Changing America in a Soviet style Police State.....really

[Guest]

Soon you won't be safe from random searches by TSA goons anywhere. They're coming to a bus, ferry, train, etc., etc. near you soon.

TSA and Sheila Jackson Lee abolish 4th Amendment for Houston Metro Riders

You don't believe me?; do some checking on your own.

Will they be wearing brown shirts?

TSA and Sheila Jackson Lee Abolish 4th Amendment for Houston Metro Riders - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=rs6TInhxD1g#)!

» Big Sis Launches Undercover TSA Spies To Ride Houston Buses Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind! (http://www.infowars.com/tsa-to-search-bags-question-passengers-on-houston-buses/)

[Guest]

Not suprised.:sad:

[Guest]

This happened in Boston a while back - random searches on the MBTA (Massachuetts Bay Transportation Authority, known locally as "The 'T'"). It didn't last long after an outcry from the public. The only difference is that I *believe* the checks were NOT done by the TSA but by other law-enforcement agents.

[Guest]

More on the transformation of the U.S. into a Police State.

"If we can't feel your nipples, they must be a bomb"

The TSA's mission creep is making the US a police state | Jennifer Abel | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2012/apr/18/tsa-mission-creep-us-police-state)

[Guest]

When you couple this with the NSA facilities now being constructed in Utah that will record every electronic communication including your phone calls, emails, text messages, Facebook postings, etc. - this is becoming more than a little scary, NSA (http://www.datelinezero.com/2012/04/04/nsas-new-spy-center-to-be-far-more-than-just-a-data-center/)

[Guest]

When you couple this with the NSA facilities now being constructed in Utah that will record every electronic communication including your phone calls, emails, text messages, Facebook postings, etc. - this is becoming more than a little scary, NSA (http://www.datelinezero.com/2012/04/04/nsas-new-spy-center-to-be-far-more-than-just-a-data-center/)

Absolutely BBQ. I hope the partisans can get past their bias and realize this is not the American way. People need to speak up.

[Guest]

Bin Laden won.

[Guest]

Bin Laden won.

Wayne, I could not agree with you more. In response to terror attacks (whether real or feared) we have given up basic liberties.

[Guest]

More on the transformation of the U.S. into a Police State.

"If we can't feel your nipples, they must be a bomb"

The TSA's mission creep is making the US a police state | Jennifer Abel | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2012/apr/18/tsa-mission-creep-us-police-state)

As usual, you delight on telling us why the glass is half-empty, or worse. This gratuitous thread with all those hot button words like 'soviet' and 'police state', and your hot button conclusions about the terrible loss of personal liberty could not be farther from what our real world is in 2012.

Instead of making a superficial, out of context commentary your cherished focus, why not recognize the way America is working today, and how remarkably good that is under the circumstances.

It is nothing short of miraculous that there has been no large scale domestic terrorist disaster in eleven years. Law enforcement agencies from coast to coast have recorded hundreds of 'near misses', many stopped only because of vigilance. You don't like vigilance because it means watching and listening, which the bad old authorities should never be able to BEGIN to do without court orders, warrants, etc. We've written lots of laws to protect our precious liberties, most before the requirement of urgent action to effectively combat sophisticated terrorism.

What you completely miss is all the other laws and the recourse we have if our precious liberties are 'violated'. We can complain, like the "T" riders did in Boston, and excesses stop. We can sue, and have our rights upheld, make a big pile of money for our clever lawyer, and a little pile for us! What a great country!!! Law enforcement agencies are obsessed with avoiding complaints and lawsuits. That keeps their 'police state' mentality in check. And when they are really professional and carefully record or video incidents, they expose the perp who hollers "police brutality" pulling the gun and firing off the first dozen rounds.

What you also completely miss is that the power to know everything through vigilance is our greatest protection. We need to have the most well developed information gathering capability possible.

Maybe I can make the big picture simpler for you. Would you rather have someone someone search your bag for 'no apparent reason' as you get on the subway, or spend a few months in the hospital with severe burns from the bomb?

Go ahead, choose. It's another one of your rights.

[Guest]

I am impressed with the point/counter point type dialogue on an important issue.

Now if we could get the same kind of participation in the thread on voter ID....I'm just sayin'....

btk

[Guest]

As usual, you delight on telling us why the glass is half-empty, or worse. This gratuitous thread with all those hot button words like 'soviet' and 'police state', and your hot button conclusions about the terrible loss of personal liberty could not be farther from what our real world is in 2012.

