Yup! I'm going to do my part for our country to reach herd immunity. That, to me, is the most patriotic thing anyone can do. Anyone who is able to be vaccinated but chooses not to be vaccinated is not my concern anymore. Sorry.

Those who have to wait for the vaccine will just have to continue to wear masks and social distance themselves from others. That is what I plan to do until I'm vaccinated and immune then, my mask comes OFF for good! I will not ever feel the need to protect others who fail to protect themselves. Those folks who have refused to wear masks since this pandemic began will not be a concern for me anymore. Why should anyone do that once they are immune?

Paraphrasing: "I feel I am safe therefore I will do nothing that inconveniences me. I don't care how it affects others, that's their problem."

You don't even understand how that statement makes you exactly the same as the never-maskers today. Very sad.

I do not agree at all with your paraphrased statement. As I said earlier, I will be assuming some risk by being vaccinated. There are benefits to taking that risk and that is the ability to go back to a normal life. I will be helping this country reach a safe herd immunity. What about this do you not understand?

Get the vaccination or don't get it. Your choice. Same as with the Flu shot, some get it and some don't. There will always be illnesses, some fatal. Once the vaccine is available here, I will take off the mask permanently whether I get the shot or not.

I did read some crazy article where someone said that the gov. was thinking of putting markers in the shot so that others would be able to tell if someone had the vaccination or not. It was to be able to verify the vaccination for travel purposes, etc. The area of the shot would supposedly be visible to the naked eye. Sounds kind of far fetched to me, but knowing how some folks want a gov nanny to protect them, I guess it is not totally impossible to believe that some could come up with something this ridiculous. Just another conspiracy theory, I hope.

You are helping yourself and the country overall by taking the vaccine. Good for you, I will be doing the same.

Where we disagree is your attitude that once YOU are immune you can stop wearing the mask. Even though you might infect those of us less fortunate than you that have to wait longer for the vaccine, YOU are immune so the rest of us can fend for ourselves.

Today there are many people who are either immune or young enough to expect minor symptoms. Using your logic, why should they wear masks? They have already helped their country by becoming immune or they are currently helping their country by attempting to become immune and adding to herd immunity. One of the benefits of taking that risk should be the ability to go back to a normal life. Sure, they can still infect both of us but that is not their problem, they have taken the risk to help their country and now they should get the benefits of taking that risk.

I will understand your position better when you start advocating that anyone that has already had the virus and anyone under 40 can stop wearing masks today.

First of all it is not a vaccine by the traditional terms. It is a bioengineered compound right out of science fiction. It contains a messenger RNA protein that goes into our cells and tells the cells to make a replica strand of the virus that activates our immune system. Bill Gates and other big techies have their hands all over this. There are also some markers that are injected along with the messenger RNA protein to “protect it” We are all being experimented on.

Total Bovine excrement!:ohdear:

Sir/madam. You are misinformed. I completely concur with Two Bills response to this post.

As you have earlier this month told us you will follow the COVID advise given by the Governor of Florida, but not accept the word of the WHO or Dr. Fauci, I present for your edification the words of Mr. DeSantis on whether or not you should accept the mRNA vaccine:
There you have it from your go to authority on Covid control. Get the shot.

Please explain, with links to evidence, what Bill Gates did that may make this vaccine unsafe. Real links to evidence, not just the ravings of people or locker room talk. The outright slander of Mr Gates by people has amazed me. Microchips. No conspiracy theory should be accepted without evidence. Spreading dangerous rumors which may result in deaths is inhuman and perhaps criminal. If people refuse this and other vaccines because they read on the internet that an evil genius is going to control your life with a super secret invisible technology that he will slip into your Covid shot without anyone knowing about it, and then they or their loved ones or even complete strangers become sick and die because we don't get Covid under control. Those who spread such garbage rumors will hopefully answer before their God for those deaths.

Or maybe Gates has bought off DeSantis or already has gotten him microchipped and is controlling him with his PlayStation.

Certainly did not happen overnight and kudos to all the research even before we knew about COVID19.

"How could scientists race out COVID-19 vaccines so fast without cutting corners? A head start helped — over a decade of behind-the-scenes research that had new vaccine technology poised for a challenge just as the coronavirus erupted.

