Cancer rates in The Villages

[Abby10]

My husband and I have been contemplating a move to TV for several years now, but one of his concerns is the possible cancer risk due to the use of pesticides there. This may very well be unrelated, but we have also had 2 relatives living in TV who have contracted pancreatic cancer since living there which increases his concern. We understand that with age, cancer rates will almost always be on the rise, but one of his relatives was under 60 years old. We have been following TOTV for almost as many years as we have been visiting TV and have come to respect the wisdom on this site. Interested to hear what you have to say about this. Do any of you have the same concerns? I did look at some stats from 2010 (couldn't find anything more recent) and was pleasantly surprised to see that the state of FL has much lower incidences of cancer overall than most other states, including melanoma, but could not find specific info for Sumter County.

[784caroline]

My husband and I have been contemplating a move to TV for several years now, but one of his concerns is the possible cancer risk due to the use of pesticides there. This may very well be unrelated, but we have also had 2 relatives living in TV who have contracted pancreatic cancer since living there which increases his concern. We understand that with age, cancer rates will almost always be on the rise, but one of his relatives was under 60 years old. We have been following TOTV for almost as many years as we have been visiting TV and have come to respect the wisdom on this site. Interested to hear what you have to say about this. Do any of you have the same concerns? I did look at some stats from 2010 (couldn't find anything more recent) and was pleasantly surprised to see that the state of FL has much lower incidences of cancer overall than most other states, including melanoma, but could not find specific info for Sumter County.

I am amazed at what people are worried about here in the Villages whether it be STD's or high cancer rates from pesticide use. My question to you would be, what makes you think TV HAS a high cancer rate due to pesticides. AS you have stated, your own research from 2010 has shown FL has a lower rate of cancer overall compared to other states. Its unfortunate that someone you know or even 2 people you know have developed pancreatic cancer, but from this you are taking a giant leap in surmizing TV has a high cancer rate.

Personally I would be more concerned about getting hit by a car while in a round-a-bout during high season .

[billethkid]

while I do not know for sure but I would bet that most incidences of cancer discovered in residents of TV were in the body long before moving here.

And as far as pesticide related, I am curious how this became a concern any more here than anywhere else in the USA or where you live.

Your additional research will not disprove the concern.

[pooh]

There are so many factors that can cause cancer to rear it's ugly head and it may not be from the relatively short exposure to pesticides used in the area. Exposure to factors that raise one' s potential for illness might have happened years ago, may be related to exposure to smog, industrial pollutants, certain chemicals found in cleaners, soaps, medicines, a compromised immune system, viruses, so many things.

In this community there are many, many older individuals and the processes that start illness may have already been doing what they do before arrival in TV.
You might statistically find more cancer in the local population. Pancreatic cancer can be the result of genetic mutations that happen early or later in life. Smoking also can play a factor in this particular type of cancer. Aging is also a factor in developing this cancer.

Please know there are risks in just living....no place is entirely danger free for humanity. Come for a visit, see how you like the place and do all you can to maintain your health, here or whoever you live.

[SALYBOW]

MAYBE i AM JUST DENSE, BUT WHERE DO THEY USE PESTICIDES IN tv EXCEPT AROUND THE WATER?

[zcaveman]

My nonmedical position on this subject is that most of the people that have been diagnosed with cancer since moving to TV had already had the "seeds" planted long before moving to TV.

I am pretty sure that my cancer was from my earlier life style - smoking - and not suddenly contracted by my moving to TV.

Z

[Carl in Tampa]

MAYBE i AM JUST DENSE, BUT WHERE DO THEY USE PESTICIDES IN tv EXCEPT AROUND THE WATER?

In my yard, for one. And in almost everyone's yard in TV where you see one of those little Massey signs warning you to stay off of the grass until the pesticide that they sprayed on it dries.

