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-   -   Check tire pressure (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/check-tire-pressure-353301/)

string 09-26-2024 06:58 PM

Check tire pressure
 
After every hurricane check your tire pressure on cars and golf carts.
Hurricanes change the barometric pressure in the area.

biker1 09-26-2024 08:27 PM

Not exactly. The ambient pressure will drop some and then return. The pressure in the tires is fine. However, seasonal temperature changes will require some adjustment.


Quote:

Originally Posted by string (Post 2373976)
After every hurricane check your tire pressure on cars and golf carts.
Hurricanes change the barometric pressure in the area.


tophcfa 09-26-2024 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biker1 (Post 2373986)
Not exactly. The ambient pressure will drop some and then return. The pressure in the tires is fine. However, seasonal temperature changes will require some adjustment.

Tell that to Roger Goodell.

Topspinmo 09-26-2024 09:17 PM

I check my tire pressure once month, it’s away down pound or 2. IMO if you don’t check you tires within 3 month period the pressure could be low enough to produce more wear tear on tires. Course running nitrogen don’t lose pressure so dramatically.

biker1 09-26-2024 09:36 PM

I’m sure someone tried to explain the ideal gas law to him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tophcfa (Post 2373996)
Tell that to Roger Goodell.


PoolBrews 09-27-2024 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topspinmo (Post 2373997)
I check my tire pressure once month, it’s away down pound or 2. IMO if you don’t check you tires within 3 month period the pressure could be low enough to produce more wear tear on tires. Course running nitrogen don’t lose pressure so dramatically.

Nitrogen is far more likely to leak than air. Nitrogen molecules are considerably smaller than oxygen and Co2, and can leak through far smaller openings than air. A good example is if you put nitrogen tanks on a standard Co2 dispenser for soda or beer, the tank will run dry in less than a day. Standard seals that contain Co2, can't contain nitrogen.

biker1 09-27-2024 08:02 AM

Nitrogen and oxygen molecules are very close in size with nitrogen being slightly larger.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoolBrews (Post 2374074)
Nitrogen is far more likely to leak than air. Nitrogen molecules are considerably smaller than oxygen and Co2, and can leak through far smaller openings than air. A good example is if you put nitrogen tanks on a standard Co2 dispenser for soda or beer, the tank will run dry in less than a day. Standard seals that contain Co2, can't contain nitrogen.


Topspinmo 09-27-2024 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoolBrews (Post 2374074)
Nitrogen is far more likely to leak than air. Nitrogen molecules are considerably smaller than oxygen and Co2, and can leak through far smaller openings than air. A good example is if you put nitrogen tanks on a standard Co2 dispenser for soda or beer, the tank will run dry in less than a day. Standard seals that contain Co2, can't contain nitrogen.

When my car was new the tires were filled with nitrogen from factory or wherever. Tire pressure was consistent for two years or more. After that I figured tires were old enough to start loosing air. That’s when I had to occasionally top them off, but, never let them get low enough for tire light to come on.

I never put nitrogen back in them figured it was waste of money and good up charge by dealer. My understanding nitrogen molecules are larger and temperature changes don’t affect nitrogen as much as plain moisten old air. Even when my car was new I still checked tire pressure once month. Waiting for tire light to come on iMO asking for tire wear, but that’s me I am asinine on certain stuff. :oops:

villagetinker 09-27-2024 09:43 AM

You do realize our atmosphere is 78% Nitrogen, I would never waste my money filling tires with pure Nitrogen.

Caymus 09-27-2024 10:05 AM

Must be some advantage to nitrogen. I thought most race car tires are nitrogen filled.

biker1 09-27-2024 10:14 AM

There will be a small reduction in pressure drop with time with a pure nitrogen fill compared with air. However, I doubt it is worth the cost or inconvenience. You should be checking your tire pressure regularly anyway and adjusting the pressure as needed with seasonal temperature changes. What race cars do usually has very little to do with what passenger cars should do. Apparently, some commercial and military applications call for nitrogen fills. Again, that probably has little to do with passenger car applications.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caymus (Post 2374141)
Must be some advantage to nitrogen. I thought most race car tires are nitrogen filled.


Topspinmo 09-27-2024 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by villagetinker (Post 2374130)
You do realize our atmosphere is 78% Nitrogen, I would never waste my money filling tires with pure Nitrogen.

