Giving an opinion is scary

[Warren Kiefer]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.

[gomoho]

Warren - I think it all comes down to how the complaint is expressed. Some folks read things into a post that really aren't there (me included) and then all hell breaks loose. I agree we need to voice opinions because if enough people are on board we can bring about a change - but, if the OP is immediately attacked for their post we are on a dead end street.

[golf4me]

What if, as it so often happens, that the complaint is one is a long series of jabs against this place. What if the poster rarely has anything positive to say and seems to have a way of saying things that really incite anger?

What can ANYONE do if the place they call home and like very much doesn't measure up to what another poster thinks is the dream of the original developer?

What can anyone do if they want an indoor pool? This is not a voting entity.

What can anyone do about a very used and sometimes ill used by rookie golfers, golf course that is appearing shabby?

What can anyone do if there is a segment of the population that refuses to obey traffic rules and drives in such a way as to endanger the majority of us who do drive safely?

What can anyone do about bringing restaurants or shops or groceries to this area?

What can the people who do like the editorial slant of the paper do for those who don't?

[gomoho]

golf4me - what they can do is express their frustration on here and get beat up for having said frustration. Hey - we are all human beings with different levels of tolerance. My mother use to say "one man's junk is another man's treasure" and so goes it on TOTV. We should respect each other - if there is someone in particular that pushes your buttons use your "ignore" capability and let them vent.

I kind of enjoy the back and forth, but maybe I am thicked skinned. Just kind of get a charge out of people getting all worked up about things. Then again it's probably 'cause I grew up Italian and that is what we did!!!

[sandybill2]

Know what you are talking about. I am very leery of posting any responses--even though I love this site and all of the advice, etc., that I can glean from it. I posted a comment about lack of Blackberries at the Blackberry Festival at the American Legion which my husband is a member of because of his Military Service------ Comment was made that "we" were obviously not "good members" because we didn't know what door to go into at the building. Still don't know how my comment----ended up challenging what kind of Members we were----- But I don't let these comments bother me----we continue to love The Village Life-----and this site. Just have to consider the source and those that are just waiting in the wings to make a comment----

[asianthree]

if everyone thought the same life would be boring...too old for things to be scary...an opinion is an opinion..not like someone is going to knock on your door...

[jtdraig]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.

I have to agree. I have posted a few things over the years trying to be helpful because I actually knew about the issue or I had an actual solution based on experience. The snipers come out. So I honestly, don't pay much attention to them. If they don't like it, tough...well, you know. Further, it reflects on them more than on me. :beer3:

[mommieswamie]

golf4me - what they can do is express their frustration on here and get beat up for having said frustration. Hey - we are all human beings with different levels of tolerance. My mother use to say "one man's junk is another man's treasure" and so goes it on TOTV. We should respect each other - if there is someone in particular that pushes your buttons use your "ignore" capability and let them vent.

I kind of enjoy the back and forth, but maybe I am thicked skinned. Just kind of get a charge out of people getting all worked up about things. Then again it's probably 'cause I grew up Italian and that is what we did!!!

I think I must be thin-skinned. Some of what I read here that others have commented on and some of the responses to me have reduced me to tears. On the other hand, I have been quite comforted by some responses here and in turn I have really tried to help other posters here when I could.

[Mikeod]

golf4me - what they can do is express their frustration on here and get beat up for having said frustration. Hey - we are all human beings with different levels of tolerance. My mother use to say "one man's junk is another man's treasure" and so goes it on TOTV. We should respect each other - if there is someone in particular that pushes your buttons use your "ignore" capability and let them vent.

I kind of enjoy the back and forth, but maybe I am thicked skinned. Just kind of get a charge out of people getting all worked up about things. Then again it's probably 'cause I grew up Italian and that is what we did!!!

I somewhat agree with your post. I like to discuss issues, but what I run into are posters who present opinions about various topics like diet, golf conditions, restaurants, etc. and when presented with differing opinions or possible explanations dismiss them or describe the poster as out of touch with reality, head in the sand, etc. I see this frequently and it does neither proponents or opponents any good. Real discussion requires people with the intent to present an opinion and listen to opposing or different opinions with an open mind.

However, I don't like to get someone into a lather. I don't think it serves either side to do that. Sometimes it occurs without intent, but it shouldn't be a goal.

[jtdraig]

I think I must be thin-skinned. Some of what I read here that others have commented on and some of the responses to me have reduced me to tears. On the other hand, I have been quite comforted by some responses here and in turn I have really tried to help other posters here when I could.