:22yikes:

[Abby10]

Thank you all for your responses so far......pretty much my sentiments exactly. My husband tends to be more concerned about these types of things than me. But as far as pesticides, Salybow, I thought that most homes also had their lawns treated on a regular basis for insect control. And Pooh, we have visited several times and absolutely love everything about TV, especially the people! I don't think this will deter us from an eventual move. I hope you all won't hold this first post against me - been lurking here for a long time and kind of nervous to post. This probably wasn't the best way to start, but hubby has been contemplating this for so long that I thought it was best that he hear from the voice of reason (and that wouldn't be me! lol!) Thanks all!

[Abby10]

Yep, Carl.....that's what I was thinking. And Zcaveman, I agree with you about the "seeds". I just wonder sometimes how environmental factors may trigger those seeds. I told my husband the bottom line is that you never know who, what, where with cancer, so with that in mind I would rather be in The Villages than anywhere else. No telling anyway what the real cause - rather live out my days either way in the closest thing to heaven on earth!

[Carl in Tampa]

Have you found any data that lists pesticides as a proximate cause of pancreatic cancer?

The risk factors that I found listed include:


Family history: 5–10% of pancreatic cancer patients have a family history of pancreatic cancer.

Age. The risk of developing pancreatic cancer increases with age. Most cases occur after age 60, while cases before age 40 are uncommon.

Smoking. Cigarette smoking has a risk ratio of 1.74 with regard to pancreatic cancer; a decade of nonsmoking after heavy smoking is associated with a risk ratio of 1.2.

Diets low in vegetables and fruits.

Diets high in red meat. Processed meat consumption is positively associated with pancreatic cancer risk, and red meat consumption was associated with an increased risk of pancreatic cancer in men.

Diets high in sugar-sweetened drinks (soft drinks). In particular, limited epidemiological studies link the common soft drink sweetener fructose with growth of pancreatic cancer cells.

Obesity.

Diabetes mellitus is both risk factor for pancreatic cancer, and new onset diabetes can be an early sign of the disease.

Chronic pancreatitis has been linked, but is not known to be causal. The risk of pancreatic cancer in individuals with familial pancreatitis is particularly high.

Helicobacter pylori infection.

Gingivitis or periodontal disease.

Partial gastrectomy.

As you might observe, pesticides did not make the list.

I find it particularly interesting that you say that two relatives who moved here developed pancreatic cancer. Have you considered the familial risk factor listed above as the possible cause?

What about lifestyle? Did the family members who were stricken have similar habits, such as smoking, and similar diets?

I would not be one to urge you to move here because I would not want you to later blame me if you were to develop a disease, but personally, I don't consider the use of pesticides in The Villages to be a matter of major concern regarding my health.

[janmcn]

In addition to the rates of incidence of some cancers, you could also research the rates of survival compared to other areas. If you live in an area with state of the art, cutting edge health care, you could be sorely disappointed with health care in The Villages and for that matter, the whole state of Florida.

[Abby10]

Thanks, Carl, I appreciate your informative post. No, I don't have any info linking pesticides with pancreatic cancer either. The interesting thing about the relatives - there was a test done to determine a genetic link, mainly because the cancers occurred one right after the other and they were brother and sister. The doctors were also concerned about that for the sake of the children and other family members (cousins). To my knowledge no genetic link was found which surprised all of us. Their lifestyles were completely different - one was a diabetic and one had no health issues at all. Neither one smoked. I think that my husband is a bit more concerned than usual because, other than the diabetes, it just didn't make sense. He is also still somewhat traumatized at losing his one cousin. He passed away 2 days before we arrived for a scheduled visit, less than 6 months ago. We are so grateful that the other cousin was spared and is now past the 1 year cancer free mark. Thanks again, Carl, for your post. I've enjoyed reading many of your past contributions to this forum.

[asianthree]

for most cancer comes with you....usually undetected until you have more time to visit a doctor, or slow down enough to have time to know something is wrong...but the bad news is there are more deaths in the area of retirement places than say an area with lots of young people...(sorry just had too)

[manaboutown]

If they were brother and sister they probably grew up in the same house(s), ate the same food and so on for 20 years more or less. Too, how reliable/sophisticated is the genetic testing for various cancer indicators?

