No special treatment for the Villages

[jimbo2012]

No wonder the Villages and its developer have given $150,000 so far this year to Gov. Rick Scott's re-election effort. All developer Gary Morse wants is to bypass state law and win approval to build a nursing home in the sprawling retirement community. Legislators representing the community are sponsoring a bill that would make an exception just for the Villages, and with a friend in the Governor's Mansion there is little doubt that legislation would become law if it gets to Scott's desk.

The sweetheart deal shouldn't get that far, no matter how many political checks Morse and the Villages write.

In 2001, the Legislature approved a moratorium on new nursing home facilities to better control Medicaid costs. The moratorium has been extended to at least 2016.
But HB 1159 would carve out an exception to the moratorium for any deed-restricted retirement community of at least 8,000 residents located in a county where at least 25 percent of the population is at least 65 years old. The county could have no more than 16.1 nursing home beds per thousand residents 65 or older. As the Legislature's own staff analysis concludes, only one community in the state of Florida fits that precise description. Guess which one.

Normally, developers who want to obtain a permit to build or expand a nursing home facility can petition the Agency for Health Care Administration for a certificate of need. That's what developer Steve Bogomilsky did to build the Villages Rehabilitation and Healthcare Center just east of the Villages. Bogomilsky followed the rules. But Republicans Rep. Marlene O'Toole and Sen. Alan Hays, whose districts include the Villages, introduced legislation that only benefits their most prominent constituent while putting Bogomilsky at an economic disadvantage. That's simply unfair.

If Morse wants a new nursing home for the Villages, he should do what any other developer does: Follow the law.
But Morse isn't that patient.
It apparently is easier for him to push legislation that benefits only his development and lavish campaign money on the governor who would sign it into law.
The Florida Legislature is one big conflict of interest, but such brazen self-entitlement ought to be too much to stomach even in Tallahassee.

Tampa Bay times
----

And By Ludmilla Lelis, Orlando Sentinel

State Rep. Marlene O'Toole, sponsor for the House version of the bill, said the population of The Villages, which stretches over Lake, Sumter and Marion counties, has "exploded."

"The need is now for us,'' the Lady Lake Republican said.

That need may not jibe with the healthy, active lifestyles promoted at The Villages, which dubs itself as "America's Friendliest Hometown" and boasts dozens of golf courses, social clubs and restaurants — but lacks a cemetery.

But the reality is that nursing-home care is needed, said Elaine Dreidame, president of the Property Owners' Association of The Villages.

"We have residents that have settled here, and it's not like they're going to go to family up North when they reach a nursing-home stage," Dreidame said. "No matter how active you are, eventually you will get older, and you may need it."

Florida has had a cap on new nursing-home beds since 2001, when the Legislature set the moratorium as a way to control Medicaid costs. There are exceptions for veterans homes and for transfers of nursing-home-bed spaces to areas with greater demand. Also, facilities with an occupancy rate of 96 percent or higher can request more bed space.

Though the proposed bills don't specifically name The Villages, the specific wording, creating an exemption for larger communities that are deed-restricted for those 55 and older, makes The Villages the prime beneficiary.

Eight community nursing homes already exist within 10 miles, according to the state Agency for Health Care Administration. Those facilities have a total of 821 beds and had an 85 percent occupancy this past fiscal year, state records show.

Two of those nursing homes just opened within the past year, state records show.

Tony Marshall, senior director of reimbursement for the Florida Health Care Association, an advocacy group for long-term-care providers, said an exemption for The Villages isn't needed because health-care companies are already responding to the demand.

Also, the average age for nursing-home residents is 85, so it may be several more years before there is greater demand. Census records show that among the community's key demographic of 55 and older, only about 11 percent of that group is older than 80.

Gary Lester, a spokesman for Gary Morse, developer of The Villages, wasn't available for comment.

Andrew Blechman, author of "Leisureville: Adventures in America's Retirement Utopias," a 2008 book that explored The Villages and other unique retirement utopias, said it wasn't surprising the community is seeking such an exemption.


