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Rainger99 03-18-2023 07:18 AM

Young people not volunteering for military
 
Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?

Addressing the U.S. Military Recruiting Crisis - War on the Rocks

Bill14564 03-18-2023 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainger99 (Post 2198927)
Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?

Addressing the U.S. Military Recruiting Crisis - War on the Rocks

The article seemed to cover both of those questions with a good level of detail.

collie1228 03-18-2023 09:15 AM

I believe it is cultural. When I turned 18, I knew that college was of no interest to me and going to work in the local large manufacturing plant seemed like jail to me at the time. There was no way my father was going to allow me to live at home for much longer, even if I was employed, so I took the next best option and joined the Navy. It turned out to be the best move ever, as the GI Bill paid for college four years later, and I learned how to be an adult, but I really didn't have much choice. If, like many (probably most) parents today, mine were willing to coddle me, give me a bed and food, wash my clothes, etc., I probably would have stayed home too. Thanks Mom and Dad for your conservative values and willingness to stick to them. It made my life a better place.

Pairadocs 03-18-2023 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by collie1228 (Post 2198993)
I believe it is cultural. When I turned 18, I knew that college was of no interest to me and going to work in the local large manufacturing plant seemed like jail to me at the time. There was no way my father was going to allow me to live at home for much longer, even if I was employed, so I took the next best option and joined the Navy. It turned out to be the best move ever, as the GI Bill paid for college four years later, and I learned how to be an adult, but I really didn't have much choice. If, like many (probably most) parents today, mine were willing to coddle me, give me a bed and food, wash my clothes, etc., I probably would have stayed home too. Thanks Mom and Dad for your conservative values and willingness to stick to them. It made my life a better place.

You expressed it perfectly. It is definitely a cultural "revolution", a totally new society of keyboard "warriors" desperately attempting to build some measure of self-esteem (yet sadly way too often ending in the desperation of suicide). An interesting observation on this recently in the news. The daughter of the king and queen of Spain, age 17, will soon complete what we here call "high school education", and will be joining her country's military. It is the custom in Spain, that those who are in the line of monarchs, to serve their county before completing further formal education. A princess not addicted to Tic Toc maybe ? ? To say I believe we, as a nation, are headed over the cliff, is an understatement. The "root" ? Well, of course we can blame it on coddling parents, but all the coddling at home is not a more powerful force in forming basic personal philosophy, as is the general agreement of parents to abolish all traces of patriotic pride, teaching of history, and the role of the United States as a leading force for liberty from public school curriculum's. Parents have been given the RESPONSIBILITY to determine what they want to emphasize in THEIR LOCAL SCHOOL'S curriculum. THAT is their responsibility, but most seem to prefer to leave it to the federal government and individual teachers (whose personal lives and philosophy may be FAR from the values, goals, and philosophy of the local area ! That is exactly what our wise forefathers anticipated: a national so large, so vast, so diverse, that a "national" or "federally mandated" public school curriculum would be a disaster.

Patriotic holidays were once a major emphasis at ALL grade levels, kindergarten to high school. Now, they are seldom even mentioned at school, let alone the kind of emphasis most of us experienced as young people: school assemblies, speakers, elementary students made red, white, blue decoration during art period, students who finished a math, English, etc. assignment before other students were always directed to the "extra work" box which held patriot coloring sheets, or word search puzzles with "patriotic" words, etc. When we are more concerned with making sure even very young children learn "pronouns" like "ze" and other gender neutral terms, than we are with junior high and high school students who can not name even 4 of the parts of speech, or have no idea what verb "tense" even is, silly as it may seem to some, I think this all works together (throw in "everyone gets a trophy, the winning team and the losing team) to form the "roots" of why so few are interested in joining a military they have been taught is "evil" !
,

Pairadocs 03-18-2023 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2198930)
The article seemed to cover both of those questions with a good level of detail.

As to your question: Why do people insist on making claims without looking them up first, do they really think no one will check? Proof by emphatic assertion rarely works.

IMHO, they do it in a desperate attempt to appear "knowledgeable"; well educated, informed, well read, to feel they have value (in a society that values less and less all the time). YES, absolutely they believe no one will check, and that actually few even have the skills to do more than a surface "scan" of yahoo or twitter feeds for their "facts". Emotional assertion, they DO believe, works, and honestly, watching the "news" from a variety of sources on the various net works, and in print, seems to support the theory that emphatic assertion DOES work, even works WELL. When one insists that individuals entering a country via illegal means are being beaten, whipped, by brutal border guards carrying whips on horseback... and passionately assert that as truth, when any experienced rider, especially of western style neck reining, knows exactly how a rider uses the reins (also spelled "reigns" by some) to control a horse. Would be nearly impossible to control the horse and at the same time use the reins to whip human beings ! If you ride, you know this ! Emphatic assertion ? I think it does work as does "repetition", repeat it enough, no matter how absurd, never stop, and people WILL believe it !

