Marijuana

[Bucco]

I sure hope this is not considered political, and it should not be.

There are currently two states where marijuana is now legal. There is currently bi partisan legislation in our congress to actually legalize it across the country in order to tax it.

Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc.

I suspect I am showing my age, but what the heck are we doing in this country......we are destroying marriage with laws and morals of the country and now we are saying it is ok to take dope.....smoke something that will impair judgement so we can collect taxes !

Why are we discussing gun control.......a person smoking marijuana would be acceptable to buy guns with the current trend.

I am confused about the direction of this country for sure, and wanted to hear what anyone else feels about it.

I suspect I am alone, and not "with it"...seems most on here want this kind of stuff which they call being......I wont use the word I was going to as it would seem political.

But, the legalization of marijuana in a few states and more moving in that direction, the discussion that we should make it legal so we can tax it.......am I the only one who sees serious problems in the future. Marriage means nothing, you can smoke dope legally, BUT WE will have made sure that we can't load our guns quickly !!

[Ecuadog]

What do you think of alcohol?

[Roaddog53]

Hmmm. I am not for or against it. Depending on who is discussing it they will tell their side of why or why not it should be legalized. obviously you hear the medicinal sides but than the paranoia sides. To each there own. But.. What is the difference than between alcohol that we know is bad and causes all kinds of concerns that is legal but taxed heavily; cigarettes the same thing. Look what prohibition cost to try and control liquor. Sure we can say more stoners on the roads now along with drunks. Go on and on.
Looking on the brighter side, we could reduce the law enforcement agencies such as the DEA, locals, trying to do their thing on this and their enormous budgets, AND make more monies for the governments at the same time to blow on other issues. Just some thoughts.

[Bucco]

1. The discussion by our leaders is only to COLLECT TAX MONEY which was one of my points but not addressed. This while we try to engage folks in a serious discussion on gun laws. The answer to our deficit and a way to continue to spend...legalize and tax dope. Nice message.

2. Not a doctor, so cannot engage in a real conversation on marijuana affects except every single thing I have read says ONE puff can make you have affects including paranoia, etc. THAT, to me anyway, trumps alcohol.

Secondly, the premise I am reading is....well, we have this alcohol and we think it is bad, so heck lets just legalize marijuana....seems the two post on here use the mere existence of alcohol as a justification to legalize marijuana.

As I said, it must be me. We actually think we have serious conversations about gun control while at the same time we talk about legalizing something that has these affects. THAT makes no sense to me.

This country is no longer the country of ideals, self discipline....it is about the easy way out. Lets legalize crack.....tell me why not ? Anything and everything that may get in the way of our good time and instant gratification .

[ilovetv]

1. The discussion by our leaders is only to COLLECT TAX MONEY which was one of my points but not addressed. This while we try to engage folks in a serious discussion on gun laws. The answer to our deficit and a way to continue to spend...legalize and tax dope. Nice message.

2. Not a doctor, so cannot engage in a real conversation on marijuana affects except every single thing I have read says ONE puff can make you have affects including paranoia, etc. THAT, to me anyway, trumps alcohol.

Secondly, the premise I am reading is....well, we have this alcohol and we think it is bad, so heck lets just legalize marijuana....seems the two post on here use the mere existence of alcohol as a justification to legalize marijuana.

As I said, it must be me. We actually think we have serious conversations about gun control while at the same time we talk about legalizing something that has these affects. THAT makes no sense to me.

This country is no longer the country of ideals, self discipline....it is about the easy way out. Lets legalize crack.....tell me why not ? Anything and everything that may get in the way of our good time and instant gratification .

It's because being in a stupor is easier than working hard, saving money and being self-disciplined.

The saying for all this in the 60's was:

"If it feels good, do it."

It's all come home to roost.

[Down Sized]

What do you think of alcohol?

Ask this question to the alcoholics that go to the 18 A A meetings per week in The Village. Or the families of theses alcoholics that attend the 4 Al-Anon meetings a week just trying to survive the damage these alcoholics cause.
:popcorn:

[buggyone]

I am all for people having access to marijuana IF they have a genuine need such as the effects of chemo for cancer or other major sources of pain. Definitely, I do not feel that the prescriptions available over the Internet are valid and those people just want the legal way to smoke dope.

If there is a medical need - no problem. Otherwise, no marijuana.

As for the tax collecting part - if marijuana for medical need is made legal, tax it. Alcohol is taxed, cigarettes are taxed, condoms are taxed, tax marijuana for legal purposes too.

[rp001]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

[John_W]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

I couldn't agree more.

.

[DougB]

But, but, but smoking marIjuana leads to murder and being institutionalized in an asylum for the rest of your natural life. Didn't you ever have to watch the movie, "Reefer Madness" in high school?

[buggyone]

But, but, but smoking marIjuana leads to murder and being institutionalized in an asylum for the rest of your natural life. Didn't you ever have to watch the movie, "Reefer Madness" in high school?

Obviously, you are a lot older. I thought that movie was from the mid-1930 era. Glad that even real old folks like you are able to participate in an online forum.

[DougB]

Obviously, you are a lot older. I thought that movie was from the mid-1930 era. Glad that even real old folks like you are able to participate in an online forum.

No, i am a child of the 60's. Movie was made in 1936, originally titled "Tell Your Children", but we actually had to watch it in high school.

[Barefoot]

I was never a big user, but over 20 years I would guess 200 times. I started when I was in the Army stationed in Korea. The majority of the people in my unit smoked it, from the helicopter pilots to the controllers. I can tell you, the only times I was ever out of control or aggressive was when I was drunk on alcohol.

Smoking grass, the biggest entertainment was watching TV or listening to music, that's all you needed. If every alcoholic replaced their booze with grass, this would be a much better world. If you haven't tried it, then don't knock it. .

IMHO, if the government permits selling of alcohol, and limits the age of use, why wouldn't they monitor marijuana use in the same way. It's a profitable business, just ask the Drug Lords. A lot of critics base opinions on lack of knowledge. Of course grass shouldn't be used when driving or working. I know a lot of people on drugs for depression or anxiety. A little medical marijuana might really cheer them up. The biggest side effect is not aggression, but unrestrained hilarity.

[beartrack]

Some people drink alcoholic and become alcoholics. The vast majority of those that enjoy alcohol are not alcoholics. As a person that was in the business of selling alcohol, Disco's, sport bars and restaurants. I have seen thousands of folks drink responsibly and I have also seen my share of abusers of alcohol. It is my experience that other problems lead to the abusive behavior. Depression, marital problems and a myriad of others. In most cases the alcoholic is a person twenty five years old and up. Generally speaking they either eventually get help "AA" or continue down that path to their own distruction.

Pot smokers on the other hand usually start at a younger age. Most that I have seen start in their early teens. Whats the harm, they are just partying and having fun. Thats better then school work or a job or both in some cases. Gee that feels good the pot smoker says, lets try something stronger, a line of coke, then two and three and more and more. Hey that cost a lot of money. Crack is cheaper. Get the picture ?

I have seen people drink too much and get sick and have terrible hangovers. But I have also seen some of my friends lose their kids to overdoses of drugs. I myself have lost two dear friends years ago to overdoses. I have also helped to bury two teenage nephews because of overdoses of drugs. It is a known fact and for what it is worth, my very considered opinion, that the first step to drug abuse, is smoking pot.

[Monkei]

I sure hope this is not considered political, and it should not be.

There are currently two states where marijuana is now legal. There is currently bi partisan legislation in our congress to actually legalize it across the country in order to tax it.

Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc.

I suspect I am showing my age, but what the heck are we doing in this country......we are destroying marriage with laws and morals of the country and now we are saying it is ok to take dope.....smoke something that will impair judgement so we can collect taxes !

Why are we discussing gun control.......a person smoking marijuana would be acceptable to buy guns with the current trend.

I am confused about the direction of this country for sure, and wanted to hear what anyone else feels about it.

I suspect I am alone, and not "with it"...seems most on here want this kind of stuff which they call being......I wont use the word I was going to as it would seem political.

But, the legalization of marijuana in a few states and more moving in that direction, the discussion that we should make it legal so we can tax it.......am I the only one who sees serious problems in the future. Marriage means nothing, you can smoke dope legally, BUT WE will have made sure that we can't load our guns quickly !!

Sure sounded political to me and furthermore your choices and beliefs are now in the minority of this country good or bad. I think we are in no worse shape now than when our grandparents wondered where this country was heading when women got the right to vote.

[Golfingnut]

I am strictly Bud Light; however, I have known folks that have drank most of their life and I know several back home that even at our age have been puffing on the wacky weed for over 40 years. In my opinion, the pot heads seem to be of better health mentally and physically than the drinkers. I think if we searched hard enough you would find more Alcohol executives than Doctors taking offense to Marijuana. Just the fact that if you take 20 people in a room and have 10 smoke a few Marijuana cigarettes and 10 have a few drinks, then interview each one, you would find the pot smokers to be more lucid and controlled than the drinkers. Check out the link below.


I have heard of Drunk Drivers killing people, but pot drivers is less mentioned.

A link to Scientific American:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=the-truth-about-pot

[Cedwards38]

I am generally in favor or allowing personal choice in all things, as long as that choice does not harm others, destroy property, or violate any other laws that are necessary to guarantee life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for others

[babbs455]

I SAY decriminalize it..alot of the talk of marijane is just that talk..show me the studies.. I will show you studies that mj kills cancer...if u have the time...watch "Rick Simpsons Phoenix tears RUN FROM THE CURE" google it, then come back and tell me abou how bad this plant is. won't post the link coz no one will open it but google it and see for yourself...

[Tom Hannon]

Yes, I smoked a few joints during the 60's as did a large percentage of the baby boomer population and it didn't give me any ideas of going out and raping little old ladies, or shooting people. Whether or not it caused me any brain damage is a decision my TOTV friends have to judge. Although I do have a few friends that still smoke the crap, I don't believe it is addicting. Of course, the stuff people are smoking today is much stronger. And perhaps is more dangerous. But to give my opinion, I don't think it should be legalized as it does hinder your reflexes and I wouldn't want my kid riding with a bus driver who smoked weed, or the pilot flying the plane I'm in.

[Golfingnut]

Yes, I smoked a few joints during the 60's as did a large percentage of the baby boomer population and it didn't give me any ideas of going out and raping little old ladies, or shooting people. Whether or not it caused me any brain damage is a decision my TOTV friends have to judge. Although I do have a few friends that still smoke the crap, I don't believe it is addicting. Of course, the stuff people are smoking today is much stronger. And perhaps is more dangerous. But to give my opinion, I don't think it should be legalized as it does hinder your reflexes and I wouldn't want my kid riding with a bus driver who smoked weed, or the pilot flying the plane I'm in.

Not the point Tom. None of us would want the bus driver to be smoking pot, drinking alcohol nor even eating a foot long hero with fries and a coke while driving, but it is about individual freedom. Big business has a lock on alcohol, so that is why it is OK. Please compare a teen age kid after smoking a joint and one after drinking a bottle of Vodka. The smoker will be more likely to get home alive than the vodka drinker. This is not about protecting anyone, it is all about the almighty dollar. Alcohol is the fastest acting DOPE we have. I enjoy drinking, so I am living large in The Villages, but for those that find any alcohol distasteful, but wish to relax once in a while are being denied what I see as an individual right.

[Cantwaittoarrive]

I am generally in favor or allowing personal choice in all things, as long as that choice does not harm others, destroy property, or violate any other laws that are necessary to guarantee life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for others

My thoughts exactly. hard for me to say more without getting political, but I don't believe that personal behavior should be regulated as long as the only person it can hurt is the person engaged in this behaviour. This extended to behaviors I might not personally agree with.

[rp001]

Some people drink alcoholic and become alcoholics. The vast majority of those that enjoy alcohol are not alcoholics. As a person that was in the business of selling alcohol, Disco's, sport bars and restaurants. I have seen thousands of folks drink responsibly and I have also seen my share of abusers of alcohol. It is my experience that other problems lead to the abusive behavior. Depression, marital problems and a myriad of others. In most cases the alcoholic is a person twenty five years old and up. Generally speaking they either eventually get help "AA" or continue down that path to their own distruction.

Pot smokers on the other hand usually start at a younger age. Most that I have seen start in their early teens. Whats the harm, they are just partying and having fun. Thats better then school work or a job or both in some cases. Gee that feels good the pot smoker says, lets try something stronger, a line of coke, then two and three and more and more. Hey that cost a lot of money. Crack is cheaper. Get the picture ?

I have seen people drink too much and get sick and have terrible hangovers. But I have also seen some of my friends lose their kids to overdoses of drugs. I myself have lost two dear friends years ago to overdoses. I have also helped to bury two teenage nephews because of overdoses of drugs. It is a known fact and for what it is worth, my very considered opinion, that the first step to drug abuse, is smoking pot.


I was raised ultra conservative. I didn't think of trying this till in the late 20's. Even in Vietnam I wouldn't think of using this. Later I did try it and realized it was just hype, for whatever reason. Never once did I, or any of my friends EVER wish to experiment with more proven, dangerous drugs. I did know many folks, sadly, that experimented with the many dangerous drugs that are out there. Sadly some are no longer on this earth. They were NOT pot smokers. The whole notion that pot smoking leads to this dangerous side is just plain gibberish. I think "Experimenters" are doing it just for the ability to be anti establishment, and would try the dangerous ones no matter what. The plain truth is we as a nation cannot afford to keep stocking our prisons and jails with convicted Pot Smokers.

[JoeC1947]

The biggest issue with using marijuana is eating too much and getting a "pot belly":mmmm:

[Golfingnut]

I was raised ultra conservative. I didn't think of trying this till in the late 20's. Even in Vietnam I wouldn't think of using this. Later I did try it and realized it was just hype, for whatever reason. Never once did I, or any of my friends EVER wish to experiment with more proven, dangerous drugs. I did know many folks, sadly, that experimented with the many dangerous drugs that are out there. Sadly some are no longer on this earth. They were NOT pot smokers. The whole notion that pot smoking leads to this dangerous side is just plain gibberish. I think "Experimenters" are doing it just for the ability to be anti establishment, and would try the dangerous ones no matter what. The plain truth is we as a nation cannot afford to keep stocking our prisons and jails with convicted Pot Smokers.

Every point in this post is spot on accurate. You have done proper research.

:beer3::BigApplause:

[JoeC1947]

Obviously, you are a lot older. I thought that movie was from the mid-1930 era. Glad that even real old folks like you are able to participate in an online forum.

Boy Howdy!

[Barefoot]

The whole notion that pot smoking leads to this dangerous side is just plain gibberish. I think "Experimenters" are doing it just for the ability to be anti establishment, and would try the dangerous ones no matter what. The plain truth is we as a nation cannot afford to keep stocking our prisons and jails with convicted Pot Smokers.

Pot smoking is happening. Drug kings are profiting. Pot is being sold to children and teenagers. Ignoring problems doesn't make them go away. Prohibition didn't work. Ignoring pot smoking and arresting users isn't working either. Why not regulate marijuana, hopefully making it less available to children and teens. The US Government can use the profits to fund the health-care system.

[blueash]

J Sch Health. 2012 Aug;82(8):371-9. doi: 10.1111/j.1746-1561.2012.00712.x.

Alcohol as a gateway drug: a study of US 12th graders.

Kirby T, Barry AE.


Source

Organizational Development, Franciscan St. Elizabeth Health, 1501 Hartford Street - Room G137, Lafayette, IN 47904, USA. tristan.kirby@franciscanalliance.org


Abstract

BACKGROUND:

The Gateway Drug Theory suggests that licit drugs, such as tobacco and alcohol, serve as a "gateway" toward the use of other, illicit drugs. However, there remains some discrepancy regarding which drug-alcohol, tobacco, or even marijuana-serves as the initial "gateway" drug subsequently leading to the use of illicit drugs such as cocaine and heroin. The purpose of this investigation was to determine which drug (alcohol, tobacco, or marijuana) was the actual "gateway" drug leading to additional substance use among a nationally representative sample of high school seniors.

METHODS:

This investigation conducted a secondary analysis of the 2008 Monitoring the Future 12th-grade data. Initiation into alcohol, tobacco, and other drug use was analyzed using a Guttman scale. Coefficients of reliability and scalability were calculated to evaluate scale fit. Subsequent cross tabulations and chi-square test for independence were conducted to better understand the relationship between the identified gateway drug and other substances' use.

RESULTS:

Results from the Guttman scale indicated that alcohol represented the "gateway" drug, leading to the use of tobacco, marijuana, and other illicit substances. Moreover, students who used alcohol exhibited a significantly greater likelihood of using both licit and illicit drugs.

