New Sinkhole in St. James on Edenville Path.

[graciegirl]

We went to check on interior of friends home in St. James and passed a very wide but not very deep sink hole 2'-3' it looked like from the car in the 2500 block of Edenville path. It is the side toward the pond. It came right up to the base of the person's home in the side and front yard.

The ponds are up everywhere past the treelines and they are running sprinklers everywhere to get them to come down.

[MadisonandParker]

Did you report it to the villages???

[graciegirl]

Did you report it to the villages???

They already had a bunch of trucks and yellow tape and all. Some of the trucks were Comcast.

[Bogie Shooter]

Did you report it to the villages???

Village watch picks up those kind of things on their rounds.

[kentucky blue]

:$:We went to check on interior of friends home in St. James and passed a very wide but not very deep sink hole 2'-3' it looked like from the car in the 2500 block of Edenville path. It is the side toward the pond. It came right up to the base of the person's home in the side and front yard.

The ponds are up everywhere past the treelines and they are running sprinklers everywhere to get them to come down.

I am hoping that this sinkhole will be an isolated incident,but i doubt it.With all the rainfall we've had , the redirecting of the water by way of storm sewers,and the rock formations underground it does not look good.Just gives the insurance companies more ammunition to increase future premiums and deductibles.Before long they will all completely stop writing sinkhole coverage .:$:

[justjim]

Karl says 8.11" of rain in the Sunday 24 hr. period. There is more since and yes sinkholes could develop with this kind of rainfall.

[anlashokna]

I was just posting something on Fenwick Loop down here in Sanibel too. Saw all the golf course sprinkler activity and some localized flooding on a few courses on my drive down from LSL this morning. The activity on fewick looked like there was some sort of engineer over there overseeing all the dump trucks and bulldozing and of course there will be asphalt repair to come. This morning it looked fine..this evening evidently something major happened. That was alot of dump trucks and the lot also back to a large pond as well. Have been watching the pond since its WAY up too.

[Roaddog53]

I thought I would add my two cents I researched and talked to one of the builders about. NOT a supt but the builder. With all of the rain, people are so worried about sinkholes. I too was worried and asked. He told me, than went out to "prove" it on a site with a cavity. He had a 5 ft rod with a T-handle. he pushed down in various areas. It went down about 3 ft in every area along a stretch from the side of the house to the back. Some areas more than others. Especially on newer homes, the utility (cable/power) underground lines are trenched. Due to the rains, these "settle" more so they feel squishy and sink down some. As he plotted along I could see what he was talking about. the cable or power companies, and The Villages are out there with their trucks and backhoes filling these back in AND making sure the lines are fine. Sounds like wha tthis one may have been.

[A-4 Skyhawk]

Thanks anlashokna and Roaddog53 for the information and PM on what's going on down on Fenwick Loop. We just bought there and are preparing to move this weekend. If you or anyone else hear any more about what's happening we'd sure like to hear from you. This sure rattled our cage when we read it.
Thanks again,
A-4

[anlashokna]

Its the nature of the land A-4. Long drought and heavy rains equal ground movement/erosion. We were jittery about it but as many homes built down here its a small percentage thing. But wakes you up when something happens nearby! Like I said not I was thinking wash out but with the amount of dirt and bulldozing its strikes more of a fill/fix. Maybe the paper will have something on this in the paper. (fenwick one).

[Down Sized]

As for sink hole coverage .they would not write me coverage last week on my house. Liberty

[glgene]

Are sink holes more prevalent in newly-constructed areas vs. established neighborhoods?
Or the same risk regardless?

Gene

[A-4 Skyhawk]

As for sink hole coverage .they would not write me coverage last week on my house. Liberty

I just got sink hole coverage on my new homeowners from The Villages Insurance. House and contents about $22 a year

[redwitch]

This is actually second hole that I know of on Edenville -- the other was about 5 houses down from this one. Neither of these were very deep sinkholes and both were quickly repaired by TV. Hopefully, this new one will cause no damage to the home -- the last one didn't.

What was interesting was watching a diver do some work on the pond yesterday -- not exactly sure what was being done. I'd guess something to do with pumps or drainage (that pond is FULL!!!).

The explanation about utilities and sand certainly makes sense to me. At least it seems to be a quick and easy fix.

[GatorFan]

These would be catastrophic ground collapse not sinkhole. If home damaged it would be covered by homeowners insurance.

[CarGuys]

$22 a year must be a typo $220 more like it

[2 Oldcrabs]

[QUOTE=Roaddog53;511777] It went down about 3 ft in every area along a stretch from the side of the house to the back. Some areas more than others. Especially on newer homes, the utility (cable/power) underground lines are trenched. Due to the rains, these "settle" more so they feel squishy and sink down some.