One of my high school classmates died of pancreatic cancer at about age 65. As far as I know he was never obese or smoked.

[justjim]

If they were brother and sister they probably grew up in the same house(s), ate the same food and so on for 20 years more or less. Too, how reliable/sophisticated is the genetic testing for various cancer indicators?

One of my high school classmates died of pancreatic cancer at about age 65. As far as I know he was never obese or smoked.

My brother-in-law passed at 52 from pancreatic cancer. He was an electrician. Asbestos? Never smoked and very healthy in a small Southern Illinois town.

Come on down---your chances of cancer are no greater here than any other place in the country.

[Villages PL]

Perhaps the question might be about cancer in general and pancreatic cancer just happens to be an example. As people age, their immune systems tend to get weaker and less effective at fighting off disease. Everyone is different so one person might have a predisposition for one thing and someone else might have a predisposition for something else entirely different (parkinson's or whatever).

So, for someone who has a weakened immune system, there might be good cause to worry. Could it be that some people eat out more when they come to The Villages? Perhaps they eat more of the wrong foods and gain weight?

Then the other thing I would worry about is buying a house next to some place where they might do a lot of spraying of pesticides and/or herbicides. One example might be a golf course lot. What would happen if they spray on a breezy spring day when some people might be in their back yards or in the house with doors and windows open? I'm just wondering. It might serve as a trigger for lung disease, Parkinson's or any number of diseases, depending on what the person has a predisposition for.

[graciegirl]

Perhaps the question might be about cancer in general and pancreatic cancer just happens to be an example. As people age, their immune systems tend to get weaker and less effective at fighting off disease. Everyone is different so one person might have a predisposition for one thing and someone else might have a predisposition for something else entirely different (parkinson's or whatever).

So, for someone who has a weakened immune system, there might be good cause to worry. Could it be that some people eat out more when they come to The Villages? Perhaps they eat more of the wrong foods and gain weight?

Then the other thing I would worry about is buying a house next to some place where they might do a lot of spraying of pesticides and/or herbicides. One example might be a golf course lot. What would happen if they spray on a breezy spring day when some people might be in their back yards or in the house with doors and windows open? I'm just wondering.



They spray almost all of our lawns, vpl.

[Villages PL]

They spray almost all of our lawns, vpl.

And your point is?

[Villages PL]

They spray almost all of our lawns, vpl.

I haven't had mine sprayed for several years and none of my close neighbors have either. If I want some fresh air in the morning I open the sliding glass door facing my neighbors patio villa. I could open all the windows if I wanted to but it's easier to just open the sliding glass door and sometimes the front door too.

[B767drvr]

...

[Abby10]

Villages PL - was hoping you would respond as I was interested in hearing your perspective, knowing from your previous posts that you are very health conscious. Appreciate your input.

[JP]

Everyone has cancer.
You don't get a full blown case of cancer because your body is constantly attacking it and fighting it off.
What causes your body to not be able to fight off cancer is the million dollar question.
No one knows.
Are there triggers that cause your body to stop fighting cancer? Probably.
Do we know what these triggers are? Probably not and probably different for everyone.
If you think not living around pesticides, electric power lines, waste dumps, etc will help you avoid cancer, don't live by them.
Will not living by these types of sites cause you not to get cancer if you are predisposed to it? Probably not.
You need to do what makes you feel the most comfortable which in itself will probably aide your immune system and lower your cancer risks.

[jblum315]

MAYBE i AM JUST DENSE, BUT WHERE DO THEY USE PESTICIDES IN tv EXCEPT AROUND THE WATER?

haven't you wondered why there are NO mosquitoes? Hello??

[redwitch]

I do believe that pesticides have some real risks. There have been several cases of dogs getting foot tumors, forcing the owners to either have the foot amputated or put down. I do believe these were caused by the chemicals used here, especially in the common areas.