CONCLUSION:

The findings from this investigation support that alcohol should receive primary attention in school-based substance abuse prevention programming, as the use of other substances could be impacted by delaying or preventing alcohol use. Therefore, it seems prudent for school and public health officials to focus prevention efforts, policies, and monies, on addressing adolescent alcohol use.

[paulandjean]

Pot is sold to kids and teenagers, but lots and lots being sold to adults. I am talking older generation,60 and 70 year olds. There have been a few nights at the squares,with the wind blowing the right direction, the smell of some pot drifted in the air.Think the covered area with the picnic tables always has been a good spot.

[rp001]

Pot is sold to kids and teenagers, but lots and lots being sold to adults. I am talking older generation,60 and 70 year olds. There have been a few nights at the squares,with the wind blowing the right direction, the smell of some pot drifted in the air.Think the covered area with the picnic tables always has been a good spot.


Wow, I didn't know that. I may have to go there now..lol

[Barefoot]

Pot is sold to kids and teenagers, but lots and lots being sold to adults. I am talking older generation,60 and 70 year olds. There have been a few nights at the squares,with the wind blowing the right direction, the smell of some pot drifted in the air.Think the covered area with the picnic tables always has been a good spot.


Wow, I didn't know that. I may have to go there now..lol

Another TOTV meeting place! :girlneener:

[Bogie Shooter]

What's wrong with a little marjie jo among friends?

[Monkei]

The war on drugs was and continues to be a war we cannot win and one which has become a bottomless pit of funding.

[rp001]

Another TOTV meeting place! :girlneener:


I know that in that atmosphere even a political discussion would be civil. Of course no one would remember it the next day...

[DDoug]

Boogie its call Mary Jane least where I went to school. But agree tax it limit the acreage that it came be grown on. Make the money from it instead of spending

[karostay]

:crap2::crap2: How about a medical dispensary located at the huts on the town squares

[Barefoot]

:crap2::crap2:
How about a medical dispensary located at the huts on the town squares

It gives new meaning to the term "Happy Hour". :angel:

[Trish Crocker]

No, i am a child of the 60's. Movie was made in 1936, originally titled "Tell Your Children", but we actually had to watch it in high school.

did it help? :)

[Trish Crocker]

I was in my forties...went over to my aunt and uncle's house..you know, typical old aunt and uncle...found my aunt and my mother smoking a joint! I was sooo naive.

[senior citizen]

I was raised ultra conservative. I didn't think of trying this till in the late 20's. Even in Vietnam I wouldn't think of using this. Later I did try it and realized it was just hype, for whatever reason. Never once did I, or any of my friends EVER wish to experiment with more proven, dangerous drugs. I did know many folks, sadly, that experimented with the many dangerous drugs that are out there. Sadly some are no longer on this earth. They were NOT pot smokers. The whole notion that pot smoking leads to this dangerous side is just plain gibberish. I think "Experimenters" are doing it just for the ability to be anti establishment, and would try the dangerous ones no matter what. The plain truth is we as a nation cannot afford to keep stocking our prisons and jails with convicted Pot Smokers.

Not sure if hashish is just a stronger marijuana or not.....but a neighbor's son, back in the Viet Nam era, got into hashish and later on, in his early 60's was diagnosed with Alzheimers. The docs claimed it was from the drug he smoked when younger, during the Viet Nam era. He became very confused, forgetful, etc. at age 60* and died at age 61. He went fast.
*According to his ex wife and daughter, he might have had it earlier than 60, but that was when he was diagnosed. He was treated at a clinic that was doing a study on the effects of the Viet Nam generation that did hashish.

[Golfingnut]

Not sure if hashish is just a stronger marijuana or not.....but a neighbor's son, back in the Viet Nam era, got into hashish and later on, in his early 60's was diagnosed with Alzheimers. The docs claimed it was from the drug he smoked when younger, during the Viet Nam era. He became very confused, forgetful, etc. at age 60* and died at age 61. He went fast.
*According to his ex wife and daughter, he might have had it earlier than 60, but that was when he was diagnosed. He was treated at a clinic that was doing a study on the effects of the Viet Nam generation that did hashish.


:ohdear:

[Xavier]

Hmmm, I wonder if the response given is what the original poster expected.

Forcing one's personal ideology on everyone else is becoming so out of fashion. I'm just saying...

Xavier

[Golfingnut]

Hmmm, I wonder if the response given is what the original poster expected.

Forcing one's personal ideology on everyone else is becoming so out of fashion. I'm just saying...

Xavier

So True. What I find fascinating is how incredibly gullible folks are. My eyes roll back in my head when I read comments like:

I heard BLAH BLAH and without any verification or reliable source, it is taken as cut in stone FACT. My question; is this due to being Stupid, Lazy or Just don't care. We all should have left the gossip and guessing about things that are important or could cause mental or physical harm to someone in the middle school playground. I would ask that if you do not know, ask; however, if you don't know, NEVER answer someones serious question with a guess or WELL I HEARD etc.

[Bucco]

Hmmm, I wonder if the response given is what the original poster expected.

Forcing one's personal ideology on everyone else is becoming so out of fashion. I'm just saying...

Xavier

1. I do not think what has transpired is what I expected.

2. Not sure what you are speaking of in regards to "Forcing one's personal ideology on everyone else is becoming so out of fashion"
It appears to me that those who preach to be tolerant are the most intolerant when it comes to how others feel.

The point of the post was that in the midst of a supposed conversation on gun control and mental health as it relates, it is a bit ironic that our leaders of both parties are considering making legal a drug that ALL studies show has a very serious effect, especially on young folks, in increased paranoia. This in the name of raising taxes instead of cutting spending.

I find that ironic


I also will add that those who preach that you should be able to do anything you want if it makes you feel good as long as it does not effect anyone else must have a different definition of effect, as I believe that anything that destroys the fabric of this country or does harm to anyone, even though it is not me, DOES effect me !!!!

But again, not surprised that I appear to be in the minority when it comes to this kind of thing. I apologize to those who read this and found it intolerant, and bow to the very "tolerant" of you who feel I am old fashioned, political or whatever tag you find for someone who does not agree with you.

And I also apologize to those of you who feel that the MERE existance of alcohol justifies the legalization of this drug.

[2BNTV]

I think the only place for marijuana is for those who need it for medical reasons.

Somehow, I can't buy into general use, as some people will not react in a traditional manner, as I am assuming the effect it will have, is different, for each person. I can't buy into the powers that be, need to tap this as a source of revenue.

What ever happened to a balance budget where one doesn't spend more than monies that are collected for revenue. Maybe that's an over simplication of how monies are to be utilized.

At one time, we have a surplus of money. GOD forbid we should go back to those times. :smiley:

[Golfingnut]

Good discussion and great points on both FOR and AGAINST pot. I think it would be better than alcohol for society in whole, but since I love beer and don't have anything to do with pot, I say if we can't have both, THEN KEEP YER HANDS OFF MY BUD LIGHT. LOL I hear you loud and clear Bucco and I find nothing wrong with your thoughts on the matter nor can I come up with any argument to prove you wrong so, :beer3: on.

[PennBF]

It is obvious that few have treated the addicts be it Alcohol, Marijuana, Coke, Herion, Meth, etc.etc. Will not get on the "soap box" but would add that (a) Alcohol is the only drug that attacks every organ of your body, (b) marijuana studies have shown that (i) it is a gateway drug and (ii) its effect on those that start at a younger age has a terrible effect in later years, (c) most will not die from coke overdose but will be pretty darn sick. There is a better chance of dying from overdrinking. As I said no "soap box" but to take positions on any drug usage without the
proper knowledge is at best not responsible and at worse making it appear the usage is not effecting the body/mind in any serious way. :bowdown:

[Suzi]

Good discussion. I see the point some make that alcohol causes major bodily problems if used excessively. And, if we accept that alcohol in large quanities is not good for you, why do we want to legalize another substance that has potential to do harm? What are the criteria for bodily harm: 1 joint=feeling good? 2 joints=unsafe driving?
3 joints=falling down the stairs? Do we question that smoking is bad for the lungs?
Do we question that we need more impaired drivers on the road? Do we question that we need more excuses for people to be incapable of work, supporting a family, parenting?
We already have alcohol that is legal and have all the consequences associated with it. Do we really want to legalize another drug and accept all the consequences that come with it? Will you feel any differently if a loved one gets killed on the road by an intoxicated pot driver versus a person intoxicated by alcohol or drugs......knowing that you VOTED to have another drug legalized?
I get it....believe me I do....I struggle with this concept myself. I want the $$$$ taken out of the equation - theft etc to support habits - but I'm also scared of the repercussions to our society.

[janmcn]

The two states that legalized marijuana, CO and OR, did so after a ballot initiative was approved by the voters. To the best of my knowledge, the FL Legislature is proposing no such legislation. If TV residents want marijuana to be legal, they would have to get the signatures needed to get it on the ballot.

[Barefoot]

Good discussion. I see the point some make that alcohol causes major bodily problems if used excessively. And, if we accept that alcohol in large quanities is not good for you, why do we want to legalize another substance that has potential to do harm? What are the criteria for bodily harm: 1 joint=feeling good? 2 joints=unsafe driving?
3 joints=falling down the stairs? Do we question that smoking is bad for the lungs?
Do we question that we need more impaired drivers on the road? Do we question that we need more excuses for people to be incapable of work, supporting a family, parenting?
We already have alcohol that is legal and have all the consequences associated with it. Do we really want to legalize another drug and accept all the consequences that come with it? Will you feel any differently if a loved one gets killed on the road by an intoxicated pot driver versus a person intoxicated by alcohol or drugs......knowing that you VOTED to have another drug legalized?
I get it....believe me I do....I struggle with this concept myself. I want the $$$$ taken out of the equation - theft etc to support habits - but I'm also scared of the repercussions to our society.

I'm not arguing with your comments. Based on the logic in your post, we should return to Prohibition. It would hopefully protect people against themselves. It would make the roads safer, people healthier, and protect the fabric of this country. Who doesn't want that?

But then people would obtain alcohol illegally and continue to use it, and this is what is happening today with marijuana. If people are going to use alcohol and marijuana illegally, the licensing of it gives the government some control over who uses it. Hopefully it will stop being sold in schools and playgrounds. And the revenues bring much-need monies for iniatives to feed hungry children, give them health care and fund other valuable programs.

[Bucco]

The two states that legalized marijuana, CO and OR, did so after a ballot initiative was approved by the voters. To the best of my knowledge, the FL Legislature is proposing no such legislation. If TV residents want marijuana to be legal, they would have to get the signatures needed to get it on the ballot.

I think that everyone realizes that it requires a state to pass legislation.....my point was our FEDERAL LAWMAKERS considering legislation to tax WHEN state laws are passed.

The laissez faire attitude of our government on this issue while discussing gun control and mental health at the same time, to me, is a bit disturbing. Is it a laissez faire attitude...an attitude of it isnt hurting me so why worry....

"The U.S. Justice Department has yet to clarify its stance on the issue, but..... has said it does not make sense for the federal government to focus on recreational drug users in such states, given limited government resources and growing public acceptance."


Marijuana Legalization Bill, Federal Taxation Measure Set For Introduction In Congress (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/05/marijuana-legalization-bill_n_2623528.html)

We will get on tv and argue the pros and cons of mental health as it relates to guns, and at the same time have this attitude toward a drug, that despite those who really think it is fine, it is not.

Again, I do not believe that "if it does not hurt me NOW or PERSONALLY, then it is ok" That is a bit arrogant and self absorbed to me.

[sharonga]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

AGREE 100%:girlneener:

[sharonga]

Don't knock it if you haven't tried it. At this point in life I think a little marijuana is a lot better than a bottle of scotch, rum, or whatever they are drinking as their golf cart swerves from road to road!!!!!

[sharonga]

Did you also see the Tingler??????

[Mikeod]

I'm not arguing with your comments. Based on the logic in your post, we should return to Prohibition. It would hopefully protect people against themselves. It would make the roads safer, people healthier, and protect the fabric of this country. Who doesn't want that?

But then people would obtain alcohol illegally and continue to use it, and this is what is happening today with marijuana. If people are going to use alcohol and marijuana illegally, the licensing of it gives the government some control over who uses it. Hopefully it will stop being sold in schools and playgrounds. And the revenues bring much-need monies for iniatives to feed hungry children, give them health care and fund other valuable programs.
I don't think that's what svgephart meant at all. My take was that since we already have a legal substance that has potential to cause all the problems associated with it, why do we want to legalize another substance with potential problems associated with it. IOW, why add to the problems?

As far as the government having some control over it, you've got to be kidding if you think that would stop it being sold in schools and playgrounds. Whatever age they establish for legal use of pot, you can bet there will be many sales of pot in middle schools and high schools, and probably some elementary schools. Hey, if mom and dad can get high, and it looks cool, I want some!!! Makes me look cool. It's already illegal, yet still available. What's government "control" going to do to prevent underage use? How effective has that been with alcohol?

[rubicon]

The advocates arguments being advanced to promote the use of marijuana are just nonsense. What in the world has happen to us? Instead of getting high on life's pursuits of knowledge life's goal, dream occupation , adventure etc we have lowered ourselves to getting high on dope. That's it! Seriousy!. A person's life ambition is demanding the right to get high!

Shades of Cheech and Chong!. Stop the world I need to get off.

[Golfingnut]

The advocates arguments being advanced to promote the use of marijuana are just nonsense. What in the world has happen to us? Instead of getting high on life's pursuits of knowledge life's goal, dream occupation , adventure etc we have lowered ourselves to getting high on dope. That's it! Seriousy!. A person's life ambition is demanding the right to get high!

Shades of Cheech and Chong!. Stop the world I need to get off.

Were retired and most of us have met or exceeded our life's goals, competed and retired from our occupation, have traveled the world and now live in the villages and want to get our buzz on. What is so unamerican about that? I think folks are just wanting the Government to stop meddling in our lives and let us have our constitutional freedoms. I have my freedom because I am a beer and bourbon drinker, and if my fellow American neighbors wish to smoke their way to the Buzz, I feel they have that right as an American. Who was it that chose Alcohol over Pot to begin with. I know my alcohol is a blend of poisons brewed up by man where pot is a plant provided by God that anyone can grow in the garden beside your tomato's and carrots.

[JoeC1947]

The advocates arguments being advanced to promote the use of marijuana are just nonsense. What in the world has happen to us? Instead of getting high on life's pursuits of knowledge life's goal, dream occupation , adventure etc we have lowered ourselves to getting high on dope. That's it! Seriousy!. A person's life ambition is demanding the right to get high!

Shades of Cheech and Chong!. Stop the world I need to get off.

People have been getting high on one thing or another forever. This is nothing new. Remember when coke was in coke?

[mulligan]

I'd love to know what was in those "peace pipes" the Indians.....ooooppps Native Americans were smoking.

[SALYBOW]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

I find it curious that we , the reefer generation have our knickers in a twist about pot. Our generation used it as did those that followed us. I am an adult child of an alcoholic and have a family riddled with alcoholism. I also know some of my younger relatives who smoke pot. I am much less worried about the effects of pot than I am of alcohol.

To the poster who posted this:
" Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc." Please cite your sources.

I had a discussion with my son who is a physician and he said it is probably less problematic than alcohol, but it is illegal. Since I tend to be an addictive personality I stay away from the whole banana. My son was at |Margarita republic the other night and a guy he met there told him most of the people who frequent that place toke. "This is just an opinion before you get all over me." He also said it is readily available in TV.
I am going to go out on a limb and say that I might rather have them selling pot at the bait shacks that alcohol. Our rate of alcoholism in TV is way too high. I saw the effects of it all the time as a chaplain but I don't think I ever saw someone admitted due to pot use.
I wonder why we cannot be happy with ourselves the way God made us instead of have to alter our minds so often. We live in paradise for heavens sake! :spoken:

[buggyone]

People have been getting high on one thing or another forever. This is nothing new. Remember when coke was in coke?

Wow, I guess we do have some old-timers in The Villages if you were around when cocaine was in Coca-Cola. It was removed (according to the Internet!) in 1903. Congratulations on being over 110 years old and knowing how to post on this forum at that age.

[Bucco]

I find it curious that we , the reefer generation have our knickers in a twist about pot. Our generation used it as did those that followed us. I am an adult child of an alcoholic and have a family riddled with alcoholism. I also know some of my younger relatives who smoke pot. I am much less worried about the effects of pot than I am of alcohol.

To the poster who posted this:
" Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc." Please cite your sources.