"The Villages is basically organized on a premise that what the builders want, the builders get, and they should be treated differently," Blechman said.

He added that it was interesting that the community was addressing an inevitable consequence of having a 55-and-older population.

"People are getting older, and they have to plan for it," he said. "But I guess building a nursing home wasn't part of the original marketing scheme."

Dreidame, who has lived in The Villages for 14 years, has seen firsthand the need for nursing-home care. She has known acquaintances who had to leave The Villages for nursing-home care before they died. Also, there are couples in which one person is healthy while the other needs such care, and it would be better for the couple if they could have a facility close to home.

"Do we fit the typical pattern of how many nursing homes you need? No. We're atypical, and we need this exception," she said.

[skip0358]

So what. If the Bill gets passed good for him. How many other facilities in TV are age related? Two more that I know of are planned for 466A, one is going up on Parr Drive, tha Hospital if it happens may be going up by Brownwood, there's an extension planned for Freedom Point, etc. People moved here to retire and spend the rest of their lives here, and a good majority will be buried here. TV puts a ton back into the county coffers and if they get it passed AMEN for them. More jobs will be created and a spouse or family member will be closer to loved ones.. JMO

[rhood]

Some folks just like to complain about everything the developer does.

[Cantwaittoarrive]

So what. If the Bill gets passed good for him. How many other facilities in TV are age related? Two more that I know of are planned for 466A, one is going up on Parr Drive, tha Hospital if it happens may be going up by Brownwood, there's an extension planned for Freedom Point, etc. People moved here to retire and spend the rest of their lives here, and a good majority will be buried here. TV puts a ton back into the county coffers and if they get it passed AMEN for them. More jobs will be created and a spouse or family member will be closer to loved ones.. JMO

You are right :bigbow:

[Moderator]

The topic is the need for nursing home facilities in The Villages, although the OP had some political slant to it.

If we are able to stay on topic, the thread will remain open.

If, however, the replies become too political it will be closed.

[birdawg]

So what. If the Bill gets passed good for him. How many other facilities in TV are age related? Two more that I know of are planned for 466A, one is going up on Parr Drive, tha Hospital if it happens may be going up by Brownwood, there's an extension planned for Freedom Point, etc. People moved here to retire and spend the rest of their lives here, and a good majority will be buried here. TV puts a ton back into the county coffers and if they get it passed AMEN for them. More jobs will be created and a spouse or family member will be closer to loved ones.. JMO

Well said. So far the morse family has done my family right, They built paradise for us

[graciegirl]

Read carefully. Jimbo is quoting several things, but it isn't clear.

THE first part is a quote from The Tampa Bay Times and it has a political slant to it.

Jimbo ended up making the post fair...but I had to reread it several times.


I was about to go over and kick him in his bad leg.;)

[tghoul]

The Nursing Home in Lady Lake recently told me they have a 3 to 4 year waiting list.

[Golfingnut]

Sounds like a good plan to me. If the developer finds a better faster way to benefit the residents of the Villages. I thank them for that. Being upset at this plan has no merit.

[Ragman]

Sounds like a good plan to me. If the developer finds a better faster way to benefit the residents of the Villages. I thank them for that. Being upset at this plan has no merit.

:BigApplause::agree:

[dillywho]

Some folks just like to complain about everything the developer does.

Thank you. I totally agree with your assessment.

[Polar Bear]

Maybe they should consider an exception for TV. After all, TV IS an exception. It's truly a one-of-a-kind place.