So, yes, there are probably some risks for cancer due to pesticides here. There are also risks for melanoma because of the many hours of sunshine. You have to decide what risks you are willing to take. I don't believe that TV or Florida is really any riskier than any other state or area. The risks may be different here but there are unquestionably risks wherever you choose to live.

[graciegirl]

I do believe that pesticides have some real risks. There have been several cases of dogs getting foot tumors, forcing the owners to either have the foot amputated or put down. I do believe these were caused by the chemicals used here, especially in the common areas.

So, yes, there are probably some risks for cancer due to pesticides here. There are also risks for melanoma because of the many hours of sunshine. You have to decide what risks you are willing to take. I don't believe that TV or Florida is really any riskier than any other state or area. The risks may be different here but there are unquestionably risks wherever you choose to live.





Melanoma is a real issue. I also think the chemicals used on the grass are toxic and worry about the young men who apply them. However pesticides are not limited to this area. They were used in Ohio too.

[jimmy D]

If you have visited many times, and hubby is holding back. I say do not move here. If he gets sick you will never hear the end of it

[billethkid]

Sounds like some have never had their lawn "sprayed" or bugs "sprayed" where ever they are from.
It ain't unique to FL!

[senior citizen]

............

[senior citizen]

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[Bogie Shooter]

Oh my God, what shall I do?

[jblum315]

Oh my God, what shall I do?

Stop eating. Stop drinking especially water. Don't go outside your house for any reason.You won't live long enough to get cancer

[senior citizen]

,,,,,,,,,

[JP]

Exactly. It isn't just pesticides. So, don't worry. Don't stop living.


Enjoy each day.

Exactly.

Like I have said, everyone has a certain predilection for cancer that is in your heritage/genes that you in all likelihood can't override to any major extent no matter what you do with your diet, where you live, how you live etc.

Enjoy life as much as you can. It's way to short.

[senior citizen]

..........

[graciegirl]

Yes, it is way too short.......as we all realize once we get to this age.
I printed that humongous long list of carcinogens to show that it isn't just pesticides that confront us at every turn..........not to mention our own heritage or genetics (as you say above). To live a rigid life, banning every known food that might contribute to cancer , or every chemical substance, many of which we have no power to control........is not going to truly change our course of destiny one iota. Also, some people might have a natural born immunity, even if they are exposed to dangerous things on that list (actual multiple lists several posts above). Many families, mine included, have no history of cancer at all.....whereas, my husband's family DOES. Que sera sera.



I wish that every person would listen with their hearts to this good advice.

[maureenod]

EVERYTHING goes back to the immune system. Just try to build it up, 80% of the immune system is in the gut. A good glass of kiefer every day is the best.

[Gerald]

I would say don not move to the villages if you are worried.

[yabbadu]

I have had cancer multiple times before the Villages. Moved here to get away from it!

[Bizdoc]

I suspect that most folks who develop cancer here do so based on the 55+ years elsewhere and what they were exposed to. Very few cancers pop up after a a few months of exposure in a new location.

Of course, everyone here in The Villages is going to die from *some* cause.

[billethkid]

yup, the death rate could be viewed as a concern, right?
Isn't the death rate here higher than "back home"?

Not meant as sarcasm. Just trying to highlight focusing on any one "cause" is really relative. I tell my kids we are part of the here today gone tomorrow age group.....to play the guilt trip to encourage them to visit more often.

[Abby10]

BTK - Probably the best statement in this entire thread goes back to your first post here "Your additional research will not disprove the concern". So true, as there are just way too many variables involved. Appreciate the wisdom you often give in one short sentence. I also appreciate the perspective that SENIOR and others have added to the discussion - life indeed is too short to spend one additional minute worrying about things that are out of your control. I don't see that this concern will sway our decision regarding moving to The Villages as we have grown to love it and the many people we have met during our visits there. Hope to meet many of you one day too!

