shooting outside empire state bldg, nyc this a.m.

[njbchbum]

shortly after 9 a.m. this morning, 4/8 people being evaluated - 4 likely injured by bullets, shooter killed by nypd.

check internet news sites for further info

[ugotme]

What a shame!
No details yet on what this was about but it doesn't matter. Some IDIOT shot some people.
At least the NYPD got this nut!

[coralway]

A disgruntled employee ...... work place related

[Figmo Bohica]

Here is the link 2 dead, 8 injured in shooting near Empire State Building in Manhattan, police say | Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/24/multiple-people-shot-near-empire-state-building-in-manhattan-police-say/)

Now let's see - New York City, guns illegal, can't have them, banned, outlawed for the law abiding citizen, allowed for the criminal, outlaws and those that don't follow the law. The mayor needs to get his priorities in order. Things like this will continue to happen as long as law abiding citizens allow "stupid" politicians to make the rules.

My prayers goes out to those what where hurt and to the families of those that lost loved ones. This could have been prevented.

[jblum315]

I agree. Mayor Bloomberg needs to lay off the sugary soda and crack down on illegal weapons.

[Taltarzac725]

There seem to be various copycats of a highly publicized shooting such as the one in Colorado. Shame that these people have no other option than this kind of violence. Then when some recent tragedy is still fresh in the minds of someone already over the edge, they go over.

On a related subject, it sounds like the CO shooter was spinning out of control before his murderous rampage on July 20, 2012. It is beginning to look more and more like James Holmes had very serious mental health problems.

[2BNTV]

Another article:

Two dead, including gunman in shooting outside Empire State Building – This Just In - CNN.com Blogs (http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/08/24/shooting-reported-outside-empire-state-building/?hpt=hp_t1)

[graciegirl]

Here is the link 2 dead, 8 injured in shooting near Empire State Building in Manhattan, police say | Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/24/multiple-people-shot-near-empire-state-building-in-manhattan-police-say/)

Now let's see - New York City, guns illegal, can't have them, banned, outlawed for the law abiding citizen, allowed for the criminal, outlaws and those that don't follow the law. The mayor needs to get his priorities in order. Things like this will continue to happen as long as law abiding citizens allow "stupid" politicians to make the rules.

My prayers goes out to those what where hurt and to the families of those that lost loved ones. This could have been prevented.

It is funny how older people draw completely different conclusions from the same event.

[Patty55]

I agree. Mayor Bloomberg needs to lay off the sugary soda and crack down on illegal weapons.

THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL STATEMENT-I can't stand that little chit. I can't stand him way back to 2002 when he didn't go to the funerals. I can't stand his whining voice, can't stand to look at him.

Look how long it took him to get there today.

[graciegirl]

THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL STATEMENT-I can't stand that little chit. I can't stand him way back to 2002 when he didn't go to the funerals. I can't stand his whining voice, can't stand to look at him.

Look how long it took him to get there today.

Well we know for sure now you aren't Angie Fox or Boomer, Patty.

They are from other areas of the country.

[KathieI]

The construction worker who alerted the police in front of the ESB is the real hero in this situation. He saw the original shooting a few blocks away when the gunman shot his former employer to death outside their office building and followed him to the ESB where the alerted the police and they took down the murderer.

Tight gun laws in NY but you can always get a gun illegally. Same thing in LA.

[Patty55]

Well we know for sure now you aren't Angie Fox or Boomer, Patty.

They are from other areas of the country.

I'm glad we finally cleared that one up.

[Figmo Bohica]

It is funny how older people draw completely different conclusions from the same event.

What different conclusions would you draw? This could have been prevented. Gun Free Zones are better known as "Target Rich Environments." This means that the shooter knows that he/she will have no resistance and that all "targets", IE., people, who are law abiding will be UNARMED. What a deal. Have you ever noticed that there has NEVER been a shooting incident at a Firing Range.

So I don't know what conclusions you are drawing, please explain.

[Bogie Shooter]

What different conclusions would you draw? This could have been prevented. Gun Free Zones are better known as "Target Rich Environments." This means that the shooter knows that he/she will have no resistance and that all "targets", IE., people, who are law abiding will be UNARMED. What a deal. Have you ever noticed that there has NEVER been a shooting incident at a Firing Range.

