[stanley]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

We have a LONG way to go before you can say "Darwin Award time." And I'll be right in line with you on that day, passing out the cheesecake dipped in chopped liver for those lucky winners of the award.

Stop.....you're making me hungry!

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by coffeebean

Hi Walrus...
I did read your response to OBB.

I like to KISS......(keep it simple stupid). The way I see it, there is data that shows that asymptomatic infections are numerous. This is where the problem lies. Those who don't have a clue that they are transmitting this virus to others are the main drivers of this pandemic. There is data that shows that vaccinated people are not likely to become infected therefore are not likely to transmit the virus. There is also data that tells us that vaccinated people, if infected, do not have enough viral load to transmit the virus to others.

So.....with my "KISS" mentality, seems to me that we, as a community, would be much better off if everyone who CAN be vaccinated, GETS vaccinated.

All my opinion, of course.

I absolutely agree that we would be better off if everyone who can be vaccinated, get vaccinated. However, I also accept the reality of the situation: not everyone who can, will. And thanks to politics, not everyone who can, will even acknowledge that it's a good idea. In fact, many who can, and choose not to anyway, will bring up this or that conspiracy regarding microchips under the skin and whatever the current anti-vaxx deal is this week.

People who prefer to opt out of the vaccine - eh. I'm not happy about it, but it's their choice.

People who are vehemently AGAINST the vaccine, and spit froth out their mouths to make sure you know how horrible and evil the vaccines are - need to be removed from society until they can manage the alien infiltration in their brains better.

I am absolutely against government mandated vaccines "just because." Thankfully, the government isn't requiring them "just because." However, I have no problem with "if you're NOT vaccinated, you can't attend public school." I'm fine with "if you're NOT vaccinated, you may not work in the VA hospital." I'm fine with "if you're NOT vaccinated, you may not pass through customs in or out of our country."

You can work for any hospital that doesn't have vaccine requirements, the government has no problem with that. You can fly anywhere that doesn't involve customs. You can send your kid to a private school that doesn't require vaccines, or home-school, or unschool, or get your neighbors together and open a neighborhood cooperative school if that's what floats your boat. The government is staying out of private matters. But if you want to participate in something that the government oversees, then the government gets to make the rules, and you can either abide by them, or choose to do something else instead.

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by stanley

Or worse.......a free thinking American

America has done pretty darn well with a government.

Has not restricted anyones free speech. Works well.

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

Or one of the clueless who carry the banner of "free thinking" while blindly following the cult of conspiracy theorists.

Curious if the spate of conspiracy theories over the years has ever resulted in a real factual conspiracy ?

Heard a rep from Florida spouting the "deep state" as some sort of reason for his trouble with law enforcement.

Always "they are out to get me" and mostly it turns out......no, you broke the law.

[stanley]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

Or one of the clueless who carry the banner of "free thinking" while blindly following the cult of conspiracy theorists.

Ahhh................ I get it now...................no free thinking unless it's your way of thinking............
Read my signithure
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[Bucco]

Originally Posted by stanley

Ahhh................ I get it now...................no free thinking unless it's your way of thinking............
Read my signithure
V
V
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I can be convinced of things.....BY USE OF FACTS. Have heard so many conspiracy theories and again asking....have any ever turned out to be true ?

An strange as it may seem...those conspiracies normally are defensive actions, or meant to replace no knowledge

[stanley]

Originally Posted by Bucco

I can be convinced of things.....BY USE OF FACTS. Have heard so many conspiracy theories and again asking....have any ever turned out to be true ?

The "point" of discussion is free thinking........not conspiracy's. Always changing the subject.

[njbchbum]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

I made my decision based on a combination of science and evidence.

1. CDC recommendations.
2. Having to experience my sister being sick with COVID and wondering if she'd end up in the hospital (she wasn't - she was one of the "lucky" ones who "only" has lasting effects in her lungs because of the virus)
3. Having had vaccines in the past, and being personally comfortable with the concept of getting a vaccine.
4. Recognizing that this is, in fact, a situation where I can play russian roulette with the gun pointed at the rest of the world by NOT ensuring that I'm immune, or I can play russian roulette with the gun pointed at my own temple, and choosing to favor society with an unknown risk to myself. I have to choose either way. I choose to favor society

So you DID make your choice!

[Swoop]

Why should I take a vaccine that that is essentially being field tested now, where no one knows what the potential long term effects may be, when based on my age and health, according to the CDC, if I got Covid, the chances of requiring hospitalization are less than .00035?