None of these people are worth being reduced to tears. Not one of them.

[mommieswamie]

None of these people are worth being reduced to tears. Not one of them.

So true - I am just tired, very tired, and with more to face in the "golden years" than I ever imagined.

[Barefoot]

if everyone thought the same life would be boring...too old for things to be scary...an opinion is an opinion..not like someone is going to knock on your door...

I think it's important to keep things in perspective. TOTV is merely an internet chat site. There are thousands of chat sites available on the internet. Some people who post on TOTV are funny, some are compassionate, some are brilliant and creative, others are argumentative. At the end of the day, the site is here for our light reading pleasure. I don't think anyone intends to be mean. As Asian says "too old for things to be scary".

[tippyclubb]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.


Warren no disrespect to you but, I have a hard time understanding why anyone complains about anything in The Villages.

[rubicon]

Complaining is part of human beings nature beginning as when infants only means of communicating was to cry and whine in order to let people know how they were feeling. People complain for various reasons and I suspect even if they found themselves in Heaven they would find something to complain about.

Also as nature intended people are very different. as such they view situations differently and they expressed themselves differently. Likewise people on the receiving end interpret people's complaints differently. Depending on temperment from the sending/receiving the resultsrange from I feel your pain to some people are never satisfied.

Personally in most situations I have found it beneficial to hear out complaints even if I interprete them not legitimate because I either learned something new about the person or I learned something new.

I opine you decide

[jblum315]

Don't we all have a relative or friend that everybody else says "Oh she will find something to complain about" or "Joan is so picky she won't like it."

[archerlc]

It's not just complaints. A person asks a question " where can we buy fresh oysters"? The answer might be " you idiot-don't you know that raw oysters are unhealthy." If you can't answer a question as posed, don't reply.

[golf4me]

It's not just complaints. A person asks a question " where can we buy fresh oysters"? The answer might be " you idiot-don't you know that raw oysters are unhealthy." If you can't answer a question as posed, don't reply.

I think that is it. I think that some posters use the complaints as a way to bash others and some posters really do have questions and concerns that can be answered and addressed. Telling someone that their worries or concerns are misplaced and that possibly everyone is subjected to the same process or rule sometimes helps. Sometimes collectively we can find a solution. One time I read that a poster was disrupted in their sleep by a street lamp being too bright and wanted a shade put on it. I would never think to complain about that and would never think to ask to have it shaded.
(It wasn't) Sometimes things seem very unrealistic to others and you swallow hard to not answer in such a way to diminish the poster or have enough fortitude to not answer at all, and in most cases the poster will then continue to find some answer or continue to complain. I guess that some of us are more patient and compassionate than others.

Where is Gracie?

[mickey100]

I think it's important to keep things in perspective. TOTV is merely an internet chat site. There are thousands of chat sites available on the internet. Some people who post on TOTV are funny, some are compassionate, some are brilliant and creative, others are argumentative. At the end of the day, the site is here for our light reading pleasure.
.

Yes, I agree. And as this is just an internet chat site I do not find it to be representative of people I've met in the Villages. In spite of its faults, and yes, The Villages does have some IMHO, I've met some wonderful people here and am having the time of my life. If I had judged The Villages based on comments I've read on this site, I would probably have a different opinion of Villagers.

[senior citizen]

Complaining is part of human beings nature beginning as when infants only means of communicating was to cry and whine in order to let people know how they were feeling. People complain for various reasons and I suspect even if they found themselves in Heaven they would find something to complain about.

Also as nature intended people are very different. as such they view situations differently and they expressed themselves differently. Likewise people on the receiving end interpret people's complaints differently. Depending on temperment from the sending/receiving the resultsrange from I feel your pain to some people are never satisfied.

Personally in most situations I have found it beneficial to hear out complaints even if I interprete them not legitimate because I either learned something new about the person or I learned something new.

I opine you decide


Well thought out post with excellent reasoning.....you are always fair and honest. I enjoy reading your opinions..........

I do believe that a few folks misinterpret someone's asking a question with regard to something that they, the long time Villager, might conceive to be negative......or disparaging to THE VILLAGES.......when in reality it was NOT intended that way.

I remember when some coyote sightings were happening.......
I mentioned that we had spotted one during our first Lifestyle Visit....
The coyote was walking along the white picket fence, with its head hung down.......INSIDE our backyard (the golf cart path was on the other side of the fence). Our home was on Merryweather Way near L.S.L.

