[CFrance]

se

Originally Posted by outlaw

Why would a parent with a child that has a compromised immune system let their child go to a public school with all the colds, flu, etc always going around?

If a child cannot be vaccinated for medical reasons, are you saying they should also not be allowed to go to public school?

The point is that if everyone is vaccinated, the child with the compromised immune system would not be open to catching devastating diseases.

[Mikeod]

Originally Posted by outlaw

Why would a parent with a child that has a compromised immune system let their child go to a public school with all the colds, flu, etc always going around?

If a child cannot be vaccinated for medical reasons, are you saying they should also not be allowed to go to public school?

No, I believe that post is saying that parents with children who cannot be vaccinated against childhood illnesses for medical reasons already have a risk sending the child to school. They should not have that risk increased by people who choose to not vaccinate their children for whatever reason. There are some things we have to do for the common welfare.

[outlaw]

Originally Posted by CFrance

se
The point is that if everyone is vaccinated, the child with the compromised immune system would not be open to catching devastating diseases.

But if you allowed these special cases to attend school then everyone would not be vaccinated. It seems no one has a good answer as to why a non vaccinated kid would pose a material threat to a vaccinated kid.

[CFrance]

Originally Posted by outlaw

But if you allowed these special cases to attend school then everyone would not be vaccinated. It seems no one has a good answer as to why a non vaccinated kid would pose a material threat to a vaccinated kid.

The vaccine takes a while to be effective, and in some cases does not work. So some vaccinated children are at risk from eing around the unvaccinated. Measels had been eradicated before this, with only a scattering of cases. Now it is escalating due to the fact that there are so many people not vaccinating their children. What's to keep the disease from mutating into something stronger that the vaccinations can't prevent?

It just doesn't make sense to me to allow a controllable disease to gain a foothold. Nothing good can come of it.

[dbussone]

Originally Posted by CFrance

The vaccine takes a while to be effective, and in some cases does not work. So some vaccinated children are at risk from eing around the unvaccinated. Measels had been eradicated before this, with only a scattering of cases. Now it is escalating due to the fact that there are so many people not vaccinating their children. What's to keep the disease from mutating into something stronger that the vaccinations can't prevent?

It just doesn't make sense to me to allow a controllable disease to gain a foothold. Nothing good can come of it.

Quite correct. And the majority of those not vaccinating are doing so based on bad science. The pediatrician who initiated this idiotic trend in the UK is now an embarrassed liar and a joke in the scientific community. His data was falsified and those who believed him are endangering their children and others.

[blueash]

Originally Posted by outlaw

But if you allowed these special cases to attend school then everyone would not be vaccinated. It seems no one has a good answer as to why a non vaccinated kid would pose a material threat to a vaccinated kid.

I don't know if you are serious in that posting, but I will answer it as if you don't already know the reasons.

No vaccine is 100% effective in producing protection. Some are 99+ % and some are in the 70% range (whooping cough). There are some vaccines that require a series of shots each one re-exposing the patient to a piece of the disease organism to get the body to increasingly respond with anti-bodies and T-cells which will be available should there be a future attack by the actual disease. Over time for some vaccines this immune system preparedness wanes and needs to be boosted. You should be receiving a tetanus booster every 10 years.

Even in a fully vaccinated person it is entirely possible that they are not fully protected as there may have been a sub-adequate response to the vaccine, the vaccine may have been administered incorrectly (given IM when it should have been subQ or vice versa, improperly stored or shipped etc.)

There are also what you derisively call special cases which I don't see as special but fully expected and predictable. There will be in a school not only children who did not get immunity when they were vaccinated, but children who are immunosuppressed either through new illness or medication. Every school has kids on chemo. Every school has kids on immunosuppressants for illnesses. Every community has children too young to have been even offered vaccines.

Read about the measles outbreak in Calif that is continuing to spread and note that a small percentage of those who have become ill were vaccine recipients. So absolutely, non-vaccinated people are a risk both to those who also have not been vaccinated and to those who have been vaccinated. And that is everyone.

[CFrance]

Thanks for the complete explanation, blue ash.