I had a discussion with my son who is a physician and he said it is probably less problematic than alcohol, but it is illegal. Since I tend to be an addictive personality I stay away from the whole banana. My son was at |Margarita republic the other night and a guy he met there told him most of the people who frequent that place toke. "This is just an opinion before you get all over me." He also said it is readily available in TV.
I am going to go out on a limb and say that I might rather have them selling pot at the bait shacks that alcohol. Our rate of alcoholism in TV is way too high. I saw the effects of it all the time as a chaplain but I don't think I ever saw someone admitted due to pot use.
I wonder why we cannot be happy with ourselves the way God made us instead of have to alter our minds so often. We live in paradise for heavens sake! :spoken:

"To the poster who posted this:
" Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc." Please cite your sources."

From the NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF HEALTH...

"Use of synthetic marijuana (also known as spice, K2, aroma, and eclipse) is often viewed by young people as harmless recreation. Until recently, the substance was freely available in U.S. convenience stores and head shops, and it is still available via the Internet. Emerging evidence shows a wide range of responses to the drug, including paranoia, aggressive behavior, anxiety, and short-term memory deficits. Synthetic cannabinoids are not currently detectable via standard toxicology tests. Recognition and management of synthetic cannabinoid use are discussed."

Risky recreation: syntheti... [J Psychosoc Nurs Ment Health Serv. 2012] - PubMed - NCBI (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22801822)

From TIME magazine health editor

"Paranoia is one of the most unpleasant “side effects” of marijuana. It’s also a key experience shared by marijuana smokers and people with schizophrenia. But exactly how does smoking a joint cause the feeling that dark forces are conspiring to do you wrong?"


A Rat Study Helps Explain Why Pot Smokers and People With Schizophrenia Are Paranoid | TIME.com (http://healthland.time.com/2011/04/06/why-pot-smokers-are-paranoid/)


From CBS news in 2009

"ew findings on marijuana's damaging effect on the brain show the drug triggers temporary psychotic symptoms in some people, including hallucinations and paranoid delusions, doctors say.

British doctors took brain scans of 15 healthy volunteers given small doses of two of the active ingredients of cannabis, as well as a placebo.

One compound, cannabidiol, or CBD, made people more relaxed. But even small doses of another component, tetrahydrocannabinol, or THC, produced temporary psychotic symptoms in people, including hallucinations and paranoid delusions, doctors said.

The results, to be presented at an international mental health conference in London on Tuesday and Wednesday, provides physical evidence of the drug's damaging influence on the human brain.

"We've long suspected that cannabis is linked to psychoses, but we have never before had scans to show how the mechanism works," said Dr. Philip McGuire, a professor of psychiatry at King's College, London."




Doctors: Marijuana Triggers Psychosis - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-204_162-2746434.html)

I am sure it does not affect everyone this way, but according to the government, the effect on young people is much more than described above.

AGAIN, those who say "who does it hurt" and we have a "right" to do whatever we want are diluting themselves. If it hurts the fabric of our country, it hurts you.

Meanwhile we continue to be holier than thou and have a gun debate and the mental aspects of gun ownership while we move closer to making this stuff legal !

[Bucco]

This from the NATIONAL INSTITUTE ON DRUG ABUSE...

"
Effects on Life

Research clearly demonstrates that marijuana has the potential to cause problems in daily life or make a per-son's existing problems worse. In fact, heavy marijuana users generally re-port lower life satisfaction, poorer mental and physical health, relation-ship problems, and less academic and career success compared to their peers who came from similar back-grounds. For example, marijuana use is associated with a higher likelihood of dropping out from school. Several studies also associate workers' mariju-ana smoking with increased absences, tardiness, accidents, workers' com-pensation claims, and job turnover.


Now continue saying it does not matter what others do as long as "it doesn't bother the rest"......it does. All actions like those described in this and others affect ME because it affects the fiber of the country !

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

What do you think of alcohol?

The difference between marijuana and alcohol is that many people have one or two drinks, often with a meal with little or no effect on them. People smoke marijuana for one reason, and one reason only, to get high.

People sit around and have a drink or two while socializing, watching sports or playing pool without getting drunk. People do not do that with marijuana.

Alcoholic beverages are produce under very controlled circumstances with government inspections and regulations guiding exactly what and what cannot be done. Who knows who is growing marijuana and what it is mixed with.

[JoeC1947]

The difference between marijuana and alcohol is that many people have one or two drinks, often with a meal with little or no effect on them. People smoke marijuana for one reason, and one reason only, to get high.

People sit around and have a drink or two while socializing, watching sports or playing pool without getting drunk. People do not do that with marijuana.

Alcoholic beverages are produce under very controlled circumstances with government inspections and regulations guiding exactly what and what cannot be done. Who knows who is growing marijuana and what it is mixed with.

You're bumming me out man.

[rp001]

And the establishment speaks....Have any of the naysayers even tried it? Probably not and continue to speak without any personal knowledge..Unbelievable is all I can say...No I am not paranoid, nor psychotic, nor are any of my friends, prominent businessmen, educators, and legal profession..Give me a break. They continue to speak the diatribe of the same folks that have been saying these things since the 60's.

[shcisamax]

IMHO, if the government permits selling of alcohol, and limits the age of use, why wouldn't they monitor marijuana use in the same way. It's a profitable business, just ask the Drug Lords. A lot of critics base opinions on lack of knowledge. Of course grass shouldn't be used when driving or working. I know a lot of people on drugs for depression or anxiety. A little medical marijuana might really cheer them up. The biggest side effect is not aggression, but unrestrained hilarity.

Yes, grass shouldn't be used when driving ...LIKE ALCOHOL... especially because people get laughing so hard they can't see through the tears running down their face :)

[Barefoot]

The difference between marijuana and alcohol is that many people have one or two drinks, often with a meal with little or no effect on them. People smoke marijuana for one reason, and one reason only, to get high.

I think people have a couple of drinks to relax. I think people have a couple of tokes of MJ to relax. Or at least that's what people tell me. :angel:

[shcisamax]

You're bumming me out man.


:a20:

[Bucco]

And the establishment speaks....Have any of the naysayers even tried it? Probably not and continue to speak without any personal knowledge..Unbelievable is all I can say...No I am not paranoid, nor psychotic, nor are any of my friends, prominent businessmen, educators, and legal profession..Give me a break. They continue to speak the diatribe of the same folks that have been saying these things since the 60's.

Yeah, you have a point....that National Institute of Health, that dirty Institute of Drug Abuse...they just flat out lie UNLESS they say what we want them to say, hey ? My point exactly.

Oh, and I have not tried crack.....have you ? Should I try it just to be able to speak to how it damaged things ?

I am not sure of your point. The fact that you smoke or smoked pot and have found no bad affects and the fact that I never smoked it means exactly what ?

We are losing our way here...my original post questioned the government of the United States who has said it will not take any action against those who smoke it even though it is illegal because "is becoming accepted" but to my knowledge has never had any discussion on it and whose own departments of health warn about it is the same government who now fosters a debate on gun control and the mental health of those who might buy a gun, and the same government who is ready now to tax heavily WHEN it becomes legal.

Am I the only one who sees so many conflicts working here ?

I do see a trend in the posts. Whatever feels good for me I should have the RIGHT to do no matter what. And if I cannot see the affects on others, then there are none. Seems to be the trend !!!!

[gustavo]

.....Am I the only one who sees so many conflicts working here ?

Apparently, yes.

[villagerjack]

Ever wonder why you want to step away from reality and alter your senses?

[Golfingnut]

Lets leave Crack and synthetic drugs out of the discussion. Using them here just confuses the point of this thread. And since you can find studies that support both sides of this argument, I agree, that if you have no personal experience with pot, you are only guessing and guessing is not a wise tool for debates.

[JoeC1947]

Dude, Where's My Golf Cart?

[Xavier]

This from the NATIONAL INSTITUTE ON DRUG ABUSE...

"
Effects on Life

Research clearly demonstrates that marijuana has the potential to cause problems in daily life or make a per-son's existing problems worse. In fact, heavy marijuana users generally re-port lower life satisfaction, poorer mental and physical health, relation-ship problems, and less academic and career success compared to their peers who came from similar back-grounds. For example, marijuana use is associated with a higher likelihood of dropping out from school. Several studies also associate workers' mariju-ana smoking with increased absences, tardiness, accidents, workers' com-pensation claims, and job turnover.


Now continue saying it does not matter what others do as long as "it doesn't bother the rest"......it does. All actions like those described in this and others affect ME because it affects the fiber of the country !

Maybe I missed it, have you provided the applicable source that states that the primary reason for legalizing MJ is so that it can be taxed? Or, is that a conclusion that you leaped to? Talk about paranoia. What they be smokin" in the hills of Pennsylvania? I grew up there and we didn't have none of THAT stuff!

Now "Low Blood Sugar" is a TRIP you don't want to take! Don't be walkin', talkin', jivin', drivin' or even tokin' when that happens.

Xavier (with just a touch of humor)

[Golfingnut]

Why not say: people that are likely to have absences, tardiness, accidents, workers' compensation claims, and job turnover also tend to drink and smoke grass to fill in there free time. Don't blame the weed for someones laziness or lack of work ethics. We have those folks that do not touch weed yet are not worth their salt. Maybe if they smoked a joint for breakfast, they would find pleasure in their job and do it better. Track the funding for studies that find it harmful and you may very well have a line leading to the alcohol industry.

[Quixote]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

I also couldn't agree more! Just because something is LEGAL does not REQUIRE people to use it. I personally do not eat fried foods for health reasons. Does that mean that I should go on a campaign to make "Would you like fries with that?" illegal? What happened to "live and let live" (assuming it's something that is legal)? People can responsibly make their own choices--and take responsibility for them.

[Quixote]

Dude, Where's My Golf Cart?

But I do, from time to time! This is me now (and likely many of us, willing to admit it or not), without a single mood/mind/memory altering substance....

[Patty55]

You know, back in the day I might not have been so paranoid if it hadn't been so illegal.

[mickey100]

I'd be a lot more worried if my kids or grandkids were smoking cigarettes than smoking pot.

[tommy steam]

But, but, but smoking marIjuana leads to murder and being institutionalized in an asylum for the rest of your natural life. Didn't you ever have to watch the movie, "Reefer Madness" in high school?

I just knew someone wrought bring that up. rotfl:

[tommy steam]

:ohdear:

I agree.....Viet 66-67

[rp001]

Yeah, you have a point....that National Institute of Health, that dirty Institute of Drug Abuse...they just flat out lie UNLESS they say what we want them to say, hey ? My point exactly.

Oh, and I have not tried crack.....have you ? Should I try it just to be able to speak to how it damaged things ?

I am not sure of your point. The fact that you smoke or smoked pot and have found no bad affects and the fact that I never smoked it means exactly what ?

We are losing our way here...my original post questioned the government of the United States who has said it will not take any action against those who smoke it even though it is illegal because "is becoming accepted" but to my knowledge has never had any discussion on it and whose own departments of health warn about it is the same government who now fosters a debate on gun control and the mental health of those who might buy a gun, and the same government who is ready now to tax heavily WHEN it becomes legal.

Am I the only one who sees so many conflicts working here ?

I do see a trend in the posts. Whatever feels good for me I should have the RIGHT to do no matter what. And if I cannot see the affects on others, then there are none. Seems to be the trend !!!!


And you trust the opinions of these folks?...Just Say No

[senior citizen]

Long-term effects of cannabis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Long-term_effects_of_cannabis&printable=yes)


Please read this in its entirety to get the full gist of the research........


We’ve know a few folks who did smoke marijuana or hashish for a decade or more.........during the Viet Nam era.


They did have fertility issues, they did have mood disturbances, they did have early onset Alzheimers that was diagnosed as having come from smoking hashish in the 1960’s.


We’ve never done any kind of drugs ourselves, however, do know of a few that had ill effects “down the road”.......as they aged.


I understand they are “talking about” having Vermont join Colorado as one of the states where pot will be legalized.


If you could only see the “pot heads” sitting on the corners in downtown Denver.........with their signs.........who needs that?


Who needs their children or grandchildren exposed to that? Anyway, please scroll all the way down after clicking on above hyperlink...........


We were teens in the early 1960’s; about aged 25 when we moved to Vermont. We were warned about all the “hippies on pot”.....ha ha.


They were the nicest people; highly educated from Skidmore College, etc.............but they all aged very very quickly if you saw them now.


I guess we raised our family when it was “Just Say NO” to drugs.........and luckily our kids escaped all that............

[rp001]

I think that everyone realizes that it requires a state to pass legislation.....my point was our FEDERAL LAWMAKERS considering legislation to tax WHEN state laws are passed.

The laissez faire attitude of our government on this issue while discussing gun control and mental health at the same time, to me, is a bit disturbing. Is it a laissez faire attitude...an attitude of it isnt hurting me so why worry....

"The U.S. Justice Department has yet to clarify its stance on the issue, but..... has said it does not make sense for the federal government to focus on recreational drug users in such states, given limited government resources and growing public acceptance."


Marijuana Legalization Bill, Federal Taxation Measure Set For Introduction In Congress (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/05/marijuana-legalization-bill_n_2623528.html)

We will get on tv and argue the pros and cons of mental health as it relates to guns, and at the same time have this attitude toward a drug, that despite those who really think it is fine, it is not.

Again, I do not believe that "if it does not hurt me NOW or PERSONALLY, then it is ok" That is a bit arrogant and self absorbed to me.


I find it intolerable that you have passed judgement on those that disagree with your opinion. To describe others as "self absorbed and arrogant" is a bit much. Especially when we speak of personal knowledge vs your government sponsored diatribe that has been proven nonsensical since it's inception. People are demanding their freedoms and it's about time. We are not here to pass our ideals on everyone else and then condemn them for their own...Just MY HUMBLE OPINION!

[JoeC1947]

I forgot what we were talking about.

[Xavier]

I fear that in the Original Poster's mind there is no right unless it's his right. Right? It sounds like something that is happening on the National Level as well.

IMHO it's time to close the thread.

Xavier

[JoeC1947]

I fear that in the Original Poster's mind there is no right unless it's his right. Right? It sounds like something that is happening on the National Level as well.

IMHO it's time to close the thread.

Xavier

Boy Howdy!

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

I was raised ultra conservative. I didn't think of trying this till in the late 20's. Even in Vietnam I wouldn't think of using this. Later I did try it and realized it was just hype, for whatever reason. Never once did I, or any of my friends EVER wish to experiment with more proven, dangerous drugs. I did know many folks, sadly, that experimented with the many dangerous drugs that are out there. Sadly some are no longer on this earth. They were NOT pot smokers. The whole notion that pot smoking leads to this dangerous side is just plain gibberish. I think "Experimenters" are doing it just for the ability to be anti establishment, and would try the dangerous ones no matter what. The plain truth is we as a nation cannot afford to keep stocking our prisons and jails with convicted Pot Smokers.

My former wife was a substance abuse counselor at a rehab facility. Their data showed that almost 100% of heroin users used marijuana as their first drug.

[Mr Hanky]

[QUOTE=Dr Winston O Boogie jr;623280]My former wife was a substance abuse counselor at a rehab facility. Their data showed that almost 100% of heroin users used marijuana as their first drug.

And nearly 100% of weed smokers never have tried heroin or ever will!

[Bucco]

I find it intolerable that you have passed judgement on those that disagree with your opinion. To describe others as "self absorbed and arrogant" is a bit much. Especially when we speak of personal knowledge vs your government sponsored diatribe that has been proven nonsensical since it's inception. People are demanding their freedoms and it's about time. We are not here to pass our ideals on everyone else and then condemn them for their own...Just MY HUMBLE OPINION!

That is my opinion, and I suppose I should apologize for sharing my opinion, which I stated as such, because you dont agree.

If you find other folks opinions intolerable, perhaps it is not me passing judgement.

I think this thread is done....the point was concerning the our leaders and how conflicted they are on this subject. It as turned into much more than it was expected to be.

Oh, and again, my apologies for not sharing your opinion. I do not feel as you must (" People are demanding their freedoms and it's about time") that everyone has the freedom to do as they please because they want to. It is ok to disagree, but my opinion, at least in my opinion, is worth at least as much as yours.

You find my opinion "intolerable"........I simply disagree with yours and apologize to you for upsetting you.

Please close this thread......the concept has long been lost

[rp001]

And we should close it because a couple of naysayers are asking for it? What was intolerable was not your views, it was your classifications of others as self absorbed and arrogant. No I have not ever tried coke or Heroin and believer that it is a very small percentage of smokers that move onto this. The ones I know are much smarter than that and I'll bet those folks that were the users previously described started on booze. And before that sugar...Let's make the world safer now and impose even more laws and make even more criminals. Just doesn't make us very smart.