WE know what coyotes look like. Vermont has them. We hear them when we go for a walk int he foothills. People spot them. No one in Vermont would DENY that coyotes are in Vermont..........ditto for Colorado.

In the Villages, however, coyote is a bad word and spotting one is even worse.

This is what people are trying to explain....in my opinion anyway.
Not necessarily complaints, but no one takes anyone seriously.

Farmlands in Vermont have rodents, beavers, groundhogs, you name it.....we don't deny their existence. When people inquire as to if there is a problem in TV, knowing of their existence in Florida......I think they'd just like reassurance that the issue is "under control" or controllable.......not to hear that they don't exist.......or that the person asking is the one with the problem. Again, honesty is always the best .

Heck, rats are in the New York City subways and in the walls of the best high rise buildings. A Fact. Not a complaint.

A nice realtor in Mount Dora told us that "Yes, rats are in Mount Dora, but we do our best to keep them out of the homes"........to me that was honest.....it was something I could deal with. It's an older town; I assume with a sewer system.......and we found out all too well, in Venice, that they were in the sewers...and got into the condos......doing property damage.....people on here have said, do not buy near water...nuff said.

Denial can be powerful , in the wrong way, but truth is always better.
No place is perfect and every place has something or other............

Ditto for the alligators or the man who jumped in to save his pooch.
All he got was negative flack from posters........people didn't even believe it happened, even after it was in the Orlando Sentinal. I mean, come on.
That is negative. Not those asking the questions in all good faith and sincerity....with a need to know.

This is why some people do not believe that all posters are real people, but are part of the establishment who work there.

[rubicon]

Well thought out post with excellent reasoning.....you are always fair and honest. I enjoy reading your opinions..........

I do believe that a few folks misinterpret someone's asking a question with regard to something that they, the long time Villager, might conceive to be negative......or disparaging to THE VILLAGES.......when in reality it was NOT intended that way.

I remember when some coyote sightings were happening.......
I mentioned that we had spotted one during our first Lifestyle Visit....
The coyote was walking along the white picket fence, with its head hung down.......INSIDE our backyard (the golf cart path was on the other side of the fence). Our home was on Merryweather Way near L.S.L.

WE know what coyotes look like. Vermont has them. We hear them when we go for a walk int he foothills. People spot them. No one in Vermont would DENY that coyotes are in Vermont..........ditto for Colorado.

In the Villages, however, coyote is a bad word and spotting one is even worse.

This is what people are trying to explain....in my opinion anyway.
Not necessarily complaints, but no one takes anyone seriously.

Farmlands in Vermont have rodents, beavers, groundhogs, you name it.....we don't deny their existence. When people inquire as to if there is a problem in TV, knowing of their existence in Florida......I think they'd just like reassurance that the issue is "under control" or controllable.......not to hear that they don't exist.......or that the person asking is the one with the problem. Again, honesty is always the best .

Heck, rats are in the New York City subways and in the walls of the best high rise buildings. A Fact. Not a complaint.

A nice realtor in Mount Dora told us that "Yes, rats are in Mount Dora, but we do our best to keep them out of the homes"........to me that was honest.....it was something I could deal with. It's an older town; I assume with a sewer system.......and we found out all too well, in Venice, that they were in the sewers...and got into the condos......doing property damage.....people on here have said, do not buy near water...nuff said.

Denial can be powerful , in the wrong way, but truth is always better.
No place is perfect and every place has something or other............

Ditto for the alligators or the man who jumped in to save his pooch.
All he got was negative flack from posters........people didn't even believe it happened, even after it was in the Orlando Sentinal. I mean, come on.
That is negative. Not those asking the questions in all good faith and sincerity....with a need to know.

This is why some people do not believe that all posters are real people, but are part of the establishment who work there.

senior citizen: Thank you for the kind words. I agree with premise regarding denial being powerful.

In my humble view the critic of a "so called complaint" response will face the same judgment as the so called complainer. You identified one of the controlling factors "a power play by denial. another is when a critic deals with the situation in absolutes. Ex I like good steaks. Does anyone know where I can good steaks in The Villages? Critic, Why would you want to eat steak or meat for that matter its only going to kill you faster?
First the critic never addressed the question and secondly was more interested in his/her view belief, etc.

Our society is diminished because people have become accustom to political speak in the form of denials, absolutes,etc. that we forgot how to ask probing questions to get at the truth or at least a satisfying compromise.

