[Kelevision]

[QUOTE=Topspinmo;1978893]It’s not known cause nobody bean counting.

I love beans though they do give me gas.

[Kelevision]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

Please provide a link to a reference. I could only find a reference that I provided that said specifically the number was not known but was nothing more than a rumor.

"it is known" is not proof.

I like you!! Hearsay as fact drives me crazy.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by dtennent

The article you referenced deals with patients who have contracted COVID 19, not people who were vaccinated. Can you provide a study that addresses people who have been vaccinated? Furthermore, the article is about computer simulations. While these are useful in designing experiments, they are not proof positive for the conclusion you have drawn.

As for my credentials, I have Ph.D. In chemistry and spent my career in R&D. I have worked with computer modelers to work through scenarios but always counted on the data from actual experiments to draw conclusions.

Another conspiracy theory debunked. Thank you.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by drducat

Someone knows this...What is the difference between the Spike Protein from the actual virus and from the vaccine...anyone?

I'll take a shot........

The spike protein is one component of the virus which allows the virus to attach itself to human cells.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by Topspinmo

It’s coming next week if not before.

Not here in Florida, especially from our governor who has referred to masks as "muzzles". I saw him say that with my own two eyes and my own two ears. What a buffoon!

As an aside...............I don't expect vaccinated people to have to mask up except where it is posted as required but un-vaxxed should be masking at this point when in public indoor spaces everywhere. Pipe dream, I know given the absolute disdain for masking by the anti-vaxxers.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

I feel 100% comfortable in asking everyone I come in contact with, if they've been vaccinated. If they say yes, then I don't have to wear a mask. If they say no, I get to put them on the defense and ask them why not.

If they don't tell me it's because they have allergies/immune disorder that prohibits them from vaccinating, then they can buy me a mask, and I'll wear it in their presence.

If they're not willing to pay for the mask they need me to wear, then THEY can go somewhere else.

If they're medically unable to vaccinate, I'll pull out my own mask and wear it, gladly to protect them.

Anyone who is not able to be vaccinated for medical reasons needs to defend THEMSELVES when in public. THEY should be wearing an N95 mask to protect themselves. They should not be relying on vaccinated people to protect them by wearing a mask. I'm ALREADY protecting them by being vaccinated as I will not spread the virus to anyone with a minimal viral load if I happen to be infected. I am no threat to anyone who protects themselves with an N95 or equivalent mask. Also......those who cannot be vaccinated due to medical issues need to stay home where they can remain safe. Venture out of the house?.......wear an N95 mask.

I'M VACCINATED. That is one of the perks of being vaccinated. I know I'm cannot be a super spreader of this virus.

OBB.....I usually see eye to eye with you but not in this case.

[Swoop]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

You really need to get beyond the 0.007%. The CDC did not claim that as a breakthrough rate, they reported the incomplete data they received (43 states and undercounted) and the result from that data was 0.007%. That data is now several months and 80M vaccinations old.

There are a few things we don't know:
- How many people would test positive if tested today
- How many people who test positive have a coronavirus infection and how many just have a detectable level of whatever the test looks for
- How many people who test positive are carrying enough virus to pass it to someone else

There is likely a large difference between having enough coronavirus in your airway to be detectable by a finely-tuned test and having enough coronavirus to be contagious. If the vaccination is successfully preventing the progression from detectable to contagious then we need to set the bar higher before we use the word "case."

So the CDC, the organization that is supposed to keep us updated on the virus and it’s trends are months behind? The number of breakthrough cases is climbing and yet it is going unreported by the CDC. The fact is, they made the decision to stop reporting the number of breakthrough cases…
One former medical professional on TOTV constantly refers to the CDC’s .007% number when defending the vaccine’s effectiveness. I have never seen you respond to his posts regarding the use of that figure…
We were told since the onset of the virus that you could still spread Covid even if you were asymptotic. That’s why it was so important to wear masks. Because you could have the virus and not know it, and still pass it on to others. So why wouldn’t that hold true for breakthrough cases??…

[justjim]

[QUOTE=Dana1963;1978670]We DON’t NEED NO STINKING MASKS. But Respiratory Ventilators work so much better.
Who would have thought this was going to happen?[/QUE]

If you are unvaccinated and decide to not wear a mask indoors and outdoors among large groups you sure are pushing the envelope toward catching Covid. “Herd immunity”is the goal and is within sight. Science has provided a way out from this pandemic if those that medically can will just do the right thing for the better good and get vaccinated.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Swoop

So the CDC, the organization that is supposed to keep us updated on the virus and it’s trends are months behind? The number of breakthrough cases is climbing and yet it is going unreported by the CDC. The fact is, they made the decision to stop reporting the number of breakthrough cases…
One former medical professional on TOTV constantly refers to the CDC’s .007% number when defending the vaccine’s effectiveness. I have never seen you respond to his posts regarding the use of that figure…
We were told since the onset of the virus that you could still spread Covid even if you were asymptotic. That’s why it was so important to wear masks. Because you could have the virus and not know it, and still pass it on to others. So why wouldn’t that hold true for breakthrough cases??…

I have not yet found a page where the CDC calculates the 0.007% number. The data they provide as of 4/30 is 10,000 cases out of 101M vaccinations or 1:10,000. Their is a difference between reporting an observation at a particular time and demanding that future observations match the first.

