bad bike on pinellas

[fnhski]

went out for a ride on my bike on january 15...when i was approaching one of the area's where u have to merge with traffic a pick up truck full of construtions workers passed me and gave me the your number one sign and yelled that i should be on the sidewalk...they then proceeded to slow down and verbally abuse me some more.....i wish had been able to get the license number of the truck and the company name on the side but was not able to do this.....but i do believe i was in the rite to be in the multi-modal path....but i guess there r a.. holes all over.......

[Happinow]

Since you are talking about riding a bike, we were on Morse yesterday headed towards the intersection of Morse and the intersection of 466A when we came across a pack of bikers (8). They were all riding in the car lane. It frustrated me that all,of,these bikers were not riding on the side of the road, but directly in the middle of the lane as if they were a car. What is the proper lane, if any, that they should be in as not to hold up traffic and not be such a danger on the roadways??

[GaryW]

If the cyclist are approaching or at a red lite and are in a pack,, yes they take up the lane for the most part,... Here is the deal, if they do not, then the cars will pull right up beside them or try to turn on them... Just like entering a round-a-bout, in a pack will take up the lane. I have been almost run over entering the circles so many times. Cyclist have a right to the road as a car does... You have to yield 3 feet to cyclist when passing. If you pass them in a no passing zone, you can be ticketed depending on traffic patterns and the officer, have seen it done on the We Ride For Kids Ride that starts at the Sea Breeze Rec Center. Car passed us in a no passing zone, speed limit 45 mph. Car went around us flying. I guess he could not see the FHP Trooper leading us down the road,,,

With all that said,, Cyclist also need to use their smarts. We as cyclist do some things we should not do also. But for the most part most of us try...
There are folks that ride on the main roads with no helmet,, ride super slow that should not be on the roads, but on the paths when available. So bare with us,, We Try.....

[Mikeod]

Since you are talking about riding a bike, we were on Morse yesterday headed towards the intersection of Morse and the intersection of 466A when we came across a pack of bikers (8). They were all riding in the car lane. It frustrated me that all,of,these bikers were not riding on the side of the road, but directly in the middle of the lane as if they were a car. What is the proper lane, if any, that they should be in as not to hold up traffic and not be such a danger on the roadways??

A couple of observations. As the poster above states, the bicyclists have as much right to the lane as autos. I have seen bikes riding to the right side of the lane and cars pass them in the same lane by not giving them the three foot clearance the law requires. This is very dangerous. So, I can't blame them for riding nearer the center of the lane. When I learned to ride a motorcycle, I was taught to never ride in the center of the lane because that is where a lot of oil from vehicles can accumulate making it potentially slippery. The area where the tires from cars and trucks hit the pavement tends to have less and is safer. I would expect bikes to do the same.

A few days ago, I was behind a group of cyclists turning from 466 to Morse. The last cyclist in the group pulled out and rode near the lane marking on the left. At first I was annoyed, but then realized they probably had experienced cars crowding them in their lane and this was a way to keep cars in the other lane and safely away from the bikes.

So, some of the things you see cyclists doing may be more self-preservation than designed to annoy. That said, cyclists have to remember that if they want the rights to the road, they have to obey the same rules, including stop signs and yield signs. And that a group of cyclists is not a single vehicle.

[GaryW]

A couple of observations. As the poster above states, the bicyclists have as much right to the lane as autos. I have seen bikes riding to the right side of the lane and cars pass them in the same lane by not giving them the three foot clearance the law requires. This is very dangerous. So, I can't blame them for riding nearer the center of the lane. When I learned to ride a motorcycle, I was taught to never ride in the center of the lane because that is where a lot of oil from vehicles can accumulate making it potentially slippery. The area where the tires from cars and trucks hit the pavement tends to have less and is safer. I would expect bikes to do the same.

A few days ago, I was behind a group of cyclists turning from 466 to Morse. The last cyclist in the group pulled out and rode near the lane marking on the left. At first I was annoyed, but then realized they probably had experienced cars crowding them in their lane and this was a way to keep cars in the other lane and safely away from the bikes.

So, some of the things you see cyclists doing may be more self-preservation than designed to annoy. That said, cyclists have to remember that if they want the rights to the road, they have to obey the same rules, including stop signs and yield signs. And that a group of cyclists is not a single vehicle.


