Daily Sun article about "whole" grains

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Old 03-22-2013, 11:02 AM
Villages PL Villages PL is offline
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In today's Daily Sun (Friday, p.5) there's a column: "Increase whole grains in your diet with MyPlate."

First paragraph - question: "What are whole grains."

The answer given, in part: Whole-wheat flour, and cerials, breads, crackers, and pasta, (all made with whole wheat flour).

I'm sorry, but it's just not true. If you take whole grain and grind it into a fine flour, it's not whole anymore. What could be more obvious than that? By law, it can be called "whole grain", meaning that nothing has been removed. But, again, it's obviously not whole if it has been ground into flour. Therefore, any products made with flour are not whole either, they are highly processed.

"So what", you may ask? Your digestive system knows the difference because products made from flour get absorbed faster. To the extent that you consume these products, you may likely have a faster rise in blood sugar and a resulting faster rise in insulin. You could become insulin-resistant, gain weight and become pre-diabetic or diabetic.

So, beware: "Healthier" does not always mean "healthy". What it means in this case is "good marketing"; as I said last week, MyPlate is more about marketing U.S. agricultural products than it is about health.
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Old 03-22-2013, 11:59 AM
ilovetv ilovetv is offline
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To most of us, "whole grain" means that a physical process--like crushing or grinding--has not removed any of the nutrients contained in the entire grain seed.


"Following is the official definition of whole grains, approved and endorsed by the Whole Grains Council in May 2004:

Whole grains or foods made from them contain all the essential parts and naturally-occurring nutrients of the entire grain seed. If the grain has been processed (e.g., cracked, crushed, rolled, extruded, and/or cooked), the food product should deliver approximately the same rich balance of nutrients that are found in the original grain seed.

This definition means that 100% of the original kernel all of the bran, germ, and endosperm must be present to qualify as a whole grain."

Definition of Whole Grains | The Whole Grains Council
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Old 03-22-2013, 12:41 PM
Villages PL Villages PL is offline
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Originally Posted by ilovetv View Post
To most of us, "whole grain" means that a physical process--like crushing or grinding--has not removed any of the nutrients contained in the entire grain seed.


"Following is the official definition of whole grains, approved and endorsed by the Whole Grains Council in May 2004:

Whole grains or foods made from them contain all the essential parts and naturally-occurring nutrients of the entire grain seed. If the grain has been processed (e.g., cracked, crushed, rolled, extruded, and/or cooked), the food product should deliver approximately the same rich balance of nutrients that are found in the original grain seed.

This definition means that 100% of the original kernel – all of the bran, germ, and endosperm – must be present to qualify as a whole grain."

Definition of Whole Grains | The Whole Grains Council
Your post was not necessary because I mentioned that in my opening post. If you will go back and reread it you will find it. I said that by law they can call it "whole grain" because nothing has been removed. So grinding is not a question of losing nutrition. Did my opening post say anything about losing nutrition? No.

The main point of the whole thread that you missed was the way in which flour-based products get absorbed into your system. They get absorbed faster and thereby are likely to raise blood sugar and insulin. This in turn can bring on a whole host of health issues.
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Old 03-22-2013, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Villages PL View Post
...If you take whole grain and grind it into a fine flour, it's not whole anymore. What could be more obvious than that?...
I'm no expert, and what you say MAY be true, but I don't see that it's so obvious. Something can be ground and still contain all of its original components. Wouldn't that mean it is still whole grain?
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Old 03-23-2013, 02:21 PM
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I'm no expert, and what you say MAY be true, but I don't see that it's so obvious. Something can be ground and still contain all of its original components. Wouldn't that mean it is still whole grain?
Yes, it is whole in the sense that it's all there. But the fact that something is all there doesn't mean that it's there in the best possible form for promoting good health. That's because it isn't absorbed slowly into your system as nature intended.
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Old 03-23-2013, 05:19 PM
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...But the fact that something is all there doesn't mean that it's there in the best possible form for promoting good health...
Possibly. But it's this statement that I take issue with...
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Originally Posted by Villages PL View Post
... If you take whole grain and grind it into a fine flour, it's not whole anymore. What could be more obvious than that?...
Not obvious at all. If it's all there, it's still whole grain. Your statement is not only not obvious, it's not even true.
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Old 03-26-2013, 11:34 AM
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Possibly. But it's this statement that I take issue with...


