Paul Ryan is the Pick

[Guest]

This choice will please the right wing and be chilling to some.

[Guest]

NBC News is confirming that Congressman Paul Ryan will be announced as the VP pick at 9:00am in Norfolk, VA. Now we can have that discussion about getting rid of those pesky socialist programs like Medicare and Social Security.

If you hate Medicare, you'll love Paul Ryan.

[Guest]

Paul Ryan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Ryan)

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2012/08/06/120806fa_fact_lizza

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/11/paul-ryan-mitt-romney_n_1684794.html?flv=1

http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Paul_Ryan.htm/


Seems like a shot in the foot for the Romney campaign. Ryan does look like someone who could run the US as President unlike say Sarah Palin, Joe Biden, Dick Cheney, and a number of other people. There was Chester Arthur, however, who looked like a lackey of the machine politics of the 1870s and 1880s when he was VP. Then, he became a force to be reckoned with when he became President after the assassination attempt and then death of James Garfield.

[Guest]

I say bring it on.

Paul Ryan is an outstanding pick.

The Obama cheerleaders in the media are already attacking him because of the budget he proposed last year. Well, let's have at it. Let's have a fight over substance. And let's expose Obama for the destructive leftist he is, and Biden for the weak dufus he is.

[Guest]

VIDEO: Paul Ryan took apart Obama and Obamacare -- in 6 minutes!


Paul Ryan: Hiding Spending Doesn't Reduce Spending - YouTube

[Guest]

"When Mitt Romney taps Rep. Paul Ryan to be his running mate on Saturday, he is picking someone who has already tangled toe-to-toe with President Obama on several occasions, and is prepared for the bruising battle ahead.

Indeed, Mr. Obama has built up plenty of bad blood with Mr. Ryan, calling him the architect of “social Darwinism” earlier this year, stemming from the Wisconsin Republican’s budget plan.

And last year Mr. Obama invited Mr. Ryan to sit in the front row of a budget speech as the president pointedly called his budget blueprint not “serious” — then a day later pointedly blasted Mr. Ryan to campaign donors in Chicago, saying he’s “the same guy that voted for two wars that were unpaid for, voted for the Bush tax cuts that were unpaid for, voted for the prescription drug bill that cost as much as my health care bill — but wasn’t paid for. So it’s not on the level. And we’ve got to keep on, you know, keep on shining a light on that.”

After one of those broadsides, Mr. Ryan fired back, saying he had hoped for more out of the president.

“Rather than building bridges, he’s poisoning wells,” the usually mild-mannered Mr. Ryan said. “Exploiting people’s emotions of fear, envy and anxiety is not hope; it’s not change. It’s partisanship. We don’t need partisanship. We don’t need demagoguery. We need solutions. And we don’t need to keep punting to other people to make tough decisions.”

Obama and Ryan have tangled repeatedly - Washington Times (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/aug/11/obama-and-ryan-have-tangled-repeatedly/)

[Guest]

I say bring it on.

Paul Ryan is an outstanding pick.

The Obama cheerleaders in the media are already attacking him because of the budget he proposed last year. Well, let's have at it. Let's have a fight over substance. And let's expose Obama for the destructive leftist he is, and Biden for the weak dufus he is.

VP Joe Biden was formerly Chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee for many years, and before that he was Chairman of the Judiciary Committee. Where is Congressman Paul Ryan's foreign relations experience? Mitt Romney needs all the help he can get in that regard, as became apparent on his recent overseas trip.

[Guest]

This is a SERIOUS and ADULT choice

[Guest]

This is a SERIOUS and ADULT choice

That will make Obama's victory look like child's play. :icon_wink:

[Guest]

VIDEO: Paul Ryan took apart Obama and Obamacare -- in 6 minutes!


Paul Ryan: Hiding Spending Doesn't Reduce Spending - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPxMZ1WdINs)

We're thinking alike this morning. I see this post of yours after I started a thread about this same video showing Ryan eviscerating ObamaCare to the solemn face of Obama and the dufus smirk of Biden.

This will be an interesting number of months coming.

[Guest]

NBC News is confirming that Congressman Paul Ryan will be announced as the VP pick at 9:00am in Norfolk, VA. Now we can have that discussion about getting rid of those pesky socialist programs like Medicare and Social Security.

If you hate Medicare, you'll love Paul Ryan.

some more nonsense

[Guest]

This could bring Florida completely to Obama. The good possibility of being able to play up the Medicare angle has David Axelrod jumping up and down with glee.

Without Florida, Romney loses.

[Guest]

This could bring Florida completely to Obama. The good possibility of being able to play up the Medicare angle has David Axelrod jumping up and down with glee.

Without Florida, Romney loses.

and Ohio.

[Guest]

This could bring Florida completely to Obama. The good possibility of being able to play up the Medicare angle has David Axelrod jumping up and down with glee.

Without Florida, Romney loses. :boxing2: Romney doesn't lose Florida with Ryan as VP pick. Romney would win Florida no matter who he picked as a running mate but with Ryan Florida definitely goes RED. Ohio is still a toss up.

[Guest]

Looks like Romney Advisor's went for "deficit reduction" as a main issue for which Ryan is "King" in that parade and with Romney the "business man" looks very promising for the GOP on these two issues. Obama/Bidden are both in La La land when it comes to the deficit and the economy. I am a bit surprised that the announcement was made on a Saturday----usually not a big news day.

[Guest]

The pick of Paul Ryan is so laughable that I thought it was a spoof.

His crazy ideas with Social Security and Medicare will turn off the Florida voters 100%. Those same ideas also will not play with the younger voters.