Instead of making a superficial, out of context commentary your cherished focus, why not recognize the way America is working today, and how remarkably good that is under the circumstances.

It is nothing short of miraculous that there has been no large scale domestic terrorist disaster in eleven years. Law enforcement agencies from coast to coast have recorded hundreds of 'near misses', many stopped only because of vigilance. You don't like vigilance because it means watching and listening, which the bad old authorities should never be able to BEGIN to do without court orders, warrants, etc. We've written lots of laws to protect our precious liberties, most before the requirement of urgent action to effectively combat sophisticated terrorism.

What you completely miss is all the other laws and the recourse we have if our precious liberties are 'violated'. We can complain, like the "T" riders did in Boston, and excesses stop. We can sue, and have our rights upheld, make a big pile of money for our clever lawyer, and a little pile for us! What a great country!!! Law enforcement agencies are obsessed with avoiding complaints and lawsuits. That keeps their 'police state' mentality in check. And when they are really professional and carefully record or video incidents, they expose the perp who hollers "police brutality" pulling the gun and firing off the first dozen rounds.

What you also completely miss is that the power to know everything through vigilance is our greatest protection. We need to have the most well developed information gathering capability possible.

Maybe I can make the big picture simpler for you. Would you rather have someone someone search your bag for 'no apparent reason' as you get on the subway, or spend a few months in the hospital with severe burns from the bomb?

Go ahead, choose. It's another one of your rights.

Very well presented!

[Guest]

As usual, you delight on telling us why the glass is half-empty, or worse. This gratuitous thread with all those hot button words like 'soviet' and 'police state', and your hot button conclusions about the terrible loss of personal liberty could not be farther from what our real world is in 2012.

Instead of making a superficial, out of context commentary your cherished focus, why not recognize the way America is working today, and how remarkably good that is under the circumstances.

It is nothing short of miraculous that there has been no large scale domestic terrorist disaster in eleven years. Law enforcement agencies from coast to coast have recorded hundreds of 'near misses', many stopped only because of vigilance. You don't like vigilance because it means watching and listening, which the bad old authorities should never be able to BEGIN to do without court orders, warrants, etc. We've written lots of laws to protect our precious liberties, most before the requirement of urgent action to effectively combat sophisticated terrorism.

What you completely miss is all the other laws and the recourse we have if our precious liberties are 'violated'. We can complain, like the "T" riders did in Boston, and excesses stop. We can sue, and have our rights upheld, make a big pile of money for our clever lawyer, and a little pile for us! What a great country!!! Law enforcement agencies are obsessed with avoiding complaints and lawsuits. That keeps their 'police state' mentality in check. And when they are really professional and carefully record or video incidents, they expose the perp who hollers "police brutality" pulling the gun and firing off the first dozen rounds.

What you also completely miss is that the power to know everything through vigilance is our greatest protection. We need to have the most well developed information gathering capability possible.

Maybe I can make the big picture simpler for you. Would you rather have someone someone search your bag for 'no apparent reason' as you get on the subway, or spend a few months in the hospital with severe burns from the bomb?

Go ahead, choose. It's another one of your rights.

I don't ignore that we've been relatively safe, for now, but I don't think that the intrusive tactics of our government in the form of the TSA has had diddly to do with it.

All you need to know, is to read my standard signature sentence.

Our freedoms should not be given up to government whims so readily.

[Guest]

ijusluvit: You make a very good point that I completely agree with.

*LAW ENFORCEMENT* has discovered plots, arrested terrorists before disasters and provided intel to share amongst their agencies.

Name me *ONE* big break the TSA has made. ONE foiled plot.

The aspects of the "USA PATRIOT Act" that allowed for sharing of intelligence between law enforcement agencies is something I wholeheartedly supported and still do.

The TSA is security theater and nothing more.

[Guest]

ijusluvit: You make a very good point that I completely agree with.

*LAW ENFORCEMENT* has discovered plots, arrested terrorists before disasters and provided intel to share amongst their agencies.

Name me *ONE* big break the TSA has made. ONE foiled plot.

The aspects of the "USA PATRIOT Act" that allowed for sharing of intelligence between law enforcement agencies is something I wholeheartedly supported and still do.

The TSA is security theater and nothing more.

Your last sentence is the first time I've ever seen you qualify for the "Off-The-Wall Ridiculous Generalization Club".