[blueash]

Note that present law already allows for the addition of nursing home beds to the area. If there is demonstrated need then beds can be "transferred" from another facility which exists in a lower demand area. This allows for Morse to build here if he closes beds elsewhere where they are not needed. Obviously if our local occupancy rate is 85% and the law defines full occupancy as 96% to automatically grant new beds, we don't have excess occupancy here. If the 10 local facilities, including 2 new ones in the last year are not up to Morse's vision, there would be nothing to stop him from purchasing those existing facilities and upgrading them in place nor relocating them within the local community, if I understand the law as it exists.
The state of Florida, wisely or meanly, decided that it was spending too much on poor people living in nursing homes that weren't filled. If the home has empty beds the cost per resident is obviously higher, and that cost is passed to the taxpayer.
You may feel the Villages is different. Why? Is this the only area in the state where residents deserve more? If the law is bad, then get rid of it statewide. Why the tricky wording instead of just asking for a new law saying the old law doesn't apply to the Villages? The OP is asking, and the newspapers are asking, should Morse's desires carry more weight in the state because he gives so much to the party that is in charge. If this law passes, are you comfortable that it was done because it is right for all the citizens of Florida, or because in part those in government are beholden to a family that has the money and the willingness to give it to those that do its bidding are in power. The old line.. The best government that money can buy.

[paulandjean]

Maybe they should consider an exception for TV. After all, TV IS an exception. It's truly a one-of-a-kind place.

Hypocrisy. Question you should ask? Could this be built in another part of Florida ? No Wonder why so many non-villagers hate us.

[graciegirl]

Note that present law already allows for the addition of nursing home beds to the area. If there is demonstrated need then beds can be "transferred" from another facility which exists in a lower demand area. This allows for Morse to build here if he closes beds elsewhere where they are not needed. Obviously if our local occupancy rate is 85% and the law defines full occupancy as 96% to automatically grant new beds, we don't have excess occupancy here. If the 10 local facilities, including 2 new ones in the last year are not up to Morse's vision, there would be nothing to stop him from purchasing those existing facilities and upgrading them in place nor relocating them within the local community, if I understand the law as it exists.
The state of Florida, wisely or meanly, decided that it was spending too much on poor people living in nursing homes that weren't filled. If the home has empty beds the cost per resident is obviously higher, and that cost is passed to the taxpayer.
You may feel the Villages is different. Why? Is this the only area in the state where residents deserve more? If the law is bad, then get rid of it statewide. Why the tricky wording instead of just asking for a new law saying the old law doesn't apply to the Villages? The OP is asking, and the newspapers are asking, should Morse's desires carry more weight in the state because he gives so much to the party that is in charge. If this law passes, are you comfortable that it was done because it is right for all the citizens of Florida, or because in part those in government are beholden to a family that has the money and the willingness to give it to those that do its bidding are in power. The old line.. The best government that money can buy.

Could you further explain this part? Is this kind of like public housing?

[NJblue]

The basis for the original law seems to fly in the face of the laws of supply and demand. Perhaps someone can come up with an example of a situation whereby supply is restricted by fiat and the result was lower price, but I can't. It would seem to me that this law has the opposite effect of lowering costs by artificially restricting the supply and thus driving the price up.

An argument could then be made that Morse should try to reverse the entire law. However, perhaps the politics to do so are too much to overcome and instead he chooses the simpler path of addressing the needs of his community. Regardless of how it is accomplished, it seems like a positive thing for those of us who may benefit.

As to the media coverage of this, I wish they would spend an equal amount of ink on questioning the premise of the original law. It would be interesting to see who was behind its original inception. My guess is that those who currently owned nursing homes were putting money into its passage since it is a way to minimize competition. Wouldn't it be great to operate in an environment that virtually guarantees you 96% occupancy? Wouldn't the hotel industry love a law like this?

[blueash]

Could you further explain this part? Is this kind of like public housing?

The rationale for Florida attempting to control nursing home cost is this:
"Medicaid is the primary payer of nursing home care in
Florida, paying for 61% of total nursing home patient days. Medicare pays for 19% of nursing
home patient days and the remaining 20% is paid for through private sources such as
insurance or residents’ personal funds. At 80% government funding, nursing homes are
heavily subsidized and dependent upon state and federal funds for operation."