[JoeC1947]

And we should close it because a couple of naysayers are asking for it? What was intolerable was not your views, it was your classifications of others as self absorbed and arrogant. No I have not ever tried coke or Heroin and believer that it is a very small percentage of smokers that move onto this. The ones I know are much smarter than that and I'll bet those folks that were the users previously described started on booze. And before that sugar...Let's make the world safer now and impose even more laws and make even more criminals. Just doesn't make us very smart.

If we keep responding to the request of the poster wanting to close the thread then it probably will be closed because I can see this turning into an argument and not a discussion. Better off using your ignore button. Don't take the bait.

[JoeC1947]

My former wife was a substance abuse counselor at a rehab facility. Their data showed that almost 100% of heroin users used marijuana as their first drug.

I guess me and most of my friends were the lucky ones then.

[PennBF]

It is probably unfortunate but those that elect to use a drug, be it Alcohol,
Pot, Coke, Herion, et al will not stop because someone pointed out the risks.
They will only stop when they recognize the dangers in using. Having said this the terrible thing is that the user who does not care about their mental or physical health effect the younger poplulation which are still in development. To question if there is a risk in using ANY of these drugs is kind of outrages but all discussions and agruments will fail because the drug is more important to the person than the risks. As an example, how many people still smoke even though it has been proven beyond a doubt that it can cause lung cancer. They only quit when they (a) get a cancer, (b) feel so bad or (c) die. Forget telling them to quit. They must decide. This applies to all of the drug users that use Alcohol, Pot, Herion, Coke, Meth, and all the other ones. Message: Stop trying to convince them to stop let the effect on their mental or physical health do the trick. On the positive side they keep a good economy going for Councelors, Doctors, Rehabs, Hospitals and Psychologists. They need to eat too..:ho:

[Suzi]

As I see it, we are NOT looking to make more drug laws - we are considering whether we should get rid of some. Legalize weed. So we are considering to give more freedoms - not less.
I AM a health care provider and this is what I see:
1. Alcohol use in middle school very frequently - how do they get it ? "it's illegal". Do you think it will be different for pot?
2. Babies born to alcoholic/drug/pot mothers. Have you ever cared for a baby in withdrawl?
3. Babies/children raised in alcoholic/drug/pot homes-what kind of a chance to you see that they have in life? How many "sad" eyes have you looked into?
4. How many people have you cared for with lung disease (COPD) due to smoking pot?
Its worse than cigarettes in that the purpose is to hold the smoke in your lungs to get the feeling.
5. It is baloney to think that pot is not a "beginner" drug. If you believe that - I have a bridge. Follow me on rounds some day. I don't believe I have a single drug addict in the hospital at this moment that didn't "start" with pot. Addictive personalities - whether food, alcohol, smoking, drugs etc. are ALWAYS looking for something. It makes them feel better until it doesn't....then lets see what else would feel good.

We are discussing whether we want to make the practice legal. Not take away any rights you currently enjoy. I know/suspect many very functional and respected people who enjoy a joint now and then and its illegal and I'm OK with that. Its making it legal that worries me. If we can't or our government can't control alcohol problems such as underage drinking, impaired driving, job loss etc. What makes you think that legalizing another substance will be any different.

[kittygilchrist]

Kudos to you, svgephart, for what you do. I was a social worker for 30 years, and know you have a well-earned perspective. I do wonder, though if addictive personalities would not find their way to getting high regardless of laws, and thus whether legalizing would matter? Is it possible that legal pot might be an attractive alternative to illegal, more expensive harder drugs? I don't know, just tossing it for discussion.

[twinklesweep]

I sure hope this is not considered political, and it should not be.

There are currently two states where marijuana is now legal. There is currently bi partisan legislation in our congress to actually legalize it across the country in order to tax it.

Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc.

I suspect I am showing my age, but what the heck are we doing in this country......we are destroying marriage with laws and morals of the country and now we are saying it is ok to take dope.....smoke something that will impair judgement so we can collect taxes !

Why are we discussing gun control.......a person smoking marijuana would be acceptable to buy guns with the current trend.

I am confused about the direction of this country for sure, and wanted to hear what anyone else feels about it.

I suspect I am alone, and not "with it"...seems most on here want this kind of stuff which they call being......I wont use the word I was going to as it would seem political.

But, the legalization of marijuana in a few states and more moving in that direction, the discussion that we should make it legal so we can tax it.......am I the only one who sees serious problems in the future. Marriage means nothing, you can smoke dope legally, BUT WE will have made sure that we can't load our guns quickly !!

There are now ten pages of discussion, comment, response, criticism on this topic--and nothing is resolved. As a previous poster pointed out, all responders are merely expressing their personal opinions, some based in their own reality, some in facts, and others in pure speculation. I decided it would be worthwhile to go back to the original poster of this thread--and I find myself pretty confused by it as I go through it line by line.

Assuming bipartisan federal legislation legalizing marijuana is passed, why would anyone object to its being regulated and taxed, just as alcohol, gasoline, and many other commodities is? Is this comment a pervasive attitude about being taxed in general? If so, that’s a topic for another thread that may no longer be permitted on TOTV. If not, then what is the issue?

I have heard people say that they will not smoke marijuana because it makes them feel paranoid while they are smoking it. These people seem to know that it’s not something comfortable for them so engage in, so they don’t. If they don’t get such side effects from alcohol, then they will drink if they choose to. Or not choose to. The important point I’ve learned from them is that the feeling of paranoia is unpleasant, yes, but that it is very, very temporary.

What on earth is the connection between legalizing marijuana and “we are destroying marriage with laws and morals of the country”? And even if it had an iota of relevance, how are we “destroying marriage with laws”? I cannot even understand what laws could he or she be referring to. “Morals” are a whole other story, given an approximate 50% divorce rate, a fair percentage due to the effects of alcoholism on the relationship.

And the same about gun control. What can this possibly have to do with legalizing marijuana? I once lived in an area where hunting was pervasive, and if you have not hunted or spent time with hunters, you cannot imagine the number of drunks with rifles out there shooting cows, horses, occasionally people, and more often each other, hunting being their opportunity to get away from reality and be their true selves? I am absolutely sure there are healthy, sober hunters enjoying their sport while at the same time filling their freezers with food for the next period of time if they are successful; unfortunately, then there are the others….

I too am confused--and troubled--about the direction of this country, where greed and “worship of the Almighty Dollar” has become so detrimental to the lives of millions and millions of U.S. citizens and beneficial to only a handful; to an educational system that has become so “dumbed down” that there are instances where those who cannot read graduate with a high school diploma. I agree that there are serious problems in the future, and I add that there are equally serious problems in the present that started long before five months--or five years--ago. But what does this have to do with the legalization of marijuana?

I am fairly certain that this poster is not “alone”; while we’re all individuals with unique beliefs, there is also much in common among individuals who share beliefs. Look around; we are surrounded by groups. You are certainly entitled to your beliefs, and you certainly don’t have to come across as “whiny”; you can simply express your opinions and encourage others to do the same.

Yes, I agree; for many, “marriage means nothing,” as noted previously in relation to a 50% divorce rate, brought about in part by our being encouraged to be a throw-away society rather than one that repairs with some effort with the understanding that while many things, including marriages, can be “repaired,” yes, there are those that simply cannot even after heartfelt efforts at trying. Very sad.

And again wondering what on earth this has to do with legalizing marijuana, what is meant by “we can’t load our guns quickly”? Let’s for a moment go back to our U.S. Constitution that, notwithstanding the need for amendments to it over the years (initially ten, three at the same time under the aegis of President Lincoln, and one every few years, we are assured of the right of a well-armed militia. If this is interpreted in everyone—not just those trained as part of a “militia”—can own a musket (as existed at the time of the creation of our Constitution), then so be it. I believe I am literally understanding the Constitution in the context in which it was created. But this is solely my opinion.

Sir or Ma'am, I believe my confusion reading your posting stems from your own confusion in presenting it. To discuss the legalization of marijuana is one thing, and perhaps the only thing that should be part of this discussion. However, you have interspersed this with so many unrelated thoughts and comments, some perhaps worthy of their own threads individually, but all it does is muddy the waters of the prime issue and thus making it difficult to impossible to understand.

Thank you for allowing me to express my views.

[billethkid]

that cry to close a thread always has an all too familiar ring to the sound of the attitude that comes with it.....

ever wonder why they just continue to visit that which they choose not to support/like/listen to?

So familiar!!!!

btk:)

[janmcn]

If this bipartisan federal legislation legalizing marijuana ever reaches congress, all the average citizen can do is contact their congressman and senators and express their feelings...yea or nay. Democracy is all about majority rule.

[De Lis]

Great, first we have to watch out for drunk drivers and now you want stoned ones, as well? This is not funny, it's could become a very serious issue.

Pot isn't the same as it was in the 60s & 70s. You want massive lung problems? The stuff now is terribly dangerous!

Lastly, kindly knock it off with trashing our DEA agents. Those guys put their lives on the line every day to Protect you! Have some respect.

Enough. Have a nice day.

[rp001]

Great, first we have to watch out for drunk drivers and now you want stoned ones, as well? This is not funny, it's could become a very serious issue.

Pot isn't the same as it was in the 60s & 70s. You want massive lung problems? The stuff now is terribly dangerous!

Lastly, kindly knock it off with trashing our DEA agents. Those guys put their lives on the line every day to Protect you! Have some respect.

Enough. Have a nice day.

I don't think so..What is deemed dangerous to some, is if pot were legal, perhaps we wouldn't need as many prisons, prosecuting attorneys, judges, and yes DEA agents. Don Quixote is alive and well, and he will fight the fight, no matter what.

[perrjojo]

I agree with Bucco that those screaming the loudest for "tolerance" are often the most intolerant. Geesh, this thread has taken on a life of it's on. As a side note I was amused the other day when a VERY young Villager commented to me how she was so amazed at how many Villagers smoked pot. Did she not ever hear about the 60's? Young people probably think they invented sex too!

[rubicon]

I just can't get my mind wrapped around the casual aproach toward the use of marijuana especially when we seem to have a health obsessed society.
In addition we now find state government who once regulated such things as illegal gambling and drugs now promoting them as a revenue generator
What a sad state of affairs:ohdear:

[DaleMN]

Noth'n wrong with a little doobie once in a while. :icon_wink:

[davecz1]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

U nailed it. I agree 100%:bigbow:

[gomoho]

Please don't worry about people high on marijuana out on the roads - they have no motivation to get in the car and drive anywhere - perfectly happy just sitting where they are enjoying life. And if by chance they did go out they wouldn't be driving any faster than a few miles an hour so probably wouldn't cause too much trouble. Don't worry - be happy.

[travelguy]

I remember getting the munchies and falling asleep.

[DougB]

If you remember the 60s, you weren't there.

[Xavier]

I agree with Bucco that those screaming the loudest for "tolerance" are often the most intolerant. Geesh, this thread has taken on a life of it's on. As a side note I was amused the other day when a VERY young Villager commented to me how she was so amazed at how many Villagers smoked pot. Did she not ever hear about the 60's? Young people probably think they invented sex too!

S E X!!! - Shhhhh, don't tell Bucco.

Xavier

[Topspinmo]

With the tonage of MJ and coke smuggled into this country I have to wonder who's not on it?. I mean really who's buying all that junk? When I drive down the road I keep sharp eye out for drunks, pot smokers, dope feens, texters, and SOMEBODY yakka, yakka on the phone while driving. Wait till the Baby Boomers take over TV's. Probably look like wild fire or LA smog from town of Ladylake or Oxford all the second hand smoke.

[ilovetv]

With one joint containing as many carcinogens as 20 cigarettes, it is LUNACY to be an organic, vegan or vegetarian, health-food nut who smokes pot.

It just shows how screwed up people have become on it. Like increased risk of lung cancer, COPD and emphysema is not bad.

Go ahead and choke to death, gasping for breath and coughing up green and black slime for a couple of years. All the rest of us who pay our own whole health insurance premiums besides our taxes will have higher and higher taxes taken out of our paychecks to pay for your years of treatment while you slowly choke to death anyway.

Cowsh*t for brains is what it is.

[Patty55]

With one joint containing as many carcinogens as 20 cigarettes, it is LUNACY to be an organic, vegan or vegetarian, health-food nut who smokes pot.

It just shows how screwed up people have become on it. Like increased risk of lung cancer, COPD and emphysema is not bad.

Go ahead and choke to death, gasping for breath and coughing up green and black slime for a couple of years. All the rest of us who pay our own whole health insurance premiums besides our taxes will have higher and higher taxes taken out of our paychecks to pay for your years of treatment while you slowly choke to death anyway.

Cowsh*t for brains is what it is.

WOW MAN, Bummer head.

[JP]

:agree: Let's legalize pot nationally so we can better utilize our DEA and tax money on more important issues. Alcohol has a lot more social and physical issues than pot will ever have. How many pot smokers die at 50 from a fried liver? How many pot smokers beat, rape and kill their wives? When pot smokers get behind the wheel of a car they are more likely to be driving 20 mph than speeding. Come on people. Get real.

[Golfingnut]

With one joint containing as many carcinogens as 20 cigarettes, it is LUNACY to be an organic, vegan or vegetarian, health-food nut who smokes pot.

It just shows how screwed up people have become on it. Like increased risk of lung cancer, COPD and emphysema is not bad.

Go ahead and choke to death, gasping for breath and coughing up green and black slime for a couple of years. All the rest of us who pay our own whole health insurance premiums besides our taxes will have higher and higher taxes taken out of our paychecks to pay for your years of treatment while you slowly choke to death anyway.

Cowsh*t for brains is what it is.

Incorrect::: Although the carcinogens are similar from one joint to one cigarette, even with that, the health effects are much less with a joint than with ONE cigarette. Read link from MEDMD
Pot Smoke: Less Carcinogenic Than Tobacco? (http://www.webmd.com/cancer/news/20051017/pot-smoke-less-carcinogenic-than-tobacco)

We should be honest with each other.

[De Lis]

I don't think so..What is deemed dangerous to some, is if pot were legal, perhaps we wouldn't need as many prisons, prosecuting attorneys, judges, and yes DEA agents. Don Quixote is alive and well, and he will fight the fight, no matter what.

Please don't smear the good name of Don Q.

Do you honestly think the cartels and gangs are simply going to vanish the moment we legalize this junk? Wrong...just ask Holland...they did that and now they are swimming in problems.

As far as being too mellow to drive, watch the papers when the Hollywood 'stars' get on the road.

We will be losing an entire generation ++ if we legalize dope and allow it to become commonplace.

[twinklesweep]

Incorrect::: Although the carcinogens are similar from one joint to one cigarette, even with that, the health effects are much less with a joint than with ONE cigarette. Read link from MEDMD
Pot Smoke: Less Carcinogenic Than Tobacco? (http://www.webmd.com/cancer/news/20051017/pot-smoke-less-carcinogenic-than-tobacco)

We should be honest with each other.

... for documenting how erroneous is the statement of ilovetv. I was about to post a request for documentation of that very glib statement until I saw your post. Issues like this cannot be discussed by making up arguments based on our personal opinions; after all, the rest of us are not naive or stupid. Yes, we should definitely be honest with each other--and at the same time definitely be suspicious of any statement made by someone that is proven obviously false.

[ilovetv]

... for documenting how erroneous is the statement of ilovetv. I was about to post a request for documentation of that very glib statement until I saw your post. Issues like this cannot be discussed by making up arguments based on our personal opinions; after all, the rest of us are not naive or stupid. Yes, we should definitely be honest with each other--and at the same time definitely be suspicious of any statement made by someone that is proven obviously false.

"Personal opinion"? "Proven obviously false"????

"(Reuters) - Smoking a joint is equivalent to 20 cigarettes in terms of lung cancer risk, scientists in New Zealand have found, as they warned of an "epidemic" of lung cancers linked to cannabis.

Studies in the past have demonstrated that cannabis can cause cancer, but few have established a strong link between cannabis use and the actual incidence of lung cancer.

In an article published in the European Respiratory Journal, the scientists said cannabis could be expected to harm the airways more than tobacco as its smoke contained twice the level of carcinogens, such as polyaromatic hydrocarbons, compared with tobacco cigarettes.

The method of smoking also increases the risk, since joints are typically smoked without a proper filter and almost to the very tip, which increases the amount of smoke inhaled. The cannabis smoker inhales more deeply and for longer, facilitating the deposition of carcinogens in the airways.

"Cannabis smokers end up with five times more carbon monoxide in their bloodstream (than tobacco smokers)," team leader Richard Beasley, at the Medical Research Institute of New Zealand, said in a telephone interview.

"There are higher concentrations of carcinogens in cannabis smoke ... what is intriguing to us is there is so little work done on cannabis when there is so much done on tobacco........"

