Community standards ?

[beartrack]

When you walk into Walmart's garden dept. you will see a Sunbrella gazebo structure that is 11' X 11' on display. It has four poles, one in each corner. The top is solid brown with a small vent at the top. I asked Community standards if I could put this on my 20' concrete patio. I filled out the paper work and one week later they said no. They said that we could have an umbrella but this was too tent like. I asked if I needed their permission for an umbrella, they said no, that umbrellas are allowed. Then "Lo and Behold" I recieved a flyer this morning for an umbrella that measur's 11' X 11'. With the exact same roof as the Gazebo. The only difference is instead of one support at each corner, there is one support in the middle. I just don't get it! It's in my back yard, we have hedges and other shrubs. The only thing that any of my back yard neighbors would see is the roof, and they are exactly the same. I'm confused !!!!

[downeaster]

When you walk into Walmart's garden dept. you will see a Sunbrella gazebo structure that is 11' X 11' on display. It has four poles, one in each corner. The top is solid brown with a small vent at the top. I asked Community standards if I could put this on my 20' concrete patio. I filled out the paper work and one week later they said no. They said that we could have an umbrella but this was too tent like. I asked if I needed their permission for an umbrella, they said no, that umbrellas are allowed. Then "Lo and Behold" I recieved a flyer this morning for an umbrella that measur's 11' X 11'. With the exact same roof as the Gazebo. The only difference is instead of one support at each corner, there is one support in the middle. I just don't get it! It's in my back yard, we have hedges and other shrubs. The only thing that any of my back yard neighbors would see is the roof, and they are exactly the same. I'm confused !!!!

I commend you for seeking permission before the fact.
This is a deed restricted community and we all accepted the rules when we purchased our homes. We agree on what we can and cannot put in our own backyard.
They have to draw the line somewhere and a gazebo is a gazebo and an umbrella an umbrella.
If they were to make an exception for you they would have to make it for all.
Why an umbrella and not a gazebo? People tend to fold their umbrellas when not in use. Gazebos not so. So while one is away for a day, or just for a short time, and a strong wind appears and gazebo becomes lethal. I have been at a beach where this has happened and people were hurt. Also, many of our backyards have "kissing lanais" and gazebos may be considered unsightly by our neighbors.
I can go and on about the merits of our deed restricted community and they far out way the disadvantages. That is one of the main reasons we moved here.
BTW, my son lives in a non-restricted community where lot sizes are measured in acres. He had one of those gazebos and nailed the legs to his wood deck. A strong wind still tore it loose.

[Challenger]

When you walk into Walmart's garden dept. you will see a Sunbrella gazebo structure that is 11' X 11' on display. It has four poles, one in each corner. The top is solid brown with a small vent at the top. I asked Community standards if I could put this on my 20' concrete patio. I filled out the paper work and one week later they said no. They said that we could have an umbrella but this was too tent like. I asked if I needed their permission for an umbrella, they said no, that umbrellas are allowed. Then "Lo and Behold" I recieved a flyer this morning for an umbrella that measur's 11' X 11'. With the exact same roof as the Gazebo. The only difference is instead of one support at each corner, there is one support in the middle. I just don't get it! It's in my back yard, we have hedges and other shrubs. The only thing that any of my back yard neighbors would see is the roof, and they are exactly the same. I'm confused !!!!

I would assume that one is tent like and the other is an umbrella. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with the decision merely reflecting that the standard must begin somewhere. The next guy may not have shrubs or may decide that side walls are ok. Standards are sometimes tough to agree upon but someone has to have authority to enforce standards and apply them consistently or we will begin to junk up like most of Florida(and many other areas) Just MHO

[gomoho]

I actually saw something very similair to what you are describing on a golf course lot no less and thought it was very attractive.