Here is the specific law and "reasoning" by statute
"408.0435 Moratorium on nursing home certificates of need.—
(1) Notwithstanding the establishment of need as provided for in this chapter, a certificate of need for additional community nursing home beds may not be approved by the agency until Medicaid managed care is implemented statewide pursuant to ss. 409.961-409.985 or October 1, 2016, whichever is earlier.

(2) The Legislature finds that the continued growth in the Medicaid budget for nursing home care has constrained the ability of the state to meet the needs of its elderly residents through the use of less restrictive and less institutional methods of long-term care. It is therefore the intent of the Legislature to limit the increase in Medicaid nursing home expenditures in order to provide funds to invest in long-term care that is community-based and provides supportive services in a manner that is both more cost-effective and more in keeping with the wishes of the elderly residents of this state."

I leave it to each person's interpretation whether this law is really "in keeping with the wishes of the elderly" or really more motivated by wanting to force the poor in "managed" Medicaid (read private insurance taking a portion of the health care dollars and limiting patient access to produce a corporate profit). Bold typeface is mine and not in the original.

[jimbo2012]

ooouch!!!!

I didn't write any of it, just straight from the papers.



Read carefully. Jimbo is quoting several things, but it isn't clear.

THE first part is a quote from The Tampa Bay Times and it has a political slant to it.

Jimbo ended up making the post fair...but I had to reread it several times.


I was about to go over and kick him in his bad leg.;)

[blueash]

The basis for the original law seems to fly in the face of the laws of supply and demand. Perhaps someone can come up with an example of a situation whereby supply is restricted by fiat and the result was lower price, but I can't. It would seem to me that this law has the opposite effect of lowering costs by artificially restricting the supply and thus driving the price up.

I am not qualified to answer that good question. But if the supply greatly exceeds the demand and the government pays 80% of the cost, would it not be reasonable to try to use the supply efficiently? Doesn't Walmart keep costs down by not having excess inventory? (Beds are inventory for a hospital or nursing home) Would you see the logic of filling the jail cells we already have before we build more jails? Would you as a taxpayer support a law that says no new jails until the ones we have are filled to 96% capacity? I don't want anyone thinking I am comparing nursing home residents to inmates, but the likelihood of controlling supply can easily been seen to lower cost. Would you build a new hotel if the hotels in the area all have lots of empty beds? Keep in mind there is no provision for "we are going to build a nicer hotel." The legislature does not see the supply as restricted with existing empty beds just expensive as it is paying for those empty beds.

[gpirate]

What about Asst Living in The Villages? Does TV have one? I would think many as they grow older would prefer an Asst Living facility and then moved to nursing home when needed. Just my 2 cents worth.

[NJblue]

I am not qualified to answer that good question. But if the supply greatly exceeds the demand and the government pays 80% of the cost, would it not be reasonable to try to use the supply efficiently? Doesn't Walmart keep costs down by not having excess inventory? (Beds are inventory for a hospital or nursing home) Would you see the logic of filling the jail cells we already have before we build more jails? Would you as a taxpayer support a law that says no new jails until the ones we have are filled to 96% capacity? I don't want anyone thinking I am comparing nursing home residents to inmates, but the likelihood of controlling supply can easily been seen to lower cost. Would you build a new hotel if the hotels in the area all have lots of empty beds? Keep in mind there is no provision for "we are going to build a nicer hotel." The legislature does not see the supply as restricted with existing empty beds just expensive as it is paying for those empty beds.

Yes, Walmart does do this because they operate under the law of supply and demand versus government dictate. Can you imagine the price of toothpaste if the government said that stores would not be allowed to stock more than 50 tubes at a time?

The hotel analogy is precisely my point. Why does the government need to get involved with restricting beds when the laws of supply and demand already would do that? Just as a potential hotel owner may think twice about opening a new hotel if the occupancy rate in existing hotels is low, a potential nursing home owner would look at local occupancy rates before deciding to build.

The jail analogy is apples and oranges since jails do not operate under laws of supply and demand since they are government run and hence are a monopoly. However, in some areas there are privately run jails and I'm sure that these private operators do look at occupancy rates before deciding to build.