The CDC says they have moved on. They stopped reporting positive test results due to the likelihood that the data they were receiving represented an undercount. Their page says they shifted focus to hospitalized and fatal cases to improve accuracy.

"why wouldn't that hold true for breakthrough cases" I am not an epidemiologist or medical professional, I do not play one on tv or in TV, and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. I can read and understand the English language, I can run a calculator, and I can usually make some sort of sense out of multiple sets of data. I don't have an authoritative answer to that question, only my guess.

My guess is that far fewer detectable "infections" are able to take hold and grow in a vaccinated person (detectable in a vaccinated person does not necessarily lead to contagious or symptomatic) though in a small number of cases (6,000 in 160M) they do. If my guess is correct then it makes sense to look for detectable "infections" in unvaccinated people since there is a good chance the infection will continue to grow but not in vaccinated people since there is reason to believe the infection will be stopped. That's my guess, my theory, but we'll have to wait for the right studies to come out to learn whether it happens to be correct.

[Boffin]

[Tim C.]

and Mississippi is the #1 State in terms of rates of obesity. Alabama is #1 in terms of heart disease death rates. and DC has the highest murder rate!!

blah blah blah blah

[tuccillo]

That is not quite correct. Effective May 1, 2021, the CDC switched to identifying and investigating those breakthrough cases that result in hospitalization and death. For the hospitalized and dead, the breakthrough rate is approximately 0.004% (5914 out of 161 million as of July 19, 2021).

The previous reporting period, Jan 1, 2021 to April 30, 2021, was not limited to only hospitalizations and death and saw 10262 breakthrough infections reported out of 101 million vaccinated people. This was a breakthrough rate of 0.01% but is probably undercounted. Approximately 12% of those were hospitalized or died.

COVID-19 Breakthrough Case Investigations and Reporting | CDC

Originally Posted by Swoop

So the CDC, the organization that is supposed to keep us updated on the virus and it’s trends are months behind? The number of breakthrough cases is climbing and yet it is going unreported by the CDC. The fact is, they made the decision to stop reporting the number of breakthrough cases…
One former medical professional on TOTV constantly refers to the CDC’s .007% number when defending the vaccine’s effectiveness. I have never seen you respond to his posts regarding the use of that figure…
We were told since the onset of the virus that you could still spread Covid even if you were asymptotic. That’s why it was so important to wear masks. Because you could have the virus and not know it, and still pass it on to others. So why wouldn’t that hold true for breakthrough cases??…

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by drducat

Best chance of ending the pandemic is by natural immunity according to peer reviewed research.

persisting antibody responses and memory B and T cells

That is not the conclusion of the paper.

[stanley]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

I feel 100% comfortable in asking everyone I come in contact with, if they've been vaccinated. If they say yes, then I don't have to wear a mask. If they say no, I get to put them on the defense and ask them why not.
.

First, if you "ask" me if I've been vaccinated, I will tell you none of your f'n business. You could deduce by that that I have not. Yes, that's what it's coming down to

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

If they don't tell me it's because they have allergies/immune disorder that prohibits them from vaccinating, then they can buy me a mask, and I'll wear it in their presence.

Second, why would "you" need to wear a mask "if" you are vaccinated? Seems like a lot of the "vaccinated" are having doubts about the effectiveness of it. And how exactly would you make someone buy you a mask?

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

If they're not willing to pay for the mask they need me to wear, then THEY can go somewhere else.

Third, how exactly are you going to make "ME" "go somewhere else"?

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

If they're medically unable to vaccinate, I'll pull out my own mask and wear it, gladly to protect them.

And fourth, I refer you to this;

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

If they don't tell me it's because they have allergies/immune disorder that prohibits them from vaccinating, then they can buy me a mask, and I'll wear it in their presence.
.

You make no sense.

[dtennent]

Originally Posted by drducat

Best chance of ending the pandemic is by natural immunity according to peer reviewed research.

persisting antibody responses and memory B and T cells

That is not the conclusion of this paper. It only discussed patients who had mild to moderate response to Covid 19 and the decay of immune system responses to the virus. It did not include anyone who had been vaccinated. In fact the last sentence of the introduction says

"This investigation will also serve as a benchmark for immune memory induced in humans by SARS-CoV-2 vaccines."

Good news is that you have moved to referencing papers instead of press releases. The bad news is that you have extrapolated beyond what their data set allows.