[beartrack]

So far all the answers to my Question have been very understandable and show differences of opinion on the subject. My dillema however, still rests with the word standards. No one could possibly know whether or not some folks will fold up there umbrella when they are away or not. Sure, a wind could knock it over or as described in another post turn it into a missile but, same can be said of many things like furniture, potted plants, barbeques etc. etc. The word that come s to mind is "Standards " Is there a rule that says we "Must" put our things away before we leave for a long period of time, or would it be just plain common sense, not "Standards" We can not legislate common sense. We must just trust our neighbors to use some. I live here year around and if I know my neighbors are gone and we receive a storm warning, I check their homes and secure what I can as best as I can. Common sense? I think so. By the way I recently read where the villages has approved an awning company to make covers for our birdcages. Let's see, a birdcage with a cover? Hmmm, might look like a tent, ya' think???

[graciegirl]

So far all the answers to my Question have been very understandable and show differences of opinion on the subject. My dillema however, still rests with the word standards. No one could possibly know whether or not some folks will fold up there umbrella when they are away or not. Sure, a wind could knock it over or as described in another post turn it into a missile but, same can be said of many things like furniture, potted plants, barbeques etc. etc. The word that come s to mind is "Standards " Is there a rule that says we "Must" put our things away before we leave for a long period of time, or would it be just plain common sense, not "Standards" We can not legislate common sense. We must just trust our neighbors to use some. I live here year around and if I know my neighbors are gone and we receive a storm warning, I check their homes and secure what I can as best as I can. Common sense? I think so. By the way I recently read where the villages has approved an awning company to make covers for our birdcages. Let's see, a birdcage with a cover? Hmmm, might look like a tent, ya' think???

In answer to any actions by the architectural review committee. It is what it is.

I like, no, I love deed restrictions that keep individual interpretation of what is beautiful to rule over some kinds of REALLY not pretty things you see elsewhere in Florida.

I have lived in areas of deed restrictions for many years in Ohio and it does keep your property values protected in some ways.

I know you are frustrated, but you aren't being singled out.

On the north side of 466 there are fewer restrictions.

[jimbo2012]

It may be better when the new districts ARC are no longer controlled be the villages and turned over to the owners, but maybe not.

At least then with owners there is a a review process not it really up to one person.

Now you only alternative is to challenge them in Court, you may win but the costs I doubt will justify the fight.

Better things to do like enjoy!

[rp001]

So far all the answers to my Question have been very understandable and show differences of opinion on the subject. My dillema however, still rests with the word standards. No one could possibly know whether or not some folks will fold up there umbrella when they are away or not. Sure, a wind could knock it over or as described in another post turn it into a missile but, same can be said of many things like furniture, potted plants, barbeques etc. etc. The word that come s to mind is "Standards " Is there a rule that says we "Must" put our things away before we leave for a long period of time, or would it be just plain common sense, not "Standards" We can not legislate common sense. We must just trust our neighbors to use some. I live here year around and if I know my neighbors are gone and we receive a storm warning, I check their homes and secure what I can as best as I can. Common sense? I think so. By the way I recently read where the villages has approved an awning company to make covers for our birdcages. Let's see, a birdcage with a cover? Hmmm, might look like a tent, ya' think???


While recently contemplating building a substantial addition to my home, I spent several hours with three of the leading contractors in this area..Lots of the time was spent discussing the community architectural board and the "standards," or lack thereof. It seems there is a lot of room in "negotiating" with these folks. Each of the contractors related stories to me regarding "mood swings" by these committees. Something as simple as setback requirements were arbitrary. One time they allowed one and another one was different. The contractors truly don't know which way the wind will blow. I'd take pictures of any existing around town and use that in the approval process.

[mickey100]

I believe it, after seeing what is "out and about". Much variation. The architectural review board needs to use some common sense. For example, you could put up a bright purple polka dot umbrella, which they would allow, because it is an umbrella, but because of the color and patterns could look hideous. But if you install a neutral color gazebo thing, it is not allowed and probably would be less offensive to neighbors and the community. I'm in favor of deed restrictions, but I think they need to have a very limited amount of flexibility in interpreting the standards, to avoid situations such as this.

[graciegirl]

It may be better when the new districts ARC are no longer controlled be the villages and turned over to the owners, but maybe not.

At least then with owners there is a a review process not it really up to one person.

Now you only alternative is to challenge them in Court, you may win but the costs I doubt will justify the fight.

