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-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Developer’s largest income stream (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/developers-largest-income-stream-351839/)

Papa_lecki 08-02-2024 12:11 PM

Developer’s largest income stream
 
With the talk of Spanish Springs, it got me thinking, where do you think the Developer generates more income?

Commercial Real Estate Landlord or
Home Developer?

Bill14564 08-02-2024 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa_lecki (Post 2355537)
With the talk of Spanish Springs, it got me thinking, where do you think the Developer generates more income?

Commercial Real Estate Landlord or
Home Developer?

Interesting question.

As a Home Developer he earns profit on approximately 250 sales each month. I have to believe the profit on a single home sale is significantly more than the lease for a single commercial property. Could he own enough commercial property (some multiple of 250 units) to overcome that difference?

pauld315 08-03-2024 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2355543)
Interesting question.

As a Home Developer he earns profit on approximately 250 sales each month. I have to believe the profit on a single home sale is significantly more than the lease for a single commercial property. Could he own enough commercial property (some multiple of 250 units) to overcome that difference?

Last I saw, they own over 7 million square feet of commercial property. Commercial property leases are their biggest source of revenue by far.

Bill14564 08-03-2024 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauld315 (Post 2355829)
Last I saw, they own over 7 million square feet of commercial property. Commercial property leases are their biggest source of revenue by far.

So some WAGs on numbers:

Commercial: 7,000,000sqft * $30/sqftyr = $200M/yr
Development: 3,000homes/yr * $400,000/home * 15%profit = $180M/yr

Using those guesses, commercial wins but certainly not "by far."

gego3650 08-03-2024 09:27 AM

no facts just guessing

Bill14564 08-03-2024 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gego3650 (Post 2355850)
no facts just guessing

Yeah, I thought about asking them to show me their books but didn't think I would get very far.

Lacking that, the only information is the number of new homes as reported by Sumter County in their annual budget letter, the number of square feet of commercial space as reported by the Villages in their advertising material, a high average of retail space rent across the country, and a high average of developer profit on new home sales.

BrianL99 08-03-2024 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pauld315 (Post 2355829)
Last I saw, they own over 7 million square feet of commercial property. Commercial property leases are their biggest source of revenue by far.

Just a wild guess, but if the Developer sells 3000 homes per year and owns 7,000,000 of commercial space, I'd say his single family home sales generate double the profit of his commercial space. $300M vs $150M.

CoachKandSportsguy 08-03-2024 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2355844)
So some WAGs on numbers:

Commercial: 7,000,000sqft * $30/sqftyr = $200M/yr
Development: 3,000homes/yr * $400,000/home * 15%profit = $180M/yr

Using those guesses, commercial wins but certainly not "by far."

Agree, and potentially the dev 15% is a bit low, being in a monopoly market.
I would use 20% because of the monopolistic backdrop. .

good finance estimates though

Kenswing 08-03-2024 09:54 AM

If you add the actual businesses that Developer owns to the commercial side I think it might tilt it in that direction. Don’t forget, the Developer owns Villages Health, Citizens First Bank, the golf cart stores, the title company, the Championship golf courses and clubhouse restaurants. They still own the majority of the amenities below 44. I’m sure they have a lot more stuff that I haven’t mentioned. One thing for sure is that the residential feeds the commercial.

BrianL99 08-03-2024 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy (Post 2355859)
Agree, and potentially the dev 15% is a bit low, being in a monopoly market.
I would use 20% because of the monopolistic backdrop. .

good finance estimates though

Home estimates are low, IMO.

The Developer is earning a "developers profit", a "builders profit" and a "sales commission". More likely, closer to 20%-23% in total ... perhaps higher.

For Commercial Space, I used a blended rate of $23/sq. ft. net. I could be off on that.

Normal 08-03-2024 11:12 AM

Citizens First
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa_lecki (Post 2355537)
With the talk of Spanish Springs, it got me thinking, where do you think the Developer generates more income?

Commercial Real Estate Landlord or
Home Developer?

It’s the bank.

Altavia 08-03-2024 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy (Post 2355859)
Agree, and potentially the dev 15% is a bit low, being in a monopoly market.
I would use 20% because of the monopolistic backdrop. .

good finance estimates though

Especially since profit on view lots will be considerably higher.

justjim 08-03-2024 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2355844)
So some WAGs on numbers:

Commercial: 7,000,000sqft * $30/sqftyr = $200M/yr
Development: 3,000homes/yr * $400,000/home * 15%profit = $180M/yr

Using those guesses, commercial wins but certainly not "by far."

As reported by Forbes, the Developers are Billionaires but most would say they earned it! Frankly, only they know where the “most” profit comes from. Anything else is anybody’s guess.

Topspinmo 08-03-2024 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gego3650 (Post 2355850)
no facts just guessing


My guess is sales, diverting costs, and control amenities/impact frees. :Screen_of_Death:

PersonOfInterest 08-04-2024 05:11 AM

Trail Fees and Amenity Fees.


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