[JourneyOfLife]

---
If the home has empty beds the cost per resident is obviously higher, and that cost is passed to the taxpayer.
---

Several states have put a moratorium on Nursing Home capacity (limit the building of new facilities) in an attempt to control Medicaid Cost.

But I do not think it works like that. IOW I doubt Medicaid will cover a NH loss due to vacancies.

I think it is more likely to be: Fewer Medicaid beds, means fewer people relying on Medicaid will be admitted at a given point in time. Medicaid recipients may end up on a waiting list. I look at it as a form of rationing without refusing payment.

Nursing homes prefer private pay patients because the reimbursement rate is higher.

In many states, nursing homes only allow a fraction of their bed to be eligible for Medicare and Medicaid patients. I am sure the state can influence the number somewhat. But they would stop short of saying open it all up. That would probably just cause many of them shutdown.

I think nursing homes shoot for an average reimbursement rate (mix of payers) that gives them the best profit margin balanced by whatever the state and federal rules require.

[justjim]

Does TV need more nursing home beds? The answer would seem to be YES. Even a casual observation of our population and the number of nursing homes available, one would easily come to the conclusion of a GREAT need for more nursing home beds in TV.

[Harry Gilbert]

Does TV need more nursing home beds? The answer would seem to be YES. Even a casual observation of our population and the number of nursing homes available, one would easily come to the conclusion of a GREAT need for more nursing home beds in TV.

The only way to qualify your statement would be to know if and how large a waiting list is to get into the presently operating nursing facilities.

I am not familiar with the facilities there but am somewhat with those in NJ. I can say that those that are mainly govt subsidized (medicare, medicaid, welfare ) are not places that I would send any of my family to. Now those that cater to the wealthy elderly are quite a different story. These are mostly out of pocket and run 10K per month and up. I'm guessing that any new facilities in TV would be self pay? Business wise it makes perfect sense. Kind of a back door way to get it built though

[golf2140]

So what. If the Bill gets passed good for him. How many other facilities in TV are age related? Two more that I know of are planned for 466A, one is going up on Parr Drive, tha Hospital if it happens may be going up by Brownwood, there's an extension planned for Freedom Point, etc. People moved here to retire and spend the rest of their lives here, and a good majority will be buried here. TV puts a ton back into the county coffers and if they get it passed AMEN for them. More jobs will be created and a spouse or family member will be closer to loved ones.. JMO

:bigbow::bigbow::bigbow::bigbow:

[Bogie Shooter]

Gov Scott will take money from anybody for anything....just happens this is for a nursing home. Last year he was against having volunteers visiting nursing homes looking for poor conditions. Go figure. All political.

[janmcn]

Gov Scott will take money from anybody for anything....just happens this is for a nursing home. Last year he was against having volunteers visiting nursing homes looking for poor conditions. Go figure. All political.

And in the grand scheme of things, $150,000 is small potatoes. How much is this high paid lobbyist in Tallahassee costing we the people, to say nothing of the high paid lobbyist we are paying in Washington. Hopefully, we will get our money's worth.

[djl8412]

:ohdear:

Talk about being in denial!? Yes, the lifestyle is what we moved here for but we still need to be part of an entire population and should assume a sense of special entitlements. Some of the comments supporting special treatment of The Villages may very well be the fuel for outside residents sterotyping Villages residents and it's becoming easier to understand why.

[djl8412]

:ohdear:

Talk about being in denial!? Yes, the lifestyle is what we moved here for but we still need to be part of an entire population and should assume a sense of special entitlements. Some of the comments supporting special treatment of The Villages may very well be the fuel for outside residents sterotyping Villages residents and it's becoming easier to understand why.

OOPS! My second sentence in the quote should have read "we still need to be part of an entire population and should NOT assume a sense of special entitlements."

[blueash]

The hotel analogy is precisely my point. Why does the government need to get involved with restricting beds when the laws of supply and demand already would do that? Just as a potential hotel owner may think twice about opening a new hotel if the occupancy rate in existing hotels is low, a potential nursing home owner would look at local occupancy rates before deciding to build.

