Another Mass Shooting
 

Very few actual details, on who/why/what was used.

Although limited info as of now, Police Chief says..."long-time employee." :(

My confidence is very low that this will cause even a ripple in our society; it has ceased to do so. We simply accept it every time, send thoughts and prayers and change nothing. And now, our society does not even discuss doing anything.

What has changed in our society that people now think shooting a group of people is the answer to their problems or is the avenue for revenge?

I know people are going to take their usual positions about guns but we've always had guns. We haven't always had this number of mass shootings. What has changed?

You are correct. We have become a hate filled society, where it is now normal NOT to express what we believe in, but only to insure we identify those we hate.

I am not anti gun, but I resent the thinking that being macho is an answer. That seems to be the prevailing mood now, and frankly it will worsen...our individual psyches cannot take hate day in and day out. We are being "taught" and shown by examples each day that we should "fight fire with fire" and playing a victim is acceptable.

You mentioned young people and that is for another thread, but in any case, if you simply bring up disgust at shootings, you are assured you will be assailed and told guns don't kill people....somebody once asked...then why do killers have them ?

I have no idea of this particular motive, but you must be filled with hate to even contemplate action like this

Get people reading more books than playing video games and the like. Books usually create empathy with other people which is something that seems to be eroding in our culture. It is harder I expect to shoot someone whom you see as a person like yourself. And I believe this is drawn out in how the military used to dehumanize various "enemies' through the use of propaganda which describes other people in the most banal of ways.

:agree:


The current depth of hate and the 'acceptance' of it by a lot of people...needs to stop.

And that's not going to happen with just..."thoughts and prayers." :oops:

I also believe the easy access to firearms...plays a role in these horrific incidents.

While I won't speculate as to what type(s) of weapon(s) he used, I would be willing to bet that he brought plenty of ammo (even if it was a handgun)...and he wasn't using a 6-shot revolver that took time to reload.

I absolutely agree that we have become a hate filled society. But again, why? What is perpetrating this?

How can you be taught to fight fire with fire and that being a victim is acceptable? It would seem counter intuitive.

I believe everyone should be outraged at these shootings. But I'll place my outrage with the shooter.

Not sure where I mentioned young people but this problem does seem to affect the young more prevalently than an older demographic. What are the influences that make this generation go this route? Is it lead by example? Is it that they've been raised with more violence in their lives? Violent video games and media? I just want to know what is causing this.

Violent video games and media certainly play a big part, that and the ease of getting a gun. "So easy a caveman could do it"

If you watch the news or the happenings in our country, even from afar, you see nothing but hate speak. Saying what you might endorse or believe in, will bring a torrent of high profile attacks at your sheer existence.

80 years on this planet....lived through a lot....never experienced such venom, to the point where I, a news junkie, hides from the latest but you cannot escape it.

I fought for this country and what it stood for and I want that feeling again.

And while I understand your outrage at the shooter, and understand, even you are asking the right question about where this comes from....THAT, to me is the MAJOR contributor

I agree but how do you change something that big? First we need to know how it got that way before we can figure out how to reverse it.

Quote:

And that's not going to happen with just..."thoughts and prayers." :oops: I also believe the easy access to firearms...plays a role in these horrific incidents.

It very well may be. But guns have never really been hard to get. Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws in the country and they had 43 shootings over the Memorial Day weekend. But no outcry about that. As Bucco eluded, we've pretty much become numb to the violence.

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While I won't speculate as to what type(s) of weapon(s) he used, I would be willing to bet that he brought plenty of ammo (even if it was a handgun)...and he wasn't using a 6-shot revolver that took time to reload.

I agree. It probably wasn't a revolver.

Yep, :agree:...COMPLETELY! ;)

I assume your comment on happenings and the news has to do with what is going on today, but how does that explain the Columbine school shooting in 1999 and all the shootings that have happened between then and now?

Was not meant to explain any shooting. I was responding to a question,....direct question, which had nothing to do with school shootings at all.

CONTEXT

It seems he was a long time utility company employee who went postal.

More shall be revealed but I wonder if there were any early warning indicators or whether he suddenly just flipped out.

Oh please. I've been playing violent video and RPG games since Zork when I killed my first grue, and I haven't ever given a moment's thought to owning, let alone using, a firearm.

Millions of people play video games and RPGs and don't go out and kill people. There are also people who kill other people, who don't play violent video games. And you forgot the whole "oh they listen to death metal" rhetoric.

That's stuff and nonsense, propaganda created by the NRA to put the blame on anything except where it belongs: on lack of enforcement of existing gun laws, and gun laws that are not universal, thus allowing anyone to get a gun simply by crossing state lines.

Still doesn't explain why people are doing this. Gun laws or no gun laws. People are committing mass murder which is much more serious than violating a gun law. The law of not murdering people is pretty basic and fundamental.

I picked up a snippet while I was changing radio stations in the car today.
The person who was being interviewed (?) was saying that very often the person who commits this type of killing is suicidal.
They go into their old workplace and start shooting up anyone in their path.
They are angry and just don't care.

It's sad -- very, very sad.

This is so true. Video games are mostly killing, whether guns, knives, cannons, etc. Just killing something sells. TV is soooo full of violence, then the actors protest guns, hypocrites.

