Dream Act Passed By Executive Order

[Guest]

President Barack Obama will announce in the Rose Garden at 1:15pm today that he is suspending the deportation of young people under the age of 30 and granting them work visas by executive order. This is essentially the Dream Act, that Senator Marco Rubio has talked about but never put down on paper, making it difficult for republicans difficult to oppose.

President Obama already holds a 41% lead over Mitt Romney with hispanics.


Obama Administration To Stop Deporting Younger Undocumented Immigrants And Grant Work Permits (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/15/obama-immigration-order-deportation-dream-act_n_1599658.html)

[Guest]

So your proud of fiat by government. Try living in Syria, Iran or North Korea and if you are ever allowed to leave let us know how you liked it.

[Guest]

We know Obama is proud of government by fiat (he admits he's envious of the Chinese president).

I think the OP was simply pointing out what Obama is doing, how it resembles ideas proposed by certain GOP members, and how it will probably solidify his base in the Hispanic community.

[Guest]

This is from the DREAM Act proposed legislations described in wikipedia....arguments for and against are there.

These are valid points in opposition to the concept, whether or not you like government by fiat.

"Opponents of the DREAM Act argue that it encourages and rewards illegal immigration. Other stands include viewing it as importing poverty and cheap labor, being a military recruitment tool, having economic and social burdens (subsidies from state and federal taxes, degradation of the public school system and neighborhoods), and as being unfair to American-born and legal immigrant parents and children who must pay full tuition at state universities and colleges.

Some concerns center on the parameters of the proposal, specifically that it would admit individuals who have already formed their identities overseas (i.e. people who arrived up to age 16), that illegal immigrants up to age 35 are allowed to legalize through it, that it would result in massive fraud similar to the 1986 amnesty, and that it will encourage additional illegal immigration. There are additional concerns that the DREAM Act will shield gang members from deportation."

[Guest]

We know Obama is proud of government by fiat (he admits he's envious of the Chinese president).

I think the OP was simply pointing out what Obama is doing, how it resembles ideas proposed by certain GOP members, and how it will probably solidify his base in the Hispanic community.

quidam65If that were only the case but I have read several of this members posts and s/he intent here was reflected in my response because otherwise I always try and give a person the benefit of doubt

[Guest]

What I noticed the other day while shopping with my wife were all of these workers, young and obviouly American born kids, who were taking jobs away from illegals.

[Guest]

isn't this SIMILAR to the guest worker program that gw bush promoted and was demonstrably criticized for?

[Guest]

OK you know the territory better than I so I will give you the benefit of the doubt as to who is in the tank for Obama and who isn't.

[Guest]

In response to the president's announcement, Senator Marco Rubio did concede in a statement that President Obama's immigration order is "welcome news for many of these kids desperatly waiting for an answer".

Worth noting about Rubio and his Dream Act alternative; He's yet to write draft on any legislation on the subject. This could cause problems between him and Mitt Romney, as Romney has vowed to repeal any Dream Act that gets passed by congress.

Rubio Has Yet to Provide His Alternative to Dream Act | TheLedger.com (http://www.theledger.com/article/20120614/POLITICS/120619639?Title=Rubio-Has-Yet-to-Provide-His-Alternative-to-Dream-Act)

[Guest]

Correction: It's not the Dream Act, but a new policy for young immigrants that the president just unveiled. The Dream Act is stuck in congress - surprise, surprise. There is no path to citizenship in his proposal, only a two year work permit with no threat of deportation for qualified young people.

[Guest]

Today's action was certainly a major coup for him and a real step upward.

No one can criticize it. It does not give citizenship and it does not threaten deportation to children who have been raised in Americal. It is a win-win for the President.

[Guest]

if Obama has such a commanding lead why did he prostitute himself (AGAIN!) with a back door approach which has been labeled by both parties today as nothing but a blatant political move.

It will definitely derail any hopes of immigration reform. Why would there be a need for any reform. He just put the welcome sign at the border....c'mon over and bring your kids or anybody else's kids with you.

So now what do we do with the illegal parents? NOTHING as per usual except now who would have the heart to send the parents packing?

And oh by the way what are the age limits? what are the controls for the young ones you really don't want in this country?

I say again if he has such a commanding lead with Hispanics why would he do take such a know controversial action?
One reason and one reason only...he is not confident enough he can hold the voting base....Hispanic or otherwise.

Please don't give me any of the partisan flotsam that he is doing the right thing for the illegal young.

He is buying votes pure and simple...Obama only moves or takes action on that which benefits Obama.

Just the beginning. Wait and see what else he does to buy votes.

Political prostitution to be as polite as possible about it.

btk

[Guest]

if Obama has such a commanding lead why did he prostitute himself (AGAIN!) with a back door approach which has been labeled by both parties today as nothing but a blatant political move.

It will definitely derail any hopes of immigration reform. Why would there be a need for any reform. He just put the welcome sign at the border....c'mon over and bring your kids or anybody else's kids with you.

So now what do we do with the illegal parents? NOTHING as per usual except now who would have the heart to send the parents packing?

And oh by the way what are the age limits? what are the controls for the young ones you really don't want in this country?

I say again if he has such a commanding lead with Hispanics why would he do take such a know controversial action?
One reason and one reason only...he is not confident enough he can hold the voting base....Hispanic or otherwise.

Please don't give me any of the partisan flotsam that he is doing the right thing for the illegal young.

He is buying votes pure and simple...Obama only moves or takes action on that which benefits Obama.

Just the beginning. Wait and see what else he does to buy votes.

Political prostitution to be as polite as possible about it.

btk

Are you calling the POTUS a ho? :yuck:

[Guest]

if Obama has such a commanding lead why did he prostitute himself (AGAIN!) with a back door approach which has been labeled by both parties today as nothing but a blatant political move.

It will definitely derail any hopes of immigration reform. Why would there be a need for any reform. He just put the welcome sign at the border....c'mon over and bring your kids or anybody else's kids with you.

So now what do we do with the illegal parents? NOTHING as per usual except now who would have the heart to send the parents packing?

And oh by the way what are the age limits? what are the controls for the young ones you really don't want in this country?

