gas or electric? the free market decided

[Bonnevie]

I've been looking for golf carts. The push to buy gas is very evident. Seems people have range anxiety. Apparently, that's what most people are buying so many of the stores only bring electric up if specifically asked.

I want to friendly to the environment but it's hard to put a lot into an electric cart which apparently will be worth less than a gas one should I want to trade it in sometime. Carts and Clubs has only gas on the showroom but said it would get an electric if that's what one wanted.

In fact, I don't think I saw any new electric carts were displayed in any of the places I went.

Is there really hope for solar power to help electric carts?

[ajbrown]

I've been looking for golf carts. The push to buy gas is very evident. Seems people have range anxiety. Apparently, that's what most people are buying so many of the stores only bring electric up if specifically asked.

I want to friendly to the environment but it's hard to put a lot into an electric cart which apparently will be worth less than a gas one should I want to trade it in sometime. Carts and Clubs has only gas on the showroom but said it would get an electric if that's what one wanted.

In fact, I don't think I saw any new electric carts were displayed in any of the places I went.

Is there really hope for solar power to help electric carts?

Darn it I cannot let it go....:024:

Did you try any dealers that did not sell Yamaha? How about EZGO, Par Car or Tomberline.....they all gas?

No doubt, solar is interesting, along with battery technology improvements, but to be honest, electric carts do not need any help. Except maybe to reduce the misinformation that prevails on this site.....

[Maiercab]

We have a 2006 Par Car, Electric, love it. We do not like smelling fumes and talking over the gas motor. Our next cart will definitely be another electric - 70-80 mile range is good for us!

[TicoTexan]

Gas carts are good for snowbirds since extended storage periods are hard on the batteries.

Other than that, I can think of no reason for choosing gas over electric.

[Carl in Tampa]

Gas carts are good for snowbirds since extended storage periods are hard on the batteries.

Other than that, I can think of no reason for choosing gas over electric.

Range

Reliability

Resale value

Et al, ad infinitum.............

:)

[Yung Dum]

To me, the smell of gas carts is sickening. It seems there are more of them lately. Or maybe they just smell worse. I would love to see TV ban them.

[Golfingnut]

Range 50-60 miles is enough for mr

Reliability. same

Resale value.

Et al, ad infinitum.............

:)

.....

[Bonnevie]

and loud....I know people said they were loud but I didn't realize how loud until I drove one....I went to EZ Go, Yamaha, Grandpa and Grandmas....several other places and only EZ Go asked if I was looking for electric or gas.....everyone else said they are pretty much just selling gas carts

[Mikeod]

I have had both types and currently have a gas cart. My first electric cart had 8 6-volt batteries and we never had range anxiety. But SWMBO didn't like the climb in and out of the cart so we got another electric with 6 8-volt batteries. Range became a problem eventually so we got new batteries, but it didn't get much better. LSL to Brownwood was scary as the pack voltage kept dropping to the point we thought we might not get home. Then there was the problem that the cart was not available while it was being charged. So, we went with gas.

My mom has an electric cart with 6 8-volt batteries and a Curtis cab. Her range is poor, so that even a LSL to Colony results in a low battery warning on the way back. I don't know if it's just a bad digital gauge or if the pack is really depleted. I need to put a voltmeter on it when it says trouble.

Yes, gas is noisier. Yes, there is the exhaust, although the fuel injection is supposed to reduce that somewhat. But it is nice to be able to just jump in the cart and go. If the gauge shows 1/4 tank, we fill it up.

If you go electric, my advice would be to go with 8 6-volt batteries. The increased range and reduced anxiety is well worth it. Otherwise, go gas.

[Polar Bear]

...I can think of no reason for choosing gas over electric.

I'm not hard core either way, but how about range. And then there's range.

And did I mention...range!

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

I was in the golf business for 35 years and taking care of golf cart fleets was a part of my job.
I also have a friend that is president of a Club Car dealership. I've also attended many seminars put on by the PGA and I can tell you that the free market will tell you that electric are far more popular than gas.

You have to remember that the majority of golf carts sold nationwide are in fleets intended for use on a golf course. When Club Car came out with the first 48 volt electric system it all but put gas carts out of business. Number of rounds per charge was a big concern with golf courses and some, especially hilly courses, could not get more then one round out of the old 36 volt carts. The 48 volt Club Car would go two plus rounds and that was more than enough for golf course owners.

Having said that, here in the Villages is a bit of a different story. People are concerned with range and the 30 miles or so that an electric Club Car will get is not enough for some people. If that's the case, you have two options, buy a gas cart or modify your electric cart to get more hours of run time.