Cannabis bigger cancer risk than cigarettes: study | Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/2008/01/29/us-cancer-cannabis-idUSHKG10478820080129)

European Respiratory Journal Study:
http://www.ersj.org.uk/content/31/2/280.full

"...New Zealand represents an ideal country in which to study the association between cannabis and respiratory tract cancer. New Zealand has a high rate of cannabis use 20, and cannabis is rarely mixed with tobacco within the joint 21, as is the custom in the UK 22. New Zealand has among the highest rates of lung cancer worldwide with the indigenous Maori population having the highest incidence of any ethnic group 23. These circumstances provided the opportunity to undertake a case–control study to investigate the association between lung cancer and cannabis use in young people...." (From study linked directly above)

[PennBF]

It is not possible to help or stop marijuana users although there is great evidence as to it's negative effects. They must, like cigs, decide for themselves. There are serious effects in using but the typical user will try to compare it to alcohol, cigs, as a form of denial. Just a few of considerations are:
1)The ability to do complex tasks could be compromised
2) It may increase the risk of developing psychosis
3) About 9 percent of people who use marijuana become dependent on it. The number increases to about one in six among those who start using it at a young age, and to 25 to 50 percent among daily users.
4) Marijuana increases dopamine, which creates the good feelings or “high” associated with its use.
5) People who use marijuana are at risk of injuring their lungs through exposure to respiratory irritants found in marijuana smoke.
6) The smoke from marijuana risk of using cocaine is much greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it.
7) Using marijuana puts children and teens in contact with people who use and sell other drugs. So, a person who uses marijuana is more likely to deal
with this type of "criminal element"?
None of the above are guesses but proven through a number of studies and
there are a great many more but am trying to just throw out a little.
Kind of a waste of time since only the "User" can decide that it is harmful and elect to stop. :jester:

[JoeC1947]

With one joint containing as many carcinogens as 20 cigarettes, it is LUNACY to be an organic, vegan or vegetarian, health-food nut who smokes pot.

It just shows how screwed up people have become on it. Like increased risk of lung cancer, COPD and emphysema is not bad.

Go ahead and choke to death, gasping for breath and coughing up green and black slime for a couple of years. All the rest of us who pay our own whole health insurance premiums besides our taxes will have higher and higher taxes taken out of our paychecks to pay for your years of treatment while you slowly choke to death anyway.

Cowsh*t for brains is what it is.

That's why you should use a water pipe! Oh yeah, Mooooo.

[JP]

Hey you don't have to always smoke pot. Anyone ever hear of brownies?

[mickey100]

Hey you don't have to always smoke pot. Anyone ever hear of brownies?

Exactly. :clap2:

[TrudyM]

Seattle resident here-- we did pass legalization but because it is still federally illegal it has had no effect other than no local cops spend any time on enforcement and only large growers that come under the feds get hassled and it makes it a little easier for those who use for medical reasons.
It was as you can imagine widely researched and discussed in our media.
What I had not realized before was that some of the worse effects come from the tainted quality of the street MJ, that people soak it in other drugs to increase sales.

There are different options all with different pluses and minuses being discussed at the federal level as I understand it.

1. Decriminilization -- Making it a less offense or setting up different rules than currently exist to free up law enforcement, court and penal resources for more important issues. Minus is it makes laws more complicated and would conflict with many state laws. As federal law is now more strict than alot of states.

2.- Limited legalization - Rules on distribution who to and age restriction. regulation of production would control the additives that are frequently a major problem and cause many of the sited ill effects. Because currently the drug world is envolved in distribution they soak the stuff in cems that are more harmful than the weed itself. This would also allow for taxation

3- RX only - But with approved growers and quality control and taxation. This is the way California went with no legalized growers do to Federal laws it makes it hard to control.

It seems to me that at the very least legalized growers that are quality controled for saftey for RX use needs to happen to safegaurd those that use it for medical reasons. Most anit depressants have very dangerous side effects and I have a friend who lives in Calif who now uses MJ for bouts of severe depression under a doctors care with much better results.

Also those with an adictive personality will become an abuser if not carful either of drugs or acahol.

We each have to decide how we want the line drawn and the trade offs and let our elected officials know what we want. The majority as always in a free society will out.

Just My opinion

[mickey100]

A very thoughtful post Trudy. There are many substances out there that could be harmful or addictive that are also legal, and if people have that type of personality they will find those things and become an addict. They tried prohibition and it didn't work. Cigarettes have been proven addictive, are a major health risk costing this country probably billions in health care costs, and they are legal. I don't think you can legislate what people choose to put into their bodies. Let's spend our law enforcement money on something that might actually have some benefit to society. Violent crime seems a much better place to spend money on enforcement and prevention, than smoking a little pot.

[Cedwards38]

I'm for allowing adult Americans to make their own choices about what they drink, smoke, or do in the privacy of their own home, as long as they don't injure anyone else in the process. I try to never impose my morals on others unless their moral choice has a direct impact on the rest of us. For example, if you want to drink, then enjoy it, but if you want to drink and drive, that effects the rest of us and should be subjected to legislative oversight.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

[QUOTE=Dr Winston O Boogie jr;623280]My former wife was a substance abuse counselor at a rehab facility. Their data showed that almost 100% of heroin users used marijuana as their first drug.

And nearly 100% of weed smokers never have tried heroin or ever will!

Where does that statistic come from? A 1991 NIDS study shows that that young users of cannabis are 85 times more likely than non-users to try cocaine.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

:agree: Let's legalize pot nationally so we can better utilize our DEA and tax money on more important issues. Alcohol has a lot more social and physical issues than pot will ever have. How many pot smokers die at 50 from a fried liver? How many pot smokers beat, rape and kill their wives? When pot smokers get behind the wheel of a car they are more likely to be driving 20 mph than speeding. Come on people. Get real.

The fact that alcohol has many more social issues than pot could be because alcohol is legal and much more readily available. There are far more alcohol drinkers than pot smokers.

We really don't know enough about the physical issues.

[JoeC1947]

The fact that alcohol has many more social issues than pot could be because alcohol is legal and much more readily available. There are far more alcohol drinkers than pot smokers.

We really don't know enough about the physical issues.

I believe that just about anyone that wants to use pot can because it is readily available anywhere.

As far as more alcohol drinkers than pot users, probably true but can't be proven and doesn't really matter because you're not comparing apples to apples.

What do you mean regarding physical issues?

[Polar Bear]

I believe that just about anyone that wants to use pot can because it is readily available anywhere...

I won't disagree with that statement, but not nearly AS readily available as booze. :smiley:

[mickey100]

I'm for allowing adult Americans to make their own choices about what they drink, smoke, or do in the privacy of their own home, as long as they don't injure anyone else in the process. I try to never impose my morals on others unless their moral choice has a direct impact on the rest of us. For example, if you want to drink, then enjoy it, but if you want to drink and drive, that affects the rest of us and should be subjected to legislative oversight.

I agree. However, playing devil's advocate, cigarette smoking causes all sorts of cancers, etc., and has a huge impact on higher health costs/insurance rates for society. Should we make it illegal?

[anarick]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[PJUCTH]

Not to relevant. But instead of taxing gaas more, Why not 5 or 10 cents on a six pack to treat some of the disasters caused by alcohol.bet this causes a lot of unkind comments in the unsober society

[Jaggy]

isn't it 4:20 yet and time to put this to sleep??

[JoeC1947]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

Somebody has the munchies!:mmmm:

[PennBF]

An addict will only stop when they want. The drug can be Pot, Alcohol, Coke, Meth, Herion, etc. I believe the solution should be in the "consequences". I remember listening to a Nun on TV during the excessive demonstrations of the 60's. She made a great comment which I always remembered. People want to violate the law one but they don't want to pay the consequences. If you want to "get high" on any drug and you cause harm to someone else you must be ready to take the consequences and they should be serious enough to convince you to stop or understand the risks you are putting other people at because of the lack of respect for the law. As they say "it is jail time". Problem is the lack of respect for the law as society has stopped enforcing consequences for those that have disrespect for the community. I loved the 50's when we respected the law and fun was not putting dope in your body but rather clean fun.:police:

[shcisamax]

I loved the 50's when we respected the law and fun was not putting dope in your body but rather clean fun.:police:

Unfortunately, the law hadn't caught up with the consequences of alcohol. If you recall, you could drive drunk, hit someone and it was "an accident". I remember how much drinking went on "socially" in my parents generation and it was the way business was done with the three martini lunch. The "socially accepted alcoholic" was just as addicted as the heroin addict. I sometimes wonder if that was the beginning of the American family unit breaking down - not the monumental 60's generation with pot and psychedelics but the more subtle effect on the family from the accepted form of alcoholism.

[rp001]

Unfortunately, the law hadn't caught up with the consequences of alcohol. If you recall, you could drive drunk, hit someone and it was "an accident". I remember how much drinking went on "socially" in my parents generation and it was the way business was done with the three martini lunch. The "socially accepted alcoholic" was just as addicted as the heroin addict. I sometimes wonder if that was the beginning of the American family unit breaking down - not the monumental 60's generation with pot and psychedelics but the more subtle effect on the family from the accepted form of alcoholism.

Yea, I remember the fabulous fifties...Kids pregnant and getting back alley abortions, stealing booze from their parents and suffering alcohol poisoning, and of course smoking a pack a day of Pall Mall cigarettes...

[BSurb]

Marijuana smokers tend to mind their owner business and can actually handle how they act. I don't see why you can have a beer in your hand on the street but you can't smoke? There has been no reports of people dying from marijuana. Its not like cigarettes and not as near as bad with after effects like it is with alcohol.

[JoeC1947]

Yea, I remember the fabulous fifties...Kids pregnant and getting back alley abortions, stealing booze from their parents and suffering alcohol poisoning, and of course smoking a pack a day of Pall Mall cigarettes...

Don't forget woman staying home to take care of her man and the family!

[Barefoot]

I loved the 50's when we respected the law and fun was not putting dope in your body but rather clean fun.


Yea, I remember the fabulous fifties...Kids pregnant and getting back alley abortions, stealing booze from their parents and suffering alcohol poisoning, and of course smoking a pack a day of Pall Mall cigarettes...


Don't forget woman staying home to take care of her man and the family!

Sorry, this is getting off topic, but sometimes that happens.

Ah yes, the 1950s, before the birth control pill was approved for general use. If a girl became pregnant in high school, she usually went to a home for unwed mothers and gave up her baby, or had an illegal back-alley abortion. A married woman couldn't use her income to qualify for a mortgage because she might get pregnant and stop working.

[Geewiz]

I am pro-decriminalization; as jailing folks who smoke it or brownie it are no more criminals than folks who drink.

That doesn't mean I advocate its use. A very close family member suffered 2 bouts of marijuana-induced psychosis. I was there...it was damned scary and the second time - even with hospitalization and massive doses of Risperdal - the anti-psychotic drug of choice for kids dealing with this, it was very iffy whether he would kick out of it. How bad was it? Picture yourself with your hands raised over you head for 5 hours, in a dark room, just so "the bad people" wouldn't hurt us. Scary stuff, indeed. Scary - a bad choice - but not a crime.

Of course it led to a minor crime...because when I found the dealer - a serious kick ass session commenced. I never beat anyone that bloody before...and with my foot grinding his face in the cement - I quietly told him that if I ever saw him again I'd repeat as needed maybe with the addition of a blow torch. That's what you learn when you grow up in an outfit family. I never saw the kid again. Decisions have consequences.

[rp001]

I am pro-decriminalization; as jailing folks who smoke it or brownie it are no more criminals than folks who drink.

That doesn't mean I advocate its use. A very close family member suffered 2 bouts of marijuana-induced psychosis. I was there...it was damned scary and the second time - even with hospitalization and massive doses of Risperdal - the anti-psychotic drug of choice for kids dealing with this, it was very iffy whether he would kick out of it. How bad was it? Picture yourself with your hands raised over you head for 5 hours, in a dark room, just so "the bad people" wouldn't hurt us. Scary stuff, indeed. Scary - a bad choice - but not a crime.

Of course it led to a minor crime...because when I found the dealer - a serious kick ass session commenced. I never beat anyone that bloody before...and with my foot grinding his face in the cement - I quietly told him that if I ever saw him again I'd repeat as needed maybe with the addition of a blow torch. That's what you learn when you grow up in an outfit family. I never saw the kid again. Decisions have consequences.

I watched some tv show the other night and in a discussion regarding potency and side effects it was stated the strain grown today is more powerful than what we experienced.. One additional reason for government control is amateur growers are "enhancing" the pot with all kinds of chemicals to increase this potency. Hell even when the US government was trying to control the Columbians they sprayed the pot fields with Paraquat, a known carcinogen, then of course they can say pot causes cancer..It's totally ridiculous what some believe, and what the government is doing to this generation by criminalizing pot, at the request of the booze companies.

[sharonga]

My new motto is " I am 62, if it makes me happy, I am doing it, if someone doesnt like it, stay away from me" I have earned the right to party!!

[graciegirl]

Boogie its call Mary Jane least where I went to school. But agree tax it limit the acreage that it came be grown on. Make the money from it instead of spending

Bogie: One over par.

Boogie: Dancin' or something that comes from the nose.

Mary Janes: One strap patent leather shoes worn on Easter by girls under ten.

Continue on with your enlightening discussion. Don't hold it in too long. ;)

[paulandjean]

I am pro-decriminalization; as jailing folks who smoke it or brownie it are no more criminals than folks who drink.

That doesn't mean I advocate its use. A very close family member suffered 2 bouts of marijuana-induced psychosis. I was there...it was damned scary and the second time - even with hospitalization and massive doses of Risperdal - the anti-psychotic drug of choice for kids dealing with this, it was very iffy whether he would kick out of it. How bad was it? Picture yourself with your hands raised over you head for 5 hours, in a dark room, just so "the bad people" wouldn't hurt us. Scary stuff, indeed. Scary - a bad choice - but not a crime.

Of course it led to a minor crime...because when I found the dealer - a serious kick ass session commenced. I never beat anyone that bloody before...and with my foot grinding his face in the cement - I quietly told him that if I ever saw him again I'd repeat as needed maybe with the addition of a blow torch. That's what you learn when you grow up in an outfit family. I never saw the kid again. Decisions have consequences.

Boy Howdy

[PennBF]

It is interesting that in all this series of notes there are none deicated to the impact of the drug on the family. The removal of being there mentally and emotionaly for the family, demonstrating to the children that it is ok to violate the law as long as it makes you feel good, it is ok to deal with those individuals who are violating the law and being a warehouse of illegal drugs, it is OK to compare Pot to other drugs and justify its usage, telling the kids it is OK to use even though it has been proven without a question or doubt that the impact of usage on those under 18 has a major impact on their later life and their physical health, feeling good is more important than being healthy, and many many so ons. Is it selfish to ignore the impact on the family just so a person can be high and avoid real feelings. That is for the reader to decide. Kind of sad that many in our society follow this path. :ho:

[paulandjean]

It is interesting that in all this series of notes there are none deicated to the impact of the drug on the family. The removal of being there mentally and emotionaly for the family, demonstrating to the children that it is ok to violate the law as long as it makes you feel good, it is ok to deal with those individuals who are violating the law and being a warehouse of illegal drugs, it is OK to compare Pot to other drugs and justify its usage, telling the kids it is OK to use even though it has been proven without a question or doubt that the impact of usage on those under 18 has a major impact on their later life and their physical health, feeling good is more important than being healthy, and many many so ons. Is it selfish to ignore the impact on the family just so a person can be high and avoid real feelings. That is for the reader to decide. Kind of sad that many in our society follow this path. :ho:

I have never seen anything in our schools that say using pot is OK.

[perrjojo]

It is interesting that in all this series of notes there are none deicated to the impact of the drug on the family. The removal of being there mentally and emotionaly for the family, demonstrating to the children that it is ok to violate the law as long as it makes you feel good, it is ok to deal with those individuals who are violating the law and being a warehouse of illegal drugs, it is OK to compare Pot to other drugs and justify its usage, telling the kids it is OK to use even though it has been proven without a question or doubt that the impact of usage on those under 18 has a major impact on their later life and their physical health, feeling good is more important than being healthy, and many many so ons. Is it selfish to ignore the impact on the family just so a person can be high and avoid real feelings. That is for the reader to decide. Kind of sad that many in our society follow this path. :ho:

:bigbow:it is amazing how many of us seem to pick and choose which laws we need to obey. It's okay for "me" to "do it" but not others. One example is those who choose not to stop at STOP signs or go thru the red light. After all, i could see it was safe. I wasn't hurting anyone. OOPS! I didn't see that car coming. I didn't think I was hurting anyone.