I say again if he has such a commanding lead with Hispanics why would he do take such a know controversial action?
One reason and one reason only...he is not confident enough he can hold the voting base....Hispanic or otherwise.

Please don't give me any of the partisan flotsam that he is doing the right thing for the illegal young.

He is buying votes pure and simple...Obama only moves or takes action on that which benefits Obama.

Just the beginning. Wait and see what else he does to buy votes.

Political prostitution to be as polite as possible about it.

btk

What do you call Mitt Romney, who during the GOP primary staked out the most extreme immigration position of the GOP field, saying he would repeal the Dream Act if congress passed it. Today Romney said he agrees with Senator Marco Rubio, who said earlier the president's act is "welcome news for many of these kids desperate for an answer".

Getting dizzy watching Romney change positions. President Obama might have assured today that Rubio will be the VP pick. Looks like you're running out of people to vote for.


EXCLUSIVE: Romney Immigration Adviser Calls Obama's New Policy 'Illegal' | ThinkProgress (http://thinkprogress.org/election/2012/06/15/500835/exclusive-romney-immigration-adviser-calls-obamas-new-policy-illegal/)

[Guest]

The actions of a Dictator. His way or the highway. No Congress, no bills, not even an executive order.

If anyone needed any more proof that "The Amateur" needs to be run out of Washington on a rail, this is it.

This is the nail in the coffin of the Obama Presidency.

[Guest]

Today's action was certainly a major coup for him and a real step upward.

No one can criticize it. It does not give citizenship and it does not threaten deportation to children who have been raised in Americal. It is a win-win for the President.

i see this as a win-win for those who qualify for the benefit - not as a win-win for the prez who has again made a purely insincere political move.

[Guest]

What do you call Mitt Romney, who during the GOP primary staked out the most extreme immigration position of the GOP field, saying he would repeal the Dream Act if congress passed it. Today Romney said he agrees with Senator Marco Rubio, who said earlier the president's act is "welcome news for many of these kids desperate for an answer".

Getting dizzy watching Romney change positions. President Obama might have assured today that Rubio will be the VP pick. Looks like you're running out of people to vote for.


EXCLUSIVE: Romney Immigration Adviser Calls Obama's New Policy 'Illegal' | ThinkProgress (http://thinkprogress.org/election/2012/06/15/500835/exclusive-romney-immigration-adviser-calls-obamas-new-policy-illegal/)

seems to me that you and the article's author are making the assumption that BECAUSE romney did NOT come out and voice an opinion that is counter to the intent of this political action that he has changed his position since may. until i actually hear romney say something to that effect, i will not make the same assumption.

[Guest]

I'm thinking that the Obama Team has intel that Rubio is the pick for VP and has quickly tossed this new ruling out there to offset that choice. They seem to fire things off quickly and let the courts sort it out later.

[Guest]

The actions of a Dictator. His way or the highway. No Congress, no bills, not even an executive order.

If anyone needed any more proof that "The Amateur" needs to be run out of Washington on a rail, this is it.

This is the nail in the coffin of the Obama Presidency.

Doesn't behave much like an amateur. :laugh:

[Guest]

Doesn't behave much like an amateur. :laugh:

prob because he has axlerod and plouffe pulling his strings!

[Guest]

Republicans seem to forget that in 1986 their hero, President Ronald Reagan, passed the 1986 Immigration Reform and Control Act that granted amnesty to nearly three million illegal immigrants.


http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128303672

[Guest]

Today's action was certainly a major coup for him and a real step upward.

No one can criticize it. It does not give citizenship and it does not threaten deportation to children who have been raised in Americal. It is a win-win for the President.

But it is a lose-lose for citizens and legal residents of the USA who are jobless and now have even more competition for jobs, since the people benefiting from today's executive order will be given work permits.

It is also a lose-lose for college students applying for financial aid, which is already less available to non-minority low-income students.

Again, the middle-income taxpayer will be subsidizing other students' financial aid while they (taxpayers) cannot afford to pay for their own children's college costs. And the citizen college students themselves, whose unemployment rate is already 25% or more, will have more competition for the jobs they need while in college because the illegals will now have work permits.

[Guest]

Are you calling the POTUS a ho? :yuck:

I hope not. That would be an insult toy the honest ho's of this nation.

[Guest]

I hope not. That would be an insult toy the honest ho's of this nation.

:bigbow::bigbow::1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

[Guest]

The Tea Peeps are throwing a hissy fit tonight.

Has Willard backed away from his self-deport nonsense?

[Guest]

Classy.

[Guest]

Doesn't behave much like an amateur. :laugh:

You're wholly mistaken. This is going to cause a huge backlash. He's going to regret this day, even if he takes it back.

A true Amateur.

[Guest]

...It will definitely derail any hopes of immigration reform...It was a smart political move by Obama, doing something that is impossible for either party to criticize. If there's any criticism at all it is that the POTUS has bypassed the Congressional legislative process.

But it really can't be alleged that Obama "derailed any hope of immigration reform". Sadly, there was no hope of any reform because of the ideological and political deep freeze in Congress.

[Guest]

It was a smart political move by Obama, doing something that is impossible for either party to criticize. If there's any criticism at all it is that the POTUS has bypassed the Congressional legislative process.

But it really can't be alleged that Obama "derailed any hope of immigration reform". Sadly, there was no hope of any reform because of the ideological and political deep freeze in Congress.

The Dream Act is stalled in congress because Republican Senators filibustered the bill, even though it got 55 votes. The president's actions yesterday may cause congress to revisit this bill, or may cause Senator Marco Rubio to actually produce the bill that he's been working on but has yet to put anything in writing. These are the two choices for republicans if they hope to get any hispanic votes in the upcoming election.

Of course, we know that Speaker Boehner lead his house members on their ninth recess of the year, and this is only mid-June, so how could they debate anything?

[Guest]

You're wholly mistaken. This is going to cause a huge backlash. He's going to regret this day, even if he takes it back.

A true Amateur.

I love your references to FOX Noise constantly. Your television or computer must be linked to them 24/7. Bet it drives Mrs. Lion up the wall.