Yamaha is the biggest dealer here by far. They have three locations within the Villages. Yamaha makes the best gas golf cart on the market. Club Car, by everything that I learned, makes the best electric. The Club Car dealer is not located in the Villages. Yamaha dealers of course push gas carts and something like 90% of what they sell are gas carts. They will sell you an electric cart, as Club Car will sell you a gas cart, but make no mistake, the meat of their business is in the carts in which they specialize.

Now some people say you can go out and by a Columbia Par Car who advertises that you can get 80 miles on a single charge. You have to remember that claim is made based on a promotional stunt that they conducted a while ago where they ran a cart under absolute ideal conditions and did run 80 miles. They also gave that cart away as a promotion and changed the batteries because the batteries in that cart were destroyed. I think that pretty much any electric cart will do the same if the test is run the same way. Club Car salesmen claim that their basic D/S cart with the standard six 8 volt battery configuration will go 50 miles on a charge. They're probably right.

You can change the batteries in a 48 volt electric cart to eight 6 volt batteries and extend your miles significantly. There are other modifications that can be done to increase both speed and range. In addition there are some companies currently selling solar panels for the roof of the cart which will increase range a small amount. I would suspect that those panels will be improved in the future to add significantly to range.

Electric carts have fewer moving parts and require less maintenance. As gas carts age they tend to have more problems than electrics. This is not a problem of course, if you intend to trade your cart in every few years for a new one.

I dealt with both gas and electric carts in my career and as you can probably guess, I prefer electric. But if you want to have unlimited range a gas cart might be the right choice for you in this particular application.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

I believe so

many have asked where is it.

Well getting side tracked with two big projects on my home, it's back on the top of my short list to get two on the road.

The pics below were taken in June to show it is fact a reality.

In Brownwood after a 46 mile test run, battery bank still showed 45% reserve left.

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/attachments/solar-golf-carts-347/15240d1370628159t-cart-now-here-sam_0800.jpg

..

https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/attachments/solar-golf-carts-347/15239d1370628159t-cart-now-here-sam_0799.jpg

This one has not been plugged into a charger in several years.

This is not a fancy cart it is the proto type, bare bones, it is running on 4 not 6 batteries.

Four 12V AGM (glass matt batteries)

I have two carts the body on one for paint the other is getting a full body replacement.



I have tested one at 73 miles already.


.

So when will these be available to the general public and what will the cost be?

[billethkid]

do I understand correctly that the solar panels do not keep the batteries topped off as the cart is in use but only charges when not in use???

This is what I was told by a friend who had the panels on his cart.

I would have thought the charging would be constant as long as the appropriate light level was on the panels...that is me guesstimating how they could work?

btk

[rubicon]

I have been told that a solar panel works better if a cart owner installs lithium batteries.

I have a Sun Catcher Solar Panel which was installed a number of years ago. I suspect that I get some trickle down benefit but not what I was promised. Then again I never really tested it for distance.

I only use my golf cart for golf. I normally travel no more that 9 miles out play 9 holes of golf and return home. I occasionally play 18 holes of golf again with no problem. My analog voltage meter registers on the white when I return home. My trip home is uneventful meaning I feel no loss of power. My batteries are three years old.

I have 6-8 volt batteries but prefer 8-6 volts but my repair guy said he would have to modify my Precedent to fit all 8. My repair guy prefers the Club Car DS over any other cart.

I have driven other brand name carts and prefer the Club Car. I just don't like the local dealer. so if I buy again it will be a trip to Leesburg or Ocala or both

[Pturner]

I've been looking for golf carts. The push to buy gas is very evident. Seems people have range anxiety. Apparently, that's what most people are buying so many of the stores only bring electric up if specifically asked.

I want to friendly to the environment but it's hard to put a lot into an electric cart which apparently will be worth less than a gas one should I want to trade it in sometime. Carts and Clubs has only gas on the showroom but said it would get an electric if that's what one wanted.

In fact, I don't think I saw any new electric carts were displayed in any of the places I went.

Is there really hope for solar power to help electric carts?

Hi Bonnievie,
That's interesting. Before TV crossed 466, I suspect the market here, as in most places, was dominated by electric carts. Even when TV grew down to 466a, electric carts remained a strongly popular choice for new buyers. Now that TV extends all the way down to Hwy 44, it's not surprising if gas now dominates the new cart market among Villagers.

Even so, if you prefer an electric cart and range isn't an issue for you, why not go with what you want? I'm sure there will still be a market for used electric carts when you're ready to trade.