“The speed is a reflection of years of work that went before,” Dr. Anthony Fauci, the top U.S. infectious disease expert, told The Associated Press. “That’s what the public has to understand.”

"Creating vaccines and having results from rigorous studies less than a year after the world discovered a never-before-seen disease is incredible, cutting years off normal development. But the two U.S. frontrunners are made in a way that promises speedier development may become the norm — especially if they prove to work long-term as well as early testing suggests."

Years of research laid groundwork for speedy COVID-19 vaccines | PBS NewsHour

You are assuming that after you are vaccinated you are not going to get Covid and therefore you cannot spread it to others. Wearing a mask as you are well aware is to protect others from your potentially infectious material. If getting the vaccine 100% meant you could not have Covid in your breath droplets then your position of not needing a mask would be justified. However the best vaccine is 95% effective against clinical disease and of unknown but certainly below 100% against sub-clinical disease. So you have a 5% risk of not being protected from Covid even after you complete your shots and additional risk of spreading Covid if you are sub-clinically infected.

That is why people are writing that it is better to continue to wear your mask even after you get your shots until we reach the point when Covid is not widely circulating.

"No conspiracy theory should be accepted without evidence. Spreading dangerous rumors which may result in deaths is inhuman and perhaps criminal."


Sadly, that horse left the barn long ago - in a full gallop. Even more sad, is that it's only getting worse and more horses are bolting every day. Personally, I can't wait until it's my turn in line and if others in front of me want to drop out, I'm certainly not going to expend any effort in changing (as if that were even possible) their gullible minds.

Without the long post to which biker was replying this is a bit confusing, but the earlier post was that in studies they watch for adverse effects in the active as well as placebo group.

Biker you are simultaneously right and wrong. No one knows what the risks might be of a medication or vaccine. So while something that happened long term might be an adverse reaction to the shot the only way to know is to record all events in both groups. This might include obvious things like hives or fever but also things like kidney failure or arthritis or heart attacks. Kidney failure is going to happen in any group you watch over months or years. The question is does it happen significantly more often in the drug group. So yes, the manufacturer watches for all outcomes short and long term in the active and placebo group as that data is needed for comparison and risk assessment.

Only after analysis can it then be said if an outcome is a drug related adverse event or the background expected rate.

I think a Turkish married couple with their own research company in Germany were heavily involved in the discovery of the Pfizer vaccine, or have they already been written out of history?

All I know or care about is that once the vaccination is available here, I will no longer be wearing a mask regardless of what a bunch of so-called experts say on TV. If I still get the virus, I will take precautions to prevent the spread of it. I will worry about it then, but I have no intention of wearing that stupid, practically worthless rag over my face once the vaccine is here. If you don't get the vaccine, do not blame me if you become infected. It's all on you. And if you fear me then stay the heck away from me. If you still find some reason that you feel necessary to approach me, then it is all on you. If you walk in front of a moving car, it is not the operator's fault if you get run over. If you think I am dangerous, it behooves you to stay away. If that is considered uncaring, irresponsible or selfish, that is your problem so don't attempt to make it mine.
So, don't tell me that the vaccination does not protect me from the virus and that I should continue to wear my mask, because I will abstain from getting vaccinated if I am told there is no benefit from the vaccine.

I think you should re read the link I supplied. It is pretty specific about where, who and when.

"But long before COVID-19 was on the radar, the groundwork was laid in large part by two different streams of research, one at the NIH and the other at the University of Pennsylvania — and because scientists had learned a bit about other coronaviruses from prior SARS and MERS outbreaks."

"That was a discovery in 2013, when Graham, deputy director of NIH’s Vaccine Research Center, and colleague Jason McLellan were investigating a decades-old failed vaccine against RSV, a childhood respiratory illness.

"They homed in on the right structure for an RSV protein and learned genetic tweaks that stabilized the protein in the correct shape for vaccine development."

"Likewise, Germany’s BioNTech in 2018 had partnered with New York-based Pfizer to develop a more modern mRNA-based flu vaccine, giving both companies some early knowledge about how to handle the technology.

“This was all brewing. This didn’t come out of nowhere,” said Pfizer’s Dormitze"

"Then at the NIH, Graham woke up on Saturday Jan. 11 to see Chinese scientists had shared the genetic map of the new coronavirus. His team got to work on the right-shaped spike protein. Days later, they sent Moderna that recipe — and the vaccine race was on."