So sad

Simply not true. And not as easy as you make it sound.
Steve

I know many gun owners. Their weapons are locked up or in hiding and only come out when they go to the range, for cleaning or on the very rare occasion when they're needed for protection of themselves or someone else. As for the mass shootings school, workplace or other events I'd suspect these people have some sort of mental issue or have been abused either physically or mentally and figure this is the best way to handle or deal with the problem. Not right by any means but certainly in their mind it is. Made fun of at school, stepped on or over on a job, or ridiculed by friends. I'll show them attitude. Agree it's sad what's happening but it's the person behind the weapon be it a car, gun, bomb,fire or whatever.

Certainly think we need tougher guns and much more intelligent handling of restrictions on who can get a gun with a very heavy emphasis on context. The FACTS of each case should be the guide and not some bureaucratic check-list. People are too quick to seek simplistic answers that make good bumper stickers.

Will be interesting to see the details of the shooter in this case. Each seems to be different from the next.

The daily training of society to accept/embrace/approve violence is proven day in and day out.
Just look at the movie line up on Netflix or Amazon and others.....mostly violence based "entertainment" and more often than not utilizing guns in one form or another.

There is no control anymore who is allowed to watch what or not. Young children are growing up conditioned to seeing murder and mayhem in their games and movies. Beheading, disemboweling, rampaging killing are all in front of our society every single day.

Human behavior has been changed by these events. Tolerances for murder and mayhem are acceptable "entertainment". There is nothing left to the imagination anymore.

If it bleeds it leads is more true today than ever before. To say it has no effect on the attitudes, outlook and behavior of our society is missing the major contributor to what is now acceptable in our lives.

The Bible and Homer's The Iliad are some of the most violent books I have ever read as are some of the movies based on these.

There would be a great deal more violence in our society though if there was much cause-and-effect between watching very gory movies and taking a gun or some other weapon and murdering people.

Saving Private Ryan are other such very realistic movies might actually work against contemplating such behavior. These do get you to care about the characters in the dramas.

Game of Thrones is very violent but you became very drawn into the heroes, villains, and how they interacted.

////////

:pray:




So many people lives effected.

:bigbow:
Amen to that Tal, best response ever. There are always many sides to each issue and many facts to support each side.

I am quite familiar with violence and it affects. A police officer came to talk to us Earl Wooster High School students to "help" us deal with the 2-24-1976 murder of Michelle Mitchell near the University of Nevada, Reno campus but instead of empathizing with us he started talking about a 1963 extremely gory killing by a Earl Wooster HS student, Thomas Lee Bean, at that time of a female Olympic skier. Context is extremely important as is trying to get know the people involved in these kind of tragedies.

I came across a former cell mate of Bean -- the 1963 murderer-- who actually said that this is a very nice guy now. Or he was when he was this guy's cellmate. I visit with a lot of people via Facebook who live or lived in Reno, Nevada.

What this guy did to the skier, Sonja McCaskie, is still horrific even by 2019 standards. Bean looks evil to me and not so much mentally ill.

The latest I read was that the shooter, DeWayne Craddock, had been disciplined for some reason and apparently came back for revenge. He still had his pass card to gain entry into nonpublic areas of the building. His residential neighbors did not really know him as he kept to himself. They said he always carried a book bag...

Not that it really matters but the weapon used was a .45 handgun..

It is so hard to hear about another mass killing. I don’t blame the guns alone, the man could have used any other method, but the gun he brought certainly helped.

Then there are the victims, completely unanticipated, life suddenly over. Who will look after their families now?

He also had a rifle (unidentified type as of now), a suppressor and (as predicted)...extended magazines for the .45 cal. :ohdear:



Live: Virginia Beach mass shooting - CNN

We were warned about the violent video games but I’m afraid the ship has already sailed on that issue. Our culture has changed especially in the last 50 years and it has not been for the better. Too much “me” and freedom to act out that “freedom” has become a major violent shooting problem in the Country we all love. There has to be a “middle ground” established in America or we are going to self destruct from within. A House divided will not continue to stand...

My opinion.

This post is symbolic of "kicking the can down the road".

Believing there is too much freedom simply belies the facts.

By the way, news reporting they found further guns at his home,but I am sure they were all for personal protection and sport. I

It took 4 officers and ALL their ammo to stop this one man, who would have killed more. Sounds like Afghanistan, but it is the United States of America

Guns are the weapon of choice for mass killings because they're relatively easy to get, easy to use, ammo is cheap enough, and they can kill a lot of people in a very short amount of time even if you're a lousy shot.

The primary function of a gun is to kill. That is why they exist. Every other function (fun, competition, symbolic, providing a physical visible threat for any reason at all) is secondary.

I believe the perps would use other methods, sadly, if guns were not available. We can not be naive about the intentions of these killers.

EXACTLY! :ohdear:

Yes, knifings in England and Wales for example! Ten charts on the rise of knife crime in England and Wales - BBC News

Such as?

A sword?

A knife?

A baseball bat?

Grenades?

?????

:agree: on the "naiveté" though...just not on the subject you've mentioned. :ohdear:



NOTHING allows killing faster and more effectively...than a firearm. :oops:

Legal gun ownership in Mexico is nearly impossible unless you are connected to the right people. Back in the late 80's I read a report stating that there were more knife homicides in Mexico than homicides from all causes (knife, gun, bludgeon, beating, etc.) in the United States for the same time frame. If a person has the intent to kill they will find something to use to commit the murder.