[Peachie]

I was in the golf business for 35 years and taking care of golf cart fleets was a part of my job.
I also have a friend that is president of a Club Car dealership. I've also attended many seminars put on by the PGA and I can tell you that the free market will tell you that electric are far more popular than gas.

You have to remember that the majority of golf carts sold nationwide are in fleets intended for use on a golf course. When Club Car came out with the first 48 volt electric system it all but put gas carts out of business. Number of rounds per charge was a big concern with golf courses and some, especially hilly courses, could not get more then one round out of the old 36 volt carts. The 48 volt Club Car would go two plus rounds and that was more than enough for golf course owners.

Having said that, here in the Villages is a bit of a different story. People are concerned with range and the 30 miles or so that an electric Club Car will get is not enough for some people. If that's the case, you have two options, buy a gas cart or modify your electric cart to get more hours of run time.

Yamaha is the biggest dealer here by far. They have three locations within the Villages. Yamaha makes the best gas golf cart on the market. Club Car, by everything that I learned, makes the best electric. The Club Car dealer is not located in the Villages. Yamaha dealers of course push gas carts and something like 90% of what they sell are gas carts. They will sell you an electric cart, as Club Car will sell you a gas cart, but make no mistake, the meat of their business is in the carts in which they specialize.

Now some people say you can go out and by a Columbia Par Car who advertises that you can get 80 miles on a single charge. You have to remember that claim is made based on a promotional stunt that they conducted a while ago where they ran a cart under absolute ideal conditions and did run 80 miles. They also gave that cart away as a promotion and changed the batteries because the batteries in that cart were destroyed. I think that pretty much any electric cart will do the same if the test is run the same way. Club Car salesmen claim that their basic D/S cart with the standard six 8 volt battery configuration will go 50 miles on a charge. They're probably right.

You can change the batteries in a 48 volt electric cart to eight 6 volt batteries and extend your miles significantly. There are other modifications that can be done to increase both speed and range. In addition there are some companies currently selling solar panels for the roof of the cart which will increase range a small amount. I would suspect that those panels will be improved in the future to add significantly to range.

Electric carts have fewer moving parts and require less maintenance. As gas carts age they tend to have more problems than electrics. This is not a problem of course, if you intend to trade your cart in every few years for a new one.

I dealt with both gas and electric carts in my career and as you can probably guess, I prefer electric. But if you want to have unlimited range a gas cart might be the right choice for you in this particular application.


I've often wondered if all the golf carts in The Villages were electric, how many more house fires do you think we would have seen from battery charging. There is definitely a higher risk of fire with an electric cart recharging, (I didn't say high risk), and this may be a problem with ongoing, daily maintenance of these electric carts by an aging population.

Also, some others have previously mentioned on TOTV how the light splash from filling their batteries had left pinprick holes in their clothing.

[ajbrown]

I was in the golf business for 35 years and taking care of golf cart fleets was a part of my job.
I also have a friend that is president of a Club Car dealership. I've also attended many seminars put on by the PGA and I can tell you that the free market will tell you that electric are far more popular than gas.

<stuff cut by Alan from OP for brevity>

I dealt with both gas and electric carts in my career and as you can probably guess, I prefer electric. But if you want to have unlimited range a gas cart might be the right choice for you in this particular application.

Nice read, thanks for taking the time to post.

[ilovetv]

I was in the golf business for 35 years and taking care of golf cart fleets was a part of my job.
I also have a friend that is president of a Club Car dealership. I've also attended many seminars put on by the PGA and I can tell you that the free market will tell you that electric are far more popular than gas.

You have to remember that the majority of golf carts sold nationwide are in fleets intended for use on a golf course..........


Of course people would prefer electric carts when most of them are in golf course or country club fleets. Somebody else maintains and charges them (bag room workers or cart barn workers).

And those employees bring the golfer another cart if the cart they're using dies out on the golf course. Here, it's the owner who has to deal with the problems, calls a service person to come out to tow and fix it, and makes sure somebody takes care of it while gone for months.

[Easyrider]

Of course people would prefer electric carts when most of them are in golf course or country club fleets. Somebody else maintains and charges them (bag room workers or cart barn workers).

And those employees bring the golfer another cart if the cart they're using dies out on the golf course. Here, it's the owner who has to deal with the problems, calls a service person to come out to tow and fix it, and makes sure somebody takes care of it while gone for months.

Exactly, if you only take short trips no problem.

:gc:

[Matzy]

I used both types for a while, gas and electric. Personally I would recommend electric golf carts. Range between 65-80 miles, enough to travel to all places in TV without a charge. Just watch out when traveling with electric that some people can't hear them and then be shocked that there is a vehicle.