Anyhow, back to the message - this pre-emptive move by Pres. Obama against anything proposed in the future by Marko Rubio was brilliant. Mitt Romney cannot speak against it since Rubio wanted something very similar. It is not a law so it does not have to go through Congress. Brilliant is the best description for this exceptional political play that will benefit thousands of good young people in the USA.

[Guest]

I am astounded at the number of people that appauld, rather than show concern, for this Chavez-esque move by Obama, something that he has done repeatedly in the past and will clearly do in the future. Given that second terms leave plenty of room for ignoring accountability this ego-centric artful dodger is going to eat all of our lunches if he is re-elected.

I am afraid that the criticism of our failing education system has taken root because far too many voters fail to comprehend or recognize abuses by the government and this Administration in particular of ignoring the Constitution and our loss of freedoms. The government role should be to educate and advise but the people should decide. Perhaps there is gridlock in Congress but then perhaps some of those issues need to be tabled, perhaps not. However, I would prefer a slow moving Congress rather than these assaults on our constitution by Obama.

[Guest]

Lets see...must be no older than 30,enrolled in school,graduated from high school or served in military,has been here 5 continuous years and have a clean criminal record. Those are the qualifications...the dream act has been stuck in congress filibustered by repubs,nothing getting done as usual by Congress. I applaud the President for doing something,I wish he would do it more. Then we have the utter nonsense from the right...chavez-esque the amateur,dictator,back-door,more competition,assault,and the new catch word fiat! If congress refuses to get anything done let the chavez-esque,amateur,dictator rule by fiat.

[Guest]

Brilliant is the best description for this exceptional political play that will benefit thousands of good young people in the USA.

Can someone please explain to me how and why this will benefit
WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES????

Will we be "footing the bill" for the next two years for illegal aliens?

If their parents are still illegal and unable to buy a house, who is paying the school taxes?

What about health care? Will they continue to use "charity care" which was running rampant in New Jersey when I lived there....

Please...just explain the benefits to we citizens of this country...I am totally stumped and would appreciate any insight you guys could give me.

[Guest]

"...chavez-esque the amateur,dictator,back-door,more competition,assault,and the new catch word fiat!"

All of these words were taken directly from FOX News. These wubers love to parrot words by their heroes of Lush, Caribou Barbie, and the rest of those wing-nuts.

[Guest]

The Dream Act is stalled in congress because Republican Senators filibustered the bill, even though it got 55 votes. The president's actions yesterday may cause congress to revisit this bill, or may cause Senator Marco Rubio to actually produce the bill that he's been working on but has yet to put anything in writing. These are the two choices for republicans if they hope to get any hispanic votes in the upcoming election.

Of course, we know that Speaker Boehner lead his house members on their ninth recess of the year, and this is only mid-June, so how could they debate anything?

do you really believe that rubio is atually working on a bill? i am more likely to believe that the bill is pretty much written and was written by committee with rubio appt'd to be the prime sponsor if he is needed to run as v.p.! hod do ya like that conspiracy? ;)

[Guest]

Lets see...must be no older than 30,enrolled in school,graduated from high school or served in military,has been here 5 continuous years and have a clean criminal record. Those are the qualifications...the dream act has been stuck in congress...nothing getting done as usual by Congress....Was the Executive Order political?...absolutely. But did it order something that both political parties pretty much agreed upon, but held hostage in Congress for purely political reasons?

Whoever winds up getting more votes as the result of this order--and at this point it appears to be Obama--the opposing political party in Congress has no one to blame but themselves for being so stalemated and non-productive as to permitted it to happen.

I hate to say it, but if the democratic process no longer works, maybe a benevolent dictatorship is the next best thing. It's an easy fix...get a Congress that will actually legislate for the benefit of the People!

[Guest]

"...chavez-esque the amateur,dictator,back-door,more competition,assault,and the new catch word fiat!"

All of these words were taken directly from FOX News. These wubers love to parrot words by their heroes of Lush, Caribou Barbie, and the rest of those wing-nuts.

You're so full of it. You're just instigating without substance, and making it up as you go along. Whenever you're stumped for a cogent comment you accuse others of stupidity and only being parrots of others, when the truth is that you have no compelling response to offer and can only bash out of frustration.

How about a little honesty.

[Guest]

Lets see...must be no older than 30,enrolled in school,graduated from high school or served in military,has been here 5 continuous years and have a clean criminal record. Those are the qualifications...the dream act has been stuck in congress filibustered by repubs,nothing getting done as usual by Congress. I applaud the President for doing something,I wish he would do it more. Then we have the utter nonsense from the right...chavez-esque the amateur,dictator,back-door,more competition,assault,and the new catch word fiat! If congress refuses to get anything done let the chavez-esque,amateur,dictator rule by fiat.

wayne - i'd like to know why the potus did not get the dream act passed when he had the congressional majority for 2 years? why did the issue have to wait so long to be resolved? as if we all didn't know! lol how can you applaud the prez for the unethical end run of congress? i find such behavior despicable and without courage! ruling by fiat is proof that the ruler doesn't have the guts - nor the votes - to fight for what they believe is the right thing to do.

[Guest]

Losing it! :kiss:

[Guest]

wayne - i'd like to know why the potus did not get the dream act passed when he had the congressional majority for 2 years? why did the issue have to wait so long to be resolved? as if we all didn't know! lol how can you applaud the prez for the unethical end run of congress? i find such behavior despicable and without courage! ruling by fiat is proof that the ruler doesn't have the guts - nor the votes - to fight for what they believe is the right thing to do.

President Obama tried to get the Dream Act passed when he had the congressional majority. Unfortunately, on Dec 18, 2010 the senate vote was 55-41, and the republicans filibustered the bill requiring a 60 vote majority. Five democrats voted no, three republicans voted yes, and four senators were absent.

44 - Senate defeats DREAM Act (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/12/senate-defeats-dream-act.html)

[Guest]

You're so full of it. You're just instigating without substance, and making it up as you go along. Whenever you're stumped for a cogent comment you accuse others of stupidity and only being parrots of others, when the truth is that you have no compelling response to offer and can only bash out of frustration.

How about a little honesty.

Wow, cool down, old buddy and take a deep breath. I do not accuse others of stupidity. Those words would not be acceptable on TOTV. Parrots of others happens to be another thing, though. Those are the same words that FOX has used many times on their programs.

I am not bashing by any means. I am not frustrated with anything except my golf game.

Personally, I think this Executive Order by OUR President was a brilliant political move and took all the wind out of Marko Rubio's still unwritten plan for the same thing and also that Mr. Romney will be hard put to criticize it since it was something Rubio was offering up, too.

[Guest]

I just wish that more than 38% of the eligible U.S. population would actually go to the polls and VOTE! Very sad.

[Guest]

Can someone please explain to me how and why this will benefit
WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES????

Will we be "footing the bill" for the next two years for illegal aliens?

If their parents are still illegal and unable to buy a house, who is paying the school taxes?

What about health care? Will they continue to use "charity care" which was running rampant in New Jersey when I lived there....

Please...just explain the benefits to we citizens of this country...I am totally stumped and would appreciate any insight you guys could give me.

It's also going to be "interesting" to see how this promotes JOBS for American citizens and legal residents who are out of work and seeking a job.

But then, maybe the young illegals with work permit won't be job competition, since they will get full financial aid for college based on financial need and preferred minority status.

And now I have to go and barf.

[Guest]

I just wish that more than 38% of the eligible U.S. population would actually go to the polls and VOTE! Very sad.

In 2008, President Obama received the most votes for a presidential candidate in American history, and the turnout was 63%. Hopefully, he'll make history again in 2012.


United States presidential election, 2008 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008)

[Guest]

President Obama tried to get the Dream Act passed when he had the congressional majority. Unfortunately, on Dec 18, 2010 the senate vote was 55-41, and the republicans filibustered the bill requiring a 60 vote majority. Five democrats voted no, three republicans voted yes, and four senators were absent.

44 - Senate defeats DREAM Act (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/12/senate-defeats-dream-act.html)

bottom line was that he could NOT bring a sufficient number of pols in line with his desire!

[Guest]

bottom line was that he could NOT bring a sufficient number of pols in line with his desire!

Since the Republicans are under marching orders from their Tea Party supporters of their PAC money "to dig in their heels and not compromise", President Obama decided the best way to get something similar to the DREAM Act passed was by Executive Order.

This was a brilliant move that took the wind out of the sails of the Republican plan to make their DREAM Act a plan drawn up by Marko Rubio. They cannot come back with an alternative plan now and they cannot criticize because their own Tea Partier Rubio was going to have a very similar plan their "gamewinner Hail Mary" for the Republican Convention.

[Guest]

Since the Republicans are under marching orders from their Tea Party supporters of their PAC money "to dig in their heels and not compromise", President Obama decided the best way to get something similar to the DREAM Act passed was by Executive Order.

This was a brilliant move that took the wind out of the sails of the Republican plan to make their DREAM Act a plan drawn up by Marko Rubio. They cannot come back with an alternative plan now and they cannot criticize because their own Tea Partier Rubio was going to have a very similar plan their "gamewinner Hail Mary" for the Republican Convention.

I will bet you that Obama regrets this day. He going to be the victim of intense backlash. He will scale back his rhetoric very soon.

[Guest]

buggyone - you give the tea party and its supporters way too much credit! ;)

[Guest]

I will bet you that Obama regrets this day. He going to be the victim of intense backlash. He will scale back his rhetoric very soon.

Intense backlash from whom? The right-wing nut jobs who were never going to vote for him in the first place. Perhaps this will get congress to work on comprehensive immigration reform. Perhaps not.

If congress won't get the job done, the president has no choice but to go it alone. According the today's New York Times, "This was well within President Obama's authority to do so because the federal government can decide how to enforce immigration law".



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/16/opinion/a-step-toward-a-dream.html?_r=1&ref=illegalimmigrants


.

[Guest]

buggyone - you give the tea party and its supporters way too much credit! ;)

I love that they do this though, because it illustrates nicely for us the misdirection of their efforts. It's why they will lose.

[Guest]

Intense backlash from whom? The right-wing nut jobs who were never going to vote for him in the first place. Perhaps this will get congress to work on comprehensive immigration reform. Perhaps not.

If congress won't get the job done, the president has no choice but to go it alone. According the today's New York Times, "This was well within President Obama's authority to do so because the federal government can decide how to enforce immigration law".



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/16/opinion/a-step-toward-a-dream.html?_r=1&ref=illegalimmigrants


.

i don't think backlash wil come just from the right - more likely from those who can't get college loans and/or jobs and others who are sick and tired of paying for the health care the illegals have been getting for free since their parents carried them over the border.

[Guest]

The outrage coming from the right is just precious. Expect one of these cabinet-level directives every Friday. Mitt Romney won't know what hit him. Team Obama is just getting fired up and ready to go.

[Guest]

i don't think backlash wil come just from the right - more likely from those who can't get college loans and/or jobs and others who are sick and tired of paying for the health care the illegals have been getting for free since their parents carried them over the border.

You are forgetting that the Republicans were planning to bring out their own version of the DREAM Act. This is very similar to what they were planning and it took all the wind out of their sails. Tremendous coup by the Democrats and President Obama.

[Guest]

You are forgetting that the Republicans were planning to bring out their own version of the DREAM Act. This is very similar to what they were planning and it took all the wind out of their sails. Tremendous coup by the Democrats and President Obama.

Having an elected congress (however inept )debate an issue is one thing. Having the President find a way to make it law as a political stunt is another.

I, frankly, am tired of this man being given a pass on his absence of leadership and his constant and all consuming use of the oval office for politics.

He is aware this will be overturned after the election and he is refusing to assist in insuring that illegals are pruned from the voting lists....HE REFUSES to assist..amazing. This was a stunt, and in my opinion, will cost him,not get him the election.

No US CITIZEN is going to laud this unless they are party loyalist....there is no control over any of it and he knows it.

His character and lack of leadership of this country has always been my top two reasons to oppose him and he keeps on insuring that I am correct.

[Guest]

the outrage coming from the right is just precious. Expect one of these cabinet-level directives every friday. Mitt romney won't know what hit him. Team obama is just getting fired up and ready to go.

country be damned !!!!