[graciegirl]

BTK - Probably the best statement in this entire thread goes back to your first post here "Your additional research will not disprove the concern". So true, as there are just way too many variables involved. Appreciate the wisdom you often give in one short sentence. I also appreciate the perspective that SENIOR and others have added to the discussion - life indeed is too short to spend one additional minute worrying about things that are out of your control. I don't see that this concern will sway our decision regarding moving to The Villages as we have grown to love it and the many people we have met during our visits there. Hope to meet many of you one day too!



I can just tell by how you post, that you would love it here and we would love you.


Hurry home.

[Abby10]

Thanks so much Gracie. Don't tell anyone, but I think my husband has a secret crush on you....he can't wait to meet you some day and neither can I!

[Villages PL]

Enjoy life as much as you can. It's way to short.

I always say, "If life is too short, let's lengthen it." :thumbup:

[Villages PL]

Villages PL - was hoping you would respond as I was interested in hearing your perspective, knowing from your previous posts that you are very health conscious. Appreciate your input.

I see from reading the other posts that there's no shortage of things to worry about. But here's something different that no one has mentioned:

As has been said, there's a lot of spraying of pesticides and herbicides. The wind may or may not blow the stuff around. It's not so much a problem in yards where the man walks around with a wand and is usually careful about it. My doubts about the golf courses stems from not knowing what method they use. I've never seen it done.

But here's another thought concerning the pesticides and herbicides. Let's assume they are put down safely and they soak into the top layer of the soil. What happens after drying? Springtime, for example, can be very dry and windy. I remember it being very windy in April and very dry.

I believe the wind will pick some of it up and carry it around. Those who have a screened in lanai must know how dusty it can get in windy weather. I've heard people say they have to wipe the dust off everyday because they like to eat breakfast out on the lanai. So it must be that the wind is picking up some of the soil and I imagine whatever chemicals there are will go along for the ride. And a lot of it may be microscopic I'm sure.

So what happens if you're out for a brisk walk or jogging for exercise on a windy or breezy day? You likely will be breathing deeply and taking all those pollutants into your lungs. You'll be getting whatever is being lifted off of the top layer of soil.

Large open spaces are usually windier as there is no resistance, nothing to break the wind (parking lots, golf courses, sidewalks along boulevards etc. But these microscopic particles will carry everywhere for very long distances. So I would just stay indoors, as much as possible, on the windiest days.

[twinklesweep]

I grew up in and lived for decades in a fruit-growing region. It was the only income source in the area, virtually all for small growers. Without statistics, lawsuits, and such, it was simply a given that spraying times were announced, and particularly for those who lived adjoining the orchards, if you couldn’t be away at spraying time, you had to seal yourself into your own home. While the local health services urged awareness of cancer issues, particularly for those who lived closest to the orchard areas, equally serious were respiratory issues stemming from the chemical sprays.

Living in an area like that, it was more or less a no-brainer that the closer one was to pesticide and herbicide spraying, the greater the potential for health risks. For me, it’s hard to imagine rationalizing living around these chemicals as “Oh, they’re no big deal.” Potentially they ARE a big deal, and we don’t need statistics that prove it! Anyone with concerns about these kinds of chemicals should probably not live in an area where they are used routinely, which has to be worse than the need to spray orchards on a regular but far from daily basis.

For those who feel that there is NO risk at all in pesticide and herbicide spraying, TV does indeed offer a wonderful lifestyle. For those who feel there is some concern, they can choose to avoid living by areas with the greatest concentration of these chemicals, such as facing a golf course (which are ironically called “premium lots,” just as lots around a manmade catchment basis are called “premium” because they have a water view!). And for those who know the horror stories and/or are particularly traumatized at even just the thought of deliberately choosing the exposure, frankly those people need to find an altogether environmentally different place to live, where the focus is not on pristine lawns and even more pristine golf courses.

[graciegirl]

I grew up in and lived for decades in a fruit-growing region. It was the only income source in the area, virtually all for small growers. Without statistics, lawsuits, and such, it was simply a given that spraying times were announced, and particularly for those who lived adjoining the orchards, if you couldn’t be away at spraying time, you had to seal yourself into your own home. While the local health services urged awareness of cancer issues, particularly for those who lived closest to the orchard areas, equally serious were respiratory issues stemming from the chemical sprays.