[golf4me]

Sometimes posters read only the last post and do not take the time to read all of the posts and some posters focus on one detail and do not take the time to get the gist of the post. Some posters do not jump, they leap to conclusions and the conclusions are proceeding from very illogical premises.

Many posters live here and have lived here for some time and other posters have visited here for a week or two. Many posters having seen the villages for the first time are incredulous and want to know "What's the Catch?????" I think almost everyone feels that at first. I think all of us worry that it will continue to be as well maintained and as well run after buildout. Or the IRS issue will not be resolved and hurt all of our pocketbooks, although many are thinking about that differently, well never mind.

There is nothing wrong, in fact everything right about people who do not yet live here questioning process and procedures and ways of doing things that are different here but I do have a problem with them posting facts about this place which are simply not true. New readers don't know what to believe and those of us with justifiable pride in the place we have chosen to live year round or a good part of our time and in which we have sunk sizable dollars and are very satisfied, get a little riled when something is stated as fact that is not a fact. We get a little annoyed when someone who does not live here incorrectly judges a situation and proceeds to address it as if it were a fact.

[CarolSells]

[QUOTE=golf4me;683766]Sometimes posters read only the last post and do not take the time to read all of the posts and some posters focus on one detail and do not take the time to get the gist of the post. Some posters do not jump, they leap to conclusions and the conclusions are proceeding from very illogical premises. [Quote]

Thanks you beat me to the punch in posting my exact thoughts! Case in point: poster lost wheelbarrow and asked if anyone might be selling a used one. The answers actually devolved into chastising OP for not shredding his/her personal info before putting it at the curb! Hello?

[Schaumburger]

I think it's important to keep things in perspective. TOTV is merely an internet chat site. There are thousands of chat sites available on the internet. Some people who post on TOTV are funny, some are compassionate, some are brilliant and creative, others are argumentative. At the end of the day, the site is here for our light reading pleasure. I don't think anyone intends to be mean. As Asian says "too old for things to be scary".

Barefoot, Excelllent post!

[gocubsgo]

Sometimes I think (CAUTION!! Opinion coming!!) this board is the equivalent of a therapy session. It's free and you know people are going to listen to you! Some people come here to vent, complain and gripe... then there are those who tell us how everything is wonderful in their worlds (YAY!).

In one ear (or eye) and out the other with the complainers...

[senior citizen]

senior citizen: Thank you for the kind words. I agree with premise regarding denial being powerful.

In my humble view the critic of a "so called complaint" response will face the same judgment as the so called complainer. You identified one of the controlling factors "a power play by denial. another is when a critic deals with the situation in absolutes. Ex I like good steaks. Does anyone know where I can good steaks in The Villages? Critic, Why would you want to eat steak or meat for that matter its only going to kill you faster?
First the critic never addressed the question and secondly was more interested in his/her view belief, etc.

Our society is diminished because people have become accustom to political speak in the form of denials, absolutes,etc. that we forgot how to ask probing questions to get at the truth or at least a satisfying compromise.

Right again. I totally understand your train of thought.......

If and when we get there, and if you truly do like good steaks, as per above mention.......we will have you and your family over for "Steak Pizzaiola" which my dad used to make.........life is too short never to have a steak and this one is comfort food for Italians and non Italians alike......

Will post on the kitchen or recipe section.........in case you can't wait until our house sells........

[KayakerNC]

Complaints can be valid and even necessary to bring attention to a problem. However, I get a little leery of complaints that bring words like "BEWARE" & "SCAM" in the title.

[westcoastsunshine]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.

This is a well said post...thank you! I rarely post unless something really
moves me to do so simply because of all the "attackers".

Sadly, they always manage to find some little thing within your sentence
to b....h about and then you have to defend yourself. I really don't
think that is the purpose of this forum.

I have used the info received on this forum to make my own decisions
about certain establishments, etc.... good or bad.

[Russ_Boston]

My only concern with any post is that is contain accuracy. Some people state facts that are simply NOT facts (I'm not talking about an opinion). If I bring this inaccuracy to their attention they blast me. Many people read this forum and I won't let a false statement sit out there without rebuttal. Am I right all the time? Of course not but if someone restates a fact to me and provides proof then I apologize for my error and will sometimes redact my post.