The jail analogy is apples and oranges since jails do not operate under laws of supply and demand since they are government run and hence are a monopoly. However, in some areas there are privately run jails and I'm sure that these private operators do look at occupancy rates before deciding to build.

Now we are getting to the heart of the financial interest of the state. The hotel owner is now going to build a new hotel with beds that are not needed. Of course some consumers will use his hotel, which then lowers the occupancy of the nearby hotels. The total number of vacationers is not changed they just are more spread out. Here's where it gets interesting. The hotel owners all need to up their room rates to cover their costs or go out of business. However, they figure out that the government is having their officials occupy 80% of the beds and the government will pay more if that is what the local costs require. The very creation of more beds made the costs per bed go up, and payment of those increased costs is guaranteed by the state. (Medicaid and Medicare payments are determined by cost of provision of that service in that locality). Keep in mind that in Florida 80% of the cost of nursing home care is paid by the government which does not have the option of not providing that service. Supply and demand is not applicable to nursing home beds.

As to jails, if the government said to all private jails, We will pay you whatever it costs plus a profit even if your cells are empty you know there would be endless private jails. The limitation is that the government competes with its own jails which it will utilize if the costs are lower. The government does not have its own nursing homes, so there is not even that cost control for nursing homes. If a corporation is guaranteed to make money, why wouldn't they produce more of a product regardless of the demand because with nursing home beds, the more beds that are empty the more they cost, not the opposite.

[paulandjean]

:ohdear:

Talk about being in denial!? Yes, the lifestyle is what we moved here for but we still need to be part of an entire population and should assume a sense of special entitlements. Some of the comments supporting special treatment of The Villages may very well be the fuel for outside residents sterotyping Villages residents and it's becoming easier to understand why.

I agree with you. Thats one negative thing about the villages,seems many feel a 'SPECIAL ENTITLEMENT" because they live in the villages.

[Polar Bear]

Hypocrisy. Question you should ask? Could this be built in another part of Florida ? No Wonder why so many non-villagers hate us.

Chill out a bit. Sheesh. Question you should ask? Does this need to be built in another part of Florida? No. (And I'm not so sure as many non-TVers hate us as you imply.)

In my opinion, nobody...at least on these boards...is talking about special treatment for TV. It's just discussion regarding the possibility that TV may unique, with a greater need for nursing home care than the typical community.

[gomoho]

I for one am still not clear if we are talking about "nursing homes" or "assisted living/memory care" facilities. BIG DIFFERENCE!!! And as someone mentioned in an earlier posts will these be medicaid approved facilites or pay on your own???

[skyc6]

I agree with you. Thats one negative thing about the villages,seems many feel a 'SPECIAL ENTITLEMENT" because they live in the villages.

Where are all these people who hate us? I've been to Wildwood, Friutland Park, Leesburg and Ocala, and have not encountered this hatred.
I also don't feel a Special Entitlement, but am happy if the 102,000 people living here have the facilities they need.

People do an awful lot of complaining on here!
As my grandmother would say
"quit yer kvetchin'" :ohdear:

[paulandjean]

Chill out a bit. Sheesh. Question you should ask? Does this need to be built in another part of Florida? No. (And I'm not so sure as many non-TVers hate us as you imply.)

In my opinion, nobody...at least on these boards...is talking about special treatment for TV. It's just discussion regarding the possibility that TV may unique, with a greater need for nursing home care than the typical community.

The "special treatment" Is for the owner and builder of the villages. Special treatment for him. The question I ask is could this be built anywhere but the villages and I said NO. because of his political donations.If they get special treatment there are many people who do not like the villages.So relax and enjoy and slow down.

[mickey100]

OOPS! My second sentence in the quote should have read "we still need to be part of an entire population and should NOT assume a sense of special entitlements."

Agreed. The rules apply to The Villages (and to the Morses). Period.

[Polar Bear]

...So relax and enjoy and slow down.