[Guest]

The Imperial Presidency. The citizens will revolt, if Congress doesn't shut him down.

[Guest]

You are forgetting that the Republicans were planning to bring out their own version of the DREAM Act. This is very similar to what they were planning and it took all the wind out of their sails. Tremendous coup by the Democrats and President Obama.

i didn't forget that AT ALL! IF the Rs HAD come out with a plan or even have a plan to come out with - they could NOT implement it by executive order! and the fact that the prez did so just goes to show how intimidated he is by what the Rs might do before he can! lol

[Guest]

The outrage coming from the right is just precious. Expect one of these cabinet-level directives every Friday. Mitt Romney won't know what hit him. Team Obama is just getting fired up and ready to go.

the good news is that any obama executive order can be rescinded with a few strokes of a pen - unlike unemployment - as obama has shown!

[Guest]

The Imperial Presidency. The citizens will revolt, if Congress doesn't shut him down.

Get your musketloader ready. :boom:

[Guest]

The Imperial Presidency. The citizens will revolt, if Congress doesn't shut him down.

Don't hold your breath waiting for either one to happen.

[Guest]

Don't hold your breath waiting for either one to happen.

While a long shot for sure ...I KNOW that you know VK that this President does not even talk to his own party in congress...it has been discussed on Morning Joe more than once. His party is going to be under pressure...he has allowed, and this is my opinion, this congress to waffle...no leadership whatsoever. As I said, I KNOW that you have heard the same thing...he is in his world playing and using the country as a pawn in his little political game.

But you are correct...it is not something that is likely but I spoke to a number of political types in Tampa yesterday and today and the Democrats are not swooning any longer for sure.

[Guest]

While a long shot for sure ...I KNOW that you know VK that this President does not even talk to his own party in congress...it has been discussed on Morning Joe more than once. His party is going to be under pressure...he has allowed, and this is my opinion, this congress to waffle...no leadership whatsoever. As I said, I KNOW that you have heard the same thing...he is in his world playing and using the country as a pawn in his little political game.

But you are correct...it is not something that is likely but I spoke to a number of political types in Tampa yesterday and today and the Democrats are not swooning any longer for sure.....I'm guessing there are a whole lot of people like Mrs. Kahuna and me--people who voted for Obama and even contributed to his campaign in 2008--who won't be voting for him in November.

I'd like to get enthused about the prospects that things will change in the country as the result of the fall elections. There will be some pushes and pulls in the Congress. The GOP might even get a majority in both he House and the Senate. But they won't get a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. The likely result is that the Democrats will continue to frustrate the legislative process with purely politically-driven maneuvers. Instead of the anti-Obama moves we've seen from the GOP, it'll become anti-Romney, anti-Republican.

I wish I could project, in my own mind anyway, Mitt Romney being such a strong and compelling leader that he will be able to lead the country, maneuver the Congress to accomplish something, regain our status as a voice in the world that must be listened to.

While I'll vote for him, I can't project him into that kind of leadership role. I only hope that I'm as wrong with Romney as I was with Obama four years ago.

[Guest]

....I'm guessing there are a whole lot of people like Mrs. Kahuna and me--people who voted for Obama and even contributed to his campaign in 2008--who won't be voting for him in November.

I'd like to get enthused about the prospects that things will change in the country as the result of the fall elections. There will be some pushes and pulls in the Congress. The GOP might even get a majority in both he House and the Senate. But they won't get a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. The likely result is that the Democrats will continue to frustrate the legislative process with purely politically-driven maneuvers. Instead of the anti-Obama moves we've seen from the GOP, it'll become anti-Romney, anti-Republican.

I wish I could project, in my own mind anyway, Mitt Romney being such a strong and compelling leader that he will be able to lead the country, maneuver the Congress to accomplish something, regain our status as a voice in the world that must be listened to.

While I'll vote for him, I can't project him into that kind of leadership role. I only hope that I'm as wrong with Romney as I was with Obama four years ago.


Well, for one time only I will say I told you so on Obama in 2008.....a bigger phoney we have never had in this high political arena !!!

However, your point on Romney is fair. I couldnt project Reagan either to be quite frank..

What I DO KNOW is that no matter who wins the other party will resist him in congress. If it is Romney, he will need to immediately forge some kind of partnerships with the Democrats, hopefully people not of the Pelosi, Reid, Frank ilk in order to get anything done.

I do not think that Obama has a snowballs chance in anything to forge those kind of things with the Republicans. Not all his fault, but this guy has burned all his bridges to get political gains. He has tried..yep tried..from day one to put the Republicans in a bad light (and if you want I will be glad to give you a list of things he did the first two years to do that) and the folks still voted in the Republicans to congress. If he gets reelected he better have control of both houses.

[Guest]

This is so obviously in response to Florida purging illegals off of the voter registration. The next step will be an executive order followup for them to vote.

It will be the congressman and senators who will feel the backlash back home.

The tyrant in the white house, "didn't ask for an argument".

[Guest]

"...chavez-esque the amateur,dictator,back-door,more competition,assault,and the new catch word fiat!"

All of these words were taken directly from FOX News. These wubers love to parrot words by their heroes of Lush, Caribou Barbie, and the rest of those wing-nuts.

buggyone: Just so you know I watch Fox News but I also watch other news casts from NBC, CBS, ABC etc. I read the Wall Street Journal and anyone familar with it understands that their point of view is primarily how political activity affects the market and hence people's investments. I subscribe to various newletters etc etc etc. To suggest that the only basis for someone to use chavez-esque, amateur, dictator backdoor assualt and fiat singly because they watch Fox News is as liberals are fond of saying "disingenious" and short sighted to suggest that people limit their views based on Fox News.
What you didn't say and what I believe to be true is that these terms accurately describe this artful dodger.

You are far too intelligent to actually believe your above-mentioned post but I congratulate you on a good college try. Finally given the poor character of Obama I am surprised that you would throw your support behind him

Personal Best Regard

[Guest]

[QUOTE=Guest;507041]buggyone: Just so you know I watch Fox News but I also watch other news casts from NBC, CBS, ABC etc. I read the Wall Street Journal and anyone familar with it understands that their point of view is primarily how political activity affects the market and hence people's investments. I subscribe to various newletters etc etc etc. To suggest that the only basis for someone to use chavez-esque, amateur, dictator backdoor assualt and fiat singly because they watch Fox News is as liberals are fond of saying "disingenious" and short sighted to suggest that people limit their views based on Fox News.
What you didn't say and what I believe to be true is that these terms accurately describe this artful dodger.