Djean1981 03-18-2023 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by collie1228 (Post 2198993)
I believe it is cultural. When I turned 18, I knew that college was of no interest to me and going to work in the local large manufacturing plant seemed like jail to me at the time. There was no way my father was going to allow me to live at home for much longer, even if I was employed, so I took the next best option and joined the Navy. It turned out to be the best move ever, as the GI Bill paid for college four years later, and I learned how to be an adult, but I really didn't have much choice. If, like many (probably most) parents today, mine were willing to coddle me, give me a bed and food, wash my clothes, etc., I probably would have stayed home too. Thanks Mom and Dad for your conservative values and willingness to stick to them. It made my life a better place.

Exactly. We were expected out of the house at 18.

Michael G. 03-18-2023 12:41 PM

The #1 reason parents move to the villages, there's no basements for kids to live in......:thumbup:

I'm Popeye! 03-18-2023 12:51 PM

Let's face it...
After the "Greatest Generation" this country has produced and allowed mostly ____.......
......and if you disagree, you are part of the problem! :ho:

retiredguy123 03-18-2023 01:12 PM

Why does the military guarantee a lifetime of support for a soldier and his family, even if he/she never sees any combat action? I think they should recruit people to serve where and when they are needed for a limited term and pay them big bucks. A soldier who serves a deployment in a combat zone should be paid way more than someone sitting behind a desk in the Pentagon, drinking coffee.

Keefelane66 03-18-2023 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2199068)
Why does the military guarantee a lifetime of support for a soldier and his family, even if he/she never sees any combat action? I think they should recruit people to serve where and when they are needed for a limited term and pay them big bucks. A soldier who serves a deployment in a combat zone should be paid way more than someone sitting behind a desk in the Pentagon, drinking coffee.

You are misinformed VA benefits are for Veterans receiving a disability in line of duty.
Retired Veterans Active or Reserve receive Tri-Care upon completion of service enlistment requirements retirement.
Active duty in War zone receive extra pay also seagoing Sailors receive extra pay. Also Military personnel assigned to isolated duty receive extra pay

CFrance 03-18-2023 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I'm Popeye! (Post 2199063)
Let's face it...
After the "Greatest Generation" this country has produced and allowed mostly ____.......
......and if you disagree, you are part of the problem! :ho:

Ridiculous blanket accusation.

fdpaq0580 03-18-2023 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by collie1228 (Post 2198993)
I believe it is cultural. When I turned 18, I knew that college was of no interest to me and going to work in the local large manufacturing plant seemed like jail to me at the time. There was no way my father was going to allow me to live at home for much longer, even if I was employed, so I took the next best option and joined the Navy. It turned out to be the best move ever, as the GI Bill paid for college four years later, and I learned how to be an adult, but I really didn't have much choice. If, like many (probably most) parents today, mine were willing to coddle me, give me a bed and food, wash my clothes, etc., I probably would have stayed home too. Thanks Mom and Dad for your conservative values and willingness to stick to them. It made my life a better place.

Conservative values? My folks were liberal but aside from that, you could be telling my story, except my work came from 6 years of Navy schools and experience.

Babubhat 03-18-2023 07:27 PM

Instead of putting people in Coleman, sentence them to join the military. More effective than prison

Rainger99 03-18-2023 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babubhat (Post 2199153)
Instead of putting people in Coleman, sentence them to join the military. More effective than prison

I think you have to be convicted of a felony to get into Coleman. Depending on the crime, I would be reluctant to work next to a convicted felon. I wouldn't mind someone convicted of tax evasion but I would prefer not to work with someone convicted of murder.

Jack Henry Abbott - Wikipedia

Boston-Sean 03-18-2023 09:34 PM

I served in both the Army Reserves and regular Air Force. Worked out great for me.

No way would I advise anyone to join the military today. Would you want the life of your kid in the hands of a buffoon like Mark Milley?

Garywt 03-18-2023 10:38 PM

Kids today are more interested in changing history or eliminating history than making history. The fact the is not politically correct to say master bedroom anymore says it all to me.

jimbomaybe 03-19-2023 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2199068)
Why does the military guarantee a lifetime of support for a soldier and his family, even if he/she never sees any combat action? I think they should recruit people to serve where and when they are needed for a limited term and pay them big bucks. A soldier who serves a deployment in a combat zone should be paid way more than someone sitting behind a desk in the Pentagon, drinking coffee.