By not picking Portman, Romney sacrificed Ohio.

By not picking Rubio, Romney sacrificed all the possible Cuban-American votes in Florida as well as already not having the rest of the Hispanic vote.

Now, the senior citizen vote, younger American vote, Hispanic vote, Democrat vote, thinking women vote, over 50% of the Independent vote, Black vote, and even some free-thinking Republican votes - the Democrats are sure to win in November.

When David Axelrod and his team gets done with all of these groups, it is really going to be a great campaign!

[Guest]

The Democrats would have attacked Ryan's proposals as embraced by Romney whether romneychose Ryan or not. Bucco is spot on inexpaling that Romney's choice is a serious and adult choice. It may beamusing to for Democrats to show Ryan throwing granny off a cliff but it adds nothing to serious and much needed discussion about America's economic priorities.

Obama despises Ryan because Obama doesn't understand the economy. for instance he talks about classes as if that is a static lael. A worker can go from rich to poor or poor to ricj in an instant. Middle calsses can advance or their status retreat.

Paul Ryan's opening speech has the ability to take complex issues and reduce them so that we all understand. If you worked in a corporation think back to those meetings on the economic status of the company given by the financial guys and then recall the glossing over of eyes from memebers of the audience.

Paul Ryan is an excellent choice and as Ryan shared in his speech "America is not only a place but an idea" "Americians get their freedoms from natural law and God not the government: Who in their right mind would argue that?

[Guest]

All of those of you, mostly on the left, who immediately with absolutely NO thought whatsoever say some of the things you say on here...let me tell you something...

If you think that General Motors was in trouble, the United States of American is in even worse shape financially !

You can mock an adult looking for a solution to the problem, and EVERYONE on both sides of the aisle agree, some more publicly than others that we need to address entitlements.

I am going to tell you something. This country has to make adult and difficult choices....who will bail out the USA.....France ? The choices are not easy, but rest assured they have to be faced. The teenage attitude that this (and that means all spending...entitlements, etc) can just continue is just plain denying facts !

You will all be on here making fun of Ryan....making up cute names for him..demeaning him at every turn, but WILL YOU EVER GROW UP enough and look your children and their children in the eye and realize where this country is heading ?

Obama is pandering for votes......Ryan will be pandering for our future, and those who will come on here and flaunt polls, etc...keep in mind PLEASE that you were lied to 4 years ago.....and sometimes the truth is not that comfortable. An adult is able to look you in the eye and tell you the truth, whether you like it is up to you.....just look at your children and grandchildren.

[Guest]

All of those of you, mostly on the left, who immediately with absolutely NO thought whatsoever say some of the things you say on here...let me tell you something...

If you think that General Motors was in trouble, the United States of American is in even worse shape financially !

You can mock an adult looking for a solution to the problem, and EVERYONE on both sides of the aisle agree, some more publicly than others that we need to address entitlements.

I am going to tell you something. This country has to make adult and difficult choices....who will bail out the USA.....France ? The choices are not easy, but rest assured they have to be faced. The teenage attitude that this (and that means all spending...entitlements, etc) can just continue is just plain denying facts !

You will all be on here making fun of Ryan....making up cute names for him..demeaning him at every turn, but WILL YOU EVER GROW UP enough and look your children and their children in the eye and realize where this country is heading ?

Obama is pandering for votes......Ryan will be pandering for our future, and those who will come on here and flaunt polls, etc...keep in mind PLEASE that you were lied to 4 years ago.....and sometimes the truth is not that comfortable. An adult is able to look you in the eye and tell you the truth, whether you like it is up to you.....just look at your children and grandchildren.

Exactly what well Rmoney and RyanRand do for the US economy except cut entitlement prgrams like Medicaid, Medicare, pensions for federal workers, etc. and lower taxes on the rich in the hope that the money will trickle down to the middle class and the poor?

The money to my knowledge has never trickled down to the middle classes that I can think of in the US unless it is through some kind of entitlement program and work projects plan.

It sounds like under a RMoney and RandRyan Administration that things in the US will get incredibly bad for a while before they supposedly get better. We will have a few years of austerity under the Rs at least for the middle class and poor. I suppose the rich will just keep getting richer though.

[Guest]

Has the Romney campaign announced yet if Congressman Paul Ryan was asked to turn over more than 1.5 years of tax returns? Does Ryan have enough confidence in Mitt Romney winning that he won't run for reelection to the house?

[Guest]

how about partisan BS aside......I know an impossible notion for some.

How about just focusing.....FOCUSING.....on the following:

Government by consent of the governed.....do you agree with that concept? Not who said it. Not what party it came from? Not any hidden messages. Do you agree with the statement?

Rights from nature and GOD not government. Do you agree with this statement?

Last one; equal opportunity not equal outcome. Do you agree with this one.

I really do challenge the die hard partisans to give their opinion very specifically to the above three. You need not work the usual partisan approach.

If I had to add one more it would be leadership and truth (has sorta a hope and change ring to it does it not?).

And for those who continue to credit Ryan and Romney for cutting Medicare and SS you must not have heard or you are using selective hearing or it just does not matter what was really said....both Ryan and Romney committed to saving both. How convenient.

I believe there is now a ray of hope that we will eventually get to discussing the real issues.

And now the dirt digging on Ryan begins.

All I can say is Ryan's choice is a good one based on the man's background and experience. When one looks at the backgrounds or resume's of the the two it is impressive that one brings none Washington business leadership and the other brings congressional leadership experience.