__________________________________________________ ___

Well, Rubicon, I have heard all these words on the rare occasions I have FOX News turned on. I do like the local FOX because I think their weather reporting is the best we have in the area. Yes, I do believe the posters who use those words are merely parrots without any original thought of their own.
I am not going to get goaded into an arguement about that, though. It was hilarious yesterday when the local FOX commentator had a Latino attorney on to deride the Executive Order to say it was illegal. The attorney praised it and said it was completely legal and a great move for the President to make. The commentator was actually stammering in trying to get the attorney to say words that Fox wanted to hear - they never came!

I am glad to see you are such a news hound. Perhaps you saw in this morinings Daily Sun that Mitt Romney had to back off his tough immigration stance due to President Obama's Executive Order. This is causing a big problem for the Republicans and they are flummoxed at this time. I wonder what they will try to do in response to the Executive Order.

[Guest]

Can someone please explain to me how and why this will benefit
WE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES????

Will we be "footing the bill" for the next two years for illegal aliens?

If their parents are still illegal and unable to buy a house, who is paying the school taxes?

What about health care? Will they continue to use "charity care" which was running rampant in New Jersey when I lived there....

Please...just explain the benefits to we citizens of this country...I am totally stumped and would appreciate any insight you guys could give me.

Excellent point, the answer is there no benefit to legal Americans, he thinks he is the President of the world, remember he has at least two relatives here illegally. I guess he thinks it is a matter of fairness for NON Americans!

[Guest]

[QUOTE=Guest;507041]buggyone: Just so you know I watch Fox News but I also watch other news casts from NBC, CBS, ABC etc. I read the Wall Street Journal and anyone familar with it understands that their point of view is primarily how political activity affects the market and hence people's investments. I subscribe to various newletters etc etc etc. To suggest that the only basis for someone to use chavez-esque, amateur, dictator backdoor assualt and fiat singly because they watch Fox News is as liberals are fond of saying "disingenious" and short sighted to suggest that people limit their views based on Fox News.
What you didn't say and what I believe to be true is that these terms accurately describe this artful dodger.


__________________________________________________ ___

Well, Rubicon, I have heard all these words on the rare occasions I have FOX News turned on. I do like the local FOX because I think their weather reporting is the best we have in the area. Yes, I do believe the posters who use those words are merely parrots without any original thought of their own.
I am not going to get goaded into an arguement about that, though. It was hilarious yesterday when the local FOX commentator had a Latino attorney on to deride the Executive Order to say it was illegal. The attorney praised it and said it was completely legal and a great move for the President to make. The commentator was actually stammering in trying to get the attorney to say words that Fox wanted to hear - they never came!

I am glad to see you are such a news hound. Perhaps you saw in this morinings Daily Sun that Mitt Romney had to back off his tough immigration stance due to President Obama's Executive Order. This is causing a big problem for the Republicans and they are flummoxed at this time. I wonder what they will try to do in response to the Executive Order.

Buggy, the only reason you "accuse" people of getting info from FOX News is to demean the poster in an allusion to being some sort of mindless dolt who would have no clue otherwise.

The idea that anyone would have to defend watching the most watched cable new network on television to you is ludicrous anyway.

You get your ideas and false conclusions from some of the most odious left wing rags and broadcasts that man can devise............ (how did that feel)

I just said that to make a point, that your intentions in doing what you do in this regard is to hurt. I'm just saying.

[Guest]

How many more ways can Mitt Romney say nothing about reversing President Obama's cabinet-level directive on immigration? First he said he would veto the bill if passed by congress if he were president, then he said he would repeal the law when president. Today on "Face the Nation" Bob Scheiffer asked him three times if he would repeal it. Here is how he avoided the question again.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/17/mitt-romney-immigration_n_1603549.html


http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entries/romney-refuses-to-say-if-hell-reverse-obamas

Vice Presidential hopeful Tim Pawlenty flays President Obama for failing to pass the Dream Act through congress, on ABC's This Week today. Does Pawlenty believe the GOP was wrong to block it in the senate?

[Guest]

How many more ways can Mitt Romney say nothing about reversing President Obama's cabinet-level directive on immigration? First he said he would veto the bill if passed by congress if he were president, then he said he would repeal the law when president. Today on "Face the Nation" Bob Scheiffer asked him three times if he would repeal it. Here is how he avoided the question again.



Romney Refuses To Say If He'll Reverse Obama's Immigration Move | TPM Livewire (http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entries/romney-refuses-to-say-if-hell-reverse-obamas)

Vice Presidential hopeful Tim Pawlenty flays President Obama for failing to pass the Dream Act through congress, on ABC's This Week today. Does Pawlenty believe the GOP was wrong to block it in the senate?

Frankly, Romney was right on !!!!!

This "stunt" will be reversed or changed dramatically no matter who is elected, and there are yet to be any "rules" of his stunt announcement. It was a great political stunt, that I will admit, but that is what it is. It is simply ANOTHER political move using our country as a toy to advance a political plan.

He totally ignored the issue for years.....and no matter how inept congress may be, and they are, he is the President and needs to supply leadership. Both sides in congress are blocking each other at every turn and this man does not even talk to his own party.

It is a stunt, and except for those he aimed it at, it will and is being seen as such.

Why folks take pride, and you actually are not seeing much of that except for those who are party trolls , in such an action is something that is beyond me and most others of any import. Most are not even discussing it as they know full well why it was done and it just lessens any respect left for this man.

To do this in an election year for no apparent reason, other than "its the right thing to do" is being treated as it should be....a stunt that is again using people. I suppose it just became the "right thing to do" !!!

[Guest]

still waiting for the Obama supporters reply to why they think this amnesty vote buying charade is a good deal for America?

Same question raised in several threads by some of us and the same eerie silence. Must be on the do not discuss or answer list. Or the responses have not been distributed yet!