I'll add an anecdotal tidbit to that. During an outbreak of mumps in the NHL, Pittsburgh Penguin Sydney Crosby's contracted them despite having had a vaccination as a child plus a booster.

Of course, a team locker room is a great breeding ground for germs, as would be school gym locker rooms.

[Bonnevie]

Originally Posted by outlaw

But if you allowed these special cases to attend school then everyone would not be vaccinated. It seems no one has a good answer as to why a non vaccinated kid would pose a material threat to a vaccinated kid.

well, the measles virus is very contagious and can last on surfaces for 2 hours. so, say an unvaccinated kid is coming down with it and sneezes on little Johnny right before school ends and Johnny has an infant sibling (too young for vaccination) at home, or one undergoing chemotherapy and loves to hug little Johnny when he comes home and comes down with measles.

as to colds and flu...well the flu shot is recommended for all children and if they ever had a cold vaccine I'd be the first in line to get it.

everyone is entitled to their opinion, but for the articles the OP referenced, please put the topic in google and read other sources before believing them. a scientific article explains that many of China's measles cases are in children too young for the vaccine, there's poor reporting of vaccinations in some cases, so there may be less coverage than reported.

[Villages PL]

There was an article in the Friday Daily Sun: "Q-and-A: Why You Should, and Shouldn't, Worry About Measles"

The last question asked if adults need shots. The answer was "most likely not."

The article states if you were born before 1957 you should be immune because measles was widespread and most kids had it. Those who got vaccinated are ok because they are protected for life.

Those who are not sure whether they were vaccinated or not can get the shots now.

I remember as a kid getting vaccinated when I started school at about 5 years old. But I have no idea if it was for measles or something else. And I don't remember having measles or anyone in my family having measles. I'm sure I would have remembered if I had blotches all over my body.

Wouldn't it be a good idea for me to get vaccinated, just to play it safe? Is it a two step process? One shot now and another one later?

[rubicon]

Originally Posted by sunnyatlast

They prefer to listen to the boob tube celebs and former Playboy Playmates and Oprah and The View who give them an instant audience of millions of people who do not read from sources like National Institutes of Health or Centers for Disase Control…….

Jenny McCarthy: anti-vaxxer, public menace - LA Times

sunnyatlast: Not even my smoke alarm going off could get me out of the house as fast as my wife tuning into "The View" Talk shows like this are antithesis to anything remotely termed informational so your term "boob tube is quite appropriate

[rubicon]

Clearly it is obvious that one should not take as faith what a person says just because s/he wears a white lab coat. Conversely the old saw "He who doctors himself has a fool for a patient" and those who intentionally hold back vaccinating their kids without exploring both sides.

Often medical products or procedures take years before an identifying pattern emerges . However vaccinating for childhood diseases has been ongoing for a very long time

[Villages PL]

Originally Posted by lightworker888

I was hesitant to share this but felt the need to let those who are of like mind, know that there is lots of evidence to use other avenues of health support. Like I have always felt, if I had a broken bone, I would head to the ER. However, this article really supports many of the decisions I have made over the years regarding how to handle health concerns in the family. I was fortunate to have a paediatrician who was in charge of disease control at Sick Kids, and he always waited until there was more symptoms before prescribing anything drug related, so my kids didn't have the antibiotic approach that was fairly common at that time.

Over the years, I have studied many alternative approaches to health, both Eastern and Western and in our practice we have seen children who have been negatively affected, some very severely, by vaccinations and other medical interventions. I don't mean to throw the baby out with the bath, but I do think it is prudent for anyone to research and learn for themselves what alternatives are available, if you have the time to do that and are not in crisis.

Like most things, it is better to do your research before you need the help, so you can make as informed a choice as possible, if need be. For us, it has become a lifestyle choice and hopefully it will help us to live out our golden years with more vitality and good health.

Wishing that for everyone.

LW888

Breaking

Too bad that not much has been said about your link which I found extremely interesting. I never seem to make the time for it to do it justice.
Hopefully, I'll make some time for it later today.

[Madelaine Amee]

The Villages Daily Sun, Feb 12, Local News Section Page C11 gives an excellent and concise explanation of Measles, Vaccines and Autism. Well worth reading.