You're kidding, right? :shocked: Who's the one talking about "hypocrisy" and "hate". I suggest you take your own advice.

[gomoho]

I would say if outsiders "hate the villages" and I don't for a minute believe that to be true, they don't have a clue about the Morse family, but may have some envy of what we are so fortunte to enjoy because of luck, hard work or whatever. Was the Morse family even a bleep on your radar screen before you came here? And I would hope those familiar in surrounding areas would be thanking their lucky stars there are job opportunities here that wouldn't exist without our community.

[ljones190]

Has anyone thought about 102,000 people with no post office,maybe the Developer can run a community much better than our government

[paulandjean]

You're kidding, right? :shocked: Who's the one talking about "hypocrisy" and "hate". I suggest you take your own advice.

I am sure that you have never seen the "other" Talk about the village site.So slow down ,take a deep breath. Yes to others outside of the bubble here they have much to say about the villagers.So take my advice.

[gomoho]

How do you get to that site? And why would you give a second thought to something someone says that doesn't even live here??? Has to be speculation, rumor or envy. Where are you coming from with this??? Why does it matter what people that don't live here or know what we do here?

[graciegirl]

I am sure that you have never seen the "other" Talk about the village site.So slow down ,take a deep breath. Yes to others outside of the bubble here they have much to say about the villagers.So take my advice.

It is easy to read gentleness, acceptance, happiness and joy of life on here. AND to sense the opposite.

No one I know of or have heard about including the Morse family has stolen anything from anyone or hurt anyone to end up here. It is a place that almost everyone could live with homes priced across a very broad spectrum and budgets can be much lower if people don't drink a lot and eat a lot of meals at home. This place is affordable for many, if not all seniors.

Some of us have saved more than others and we have all tried to plan that we can continue to take care of ourselves and watch out for our families.

We should not be held up for criticism for those traits.

Sometimes I feel...very disliked on this forum. I suspect others do as well..because we are so happy and glad we are HERE.

It isn't nice and it isn't right and it isn't fair.

We all put on our pants one leg at a time and most of us will be dead in way too short a time. We all have far fewer years ahead than we have behind us.

Let's try to see the good in each other.

[Polar Bear]

...Sometimes I feel...very disliked on this forum. I suspect others do as well..because we are so happy and glad we are HERE...

As I've stated before, I don't even live in TV yet, but it's so obvious that many people are very happy here...knowing it's not perfect, but simply enjoying their life and not being afraid to say so on these forums.

Then there are others who just can't stand it. Why is a bit of a mystery. Or maybe not...maybe it's simply because those few are not so happy here.

[Trish Crocker]

Read carefully. Jimbo is quoting several things, but it isn't clear.

THE first part is a quote from The Tampa Bay Times and it has a political slant to it.

Jimbo ended up making the post fair...but I had to reread it several times.


I was about to go over and kick him in his bad leg.;)

You're right Gracie, Jimbo was giving both sides and I think some people didn't read it all the way through. By the way, on your way over to kick Jimbo stop by..on second thought, I'll get Jimbo and Cathy to stop by and you can come over and kick him here (but please, do it gently! I don't think solar casts have been invented yet). :)

[perrjojo]

I agree with you. Thats one negative thing about the villages,seems many feel a 'SPECIAL ENTITLEMENT" because they live in the villages.

In this instance "special entitlement" is warranted. Where else do 102,000 retires live in one small area? Why should I have to send my loved one to Tampa just because they have empty beds? If my loved one needs nursing home care it should be available near our home. Supply and demand...yes...and the demand in TV is greater than other areas; therefore a special need has arisen. It has nothing to do with we are special" but everything to do with the special needs of our community.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

How would limiting the number of new nursing home facilities help to hold down Medicare costs?

[skyc6]

You're kidding, right? :shocked: Who's the one talking about "hypocrisy" and "hate". I suggest you take your own advice.

:bigbow: Exactly! Great reply!