Or it is the continuation of as long as Obama did it, said it....it is OK.

:shrug:

btk

[Guest]

still waiting for the Obama supporters reply to why they think this amnesty vote buying charade is a good deal for America?

Same question raised in several threads by some of us and the same eerie silence. Must be on the do not discuss or answer list. Or the responses have not been distributed yet!

Or it is the continuation of as long as Obama did it, said it....it is OK.

:shrug:

btk


The only "positive" was by a poster who suggested it would be great for the Villages in that they would know that the landscapers and folk working with the concrete would show up for work.

An extremely racial remark, and a great example of profiling but thus far the only comment that allowed something positive can come out of it.

[Guest]

The waiting is the hardest part....:doh:

[Guest]

[QUOTE=Guest;507041]buggyone: Just so you know I watch Fox News but I also watch other news casts from NBC, CBS, ABC etc. I read the Wall Street Journal and anyone familar with it understands that their point of view is primarily how political activity affects the market and hence people's investments. I subscribe to various newletters etc etc etc. To suggest that the only basis for someone to use chavez-esque, amateur, dictator backdoor assualt and fiat singly because they watch Fox News is as liberals are fond of saying "disingenious" and short sighted to suggest that people limit their views based on Fox News.
What you didn't say and what I believe to be true is that these terms accurately describe this artful dodger.


__________________________________________________ ___

Well, Rubicon, I have heard all these words on the rare occasions I have FOX News turned on. I do like the local FOX because I think their weather reporting is the best we have in the area. Yes, I do believe the posters who use those words are merely parrots without any original thought of their own.
I am not going to get goaded into an arguement about that, though. It was hilarious yesterday when the local FOX commentator had a Latino attorney on to deride the Executive Order to say it was illegal. The attorney praised it and said it was completely legal and a great move for the President to make. The commentator was actually stammering in trying to get the attorney to say words that Fox wanted to hear - they never came!

I am glad to see you are such a news hound. Perhaps you saw in this morinings Daily Sun that Mitt Romney had to back off his tough immigration stance due to President Obama's Executive Order. This is causing a big problem for the Republicans and they are flummoxed at this time. I wonder what they will try to do in response to the Executive Order.

buggyone: Obama's stunt has created a big problem for both Republicans and Democrats because Obama has flummoxed them all but the biggest loser is going to be Obama himself. Do you believe as a Democrat Senator or Congressman that you would have any respect or confidence in a guy that governs by fiat in a Chavez-esque manner? Yes I used those Fox Noise two words again, except Chavez-esque is mine and fiat is used by most news outlets Obama's own party is turning on him .

[Guest]

[quote=buggyone;507082]

buggyone: Obama's stunt has created a big problem for both Republicans and Democrats because Obama has flummoxed them all but the biggest loser is going to be Obama himself. Do you believe as a Democrat Senator or Congressman that you would have any respect or confidence in a guy that governs by fiat in a Chavez-esque manner? Yes I used those Fox Noise two words again, except Chavez-esque is mine and fiat is used by most news outlets Obama's own party is turning on him .

Yes, definitely Democrat Senators or Congressmen will have a lot of respect for this President who knows how to get things done when a Tea Party-esque House will not do any compromising and is mule stubborn.

I am happy you are able to drive around in your Fiat and hope that Chavez gives you all the gasoline you need for coining a term.

[Guest]

[quote=rubicon;507148]

Yes, definitely Democrat Senators or Congressmen will have a lot of respect for this President who knows how to get things done when a Tea Party-esque House will not do any compromising and is mule stubborn.

I am happy you are able to drive around in your Fiat and hope that Chavez gives you all the gasoline you need for coining a term.

In leftist-speak:

"compromise" means you agree with us.

It also means that when Obama proposes a budget and all vote against it, it's still blamed on Republicans.

When Bush acted it was high treason; when Obama acts it's OMG, he's brilliant; I have tingles going up my leg.

[Guest]

I really would like RichieLion to defend his statement of;"When Bush acted it was high treason" with some examples.

Could he be thinking of lying about WMDs in order to involve the US with an illegal war with Iraq? Well, those lies did cost the US trillions of dollars and wasted over 4,400 American lives.

Invading Iraq really does not compare with the newly signed DREAM Act by an Executive Order, in my opinion.

What are some examples of the "high treason" that liberals tie to Bush?

[Guest]

I really would like RichieLion to defend his statement of;"When Bush acted it was high treason" with some examples.

Could he be thinking of lying about WMDs in order to involve the US with an illegal war with Iraq? Well, those lies did cost the US trillions of dollars and wasted over 4,400 American lives.

Invading Iraq really does not compare with the newly signed DREAM Act by an Executive Order, in my opinion.

What are some examples of the "high treason" that liberals tie to Bush?

From July 2008..

"Barack Obama told House Democrats on Tuesday that as president he would order his attorney general to scour White House executive orders and expunge any that "trample on liberty," several lawmakers said."

From November 2001...

"WASHINGTON - One historian calls it a ``disaster for history,'' but the White House insists a new executive order issued by President Bush balances the public's right to see the records of past presidents with a need to protect national security.

Advocates for the release of government documents say the executive order violates the spirit of the 1978 Presidential Records Act and will usher in a new era of secrecy for papers left behind by America's chief executives. "

From July 2007 (concerning interragation of prisoners)

"Rights activists criticized Bush's order for failing to spell out which techniques are now approved or prohibited. It said instead that CIA interrogators cannot undertake prohibited acts such as torture and murder, and it barred religious denigration and humiliating or degrading treatment "so serious that any reasonable person, considering the circumstances, would deem" it "beyond the bounds of human decency." Detainees, it said, must be provided with "the basic necessities of life," including adequate food and water, clothing, essential medical care, and "protection from extremes of heat and cold."

From Jan 2007 (regarding rules and policy to govern over public health and safety)

"Consumer, labor and environmental groups denounced the executive order, saying it gave too much control to the White House and would hinder agencies’ efforts to protect the public."

From July 2007...