I use to install power lines for a utility. If it is a straight line from the "green box" to the meter on the side of the house, about 3' deep and about 1' wide ( you can check with a wooden broom handle), it is normal settlement from the utility lines. If it is "round in nature" you may have a sink hole.:(

[flhogi]

I live in the house on st james that yard wash away.
First of all it has not been determed that it was a sink hole and not a wash away. There has been a few houses that have had problems on this street. They have all been near drainage pipes. My feelings are they didn't seal the pipes properly and all the rain is causing a vacum effect and the soil is being draned though the pipes. and believe me the hole was alot bigger then 2-3 feet. Before you post something get your facts and don't start RUMORS

[flhogi]

The villages watch didn't report it. I did when I took my dog out for a walk. It's my house.

[flhogi]

It is my house on Edenville Path The hole was alot bigger then 2-3 feet It was twenty feet in diamator and 10-12 feet deep it was three differant holes they arre all being caused by the drainage pipes there have been three houses that have had problems all three have been near drainage pipes. They are not sink holes they are wash aways. Don't start rumors get your facts start this is a good site to start rumors.
Okay today found out it was a sinkhole June 28th 2012

[Opulence]

I am so sorry to hear that your new home has suffered sinkhole damage. My heart goes out to you. I can only imagine how I would feel. I trust you are safe and out of harms way and that this is an easy fix for you.

Betty

[Posh 08]

The villages watch didn't report it. I did when I took my dog out for a walk. It's my house.

So sorry to hear that. Hope things work out for you.

[graciegirl]

It is my house on Edenville Path The hole was alot bigger then 2-3 feet It was twenty feet in diamator and 10-12 feet deep it was three differant holes they arre all being caused by the drainage pipes there have been three houses that have had problems all three have been near drainage pipes. They are not sink holes they are wash aways. Don't start rumors get your facts start this is a good site to start rumors.

I am so sorry that is was deeper than it looked. And glad they were not sinkholes. I am sorry that I incorrectly reported what happened, but sorrier that you have had this very unfortunate situation occur in your yard. I hope it will be completely remedied soon.

You are right about this site being a good one to start rumors. This time I am at fault and I am very sorry to have worried anyone.

[hotrodgirl]

I am very saddened to hear about your home. I hope you have not lost too much. I hope you are staying somewhere safe as I imagine you were told to leave until things can be fixed? Wish I were there to offer some assistance. You also stated in your case this was a wash away as opposed to a sink hole. Would that be a case of the "fill" from the pipes being carried away by the water? I hope everything gets straightened around timely for you so you can enjoy your home again soon:pray:

[flhogi]

I have made a call to tvpm and haven't heard back yet. I think they are avoiding us.

[graciegirl]

I have made a call to tvpm and haven't heard back yet. I think they are avoiding us.

What is tvpm?

[jnieman]

These would be catastrophic ground collapse not sinkhole. If home damaged it would be covered by homeowners insurance.

Catastrophic ground collapse is when most or all of your house falls into a big sinkhole and the home becomes unliveable. You would have to lose your home occupancy permit to be covered by the catastrophic ground collapse insurance.

[Nipper]

I have homeowners insurance through The Villages. I live in Winifred (2004). In January, I asked about sink hole insurance. I was told that the property would have to be inspected for $140 and chances of being approved for SH insurance was small. We had the inspection, and we were not approved. No inside cracks. A couple of hairline cracks in exterior stucco. Someone said I could thank Gov. Scott for the refusal of sink hole insurance. And yes, this wonderful governor is in the pockets of the insurance companies.

"Recent amendments to Florida insurance laws have changed insurance companies' legal obligations to cover homes, condominiums and commercial buildings damaged by sinkholes. Despite considerable controversy over the effect on insurance consumers, Senate Bill 408 passed with solid majorities in the Florida House and Senate and was signed by Governor Rick Scott last May" (2011).


Sweeping home insurance changes become law with Scott's blessing | House Keys blog (http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/business/realestate/housekeys/blog/2011/05/scott_signs_sweeping_home_insu.html)

[LAshby50]

We are building on the rentention pond on Fenwick Loop in October. Our lanai should face east and the lot is more on the northeast corner. Interested in any reports from that area. We are in Minnesota now and will not be in TV until mid-September.

[graciegirl]

I have made a call to tvpm and haven't heard back yet. I think they are avoiding us.

What is tvpm?

I went by your home again today in the car and it looked like a lot of it is filled in. I hope things will all soon be fixed.