There's nothing more vulnerable and no 'bigger' strategic target for terrorists than an airplane. Shoe bombers, underwear bombers...have we not had everything but body cavity bombers?!! The TSA has had to scramble furiously to keep up, with the stakes always incredibly high. We all think we could do a better job. We are all so outraged at the excesses the media loves to embellish.

Yes, with imperfect humans doing every operation, and in the necessity to anticipate every possibility, the TSA has made some errors of commission. But not a single one of omission. That's 0 terrorist strikes on airplanes in eleven years.

[Guest]

I don't ignore that we've been relatively safe, for now, but I don't think that the intrusive tactics of our government in the form of the TSA has had diddly to do with it.

All you need to know, is to read my standard signature sentence.

Our freedoms should not be given up to government whims so readily.

Your first sentence reinforces your position as a charter member of the "Off-The-Wall Ridiculous Generalizations Club".

[Guest]

As usual, you delight on telling us why the glass is half-empty, or worse. This gratuitous thread with all those hot button words like 'soviet' and 'police state', and your hot button conclusions about the terrible loss of personal liberty could not be farther from what our real world is in 2012.

Instead of making a superficial, out of context commentary your cherished focus, why not recognize the way America is working today, and how remarkably good that is under the circumstances.

It is nothing short of miraculous that there has been no large scale domestic terrorist disaster in eleven years. Law enforcement agencies from coast to coast have recorded hundreds of 'near misses', many stopped only because of vigilance. You don't like vigilance because it means watching and listening, which the bad old authorities should never be able to BEGIN to do without court orders, warrants, etc. We've written lots of laws to protect our precious liberties, most before the requirement of urgent action to effectively combat sophisticated terrorism.

What you completely miss is all the other laws and the recourse we have if our precious liberties are 'violated'. We can complain, like the "T" riders did in Boston, and excesses stop. We can sue, and have our rights upheld, make a big pile of money for our clever lawyer, and a little pile for us! What a great country!!! Law enforcement agencies are obsessed with avoiding complaints and lawsuits. That keeps their 'police state' mentality in check. And when they are really professional and carefully record or video incidents, they expose the perp who hollers "police brutality" pulling the gun and firing off the first dozen rounds.

What you also completely miss is that the power to know everything through vigilance is our greatest protection. We need to have the most well developed information gathering capability possible.

Maybe I can make the big picture simpler for you. Would you rather have someone someone search your bag for 'no apparent reason' as you get on the subway, or spend a few months in the hospital with severe burns from the bomb?

Go ahead, choose. It's another one of your rights.

There seems to be a balance made between security and freedom. They are at odds between one another. Bush and Obama's teams have done fairly well with keeping us relatively safe since 9/11.

[Guest]

I agree with Tartelzac. No attacks on US soil since 9/11/2001. Let's keep up the good work!

[Guest]

Your first sentence reinforces your position as a charter member of the "Off-The-Wall Ridiculous Generalizations Club".

Your whole stance on this is just ignorant of reality, in my view.

You seem to think big government can do little wrong.

We'll have to try to save what freedoms we have in spite of you.

[Guest]

I agree with Tartelzac. No attacks on US soil since 9/11/2001. Let's keep up the good work!

Name just one; just one plot foiled by the TSA, and I'll shut up about them.

(hint) I won't be shutting up soon.

[Guest]

Your whole stance on this is just ignorant of reality, in my view.

You seem to think big government can do little wrong.

We'll have to try to save what freedoms we have in spite of you.


I've called you on your sweeping generalizations, for which you have no accurate, rational or factual reply.

What totally disgusts me about you is that in these situations you regularly act like the spoiled child with disparaging remarks about the persons whose ideas don't line up with yours. Your remarks above are simply designed to insult.

TOTV would be far better off without your egotistical grandstanding and ridicule of others.

[Guest]

Name just one; just one plot foiled by the TSA, and I'll shut up about them.

(hint) I won't be shutting up soon.

TSA: Information on Plot to Attack John F. Kennedy Airport (http://www.tsa.gov/press/happenings/jfk_terror_plot.shtm)

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2009-12-26/news/17942624_1_security-for-air-travel-tsa-passengers

http://blog.heritage.org/2009/12/26/detroit-terror-plot-makes-28-plots-foiled-since-911/

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2010/04/30-terrorist-plots-foiled-how-the-system-worked

None of these just involve the TSA but it looks like they did help in some of them.