Better things to do like enjoy!

The very thought of that time when the any decisions are turned over to the owners makes me break out in a cold sweat.

There are people here who have been highly involved with homeowners associations that can tell you tales that would curl your hair.

I hope that I do not live to see the day that this place is run by the homeowners.

[beartrack]

Once again, all good answers. Let me be clear, I am very much in favor of deed restrictions, Just so that they apply to every one the same. I'm not upset because they turned me down, I'm upset because,as has been suggested here that the same "Standards" do not apply to everyone. As I negotiate the cart paths all through the villages I see these Gazebo things in backyards all over the place some are even in birdcages clearly visable to any passer-bye. MY issue here is the folks at architechtural review. They do not seem to have any standards. What would be wrong with someone wanting something and the "Board" not liking it to have the person appear before the board to state their case? The folks at Walmart and Sam's and Bed bath and beyond tell me that they sell dozens of these units to Villagers. Maybe they take them up north, who knows? Well, today I solved my problem. I signed a contract with a reputible contractor who will be installing a birdcage in my yard. The gazebo thing? that will go inside the birdcage over our hot tub. There I will soak all my cares away. Oh by the way. I stopped at a house with the gazebo thing in his yard. He said he has had it for three years and no one has complained. AHAH!!! that's the answer, the diffrence between him and me is that I was stupid enough to ask permission. All this stuff is complaint driven, so if you have a nosey neighbor, watch out.

[gomoho]

Oh by the way. I stopped at a house with the gazebo thing in his yard. He said he has had it for three years and no one has complained. AHAH!!! that's the answer, the diffrence between him and me is that I was stupid enough to ask permission. All this stuff is complaint driven, so if you have a nosey neighbor, watch out.[/QUOTE]

You are absolutely right - if your neighbors don't care and it's in the back probably would never have become an issue.

[Barefoot]

In answer to any actions by the architectural review committee. It is what it is. I like, no, I love deed restrictions that keep individual interpretation of what is beautiful to rule over some kinds of REALLY not pretty things you see elsewhere in Florida.

The ARC process keeps The Villages a beautiful, tranquil community. It's true that you can erect what you want, and if neighbors don't complain, you may get away with it. For a while. Until a neighbor sells, and a new neighbor moves in, and complains. Then you'll have the expense of removing it.

[downeaster]

Once again, all good answers. Let me be clear, I am very much in favor of deed restrictions, Just so that they apply to every one the same. I'm not upset because they turned me down, I'm upset because,as has been suggested here that the same "Standards" do not apply to everyone. As I negotiate the cart paths all through the villages I see these Gazebo things in backyards all over the place some are even in birdcages clearly visable to any passer-bye. MY issue here is the folks at architechtural review. They do not seem to have any standards. What would be wrong with someone wanting something and the "Board" not liking it to have the person appear before the board to state their case? The folks at Walmart and Sam's and Bed bath and beyond tell me that they sell dozens of these units to Villagers. Maybe they take them up north, who knows? Well, today I solved my problem. I signed a contract with a reputible contractor who will be installing a birdcage in my yard. The gazebo thing? that will go inside the birdcage over our hot tub. There I will soak all my cares away. Oh by the way. I stopped at a house with the gazebo thing in his yard. He said he has had it for three years and no one has complained. AHAH!!! that's the answer, the diffrence between him and me is that I was stupid enough to ask permission. All this stuff is complaint driven, so if you have a nosey neighbor, watch out.

It was not stupid to ask permission. It was the correct thing to do. There are a few residents who seem to delight in ignoring the rules that were put in place to make this a desirable place to live. The ARC does not have the wherewithal to police the neighborhoods for infractions. They, and we the residents, must rely on each other. It is not a perfect method but it works.

I have lived in neighborhoods with strict enforcement, no enforcement, and poor enforcement. Poor enforcement is no better than no enforcement.

It is annoying to see others "get away with it". However, they are in the minority. Our residents in neighborhoods with more liberal restrictions seem to recognize the need for maintaining their properties. One sees a few outlandish ornaments, etc. but for the most part homes are well kept.