[LiverpoolWalrus]

Originally Posted by Eg_cruz

I will not sugar coated my reply.
You want to be a guinea pig have at it. I don’t criticize you that I think your a fool for jumping on the vaccine wagon. I have done my research and made my decision. Who are you to say anything about.

The so call vaccine DOES NOT PREVENT YOU FROM GETTING THE VIRUS NOR FROM SPREADING THE VIRUS

So, a shot that does not prevent nor stop the spread how it going to cause herd immunity?
I choose to stop the spread by my actions I follow the social distance, mask wearing and washing hands. I don’t put myself in risking positions.
So back off with trying to shame people for not walking around Willfully Blind

Another hole in the vaccine defense is that unvaccinated people have an 80-90% chance of having no symptoms or nothing more than mild symptoms IF they get infected. Vaccinated people have a 95% chance of having no symptoms or nothing more than mild symptoms if they get infected. (Source in previous post but this is pretty common knowledge.) Is it worth getting an unapproved vaccine for about a 5% upgrade in your chances of an uneventful outcome?

On the other hand, the vaccine pretty much guarantees a 0% chance of hospitalization or death after infection, according to the vaccine makers. If true, that's a persuasive reason for getting the vaccine. (Unless you think your chances of hospitalization or death are close to zero anyway even if you don't get vaccinated - which appears to be true for most people).

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by Swoop

Why should I take a vaccine that that is essentially being field tested now, where no one knows what the potential long term effects may be, when based on my age and health, according to the CDC, if I got Covid, the chances of requiring hospitalization are less than .00035?

THEN don't....nobody forcing anyone

People talk about individual freedom...how they are being wronged about the vaccine, YET, they seem to be the only folks who take great umbrage at those who feel differently than they. Gaslighting 101

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by Becca9800

Someone asked if the others had spoke w any healthcare workers. I'm a 34-year registered nurse, certified nurse paralegal, and 22-year health care risk manager. I can tell you, the medical professional populace is equally divided on whether or not they will get the C19 vaccine(s). These are equally educated (at minimum, w the basic education required for licensure/certification) professionals. Because you don't agree with their decision should not allow you to consider either side ignorant. Instead, you must recognize that not all these educated, responsible people think alike. You trust them with your lives, but think you know what's best for them personally?

I can tell you that in my 300 bed acute care hospital, every one of the COVID + patients requiring a ventilator had one or more UNCONTROLLED underlying conditions, not one was a healthy adult, w or wo a controlled underlying condition, regardless of their age. My peers, while equally divided, have good rationale for getting or not getting the vaccine. I have researched the issue and I have elected to not get a vaccine despite being high risk (breast CA, fully-controlled insulin-dependent diabetes and coronary artery disease). I have my reasons and they are solid. My husband will take the vaccine. He respects my decision and I respect his.

And yes, our civil liberties are threatened, regardless of what you personally believe, or want to call it. Airlines, concert ticket sellers, cruise lines, football venues etc have already announced they are looking into adopting policy for their vaccinated v non-vaccinated patrons. I will eventually be forced to drive 1100 miles 2x/year when the airline won't sell me a ticket bc I'm not vaccinated. It's coming. Not a conspiracy theory, the bootleggers are already selling fake c19 vaccine cards.

Sorry.....you lost me when you divulged to us that you are high risk for Covid, yet have made the decision not to get vaccinated.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by PNaughton;1935195[B

]If we get vaxxed and still can get it what's the point of getting vaccinated?[/B] An anti vaxxer I know will not get vaxed and says if we all get vaxed he has nothing to worry about. Sort of saying the vaccine works but they won't admit it.

Did you REALLY ask that question?

[Joe C.]

Divide and conquer !!!!

The enemy is doing it quite successfully!!!

[Swoop]

Originally Posted by Bucco

THEN don't....nobody forcing anyone

People talk about individual freedom...how they are being wronged about the vaccine, YET, they seem to be the only folks who take great umbrage at those who feel differently than they. Gaslighting 101

Plenty of people are suggesting that if I don’t get vaccinated, I should be punished. I shouldn’t be allowed to travel, go to theme parks, go on cruises, etc. I don’t care if you are vaccinated or not. If you are high risk, it certainly appears to be a good decision to get the vaccine. But based on my health, the smarter decision for me is to take the known odds vs the unknowns of the vaccine.