This is of interest-- http://www.flyavp.com/safetyandsecuritytips.html

[Guest]

Why We Hate Airport Security | Psychology Today (http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/let-their-words-do-the-talking/201112/why-we-hate-airport-security)

[Guest]

TSA: Information on Plot to Attack John F. Kennedy Airport (http://www.tsa.gov/press/happenings/jfk_terror_plot.shtm)

Foiled terror plot aboard Northwest Flight 253 sparks strict security rules for air passengers - New York Daily News (http://articles.nydailynews.com/2009-12-26/news/17942624_1_security-for-air-travel-tsa-passengers)

Detroit Terror Plot Makes 28 Plots Foiled Since 9/11 (http://blog.heritage.org/2009/12/26/detroit-terror-plot-makes-28-plots-foiled-since-911/)

30 Terrorist Plots Foiled: How the System Worked (http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2010/04/30-terrorist-plots-foiled-how-the-system-worked)

None of these just involve the TSA but it looks like they did help in some of them.

This is of interest-- Safety & Security Tips (http://www.flyavp.com/safetyandsecuritytips.html)

Nothing here validates the groping intrusions, and unconstitutional unwarranted searches of the TSA in increasing venues, and that's what I'm referring to. Unsubstantiated giving of credit to the TSA, amongst other agencies in the middle of a paragraph, does not impress me.

I guess I won't be shutting up soon.

[Guest]

I've called you on your sweeping generalizations, for which you have no accurate, rational or factual reply.

What totally disgusts me about you is that in these situations you regularly act like the spoiled child with disparaging remarks about the persons whose ideas don't line up with yours. Your remarks above are simply designed to insult.

TOTV would be far better off without your egotistical grandstanding and ridicule of others.

You're not grandstanding here?

Give me a break.

Read your own post above. Nothing I've said is a grotesquely rude as this.

[Guest]

TSA: Information on Plot to Attack John F. Kennedy Airport (http://www.tsa.gov/press/happenings/jfk_terror_plot.shtm)

Foiled terror plot aboard Northwest Flight 253 sparks strict security rules for air passengers - New York Daily News (http://articles.nydailynews.com/2009-12-26/news/17942624_1_security-for-air-travel-tsa-passengers)

Detroit Terror Plot Makes 28 Plots Foiled Since 9/11 (http://blog.heritage.org/2009/12/26/detroit-terror-plot-makes-28-plots-foiled-since-911/)

30 Terrorist Plots Foiled: How the System Worked (http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2010/04/30-terrorist-plots-foiled-how-the-system-worked)

None of these just involve the TSA but it looks like they did help in some of them.

This is of interest-- Safety & Security Tips (http://www.flyavp.com/safetyandsecuritytips.html)

As you note none of these involved the TSA in the slightest. SFO - The San Francisco airport has the most effective and lowest cost screening process of any major airport in the US. Why is it so different? The TSA is not involved and the work is being done by a private security company. When will we finally learn to listen to Peter Drucker who observed, "The only thing the government does well is to wage war."

[Guest]

You're not grandstanding here?

Give me a break.

Read your own post above. Nothing I've said is a grotesquely rude as this.

The truth sometimes hurts doesn't it richie?

[Guest]

The truth sometimes hurts doesn't it richie?

??????????? Do you ever know what you're talking about??

You're even pathetic when you are trying to insult me.

[Guest]

Nothing here validates the groping intrusions, and unconstitutional unwarranted searches of the TSA in increasing venues, and that's what I'm referring to. Unsubstantiated giving of credit to the TSA, amongst other agencies in the middle of a paragraph, does not impress me.

I guess I won't be shutting up soon.

Richie - The groping intrusions may be why Sheila Jackson Lee wants the TSA involved. It may be the only way she will ever be touched by anyone.

[Guest]

As you note none of these involved the TSA in the slightest. SFO - The San Francisco airport has the most effective and lowest cost screening process of any major airport in the US. Why is it so different? The TSA is not involved and the work is being done by a private security company. When will we finally learn to listen to Peter Drucker who observed, "The only thing the government does well is to wage war."

SFO - San Francisco International Airport - safety & security (http://www.flysfo.com/web/page/atsfo/saf-sec/)

The TSA has a contract with this company to provide private security, so I would say they are involved. http://covenantsecurity.com/sfo/

Would like to know where you are getting your statistics about the San Francisco Airport and its "most effective and lowest cost screening process". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_International_Airport


This is also of interest-- http://www.foxbusiness.com/travel/2012/02/08/tsa-expands-quick-screen-program-to-28-more-airports/

[Guest]

Richie - The groping intrusions may be why Sheila Jackson Lee wants the TSA involved. It may be the only way she will ever be touched by anyone.