So I don't know what conclusions you are drawing, please explain.

A mom shot her son at a gun range in Casselberry in 2009. See Google.

[Figmo Bohica]

A mom shot her son at a gun range in Casselberry in 2009. See Google.

I know of lots of accidents, this was a mentally ill woman who should not have been allowed to to handle a gun. I will be willing to bet that there where signs that she was coming apart long before this happened. But since we live in such a PC world, no one will take the responsibility to get help for someone like this. Having run a range for many years, I have no problem throwing you off my range if you do something that you should not be doing. All AD (Accidental Discharges) should be called ND, (Neglient Discharges) since someone did not follow the 4 main rules of safe firearms handling.

So I will still stand by my statement that there has been NO MASS Shooting Incidents at any Firing Range.

[Bogie Shooter]

I know of lots of accidents, this was a mentally ill woman who should not have been allowed to to handle a gun. I will be willing to bet that there where signs that she was coming apart long before this happened. But since we live in such a PC world, no one will take the responsibility to get help for someone like this. Having run a range for many years, I have no problem throwing you off my range if you do something that you should not be doing. All AD (Accidental Discharges) should be called ND, (Neglient Discharges) since someone did not follow the 4 main rules of safe firearms handling.

So I will still stand by my statement that there has been NO MASS Shooting Incidents at any Firing Range.

Mass was not part of your statement..........

[Taltarzac725]

What different conclusions would you draw? This could have been prevented. Gun Free Zones are better known as "Target Rich Environments." This means that the shooter knows that he/she will have no resistance and that all "targets", IE., people, who are law abiding will be UNARMED. What a deal. Have you ever noticed that there has NEVER been a shooting incident at a Firing Range.

So I don't know what conclusions you are drawing, please explain.

Actually I remember an incident at a firing range. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30109090/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/mom-kills-son-then-self-shooting-range/

See that someone else beat me to it. I believe the shooting at the Army Base though would qualify for a mass shooting at a place where others have some access to weapons.

I still think that people should not jump on the mentally ill card. People in power can use a label of "mentally ill" to discredit people they see as a problem in some way. It is both a weapon for lawyers as well as a shield. The shield is to help prevent people who have committed crimes from being punished; but, this can cut the other way too of harming whistleblowers, activists, etc.

The US military actually had psychiatrists label female soldiers "mentally ill" who complained about sexual assaults by other soldiers.

It has also been a useful weapon of Communists in China and the Soviet Union as well as Nazis to label someone they saw as a troublemaker as a paranoid schizophrenic. They were out to get these people but could just deny it and then have them put into mental institutions.

[Figmo Bohica]

Mass was not part of your statement..........

One incident in 2009 don't leave lots of incidents to draw from. Since the OP was about a mass shooting didn't think that I would have to add that to the statement. You are grabbing for straws since there have been no mass shootings at gun ranges.

[Patty55]

All I know is if I were in a situation where something was going down I'd like to have Figmo there.

[Figmo Bohica]

Actually I remember an incident at a firing range. Mom kills son, then self at gun range - US news - Crime & courts - NBCNews.com (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30109090/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/mom-kills-son-then-self-shooting-range/)

See that someone else beat me to it. I believe the shooting at the Army Base though would qualify for a mass shooting at a place where others have some access to weapons.

I still think that people should not jump on the mentally ill card. People in power can use a label of "mentally ill" to discredit people they see as a problem in some way. It is both a weapon for lawyers as well as a shield. The shield is to help prevent people who have committed crimes from being punished; but, this can cut the other way too of harming whistleblowers, activists, etc.

The US military actually had psychiatrists label female soldiers who complained about sexual assaults by other soldiers "mentally ill".

None of the soldiers had access to weapons at Fort Hood. So you are mistaken. It took civilians working as police to take the shooter down. There was also signs that this individual should have been booted from the military. But once again PC took hold and no one did anything. Time to get off that kick.

As for declaring a whistle blower mentally ill. If it is proven otherwise then the accuser should do jail time. That would stop that madness. That goes for both civilian and military.