[skyc6]

Has anyone thought about 102,000 people with no post office,maybe the Developer can run a community much better than our government

You know, The Morses built a post office for the villages to have and the USPS still refused to let that happen. The building is what is currently the woodworking shop for the villagers. Its intended purpose was originally a post office, and it was built and paid for by the developer.

[skyc6]

I am sure that you have never seen the "other" Talk about the village site.So slow down ,take a deep breath. Yes to others outside of the bubble here they have much to say about the villagers.So take my advice.

Why would you care what someone who lives elsewhere thinks about where you live?
If I decided to say that I don't like people in some particular town, I certainly can't imagine that they would even know, much less care. Some people just decide they don't like someone or someplace when they don't know them or have never been there.
There will always be judgemental, negative people around. Usually it means they are unhappy with themselves or their lot in life.
Unfortunately, there are a few on this site, and they have a hard time with the happiness others feel. Maybe they have reasons for that.

[jimbo2012]

You're right Gracie, Jimbo was giving both sides and I think some people didn't read it all the way through. By the way, on your way over to kick Jimbo stop by..on second thought, I'll get Jimbo and Cathy to stop by and you can come over and kick him here (but please, do it gently! I don't think solar casts have been invented yet). :)

I'm designing one now!!! that I'm stuck sitting around.:ohdear:

It will generate heat to the affected area increase blood flow and get the endorphins cooking. :coolsmiley:


We would like to do that. I'll run (well limp) over anytime.:duck:

Ps: I guess I should have reversed the order of the two articles?????

[djl8412]

:ohdear:

Wow! It's amazing how follow-up posts get spun out of control and away from the original statement. I had to take a dose of Dramamine for motion sickness. If there was a deal made giving a developer or other entity an advantage over a law that was enacted to apply to ALL entities in the state, then it is wrong whether you like the developer or not. The Villages is NOT the only age restricted community in the state no matter what the population and it is certainly not confined to a small area as a previous post intimated (it effects 3 different counties). I'm sure other communities who have senior populations would love to have similar facilities within their gates but can't. I don't recall earlier posts having claimed that "most" or "all" non-Villagers hate us but I personally have heard comments from other area senior developments that are far from complimentary, some a few years before we moved here.
Thank you Gracie Girl. I don't often agree with your posts but I like your approach on this one.:clap2:

[graciegirl]

:ohdear:

Wow! It's amazing how follow-up posts get spun out of control and away from the original statement. I had to take a dose of Dramamine for motion sickness. If there was a deal made giving a developer or other entity an advantage over a law that was enacted to apply to ALL entities in the state, then it is wrong whether you like the developer or not. The Villages is NOT the only age restricted community in the state no matter what the population and it is certainly not confined to a small area as a previous post intimated (it effects 3 different counties). I'm sure other communities who have senior populations would love to have similar facilities within their gates but can't. I don't recall earlier posts having claimed that "most" or "all" non-Villagers hate us but I personally have heard comments from other area senior developments that are far from complimentary, some a few years before we moved here.
Thank you Gracie Girl. I don't often agree with your posts but I like your approach on this one.:clap2:

I just read back over all of your posts to get a sense of what it is that you find important and how you feel about other issues.

I still don't know, but it is kind of you to agree this time. I will try to do better.

[djl8412]

[/COLOR]

I just read back over all of your posts to get a sense of what it is that you find important and how you feel about other issues.

I still don't know, but it is kind of you to agree this time. I will try to do better.

:)I was absent on the board for quite a while until earlier this week. In addition to this topic I posted strong opinions on golf course conditions. Sorry to cause you the research time.

[JourneyOfLife]

Agreeing with the political method or not.... I can't imagine anyone with a stake in TV being disappointed about it.

Think about what happens if you have the need and the service is not available.

Besides, if you look at the demographics of TV and the 3 counties. It is a statistical outlier in terms of the 65 and older age band compared to the size of the general population. By any normal measure, the TV area is probably due more Nursing home capacity. The state would want imbalances pointed out proactively rather than wait till there is a crisis.