“I never put nitrogen back in them figured it was waste of money and good up charge by dealer“

Quoted from my post.

Caymus 09-27-2024 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biker1 (Post 2374143)
There will be a small reduction in pressure drop with time with a pure nitrogen fill compared with air. However, I doubt it is worth the cost or inconvenience. You should be checking your tire pressure regularly anyway and adjusting the pressure as needed with seasonal temperature changes. What race cars do usually has very little to do with what passenger cars should do. Apparently, some commercial and military applications call for nitrogen fills. Again, that probably has little to do with passenger car applications.

Before I retired, I would use the "free" Nitrogen at work. We used a lot to inert our reactors and keep them from going "boom":angel:

Michael G. 09-27-2024 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caymus (Post 2374141)
Must be some advantage to nitrogen. I thought most race car tires are nitrogen filled.

Ace car tires yes, but not for everyday driving
How many race cars do you see at Spanish springs??

Topspinmo 09-27-2024 04:55 PM

From Google


The main benefit of nitrogen-filled tires is that the loss of tire pressure is slower, because the gas in the tire escapes more slowly than air does. With more stable tire pressure, the thinking goes, you'll get better gas mileage and get full tire life since you're always rolling on fully inflated tires.

Which does same thing check tire pressure once month.

justjim 09-27-2024 09:21 PM

Every time I go north to a cold climate the light comes on for low tire pressure.

Rocksnap 09-28-2024 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoolBrews (Post 2374074)
Nitrogen is far more likely to leak than air. Nitrogen molecules are considerably smaller than oxygen and Co2, and can leak through far smaller openings than air. A good example is if you put nitrogen tanks on a standard Co2 dispenser for soda or beer, the tank will run dry in less than a day. Standard seals that contain Co2, can't contain nitrogen.

All due respect, but you have this backwards. O2 molecules are smaller than nitrogen molecules. Which is 1/2 the reason it’s used to inflate aircraft tires.

bogmonster 09-28-2024 05:54 AM

shrinkage is real

rsmurano 09-28-2024 05:54 AM

It doesn’t matter if storms come or go, you should always check your tire pressure every month when the tires are cold. You can also check your tire pressure when driving using your cars computer but if you have been driving for a while, they will show up to 4 or 5 pounds more pressure.

biker1 09-28-2024 06:38 AM

A ballpark estimate is that you will lose about 1 PSI for each 10F drop in ambient temperature. You should check when the car has been sitting for some time, say in the morning. If you travel from an area where the overnight temperatures are typically 80F to an area where they are typically 30F then you may see about a 5 PSI drop. This may very well trigger the TPMS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by justjim (Post 2374299)
Every time I go north to a cold climate the light comes on for low tire pressure.


phousel 09-28-2024 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoolBrews (Post 2374074)
Nitrogen is far more likely to leak than air. Nitrogen molecules are considerably smaller than oxygen and Co2, and can leak through far smaller openings than air. A good example is if you put nitrogen tanks on a standard Co2 dispenser for soda or beer, the tank will run dry in less than a day. Standard seals that contain Co2, can't contain nitrogen.

Not correct! Nitrogen molecules are slightly (3%) larger (more volume) than air.

ThirdOfFive 09-28-2024 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rsmurano (Post 2374335)
It doesn’t matter if storms come or go, you should always check your tire pressure every month when the tires are cold. You can also check your tire pressure when driving using your cars computer but if you have been driving for a while, they will show up to 4 or 5 pounds more pressure.

True. If you check your tires regularly it doesn't really matter if you fill them with nitrogen or just plain everyday air.

Nitrogen has qualities that makes it overall better for tire inflation. However those qualities, as compared to straight air, are pretty minuscule when talking about the average joe tooling on down the freeway. They become significant, however, when the tires under consideration are on race cars, semi truck fleets, commercial and military aircraft, and the like. I think NASA used nitrogen in the space shuttle tires though I don't know that for sure.

