Southwest Airlines = Dumpster Fire
 

Southwest Airlines has cancelled about 3,000 flights during the post-Christmas travel rush. This included a Thursday flight family members were on leaving out of Orlando. A check of the SWA website showed ZERO flights leaving Orlando until Saturday, December 31st. Of all airline cancellations, Southwest is accounting for nearly 75% of the total.

Calls to Southwest "customer service" number were met with either busy signals, or immediate disconnection. We could not even get the privilege of being placed on hold for hours. Fortunately, we were able to book our family members on an American Airlines flight before the inevitable price gouging kicked in. The same flight we booked our kids on 3 hours ago is now showing fares SIX TIMES what we booked for.

Southwest has made press comments with a wide variety of excuses for these mass cancellations. However, I have not seen "bad management" mentioned a single time by the airline. I feel bad for the thousands of travelers stuck around the country who are trying to get home. Southwest Airlines truly is the Grinch who stole Christmas.

While management of communications is a big problem they need to fix, I have heard "reasons" rather than "excuses."

Logistics is a huge deal.

In order for planes to leave out of Orlando, there has to be planes IN Orlando. Those planes were coming from the north - where airports have been shut down. No planes = no flights out. Some planes went out of Orlando, but some were supposed to go to airports that were shut down due to the "climate change that doesn't exist" - not existing again in the north. So those planes couldn't leave Orlando.

You have planes NOT coming from shut-down airports, and planes NOT going to shut-down airports, and you have an entire airline that is blocked from travel.

At some level, your logic might be sound. But...why is it only affecting Southwest? Flights were available from American, Delta, etc. They have planes coming from the north, as well. The Southwest website was, as of this morning, showing NO flights out of Orlando for the next FOUR days. ZERO flights. SWA seems to be the only airline affected to this extreme.

Precisely. This was a mass storm in areas primarily served by Southwest and then you have John Q Public, who is well aware of the mess, going to the airports regardlessly and thinking their’s will be the flight that magically will happen. Air carriers offered to allow people to change their tickets to another time because of the severe weather for a reason. If you don’t live near family and are subject to possible blizzards around Christmas, common sense should tell you that some years your travel won’t happen. We love Southwest but do wish seats were assigned when booking.

Don't fly around Thanksgiving or Christmas/New Years. If you can't drive it, tell the kids you will see them before/after. Turkey tastes the same regardless of the day.

At least they are reimbursing expenses. The hazard of holiday travel

Last time I checked Southwest was the only airline to give its travelers two free pieces of luggage. Could this be their undoing.
When you use another airline you downsize to maybe take one checked (paid for) piece of luggage. Or shove stuff in a carry on.

It seems ironic the airlines that charge an arm and a leg for baggage, don’t have the luggage issue from all the weather delays?

Does SW have a hub in Chicago? I had thought SW did not have a central hub, saying their system avoided a chain effect of cancellations when bad weather hit a hub.
Why was SW effected more than other carriers OR does SW account for 75% of flight leaving Orlando? Have have not done any statistical analysis, but if they made up 75% of flight cancellations from Orlando it would appear they have a flaw in their operations (assuming their % of cancelled flights does not coincide with their total % of departing flights.

I would never fly on Southwest because they won't give me an assigned seat. I want an assigned seat, and once I sit down, I'm not moving, except to first class. I don't care who wants to sit next to someone else. So, there!

We "Luv" Southwest, but I believe this is mostly a self-inflicted wound. Yes, the combinations of the horrible weather and that they don't operate a Hub/Spoke system (crews typically back to one location), are probably partly to blame. However, it's their antiquated reservation system that can't keep up with all of the currently spread out crews and planes - that is most likely the primary culprit.

I really hope they get their issues squared away soon, as I much prefer to use them when not going too far. On long flights however, nothing beats...sitting way up front. lol

At least from the Northeast to Orlando, Southwest seems to operate magical medical flights. People board from wheelchairs but somehow, they are "healed" during the flight and are the first to run off on their own power. It couldn't have anything to do with jumping the boarding line, could it?:icon_wink::icon_wink::icon_wink:

Airlines are at capacity. This shall pass regardless of emotions. And it will occur in the future.

Swa has bulk of Mco flights. Few alternatives

I hate to say it, but I think the airlines have become too efficient at filling every seat. Maybe the Federal Government should require airlines to leave 10 percent of the seats empty to allow some flexibility for cancelled flights, etc. Also, I think all bags should be checked. No carry-on luggage in overhead bins.