From a non partisan perspective...some do not recognize there is such a position, but there is.....there can be no argument about character, qualification or capability of the individuals. No R or D required for this type observation.

btk

[Guest]

I was admittedly unhappy with the Republican VP choice in 2008 as soon as I heard it. I did not know the VP candidate, but my reservation was that I felt it was not done to promote a policy, but rather to shore up a group of disenchanted voters that supported Hillary Clinton. I could be wrong of course and not important now anyway.

Today, I feel much different, I like this pick. I have always liked listening to Paul Ryan speak on issues. The things he says make sense to me when I hear them. As with anyone bold enough to try to address issues, there will be ways to criticize with one liners and talking points and I hope undecided voters can dig a bit deeper.

My big concern for the future state of this completely dysfunctional federal government is what will be different if President Obama is re-elected…. since I do not see the legislative branch changing much, I see nothing being offered that makes anything change from what is happening now.

Whether it is President Obama’s fault or not it is what it is and I see nothing being offered to change that. I believe My Romney is closer to the center and “MAY” have a chance to build around the center of both parties. Only time will tell given the chance.

I was interested in how Mr. Ryan would deliver arguably one of his bigger speeches. 10 out of 10 IMO.

Several quotes from his speech stood out that give me hope:


President Obama, and too many like him in Washington, have refused to make difficult decisions because they are more worried about their next election than they are about the next generation. We might have been able to get away with that before, but not now. We’re in a different, and dangerous, moment. We're running out of time -- and we can't afford 4 more years of this. Politicians from both parties have made empty promises which will soon become broken promises--with painful consequences--if we fail to act no
But America is more than just a place...it's an idea. It's the only country founded on an idea. Our rights come from nature and God, not government. We promise equal opportunity, not equal outcomes.
We can turn this thing around. Real solutions can be delivered. But, it will take leadership. And the courage to tell you the truth.

[Guest]

""Americians get their freedoms from natural law and God not the government."

I honestly do not know exactly what you mean by this statement. Americans had slaves until the end of the Civil War. Was slavery part of the freedom from natural law and from God?

From what I read, natural law is another term for human rights. Is that what you mean?

Can you please explain fully what you mean by your original statement? Thanks.

[Guest]

Exactly what well Rmoney and RyanRand do for the US economy except cut entitlement prgrams like Medicaid, Medicare, pensions for federal workers, etc. and lower taxes on the rich in the hope that the money will trickle down to the middle class and the poor?

The money to my knowledge has never trickled down to the middle classes that I can think of in the US unless it is through some kind of entitlement program and work projects plan.

PLEASE, write this down...if Obama is serious about cutting the deficit and spending as he says, HE WILL NEED TO DO THE SAME THING.

And be warned that he is preaching to you right now, but when push comes to shove, he will need to do the same exact things. Difference is that someone is telling you the truth up front.

Listen, I am not a stupid man ...this will probably not win the election for Romney but it is an adult and serious choice, that you and yours will mock totally but this country has no choice. You all keeping harping on the rich versus poor thing and if you knew anything about economics or history of economics, you would know that you are barking up the wrong tree.

Does that message feel better when Obama makes the pitch for rich versus poor....SURE ! Did he make you feel good in 2008....SURE...did any of it come to fruition....NOPE...it got worse.

I am more worried about my country than your polls, your rich versus poor dialogue, you demeaning of anyone who does not carry the flag for Obama . Our country is in VERY VERY SERIOUS shape...just look at the hoorays for the new healthcare law.....nobody, it seems, cares one iota IF we can pay for it. Reminds of the guys who buy new cars all the time because they are neat...someone has to pay the bills. We will not be able to.

If you really believe that we are not so near to financial collapse, I honestly wish I could join you......I actually HOPE you are right...I actually hope that the class warfare works if it somehow...preaching that hate, etc, would save us for what is happening.....then I would join you, but I KNOW, in my head how bad things are. As I said in another thread...who is going to bail us out....France ?

[Guest]

The pick of Paul Ryan is so laughable that I thought it was a spoof.

His crazy ideas with Social Security and Medicare will turn off the Florida voters 100%. Those same ideas also will not play with the younger voters.

By not picking Portman, Romney sacrificed Ohio.

By not picking Rubio, Romney sacrificed all the possible Cuban-American votes in Florida as well as already not having the rest of the Hispanic vote.

Now, the senior citizen vote, younger American vote, Hispanic vote, Democrat vote, thinking women vote, over 50% of the Independent vote, Black vote, and even some free-thinking Republican votes - the Democrats are sure to win in November.

When David Axelrod and his team gets done with all of these groups, it is really going to be a great campaign!

Oh yeah, I forgot to add well over 1 million Federal employees to the "lost" votes in the Romney/Ryan pot since those guys want to cut pay for Federal employees.

I am sure I forgot some others but those will do for right now.

[Guest]

Exactly what well Rmoney and RyanRand do for the US economy except cut entitlement prgrams like Medicaid, Medicare, pensions for federal workers, etc. and lower taxes on the rich in the hope that the money will trickle down to the middle class and the poor?

The money to my knowledge has never trickled down to the middle classes that I can think of in the US unless it is through some kind of entitlement program and work projects plan.

It sounds like under a RMoney and RandRyan Administration that things in the US will get incredibly bad for a while before they supposedly get better. We will have a few years of austerity under the Rs at least for the middle class and poor. I suppose the rich will just keep getting richer though.

Tal: I appreciate what you say but people are not paying attention . Most can't get past cuts wondering how it will affect them. When the pivotal issue is unlessand until we deal with our spending problems and tax problems we all are going down the tubes. Its tantamount to that old petroleum commerical "Pay me now or pay me later....and later means more more more.