And Repubs criticize liberals for not addressing the issue. Just another example of Supidski tactics. :cus:

[Guest]

And Repubs criticize liberals for not addressing the issue. Just another example of Supidski tactics. :cus:

I thought Jim and Marge's humor would be right up your alley of just joking about and insulting those you don't like.

Hard to figure you out.

(Ohhhh, wait a minute...........I guess it's only funny if those you don't like are gratuitously insulted............yeah...........that must be it)

[Guest]

Jim & Marge posted:
Richie - The groping intrusions may be why Sheila Jackson Lee wants the TSA involved. It may be the only way she will ever be touched by anyone.
__________________________

I thought Richie only objected when a TSA screener saw his "Hello Kitty" underwear. But as my second-favorite comedian says, "But maybe I'm wrong."

[Guest]

Richie - The groping intrusions may be why Sheila Jackson Lee wants the TSA involved. It may be the only way she will ever be touched by anyone.



Rep. Jackson Lee seems to be married with two kids. Biography | U.S. Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee (http://jacksonlee.house.gov/Biography/)

[Guest]

I thought Jim and Marge's humor would be right up your alley of just joking about and insulting those you don't like.

Hard to figure you out.

(Ohhhh, wait a minute...........I guess it's only funny if those you don't like are gratuitously insulted............yeah...........that must be it)

There are very very few people I actually dislike..... There are millions of people whose politics I dislike. There is a difference. ;)

[Guest]

There are very very few people I actually dislike..... There are millions of people whose politics I dislike. There is a difference. ;)

THIS is the most intelligent response I have seen on this board in a long time.

[Guest]

There are very very few people I actually dislike..... There are millions of people whose politics I dislike. There is a difference. ;)

It's kind of what I really meant. I appreciate you understanding I was aiming for a bit of levity with you. (even though I was making a small point)

[Guest]

And Repubs criticize liberals for not addressing the issue. Just another example of Supidski tactics. :cus:

I thought Jim and Marge's humor would be right up your alley of just joking about and insulting those you don't like.

Hard to figure you out.

(Ohhhh, wait a minute...........I guess it's only funny if those you don't like are gratuitously insulted............yeah...........that must be it)

Jim & Marge posted:
Richie - The groping intrusions may be why Sheila Jackson Lee wants the TSA involved. It may be the only way she will ever be touched by anyone.
__________________________

I thought Richie only objected when a TSA screener saw his "Hello Kitty" underwear. But as my second-favorite comedian says, "But maybe I'm wrong."

Rep. Jackson Lee seems to be married with two kids. Biography | U.S. Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee (http://jacksonlee.house.gov/Biography/)

There are very very few people I actually dislike..... There are millions of people whose politics I dislike. There is a difference. ;)

OK Folks, you got me. Yes, I tried to inject a little humor in what appeared to be some inane, snippy comments. Please note, I did not go to the accepted extremes of Bill Mahr, Jon Stewart, or Stephen Colbert.

By the way, what does being married and having kids have to do with being gropable? I mean, have you seen her? Eweeew!:icon_wink:

[Guest]

OK Folks, you got me. Yes, I tried to inject a little humor in what appeared to be some inane, snippy comments. Please note, I did not go to the accepted extremes of Bill Mahr, Jon Stewart, or Stephen Colbert.

By the way, what does being married and having kids have to do with being gropable? I mean, have you seen her? Eweeew!:icon_wink:

This did seem to be a Mad TV skit. I kind of remember one a bit like this too. Not this one though-- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbtHmUGHXsc

[Guest]

This did seem to be a Mad TV skit. I kind of remember one a bit like this too. Not this one though-- Cut and Edited Version of Ka-Son at the Airport - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbtHmUGHXsc)

YouTube from MAD TV about TSA.

[Guest]

Here's the unedited version. It's much funnier.

Mad Tv - Ka-son at the Airport. - YouTube

[Guest]

Here's the unedited version. It's much funnier.

Mad Tv - Ka-son at the Airport. - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xARiFIew8Ao)

Thanks, RichieLion.

[Guest]

Yes, with imperfect humans doing every operation, and in the necessity to anticipate every possibility, the TSA has made some errors of commission. But not a single one of omission. That's 0 terrorist strikes on airplanes in eleven years.

The TSA was supposed to be something good - they were supposed to set standards. But, right form the get-go, they were watered down. You don't even have to have a high-school diploma to be a TSA agent.