[graciegirl]

My only concern with any post is that is contain accuracy. Some people state facts that are simply NOT facts (I'm not talking about an opinion). If I bring this inaccuracy to their attention they blast me. Many people read this forum and I won't let a false statement sit out there without rebuttal. Am I right all the time? Of course not but if someone restates a fact to me and provides proof then I apologize for my error and will sometimes redact my post.

Me too.

[ugotme]

There will ALWAYS be people at both ends of the spectrum - one who complains and one who adores. Some will complain that it gets dark too late now and some wish it got dark around midnight.

I came on here last July looking for information on TV. What I found was that the vast majority of people are helpful. I may not get the answer I was "hoping for," but an honest answer is what I really want.

Everyone has that little something that they do not like and thus are likely to complain about it. In addition, views vary around the country. I am a native New Yorker - some people cringe at that! Oh well - that is their loss.

Personally, when I read the posts, I read the complainers also. maybe he/she has a valid complaint. But, as was stated before, when someone inquires where they could get a good steak and are told you should not eat beef - the ignore button comes on.

Some find beauty in anything and some find ugliness in the same things.

[ivanhoe]

Yeah...fire away!!
Some of my best lessons in life were from people who vehemently disagreed with me.

ugotme-

Yo buddy,

you ever do the 5 am "bakery ticket" deal at Bethpage black?

[Cedwards38]

I think it's important to keep things in perspective. TOTV is merely an internet chat site. There are thousands of chat sites available on the internet. Some people who post on TOTV are funny, some are compassionate, some are brilliant and creative, others are argumentative. At the end of the day, the site is here for our light reading pleasure. I don't think anyone intends to be mean. As Asian says "too old for things to be scary".

Well said. I agree.

[ugotme]

Yeah...fire away!!
Some of my best lessons in life were from people who vehemently disagreed with me.

ugotme-

Yo buddy,

you ever do the 5 am "bakery ticket" deal at Bethpage black?


LOL yes I have. Lived about 1.5 miles from the courses.
Get there around 3:30 - get a ticket to go in.
Sit there until the cage opens and stumble in.

BUMMER - But ya gotta do what ya gotta do !

[laddan]

Here is a little brujaja. See if you can figure it out for me in a better way than I handled it.
Neighbor caught 8 rats. I live backed up to a wildlife wetlands,big area. I told him he could throw the bodies out into the wild area. Another neighbor with small dog[ don't get me started on that] walks by and starts telling us we are wrong and don't do that as her dog is in danger from wildlife. We ignore/ reply nicely hope she moves on and minds her own business as we are standing on my property discussing the rat problem.Next day more rat bodies,busbody neighbor with dog again voices opinion strongly about us doing wrong. We suggest she come get the bodies and dispose of them her way. She declines tells us to bag them and put them in the dumpster at our club house[which is illegal]. We have words,well I have a few choice words for her that I am repenting of as I type. Husband then comes over and retells us what to do nicely and that I am bad[which I was] for being so brutal verbally. His solution is no more legal than hers. I call HOA and ask what to do and they say bury the bodies in your yard or wetlands as each resident is responsible for his or her own yard and pest problems:undecided:. A few days later we find a rat that has been poisoned with deadly poison on someones lawn. So what would be worse for the neighbors baby,err dog,wildlife which already exists in the area or rat poison set out in someones yard?

[John_W]

...A few days later we find a rat that has been poisoned with deadly poison on someones lawn. So what would be worse for the neighbors baby,err dog,wildlife which already exists in the area or rat poison set out in someones yard?

I've owned 7 new homes before moving to TV, each one I paid to have a privacy fence installed. I also had a dog most of the time. It obvious this person with the dog should have a privacy wood fence and in the meantime when they take their dog out, they should be on a leash. I would of somehow suggested they should purchase a privacy fence if they choose to be not involved with the neighborhood rat problem.

I also had a similar problem. I once lived backed up to Pensacola Regional Airport. It was all pine trees but you could hear the jets since we were only about 800 from the runway. We also had a rat problem, big rats would build under my pool shed. We had a privacy fence since we had a swimming pool and two dogs. My shed was one of those prefabricated steel buildings in the corner of the lot. Once I built a concert slab for the shed, no more rats. The rats seem to love the damp cool shaded ground created by the shed sitting on bare earth.