It sounds like you made a good decision by adding a bird cage and putting the gazebo inside. I expect you will get much more use and enjoyment by doing that.

[Bryan]

Deed Compliance is, indeed, a complaint driven process. Probably no one wants the Deed Police to patrol the area and write citations. The ARC responds to requests for approval and/or complaints - not a perfect system but the best we have. It works OK but the more public involvement (complaints over violations?) the better it would work.

As for making exceptions, not a good idea. For years exceptions were made (not exactly by the ARC though, in all fairness) for "For Sale" signs in yards. What a ballyhoo that eventually caused. Turns out the long history of ignoring enforcement meant they gave up the right to enforcement it. What was "OK" for For Sale signs for a week or so got out of control with "For Rent" signs that stayed up forever and a few other items. Now enforcement of that deed restriction is questionable - too much history of non-enforcement.

[jimbo2012]

Well I guess the question here is if you thought something was not in compliance would you file a complaint?

I wouldn't, would anyone else?

[graciegirl]

Well I guess the question here is if you thought something was not in compliance would you file a complaint?

I wouldn't, would anyone else?

Plenty do Jimbo. If it offends you, you can report it. You do NOT have to look at the bending over lady made of plywood in bright colors for the rest of your life.

[jimbo2012]

Doesn't offend me, just think the ARC should do the enforement

[graciegirl]

Doesn't offend me, just think the ARC should do the enforement

BUT....my dear, that ISN'T how it works!

AND it isn't likely to change.

And there probably will not be another dog park, indoor pools, a large performing art center and desired work out rooms.

It is what it is.

[Barefoot]

Well I guess the question here is if you thought something was not in compliance would you file a complaint? I wouldn't, would anyone else?

I think for most people it probably depends on the degree of non compliance. I doubt most of us would complain about a tasteful sand crane tucked into the landscaping. But if someone fenced in their back yard with a six-foot fence, or put a stuffed moose on their front lawn, I betcha someone in the 'hood would complain.

[Bogie Shooter]

Well I guess the question here is if you thought something was not in compliance would you file a complaint?

I wouldn't, would anyone else?

Yep!

[Challenger]

Well I guess the question here is if you thought something was not in compliance would you file a complaint?

I wouldn't, would anyone else?

YES----- The consistent enforcement of appropriate deed restrictions will prevent lots of trouble later. If you don't like the restrictions you have three choices: try to have them modified(very difficult) , comply, or move. :shrug:

[mulligan]

ALSO, it states in the last section of the covenants that the owners have an obligation to insure that they are enforced. Up to and including litigation.

[beartrack]

Okay, let me try to explain my thoughts with a hypothetical situation. You have a hedge across your back yard. The restrictions call that a barrier, so no barrier can be more then 4' tall. Your hedge is 41/2' tall. Some neighbor, name unknown, calls ARB to complain. An inspector shows up and says sorry but, you must cut your hedge down to 4' in order to comply. I say you are correct and I will trim them down to the required height today. As I say that, I look around in all directions from my yard and notice that all the homes to my left and right as far down as six or seven homes, all have 7' or 8' high hedges. The inspector see's me looking and says "If you want to complain about all the other hedges that are not in compliance then call my office and register your complaint and I will come back and issue those complaints to all your neighbors. Well I don't know about anyone else but, I could never do that. I am not saying that the ARB is doing anything wrong, what I am saying is that I feel it is wrong for me to have to act as a policeman with my fellow Villagers. I do not pretend to have the answers to what I percieve as a system with a giant flaw that sets neighbor against neighbor. I was hoping that if we bounce this around a little more, mybe someone can think of a better way. Please understand, I'm not knocking the Villages, I just see a problem. Maybe it can be fixed and maybe not. Couldn't hurt for reasonable folks to discuss it.