Good idea,, if you had a crystal ball that would look into the future a couple of years, would tell you exactly what the threat will be , where , what will be needed to counter that threat, a long large complex logistical organization is is the only way to give those at the pointy end of the spear the best chance of success, aside of the wisdom of .
Si vis pacem, para bellum is a Latin adage translated as, "If you want peace, prepare for war"

Villages Kahuna 03-19-2023 05:09 AM

At the end of the day, the most effective way to increase military volunteers is to make a military career a financially competitive alternative — pay volunteers a package which encourages the military as a good career choice.

— Enlistment bonuses
— Free college tuition
— Advanced choice of MOS (occupational specialty) training
— Pay which is competitive with opportunities in the private sector

Drdoug49 03-19-2023 05:29 AM

there is a labor shortage everywhere, with declining birth rates, a booming economy young people can get jobs anywhere. Also the number one reason why recruits are rejected, is obesity

rrtjp 03-19-2023 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainger99 (Post 2198927)
Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?

Addressing the U.S. Military Recruiting Crisis - War on the Rocks

1. Why has it fallen?
I think welfare has become a more appealing career choice.
2. How to increase it?
Every illegal alien entering this country gets deported back to where he or she came from or is given the choice of serving in any branch of our military and on being honorable discharged along with a DD214 they also receive their citizenship papers.

Blackbird45 03-19-2023 06:04 AM

People are not going to like why I believe recruitment is down. My parents signed me into the Navy when I was 17. I was a high school dropout from a poor family, jail look like the next stop and for me 4 years in the Navy was the best move. It actually gave me a place to grow up. I don't see recruitment ads on TV anymore, but when they were around it was always directed to the less fortunate. Join the service see the world, get an education, it was directed to people who seem they had no place to go. Today the military wants people with a higher education and those people can do better on the outside. I'm not complaining about the Navy besides giving me a place to grow up, it paid for my schooling when I got out. But when I joined, I remember one of the first things I was told "You are now the property of the Navy". They were right, you were told when to eat, sleep and not knowing where they were going to send you next. Let's be honest being a civilian is a more comfortable life.

Boffin 03-19-2023 06:36 AM

No worries. If necessary a draft will be enacted.

Bridget Staunton 03-19-2023 06:45 AM

All young people should join a branch of the service. My husband said it was the best years of his life & prepared him to become a man, far better than the years in boarding school

waterflower 03-19-2023 06:58 AM

Many are waking up to the bankers using the military to fight illegal wars.Why would you unknowingly kill someone or destroy a country for the un/nato. All criminal groups.

Bogie Shooter 03-19-2023 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterflower (Post 2199234)
Many are waking up to the bankers using the military to fight illegal wars.Why would you unknowingly kill someone or destroy a country for the un/nato. All criminal groups.

Gotta reread this slowly…..lot of political packed into three sentences.

allsport 03-19-2023 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainger99 (Post 2198927)
Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?

Addressing the U.S. Military Recruiting Crisis - War on the Rocks

Walk through a VA Hospital and you will see the ravages of war and military life. The youth of today do not want to go to unsavory locations to support the values of people who have never served. I would NEVER recommend service to anyone, clean up the politics, the places where you end up and respect for all who server no matter the gender, ethnic backgrounds and education. Stop taking drop outs and make it a respected career.

MandoMan 03-19-2023 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainger99 (Post 2198927)
Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?

Addressing the U.S. Military Recruiting Crisis - War on the Rocks

Interesting article. I don’t agree with all of it, but it offers some interesting suggestions for improvement, such as allowing recruits who aren’t married but have children. (That was once considered a way of escaping responsibilities, but these days so many are already escaping them with impunity.) One reason given that hadn’t occurred to me is that recruitment is down because we don’t currently have a war where those in the military can go out and kill people. That could be! But not for most, I think.

However, the article doesn’t mention one big one. I think that from 1980 to 2001, recruiting was based on the idea of enlisting in order to get training in what could be a useful career someday and get access to help with college costs. I recall reading that recruiters were encouraging enlistment by telling kids they were unlikely to be asked to serve in a war zone overseas. Some were allowed to sign up with stated objectives of getting to serve overseas in countries like Germany and South Korea and seeing the world. Enlisting was a career move and NOT a desire to fight for one’s country. As there was no big war, not wanting to go into battle wasn’t considered a big problem. But then came the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Recruits were not only being sent into battle where they might kill or be killed, but many were required to serve multiple tours in war zones. I recall the son of a college girlfriend of mine who enlisted in early 2001 because he was told he’d never have to go into battle, but he served three tours in Afghanistan. He wasn’t wounded, at least physically, but it was harrowing. It may have been wrong to tell recruits they wouldn’t have to serve in combat, whether they want to or not, but one could argue that it was also wrong to enlist in the military without being willing to fight.

