of all Americans earned less than $26,364 last year.
Back in 1986, one of the great Republican heroes, Ronald Reagan, strongly supported raising the capital gains tax to 29%, to align it more closely to tax rates on ordinary income. "A bus driver shouldn't be paying at a higher rate than a wealthy investor", was his reasoning. But as we all know, the capital gains rate has been whittled down to 15% since those days. More and more concerned, responsible people, (not just communists, nazis, nut-jobs and ne'r do wells, as a few people here would characterize them), have either joined "Occupy Wall Street" or are financially sustaining those demonstrations. Every one of these people and silent millions more have a single concern in mind; the alarming NEW imbalance in the country's wealth and it's implication on the future of America.

I have asked this before and not yet heard a single reason why the Republicans should continue to take their inflexible position. Even Romney, the most moderate Republican presidential candidate, has not yet articulated a rationale for the Republican position. Only Cain, oddly the most conservative, supports new taxes, but that isn't really true for one huge reason - because he says it isn't. Because they have not been able to produce any factual evidence to support it, the Republicans are finally soft-pedaling or ignoring their old mantra that any additional tax on the wealthy would immediately translate into a reduction of their job creating abilities or inclinations.

So I invite any of you, who are convinced there should be no tax revenue producing elements in any deficit reduction legislation, to share your facts and reasons

Guest
10-22-2011, 02:44 PM
We are still working, not retired, and we are

T.E.A.

Taxed Enough Already.

Guest
10-22-2011, 03:08 PM
Income redistribution is still income redistribution. Powerful people are not investing their money now because of Obama and his policies that scare the heck out of businesses. Raise their taxes more will not give us more jobs, on the contrary, jobs will become more scarce.
Haven't you seen the jobs status lately? Playing the tired old class envy baloney is not going to get us out of this mess.

Guest
10-22-2011, 03:48 PM
Do you need a symbolic tax increase? Everyone knows that a tax increase is not going to solve the problem to any degree, so is it just to make you feel better?

Taxes and regulations need to be scaled back. Anything else is counter productive.

Guest
10-22-2011, 03:49 PM
I am curious to know exactly how much money could be saved if the guy in the White House, and his family, were to remain there until the end of his term? Why is is OK for the Obama family to jet around the world constantly, along with their large support staff, while the average American is expected to "tighten their belts" and "eat their peas"...?????????? When the likes of O, Pelo(gna)si, and the rest of those elitists in DC (on both sides of the aisle) start to lead by example, then I will reconsider supporting a tax increase. :popcorn:

Guest
10-22-2011, 03:52 PM
I earned it, I get to spent it. Why should I have to give it to some dead beat who is to lazy to work or some gal who has popped several kids for more welfare. If you feel you need to give the government more of your money, write them a check.

Guest
10-22-2011, 03:57 PM
I earned it, I get to spent it. Why should I have to give it to some dead beat who is to lazy to work or some gal who has popped several kids for more welfare. If you feel you need to give the government more of your money, write them a check.

Good point. It has been made on numerous other threads also. No one is stopping anyone who wants to pay more taxes from actually doing it. The sooner the better.

Guest
10-22-2011, 04:11 PM
The original poster continues to make that same tired and counter productive philosophy that got these Occupy Wall Street kids into the mess there in now. Andy Kessler, author refers to them as the Trophy Generation. Because win or lose everyone gets a trophy. It created mediocrity in education wherein kids spent more time learning how to develop an environmental friendly waste plant, or the need for cultural and sexual diversity rather than math and science. Instead these folks earned degrees in arts humanities or gender studies. Because our public schools failed to produce students with advanced degrees in sciene, math engineering, etc Obama is now fast tracking green visa's for immgrantsfor hundresd of jobs that go unfilled.

subsequently this Trophy Generation that learned win or lose I get rewarded now occupies Wall Street with signs which read "delete the elite" "the 99% vis a vis the 1%. In otherwords wealth redistribution is an extension of the trophy philosophy which was learned in the third grade and not adhering to this redistribution model is foreign or beter yet alien to the trophy generation. The housing market is a direct consequence of this Trophy mentaility....By the way I had always disagreed with the government bailouts that came from both the Bush and Obama's Administration

So if there are any posters here whom agree with Obama and his Dems concerning tax increases...be my guest volunteer your income.

For me billionaire, or not I am sick and tired of these idiots picking my pockets for projects that go nowhere and only serve to get them re-elected.

The best way out of this mess is to cut cut cut spending and I am not buying anymore of this we need a tax increase from any pol We can reduce the government by a third maintain a viable and productive governement and save taxpayers billions and billions of tax dollars

Guest
10-22-2011, 05:35 PM
Income redistribution is still income redistribution.... Geez, the percentage of people who are very wealthy and those that are very poor are both growing at alarming rates. The class that is declining--the class that has proven most fundamental to the growth of a strong economy--is the middle class. There IS income re-distribution going on, as it has been for a decade or more. We're becoming a country of haves and have nots, with no one in between to form the basis of a vibrant economy. If that's not income redistribution, then I don't know what is.

And in case I need to point out which political party has been in control of making the laws that have had this result, it's been the Republicans for the vast majority of the last decade or more when most of this has happened. There hasn't been a tax increase that could be described as a "redistribution of income" for more than two decades. For crying out loud, don't just listen to the talking points being fed to us by the idealogues. Look at the facts!

I'm not recommending a simple tax increase on the richest individual Americans. But I am recommending a substantial redesign of the tax system in this country combined with substantial spending cuts. Maybe even a balanced budget amendment, so long it is phased in over a reasonable amount of time. Yes, the rich should pay more, as should the corporations and special interests who have bought and paid for tax benefits and deductions that unjustifiably reduce their tax obligations. Such a plan, if well thought out, could result in the beginning of the return of the middle class and maybe even a broad tax cut for most corporations.

Guest
10-22-2011, 06:40 PM
We are still working, not retired, and we are

T.E.A.

Taxed Enough Already.

Can I ask you one question then?

How do you reconcile that statement with the fact that, as a percentage of GDP, we're being taxed at less than any rate since the 1950s.

Saying "Enough already!" is clearly an opinion.

How do you back that up? By what measure? (I have a few in mind, to be honest - but I want to hear yours)