Amazing....this is what these folks do full time and are good at at. Lots of people, many countries, and lots of scientific co operation.

"Among public health experts, there is near-unanimous endorsement of universal mask mandates to shield people from the virus and slow the pandemic.

“The more people who wear a mask, the more the community is protected and therefore the more you individually benefit,” said Dr. John Brooks, chief medical officer of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention’s Covid-19 response program. “It’s like a herd effect.”

Wearing Masks to Prevent Coronavirus: Here'''s What Scientists Know - The New York Times

I was responding to what I believe was confusion by the poster regarding which group gets the vaccine during the clinical trial. It appeared that he was confused about the definition of the control group (the ones who get the placebo).

My only answer is "Covid fatigue". I know that is probably not good enough but at least I have been doing my part since the beginning of this pandemic. There are hosts of people that have not done anything at all to help quell the transmission of this virus.

I live in a retirement community so most everyone in my community will be eligible for vaccination against Covid pretty much in the same time frame. I'm going by that fact that most of my community will have the opportunity to protect themselves from Covid by being inoculated with the vaccine. If there are those folks who will not take the vaccine because they are simply anti-vaxxers, I am not about to worry about protecting them. Sorry if this is an unpopular stance but it is the one I will make once I am immune.

Yes 👍

The "experts" also suggest that you stay home so that you are not exposed to anyone contagious. And if you don't drive a car then you cannot have a car related accident. If you don't ride a bicycle you won't have to worry about a car hitting you on in the street. If you don't fly, they you wont' die in a plane crash. There are a lot of preventive practices out there, but some folks prefer to live rather than just breath in a protective coffin.
I never said the virus was a hoax. I just do not believe that anyone should be forced to wear a mask when they do not wish to. It does not bother me at all that I see those without masks when I wear one in conformance with the rest of the lemmings. I do not feel threatened when I see someone without a mask. I stay away from folks that I do not know and some that I do know. I do not rely on ANYONE else to "protect" me. I take care of myself. Do I believe that a mask helps? Yes, I do. Do I believe the mask prevents anyone with a magic shield from the virus? No, I do not. I believe that a mask is about as good as coughing into your sleeve. I believe that you would have to wear a respirator or gas mask in order to be 99% safe.
I do not believe that wearing a mask makes one patriotic. I do not believe that those that are not wearing a mask care nothing for others. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but many on here are just judging others based on their hysteria and fear. If you fear death that much, you should build a bomb shelter and move into it. Or, at least retreat to your "safe room" and cuddle your teddy bear.
Like everyone else, I have limits to what I will do to survive this thing. And like I said before, I started out wearing gloves, eye protection and a mask. Now, I only wear a mask in stores that have a sign. I do not live by other folks' limits, just my own. My life, my option. I put no one in danger. If someone approaches me, that is on them. It is not my responsibility to protect anyone other than my family. Ever heard of a Trespassing sign? Just consider anyone not wearing a mask as having one of those signs on them. Stay away from them or you are putting yourself in harms way.
The vaccine is on it's way and even after the majority receive theirs, I am willing to bet that there will be those that demand that others continue to wear their masks during flu season, and the next contagious ailment such as colds, etc. Live in fear if you all wish, but I refuse to allow mass hysteria to interfere with my lifestyle. Like it or not, but you do not have to be part of my life, so stay away from me.

I've said the same thing, only with fewer words :thumbup:

I agree with most of what Byte1 posted except, I do not trust that my fellow humans who are not wearing a mask at stores I patronize are "safe". Therefore, I wear a mask any time I am inside an establishment. Common sense.

Here are the EXPERT predictions from the Scientist at Washington State U. - by April vaccines will have saved 25,000 US citizens. That's great! BUT, more frequent mask-wearing could save an additional 56,000.

There are too many people who refuse to wear masks and insist that masks don't work to slow the spread of the virus. How do we deal with that?

I think I asked this somewhere before....after herd immunity and most have been vaccinated that leaves the anti maskers many or most of whom will be anti vaccine....do they become a more vulnerable group with a higher potential to "spread" among themselves?

Information which answers your question.......
Herd immunity - APIC