Count on the Obama people/media to spin it as gutted people incomes except for the rich but that is all bupkus intnded on distracting people.

Paul Ryan is correct and Paul Ryan is a realist so I expect that as his plans unfold he will take care not to damage any economic class.

Obama had full reign and he has failed miserably

[Guest]

Tal: I appreciate what you say but people are not paying attention . Most can't get past cuts wondering how it will affect them. When the pivotal issue is unlessand until we deal with our spending problems and tax problems we all are going down the tubes. Its tantamount to that old petroleum commerical "Pay me now or pay me later....and later means more more more.

Count on the Obama people/media to spin it as gutted people incomes except for the rich but that is all bupkus intnded on distracting people.

Paul Ryan is correct and Paul Ryan is a realist so I expect that as his plans unfold he will take care not to damage any economic class.

Obama had full reign and he has failed miserably

Obama had full reign? He is President not an Emperor. Many Congress Members have stalled any kind of Obama budget passing. For instance, the Tea Party has made significant inroads into Congress. I believe in checks and balances in US government in case a President becomes despotic in some way. But, I would never say that Obama had free reign in pushing through his budget. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/obama-budget/

[Guest]

Since Mitt does not have any ideas of his other than cut taxes for the rich he will now have to run on Ryan's ideas- cutting taxes for the rich, gutting government, eliminating Medicare as we know it, privatizing social security, and saying too bad so sad to the middle and lower classes of American society.
Mitt caved to the right wing and, thereby, has lost the election. :icon_wink:

[Guest]

check Dirty Harry's backed up list of legislation proposals that result in spending reductions....which he has refused to release for discussion in the senate.

The $7 billion benefits paid annually to illegal immigrants for example.
He is adamant to not move forward any legislation that smells like a budget discussion as he has said in the past, any discussions about budgets can only result in some pretty embarrassing questions coming to light....that will impact re-election results negatively.

As has been stated by earlier posts in this thread and many others. One can criticize all they want about the cuts the other party is proposing.....when ever and or if Obama ever addresses the spending problem, there is no magic or secret approach. He or anybody that has the guts to take on the leadership to get the spending under control....WILL HAVE TO DO THE SAME THING!!!!!!

Very, very simple concept spending CANNOT exceed revenues......we all do this every day. The government does not.....no magic....no mystery....just takes leadership and determination.....just like we do at home.

Very simple.....any non politician knows this.

btk

[Guest]

BTK...."He or anybody that has the guts to take on the leadership to get the spending under control....WILL HAVE TO DO THE SAME THING!!!!!!"

One of my biggest single problems with this administration since BEFORE the election of 2008. He will NOT address the issues if it does not produce votes.

If he is elected he MUST do all the things Ryan supports...well, maybe not all and I think Ryan has said that it is a principle and nothing is carved in stone but WE MUST ADDRESS THOSE ISSUES. If Obama is truely interested in where this country is headed he will have to support Ryan's agenda...

The sad and it is truely sad....he wont do it until after he gets votes. Read the left leaning posts on this forum for guidance. They are more interested in votes, etc than they are on the issues facing us. I suppose they think they will just go away and they ignore the President when he says he wants to do with ALL industries what he did with GM and a poster on here a few days ago who did not even know that there was an alternative to the bail out.

Point is.....ask the President...oh he wont take questions...well ask him in the debate HOW he will reduce spending and see if he can go one minute with discussing our massive entitlements...he will try not to because he is MORE interested in votes than this country !


PS...By the way, AND PLEASE FACT CHECK ME ON STATMENTS, ETC ON THIS.....this avoidance of problems that are not politically popular and do not get votes is how we got a healtch care bill that does not do anything he said it will do, we cannot afford at all, and was even opposed by his party until he made the payoffs to LA and SC. Please fact check me

[Guest]

Rights come from nature and God? Now that one I don't get at all. :ohdear:

[Guest]

"Rights from nature and GOD not government. Do you agree with this statement?"

Please explain this fully. What rights are you talking about? Remember that the writers of the constitution had slaves. Was that a right from nature and God?

I really want a full explanation of what you mean by that statement. I do not understand it. I googled it and even the Muslim faith claims that as a basis for their government. Do we want to be like Iran?

[Guest]

how about partisan BS aside......I know an impossible notion for some.

How about just focusing.....FOCUSING.....on the following:

Government by consent of the governed.....do you agree with that concept? Not who said it. Not what party it came from? Not any hidden messages. Do you agree with the statement?

Rights from nature and GOD not government. Do you agree with this statement?

Last one; equal opportunity not equal outcome. Do you agree with this one.

I really do challenge the die hard partisans to give their opinion very specifically to the above three. You need not work the usual partisan approach.

If I had to add one more it would be leadership and truth (has sorta a hope and change ring to it does it not?).

And for those who continue to credit Ryan and Romney for cutting Medicare and SS you must not have heard or you are using selective hearing or it just does not matter what was really said....both Ryan and Romney committed to saving both. How convenient.

I believe there is now a ray of hope that we will eventually get to discussing the real issues.

And now the dirt digging on Ryan begins.

All I can say is Ryan's choice is a good one based on the man's background and experience. When one looks at the backgrounds or resume's of the the two it is impressive that one brings none Washington business leadership and the other brings congressional leadership experience.

From a non partisan perspective...some do not recognize there is such a position, but there is.....there can be no argument about character, qualification or capability of the individuals. No R or D required for this type observation.

btk

Will we recognize it when they "save" it?