[Hancle704]

I've been looking for golf carts. The push to buy gas is very evident. Seems people have range anxiety. Apparently, that's what most people are buying so many of the stores only bring electric up if specifically asked.

I want to friendly to the environment but it's hard to put a lot into an electric cart which apparently will be worth less than a gas one should I want to trade it in sometime. Carts and Clubs has only gas on the showroom but said it would get an electric if that's what one wanted.

In fact, I don't think I saw any new electric carts were displayed in any of the places I went.

Is there really hope for solar power to help electric carts?

Guess you haven't been to Town & Country EZ-Go Dealer on Bichara Blvd.in Villages. He mainly sells new EZ Go Electrics which have a range of 50 miles on a charge. That's a lot of golf and Village travel for a day.

[Bill-n-Brillo]

Either type of cart will get the job done. Most folks will have a preference of one type and/or brand for a variety of very valid reasons.

Bottom line: Do your research, ask questions.......then pick the one you feel you'll be happiest with.

Bill :)

[ajbrown]

Of course people would prefer electric carts when most of them are in golf course or country club fleets. Somebody else maintains and charges them (bag room workers or cart barn workers).

And those employees bring the golfer another cart if the cart they're using dies out on the golf course. Here, it's the owner who has to deal with the problems, calls a service person to come out to tow and fix it, and makes sure somebody takes care of it while gone for months.

Understand what you need, buy what you want, enjoy the ride, but please try to get the info right for new folks....

No doubt you have to maintain the batteries, this is hardly overwhelming. You can become an expert by dedicating 30 minutes on Trojan Battery (http://www.trojanbattery.com/Tech-Support/BatteryMaintenance.aspx).

I am curious why you believe a person that owns an electric cart will need to be towed any more than a person owning a gas. I have no evidence that one breaks down more than the other for mechanical reasons.

If your basis is that people run out of battery power while out and about, then that says more about the person than the cart. Get an in dash voltmeter, learn what it means and you cannot run out of fuel.

Also for new folks wanting electric, beware anyone telling you that a cart will go 50 miles or more on a charge. Some do, some do not. Part of battery maintenance is not discharging the pack too deeply on a regular basis. Always ask a followup question. What was the voltage of the pack after that 50 miles.... Did I mention get a volt meter?

JIMBO2012 (Same as Solar Golf Carts?), my 8-6v battery pack is on its 4th year, get that panel ready, I may want to check it out. I am looking to go 100 miles in a day :coolsmiley:

[Peachie]

Are you also thinking there is no risk with gasoline stored in a garage?

I would imagine if you are storing gasoline in a garage other than in your car or golf cart, it may be a concern. Other than that, the fire risk for owning a gas golf cart is miniscule compared to battery operated carts.

If one is considering a new golf cart, please google "talkofthevillages golf cart fire" and take a look at what you find. There have been a good number of battery driven cart fires in The Villages and these have not been smoldering little fires that were easy to extinguish. Homes were lost and more importantly, if one's garage is in the front of the home like a patio villa, escape from the home may be difficult other than through a window.

Many will have a tolerance for this higher fire risk, others won't. They need to know that risk is there to make their decision when selecting a cart. Bill N'Brillo had great advice; read all the info, test drive and decide.

[Russ_Boston]

There is no need to store gas just because you have a gas cart. I gas up about once every other week and usually have put between 150 and 200 miles on the odometer. At some point during the 2 weeks I'm near a gas station:)

[graciegirl]

Either type of cart will get the job done. Most folks will have a preference of one type and/or brand for a variety of very valid reasons.

Bottom line: Do your research, ask questions.......then pick the one you feel you'll be happiest with.

Bill :)

What he said.:agree:

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

I've often wondered if all the golf carts in The Villages were electric, how many more house fires do you think we would have seen from battery charging. There is definitely a higher risk of fire with an electric cart recharging, (I didn't say high risk), and this may be a problem with ongoing, daily maintenance of these electric carts by an aging population.

Also, some others have previously mentioned on TOTV how the light splash from filling their batteries had left pinprick holes in their clothing.

How many house fires, due to electric golf carts have there been in the Villages in the past 30 years? do you really think that there is a great deal more danger than storing five gallons of gasoline in your garage? Maybe, but I would love to see documentation of that.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Of course people would prefer electric carts when most of them are in golf course or country club fleets. Somebody else maintains and charges them (bag room workers or cart barn workers).

And those employees bring the golfer another cart if the cart they're using dies out on the golf course. Here, it's the owner who has to deal with the problems, calls a service person to come out to tow and fix it, and makes sure somebody takes care of it while gone for months.