[Bogie Shooter]

Okay, let me try to explain my thoughts with a hypothetical situation. You have a hedge across your back yard. The restrictions call that a barrier, so no barrier can be more then 4' tall. Your hedge is 41/2' tall. Some neighbor, name unknown, calls ARB to complain. An inspector shows up and says sorry but, you must cut your hedge down to 4' in order to comply. I say you are correct and I will trim them down to the required height today. As I say that, I look around in all directions from my yard and notice that all the homes to my left and right as far down as six or seven homes, all have 7' or 8' high hedges. The inspector see's me looking and says "If you want to complain about all the other hedges that are not in compliance then call my office and register your complaint and I will come back and issue those complaints to all your neighbors. Well I don't know about anyone else but, I could never do that. I am not saying that the ARB is doing anything wrong, what I am saying is that I feel it is wrong for me to have to act as a policeman with my fellow Villagers. I do not pretend to have the answers to what I percieve as a system with a giant flaw that sets neighbor against neighbor. I was hoping that if we bounce this around a little more, mybe someone can think of a better way. Please understand, I'm not knocking the Villages, I just see a problem. Maybe it can be fixed and maybe not. Couldn't hurt for reasonable folks to discuss it.

In the past (Neighborhood Watch) now Community Watch was the policeman. That didn't work and was changed to what we now have.

[buggyone]

The community standards do rely on residents to make sure everything looks great.

I can imagine what kind of posts we would be seeing if Community Watch was in charge of reporting violations. It would be like "Big Brother" or "Nazi Tactics".

In the case of hedges being too tall, that is a small issue. If someone painted their house bright purple with huge yellow sunflowers on it, would you not complain about that? It would bring the value of your home down. A junk car in the driveway leaking oil? Grass not mowed all summer? Grandparents with their grown children and small grandkids living in the same house? Someone hanging clothes in the yard on a clothesline? All of these things would lower your home value and make The Villages look like a West Virginia trailer park.

Yes, we need to rely on residents to report violations. It is not pitting neighbor against neighbor. It is keeping our property values high and The Villages a place where people want to live The Villages Lifestyle.

[Bogie Shooter]

The community standards do rely on residents to make sure everything looks great.

I can imagine what kind of posts we would be seeing if Community Watch was in charge of reporting violations. It would be like "Big Brother" or "Nazi Tactics".

In the case of hedges being too tall, that is a small issue. If someone painted their house bright purple with huge yellow sunflowers on it, would you not complain about that? It would bring the value of your home down. A junk car in the driveway leaking oil? Grass not mowed all summer? Grandparents with their grown children and small grandkids living in the same house? Someone hanging clothes in the yard on a clothesline? All of these things would lower your home value and make The Villages look like a West Virginia trailer park. Yes, we need to rely on residents to report violations. It is not pitting neighbor against neighbor. It is keeping our property values high and The Villages a place where people want to live The Villages Lifestyle.

Hang on the responses will be a comin...............

[gomoho]

So what it comes down to is if you are lucky enough to have neighbors that either don't care or like your style - no problem. If you have neighbors that make your business their business or hate what you've done - too bad, so sad. Does sound like a strange way to enforce the rules.

Personally it would take a LOT for me to report someone - and I hope my neighbors feel the same - although I don't think I am violating anything.

[gomoho]

Ok - I confess - just violated the rules. Took the dogs out for a 5 minute game of fetch in the backyard (off leash). The good news is my neighbors that were on their lanai thoroughly enjoyed watching the game!

[Bogie Shooter]

Ok - I confess - just violated the rules. Took the dogs out for a 5 minute game of fetch in the backyard (off leash). The good news is my neighbors that were on their lanai thoroughly enjoyed watching the game!

Dogs running free is not in the community standards, its a county law.
Don't think you violated any law...............
What are the leash laws in Sumter County?
County Code 4-10 states that all dogs must be confined on owners property at all times or under direct control or on a leash when off the owners property.

Otherwise a citation will be issued for the animal running free.

[Warren Kiefer]

Okay, let me try to explain my thoughts with a hypothetical situation. You have a hedge across your back yard. The restrictions call that a barrier, so no barrier can be more then 4' tall. Your hedge is 41/2' tall. Some neighbor, name unknown, calls ARB to complain. An inspector shows up and says sorry but, you must cut your hedge down to 4' in order to comply. I say you are correct and I will trim them down to the required height today. As I say that, I look around in all directions from my yard and notice that all the homes to my left and right as far down as six or seven homes, all have 7' or 8' high hedges. The inspector see's me looking and says "If you want to complain about all the other hedges that are not in compliance then call my office and register your complaint and I will come back and issue those complaints to all your neighbors. Well I don't know about anyone else but, I could never do that. I am not saying that the ARB is doing anything wrong, what I am saying is that I feel it is wrong for me to have to act as a policeman with my fellow Villagers. I do not pretend to have the answers to what I percieve as a system with a giant flaw that sets


neighbor against neighbor. I was hoping that if we bounce this around a little more, mybe someone can think of a better way. Please understand, I'm not knocking the Villages, I just see a problem. Maybe it can be fixed and maybe not. Couldn't hurt for reasonable folks to discuss it.

I have bben down this road several times and conclude that without a doube that the district standards off has very little authority to do anything. Any authority they do have would be concerning issues in violation of specific regulations. Hedges and barriers are a prime example, we had neighbors who had dirt brought in and constructed into a 4 foot high berm, on top of that berm they planted hedge type plants. After a short time the hedge plants are now trimmed to 4 feet tall, add that to the berm height and you have a barrier now 8 feet tall. The neighbors have complained vigorously because this 8 foot barrier is on a sharp street curve and definately reeats a hazard. So here comes the district standards enforcer who measures only the hedges from the top of the berm up, yep he says, 4 feet and in compliance. And when you bring in the "aesthetics" that plays such a large part in the standards, you find the standards offices totally without teeth. Aesthetics are defined as being in the eye of the beholder, meaning " what you deem ugly, might be considered beautiful to the next person."

[CFrance]

Deed Compliance is, indeed, a complaint driven process. Probably no one wants the Deed Police to patrol the area and write citations. The ARC responds to requests for approval and/or complaints - not a perfect system but the best we have. It works OK but the more public involvement (complaints over violations?) the better it would work.

As for making exceptions, not a good idea. For years exceptions were made (not exactly by the ARC though, in all fairness) for "For Sale" signs in yards. What a ballyhoo that eventually caused. Turns out the long history of ignoring enforcement meant they gave up the right to enforcement it. What was "OK" for For Sale signs for a week or so got out of control with "For Rent" signs that stayed up forever and a few other items. Now enforcement of that deed restriction is questionable - too much history of non-enforcement.

This is called "selective enforcement" of the rules. We have it in our condo complex in MI, and it has caused a lot of problems. For instance... our neighbors in another part of the complex put up a one-foot wall around some landscaping that replaced a tree that was removed, because weeds and such were growing out into the yard and dune grass. A guy across the lagoon, known not to like this neighbor, complained, and the board made him remove it. Meanwhile in our building (four townhouses), our neighbor on the opposite end from us did the same thing, then put brick edging along her and the next two condos, stopping at ours. I think she knew we would not have wanted it, but never asked. So not only was she not made to take down her low wall (against deed restrictions), we have this 3/4-finished edging. In my view, it brings our building's property value down.

However, we have been cordial neighbors for 15 years, and I am not about to rock the boat. So I haven't complained. On the other hand, I hate the unfinished look. Even though a complaint is supposed to be anonymous, we all know darn well that in our close-knit community this is not the case. So I am between a rock and a hard place. I choose the hard place because we like our neighbors. But I hate the results.

In my view, selective enforcement does not work and is a lazy way to do business. I don't believe it should be up to the neighbors to enforce the rules. If you're going to have them, put something in place to enforce them. Otherwise you're just passing the buck..

[Bogie Shooter]

This is called "selective enforcement" of the rules. We have it in our condo complex in MI, and it has caused a lot of problems. For instance... our neighbors in another part of the complex put up a one-foot wall around some landscaping that replaced a tree that was removed, because weeds and such were growing out into the yard and dune grass. A guy across the lagoon, known not to like this neighbor, complained, and the board made him remove it. Meanwhile in our building (four townhouses), our neighbor on the opposite end from us did the same thing, then put brick edging along her and the next two condos, stopping at ours. I think she knew we would not have wanted it, but never asked. So not only was she not made to take down her low wall (against deed restrictions), we have this 3/4-finished edging. In my view, it brings our building's property value down.

However, we have been cordial neighbors for 15 years, and I am not about to rock the boat. So I haven't complained. On the other hand, I hate the unfinished look. Even though a complaint is supposed to be anonymous, we all know darn well that in our close-knit community this is not the case. So I am between a rock and a hard place. I choose the hard place because we like our neighbors. But I hate the results.

In my view, selective enforcement does not work and is a lazy way to do business. I don't believe it should be up to the neighbors to enforce the rules. If you're going to have them, put something in place to enforce them. Otherwise you're just passing the buck..

You mean something like this:
http://www.districtgov.org/departments/Community-Standards/images/compliance-standards/District5-Matrix.pdf

[gomoho]

Dogs running free is not in the community standards, its a county law.
Don't think you violated any law...............
What are the leash laws in Sumter County?
County Code 4-10 states that all dogs must be confined on owners property at all times or under direct control or on a leash when off the owners property.

Otherwise a citation will be issued for the animal running free.

Okay, thought I would get such a response. The dogs were not running free in the community. They were in the backyards of my neighbors fetching a ball. No, I don't believe I violated a law 'cause they are under voice command and my supervision.

I say "lighten up" or "bring it on". If you are lucky enough to have a dog that is so intent on fetching the ball there is nothing that would distract him, then you are lucky enough to enjoy one of life's simple pleasures.:eclipsee_gold_cup:

[jimbo2012]

berms r permitted if done to there extra 2' setback, therefore, should it be 4' from grade?

Well U could plant a 30' tree?

[gomoho]

berms r permitted if done to there extra 2' setback, therefore, should it be 4' from grade?

Well U could plant a 30' tree?

could you explain the berm comment??? don't understand

[tommy steam]

When you walk into Walmart's garden dept. you will see a Sunbrella gazebo structure that is 11' X 11' on display. It has four poles, one in each corner. The top is solid brown with a small vent at the top. I asked Community standards if I could put this on my 20' concrete patio. I filled out the paper work and one week later they said no. They said that we could have an umbrella but this was too tent like. I asked if I needed their permission for an umbrella, they said no, that umbrellas are allowed. Then "Lo and Behold" I recieved a flyer this morning for an umbrella that measur's 11' X 11'. With the exact same roof as the Gazebo. The only difference is instead of one support at each corner, there is one support in the middle. I just don't get it! It's in my back yard, we have hedges and other shrubs. The only thing that any of my back yard neighbors would see is the roof, and they are exactly the same. I'm confused !!!!

Go for the umbrella .

[jimbo2012]

could you explain the berm comment??? don't understand

Sorry but what exactly don't you understand the berm addition or the height?

[CFrance]

Sorry but what exactly don't you understand the berm addition or the height?

Jumbo, I didn't get it either. Can you have a berm if it's a certain distance from the road? Is that what's meant by set back? Also, is there a height restriction for a berm?

Also, if they wouldn't allow bushes higher than four feet, why would they allow berm plus bushes to exceed that height? Kind of defeats the purpose of the height restrictions.

(But I see bushes all over the sections south of 466 that are way over four feet.)

[jimbo2012]

Jumbo, I didn't get it either. Can you have a berm if it's a certain distance from the road? Is that what's meant by set back? Also, is there a height restriction for a berm?

Also, if they wouldn't allow bushes higher than four feet, why would they allow berm plus bushes to exceed that height? Kind of defeats the purpose of the height restrictions.

(But I see bushes all over the sections south of 466 that are way over four feet.)

Ok here's the guidelines on berms, they are not permitting them in the ROW "right of way", this is owned by the county about 13.5 ft. back from the curb.

Additionally, you must not place a berm right on that line 13.5 ft back you must set it 2' further back. Or 15.5'

The issue of how high was not mentioned, and your question for instance about 4' over let's say a 3 foot tall berm or 7 plus feet is fine, in fact you can have a 3' berm and a 10 foot tall tree/bush.

However, you can not have a continuance grouping over 4' tall.