I love flying SW. I get two checked bags for free, but you still get the idiots that have to try and carry on everything. I don't get a seat assignment, but I get to pick whatever open seat is there once I board. If you want to improve your odds of getting a better seat, pay a few dollars more for Early Bird. Most of the other carriers will only give you a middle seat unless you pay for a window or isle seat. I am also not nickeled and dimed to death for a carry on if I have one. Most carriers are charging $30 for your first checked bag, add that to the price of your ticket when comparing.

Actually, SW has a spoke and hub system. They are based out of Dallas, they have hubs all over the place in Phoenix, Chicago Midway, DC I think but they are all around the country. I only know this because of where I can get direct flights...

So while no airline is perfect, and they all show their Worts from time to time, they tend to have great people working the flights. That's just been my experience.

A list and the companion pass make them special

Luggage
 

Spot on. A poor management decision SW made regarding luggage IMHO. Their stock has crashed too.

Ironic? Wouldn’t common sense tell us that other airline travelers couldn’t bring the luggage they wanted? How many of those other airline travelers had to ship and pay extra to move their luggage contents where they wanted them?

This was one of those freak weather events combined with some of the biggest flying days of the year. It will all be sorted out and be something our children and grandchildren will remember. I’m amazed how people packed their medications in luggage.

They can go after Southwest and fold them, but then look at the mess we’re left with afterward.

Delta was no better this week.
 

I understand weather plays a big part in the problems with flying but it’s more than that. Two of my kids had two flights cancelled trying to fly home from here. Then Delta put them on a flight with two stops when the original flight was non stop. I spent 2.5 hours on hold with Delta on Christmas Eve. I finally hung up. We went in to the airport in Orlando to try to get a ticket agent to help. They had no flights available in the next four days. They threw their hands up. Nothing they could do. Told me to call for a refund as they can’t issue them. My kids are flying home today on Spirit. I never thought I would see the days when Spirit did a better job than Delta. All airlines need to quite overselling their flights. There is no option when flights get cancelled. I wish the Transportation Secretary would do his job and hold these airlines accountable.

I can't imagine why there would be any problem at all on the busiest weekend of the year, during massive nationwide storms. And with Christmas being on a Sunday - it means most "christmas visiting" travel will be on a Friday or Saturday - already the busiest days of the week, even when there's no holiday and perfect weather.

And all of this - hitting a particular airline that offers the most popular flights to Orlando from - everywhere that airline comes FROM, to get to Orlando.

Nah it can't possibly be a COMBINATION of things. It must - absolutely - be Southwest's fault, and no other possible factor added in.

/sarcasm

I’m not trying to be mean here, but what the heck…do people live under rocks? The possibility of the severity of this storm was forecasted over seven days before it hit. We weren’t flying anywhere but thought we’d change plans in a hurry if we were.

Where is the personal responsibility for poor planning? Airlines offered to reschedule flights to another time for no charge. This whole mess is because of the poor decision of travelers not to postpone their party.

All true, EXCEPT.......

It wasn't just Orlando, Southwest cancelled over 3,000 flights Monday representing half of all cancellations GLOBALLY. Meanwhile, American Airlines had 17, yes 17 cancellations that day (but they had over 700 delays). The son of a friend of ours is a pilot for Southwest, apparently, they weren't in the locations they needed to be, but hours of flying time was not an issue. He also stated there was a rumor among employees that they had been hacked. So there may be more to the story

The bolded underlined part is - pretty important. If they're not where they need to be, then they can't get to where they're supposed to go. That's basically the underlying problem in this current situation. The planes weren't where they needed to be, in order to get where they were going. A plane can't just take off from wherever it happens to be and go to whatever destination the airline wants it to go to, spontaneously.

It requires flight plan changes, which change the entire pattern in the skies of ALL planes flying in any given area at any given moment. One plane taking off from the wrong place at the wrong time can spell disaster. It is a very carefully coordinated process.

Crews and planes out of position. That will never change. Crews need rest but to time them out for sitting in airport idle for delays needs to be resolved. They have private rest areas to recharge which could dramatically improve performance

Agree. And apparently Southwest has a somewhat outdated system for accomplishing this, which therefore might also have some security vulnerabilities. We may learn more, and then again, we might not. Meanwhile my wife had a flight back from New England this evening, which was cancelled YESTERDAY morning. She is now looking at Saturday, if all goes well. Less than an hour after she grabbed that Saturday flight, Jan 3 became the earliest available.