They ARE theater. When I flew 3 months after 9/11, the airports were still staffed with the National Guard and I felt *safe*.

Are the TSA armed? No.

Have they broken any plots? No.

Are they trained in counter-terrorism? No.

I want the terrorists afraid to even show up at the airport. Having well-trained National Guard troops with automatic weapons at the ready does that.

Experiences like the one I had in Philly last year give me NO confidence. I went through security and proceeded to my gate. There, at the gate, we were told we were going to go through ANOTHER search. I asked why - was it because they didn't do their job at the security checkpoint? Mind you, I asked nicer than that but you get my point. The explanation? (I'm not making this up) "Please line up over there for the search".

So, either someone didn't do their job at the regular checkpoint (I know they did it when *I* went through) or this was just more Security Theater running checks on people who had already been checked.

There is NOTHING the TSA does that would thwart an attack like what happened in Glasgow (flaming car driven into a terminal) or Moscow (bomber self-detonating in the terminal). If anything, they've made it WORSE because NOW the target can be the SEVERAL planeloads of people lining up at security for those extended checks. Strap on a hot one and detonate yourself in the security line - THAT is something I've been concerned about for a while and THAT is why I want Tel-Aviv-like security or National Guard troops in the airport.

[Guest]

Yes, with imperfect humans doing every operation, and in the necessity to anticipate every possibility, the TSA has made some errors of commission. But not a single one of omission. That's 0 terrorist strikes on airplanes in eleven years.

After reading DJ's answer, I had a thought.

Your reasoning is that an airline terrorist plot hasn't been carried out on an airline since the inception of the TSA and thus proves the TSA's indispensable value.

(even though they have not thwarted an actual plot of any kind, either)

I just realized my own valuable contribution. Each day I go out and get my newspaper, or to talk to my neighbors, or just to get some sun and air.

Each time I do, I assess the situation in an effort to notice anything amiss that might be a danger to my neighborhood. I've been very diligent for almost 3 years now. No terrorist or criminal activity has been evident during all this time of my continued vigilance.

This gives me a 100% success rate in "preventing" terrorist and criminal activity in my neighborhood by the standards you mention.

I am very proud.

[Guest]

Richie: That's the difference between making an observation and establishing a causal link.

I was all in favor of the TSA - which was supposed to set high standards - when it was proposed. As soon as public unions complained about the initial requirement for a HS diploma or GED - and the government *caved* - I knew this was not going to help.

I had an opportunity to experience airport security in London, Dublin, Paris and Amsterdam since 2010 and it's a lot smoother there than it is here. I felt plenty safe. In Amsterdam, we went through scanners that did NOT show faux-nude images of you - just an outline with a 'dot' or 'x' where it detected certain things, superimposed on a generic outline of a human form - and it was all in public view so that there was no question about hassling someone for no reason.

This country seems to have been overrun with something I see in the business world that depresses me - a case of "Not Invented Here Syndrome" - if we didn't invent it, it can't be good. We can't look elsewhere to see what works because we're Americans and nothing else on the planet could possible be better than what we have here.

[Guest]

Richie: That's the difference between making an observation and establishing a causal link.

I was all in favor of the TSA - which was supposed to set high standards - when it was proposed. As soon as public unions complained about the initial requirement for a HS diploma or GED - and the government *caved* - I knew this was not going to help.

I had an opportunity to experience airport security in London, Dublin, Paris and Amsterdam since 2010 and it's a lot smoother there than it is here. I felt plenty safe. In Amsterdam, we went through scanners that did NOT show faux-nude images of you - just an outline with a 'dot' or 'x' where it detected certain things, superimposed on a generic outline of a human form - and it was all in public view so that there was no question about hassling someone for no reason.

This country seems to have been overrun with something I see in the business world that depresses me - a case of "Not Invented Here Syndrome" - if we didn't invent it, it can't be good. We can't look elsewhere to see what works because we're Americans and nothing else on the planet could possible be better than what we have here.

I absolutely agree, which is why I've often wondered, and questioned on this forum, why trying to implement some kind of system like they do in Israel where they actually have a record of preventing problems, and is far less intrusive and invasive as our methods, is a non-starter here in the U.S.

I know I'll hear many opinions on why it can't be duplicated here, but it's never been tried and so I can't abide it.

[Guest]

Think of all the government programs like this:

Government spend money it does not have, good thing.......

Government save money, bad thing..........