As far as the combined height being over 4 ' on line of bushes because of the berm brings up an interesting point. I don't know! :rant-rave:

So U can have individual bushes over 4' not a row or screen wall of them, that's my read and take on it after going thru the ARC myself.

. Simple right:shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug:

[CFrance]

Ok here's the guidelines on berms, they are not permitting them in the ROW "right of way", this is owned by the county about 13.5 ft. back from the curb.

Additionally, you must not place a berm right on that line 13.5 ft back you must set it 2' further back. Or 15.5'

The issue of how high was not mentioned, and your question for instance about 4' over let's say a 3 foot tall berm or 7 plus feet is fine, in fact you can have a 3' berm and a 10 foot tall tree/bush.

However, you can not have a continuance grouping over 4' tall.

As far as the combined height being over 4 ' on line of bushes because of the berm brings up an interesting point. I don't know! :rant-rave:

So U can have individual bushes over 4' not a row or screen wall of them, that's my read and take on it after going thru the ARC myself.

. Simple right:shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug:

Okay, thanks for the clarification.

[Warren Kiefer]

Jumbo, I didn't get it either. Can you have a berm if it's a certain distance from the road? Is that what's meant by set back? Also, is there a height restriction for a berm?

Also, if they wouldn't allow bushes higher than four feet, why would they allow berm plus bushes to exceed that height? Kind of defeats the purpose of the height restrictions.

(But I see bushes all over the sections south of 466 that are way over four feet.)

As I said earlier, my neighbors constructed a berm and planted hedge plants atop the berm. This is along their property line and in fact is on the easement property.The deed standard enforcer insisted in measuring only the plants at 4 feet and disregarded the berm. The total height varies between 7 and 8 feet in height. I asked the enforcer if I could create a 10 foot high berm and maintain a 4 hedge on top for a total barrier of 14 feet similiar to my neighbors but a little higher. His response was, don't be ridiculous. I still cannot determine why it was OK for my neighbors but ridiculous for me. I telling you that the deed restrictions offices have practically no enforcement powers what so ever...

[Bogie Shooter]

Okay, thought I would get such a response. The dogs were not running free in the community. They were in the backyards of my neighbors fetching a ball. No, I don't believe I violated a law 'cause they are under voice command and my supervision.

I say "lighten up" or "bring it on". If you are lucky enough to have a dog that is so intent on fetching the ball there is nothing that would distract him, then you are lucky enough to enjoy one of life's simple pleasures.:eclipsee_gold_cup:

I was just trying to point out that what you were doing with the dog was not a violation of the "rules".
The macho challenge to "bring it on"............was not necessary.

[jimbo2012]

As I said earlier, my neighbors constructed a berm and planted hedge plants atop the berm. This is along their property line and in fact is on the easement property.

That is absolutely out of compliance, I'm 100% certain.

The deed standard enforcer insisted in measuring only the plants at 4 feet and disregarded the berm. The total height varies between 7 and 8 feet in height. I asked the enforcer if I could create a 10 foot high berm and maintain a 4 hedge on top for a total barrier of 14 feet similiar to my neighbors but a little higher. His response was, don't be ridiculous.

you can do it, but they would come up with the issue of interfering with natural water runoff at that height & slop I suppose????

I also think the biggest you can build a berm is about 4' high because you need a slop or grade on each side so maybe at 4' tall it needs 6' on each side plus the width across the top of at least 2-3 '

So that's about 15' wide by 4' tall that size is used by several of the Patio Villa entrances on Anna Maria and in the very new Hillsborough PV'


I still cannot determine why it was OK for my neighbors but ridiculous for me. I telling you that the deed restrictions offices have practically no enforcement powers what so ever...

I have the person to contact who has that power, if interested.
PM me.

see pics, notice how those berms ARE on the ROW, they can do that we can't!:cus:

PS:Florida Friendly law says we can, but they still say no, figure that one out! :ohdear:

[DougB]

Yikes! Looks like you would be creating your own flood zone for yourself with those. No?

[jimbo2012]

U actually have that as a provision of approval, that U R responsible