/

[skyguy79]

I think it's important to keep things in perspective. TOTV is merely an internet chat site. There are thousands of chat sites available on the internet. Some people who post on TOTV are funny, some are compassionate, some are brilliant and creative, others are argumentative. At the end of the day, the site is here for our light reading pleasure. I don't think anyone intends to be mean. As Asian says "too old for things to be scary".Barefoot, I agree with you except for one thing you said... "I don't think anyone intends to be mean." I have to strongly disagree with that as I and at least two other people I know have been victimized by someone who is being intentionally mean and I have even filed a complaint with the Admin when I've seen it being done to others. I'm not going into details so I can avoid reliving the hurt and depression a few have caused me, but I will say that when someone you don't even know digs into your personal life outside TV or TOTV, you know that they're not only being mean, but also intentionally disrespectful and hurtful. Nuf said before I need earplugs to hold the steam in!

[jbdlfan]

I have to agree. I have posted a few things over the years trying to be helpful because I actually knew about the issue or I had an actual solution based on experience. The snipers come out. So I honestly, don't pay much attention to them. If they don't like it, tough...well, you know. Further, it reflects on them more than on me. :beer3:

This is so true. I have opined about a few issues that were just opinions based on my own feelings or such. But, there have been times were I have commented on situations that I know for absolute fact, but still had to defend myself. Not a big deal, since I love the banter, but you can read a post anymore and know exactly what the next few responses will be. But as I tell my students all the time, you can't tell tone or voice from an email or a text message and they can easily be misinterpreted.

[senior citizen]

I've owned 7 new homes before moving to TV, each one I paid to have a privacy fence installed. I also had a dog most of the time. It obvious this person with the dog should have a privacy wood fence and in the meantime when they take their dog out, they should be on a leash. I would of somehow suggested they should purchase a privacy fence if they choose to be not involved with the neighborhood rat problem.

I also had a similar problem. I once lived backed up to Pensacola Regional Airport. It was all pine trees but you could hear the jets since we were only about 800 from the runway. We also had a rat problem, big rats would build under my pool shed. We had a privacy fence since we had a swimming pool and two dogs. My shed was one of those prefabricated steel buildings in the corner of the lot. Once I built a concert slab for the shed, no more rats. The rats seem to love the damp cool shaded ground created by the shed sitting on bare earth.

/

WE have groundhogs that tunnel under our shed up here in Vermont......
My husband put some D-con under the shed and that seemed to get rid of them. Prior to that, he used a have a heart trap on our others..

They used to have an entire apartment house complex under our shrubs on the back hill........with buroughs and "rooms" etc.......my husband caught them for years in "Have a heart" traps and took them away.......
Still the neighbors' groundhogs would come to feast on the stuff in the traps........they ate anything. I'd see them running down from up on the neighbors' hill to ours.......

Why is it , though, that rats have a worse reputation than groundhogs?
Groundhogs are also in the rodent family and way larger......I began taking pictures of all of them as they would come down and sun themselves on our patio.......or on the tree stumps........we finally had all the shrubs excavated........the boulders excavated......destroying their habitat........and first put on a huge Trex deck.........and screened in half of that deck into a three season sunporch.........and haven't seen one in several years...........fingers crossed. They were ornery groundhogs once in the trap. He would take them away to the edge of town, to a farmer's field and dispose of them.

Our cousin in New Jersey would say that we should take them at least ten miles away or else they will come back and he swore that ours were the same groundhog.........not true. I had pictures of them all and they were all different colors, different sizes, just different.............but he insists that groundhogs will find their way home again. These were huge critters.

Still, I'd rather have a groundhog than a rat. We do have chipmunks running all over the back and front..........they are rodents also.

[senior citizen]

Don't we all have a relative or friend that everybody else says "Oh she will find something to complain about" or "Joan is so picky she won't like it."

Yes we all do......but I think it's two different things.

The folks who are so picky that nothing in this world satisfies them.
That is truly annoying. We all know them. Every tidbit of food is poison to them. Or, those who cannot "live and let live".......or feel it's only their way or the highway.

This is not quite the same as someone asking a question or doing research to get the general lay of the land.......or expressing an opinion or wondering how certain things are...........that is curiosity.

I cannot understand why anyone would even be chatting on TOTV unless they enjoyed the opinions of the wonderful folks who participate.....that doesn't mean everyone has to agree with everyone all the time..........
Most folks are researching for their ultimate retirement relocation.......and simply looking for the honest facts........

Our first impression of The Villages was that it was beautiful, well groomed, very green for Florida.......and nicely laid out , with all the services one could ever ask for...........it will be our final destination.