I went over to meet the window guy who came to fix my friends window. She is off campus. Another leak from driving rain that seemed to come mainly from the south east.

[CarGuys]

I am also sad you went through this " Drainage event? " It must have you concerned. Did the home suffer much stress and cracking inside? The picture looked like the slab was holding together?

Please keep us posted on how TV handles this for you an other neighbors. Your vacuum effect analgy sounds right. Like a underwater air lift that divers use for recovery.

That had to be a Giant Village Opps who goofed on this one?

[graciegirl]

I am also sad you went through this " Drainage event? " It must have you concerned. Did the home suffer much stress and cracking inside? The picture looked like the slab was holding together?

Please keep us posted on how TV handles this for you an other neighbors. Your vacuum effect analgy sounds right. Like a underwater air lift that divers use for recovery.

That had to be a Giant Village Opps who goofed on this one?

Car. Unless I have missed something, no one posted a picture of this home. I think you may have this one confused with the one in Belvedere or near Belvedere. This one is not a sinkhole according to the homeowner. I don't remember anything said by this homeowner about any vacuum sound either. I think you have the two confused.

[Posh 08]

What is tvpm?

I went by your home again today in the car and it looked like a lot of it is filled in. I hope things will all soon be fixed.

I went over to meet the window guy who came to fix my friends window. She is off campus. Another leak from driving rain that seemed to come mainly from the south east.

We have driving rain and snow here too but never any leaks. How come ya'll get them?

[anarick]

First of all we are very sorry for all who suffered damage this week. Our prayers are with you.
We have a lot in Fernandina where the storm drain is almost directly in front of it. Reading this thread has caused my wife and I to reconsider the lot location.
Will it make a difference to change lot location? I mean, if it was drain damage, aren't the drains running all over the place?

[CaptJohn]

First of all we are very sorry for all who suffered damage this week. Our prayers are with you.
We have a lot in Fernandina where the storm drain is almost directly in front of it. Reading this thread has caused my wife and I to reconsider the lot location.
Will it make a difference to change lot location? I mean, if it was drain damage, aren't the drains running all over the place?

I would think anything that survived this storm intact has proven itself. This was a good test. I would only be concerned if there was damage then there might be repeated damage in the future. To me this is the best time (after a big storm) to go shopping for property.

[graciegirl]

It seems that the poster is right who said that we had been through a bad period of drought and then we get eight inches of rain in 24 hours. He said we will probably see more sinkholes. (I think it was Skip and he is usually right)

It strikes fear in all of our hearts, especially when you see pictures of big gaping holes in the landscape. It is a real possibility that it could happen to YOU.

It seems that sinkholes happen in new areas and older areas as well.

If only we knew how to decide what is the safest place to choose.

One thing is that it is just not here in The Villages, and it isn't caused by human error. AND the risk isn't huge...of course until it happens to you.

Is there a statue you can bury for this? ;)

[anarick]

I would think anything that survived this storm intact has proven itself. This was a good test. I would only be concerned if there was damage then there might be repeated damage in the future. To me this is the best time (after a big storm) to go shopping for property.

We won't be visiting till Oct. would appreciate if i can get a damage report from anyone passing by Fernandina Unit 205 between Anna Maria St & Allaire Loop.

[CaptJohn]

It seems that sinkholes happen in new areas and older areas as well.

If only we knew how to decide what is the safest place to choose.

One thing is that it is just not here in The Villages, and it isn't caused by human error. AND the risk isn't huge...of course until it happens to you.

Is there a statue you can bury for this? ;)

Yes, sinkholes' locations are natures' work. People can only hope and pray.
There is some below ground testing available. I may get into that business.

From what I've read, Pasco County is the worst for sinkholes.

The statue would probably sink or wash away! :laugh:

[MadisonandParker]

What do they do for a sinkhole any ways??:confused:

[A-4 Skyhawk]

$22 a year must be a typo $220 more like it

$22 a year is correct. The entire policy is $538 a year. Sink Hole Coverage is $17.21 and Sink Hole Coverage (contents) is $4.50. That's $21.71

[jimbo2012]

I just got sink hole coverage on my new homeowners from The Villages Insurance. House and contents about $22 a year

I called that same agency today to get a quote on our future build, they said there is no way to get full sinkhole, this coverage is for catastrophic only, as required.

Just don't want you to think you have what you don't, sorry but that was what I was told & confirmed by email.

[RedChariot]

We have catastraphic, flood, and sinkhole coverage from Sumter-Marion agency. Not cheap.

[A-4 Skyhawk]

I called that same agency today to get a quote on our future build, they said there is no way to get full sinkhole, this coverage is for catastrophic only, as required.