[Guest]

those who are so well informed on what the opposition plan to do or meant about "cuts" in Medicare.......help me understand why in Obama's health care reform there is a commitment to reduce Medicare expenditures by $500 billion.....now just why does that not translate into taking away or diluting or minimizing or gutting or killing medicare????

I will be a smart a$$ about it...y'all are comfortable about it knowing full well he does not mean what he says and are assured it will not happen.

Smart a$$ness aside....why is it OK when he proposes it?

btk

[Guest]

those who are so well informed on what the opposition plan to do or meant about "cuts" in Medicare.......help me understand why in Obama's health care reform there is a commitment to reduce Medicare expenditures by $500 billion.....now just why does that not translate into taking away or diluting or minimizing or gutting or killing medicare????

I will be a smart a$$ about it...y'all are comfortable about it knowing full well he does not mean what he says and are assured it will not happen.

Smart a$$ness aside....why is it OK when he proposes it?

btk

He was foolish enough to dream that they could cut the waste and fraud in the program.

[Guest]

those who are so well informed on what the opposition plan to do or meant about "cuts" in Medicare.......help me understand why in Obama's health care reform there is a commitment to reduce Medicare expenditures by $500 billion.....now just why does that not translate into taking away or diluting or minimizing or gutting or killing medicare????

I will be a smart a$$ about it...y'all are comfortable about it knowing full well he does not mean what he says and are assured it will not happen.

Smart a$$ness aside....why is it OK when he proposes it?

btk

President Obama has not cut Medicare, rather Obamacare calls for $500 billion in savings over the next decade through operational efficiencies and more effective care. But Ryan's plan also calls for about $500 billion in savings. The plan would control Medicare spending by converting some of it into subsidies for private insurance, thereby shifting more of the burden to individuals. Ryan's plan also calls for privatizing Social Security.

Hope that answers you, btk.

[Guest]

President Obama has not cut Medicare, rather Obamacare calls for $500 billion in savings over the next decade through operational efficiencies and more effective care. But Ryan's plan also calls for about $500 billion in savings. The plan would control Medicare spending by converting some of it into subsidies for private insurance, thereby shifting more of the burden to individuals. Ryan's plan also calls for privatizing Social Security.

Hope that answers you, btk.

But wait Buggy,they are doing it for the kids and grand kids future. You know, the kids and grand kids that survive the unfunded wars. Those searches for WMDs are expensive.

[Guest]

"Ryan's plan also calls for privatizing Social Security."

That's the one that scares me more than anything. Look these guys don't give two hoots in Hell about stiffs that worked all their lives for a little bit of SS. They have theirs or are getting it. They going to change the Congress medical insurance or their big pensions? No.

[Guest]

[

QUOTE=buggyone;538233]"Rights from nature and GOD not government. Do you agree with this statement?"

Please explain this fully. What rights are you talking about? Remember that the writers of the constitution had slaves. Was that a right from nature and God?

I really want a full explanation of what you mean by that statement. I do not understand it. I googled it and even the Muslim faith claims that as a basis for their government. Do we want to be like Iran?[/QUOTE]

I have never met a family member or anyone for that matter who owned slaves. The issue over slaves was settled by way of a Civil War. Yet unbelievable liberals continue to suck capital out of that issue, capital that is long spent and personally its getting really really lame.

I am not surprised but saddened that the liberal left desires an explanation as to what "rights from natural law and God , and not government mean" I'll explain why further down in my comments.

Whether one calls it a monarchy, central planning or federal government the dictates wishes vision of that entity will prevail. Ask the Chinese people the Russians Burmese, etc. Apparently we have blessed for so long that some of us have taken for granted our blessings.

The creation and preservation of our democracy has come at a great expense for many Americans because they believed that born by accident or by God their destiny belonged to them.

But all of this is well known and I suspect those who feign a lack of understanding can probably explain this phrase better than me.

It isn't that they don't understand it, rather it is because they know it is true and they and their leader's design for total government domainace is now threatened. It is indeed sad that these l Americans would feign a lack of understanding of our basic and inalienable rights granted by natural law and God and memorialzed in the U. S. Constitution and in doing so dishonor the men and women who over America's history fought and died to protect and preserves those rights. The fact that they do so is very instructive, instructive but sad.

[Guest]

Cant wait to see him and Joe go at it.Maybe a little one sided maybe barry could also be at Joe's side.Well maybe add reid an pelosi that may make it closer

[Guest]

President Obama has not cut Medicare, rather Obamacare calls for $500 billion in savings over the next decade through operational efficiencies and more effective care. But Ryan's plan also calls for about $500 billion in savings. The plan would control Medicare spending by converting some of it into subsidies for private insurance, thereby shifting more of the burden to individuals. Ryan's plan also calls for privatizing Social Security.

Hope that answers you, btk.

It does not answer me....HOW, which is the big question will he make those efficiencies. He will not discuss it or take questions but this "efficiency" is one of the "maybes" that he uses to pay for the health care law !!

Amazing how sucked in we seem to get depending on the messenger......this "promise" of efficiencies from the same guy who promised a law to cut health costs, who is allowing our tax money to be robbed by illegal immigrant scams, who promised by saying if it did not happen he would be a one term president that unemployment would never rise about 8%...who assured us that we, the taxpayers, would never lose money on his bailouts and it is running amok.

Is this the same guy whose promise you are embracing ?

[Guest]

But wait Buggy,they are doing it for the kids and grand kids future. You know, the kids and grand kids that survive the unfunded wars. Those searches for WMDs are expensive.

Ahhh yes, the predictable smart crack....really a help for any discussion.