Southwest used to be our go to for many years before Covid. All the airlines obviously suffered during the early Covid times, but unlike the other airlines that seemed to get their act back together, Southwest never got back to anywhere close to where they were before. They used to always have more non stop flight options, very competitive prices, and a decent cancellation/delay record versus other airlines. These days Southwest seems to have way fewer non stop flight options, very expensive fares, and a horrible on time/cancellation record. In my opinion, JetBlue eats Southwests lunch these days. It sucks for us as we have about a quarter million unused Southwest travel points that we are reluctant to use. We stopped using our Southwest credit cards a couple years ago as the points no longer have much value to us. We actually preferred Southwest’s no seat assignment boarding policy when flying to/from Orlando. We liked boarding AFTER Southwest allowed families with kids to board, that way we could select seats that weren’t close to screaming and kicking kids wearing mouse ears. Southwest has gone sooooo far downhill their performance is beyond excuses, it’s got to be BAD MANAGEMENT.

I have a friend trying to get from Georgia to Colorado, and his flight was cancelled. He got a new flight, and THAT one was cancelled. The earliest he can get home by air, now, is Saturday. So he's decided to rent a car and drive. He'll be home by Thursday night.

Heads should roll at Southwest Airlines starting with the CEO and on down the line.

There is a relatively new CEO at SW and he is not very popular. SW management may be partly to blame for this mess. When there is a weather event like a major hurricane coming they act proactively to shut down airports. They knew this blizzard was coming...I don't whether they could have done a better job to prepare for it.

Good analysis here:

Flight cancellations: Why Southwest Airlines is melting down | CNN Business

Yeah, because before the media invented "climate change" we never, ever had snow storms. Gimme a break!

Southwest Airlines = Dumpster Fire
 

I didn't check ALL SW flights out of Orlando, but we're going to Aruba on 8 Jan so have checked both yesterday and today to see "how they were doing" getting these flights out of Orlando (There is only 1 flight per day) and BOTH flights yesterday and today were on time....so SOME flights apparently are still getting out....just FYI.

Cancelled
 

Same with us. Rebooked for Sunday but a real inconvenience for them and their ride on the other end. This also happened to us in the summer when two non stops were cancelled and replaced with flights with stops and lay overs. Southwest definitely has some problems.

Airline deficiency
 

Until the government stops subsidizing the airlines they have no incentive to correct the problems

Trains Planes and Automobiles
 

C’mon train service.

Good job
 

I am an ex airline pilot and your summation is excellent. Most people think every airline has extra airplanes just sitting around. Weather is the culprit here not the airlines. Flight crews are scattered around the system at closed airports and airplanes are too. Airlines are part of one of the most complicated businesses in the world

I guess the folks who think this could have been remedied didn't pay attention to the news re: the blizzard. The winds were high with the snow and white-out conditions were happening. Whole interstate systems (in the midwest at least were closed to traffic) with people dying who didn't believe the fore-cast and ventured out anyway then got stuck. THAT was on the ground. Factor in that air-travel and I guess I'd be happy they cancelled rather than to "try" to fly. We're "enjoying" the cold here because of that Artic blast that enveloped the rest of the country. IF people are making it out and to their destinations, then I'd say they're fortunate---if not, lucky. We're from the upper midwest and the storm there was pretty significant. Drifts were measured in feet as were the snow depths....rather than inches. There were power outages throughout the states as well. Couple ALL of this with the holiday---then you have what this discussion is about!!

We got canceled 2xs from Albany NY. There were several families trying to get to Disney sad. Kids crying. We at least could go back to our sons. We can’t get home until Monday.

Oh man
 

I am an ex American airline pilot. Retired after 33 years. Those of you that think SWA is the problem are wrong. Some of you have commented that American and all the other other airlines are on time and doing a great job. Nothing could be more false. I m in STL trying to get back to mco. on any airline including American. Everything is either cancelled or overbooked. I finally found a ticket on Frontier Friday. You have no idea of the complexity of the airline business the airlines don’t just have extra airplanes sitting around and air crews. They are scattered around the system. Schedulers are pulling their hair out trying to rebuild the system. Folks it is the weather, closed airports and many other factors that have created this. It’s not Southwest and it’s baggage policy. I fly SWA all the time. Love them.

There is a post going around social media from a SWA pilot. Blaming this on their antiquated system going down. I believe this. There is no reason why most of the planes and crew could not be back in place on Monday. Cancel all the flights and get everything back in place. I am A list and have companion pass. Once my points and pass expire, I will probably look elsewhere. Have already stopped using my credit card. I definitely will never book them around a busy holiday.

He’s lucky in Albany Ny there are no one way rentals