If guns aren't the problem, and people are the problem, then why are some states making it easier to put guns in the hands of problem people?

I'm not in favor of weapons bans. I'm respectful of 2A, even though I don't have a gun and won't allow one in my house. But I can't for the life of me figure out why some states bend over backward to make it easier to possess them. It's already easy to possess them - even if you're a mass murderer. It's like leading a fox into a henhouse.

Gun ownership - Wikipedia

Looks like there are almost 400,000,000 guns in the US. More than the population.

Not sure how we could stop some sales to the wrong people but we could slow them down a bit and start looking into ways of making sure the wrong people do not get their hands on them. It would take a national concerted effort though to actual make this happen.

The wrong people will get their hands on them. But we can make it cost them more to do so, AND have more severe consequences when they get caught.

1. National - not statewide - database and mandatory background check through it.
2. Mandatory federal - licensing to legally own firearms, which would require classroom instruction, passing a written test, and proof of competency at a federally-approved shooting range.
3. Mandatory federal - registration of legally-owned firearms.
4. Mandatory minimum insurance requirements - so if you shoot someone and it's determined to be either your fault, or no-fault, YOUR insurance covers at least some of the damages. (so if you shot someone who tried to shoot you first - your insurance policy would not have to cover their injuries/death)

So sure - anyone can get around all those laws. But if they're caught breaking them, they can have severe penalties imposed on them.

It won't stop the bad guys from having guns. But it'll make it cost them more, and come with more risk.

What states are "making it easier to put guns in the hands of problem people"?

What states are "making it easier to possess them"?

What specific laws have been passed?

So, you want a "Poll Tax" for gun ownership?

You want to make it more expensive to own a gun? What about people with limited means? If they cannot afford all of the extra costs, they're screwed?

Registration leads to confiscation... EVERY SINGLE TIME...

But, I'll agree with stiffer penalties if you're caught carrying or possessing illegally.

Problem is, the progressive DAs continue to drop said gun charges in order to get an easy conviction (to keep their conviction rate up). That is one of the reason there are so many people in jail for "non-violent drug offenses"...

They were caught carrying an illegal gun, those charges were dropped if they plead guilty to the drug charges. The DA gets an easy conviction (no lengthy trial), and the perp is out of jail after a few months...

Can you please explain what you mean. Where is it legal for a mass murderer to possess a firearm?

And as far a the new Florida law:

(deleted text copied from an article to avoid getting TOTV in trouble)

So, I am little bit confused on your concern. thanks

What could possibly go wrong with these suggestions? It's not like the Federal justice system could be weaponized against people that don't hold the "correct" beliefs. Oh, wait.....

Set the scene:

Permitless open carry = if you're carrying openly, and not doing anything suspicious at the moment, then no one can question you about it. No one can confront you about it. And - most people wouldn't dare confront you about it.

This means - someone who is about to commit murder will walk among you all, in plain sight, and no one will know until someone is already dead.

New scene:

Open carry NOT permitted = if you're carrying openly, you're breaking the law. The only people who are going to do that, are criminals. They'll stick out like a sore thumb. Very easy to tell which one in the crowd is about to shoot someone, because - they're the ONLY ones carrying those weapons out in the open.

Previous scene: You don't know who is the target, and who is the shooter.
New scene: the shooter is the one with the gun. It's a no-brainer.


That's just ONE example. If you want to know which states have which laws you can check, just like I did. You can even get a nice neat run-down by state on wikipedia, and on various other websites. You can check the NRA (anti-restriction) website, Giffords (anti-gun) website, the ATF (the actual law) website, if you don't like wikipedia.

I don't even know what to say. Are your scene's meant to be serious?

All states allow person to have rifles, shotguns and other similar weapons which are not concealed weapons and to move about with those weapons freely as long as they are not loaded while carried in some locales. In some states, the “long guns” may even be loaded while transported.

This has always been the case and is not a new phenomenon.

So, in your scene, the murderer who is open carrying (this term only applies to weapons that can be concealed, so we are talking handguns) and be seen by all. The person can be watched and avoided.
Replay the scene where the person is carrying concealed, and now no one can see the weapon, no one can keep an eye on the guy or avoid him until he chooses to kill people.

So, maybe I missed something really nuanced in what you were trying to say, because otherwise it makes absolutely no sense at all.

We have 15 pages of back and forth and zero progress in the discussion (shocker, I know).

Can we all agree that:
1. There are approximately 400 million guns in the U.S. a lot of which are the scary kind.
2. We have a completely open border that is unable to stop millions of illegal immigrants and literally tons of illegal drugs as well as many many weapons, lots of which are illegal (automatic weapons).
3. People (criminal) who are going to commit (mass) murder are not deterred by breaking numerous laws and taking the lives of innocents (often kids). Therefore, they will not follow gun laws and will get a weapon in some illegal fashion as necessary.
4. Therefore, the mission is to somehow predict which previously law abiding citizen has somehow snapped and prevent them from possessing or using a gun, explosive, SUV, etc., or at the very least minimize the damage they are able to inflict, while not preventing law abiding citizens from possessing weapons for self-protection, sport, or whatever other legal purpose as protected by common sense and the U.S. Constitution.

If we focussed on that real mission, then, and only then, can we make any progress.