I suggest you look closely at the situation that this country is in, and what we face in just the last of this year....it is amazing and I can not bring myself to make jokes over it.

The old tried and true "Bush did it" thing is very old....many of us disagreed with much of that spending, but to dwell on it to defend what is happening now...well, the logic simply escapes me.

of course the response instead of any factual discussion will be from somewhere another few wisecracks. Must make you all smile at times !

I sure wont refer to kids or grandkids anymore...however the jokes, it IS important to me !

[Guest]

"through operational efficiencies and more effective care." = weasel wording that means exactly the same as cuts.

When one is going to reduce Medicare costs by $500 billion I don't care what one prefers to call it, something that costs money today will have to be eliminated. Some people like to think for example if they improve efficiency and can now take care of more people for the same money....that IS NOT a cost reduction. Cost reduction = however it is being done today for $500 billion less in the till than yesterday.

If one is saying they will become more efficient and for $500 billion less money in the till we will all have the same products and services......then you are officially on something that affects one's cranial capability.

In the very unlikely event I could be wrong, please have the people responsible for such innovative, non reduced services efficiencies contact the United States Postal Service.

The amount spent, no matter how it is done or what ever it is called needs to go down by $500 billion....call it what you will to be happy. I can guarantee you there will be no reduction in cost without a reduction in services or benefits.

btk

[Guest]

"through operational efficiencies and more effective care." = weasel wording that means exactly the same as cuts.

When one is going to reduce Medicare costs by $500 billion I don't care what one prefers to call it, something that costs money today will have to be eliminated. Some people like to think for example if they improve efficiency and can now take care of more people for the same money....that IS NOT a cost reduction. Cost reduction = however it is being done today for $500 billion less in the till than yesterday.

If one is saying they will become more efficient and for $500 billion less money in the till we will all have the same products and services......then you are officially on something that affects one's cranial capability.

In the very unlikely event I could be wrong, please have the people responsible for such innovative, non reduced services efficiencies contact the United States Postal Service.

The amount spent, no matter how it is done or what ever it is called needs to go down by $500 billion....call it what you will to be happy. I can guarantee you there will be no reduction in cost without a reduction in services or benefits.

btk

It sure beats the Ryan plan of saying he would control Medicare spending by converting some of it into subsidies for private insurance, thereby shifting more of the burden to individuals. Ryan's plan also calls for privatizing Social Security. Both of those are very bad ideas.

[Guest]

[

QUOTE=buggyone;538233]"Rights from nature and GOD not government. Do you agree with this statement?"

Please explain this fully. What rights are you talking about? Remember that the writers of the constitution had slaves. Was that a right from nature and God?

I really want a full explanation of what you mean by that statement. I do not understand it. I googled it and even the Muslim faith claims that as a basis for their government. Do we want to be like Iran?

I have never met a family member or anyone for that matter who owned slaves. The issue over slaves was settled by way of a Civil War. Yet unbelievable liberals continue to suck capital out of that issue, capital that is long spent and personally its getting really really lame.

I am not surprised but saddened that the liberal left desires an explanation as to what "rights from natural law and God , and not government mean" I'll explain why further down in my comments.

Whether one calls it a monarchy, central planning or federal government the dictates wishes vision of that entity will prevail. Ask the Chinese people the Russians Burmese, etc. Apparently we have blessed for so long that some of us have taken for granted our blessings.

The creation and preservation of our democracy has come at a great expense for many Americans because they believed that born by accident or by God their destiny belonged to them.

But all of this is well known and I suspect those who feign a lack of understanding can probably explain this phrase better than me.

It isn't that they don't understand it, rather it is because they know it is true and they and their leader's design for total government domainace is now threatened. It is indeed sad that these l Americans would feign a lack of understanding of our basic and inalienable rights granted by natural law and God and memorialzed in the U. S. Constitution and in doing so dishonor the men and women who over America's history fought and died to protect and preserves those rights. The fact that they do so is very instructive, instructive but sad.[/QUOTE]

Huh??? :ohdear:

[Guest]

It sure beats the Ryan plan of saying he would control Medicare spending by converting some of it into subsidies for private insurance, thereby shifting more of the burden to individuals. Ryan's plan also calls for privatizing Social Security. Both of those are very bad ideas.

Define BURDEN as you use it here ? Please !!

Is it with or without the vouchers ?

[Guest]

Ahhh yes, the predictable smart crack....really a help for any discussion.

I suggest you look closely at the situation that this country is in, and what we face in just the last of this year....it is amazing and I can not bring myself to make jokes over it.

The old tried and true "Bush did it" thing is very old....many of us disagreed with much of that spending, but to dwell on it to defend what is happening now...well, the logic simply escapes me.

of course the response instead of any factual discussion will be from somewhere another few wisecracks. Must make you all smile at times !

I sure wont refer to kids or grandkids anymore...however the jokes, it IS important to me !

I'm not joking, the right always brings up the tots to get the heart salve flowing until they send them off to war.

[Guest]

""Americians get their freedoms from natural law and God not the government."

I honestly do not know exactly what you mean by this statement. Americans had slaves until the end of the Civil War. Was slavery part of the freedom from natural law and from God?

From what I read, natural law is another term for human rights. Is that what you mean?

Can you please explain fully what you mean by your original statement? Thanks.

This is as incoherent as it is incomprehensible.

Are you somehow thinking that God made people into slaves of other men?

Can't you answer your own silly question?

Man was endowed with inalienable rights from God that only other men can take away. (that's a clue if your own question is still stumping you)

Right now American's rights are being threatened by Democrat Socialists.