At age 68 , in a long term marriage of 48 years, we are not swingers nor anything more than retired grandparents looking ahead to more sunshine and less snow...........

And yes, our creaking joints prove to us that we do have arthritis and the wet days, the humid days and the cold snowy days give us more pain.

It's a fact of life......... After one week of steady rain up north here, with flash flooding, we had severe pain........then a dry day or two.......then rain and humidity again...........we could keep a graph on how the humidity affects our pain...........it has to be the same or worse in Florida.

It might be BETTER in Florida.........as our temperatures are LOWER , even with the humidity. I've kept a record, and when the temps are higher, our joints and old bones do feel better...........

I wouldn't wish arthritis on anyone's dog..........so, to some it is an issue.
Pain is aways an issue. Mobility is an issue.

I've come to the conclusion, we can be up here in the humidity or in sunny Florida in the humidity.........and as someone "very wise" said recently, ....at least we wouldn't have to shovel it. I liked that response.

Peace.

[Sagitarius 6]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.
I agree with you, that is why I visit and hardly comment.

[senior citizen]

Yes, I agree. And as this is just an internet chat site I do not find it to be representative of people I've met in the Villages. In spite of its faults, and yes, The Villages does have some IMHO, I've met some wonderful people here and am having the time of my life. If I had judged The Villages based on comments I've read on this site, I would probably have a different opinion of Villagers.


Mickey.........you took the words right out of my mouth and the thoughts right out of my head........if that is possible.

We also met the very nicest people when we were there, who stopped to chat, sat with us.......everyone had "time" to show kindness and give friendly advice or tell their story of moving to TV. We will always remember that kindness.

Now, TOTV does pass the time for us in the cold frozen tundra of
the north or rainy periods such as we've been in recently...........or for those, who are taking a break while "downsizing" our family sized homes to put on the market prior to relocating to TV....down the road......

But, often I wonder, "With all the activities, and all the golf, and all the wonderful things, indoors and out.........why is everyone on TOTV chatting?"

I guess because at our ages, we all need a rest now and then......
Not to mention, a challenge for our brains........so many folks on TOTV have words of wisdom to share......from years of living and experiencing life. That's the part I enjoy.

[Cantwaittoarrive]

I think if you voice a complaint on a discussion board you should be prepared that people will discuss and not everyone will agree with your point of view.

[gomoho]

I think if you voice a complaint on a discussion board you should be prepared that people will discuss and not everyone will agree with your point of view.

Agreed - the problem is not discussion or different points of view - the problem is when the OP starts getting blasted for their thoughts or opinions.:cus:

[Villages PL]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.

I'll tell you something I have noticed. I'm sure you have noticed that there are one or two people on this website who are extremely popular. They have lots of friends on their friends list. So you post a "complaint" and if they are the first to reply negatively, all of their friends take it as a signal to pile on.
And once a thread has a negative bias, it often tends to stay that way.

Possible Reasons:

1) They see this board as a sales tool and think that negative complaints will hinder sales.

2) Politics: You might not fit their idea of what they think you should be. So they set about teaching you a lesson.

3) They have nothing better to do and think it's fun to give someone a hard time.

4) They can't think for themselves so they follow a ring-leader who has some ax to grind, whatever that might be.

[Peachie]

I'll tell you something I have noticed. I'm sure you have noticed that there are one or two people on this website who are extremely popular. They have lots of friends on their friends list. So you post a "complaint" and if they are the first to reply negatively, all of their friends take it as a signal to pile on.
And once a thread has a negative bias, it often tends to stay that way.

Possible Reasons:

1) They see this board as a sales tool and think that negative complaints will hinder sales.

2) Politics: You might not fit their idea of what they think you should be. So they set about teaching you a lesson.

3) They have nothing better to do and think it's fun to give someone a hard time.

4) They can't think for themselves so they follow a ring-leader who has some ax to grind, whatever that might be.




This post is, IMHO, exactly the problem that is being discussed here. If someone has a different opinion than another poster, they are labeled, accused of ulterior motives, giving others a hard time and being ringleaders when they are stating their OWN beliefs. This isn't a podium for only the OP's point of view, it is a for opposing points of view and discussion. Why would someone post on a forum if they only wanted to hear their own opinion or rant?

[Villages PL]

This post is, IMHO, exactly the problem that is being discussed here. If someone has a different opinion than another poster, they are labeled, accused of ulterior motives, giving others a hard time and being ringleaders when they are stating their OWN beliefs. This isn't a podium for only the OP's point of view, it is a for opposing points of view and discussion. Why would someone post on a forum if they only wanted to hear their own opinion or rant?

