Originally Posted by Bellavita (Post 1997136)

Let’s not forget what we did accomplish 125,000 out that is remarkable. Biden got out period sometimes that exit isn’t pretty.

Originally Posted by I'm Popeye! (Post 1997152)

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 1996850)

Yes they all get the credit for doing all the legwork, the physical work, the strategic planning, logistics, arrangements.

But they wouldn't have done any of it if the President hadn't said "okay let's do that." He could've said no. He made the tough decision to say yes. He's being lambasted for it.

So if you want to give all those people the "credit" for doing it, then you need to accept that certain of the American citizenry are blaming Biden for all the things that went wrong - when - according to you, he didn't do anything at all. It was all those other people who did it all.

Originally Posted by MDLNB (Post 1996648)

True, but there are always contingency plans written in. Even the military members that I know said it is plainly a cluster **** as bad as the assault on Iran way back. Probably going to be worse unless they can pull a rabbit out of their @$$ and pull off a miracle. The way it looks, quite a few will be left behind.

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 1997167)

About a hundred thousand possible terrorists, but who's counting.

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725 (Post 1997203)

The U.S. destroyed or 'demilitarized' all equipment left at Kabul airport, depriving the Taliban of more trophies | The Week

They did make the military equipment unusable for it specific purposes.

Originally Posted by Wyseguy (Post 1996697)

It is either incompetence, or uncaring disregard for the lives of US Citizens and Allies who are being abandoned. Regrettably it seems a cold uncaring disregard. When asked about the people falling to their death from planes as they tried to escape the Taliban, Biden said "C'mon man, that was four or five days ago". I can not be too hard on him, as I believe he has a mental issue. Those who defend him on the other hand... Just terrible people. So desperate to make it seem like they have accomplished something that they turn their backs on men, women and children.

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 1997210)

AT THE AIRPORT. Not all the military equipment. Just the airport.

Originally Posted by Bellavita (Post 1997136)

Sacrifice more young men and women in an in winnable situation? I would make this decision and go back or use leverage to get Americans out. Let’s not forget what we did accomplish 125,000 out that is remarkable. Biden got out period sometimes that exit isn’t pretty.

Originally Posted by alemorkam (Post 1997038)

We left a busload of Americans there that wanted out. Decision of our president AND Joint Chief of Staff.

Originally Posted by MDLNB (Post 1996597)

There is ALWAYS an emergency evacuation plan for Americans in other countries. And there are ways to contact Americans. Most Americans in country are listed at the embassy and a means of contacting them with an evacuation order is known. The problem is that the plan was not utilized properly, if at all. Americans are instructed ahead of time where to meet for evacuation. It appears that this was not done.
Just my opinion, but this is probably an unusual circumstance where the leader of the country flees, leaving the country in the hands of the enemy. Even so, the evacuation plan should have stipulated such a contingency.
And yes the military has a plan written up for just about every foreign country. When civilians/bureaucrats/congress get in the way of set plans, it is inevitable that we have a catastrophe.

Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 1996528)

What is the logic of leaving Americans and Allies behind???

If it's political, just state "political" and let the thread live.

Otherwise, what is the logic???

People first, Equipment second, Troops last seem logical.

:posting:

Originally Posted by alemorkam (Post 1997038)

We left a busload of Americans there that wanted out. Decision of our president AND Joint Chief of Staff. If that bus had 50 marines would they have made the same decision to leave them there?

Originally Posted by Villages Kahuna (Post 1996959)

So much easier said than done. Once we began to withdraw our military and Afghan employees, the “government” we set up and the army we equipped and claimed we had trained began to quickly collapse as the result. Withdrawing before every single person who wanted to be removed from the country was impossible as soon as we lost control of the country and those desiring to leave couldn’t safely gain access to the airport.

The Taliban essentially won the conflict when the terms of our surrender were documented in the Doha Agreement agreed to by president Trump in 2020, then worsened when president Biden announced the specific date when we would leave.