Agree. Just one thing that might be something to ponder, that is the stop deal.

I am not sure on how it should work, but here is what we did. There was 18 of us riding. Came to stop sign. Drive yelled at us from behind and said I know you guys are not blowing this stop sign all together. He said that is against the law. So later in the ride as we approached Del Mar and Rio Grande,, we merged into the lane approaching the stop sign as we should by road markings. We lined up all 18 and did a complete stop one at a time. Of course the 7 or 8 cars behind us did not like that and told us, we should proceed thru the intersection as one pack. Then they told us how we were number one and so on.

So what do you do??????? I have tried it both ways,, easiest being the pack proceed together. We get yelled at either way. Can not please anyone group of people regaurdless of how it is done...

[mickey100]

... So bare with us,, We Try.....

I agree with everything you said except the part about "bare" with us, lol! Now that would get people's attention!:laugh:

[Mikeod]

Agree. Just one thing that might be something to ponder, that is the stop deal.

I am not sure on how it should work, but here is what we did. There was 18 of us riding. Came to stop sign. Drive yelled at us from behind and said I know you guys are not blowing this stop sign all together. He said that is against the law. So later in the ride as we approached Del Mar and Rio Grande,, we merged into the lane approaching the stop sign as we should by road markings. We lined up all 18 and did a complete stop one at a time. Of course the 7 or 8 cars behind us did not like that and told us, we should proceed thru the intersection as one pack. Then they told us how we were number one and so on.

So what do you do??????? I have tried it both ways,, easiest being the pack proceed together. We get yelled at either way. Can not please anyone group of people regaurdless of how it is done...

From Florida Bicycle Association:
s. 316.123 – Vehicle Entering Stop or Yield Intersection
(2)(a) ….every driver of a vehicle approaching a stop intersection indicated by a stop sign shall stop …. After having stopped, the driver shall yield the right-of way




Bicycle Regulations (see Section 316.2065, F.S.)
A bicyclist must obey all traffic controls and signals.

So the drivers who were upset that your group members each stopped at the sign are the ones ignorant of the law. Should you have blown by the stop signs and were ticketed, nothing would have happened to them.

Then there's this (also from the FBA):

That said, please see: Idaho Rolling Stop Law (http://flbikelaw.org/2009/08/idaho-rolling-stop-law/)
A common practice of cyclists (and motorists) is to slow and insure there is no conflict, yield as appropriate, and roll through the stop sign. Some may consider that appropriate for stop signs, but it would be hard to make that case for red lights.
Although some might consider it a safe practice, Florida law does not permit that for cyclists or motorists.

Enjoy your rides but be careful.

[GaryW]

Everyone should read up on this..

Florida Bicycle Laws (http://www.floridabicycle.org/rules/bikelaw.html)

[skyguy79]

From Florida Bicycle Association:
s. 316.123 – Vehicle Entering Stop or Yield Intersection
(2)(a) ….every driver of a vehicle approaching a stop intersection indicated by a stop sign shall stop …. After having stopped, the driver shall yield the right-of way
When I read this I had to ask myself "What? This has to be taken out of context!" The wording left me scratching my head as it did not clearify who you have to yield to; the car to the right, left, across from you or the car behind you. I surmised that it was taken out of context and when I checked it out, it was. What was indicated is accurate, but it would be better understood if the entire context was read. Here is the link to the full context:

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine (http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0300-0399/0316/Sections/0316.123.html)

[justjim]

From Florida Bicycle Association:
s. 316.123 – Vehicle Entering Stop or Yield Intersection
(2)(a) ….every driver of a vehicle approaching a stop intersection indicated by a stop sign shall stop …. After having stopped, the driver shall yield the right-of way




Bicycle Regulations (see Section 316.2065, F.S.)
A bicyclist must obey all traffic controls and signals.

So the drivers who were upset that your group members each stopped at the sign are the ones ignorant of the law. Should you have blown by the stop signs and were ticketed, nothing would have happened to them.