Living in an area like that, it was more or less a no-brainer that the closer one was to pesticide and herbicide spraying, the greater the potential for health risks. For me, it’s hard to imagine rationalizing living around these chemicals as “Oh, they’re no big deal.” Potentially they ARE a big deal, and we don’t need statistics that prove it! Anyone with concerns about these kinds of chemicals should probably not live in an area where they are used routinely, which has to be worse than the need to spray orchards on a regular but far from daily basis.

For those who feel that there is NO risk at all in pesticide and herbicide spraying, TV does indeed offer a wonderful lifestyle. For those who feel there is some concern, they can choose to avoid living by areas with the greatest concentration of these chemicals, such as facing a golf course (which are ironically called “premium lots,” just as lots around a manmade catchment basis are called “premium” because they have a water view!). And for those who know the horror stories and/or are particularly traumatized at even just the thought of deliberately choosing the exposure, frankly those people need to find an altogether environmentally different place to live, where the focus is not on pristine lawns and even more pristine golf courses.



Thoughtfully said and very good points made. I am afraid of spraying and always have been. I get the cats inside from the lanai when Massey comes and worry about the young person who handles those poisons. We have lived on golf courses for forty years, and both Helene and I have had breast cancer, BUT so have nine (I have to sit down and think of how many, but at least nine and on fathers side only) of our family members who don't live on golf course and we have been tested and it is NOT the Brc gene.


Some people have said that they would ride their bikes behind the mosquito spraying trucks as kids.


I think your point about this place being a choice is well made. AND the point about people seeking pristine lawns. I agree with both and yet we have lawn service to get rid of cinch bugs, fire ants etc.


I think about this for awhile until my mind is diverted to some other worry. I really do think that most people use the same amount of pesticides on their lawns and use them as frequently as golf courses do, and not just here, everywhere.


It is a double edged sword, banning all pesticides. I have read that they have made it illegal to use the one thing that would kill bedbugs and they are becoming an increasing danger.


(Was that last point a red herring, Rubicon? AND the one about riding bikes behind spraying trucks?) Trying to follow the rules of good debate here.

[rubicon]

Wow I was feeling optimistic about the New Year until I read this thread.

I know a guy who was exposed to heavy levels of radiation while serving in the military and was hospitalized for a long period of time. He is now 92 and as active an individual that you would ever meet. he still has a business travels all over the country, etc

Death Comes To Us All and I for one , while not tossing caution to the wind, ain't afraid of death. Of course i would prefer to avoid the horribles and i have faced death in the past

By the way my Dad once pointed to a guy in our town who was so afraid to die in his sleep he drove the streets of the town til dawn. Yep you guessed it he died in his sleep

Now get on with your great adventures and have a wonderful year

[graciegirl]

Wow I was feeling optimistic about the New Year until I read this thread.

I know a guy who was exposed to heavy levels of radiation while serving in the military and was hospitalized for a long period of time. He is now 92 and as active an individual that you would ever meet. he still has a business travels all over the country, etc

Death Comes To Us All and I for one , while not tossing caution to the wind, ain't afraid of death. Of course i would prefer to avoid the horribles and i have faced death in the past

By the way my Dad once pointed to a guy in our town who was so afraid to die in his sleep he drove the streets of the town til dawn. Yep you guessed it he died in his sleep

Now get on with your great adventures and have a wonderful year



Well said as always my friend.


On the issue above, I have always heard that if you are born to hang, you won't drown.

[senior citizen]

..........

[Villages PL]

Talking about environmental dangers upsets some people. It reminds me of something Jack Nicholson once said in a movie: "You can't handle the truth!"

;)

[pooh]

There are environmental dangers almost everywhere. One has to decide just what they will have around them, determine how they will protect themselves or....live isolated, growing their own food, weaving their own cloth and doing without many, no most, of what we have, use and enjoy today.