(that's another clue for you)

[Guest]

I'm not joking, the right always brings up the tots to get the heart salve flowing until they send them off to war.

Not sure if I understand you !!!

Are you equating cutting our deficit and spending to going to war ?

That might work, as I think of it....I honestly dont recall anyone mentioning war on here in quite sometime so I suppose I am the stupid one who does not quite understand your analogy !

Anytime I used the "tots" as you refer to them it was to say they will inherit the mess we are in if we dont something...scratch that...they WILL inherit it not matter what, but they may .....well, as a renowned economist said a few days ago on NPR.....it we did not have all the subsidies being paid out by the federal government, we would have the soup kitchens of yore, AND add to that, factually speaking, we cannot afford all those subsidies any longer ! That might get the point across

BUT if I missed some posts on war, my bad !

[Guest]

Mitt Romney claimed all along that his number one goal in selecting a VP was that this individual would be ready to be president from day one. What experience does a seven term congressman have that would qualify him for the job? Paul Ryan has no managerial experience, as a governor would have, and he has no foreign relations experience. Ryan has never even won a statewide race.

[Guest]

Mitt Romney claimed all along that his number one goal in selecting a VP was that this individual would be ready to be president from day one. What experience does a seven term congressman have that would qualify him for the job? Paul Ryan has no managerial experience, as a governor would have, and he has no foreign relations experience. Ryan has never even won a statewide race.

MORE, much more than our incumbent had or has, to be frank !!! MUCHO MORE !!! And even with 3 years in office, Ryan still outshines him in every way, shape of form, except maybe in public speaking !

Obama is the consumate and total politician and he is good at it, but right now, we need leadership and plans.

[Guest]

Shinyness is in the eyes of the beholder!!!! :icon_wink:

[Guest]

"I am not surprised but saddened that the liberal left desires an explanation as to what "rights from natural law and God , and not government mean" I'll explain why further down in my comments.

Whether one calls it a monarchy, central planning or federal government the dictates wishes vision of that entity will prevail. Ask the Chinese people the Russians Burmese, etc. Apparently we have blessed for so long that some of us have taken for granted our blessings.

The creation and preservation of our democracy has come at a great expense for many Americans because they believed that born by accident or by God their destiny belonged to them.

But all of this is well known and I suspect those who feign a lack of understanding can probably explain this phrase better than me.

It isn't that they don't understand it, rather it is because they know it is true and they and their leader's design for total government domainace is now threatened. It is indeed sad that these l Americans would feign a lack of understanding of our basic and inalienable rights granted by natural law and God and memorialzed in the U. S. Constitution and in doing so dishonor the men and women who over America's history fought and died to protect and preserves those rights. The fact that they do so is very instructive, instructive but sad."
_________________________-

I have no idea whatsoever of what was posted to try and explain "freedoms given by natural law and God."

[Guest]

MORE, much more than our incumbent had or has, to be frank !!! MUCHO MORE !!! And even with 3 years in office, Ryan still outshines him in every way, shape of form, except maybe in public speaking !

Obama is the consumate and total politician and he is good at it, but right now, we need leadership and plans.

President Obama was not appointed to any office. He earned it the old fashioned way, by campaigning long and hard, and winning election by a landslide, fair and square.

[Guest]

"I am not surprised but saddened that the liberal left desires an explanation as to what "rights from natural law and God , and not government mean" I'll explain why further down in my comments.

Whether one calls it a monarchy, central planning or federal government the dictates wishes vision of that entity will prevail. Ask the Chinese people the Russians Burmese, etc. Apparently we have blessed for so long that some of us have taken for granted our blessings.

The creation and preservation of our democracy has come at a great expense for many Americans because they believed that born by accident or by God their destiny belonged to them.

But all of this is well known and I suspect those who feign a lack of understanding can probably explain this phrase better than me.

It isn't that they don't understand it, rather it is because they know it is true and they and their leader's design for total government domainace is now threatened. It is indeed sad that these l Americans would feign a lack of understanding of our basic and inalienable rights granted by natural law and God and memorialzed in the U. S. Constitution and in doing so dishonor the men and women who over America's history fought and died to protect and preserves those rights. The fact that they do so is very instructive, instructive but sad."
_________________________-

I have no idea whatsoever of what was posted to try and explain "freedoms given by natural law and God."

yes you do and I am done with this thread

[Guest]

This is as incoherent as it is incomprehensible.

Are you somehow thinking that God made people into slaves of other men?

Can't you answer your own silly question?

Man was endowed with inalienable rights from God that only other men can take away. (that's a clue if your own question is still stumping you)

Right now American's rights are being threatened by Democrat Socialists.

(that's another clue for you)

If man was endowed with certain inalienable rights (life, liberty, pursuit of happiness), why did some of the framers of the American constitution have slaves and slavery was not abolished for about 100 years after those words were first written?

No, it is Repubicans are the ones who are threatening the American rights.

[Guest]

"Happy Days are Here Again!" (Ben Selvin and the Crooners, 1930) - YouTube

[Guest]

President Obama was not appointed to any office. He earned it the old fashioned way, by campaigning long and hard, and winning election by a landslide, fair and square.

I was unaware that Ryan never ran for office and was appointed. Thanks for the lesson.

Who said Obama won other than fair and square ? Not sure why that coment. Obama was running as soon as the votes were in to elect hm to the senate....how many days again did he actually "report for duty". I know he was absent quite a bit in Chicago.

But thanks again for the info on Ryan being appointed to congress !! He has been "appointed" quite a few times now !

[Guest]

Not sure if I understand you !!!

Are you equating cutting our deficit and spending to going to war ?