Just don't want you to think you have what you don't, sorry but that was what I was told & confirmed by email.

So today I called my Villages Insurance Agent at Colony Plaza and asked her, "if a sink hole developes under my house and the whole thing falls in or maybe just a corner of it, what do I get for $22 a year?" She said I get it replaced or fixed with no OOP. If the hole is in the front yard, that would be my hole. This rate is only available on new, not resales. I'm not an insurance expert. All I know is you have to have it. She explained it well. I'm Happy.
A-4 Skyhawk

[jimbo2012]

I was told that if the house was not ruled uninhabitable (meaning) total catastrophe say the hole only went a little bit under the house causing big cracks in the foundation & walls, you can still live in it, they are not paying.

That damage can be tens of thousands $$$ to fix, out of pocket.

If we had complete sinkhole coverage which is not available even on new, they would have paid.

Anyone else care to chime in on this?

[mulligan]

The assumption there is that the house is condemned. If it is just damage , you may have a problem.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

See this for various definitions, including "catastrophic ground collapse" and "sinkhole":

627.706 - Sinkhole insurance catastrophic ground cover collapse definitions. - 2010 Florida Statutes - The Florida Senate (http://www.flsenate.gov/laws/statutes/2010/627.706)

Bill :)

[jimbo2012]

Bill in that link this is the heart of it

YOUR POLICY PROVIDES COVERAGE FOR A CATASTROPHIC GROUND COVER COLLAPSE THAT RESULTS IN THE PROPERTY BEING CONDEMNED AND UNINHABITABLE. OTHERWISE, YOUR POLICY DOES NOT PROVIDE COVERAGE FOR SINKHOLE LOSSES.

YOU MAY PURCHASE ADDITIONAL COVERAGE FOR SINKHOLE LOSSES FOR AN ADDITIONAL PREMIUM, but that is next to impossible

Agree?

[Bill-n-Brillo]

jimbo, my personal knowledge on sinkhole coverage availability dates to March of this year - the last time I spoke with our insurance company. I called to pose the question to them about coverage availability and was told at that time they were unaware of any companies which were refusing to write sinkhole coverage in any specific areas.

Here's my entire post subsequent to that discussion:

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/464361-post192.html

So I really don't know that I'd go with the concept of "next to impossible".......but things could have changed dramatically over the past couple of months. That's the part I don't know about.

Logic would dictate that Brightway has more bases covered than some of the other insurance agencies given that they represent so many of the companies currently writing HO policies in FL. They would have better insight as to what companies are actually writing sinkhole coverage and which ones might not be.

Bill :)

[CarGuys]

So today I called my Villages Insurance Agent at Colony Plaza and asked her, "if a sink hole developes under my house and the whole thing falls in or maybe just a corner of it, what do I get for $22 a year?" She said I get it replaced or fixed with no OOP. If the hole is in the front yard, that would be my hole. This rate is only available on new, not resales. I'm not an insurance expert. All I know is you have to have it. She explained it well. I'm Happy.
A-4 Skyhawk

I have the same company and I'm taking you in with me next year for renewal. Ours was not $22 a year?

[A-4 Skyhawk]

I have the same company and I'm taking you in with me next year for renewal. Ours was not $22 a year?

God forbid I have to go to China some day to find my house:ohdear: That's when I'll find out how much my $22 got me.:boom:

[flhogi]

What is tvpm?

I'm sorry I meant thdm The villages district maintance. I has been ruled a sink hole. This morning tv went into the drain pipe and found it to be leaking. If we have a good rain storm the hole with apear again. Tv seem to be taking thier sweet time in correcting this problem. I quess we might have to start calling all the newspapers in fl all except the sun. Tv own that paper.
Any hole that forms for any reason is deemed a sink hole in fl. By law they can't cancel your ins for making a claim. They can and will raise your rate.

[flhogi]

I have heard from a friend who is also buliding over there they have had ywo sink holes

[graciegirl]

I am reviving this OLD thread to try to point out that I really do not just post positive stuff all the time. THIS IS AN OLD THREAD.

There are sinkholes here. There are sinkholes in Florida. See this map.

http://fcit.usf.edu/florida/maps/galleries/sinkholes/index.php

[optv13sp]

Does anyone know how/if this was resolved? Was it due to drainage pipes? Is there a greater risk of problems if there is a storm drainage on/near one's lot?

[gjbl8114]

:$:

I am hoping that this sinkhole will be an isolated incident,but i doubt it.With all the rainfall we've had , the redirecting of the water by way of storm sewers,and the rock formations underground it does not look good.Just gives the insurance companies more ammunition to increase future premiums and deductibles.Before long they will all completely stop writing sinkhole coverage .:$:

Sure hope those villagers in "swamp land" those beautiful, expensive new Villas at Hacienda on 466 all have sinkhole coverage. Couldn't understand why the developers continued to build there when they had issues before completing their final builds. Whoaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!