Once our political leaders made those mistakes, the sequence of withdrawal you suggest became impossible. It was amazing that we were able to get as many people safely out of the country as we did. But our failure to fulfill the promises we made to the Afghans who were loyal to us for years won’t be forgotten by those with whom we attempt to make future agreements. Afghanistan will be another important reason why the reliability and consistency of U.S. foreign policy is mistrusted.

Originally Posted by kenoc7 (Post 1997127)

There is no doubt. that it wasn't incompetence. It was the situation overtaking all reasonable contingency planning.

Originally Posted by Bill Dozer (Post 1997283)

Originally Posted by newgirl (Post 1997251)

Nobody has said that they just left anyone there. I believe what I heard from all sources that we are still going to get them out if they want out.
Wish folks listened to facts not entertainers for news.

Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 1997294)

I can't imagine our Military minds came up with this plan.

Originally Posted by Papa_lecki (Post 1996939)

Here’s the article inThe NY Times. They were students at the American University. Most were women.

American University of Kabul Students Trying to Flee Were Sent Home - The New York Times

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 1997314)

According to a tweet by a Qanon spokesperson and "face" for OANN "media" which is an alt-right Qanon sponsored political conspiracy network.

Meanwhile back in reality, there are 7 American women (not 7 busloads of American women) among the busloads of Afghan refugees that the USA will get home to the USA.

It's difficult to do because the Taliban is running the country right now - which they are doing because the previous government tucked tail and ran the second they realized that the USA was going to make them stand up for themselves for the first time in 20 years.

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan (Post 1996628)

The OP implies, my interpretation, that leaving people behind was intentional. I completely disagree with that interpretation,. I believe that decisions were made based on the best advice of top military and state department advisors.

There is NO way after 20 years we were just going to walk away and make a clean break. It has NEVER happened in all the places we have sent our military. It is just reality.

It is very easy to armchair quarterback after the fact. But, I don't accept the "incompetence" argument. People saying that were not there do not know what information was used to make the decision.

Originally Posted by I'm Popeye! (Post 1997304)

And who is going to get them out, we have no Solders, not even an Embassy there.
Listened to, which side of the facts are you talking about?

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC (Post 1997315)

And we did not have a plan on how to do the evacuation if the Afghan army collapsed?
Very sad.

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 1997324)

You know nothing, Jon Snow.


You and I and everyone on this thread know nothing about the plans that were made in advance of the withdrawal. For all we know, this was the BEST possible thing that COULD have happened, and it went flawlessly, according to plan. The only thing we can know for absolute sure:

1. This war started when Bush was President.
2. It continued while Obama was President.
3. trump "negotiated" a deal to withdraw by May and released 5000 Talibans from prison, including the leader who has taken over Afghanistan.
4. Biden met with the various military organizations and departments of our country and came up with *a* plan to withdraw. No singular person made this decision, and there were leaders of these various departments and organizations who have been with these departments and organizations throughout the previous administration, and the current one.

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 1997324)

You know nothing,

trump "negotiated" a deal to withdraw by May and released 5000 Talibans from prison, including the leader who has taken over Afghanistan.
.

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC (Post 1997315)

And we did not have a plan on how to do the evacuation if the Afghan army collapsed?
Very sad.

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC (Post 1997315)

And we did not have a plan on how to do the evacuation if the Afghan army collapsed?
Very sad.

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC (Post 1997315)

And we did not have a plan on how to do the evacuation if the Afghan army collapsed?
Very sad.

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan (Post 1997349)

Why do you assume we did not have a plan? Because it suits your politics? Everything I have heard and read said there was a plan. Plans sometimes go sideways. Even the best of plans.

But, it seems all the "patriots" on here can't wait to assign blame for things the administration is not KNOWN to have done - ie. pull out without a plan.

If you attended the meeting where they said, "lets pull out with out a plan", please let us know when and where that was.