Talk of The Villages Florida - Condition of greens 6/24/14

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Played Palmer today, fairways in horrible shape. The championship courses have declined in the last two years. Yes, the courses receive much play, but this should not be an issue.

Hopefully this gets taken care of promptly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeod (Post 902133)

I don't know. But I strongly feel that there should be a similar group for them. At first I thought the lack may be because the developer owns all of them whereas the execs are part of the amenities. But all execs below 466 (except for the Pimlico group) are still owned by the developer and our group still evaluates and discusses them.

One of the benefits of our group, IMO, is that we are on the courses regularly, so we can communicate issues we see right away. Even with best intentions, I don't think the pros or GMS hierarchy can cover the courses as completely as the residents. A group of experienced (think greens committee experience) residents for each championship course could mean more eyes looking for areas that need attention. I know our group has great relationships with the pros with oversight of our courses.

FYI Mike, each Champ. course has an advisory group made up of management, maintenance,adjacent homeowners, and players. I believe they meet monthly.

This may seem silly but I have to wonder . . .

I have been on greens where half of the green is horrible and half is okay. WHY put the cup on the side that is horrible?

I realize holes are moved but if the green is in bad condition why not put the flag where it is playable?

Quote:

Originally Posted by ugotme (Post 902684)

I've wondered the same thing. Perhaps the better area is still in the recovery phase and they don't want to set it back. But I'm not good enough to always hit it near the flag, so the entire green gets play anyway. :shrug:

Just wondering! Can a fungus be transferred, from green to green from the mower? And if so, is there a spray they can spray the mower with, after cutting?

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaPaLarry (Post 902899)

Just wondering! Can a fungus be transferred, from green to green from the mower? And if so, is there a spray they can spray the mower with, after cutting?

I don't know about mowers, but it can be transferred on golf shoes from green to green. However, all,the talk about a fungus is just speculation. There are areas on the greens that suggest a disease process, but whether it's fungus or nematodes, or something else, I don't know.

There are, to me, some weird things about the problems. For example, I noted this month at Bogart and Bacall that the greens are terrible, but also that those on the east side of Canal are significantly worse than those west. Why? I also noted that the turf between tee and green looked very good. ??? At first I thought it was because those areas aren't overseeded, but the fairways, which were, looked fairly good.

Conditions at Mallory yesterday were fine. There are areas on the edges of some greens where the grass is being killed by something (probably fungus, but who knows), but the bad spots are being treated. There is a green colored substance, which to me looks like a treatment powder, covering the damaged areas. Other than that, I found Mallory (Caroline to Virginia) to play just fine. Not perfect, but good enough for me to have a great day on the golf course.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan (Post 901194)

Just received this response from the golf administration:::

Thanks for taking the time to share your concerns and thoughts. What we are experiencing (and we are frustrated as well) is a more intense and prolonged transition period than normal. May and June will always be challenging months with transition, followed by aerfication, but this year in particular, it�s been more challenging than any we can remember. Our contractors are working diligently to return all the courses to acceptable condition ASAP, several have already made it back, and the others are well on their way. I can assure you that accountability is in full measure with our contractors. Good news, this should all be behind us soon. We appreciate your patience and support, and certainly understand your frustration and concern.

:bigbow:Hats off to you and Russ Boston. Your reply from golf admin was the same I received last month. He stated that we shouldn't expect major improvements any time soon. I, as well as others I golf with regularly, noticed poorer conditions this year and they appeared very quickly. I've had a belief that reclaimed water used in irrigation contains disease qualities that flourish in hot weather. Whatever the problem(s) are the admin. claims they can't identify anything specific. I have a problem with that assertion. They cannot convince me that if scientific samples are taken from multiple sources i.e. water, turf, soil, etc. that experts such as at the Univ. of Florida Extension could not identify problems. Perhaps even the over seed material used in the fall should be examined. Of course, the biggest problem I have is that the permanent residents of The Villages are left with closed courses and poor conditions in the summer and our seasonal residents play in better conditions in fall and winter with ALL courses open.:spoken:

Played Hacienda today. The greens are hideous, dying. Played Palmer two days ago, fairways are in terrible shape too.

What's going on?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeod (Post 902079)

There are some posters that feel golf administration does not care about the course conditions because we are a captive audience. I'd like to give my experience.

For the last five years, I've been a member of a resident group that meets quarterly with representatives of GMS, and the Director of Executive Golf Maintenance. At those meetings, we report on our evaluation of course conditions, and suggest improvements to the courses or procedures. Our reports are also sent to the facility managers responsible.

During my time with the group, we have seen several maintenance companies lose their contract or have it not renewed because of issues. At the same time, we have seen companies that produced good results get more contracts and/or more courses to handle. So these companies are required to produce results or risk losing out. With regard to the current problems, I received a response to my evaluation of the sorry state of Bogart and Bacall that indicated the contractor has even reached out to national experts for help. Since in April, these courses were graded as excellent, and I don't believe the contractor has forgotten how to maintain a course, there is something else going on. Some greens display the signs of disease, rather than just poorly growing grass.

At all our meetings, I have found these people to be engaged in the conversations, receptive to our comments, and follow through on our suggestions. As an example, the district is discussing waiving the spectator fee for the executive courses, a suggestion we brought up in April.

I cannot agree that these people don't care. My experience is the opposite. BTW, if you ever find Eric Van Gorder in his office, I would be shocked. And you may find Erik Greulach touring almost any championship or executive course every week. A claim that they sit in the office all day is not factual.

:undecided:In what ways have the contractors "reached out" to national experts and who are these experts? One can reach out very far but they need to make an actual connection on the other end. There are experts at the Univ. of Florida Agriculture Extension who may be able to determine what these problems are. Has anyone thought to take multiple samples of soil, turf, irrigation water, seeding, etc. to send for scientific analysis? If not, then they are NOT doing all they can to get these problems controlled. There is no way to convince myself and others that specific scientific issues cannot be identified. I have corresponded with Eric recently and he offered to meet to discuss these problems which I commend him for. However, meeting and discussing with your group has not produced positive results.:evil6:

[QUOTE=djl8412; I have corresponded with Eric recently and he offered to meet to discuss these problems which I commend him for. However, meeting and discussing with your group has not produced positive results.:evil6:[/QUOTE]

Did you meet with Eric? What did he say?

Our group meets quarterly. At the last meeting (April) there was no problem with conditions. Our next meeting is Thursday. We will discuss what is going on and what is being done. I reiterate, from my work with these people I can safely say that no one is happy or satisfied with these conditions. But there is no magic treatment that will suddenly grow grass.

Just finished playing Cane Garden . I was asking the starter before we teed off on Hibiscus how the course was & he said great!! I don't like calling people liars but his words were untrue. The fairways were very good but the greens wer a 2 on Hibiscus & 2.5 just a tad better on Jacarnda

I just got back from a party where people were discussing the condition of the golf courses in The Villages. Everyone agreed that the conditions overall are poor. Cane was one of those courses that should be avoided as it is not good right now. They were saying Mallory is good right now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by djl8412 (Post 903045)

Samples of the soil and grass and water have been sent to Univ. of Florida, it is a problem that they are tying to correct.