It is time to kick PC to the curb.

[Taltarzac725]

All I know is if I were in a situation where something was going down I'd like to have Figmo there.

That's true. I cannot hit an elephant at two yards with a handgun. Doubt if I could ever actually shoot another person also.

[eweissenbach]

THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL STATEMENT-I can't stand that little chit. I can't stand him way back to 2002 when he didn't go to the funerals. I can't stand his whining voice, can't stand to look at him.

Look how long it took him to get there today.

Glad you let us know that was not a political statement. Would have been hard to tell otherwise.

[Figmo Bohica]

That's true. I cannot hit an elephant at two yards with a handgun. Doubt if I could ever actually shoot another person also.

I'll tell you something. Everyday I say a little prayer that I don't have to use my skills for myself or anyone else. Killing another human changes your life for ever. All those that talk big, I will be willing to bet have never fired a shoot in anger or been shoot at. Its something that you never forget and something that you never want to have happen again.

I do not train to shoot anyone, I train to stay alive. That is also the way I train those that want to learn to shoot for self defense. That is why I avoid situations that look funny or give me that feeling that something is just not quite right. It is better to cross the street. Avoid, deterance and de-esculation will always be the better part of valor.

One of the things that I always ask when training someone to shoot and especially if they want to get a concealed carry permit. Are you willing to do what is necessary to save your life or the life of a loved one? Can you take anothers life in this situation? Those two questions have to be answered and you are the only one that can give yourself a truthful answer.

Would I have done something if I was in NYC when this took place, Yes, would I have wanted to NO.

[Patty55]

Glad you let us know that was not a political statement. Would have been hard to tell otherwise.

Yep, not political, I wasn't too fond of him before he was Mayor.

[janmcn]

It's now being reported that the shooter bought the gun in Florida, the easiest state in the country to buy a gun, and was not licensed to own it in New York. BTW: Mayor Bloomberg was on TV at 11:00am, one and a half hours after the incident.

[Bogie Shooter]

One incident in 2009 don't leave lots of incidents to draw from. Since the OP was about a mass shooting didn't think that I would have to add that to the statement. You are grabbing for straws since there have been no mass shootings at gun ranges.

There always. Seems to be an answer.......no pi€£ing contest here!

[paulandjean]

There was a killing at a gun range couple of years back. Not far from our county.

[Figmo Bohica]

There was a killing at a gun range couple of years back. Not far from our county.

Do a Google search on firing range indcidents. Lots of them. One thing no one can fix is stupid. Ignorance I can fix, stupid is permanent. Once you get knowledge you are not ignorant of a subject.

Florida is not the easiest state to buy a firearm in. Google buying pistols and read what other states require. Some you only have to be a resident and there is no waiting period. So now we have debunked that statement.

One thing to get a handgun in Florida or any other state, you must be a permanent resident, Federal Law. If you don't have a resident Florida concealed carry permit, there is a 3 day waiting period. You can buy a long gun, rifle or shotgun, without being a permanent resident or having a concealed carry permit and take possession immediately. So at one time, the shooter in NYC had to have been a permanent resident of Florida or the pistol was obtained illegally. So now we have debunked that statement, unless he was at one time a resident of Florida.

So to sum up things, when anyone wants to do something bad, they will obtain the object, a handgun, bomb, chemicals or whatever, anyway necessary. Most of the time illegally, if not all the time. So more GUN CONTROL LAWS are not necessary, Gun Control Laws are PEOPLE CONTROL LAWS. What is necessary are laws that make it a death penalty to use a firearm in the commission of a crime. Display one and its life in prison, hurt or kill someone and its the death penalty. No sitting on Death Row for 20 plus years, 30 days and its all over. This would only have to happen a couple times and the illegal use of firearms would drop to an all time low.

Now would you like to discuss how many people are killed by automobiles as oppossed to firearms, other than in the time of war? Might be time to ban all automobiles. Sure would keep us a lot safer around here. :laugh:

[Moderator]

This discussion has strayed far from the original topic of today's incident in NYC. It is now a gun control discussion with politics mixed in.

Thread closed.