[Golfingnut]

It is interesting that in all this series of notes there are none deicated to the impact of the drug on the family. The removal of being there mentally and emotionaly for the family, demonstrating to the children that it is ok to violate the law as long as it makes you feel good, it is ok to deal with those individuals who are violating the law and being a warehouse of illegal drugs, it is OK to compare Pot to other drugs and justify its usage, telling the kids it is OK to use even though it has been proven without a question or doubt that the impact of usage on those under 18 has a major impact on their later life and their physical health, feeling good is more important than being healthy, and many many so ons. Is it selfish to ignore the impact on the family just so a person can be high and avoid real feelings. That is for the reader to decide. Kind of sad that many in our society follow this path. :ho:

At least 85 % of us villagers have chosen to use a drug of choice to help us enjoy our retired years. Yet the minority 15 % seem to have it all figured out that we are the ones wrong. I love my drug of choice (bud Light) and will continue to use it. You can have your yoga or whatever gets you high, but please leave me to mine. SO :duck:

[maine04578]

On a more serious note, we need to empty our jails of pot users/dealers and get the real criminals off the streets. We can't clean up our national crime problem because budget cuts are closing jails. Plus we use a huge proportion of our law enforcement resources to fight an unwinnable war on drugs. It's a question of priorities. Pot and hard drugs won't go away because the market is insatiable (fact, whether we like it or not), so perhaps we should bite the bullet and manage it, collecting taxes on it along the way. Just being against a perceived moral decline won't solve the problem.

[rp001]

:bigbow:it is amazing how many of us seem to pick and choose which laws we need to obey. It's okay for "me" to "do it" but not others. One example is those who choose not to stop at STOP signs or go thru the red light. After all, i could see it was safe. I wasn't hurting anyone. OOPS! I didn't see that car coming. I didn't think I was hurting anyone.

I don't think the folks here are advocating ignoring a law..They are advocating changing a worthless and very expensive and yes quite damaging, law. Look at Prohibition...How'd that work out? We are too hung up on legislating morality..Live and let live, and above all, Do No Harm To Others.

[Taylormade]

I moved here from a legal medical cannabis state. After serious shoulder surgery, I found that medical cannabis worked beautifully for me in helping to manage the pain. I received a prescription from a Doctor after a thorough interview and examination. The pain pills that were prescribed messed up my stomach, made me just want to sleep, and are known to be addictive. I could overdose on the pain pills---I have never heard of anyone overdosing on marijuana. I would not consider driving after either medication. Medical dispensaries offer many options such as edibles with delicious candy bars, brownies, cookies, ice cream, and peanut butter. The staff was knowledgeable in recommending different strains that had properties that would work best for me. I also found that it helped my severe arthritis a great deal.
I ask anyone---Would you want to give up the medication that worked for you and helped you manage your pain, did not seem to harm you in any way, and was not addictive?
So I say--VOTE! Let the voices be heard! Tax it and do the merciful thing!

[elizabeth52]

Great, first we have to watch out for drunk drivers and now you want stoned ones, as well? This is not funny, it's could become a very serious issue.

Pot isn't the same as it was in the 60s & 70s. You want massive lung problems? The stuff now is terribly dangerous!

Lastly, kindly knock it off with trashing our DEA agents. Those guys put their lives on the line every day to Protect you! Have some respect.

Enough. Have a nice day.

:BigApplause:

[jimbo2012]

I was in my forties...went over to my aunt and uncle's house..you know, typical old aunt and uncle...found my aunt and my mother smoking a joint! I was sooo naive.

You naive? :a20: :beer3:

[TheVillageChicken]

I tried it once. Totally lost control and didn't take my baseball cap off in a café.

[graciegirl]

I tried it once. Totally lost control and didn't take my baseball cap off in a café.





There is a federal mandate recently signed that says all chickens can wear ball caps in cafe's.


http://thumb1.shutterstock.com/photos/display_pic_with_logo/265489/118530604.jpg

[PennBF]

I hate this subject because it is one that I can't just pass up on. There are some good benefits from marijuana for some medical conditions. My niece was a 28 year old Army Attorney who had a brain tumor and spent a year in the Walter Reed Vet Hospital in DC before she passed away. One thing that helped her was the marijuana my sister was able to buy on the black market in DC. She was married to a Dental Surgeon and not familiar with the black market. Had to learn it to get the pot for her daughter.
Having said this the use of marijuana when for "recreational purposes" 20% lead on to additions to Meth, coke, heroin, etc.etc. Check California and you will see there are significant abuses by the public by getting Dr's to prescribe pot when there is absolutely no medical needs. My point is this is how complicated the problem is. Since in most cases Doctors are not educated in additions and the impact of opening the doors for recreational uses by faking medical needs is truly a serious criminal act that has long reaching effects on our youth. The impact of pot on a person 21 and under is outstanding. Just some facts on the usage. When an adult commits the crime of buying it on the black market they are commiting a criminal act and fostering usage by the youth and funding criminals who are involved in a host of other offenses. Would I do it if my child was suffering and this helped him/her? I sure would. Do I think Dr's who give for non medical reasons should have their medical licence taken away. Absolutely:shrug:

[DougB]

There is a federal mandate recently signed that says all chickens can wear ball caps in cafe's.


http://thumb1.shutterstock.com/photos/display_pic_with_logo/265489/118530604.jpg

I believe I read here on some thread that Cody's is the only restaurant in the village with a license for customers to bring their chickens.

[Halle]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

:agree:

I believe it is fair to compare the effects of alcohol to marijuana they both alter the mind. I would choose marijuana.

[princess2u]

The dispensaries are charged a huge tax. So that's how the state will make their money. It is a great way for the states to get more taxes from the Americans.

As a chronic pain sufferer, I can't wait for this to be legalized. Marijuana is much safer on my liver and kidneys compared to the narcotics I have to take on a weekly basis to alleviate this pain. I plan on being very responsible person.

I can understand the people with addictive behaviors being scared about something becoming legal like this. But it's better on your body than alcohol any day of the week. And being responsible is the KEY.

[shcisamax]

Come November, I will be voting YES!

[Golfingnut]

Legalization is way overdue. Only people that have no experience with it are the ones that say no to it while most of them have multiple narcotic pain killers in their medicine cabinets. I personally love beer and have nothing to do with any drugs legal or illegal, but I will admit pot would be much healthier than beer.

[mickey100]

As will I. Compared to the dangers of alcohol and cigarettes, pot is much less problematic, and offers real benefits to those who have certain medical needs.

[perrjojo]

Comparing pot to alcohol makes me think of what my Grandma used to say...two wrongs don't make a right. Just food for thought.

[perrjojo]

I tried it once. Totally lost control and didn't take my baseball cap off in a café.

See what problems can occur. You are tooooooo funny!:2excited: :beer3:

[MDLNB]

I sure hope this is not considered political, and it should not be.

There are currently two states where marijuana is now legal. There is currently bi partisan legislation in our congress to actually legalize it across the country in order to tax it.

Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc.

I suspect I am showing my age, but what the heck are we doing in this country......we are destroying marriage with laws and morals of the country and now we are saying it is ok to take dope.....smoke something that will impair judgement so we can collect taxes !

Why are we discussing gun control.......a person smoking marijuana would be acceptable to buy guns with the current trend.

I am confused about the direction of this country for sure, and wanted to hear what anyone else feels about it.

I suspect I am alone, and not "with it"...seems most on here want this kind of stuff which they call being......I wont use the word I was going to as it would seem political.

But, the legalization of marijuana in a few states and more moving in that direction, the discussion that we should make it legal so we can tax it.......am I the only one who sees serious problems in the future. Marriage means nothing, you can smoke dope legally, BUT WE will have made sure that we can't load our guns quickly !!

I agree.

[MDLNB]

What do you think of alcohol?

Two wrongs does not make a RIGHT. I partake of an occasional beer or glass of wine with a meal, but would not do so if it were illegal. I see no benefits of alcohol use, but see many negatives of it's abuse.

Our government will criminalize smoking tobacco but legalize smoking MJ. Goes to show you how stupid America has become.

[janmcn]

Two wrongs does not make a RIGHT. I partake of an occasional beer or glass of wine with a meal, but would not do so if it were illegal. I see no benefits of alcohol use, but see many negatives of it's abuse.

Our government will criminalize smoking tobacco but legalize smoking MJ. Goes to show you how stupid America has become.


When did tobacco smoking become a crime? Anybody for or against legalizing marajuana for medical purposes, gets a chance to vote in November.

[jimbo2012]

Fact: About 750,000 people are arrested every year for marijuana offenses in the U.S. There's a lot of variation across states in what happens next. Not all arrests lead to prosecutions, and relatively few people prosecuted and convicted of simple possession end up in jail. Most are fined or are placed into community supervision. About 40,000 inmates of state and federal prison have a current conviction involving marijuana, and about half of them are in for marijuana offenses alone; most of these were involved in distribution. Less than one percent are in for possession alone.

Fact: The rate of pot use is higher among offenders than nonoffenders, but that definitely does not mean that pot causes criminal behavior. Another factor may be driving both results – or it could be that the causality goes the other way, and criminals are just more likely to use drugs. Furthermore, pot, unlike alcohol, doesn't generally unleash aggression, so it's much harder to link it to violent crime.

Fact: About 6 million of America's 30 million users over the age of 12 use pot on a daily or almost-daily basis according to household survey data – a fifth of those who say they have used marijuana in the past year – but they account for about 80 percent of all marijuana consumed.

Fact: Heavy use can be harmful. Since pot smoke is chemically very similar to tobacco smoke, heavy pot smokers are at risk for some of the same health effects as cigarette smokers, like bronchitis and other respiratory illnesses. Again, though, the risks are from smoking, which isn't the only way to use marijuana. Another hazard: car accidents caused by driving while high, though the risk is lower than from drunk driving.

Fact: In 2011, use of marijuana by teenagers hit a 30-year peak, with one out of every 15 high school students reporting they smoke most days, and for the first time U.S. teens reported smoking more pot than cigarettes. But: teenagers don't smoke any more pot in states where medical marijuana is legal than in ones where it's not. Legalization advocates argue that the best way to reduce use by minors is to legalize and regulate pot.

Marijuana possession remains one of the major reasons people are arrested in the United States, according to the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report for 2011. Last year the police made just over 750,000 arrests just for marijuana. That translates into one marijuana arrest every 42 seconds in America. While this is a slightly drop from 2010 this remains an unacceptable statistic.

Effectively half of all drug arrests in the county last year were for marijuana. An overwhelming 87 percent of these marijuana arrests were simply for possession.

Marijuana possession alone accounts for just over five percent of all the arrests made in the America last year. By comparison, there were only just over 500,000 arrests for all violent crimes combined.

This is in spite of the fact that 2011 was also the first year Gallup found a majority of Americans believe marijuana should be legalized. As a country, we are wasting a huge amount of law enforcement resources and saddling thousands of people with criminal records to enforce a policy that most Americans no longer even agree with.

[Golfingnut]

Fact: About 750,000 people are arrested every year for marijuana offenses in the U.S. There's a lot of variation across states in what happens next. Not all arrests lead to prosecutions, and relatively few people prosecuted and convicted of simple possession end up in jail. Most are fined or are placed into community supervision. About 40,000 inmates of state and federal prison have a current conviction involving marijuana, and about half of them are in for marijuana offenses alone; most of these were involved in distribution. Less than one percent are in for possession alone.

Fact: The rate of pot use is higher among offenders than nonoffenders, but that definitely does not mean that pot causes criminal behavior. Another factor may be driving both results – or it could be that the causality goes the other way, and criminals are just more likely to use drugs. Furthermore, pot, unlike alcohol, doesn't generally unleash aggression, so it's much harder to link it to violent crime.

Fact: About 6 million of America's 30 million users over the age of 12 use pot on a daily or almost-daily basis according to household survey data – a fifth of those who say they have used marijuana in the past year – but they account for about 80 percent of all marijuana consumed.

Fact: Heavy use can be harmful. Since pot smoke is chemically very similar to tobacco smoke, heavy pot smokers are at risk for some of the same health effects as cigarette smokers, like bronchitis and other respiratory illnesses. Again, though, the risks are from smoking, which isn't the only way to use marijuana. Another hazard: car accidents caused by driving while high, though the risk is lower than from drunk driving.

Fact: In 2011, use of marijuana by teenagers hit a 30-year peak, with one out of every 15 high school students reporting they smoke most days, and for the first time U.S. teens reported smoking more pot than cigarettes. But: teenagers don't smoke any more pot in states where medical marijuana is legal than in ones where it's not. Legalization advocates argue that the best way to reduce use by minors is to legalize and regulate pot.

Marijuana possession remains one of the major reasons people are arrested in the United States, according to the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report for 2011. Last year the police made just over 750,000 arrests just for marijuana. That translates into one marijuana arrest every 42 seconds in America. While this is a slightly drop from 2010 this remains an unacceptable statistic.

Effectively half of all drug arrests in the county last year were for marijuana. An overwhelming 87 percent of these marijuana arrests were simply for possession.

Marijuana possession alone accounts for just over five percent of all the arrests made in the America last year. By comparison, there were only just over 500,000 arrests for all violent crimes combined.

This is in spite of the fact that 2011 was also the first year Gallup found a majority of Americans believe marijuana should be legalized. As a country, we are wasting a huge amount of law enforcement resources and saddling thousands of people with criminal records to enforce a policy that most Americans no longer even agree with.

Great post.

[keithwand]

Think I will stay with Bourban Manhattans even if it becomes legalized. Tried it in college and smoking in general is not my thing.
My wife had to take a polygraph to work part time at Leu Gardens in Orlando.
One of the questions was have you ever used Marijuana?
When she said no and it was the truth the officer said well you might be the only one!
Now I do have Philip Morris stock so maybe if they can get into that business I'll be rich.

[luvmagic2]

Tax rate in Colorado for marijuana products, I.e. Edible, drinking, smoking, etc, is 25%. A very large revenue stream.

[ilovetv]

Tax rate in Colorado for marijuana products, I.e. Edible, drinking, smoking, etc, is 25%. A very large revenue stream.

Oh, great. Let's encourage and facilitate and enable more addiction and stupor, so that MORE people are unemployed, unemployable, have to get on Medicaid or Disability Medicare at age 40, get on SSI......

....so that tax-paying employers and employees are penalized even more for working and earning a living and paying their taxes for this mess, instead of sucking the government tit.

What a bunch of losers!!!!!!!!

[luvmagic2]

Ranting and raving.....but no facts

[DianeM]

Much less damaging than alcohol, salt,sugar, and a host of over the counter drugs..Too much hype about this and yes I do remember the 60's, quite fondly. A lot of the critics have never tried this and make comments based on total lack of personal knowledge. The worst danger I've ever seen from the folks I knew that used it was over eating and laughing too hard..Of course it should never be used at work or driving,etc. It does temporarily alter functionality,just as alcohol does.. One interesting note is that aggression is not one of the side effects of this, but it is with alcohol. Mean drunk or happy drunk, no one knows for sure. Most of these folks I knew that smoked pot grew into prominent members of society and we now love to laugh about the good old days..I wish it were legal in Florida.

I agree. Been there and done that. Made me want fries with ketchup back in the day. Cigs and booze are far worse.

[Golfingnut]

I agree. Been there and done that. Made me want fries with ketchup back in the day. Cigs and booze are far worse.

I agree, pot don't agree with me, but I strongly feel it is far less harmful than the alcohol I do consume.

Legalize it and they will be able to Taylor the product for specific recreational interests and medical applications.

The strongest complainers about marijuana is people that have zero experience with it. That I find shameful.

[TexaninVA]

Oh, great. Let's encourage and facilitate and enable more addiction and stupor, so that MORE people are unemployed, unemployable, have to get on Medicaid or Disability Medicare at age 40, get on SSI......

....so that tax-paying employers and employees are penalized even more for working and earning a living and paying their taxes for this mess, instead of sucking the government tit.

What a bunch of losers!!!!!!!!

This is what's so obvious and sad ... our economic competitors are getting busy and America increasingly is getting stoned. Wonder how that will work out over time?

[DianeM]

Whatever became of the 60's children who were so mellow. Yes we grew up and became responsible adults but Geesh have we forgotten "live and let live ". If you want the right to toke a joint then you should be able to do so once in a while.

[Golfingnut]

Whatever became of the 60's children who were so mellow. Yes we grew up and became responsible adults but Geesh have we forgotten "live and let live ". If you want the right to toke a joint then you should be able to do so once in a while.

Those complaining were not part of that group, they were sitting around bars learning to be adults of a different mentality.