Did you read my entire post? You left out the part where I said that there is more maintenance involved in gas carts than electric. There are more moving parts and more things that go wrong with them. That is one of the primary reasons that they are so popular with golf courses. Golf course owners are well aware of the cost of maintenance. All those cart boys and bag room attendants have to be paid.

Again, if you plan on trading your gas cart in for a new one every three or four years, this is not an issue. But if you buy an older cart or plan on keeping your cart for a long time, the maintenance on a gas cart will be higher.

[Russ_Boston]

How many house fires, due to electric golf carts have there been in the Villages in the past 30 years? do you really think that there is a great deal more danger than storing five gallons of gasoline in your garage? Maybe, but I would love to see documentation of that.

Don't think the danger is high with either. But there is no need to store gas anyway. I remember maybe 3 fires over the past 10 years that started in the garage from electric charger. Don't remember any with gas can. Not scientific reasoning but that is what I remember.

[Barefoot]

... the fire risk for owning a gas golf cart is miniscule compared to battery operated carts .

I wonder if there are statistics from the Fire Department that support this statement. Most of the threads I've seen about garage fires are pure speculation ..... "we wonder if this fire was caused by a battery-operated cart".

[Peachie]

I wonder if there are statistics from the Fire Department that support this statement. Most of the threads I've seen about garage fires are pure speculation ..... "we wonder if this fire was caused by a battery-operated cart".

That's a legitimate point, Bare. I have very busy morning so I'll try to do more research to locate all the fires I know were electric cart fires later today. In the interim, I hope this link will post to start..... it's from our own aj on this forum.

golfcartfire_zps18d5812c.jpg Photo by ajbrown2007 | Photobucket (http://s1002.photobucket.com/user/ajbrown2007/media/totv/golfcartfire_zps18d5812c.jpg.html)

[ajbrown]

That's a legitimate point, Bare. I have very busy morning so I'll try to do more research to locate all the fires I know were electric cart fires later today. In the interim, I hope this link will post to start..... it's from our own aj on this forum.

golfcartfire_zps18d5812c.jpg Photo by ajbrown2007 | Photobucket (http://s1002.photobucket.com/user/ajbrown2007/media/totv/golfcartfire_zps18d5812c.jpg.html)

That photo came from a TOTV user bkcunningham. I only helped her upload the photo, but then she figured it out.

The thread is: https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/golf-cart-fire-76213/

[Rango]

I wonder if there are statistics from the Fire Department that support this statement. Most of the threads I've seen about garage fires are pure speculation ..... "we wonder if this fire was caused by a battery-operated cart".

There is probably a higher risk of fire from a toaster oven or a Christmas tree than a gas or electric cart.

[twiceis]

We have an electric Star golf cart & the range is fantastic. We live in Gilchrist & always go round trip to Spanish Springs & further north & have more than enough charge!

[jimbo2012]

I wonder if there are statistics from the Fire Department that support this statement. Most of the threads I've seen about garage fires are pure speculation .....

:agree:.....

[Peachie]

I wonder if there are statistics from the Fire Department that support this statement. Most of the threads I've seen about garage fires are pure speculation ..... "we wonder if this fire was caused by a battery-operated cart".

Just started to look to see if electric golf cart fires were anything to be considered in the grand scope of things and came across this piece:

http://www.usfa.fema.gov/pdf/efop/efo27803.pdf

(Never know if the link will work...).

More....

http://www.firehouse.com/article/10518243/the-unexpected-golf-cart-hazard


I wish only for the safety of people owning electric carts. Is everyone, who owns an electric golf cart, cognizant of this issue and are they monitoring their homes for this potential problem? This really needs to be on an electric cart owners' "to do list" if this information is still pertinent.

[jimbo2012]

That info is over ten years old, a lot has changed

[Peachie]

That info is over ten years old, a lot has changed


So you can unequivocally state hydrogen is no longer at issue for all electric golf carts, jimbo? I do hope that is the case because I know there are still fires happening.

[jimbo2012]

No hydrogen is an issue but there have been advances in chargers, batteries and for instance the Battery minder looks interesting.

You say you know there are fires happening can you please state where in recent fire dept investigated reports?

I don't use a charger but if I did I might think about ventilation crack a window in the garage if I had a concern.

But out of the thousands of elec carts not sure how many in the last year or two where in fact the cause a fire.

For example you can be charging a power tool or batteries for a radio operated plane or boat that can have possible issues.

The clothes dryer can cause a fire or kitchen appliance.

The fact is thousands of carts are on chargers as I type I don't see any smoke.

If you're so concerned you can avoid the low risk altogether - look into solar, it works great. :icon_wink: