Some Answers To Why Police Shootings Are The Way They Are
 

There are a lot of questions concerning police shootings such as "Why didn't the police shoot to wound the person?" or "Why did they have to shoot him so many times?" I know I won't change anyone's mind with a simple post here, but my experience might help temper some views.

A few years ago, I was fortunate to be chosen for an FBI Citizen Training Course. There were 25 of us in the 10 week class. Participant citizens ranged from Black activists to far right conservatives. Subjects covered in the 4 1/2 hour weekly sessions included terrorism, white collar crime, kidnapping, violent crimes and "When and How to Use a Firearm."

The FBI trained us that if someone is life-threatening (to you or someone else) and you decide you to shoot, you shoot until the threat is ended. Only in Wild West movies does someone shoot to knock the gun out of the bad guy's hand or shoot to wound. To prove this important point, the FBI set up a very life-like full scale video on a wall with a very real looking and feeling fake gun that interacted with what was being shown. We each took turns as an FBI agent deciding if, when and whom to shoot. It was so real many of us were shaking during our turn as the video was played. Our first guy up shot the bad guy one time, and as the bad guy fell, he turned to us and smiled as he blew the imagined smoke from his gun barrel. Unfortunately for our "pretend" FBI agent, as the bad guy fell, he emptied his revolver into the back of the "agent."

At first the Black activist refused to role-play, but eventually did. He was shaking as he kept yelling, "FBI, drop the weapon!" When he finally decided to shoot, he not only emptied the gun's 8 round capacity, he reloaded and shot a couple more times. (They still talk about this in that FBI office.)

I asked a question. How do you know when to shoot? The FBI agent handed me the fake gun and said I was an FBI agent and I just caught a bad guy (him) robbing a bank. As the bad guy, he walked across the room away from me and put a fake gun to his head. I yelled, "FBI, drop the gun." He started yelling he was going to kill himself and walked toward me with the gun at his head. In less than the blink of an eye, as he got 10 feet away, he turned the gun on me, shot me, and said "You're dead." I had been ready to pull the trigger the moment he made a move. But I am now a dead FBI agent.

I am not arguing that all shootings are justified by any means. I'm just saying that those 25 citizens, who went through that training exercise, developed a lot more empathy for understanding how extremely tense those situations are- how life and death decisions have to be made in split seconds that will have ramifications for the rest of people's lives.

Had a similar experience.

Roanoke Va has a citizen police academy and took both the city and the county version.

One had us clear a room after a burglary. Bad guy got behind us and my partner saw him and turned around. The "bad guy" had a fake gun that was pointing at us.

Are the police supposed to wait to be shot? Sorry you shoot until the threat is neutralized.

The other had an electronic version where you are in a patrol car chasing a suspect. He stops gets out of his car. You do to and get behind him.

He turns around with a gun in his hand. Do you wait to get shot? I did and was shot.

One more point. Very difficult to shoot straight when you are in danger. Most police will not hit their target if more than 7 ft away. Adrenaline supposedly causes this.

This is also why elite military train constantly and shoot thousands of rounds a month.

Think of this when you ask why they do not shoot to wound their target.

Why don't police carry tasers? They are a weapon, can be used at a distance, like pepper spray, and are less lethal than guns. Through the end of September 2020, over 700 people have been shot and killed by police, an increasing trend.

Probably the same reason criminals don't carry tasers.

maybe bad guys should not threaten civilians or police officers. tasers are also very unreliable as to affect on a person that is stoned or high on drugs, or wearing thick clothing.

Many do carry tasers but tasers aren't always effective (lots of videos of people getting tased and it having no effect)

I was in two shootings as a State Trooper, the first as a sniper on a hijacking/hostage situation, the second on a stolen vehicle with an escapee whose car I did the pit maneuver on and he got out firing; this was immediately after he riddled the front of my cruiser with automatic weapon fire.

My point is, everyday I was going to do whatever it took to come home to my family every night. No LEO ever goes to work looking for a fire fight but it sometimes happens and they have to make the decision to end the threat that will keep them from going home.

OP wrote "Some Answers To Why Police Shootings Are The Way They Are" Thank you for the answer that counts...... so they can go home at the end of their shift. :ho:

That is the best answer

Tasers do not always stop a bad guy but I will agree if you can this should be the first line of defense if the other person is not holding a gun.

I took a firearms training class from the local Schieffer. The subject of shooting to wound a person was discussed and examples shown. The basic rule if you have to draw your gun and fire you fire to kill. I think the professionals have to reevaluate this and maybe we have only one officer firing at first or maybe a qualified sniper shoot to wound any suspect that has a gun. The professionals who decide are those that have been in the situation.

I agree. The most recent shooting comes to mind, when the person with mental illness was wielding a kitchen knife. Wouldn't it be nice if that person had been able to come home to his family.

After a lifetime in law enforcement and the military the main preamble to firing at a deadly threat is shoot until the threat is neutralized. That means totally neutralized. BTW: Who decides in a nano second of reaction time which officer should shoot first?

Why don’t local governments stop defunding law enforcement, then possibly they can provide LEO’s with the non lethal alternatives.

And the cost of that might have been the police officer does not get to come home to his or her family.

What would you do if you were the officer and a crazed man with a knife is coming at you? I know I would shoot to kill.

Why don't these "victims" of police shootings stop breaking the law, and then when they are apprehended comply with the instructions of the LEO? The common theme of most of the recent shootings was an encounter with police after committing a crime and then resisting arrest

When it comes to a choice of saving a criminal or a law enforcement officer I would choose the LEO every time.

That is a question for the city mayor and city council who oversee and fund the police department. The chief of police can only ask for the funding for needed equipment, the city council decides if he gets it.

Yes it would be nice if he was able to go home to his family but he chose not to follow instructions to drop the knife. Actions have consequences.

Good question. Police departments don't set policy, the mayor and city council are supposed to control and work with the PD instead of against it.

So these officers have time to have a meeting and make decisions about how and why to shoot.

Too Late You're Dead Blue Bloods - YouTube

Did you miss the mental illness part?

And not protect you that is under threat of harm -defunding is a street I wish not to live

Parents need to train their kids not to be outlaws.

Retraining the police is not the answer.

Look in the mirror

Police shootings
 

If you have a gun you shoot to kill. They are trained to shoot to kill when you take a gun class or get concealed carry you are taught shoot to kill so keeping that in mind if you pull your gun it is for one purpose...kill.

You are not supposed to wave your gun to warn.

That is why we need to give police more tools and resources I am not saying abolish police help them. Retool their department

Idea!
 

I have a possible solution to a lot of the police shootings...
When they tell you to stop, don’t keep running. That might work.

Tasers
 

Depending on the type and quality of the taser unit, they can cost upwards of $1000, but most are around half that. Using a taser on a suspect who is under the influence of meth, and/or other drugs of abuse is a crapshoot as to whether or not it will be effective. Here's a video of two PA state troopers trying to affect an arrest of a man stopped for suspected impaired driving. They eventually had to use a taser, but as you'll see, it had limited effect, and the guy ended up shooting both troopers.

PA TROOPERS SHOOTING 2017 - YouTube

The two posters who went through the police and FBI training programs provide a good description of why police shoot to kill. There is no shoot to wound - when faced with deadly force, it's your life, or the life of the assailent.

So true!!!!!!!!

Totally correct!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Look at the 3 who run Philly and you will know why the police are not supported!!!!! The police chief said she did not have a budget for tasers!!!!!! The poor Philly cops are always put down by the Mayor!!!!

If we continue to play "Monday morning quarterback" by second guessing what a LEO does in that split second, thin k about who we are going to get as LEOs in the future. I tip my hat to those who have spent their lives in law enforcement. And please don't ask me about the few bad cops you may have seen on videos. There are bad clergy, teachers, doctors, lawyers, cooks, etc. I am attaching a video named "THAT IS HOW FAST IT CAN HAPPEN". It is 6 seconds long. That cop could have died in those6 seconds. Those of you who were not in LE, think about how much time he had to react. It is scary, and God bless whoever trained him.
If we don't support our police, the ONLY people who will become police are trigger happy people who look forward to shooting someone. The adage "Be careful what you ask for" certainly applies here, and defunding police is one very stupid idea.
Watch the video.

When I got training in the military, silhouettes did not have arms or legs. The crazy folks haven’t woke up yet, but they will chime in. It’s been a great thread! Thanks to all of you with common sense!

From the data I was easily able to gather it is not an increasing trend. Since 2013 it has been pretty much the same number every year. Press would have you believe otherwise.

Because you dont bring a knife to a gun fight as the saying goes. The taser has to hit the person just right from a distance. If they havve heavy clothes on, the prongs wont go through. If they are drugged up, the taser wont affect them. Would you shoot someone who points a gun at you with just a taser? If you say yes, then I hope you have made things right with God because youre heading his way.

True this guy had mental illness and the police knew it as they had been to his house several times. But does that mean that they should allow him to kill or injure one of them?

When faced with a death threat it's either him or me. What would you have done?

they are shooting to kill. period.

Always aim for center mass.

And if he killed an officer with that knife how nice would that feel.
Should the officer have asked him first if he was mentally ill and then let him stab him with the knife.

EVERY shooting that started “peaceful demonstrations”, riots, looting and murders have two things in common....1) the person shot by LEO was on drugs, and 2) the person shot by LEO did not obey the commands of the LEO. Even if there was a disputed issue with the LEO, if they followed the LEO commands the would be alive and would have a opportunity to resolve the dispute. Follow the commands of the LEO!!!!!! You will have time to talk it out, get legal representation, and live!!!!!