[DianeM]

Those complaining were not part of that group, they were sitting around bars learning to be adults of a different mentality.

So true I'm sure.

[Barefoot]

This is what's so obvious and sad ... our economic competitors are getting busy and America increasingly is getting stoned. Wonder how that will work out over time?

Do you feel that marijuana smokers are negatively affecting the US economy?

[ilovetv]

Whatever became of the 60's children who were so mellow. Yes we grew up and became responsible adults but Geesh have we forgotten "live and let live ". If you want the right to toke a joint then you should be able to do so once in a while.

The problem is, employers cannot afford to hire people who are dopers. Most employers require drug testing for a reason.

Health insurance premiums are often reduced to incentivize a drug-free workforce, because a drug-free workforce is healthier, more reliable, and costs the insurance risk pool less when paying the claims.

I know of at least 7 college grads in their 20s who are underemployed because they cannot pass a drug test, and pot is their thing. They have expenses and can't make their student loan payments, and some are living with mom and dad again because they can't afford rent. I know a manufacturing company H.R. manager who said they cannot hire enough people because 60% of applicants cannot pass a drug test. Working there deals with machine tools and big industrial equipment where you can't have stoners operating it safely. And then there are the Workers' Compensation claims.....

[TexaninVA]

Do you feel that marijuana smokers are negatively affecting the US economy?

No, not at this point.

However, if you extrapolate over a longer period ... I would argue that to the extent marijuana is increasingly legalized, it will have a deleterious effect on the culture in general, and the work ethic in particular. It's always been a gateway drug, not to everyone who tried it in their youth ... me included, but it certainly has to some.

Historically, there's always been an understandable tension between work vs pleasure, and I think widespread legalization will inevitably result in more people incentivized to get a free ride in the wagon vs working to pull it.

[DianeM]

The problem is, employers cannot afford to hire people who are dopers. Most employers require drug testing for a reason.

Health insurance premiums are often reduced to incentivize a drug-free workforce, because a drug-free workforce is healthier, more reliable, and costs the insurance risk pool less when paying the claims.

I know of at least 7 college grads in their 20s who are underemployed because they cannot pass a drug test, and pot is their thing. They have expenses and can't make their student loan payments, and some are living with mom and dad again because they can't afford rent. I know a manufacturing company H.R. manager who said they cannot hire enough people because 60% of applicants cannot pass a drug test. Working there deals with machine tools and big industrial equipment where you can't have stoners operating it safely. And then there are the Workers' Compensation claims.....

OK so a junkie doesn't get a job - that's life in the big city. Lay off the joints and it will get out of your system. When they grow up, they will realize that. In the interim, they remain underemployed. I still maintain that there are far more drunks out there that are far more dangerous.

[graciegirl]

And there are those like me addicted to Publix Premier Rum Raisin Ice Cream.


Gonna have some now.:coolsmiley:

[CFrance]

And there are those like me addicted to Publix Premier Rum Raisin Ice Cream.


Gonna have some now.:coolsmiley:

I think you can be institutionalized for that.

[TexaninVA]

And there are those like me addicted to Publix Premier Rum Raisin Ice Cream.


Gonna have some now.:coolsmiley:

The first step to getting clean is to admit your addiction ... :)

[jmac1031]

I will second that!

[CFrance]

No, not at this point.

However, if you extrapolate over a longer period ... I would argue that to the extent marijuana is increasingly legalized, it will have a deleterious effect on the culture in general, and the work ethic in particular. It's always been a gateway drug, not to everyone who tried it in their youth ... me included, but it certainly has to some.

Historically, there's always been an understandable tension between work vs pleasure, and I think widespread legalization will inevitably result in more people incentivized to get a free ride in the wagon vs working to pull it.

So far it still is the right of employers to require not only drug testing at hiring, but random drug testing during the working relationship. Ultimately workers will have to decide which is more important to them, work or pleasure.

Employers still have the right to fire someone who is drunk on the job. I believe the same will apply to those doing drugs on the job,even if marijuana is legalized across the board.

The effect legalization may have on the economy may well come from those who cannot be employed because of their marijuana use.

[Sydney]

And there are those like me addicted to Publix Premier Rum Raisin Ice Cream.


Gonna have some now.:coolsmiley:

Pair that with Screaming Yellow Zonkers!:a040:

[Golfingnut]

The discussion should be about regulation, THC % maximums! package labeling! tax amounts age restrictions etc? Talking about should it be come legal is a waste of bandwidth. Even if it does not become legal, it is here to stay. Remember DDT, it was OK, now it's off the market as it was proven not to be OK. In Salem people that practiced witchcraft were burned at the stake, now it is just another ouija board hobby.

Point is as society evolves, we do and we undue as needed for the betterment of us all.
To stand on an opinion, is OK for yourself, but when you attempt to force your opinion on others is very wrong.

Marijuana is one of those things that deserves the opportunity to play out on the American stage. It has far to many pro and con stats for one opinion or the other to decide.

[graciegirl]

My opinion is to leave it like it is. It alters peoples reality for a time and we have enough of that already.

[Bucco]

Interesting....Jerry Brown, former Gov of California (running again he says)....a guy who rightfully or not was "alleged" to "participate" in the 60's said..

"He also expressed worry about the "tendency to go to extremes." After legalization, he said, "if there's advertising and legitimacy, how many people can get stoned and still have a great state or a great nation? The world's pretty dangerous, very competitive. I think we need to stay alert, if not 24 hours a day, more than some of the potheads might be able to put together."

Gov. Jerry Brown on legalized marijuana: ‘How many people can get stoned and still have a great state?’ (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2014/03/02/gov-jerry-brown-on-legalized-marijuana-how-many-people-can-get-stoned-and-still-have-a-great-state/)

[TexaninVA]

So far it still is the right of employers to require not only drug testing at hiring, but random drug testing during the working relationship. Ultimately workers will have to decide which is more important to them, work or pleasure.

Employers still have the right to fire someone who is drunk on the job. I believe the same will apply to those doing drugs on the job,even if marijuana is legalized across the board.

The effect legalization may have on the economy may well come from those who cannot be employed because of their marijuana use.

I fully agree with you here ... and it relates to my point earlier that there's always a tension between working and pleasure. As my boss used to say, work is a four letter word :) ... but something we all need to do if we want to afford pleasure.

It just seems common sense to predict that the wider spread the use and legalization of pot becomes, the more it will enervate the populace, increase the welfare rolls and cause a lot of people to choose the pothead life. Sad and wasteful ... plus we all get to support them when they can't do it.

[janmcn]

To be clear: Florida voters will be voting on the use of medical marijuana only, not recreational use of marijuana in November. Marijuana is only legal in two states, Colorado and Washington.

[TexaninVA]

To be clear: Florida voters will be voting on the use of medical marijuana only, not recreational use of marijuana in November. Marijuana is only legal in two states, Colorado and Washington.

Thanks for the clarification but I think most of us see medical marijuana as a stalking horse of sorts for the expanded recreational use. It's never enough ... or so it seems.

[mickey100]

Thanks for the clarification but I think most of us see medical marijuana as a stalking horse of sorts for the expanded recreational use. It's never enough ... or so it seems.

That's the type of logic the NRA uses to justify the legality of assault rifles. Inversely they claim we'll lose all gun rights if we make one type of gun illegal. I don't buy it for gun control, and I don't think legalizing medical marijuana for those who can really benefit has to be a gateway to legalization of recreational marijuana.

[TexaninVA]

That's the type of logic the NRA uses to justify the legality of assault rifles. Inversely they claim we'll lose all gun rights if we make one type of gun illegal. I don't buy it for gun control, and I don't think legalizing medical marijuana for those who can really benefit has to be a gateway to legalization of recreational marijuana.

Thanks for you insightful comment on the shortcomings of my logical processes, but I think it's still an accurate point nonetheless ... the camel's nose under the tent type thing.

[Golfingnut]

Thanks for you insightful comment on the shortcomings of my logical processes, but I think it's still an accurate point nonetheless ... the camel's nose under the tent type thing.

Yea, what's next, let women vote. :evil6:

[TexaninVA]

Yea, what's next, let women vote. :evil6:

You already know your comment has absolutely nothing to do with what we're talking about but apparently you felt a need to post it so have at it my friend. :)

[ilovetv]

Clearly, being in a pot stupor causes people to ignore these and other facts:

From Office of National Drug Control Policy, Executive Office of the President:

The Federal Government and business community are increasingly recognizing the negative consequences of substance abuse on the U.S economy and the Nation's workforce. Abuse of drugs and alcohol is costly for our society and, left untreated, places a burden on our workplace, our healthcare system, and our communities

A number of reports and surveys highlight the detrimental effects substance abuse has on business productivity and competitiveness as it also increases workplace injuries and absenteeism.

The following data provide a stark illustration of consequences of drug use in our society.

Economic Costs

The economic cost of drug abuse in the United States was estimated at $193 billion in 2007, the last available estimate. This value includes:

$120 billion in lost productivity, mainly due to labor participation costs, participation in drug abuse treatment, incarceration, and premature death;

$11 billion in healthcare costs–for drug treatment and drug related medical consequences; and

$61 billion in criminal justice costs, primarily due to criminal investigation, prosecution and incarceration, and victim costs......

White House website:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/ondcp/Fact_Sheets/effects_of_drugs_on_economy_jw_5-24-11_0.pdf

[TexaninVA]

Clearly, being in a pot stupor causes people to ignore these and other facts:

From Office of National Drug Control Policy, Executive Office of the President:

The Federal Government and business community are increasingly recognizing the negative consequences of substance abuse on the U.S economy and the Nation's workforce. Abuse of drugs and alcohol is costly for our society and, left untreated, places a burden on our workplace, our healthcare system, and our communities

A number of reports and surveys highlight the detrimental effects substance abuse has on business productivity and competitiveness as it also increases workplace injuries and absenteeism.

The following data provide a stark illustration of consequences of drug use in our society.

Economic Costs

The economic cost of drug abuse in the United States was estimated at $193 billion in 2007, the last available estimate. This value includes:

$120 billion in lost productivity, mainly due to labor participation costs, participation in drug abuse treatment, incarceration, and premature death;

$11 billion in healthcare costs–for drug treatment and drug related medical consequences; and

$61 billion in criminal justice costs, primarily due to criminal investigation, prosecution and incarceration, and victim costs......

White House website:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/ondcp/Fact_Sheets/effects_of_drugs_on_economy_jw_5-24-11_0.pdf

Wow ... excellent post. I don't see how anyone can rationally argue to legalize pot once you consider some of the facts you presented. Emotionally yes ... people can always advocate what they "feel" is best etc, but if we fully legalize pot, our kids and grandkids will rue the day. On 2nd thought, maybe a large number of them will be too stoned to realize that.

[Golfingnut]

Wow ... excellent post. I don't see how anyone can rationally argue to legalize pot once you consider some of the facts you presented. Emotionally yes ... people can always advocate what they "feel" is best etc, but if we fully legalize pot, our kids and grandkids will rue the day. On 2nd thought, maybe a large number of them will be too stoned to realize that.

That report was Not about marijuana. Gggeeezzz

[CFrance]

Yea, what's next, let women vote. :evil6:

Hey, them's fightin' words!

[Golfingnut]

Hey, them's fightin' words!

I used a similar argument to pot. Old white guys were terrified back then that giving the right to vote to women would destroy the United States.

It seems to be a natural instinct for old folks to fear what they know nothing about. Thunder, black cats, breaking a mirror and OMG, POT.

[ilovetv]

That report was Not about marijuana. Gggeeezzz

Thank you for illustrating my point. The report says under "School Performance".......

"Students who are not current marijuana users are more than twice as likely to report an average grade of "A" than those who are current users of marijuana (30.5% vs. 12.5%).

College students......"

White House website:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/ondcp/Fact_Sheets/effects_of_drugs_on_economy_jw_5-24-11_0.pdf

[Golfingnut]

Apples and oranges. This thread is about marijuana. That old 2007 article about all drugs is a poor defense for not legalizing medical marijuana. Your example is dot apply to this discussion.

[mickey100]

Apples and oranges. This thread is about marijuana. That old 2007 article about all drugs is a poor defense for not legalizing medical marijuana. Your example does not apply to this discussion.


Agreed. We are talking about medical marijuana to help sick people relieve their pain and other symptoms. Not drug and alcohol abuse. Two different conversations.

[TexaninVA]

I used a similar argument to pot. Old white guys were terrified back then that giving the right to vote to women would destroy the United States.

It seems to be a natural instinct for old folks to fear what they know nothing about. Thunder, black cats, breaking a mirror and OMG, POT.


It also seems to be natural and quick reaction by some to make absurd analogies, taken to stratospheric heights, to belittle common sense reasoning. It's like playing to the galleries ... quick, easy and momentarily popular?

[Golfingnut]

It also seems to be natural and quick reaction by some to make absurd analogies, taken to stratospheric heights, to belittle common sense reasoning. It's like playing to the galleries ... quick, easy and momentarily popular?

That's true, but don't beat yourself up about it. I am sure you meant well.

[Barefoot]

That's true, but don't beat yourself up about it. I am sure you meant well.

:evil6:

[TexaninVA]

That's true, but don't beat yourself up about it. I am sure you meant well.

No worries on that score ... in the meantime have another joint

[JourneyOfLife]

Interesting....Jerry Brown, former Gov of California (running again he says)....a guy who rightfully or not was "alleged" to "participate" in the 60's said..

"He also expressed worry about the "tendency to go to extremes." After legalization, he said, "if there's advertising and legitimacy, how many people can get stoned and still have a great state or a great nation? The world's pretty dangerous, very competitive. I think we need to stay alert, if not 24 hours a day, more than some of the potheads might be able to put together."

Gov. Jerry Brown on legalized marijuana: ‘How many people can get stoned and still have a great state?’ (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2014/03/02/gov-jerry-brown-on-legalized-marijuana-how-many-people-can-get-stoned-and-still-have-a-great-state/)

But, in a different interview, he was asked if he will make another run at the White House too. He didn't say no in the interview. More or less he said, the interviewer could interpret that he won't be running, besides he loves his job as governor and has unfinished biz in California.

Isn't that what all governors say early on? If the party comes calling, you can bet his hat will be in the ring. Even if it is as a VP candidate.

Brown was sending a message to the nation. He is liberal, but also conservative on some issues.

IMO, he was talking to independent voters that might be conservative mainly.

No presidential Candidate will touch the issue, either way. Most will be afraid of losing votes, except for the more extreme right leaning candidates.

The message will be; we will see how the experiment plays out in the states.

Besides, next up is Alaska according to a bunch of news articles.

[Golfingnut]

No worries on that score ... in the meantime have another joint

Not me my friend. Tried it 40 years ago and made me paranoid. Told that is very rare so tried it again about 38 years ago at Fort Campbell Kentucky. Same thing. I will never try it again, but if it has medicinal value or even recreational value, legalize it. Let everyone out of jail that are in there for simple possession and stop wasting money prosecuting users.

[ilovetv]

Science Daily....

Herbal cannabis not recommended for rheumatology patients

Patients with rheumatic conditions are in need of symptom relief and some are turning to herbal cannabis as a treatment option. However, the effectiveness and safety of medical marijuana to treat symptoms of rheumatic conditions such as rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, or fibromyalgia is not supported by medical evidence.

A new article published in Arthritis Care & Research, a journal of the American College of Rheumatology (ACR), explores the risks associated with using herbal cannabis for medicinal purposes and advises healthcare providers to discourage rheumatology patients from using this drug as therapy.

"Physicians caring for patients who are self-medicating with marijuana need to understand the health implications of using this drug. Our study aims to provide health care professionals with that medical evidence related to medical marijuana use in patients with rheumatic conditions."

In the U.S. twenty states, including the District of Columbia (DC), have legalized cannabis for medical purposes. The present study examines the dosing, administration, efficacy and risks of herbal cannabis in pain management for patients with rheumatic conditions........

......Furthermore, there is no formal short-term or long-term study of the effectiveness of herbal cannabis in patients with rheumatic diseases. Studies that show good efficacy of cannabinoids for cancer and neuropathic pain may not be extended to rheumatic diseases because of the differing mechanism in the types of pain.

The study authors highlight that use of medical marijuana comes with inherent risks such as compromised cognitive and psychomotor function. Long-term use of cannabis may lead to mental illness, dependence, addiction and memory issues.

In fact, a prior U.S. study of 8,000 adults who used cannabis in the previous year found that the odds of depression were 1.4 times higher in cannabis users compared to non-users.