"It would seem that George Bush has found a way to “legally” put an end to any criticism of his war in Iraq. The new Executive Order expands his powers on earlier ones and at first glance appears to be designed to stop the funding of terrorists. However, like any legal document, it is wise to read the “small print” before accepting it."

These are a few...any more, just ask !!!

American Chronicle | New Executive Order from Bush could make Iraq war criticism illegal! (http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/view/32773)

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/30/washington/30rules.html?pagewanted=all

Bush Approves New CIA Methods (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/20/AR2007072001264.html)

Critics Blast Bush Order on Papers (http://www.commondreams.org/headlines01/1102-01.htm)

Obama Would Order Review Of Bush's Executive Orders (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/07/30/obama-would-order-review_n_115782.html)

[Guest]

Good job RAGS...and add this to the list...

"As he eyes re-election, President Obama is increasingly flexing his executive muscle to outflank congressional Republicans, even though he railed against such expansive uses of presidential power as a candidate in 2008.

Over the past week alone, Obama pushed through the appointment of a consumer-protection agency head opposed by Senate Republicans, unveiled a plan to recast the U.S. military and slash defense spending and issued new rules allowing some illegal immigrants to remain in the country while they apply for legal status. Obama not only acted without congressional approval, but, in many cases, despite strenuous congressional opposition. "

Obama flexing same powers he once criticized | Campaign 2012 | Washington Examiner (http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/article/obama-flexing-same-powers-he-once-criticized/307821)

Not exactly the same things but another item he was criticizing folks for and demeaning them and now strides right into the same things...he is and always has been a hypocrite of the highest order !!!

[Guest]

Good job RAGS...and add this to the list...

"As he eyes re-election, President Obama is increasingly flexing his executive muscle to outflank congressional Republicans, even though he railed against such expansive uses of presidential power as a candidate in 2008.

Over the past week alone, Obama pushed through the appointment of a consumer-protection agency head opposed by Senate Republicans, unveiled a plan to recast the U.S. military and slash defense spending and issued new rules allowing some illegal immigrants to remain in the country while they apply for legal status. Obama not only acted without congressional approval, but, in many cases, despite strenuous congressional opposition. "

Obama flexing same powers he once criticized | Campaign 2012 | Washington Examiner (http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/article/obama-flexing-same-powers-he-once-criticized/307821)

Not exactly the same things but another item he was criticizing folks for and demeaning them and now strides right into the same things...he is and always has been a hypocrite of the highest order !!!

President Obama recess-appointed Richard Cordray to be CFPB Chief on January 4, 2012, not last week as reported above. Immediately following the appointment, Speaker John Boehner threatened to file a lawsuit. Still waiting for that lawsuit to be filed almost six month later.


Obama Bucks GOP, Nominates CFPB Chief | The Nation (http://www.thenation.com/blog/165446/obama-bucks-gop-nominates-cfpb-chief)

[Guest]

Thanks Rags and Bucco for clearing up things that Buggy clearly has expunged from his memory.

I was being treated to a fine Father's Day outing and was not available earlier to comment, and find I don't need to with such competent researchers as you guys here.

[Guest]

Thanks Rags and Bucco for clearing up things that Buggy clearly has expunged from his memory.

I was being treated to a fine Father's Day outing and was not available earlier to comment, and find I don't need to with such competent researchers as you guys here.

I saw nothing that "liberals" were saying that Bush was guilty of high treason.

Enjoy driving your new Fiat.

[Guest]

Please do not direct comments at another user.

[Guest]

Finally, at noon today (Thursday), we should finally hear what Mitt Romney would do about illegal immigration when he speaks to the National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials in Orlando. Since President Obama's announcement last Friday, Romney has sucessfully ducked the question.

[Guest]

ducking a question should not be a problem as we have been conditioned by it in the normal course of the current administration for the last 4 years.

Romney being a novice politician by comparison may even incorporate a little tell them what they want to hear which we have also bee exposed to for the last 4 years.

So in essence there isn't anything Romney can say or not say that will be unacceptable using the Obama administration and partisan measuring stick.

The approach certainly hasn't affected the Obama supporters to date.

btk

[Guest]

Finally, at noon today (Thursday), we should finally hear what Mitt Romney would do about illegal immigration when he speaks to the National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials in Orlando. Since President Obama's announcement last Friday, Romney has sucessfully ducked the question.

i'd rather hear what the supreme court is going to say about obamacare! ;)

i doubt the mittster will say much more than obama did not do enough to solve the larger immigration problem for all the years he has been in office.

[Guest]

it seems like while all the dems are puffing about the great scoop their leader has delivered...the back door amnesty....there remains the much larger issue of what to do about illegal immigration in general.

Obama's latest "splinter" is that supposed to constitute problem solved?

There is very much more to be said to the latinos including the need to stop illegal immigration as it continues today. There are those in that group that will understand and accept there is a way to get into this country and it is the legal method that all other immigrants must and do under take.

The question is like are you still beating your wife....either answer creates a problem.

So just ask a latino if they think we should continue ILLEGAL immigration when there is a worry free process undergone by millions before them.

So Romney has much that is right to talk to them that most that are affected by Obama's "splinter" will know and understand and agree with.

How can ANYBODY argue against the merits of the existing laws against ILLEGAL immigration?

btk

[Guest]

I do not think some really "get it" when they are saying all illegal immigrants should be arrested and deported. Even Newt Gingrich had a fair idea when he suggested that "church going illegals who have been in the USA for 25 years" should be left alone. Sort of ridiculous to give qualifications like that but his heart was in the right place.

Can you imagine the chaos that would take place if all the illegals were arrested over a short time period? What about the children who know nothing of their foreign language or heritage? What about the children who are American citizens because of birth?

Sure, you can talk of illegals being arrested and deported but it is not feasible to do for so many different reasons.

[Guest]

President Obama will be speaking to the National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials at 1:50pm today (Friday) in Orlando. It will be interesting to see what reception he gets compared to Mitt Romney's tepid welcome yesterday.

It's been reported that Senator Marco Rubio got a slightly more enthusiatic reception than Romney did yesterday, but still over all tepid welcome.

Governor Rick Scott, Jeb Bush and Rubio all are publicly breaking with Romney on issues, it was reported, possibly because they expect him to lose in Nov.