I recall reading another article about Coast Guard enlistments being down because enlisted men and women were being sent to war zones instead of staying in the U.S. and doing what the recruitment posters said the National Guard does. A lot of people also decided to not join the Reserves because of the likelihood that they would be sent back to war, disrupting their careers and families. I don’t see any real way around it. You shouldn’t enlist unless you are willing to fight and protect. Getting job training and other benefits should not be the main reason for joining.

I myself would favor a near universal two year conscription for training, followed by a couple decades in the reserves. If you want the right to keep and bear arms, then you ought to be willing to be properly trained to bear them and be willing to actually bear them in war. Israel has a system somewhat like that, and that’s why young Israeli men and women are so confident and strong and brave. They all know they are trained and ready.

barbnick 03-19-2023 07:32 AM

Should be mandatory of 2 years service after graduation from high school. G I bill will continue education after discharge

srswans 03-19-2023 07:38 AM

Forced “Vaccination”
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rainger99 (Post 2198927)
Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?

Addressing the U.S. Military Recruiting Crisis - War on the Rocks

The article did not mention the Covid shots - forcing someone to do this is probably detrimental to recruitment.

PugMom 03-19-2023 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterflower (Post 2199234)
Many are waking up to the bankers using the military to fight illegal wars.Why would you unknowingly kill someone or destroy a country for the un/nato. All criminal groups.

i think you captured something with comment.

FT9508 03-19-2023 07:58 AM

The Gov might try not sending the soldiers into pointless wars that defend the politicians egos more than anything else. In the world of mass media and instant messaging they just can't get away with that anymore.

maistocars 03-19-2023 07:59 AM

Only 1 reason and it's the same reason our best are retiring or leaving the armed forces. I'll leave it there.

maggie1 03-19-2023 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babubhat (Post 2199153)
Instead of putting people in Coleman, sentence them to join the military. More effective than prison

Even though the military is having problems in recruiting, they nevertheless are still selective of who they take into the service. I'm certain they won't accept people with even one incident of committing a crime of violence, and that includes a number of acts that fall into that category. Even misdemeanor offenses are scrutinized. Generally speaking, the worst kind of candidate for the military is a soon-to-be convict if they are given the choice of going to prison or the military. Their potential of becoming a discipline problem is great and they are the first to go AWOL. I see Russia is releasing prison inmates to fight in the Euchrain, where they end up as cannon fodder.

maggie1 03-19-2023 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boston-Sean (Post 2199176)
I served in both the Army Reserves and regular Air Force. Worked out great for me.

No way would I advise anyone to join the military today. Would you want the life of your kid in the hands of a buffoon like Mark Milley?

You must be a fan of Tucker Carlson. And we know all about his credibility, don't we?

GATORBILL66 03-19-2023 08:34 AM

[QUOTE=Rainger99;2198927]Interesting article on the problem with military recruitment.

Any advice as to
1. why it has fallen and
2. how to increase it?


START THE DRAFT BACK UP!

retiredguy123 03-19-2023 08:35 AM

I am always skeptical when I read that the military cannot meet their recruitment goals. Aren't they the ones who set the goals? So, is it possible that they set the goals too high on purpose? Currently, there are about 1.2 million active-duty military service members. How many do we need? Just asking.

OhioBuckeye 03-19-2023 08:50 AM

Kids today act tough but they know they don’t like to be told what to do because they think they know everything already. To put it in a nutshell they’re to soft.

Marine1974 03-19-2023 08:57 AM

How do polo players on horseback do that ? How do Calvary horse riders use a sword on their enemy ? The same way a horseman can use a whip if you give it some thought.

MrFlorida 03-19-2023 09:08 AM

After that Afghanistan fiasco, who can blame them ?

Marine1974 03-19-2023 09:23 AM

Combat pay
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2199068)
Why does the military guarantee a lifetime of support for a soldier and his family, even if he/she never sees any combat action? I think they should recruit people to serve where and when they are needed for a limited term and pay them big bucks. A soldier who serves a deployment in a combat zone should be paid way more than someone sitting behind a desk in the Pentagon, drinking coffee.

Our Military is paid combat pay while serving in a war zone .


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