The OP, Warren, said that in his experience he recalls people suggesting that the complainer should move if he doesn't like it in The Villages. That's what we're talking about. We are not simply talking about a different opinion.

I simply added some of my own observations, and I stand by them. Just because you haven't had the same experiences doesn't mean they're not valid. You should respect my observations and not tell me that my post is part of the problem.

[kimball]

Is a complaint anything more than someone giving an opinion. For sake of discussion lets call them complaints. Many times complaints lead to progress, especially if enough people voice the same complaint. The Civil Rights Movement comes to mind. But, I am shocked at times when someone offers up a "complaint" and the resulting attack by so many of their fellow residents. This seems especially true when someone "complains" about something in the Villages community. I cannot count how many times someone replys to the op why don't you just move ..... Many of tthe attackers are repeaters. Why not let the "complainer" express himself and everyone else not join in the gang attack.

Numerous members of TV community seem to feel that a question about their beloved community is an attack. That is not the case and it is shameful of them to assume such a defensive posture. Many posters on this forum believe that this is Utopia. They are totally unrealistic to the extent that they cannot even handle inquiries that they feel are intimidating. It's a great place to live but an unrelenting loyalty to the TV is simply unrealistic. I for one am getting a bit fed up with those Villagers who simply don't understand that there is another perspective that they refuse to acknowledge. I could go on and on with example after example all of which would go in one of their ears and out the other. What's wrong with a bit of intelligent dissent. It's not perfect folks and there is nothing wrong with challenging and meaningful questions.

[ivanhoe]

LOL yes I have. Lived about 1.5 miles from the courses.
Get there around 3:30 - get a ticket to go in.
Sit there until the cage opens and stumble in.

BUMMER - But ya gotta do what ya gotta do !

Hehe... excellent! Get there at 3:30 and get a 11:40 tee...hehe...and your slapping the ball around at 4:30 like when will it end!!

Much better control of things here...good luck!

[Peachie]

The OP, Warren, said that in his experience he recalls people suggesting that the complainer should move if he doesn't like it in The Villages. That's what we're talking about. We are not simply talking about a different opinion.

I simply added some of my own observations, and I stand by them. Just because you haven't had the same experiences doesn't mean they're not valid. You should respect my observations and not tell me that my post is part of the problem.


PL, that was my observation of your post. But only your observation should be respected? I didn't ask you not to stand by your post, I explained why I found your post to be problematic.

[gomoho]

I'll tell you something I have noticed. I'm sure you have noticed that there are one or two people on this website who are extremely popular. They have lots of friends on their friends list. So you post a "complaint" and if they are the first to reply negatively, all of their friends take it as a signal to pile on.
And once a thread has a negative bias, it often tends to stay that way.

Possible Reasons:

1) They see this board as a sales tool and think that negative complaints will hinder sales.

2) Politics: You might not fit their idea of what they think you should be. So they set about teaching you a lesson.

3) They have nothing better to do and think it's fun to give someone a hard time.

4) They can't think for themselves so they follow a ring-leader who has some ax to grind, whatever that might be.

Quite honestly I haven't noticed this - some individuals love it - some hate it, but I have never seen a gang mentality going on here. Just sayin!

[Warren Kiefer]

This post is, IMHO, exactly the problem that is being discussed here. If someone has a different opinion than another poster, they are labeled, accused of ulterior motives, giving others a hard time and being ringleaders when they are stating their OWN beliefs. This isn't a podium for only the OP's point of view, it is a for opposing points of view and discussion. Why would someone post on a forum if they only wanted to hear their own opinion or rant?

I always thank everyone who responds to my postings. Thanks Peachie !! There have been times were I set the stage and asked my posting be a vehicle for "discussion". Is there any time discussion is counter productive, I don't think so. What happened to my post was not a discussion but an all out attack by several responders. During the attack, what usually happens is that the responders usually lose the subject of the orginal post and soon everyone is out in left field so to speak and are commenting about a far different subject..

[billethkid]

once again due to the actions of a very few, people are "scared" to post. Visit but don't post? OP's being attacked???

This is TOTV where the issue raised is caused by a very, very, VERY few posters here. And it always winds up as though it were a general condition.

Most of the commentary in this thread and several similar prior threads sound like it used to when folks were saying the exact same thing about the political forum. See where that went!?

btk