That might work, as I think of it....I honestly dont recall anyone mentioning war on here in quite sometime so I suppose I am the stupid one who does not quite understand your analogy !

Anytime I used the "tots" as you refer to them it was to say they will inherit the mess we are in if we dont something...scratch that...they WILL inherit it not matter what, but they may .....well, as a renowned economist said a few days ago on NPR.....it we did not have all the subsidies being paid out by the federal government, we would have the soup kitchens of yore, AND add to that, factually speaking, we cannot afford all those subsidies any longer ! That might get the point across

BUT if I missed some posts on war, my bad !

The right will use kids and grand kids as political props when discussing deficit but will also use them as cannon fodder when its time to feed the military industrial complex.

[Guest]

I was unaware that Ryan never ran for office and was appointed. Thanks for the lesson.

Who said Obama won other than fair and square ? Not sure why that coment. Obama was running as soon as the votes were in to elect hm to the senate....how many days again did he actually "report for duty". I know he was absent quite a bit in Chicago.

But thanks again for the info on Ryan being appointed to congress !! He has been "appointed" quite a few times now !

I should have been more clear. Congressman Paul Ryan was selected/appointed to be Vice President of the United States by the presumptive GOP nominee, Mitt Romeny.

Earlier I was questioning how his seven terms as an elected member of congress, with no managerial experience or foreign relations experience, qualifies him to be president if, God forbid, something happened to the president.

[Guest]

The right will use kids and grand kids as political props when discussing deficit but will also use them as cannon fodder when its time to feed the military industrial complex.

I suppose you are correct...those on the right should emulate those on the left...the beacons of hope, light and the american way. They would never ever do anything shamlessly for politics.

And as a member of the right, I guess..although that is a bit of a stretch I take great personal offense at your remark but you seem to want to talk about war.....and I hate to interrupt your love affair with the saintly left....they got it right....call them names and destroy them personallly...that is the american way for sure.

And again by the way, I used the scenario, NOT THE RIGHT...and I stand by it. If you dont care, thats fine...I do care what is left of this country for them...one reason for this countries success was people thinking like that for many many decades, but if you dont care...then fine..your choice !

Now you can go back to you war talk.....and watch an Obama video on hope and change !

I really should apologize to you for the sarcasm but I am just about sick and tired of all the smart little wise cracks meant to demean other people. Thus, I am now going to return in kind.

[Guest]

I suppose you are correct...those on the right should emulate those on the left...the beacons of hope, light and the american way. They would never ever do anything shamlessly for politics.

And as a member of the right, I guess..although that is a bit of a stretch I take great personal offense at your remark but you seem to want to talk about war.....and I hate to interrupt your love affair with the saintly left....they got it right....call them names and destroy them personallly...that is the american way for sure.

And again by the way, I used the scenario, NOT THE RIGHT...and I stand by it. If you dont care, thats fine...I do care what is left of this country for them...one reason for this countries success was people thinking like that for many many decades, but if you dont care...then fine..your choice !

Now you can go back to you war talk.....and watch an Obama video on hope and change !

I really should apologize to you for the sarcasm but I am just about sick and tired of all the smart little wise cracks meant to demean other people. Thus, I am now going to return in kind.

The Left has blood on its hands too. LBJ ring any bells?

[Guest]

Buh-bye! :icon_wink:

[Guest]

the answer is pretty obvious if some one with a background like his can charm his way into being elected POTUS, then experience isn't really much of a consideration is it.

Another dem in the news today commented Ryan has no private sector experience.

Please, someone remind me about Obama's private sector experience.

Today has been the most entertaining day from the media to any and all forums/quorums dominated by dems doing their damndest to belittle the VP choice today.

No discussion at all about the specifics he and Romney proposed just snipping and bashing the person or the party.

I am increasingly convinced it is a party strategy to say and do anything, true or not to keep the discussions off the real issues. How about one of you Obama supporters take what Romney and Ryan proposed today and instead of denigrating it please contrast item by item with what you know Obama is going to do about each? We should live so long!!!

btk

[Guest]

BTK...."He or anybody that has the guts to take on the leadership to get the spending under control....WILL HAVE TO DO THE SAME THING!!!!!!"

One of my biggest single problems with this administration since BEFORE the election of 2008. He will NOT address the issues if it does not produce votes.

If he is elected he MUST do all the things Ryan supports...well, maybe not all and I think Ryan has said that it is a principle and nothing is carved in stone but WE MUST ADDRESS THOSE ISSUES. If Obama is truely interested in where this country is headed he will have to support Ryan's agenda...

The sad and it is truely sad....he wont do it until after he gets votes. Read the left leaning posts on this forum for guidance. They are more interested in votes, etc than they are on the issues facing us. I suppose they think they will just go away and they ignore the President when he says he wants to do with ALL industries what he did with GM and a poster on here a few days ago who did not even know that there was an alternative to the bail out.

Point is.....ask the President...oh he wont take questions...well ask him in the debate HOW he will reduce spending and see if he can go one minute with discussing our massive entitlements...he will try not to because he is MORE interested in votes than this country !


PS...By the way, AND PLEASE FACT CHECK ME ON STATMENTS, ETC ON THIS.....this avoidance of problems that are not politically popular and do not get votes is how we got a healtch care bill that does not do anything he said it will do, we cannot afford at all, and was even opposed by his party until he made the payoffs to LA and SC. Please fact check me


NOBODY.. Not even a single Democrat supported Obama's lame budget. If they want to attack Paul Ryan for being brave and offering up a budget, then they have to answer for their failure of a President and his failed budget.