"At this time, we cannot recommend herbal cannabis for arthritis pain management given the lack of efficacy data, potential harm from the drug, and availability of other therapies for managing pain," concludes Dr. Fitzcharles. "Physicians should discourage rheumatology patients from using medical marijuana as a therapy."

See Full Article:
Herbal cannabis not recommended for rheumatology patients -- ScienceDaily (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/03/140303083543.htm)

[mickey100]

So the studies show that there is good efficacy of cannabis for cancer and neuropathic pain.

[mickey100]

That's true, but don't beat yourself up about it. I am sure you meant well.

:bigbow:

[maynaze]

I so wish it was legal and I could find some lol. I agree with John W. You must use it responsibly. Tax the heck out of it and do some good with the money. Less stress on the legal system, when they are not having to deal with all the "small time" druggies.

[graciegirl]

Then we would have to deal with the smell of joints at the squares, and folks sitting around saying "whatever", munching and grinning and not caring if the dogs poop in their yards.


Something to think about.

[CFrance]

Then we would have to deal with the smell of joints at the squares, and folks sitting around saying "whatever", munching and grinning and not caring if the dogs poop in their yards.


Something to think about.

Or danced on their squares!!:police:

[rubicon]

The medicinal pitch is a red herring and a canard for pushing the legalization of marijuana and the incentives for politicians is tax money. But don't kid yourself these taxes will disappear just as have the taxes realized by legalizing gambling. You will never see a drop in your taxes as a result of this legislation but you will see the drop in morality. what is next legalizing prostitution in all states.

When a very liberal governor such as Jerry Brown (D-CA) is concerned about the problems associated with marijuana and takes a wait see attitude you got to be concerned. He certainly is about staying competitive because he know dope heads are not very productive and with 49% of people taking entitlements what do you suppose this country will look like in a few years.

Anyone supporting this legislation is either myopic, a doper, a dope or going to make a killing on its passage. But those in favor overlook the horribles visited upon us with its passage

As to medicinal purposes if that is the cause then it better be highly regulated because we already have more prescription drug dopers driving cars and otherwise causing unnecessary harm and damage to innocent people.

[Golfingnut]

The medicinal pitch is a red herring and a canard for pushing the legalization of marijuana and the incentives for politicians is tax money. But don't kid yourself these taxes will disappear just as have the taxes realized by legalizing gambling. You will never see a drop in your taxes as a result of this legislation but you will see the drop in morality. what is next legalizing prostitution in all states.

When a very liberal governor such as Jerry Brown (D-CA) is concerned about the problems associated with marijuana and takes a wait see attitude you got to be concerned. He certainly is about staying competitive because he know dope heads are not very productive and with 49% of people taking entitlements what do you suppose this country will look like in a few years.

Anyone supporting this legislation is either myopic, a doper, a dope or going to make a killing on its passage. But those in favor overlook the horribles visited upon us with its passage

As to medicinal purposes if that is the cause then it better be highly regulated because we already have more prescription drug dopers driving cars and otherwise causing unnecessary harm and damage to innocent people.

chilout. It has miraculous medicinal value to millions to include children with horrible deadly seizures. Please don't be so quick to dismiss any medication that is a miracle cure for anyone.
https://www.epilepsy.com/newsfeeds/press_release/1002788

[Polar Bear]

[QUOTE=Golfingnut;839197]...don't be so quick to dismiss any medication that is a miracle cure...

I favor legitimate, legalized medicinal use, but overstating the benefits does not help the cause.

[Golfingnut]

[QUOTE=Golfingnut;839197]...don't be so quick to dismiss any medication that is a miracle cure...

I favor legitimate, legalized medicinal use, but overstating the benefits does not help the cause.

I was quoting the mother and father of a child an extract from marajuna brought back from the brink of death. Were they overstating the benefit.

[graciegirl]

[quote=Polar Bear;839205]

I was quoting the mother and father of a child an extract from marajuna brought back from the brink of death. Were they overstating the benefit.



I think the neurologist who treated the child would be more qualified to say, perhaps more than the parents. Brink of death isn't a medical term, it is an emotional term, and rightly so if it were your child.


We want to support our views with valid arguments, and Polar Bear is correct. If we overstate our views, as I often do, we lose a bit of credibility..

[Golfingnut]

[QUOTE=graciegirl;839211][quote=Golfingnut;839210]



I think the neurologist who treated the child would be more qualified to say, perhaps more than the parents. Brink of death isn't a medical term, it is an emotional term, and rightly so if it were your child.


We want to support our views with valid arguments, and Polar Bear is correct. If we overstate our views, as I often do, we lose a bit of credibility..[/

For me after watching the full documentary, the child was on the brink of death as verified by the doctors in the documentary. Someone being drunk as a skunk is not a medical term either, but most people understand the term. Try to understand my meaning. Fear stops so much in the area of research. Close minded people should have no voice in matters like this. Follow the way of no,no,no and we would never advance medicine. I would also like to add that giving ones opinion of how others should post is a matter for the monitors and it loses credibility when done by someone without the proper authority to do so.
:posting:

[TexaninVA]

[QUOTE=graciegirl;839211][quote=Golfingnut;839210]



I think the neurologist who treated the child would be more qualified to say, perhaps more than the parents. Brink of death isn't a medical term, it is an emotional term, and rightly so if it were your child.


We want to support our views with valid arguments, and Polar Bear is correct. If we overstate our views, as I often do, we lose a bit of credibility..[/

For me after watching the full documentary, the child was on the brink of death as verified by the doctors in the documentary. Someone being drunk as a skunk is not a medical term either, but most people understand the term. Try to understand my meaning. Fear stops so much in the area of research. Close minded people should have no voice in matters like this. Follow the way of no,no,no and we would never advance medicine. I would also like to add that giving ones opinion of how others should post is a matter for the monitors and it loses credibility when done by someone without the proper authority to do so.
:posting:


There you go again ... "close minded people" (by whose standard?) ... "should have no voice" (does that mean you have a lock on the truth, and are the only one entitled to speak?) etc etc

In addition, Gracie's point is accurate IMHO. Your train of thought seems to veer off the tracks periodically which makes your arguments seem more confused than they already are

[Golfingnut]

[quote=Golfingnut;839225][QUOTE=graciegirl;839211]


There you go again ... "close minded people" (by whose standard?) ... "should have no voice" (does that mean you have a lock on the truth, and are the only one entitled to speak?) etc etc

In addition, Gracie's point is accurate IMHO. Your train of thought seems to veer off the tracks periodically which makes your arguments seem more confused than they already are

Close minded by my Standard. Who else. I certainly would not take my lead from someone else's mind. Her point was accurate only because she agreed with you. Do you see my point there? I realize I am a little complicated for some. I would recommend reading my posts twice before responding.

Lou

[JourneyOfLife]

Here is a link to PBS with Ken Burns' documentary on Alcohol Prohibition. IMO, It is very interesting and worth watching.

When you watch it, you will see nearly the same type of debate that is happening right now, very similar problems, and very similar points of view... on both sides.

When you watch it, think about your personal concerns or acceptance about alcohol and compare and contrast them to the thoughts expressed by people in the documentary.

It is deja vu.

Prohibition: Watch Videos | PBS (http://www.pbs.org/kenburns/prohibition/watch-video/#id=2082675582)


I streamed it from netflix when I watched it. It might still be available there too.

[TexaninVA]

[quote=TexaninVA;839246][quote=Golfingnut;839225]

Close minded by my Standard. Who else. I certainly would not take my lead from someone else's mind. Her point was accurate only because she agreed with you. Do you see my point there? I realize I am a little complicated for some. I would recommend reading my posts twice before responding.

Lou

I don't think you're complicated at all ... just simply confused. Or, maybe your thoughts are running faster than your ability to write them down coherently? Not sure which. In any event, I enjoy reading your posts.

[Golfingnut]

Here is a link to PBS with Ken Burns' documentary on Alcohol Prohibition. IMO, It is very interesting and worth watching.

When you watch it, you will see nearly the same type of debate that is happening right now, very similar problems, and very similar points of view... on both sides.

When you watch it, think about your personal concerns or acceptance about alcohol and compare and contrast them to the thoughts expressed by people in the documentary.

It is deja vu.

Prohibition: Watch Videos | PBS (http://www.pbs.org/kenburns/prohibition/watch-video/#id=2082675582)


I streamed it from netflix when I watched it. It might still be available there too.

Great article. Thanks. That is what we are facing today with pot. I am strictly a beer drinker, but I sincerely believe we would benefit to outlaw booze and legalize pot. I sure would miss bud light.

[Golfingnut]

[quote=Golfingnut;839257][quote=TexaninVA;839246]

I don't think you're complicated at all ... just simply confused. Or, maybe your thoughts are running faster than your ability to write them down coherently? Not sure which. In any event, I enjoy reading your posts.

Well thank you Virginia or Texas. I will try to use more simple terms when I post..

[TexaninVA]

[quote=TexaninVA;839270][quote=Golfingnut;839257]

Well thank you Virginia or Texas. I will try to use more simple terms when I post..

You misunderstood. Not asking that you use "simple terms." I'm just requesting that you strive for coherent, rational posts that are at least roughly in synch with the Queen's English.

[Golfingnut]

[quote=Golfingnut;839274][quote=TexaninVA;839270]

You misunderstood. Not asking that you use "simple terms." I'm just requesting that you strive for coherent, rational posts that are at least roughly in synch with the Queen's English.

LOL you thinking I misunderstood is a misunderstanding of my post.

Love Lou

[mickey100]

[quote=Golfingnut;839274][quote=TexaninVA;839270]

You misunderstood. Not asking that you use "simple terms." I'm just requesting that you strive for coherent, rational posts that are at least roughly in synch with the Queen's English.

Pretty nasty post. :mad:

[Golfingnut]

[quote=TexaninVA;839308][quote=Golfingnut;839274]

Pretty nasty post. :mad:

Very true, but the poster means well. I have come numb to silly insults.

[rubicon]

Is there really an exact argument of alcohol v drugs? It may be that there are similar arguments but in my view not quite the same because mostly of intent. never once in my life did I intend to get drunk. compare that to people who smoke dope to get "high" You won't find anyone who will admit this is true who is in favor of legalization because it goes to the issues of the underlined concerns of legalizations loss of productivity motivation and increase in DUI and m mostly addiction.

Polar bear is spot on concerning the over estimation of the miracles of marijuana

[Golfingnut]

Is there really an exact argument of alcohol v drugs? It may be that there are similar arguments but in my view not quite the same because mostly of intent. never once in my life did I intend to get drunk. compare that to people who smoke dope to get "high" You won't find anyone who will admit this is true who is in favor of legalization because it goes to the issues of the underlined concerns of legalizations loss of productivity motivation and increase in DUI and m mostly addiction.

Polar bear is spot on concerning the over estimation of the miracles of marijuana

In my humble opinion, the saving of ONE person from suffering is a miracle.
The people that smoke this stuff to get high are going to continue to do so legal or not.

ALL THE NEGATIVE TALK ABOUT THE VALIDITY OF IT HAVING MEDICINAL VALUE AND TRYING TO BLOCK IT FROM BECOMING A LEGAL MEDICINE IS ONLY HURTING THE HONEST PERSON THAT COULD BENEFIT FROM IT BUT WILL NOT BECAUSE OF A TERRIBLY MISGUIDED GROUP.

[TOTV Team]

Comments should not be directed at users but the topic. Please stay on topic or we will remove posts or close the thread. Thanks in advance.

[skeletalchain]

I am against it. there are a lot more important issues in our country that needs to be solved, I don't think legalizing marijuana is one of them

[JourneyOfLife]

Here is a Poll about use of it. It probably explains a bit about different people's views.

In U.S., 38% Have Tried Marijuana, Little Changed Since '80s (http://www.gallup.com/poll/163835/tried-marijuana-little-changed-80s.aspx)

I have no doubt everyone will end up with an opportunity to express their view with a vote on it sooner or later.

[Golfingnut]

Here is a Poll about use of it. It probably explains a bit about different people's views.

In U.S., 38% Have Tried Marijuana, Little Changed Since '80s (http://www.gallup.com/poll/163835/tried-marijuana-little-changed-80s.aspx)

I have no doubt everyone will end up with an opportunity to express their view with a vote on it sooner or later.

Great link. The statistic on age group explains the disapproval of some in The Villages.

[janmcn]

Here is a Poll about use of it. It probably explains a bit about different people's views.

In U.S., 38% Have Tried Marijuana, Little Changed Since '80s (http://www.gallup.com/poll/163835/tried-marijuana-little-changed-80s.aspx)

I have no doubt everyone will end up with an opportunity to express their view with a vote on it sooner or later.


Every registered Florida voter will have a chance to vote on marijuana for medicinal purposes in November 2014. Recreational use of marijuana is not on the ballot.

This ballet initiative required tens of thousands of signatures, verification of these signatures, and a review by the FL Supreme Court. To become law, the initiative must pass with over 60% of the vote.

[rubicon]

Before anyone votes an affirmative on this issue they may want to study some of the stats concerning the abuse of prescription drugs pill mills, abuse, etc. Florida draws a lot of people and it draws a lot of the wrong kind of people. the last thing this state needs is to pass this type of legislation and I might add continuation of legal gambling

[Golfingnut]

I recommend you pay no attention to news hype and consider the benefit to the patient. Doctors all over the world understand the medicinal value for thousands of people.
Drug abuse does and will continue to happen with prescription and illegal drugs forever. Marijuana would be just one more added to the list of thousands of drugs already on the list. Marijuana is safer than hundreds of FDA approved drugs used every day. No logical caring human should say no to anyone suffering that could be relieved of that suffering thru the use of Marijuana.

[Golfingnut]

Clear thinking on medical marijuana.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta: Why I changed my mind on weed - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/08/health/gupta-changed-mind-marijuana/)

[Golfingnut]

What do Doctors think about Medical Marijuna?

Survey: 76 percent of doctors approve of medical marijuana use - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/survey-76-percent-of-doctors-approve-of-medical-marijuana-use/)

This should be all anyone needs to vote yes in November. Hopefully we will never need it, but to keep it out of Doctors hands is sad and selfish.

[TexaninVA]

I recommend you pay no attention to news hype and consider the benefit to the patient. Doctors all over the world understand the medicinal value for thousands of people.
Drug abuse does and will continue to happen with prescription and illegal drugs forever. Marijuana would be just one more added to the list of thousands of drugs already on the list. Marijuana is safer than hundreds of FDA approved drugs used every day. No logical caring human should say no to anyone suffering that could be relieved of that suffering thru the use of Marijuana.

Actually, a lot of "logical caring humans" completely disagree with you on this point.

[Golfingnut]

Actually, a lot of "logical caring humans" completely disagree with you on this point.

Let's assume your right. With people suffering needlessly, why?

[rp001]

Most that are in disagreement with approving the use of the drug have never tried it and really have no clue. How sad that cigarettes and alcohol and sugar and salt are all more harmful than Pot. The worst that would happen from an overdose is eating too much peanut butter and jelly or laughing yourself silly.

[Jim007]

I sure hope this is not considered political, and it should not be.

There are currently two states where marijuana is now legal. There is currently bi partisan legislation in our congress to actually legalize it across the country in order to tax it.

Marijuana has been proven to have very serious side affects...paranoia, anxiety etc.

I suspect I am showing my age, but what the heck are we doing in this country......we are destroying marriage with laws and morals of the country and now we are saying it is ok to take dope.....smoke something that will impair judgement so we can collect taxes !

Why are we discussing gun control.......a person smoking marijuana would be acceptable to buy guns with the current trend.

I am confused about the direction of this country for sure, and wanted to hear what anyone else feels about it.

I suspect I am alone, and not "with it"...seems most on here want this kind of stuff which they call being......I wont use the word I was going to as it would seem political.

But, the legalization of marijuana in a few states and more moving in that direction, the discussion that we should make it legal so we can tax it.......am I the only one who sees serious problems in the future. Marriage means nothing, you can smoke dope legally, BUT WE will have made sure that we can't load our guns quickly !!

I have a simple solution to most of our issues raised here.

1. Make all drug use legal and tax them just like alcohol and tobacco.
2. Repeal all gun control laws in the land.
3. If you merely take a weapon of any kind to commit a crime, automatic life sentence with no parole (weapon doesn't have to be used, just present).
4. If you purposely take the life of another person, DEATH PENALTY.
5. If you are convicted of negligent homicide, due to alcohol or drug use, automatic life sentence with parole after 25 served.
6. If anybody's constitutional rights have been violated due to weapons, alcohol, or drug use, minimum 25 years hard labor.
7. Oh, one more thing. If your weapon gets in the hands of someone who uses it in the commission of a crime, you share the sentence with the perp in the same cell!

Simple! Have a nice day.