Then there's this (also from the FBA):

That said, please see: Idaho Rolling Stop Law (http://flbikelaw.org/2009/08/idaho-rolling-stop-law/)
A common practice of cyclists (and motorists) is to slow and insure there is no conflict, yield as appropriate, and roll through the stop sign. Some may consider that appropriate for stop signs, but it would be hard to make that case for red lights.
Although some might consider it a safe practice, Florida law does not permit that for cyclists or motorists.

Enjoy your rides but be careful.


Yep, that's what the "law" says----BUT when you are in a big pack the law really doesn't make common sense and should be changed----do we live in a great country or what?

[GaryW]

Group Riding Guidelines (http://www.floridabicycle.org/rules/groups.html)


Stop Signs and Red Lights
Lead riders should stop at all stop signs and red lights—always respecting the right-of-way of others

Stop in the right-most lane in the direction of the route:

When traveling straight, use the right-most thru lane—never travel straight in a right-turn only lane. Merge left from a shoulder or bike lane to prevent right-turning motorists from cutting you off.
When turing right, use a right-turn only lane (if one is available)—do not stay in a shoulder or bike lane, this can cause the group to be pinched in the turn by a right-turning motorist.
When turning left, use the right-most left turn lane, unless the group plans to make another left turn from the new road.
At a stop, bunch-up and take control of the lane. This allows the group to proceed through the intersection as rapidly as possible. When it is time to move, accelerate up to speed (cross the intersection before clipping into the other pedal). After the intersection, the group should move into a line to the right as appropriate. Lead riders should slow to allow everyone to regroup.

Generally, it’s better to stop in the line of traffic and not pass stopped motorists on the right. When passing a queue of stopped traffic, lead riders should consider the following:

Is it possible that a motorist could turn right across the path of the cyclists?
Will passing be easy (bike lane or paved shoulder) or difficult (narrow lane) for motorists downstream of the signal?
A lead rider who does pass on the right should not overtake the lead car in a stopped queue. Although stopped motorists preparing to turn right are supposed to signal and be positioned as far right as practical, some neglect to do this. At a stop sign or light, only pass a single motorist on the left if he or she is preparing to make a right turn.

[Mikeod]

Group Riding Guidelines (http://www.floridabicycle.org/rules/groups.html)


Stop Signs and Red Lights
Lead riders should stop at all stop signs and red lights—always respecting the right-of-way of others

Stop in the right-most lane in the direction of the route:

When traveling straight, use the right-most thru lane—never travel straight in a right-turn only lane. Merge left from a shoulder or bike lane to prevent right-turning motorists from cutting you off.
When turing right, use a right-turn only lane (if one is available)—do not stay in a shoulder or bike lane, this can cause the group to be pinched in the turn by a right-turning motorist.
When turning left, use the right-most left turn lane, unless the group plans to make another left turn from the new road.
At a stop, bunch-up and take control of the lane. This allows the group to proceed through the intersection as rapidly as possible. When it is time to move, accelerate up to speed (cross the intersection before clipping into the other pedal). After the intersection, the group should move into a line to the right as appropriate. Lead riders should slow to allow everyone to regroup.

Generally, it’s better to stop in the line of traffic and not pass stopped motorists on the right. When passing a queue of stopped traffic, lead riders should consider the following:

Is it possible that a motorist could turn right across the path of the cyclists?
Will passing be easy (bike lane or paved shoulder) or difficult (narrow lane) for motorists downstream of the signal?
A lead rider who does pass on the right should not overtake the lead car in a stopped queue. Although stopped motorists preparing to turn right are supposed to signal and be positioned as far right as practical, some neglect to do this. At a stop sign or light, only pass a single motorist on the left if he or she is preparing to make a right turn.
If riders bunch up so a group stops at the sign, then proceeds as a bunched up group, I think they are following the guidelines.I wouldn't have a problem with them doing that. It's when there is a stream of riders in a single line that blow through a yield or stop sign that people can get upset.

I can understand it breaks momentum and continuity to have to stop and/or yield at those signs,but, guess what, those of us in autos have to do it too. The fact that you are using a personal powered vehicle is not germane. If bicyclists want autos to obey the laws regarding separation and lane restrictions, they have to accfept the whole package of regulations as they apply to all vehicles.

Gary, I'm not implying you are not riding appropriately. I think there is good information for both cyclists and motorists here. Hopefully we can co-exist here in TV.