Not obvious at all. If it's all there, it's still whole grain. Your statement is not only not obvious, it's not even true.
If a brain surgeon removed your brain, dried it, ground it into a powder, and then put the powder back into your head, to what extent would you still be "all there"? There would be nothing missing (just add water) but you would cease to be functional. Would you still be a whole person?

Take a book and grind it ito a powder. Can you read it in powder form? No. What has changed? It no longer functions as a book. Is it still a whole book?

If I could take your car and grind it into a powder, would you be satisfied that you still own a whole car?

So we're talking about how something functions when you change its form. Whole (unprocessed) grain (like whole wheat berries) takes longer to digest and thus tends to keep your blood sugar (and insulin) steady, rather than spiking. So it's less likely to cause health issues and your hunger is more likely to be satisfied for a longer period of time.

Last edited by Villages PL; 03-26-2013 at 02:01 PM.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Villages PL View Post
If a brain surgeon removed your brain, dried it, ground it into a powder, and then put the powder back into your head, to what extent would you still be "all there"? There would be nothing missing (just add water) but you would cease to be functional. Would you still be a whole person?

Take a book and grind it ito a powder. Can you read it in powder form? No. What has changed? It no longer functions as a book. Is it still a whole book?

If I could take your car and grind it into a powder, would you be satisfied that you still own a whole car?

So we're talking about how something functions when you change its form. Whole (unprocessed) grain (like whole wheat berries) takes longer to digest and thus tends to keep your blood sugar (and insulin) steady, rather than spiking. So your hunger is more likely to be satisfied for a longer period of time.
Please do not try to get on my debate team.

Is Applesauce good for you?

Is Pureed Pumpkin good for you?

Is Cut up lettuce good for you?

Are green beans better for you in one piece?

Is the whole greater than the sum of it's parts?

Can a girl from a small mining town in the West find happiness with a wealthy and titled Englishman?
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Old 03-26-2013, 01:10 PM
Villages PL Villages PL is offline
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Please do not try to get on my debate team.

Is Applesauce good for you?

Is Pureed Pumpkin good for you?

Is Cut up lettuce good for you?

Are green beans better for you in one piece?

Is the whole greater than the sum of it's parts?

Can a girl from a small mining town in the West find happiness with a wealthy and titled Englishman?
Don't worry, I won't try to get on your debating team. First of all, you would need to explain what your examples prove. For example, you would need to explain how applesauce functions as well, nutritionally, as a whole apple. You haven't done that.
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Old 03-26-2013, 02:06 PM
Cantwaittoarrive Cantwaittoarrive is offline
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Originally Posted by Villages PL View Post
If a brain surgeon removed your brain, dried it, ground it into a powder, and then put the powder back into your head, to what extent would you still be "all there"? There would be nothing missing (just add water) but you would cease to be functional. Would you still be a whole person?

Take a book and grind it ito a powder. Can you read it in powder form? No. What has changed? It no longer functions as a book. Is it still a whole book?

If I could take your car and grind it into a powder, would you be satisfied that you still own a whole car?

So we're talking about how something functions when you change its form. Whole (unprocessed) grain (like whole wheat berries) takes longer to digest and thus tends to keep your blood sugar (and insulin) steady, rather than spiking. So your hunger is more likely to be satisfied for a longer period of time.
It depends on what you mean by "all there" you would still have the entire contents of your brain so yes you would be "all there" as far as 100% of your brain, just maybe not 100% brain power but you didn't ask that! Same with the car you would still own a "whole car" just in a different form. As far as how something functions when you change forms it depends on what the function is that you are looking for the item to perform. For example water is just as powerful if you change the form into steam it can be used for many different purposes like powering an engine, heating an area, cleaning and etc. or in it's frozen form it can cool other substances and move larger heavier objects and so many other uses. Certainly we could go on and on. Just because something changes form doesn't mean it's not the same or even better depends on the use. Even if you want to talk "whole grain" what if someone is in diabetic shock and needs to raise their blood sugar quickly? then ground "whole grain" would be healthier for them at that moment then unchanged "whole grain". Always dangerous when you don't explore all options and just jump to conclusions.
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Old 03-26-2013, 02:33 PM
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Folks - Villages Pl is absolutely correct. Once you strip the grain it no longer functions as it was intended to and does affect your blood sugar. For some not an issue, but for those with glucose intolerance very important. Won't kill you, but will certainly not aid in a weight reduction plan.
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