[Bill-n-Brillo]

Does anyone know how/if this was resolved? Was it due to drainage pipes? Is there a greater risk of problems if there is a storm drainage on/near one's lot?

Yes, it's long since been resolved. This particular problem was determined to be likely due to the underground storm water drain pipe between the two houses (pipe from the street drain to the pond behind the houses) having an ill-fitting connection between two sections of the pipe. TV had crews inspect the pipe (as in had divers come up the pipe from the water-side!), pumped in "grout" (as they called it) to seal around the entire problem area, backfilled the eroded hole, resodded, and everything's been fine since.

Was it a sinkhole? Logic dictated in this situation that they found the cause of the problem, fixed it........and it seems likely this wasn't a sinkhole. But nobody will ever put in writing that it was or it wasn't.

Bill :)

[gerryann]

Sure hope those villagers in "swamp land" those beautiful, expensive new Villas at Hacienda on 466 all have sinkhole coverage. Couldn't understand why the developers continued to build there when they had issues before completing their final builds. Whoaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!

Why do YOU keep bringing up problems at Mission Hills?? There are not now nor before any sinkholes in this village. You say you don't live here and you say they are overpriced...why do you care since you don't live here?? A year ago you posted the same thing. This was posted a year ago by you...

Has anyone noticed the sudden stop in building on these sites?? Rather interesting that one sink hole has already been reported there.. What's one to expect for homes built on what was once marsh land that has been filled to the brink!! Let's see - close to the road, backed up by marsh land and really close to golf cart path and overly priced... Interested buyers should check out the Appraiser's office and check out the soil type on which these expensive villas are built!!! Yes, they're attractive, but would you be wise to buy on that alone. Better check out this neighborhood before you buy....

In fact when reviewing all your previous posts, everyone is negative.

[NIPAS K-9]

please tell me all you know of that area i am looking at a villa there. thanks a Why do YOU keep bringing up problems at Mission Hills?? There are not now nor before any sinkholes in this village. You say you don't live here and you say they are overpriced...why do you care since you don't live here?? A year ago you posted the same thing. This was posted a year ago by you...

Has anyone noticed the sudden stop in building on these sites?? Rather interesting that one sink hole has already been reported there.. What's one to expect for homes built on what was once marsh land that has been filled to the brink!! Let's see - close to the road, backed up by marsh land and really close to golf cart path and overly priced... Interested buyers should check out the Appraiser's office and check out the soil type on which these expensive villas are built!!! Yes, they're attractive, but would you be wise to buy on that alone. Better check out this neighborhood before you buy....

In fact when reviewing all your previous posts, everyone is negative.

[Mack184]

I am reviving this OLD thread to try to point out that I really do not just post positive stuff all the time. THIS IS AN OLD THREAD.

There are sinkholes here. There are sinkholes in Florida. See this map.

Sinkhole Maps of Florida Counties (http://fcit.usf.edu/florida/maps/galleries/sinkholes/index.php)
As our insurance agent said to us: "If there's a sinkhole in TV you'll never hear about it in The Sun."

[gerryann]

please tell me all you know of that area i am looking at a villa there. thanks a

It's beautiful with great folks living there. Its quiet, very social, beautiful pool, and much more. However, I do not believe any new ones are left for sale. Last week there was one left and I'm sure it's been sold by now. I'm sure there's a few rentals.

[optv13sp]

Bill,
Thank you so much for your reply. Your posts are always so helpful, informative, and respectful. You seem to be such a decent and caring person with so much knowledge that you are willing to share. I appreciate that very much.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

You're welcome, dloltv.....and thank YOU!

Bill :)

[graciegirl]

As our insurance agent said to us: "If there's a sinkhole in TV you'll never hear about it in The Sun."

Sorry, he is wrong. The picture of that sinkhole near a home, the big hole, a similar photograph was in The Sun along with a story when it happened some eight or so months ago.

[gpirate]

I just got sink hole coverage on my new homeowners from The Villages Insurance. House and contents about $22 a year

What does it cover in your policy for $22 a year? Sounds like a good deal to me.

[Quixote]

What is the deductible on sinkhole coverage on newly written policies? Thank you.

[janmcn]

What is the deductible on sinkhole coverage on newly written policies? Thank you.

It's been reported on other threads that the deductible is 10% of the value of the home, minus the value of the land. If this is incorrect, I'm sure it will be corrected.