Major positive qualities for Nitrogen is that is inert: it does not support combustion or corrosion. Nitrogen is also more stable in extreme temperature fluctuations meaning that there is less variation in pressure when going from very warm to very cold. It is also less likely to leak, all other things considered, than is air, because the nitrogen molecule is a bit larger than oxygen. But nitrogen is expensive ($5 per car tire??). The overall advantages of nitrogen, should should you be driving in the Indianapolis 500 or landing a 747, are important, but I doubt it makes very little if any difference, considering the price, if the vehicle you're piloting is a Toyota Corolla.

Check out "The Pros and Cons of Nitrogen Tire Inflation" by Tsukasa Azuma, updated February 22, 2024.

nn0wheremann 09-28-2024 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topspinmo (Post 2373997)
I check my tire pressure once month, it’s away down pound or 2. IMO if you don’t check you tires within 3 month period the pressure could be low enough to produce more wear tear on tires. Course running nitrogen don’t lose pressure so dramatically.

I use a 78% nitrogen mix exclusively. Tires work just fine.

JGibson 09-28-2024 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bogmonster (Post 2374334)
shrinkage is real

"But I was in the pool"

roadrnnr 09-28-2024 08:46 AM

What pressure is right for Yamaha Golf Carts?

jarodrig 09-28-2024 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael G. (Post 2374182)
How many race cars do you see at Spanish springs??

Judging from what I’ve seen , ALL of them! Including golf carts ! :):):)

New Englander 09-28-2024 09:21 AM

You don't need Nitrogen for your tires. Just remember on Oct. 1st replace the summer air in your tires with winter air.

kburr 09-28-2024 10:49 AM

Hurricane pressure
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by biker1 (Post 2373986)
Not exactly. The ambient pressure will drop some and then return. The pressure in the tires is fine. However, seasonal temperature changes will require some adjustment.

I felt it in my sinuses.

Topspinmo 09-28-2024 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadrnnr (Post 2374381)
What pressure is right for Yamaha Golf Carts?

When I first got here I had back problems so I reduced tire pressure to 18 to 20 on 10 inch 205 tires so cushioned my back when going over street drains. In 2 years wore out rear tires due more weight on rear. The front had even wear.

For me 25 Psi for rear (more weight in rear) and 22 for front 10” 205s works for me. Back tires are newer than front so I only rotate side to side till back tire catch up.

Topspinmo 09-28-2024 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Englander (Post 2374393)
You don't need Nitrogen for your tires. Just
remember on Oct. 1st replace the summer air in your tires with winter air.

So, where do get air with no nitrogen? :pepper2:

Topspinmo 09-28-2024 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nn0wheremann (Post 2374376)
I use a 78% nitrogen mix exclusively. Tires work just fine.

The main benefit of nitrogen-filled tires is that the loss of tire pressure is slower, because the gas in the tire escapes more slowly than air does. With more stable tire pressure, the thinking goes, you'll get better gas mileage and get full tire life since you're always rolling on fully inflated tires.

Which does same thing check tire pressure once month.

Quoted from my post.

New Englander 09-28-2024 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topspinmo (Post 2374448)
So, where do get air with no nitrogen? :pepper2:

Washington DC is full of hot air without Nitrogen. :blahblahblah:

Topspinmo 09-28-2024 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Englander (Post 2374502)
Washington DC is full of hot air without Nitrogen. :blahblahblah:


Agree, but it’s non useable….:22yikes:

dougawhite 09-28-2024 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biker1 (Post 2374094)
Nitrogen and oxygen molecules are very close in size with nitrogen being slightly larger.

On the periodic table of elements Nitrogen is just before oxygen, therefore, nitrogen atoms are slightly smaller than oxygen atoms, but not by very much.

Bill14564 09-28-2024 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dougawhite (Post 2374551)
On the periodic table of elements Nitrogen is just before oxygen, therefore, nitrogen atoms are slightly smaller than oxygen atoms, but not by very much.

The atom N is smaller than the atom O. However, the compound N2 is larger than the compound O2. Since we have to deal with the compound rather than the atom….

tophcfa 09-28-2024 07:08 PM

Regardless of what you fill your tires with, remember to check your value stems periodically to be sure they are snuggly in place.

Bill14564 09-28-2024 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tophcfa (Post 2374555)
Regardless of what you fill your tires with, remember to check your value stems periodically to be sure they are snuggly in place.

????

If they are not snuggly in place is there any air in the tire at all??

FredMitchell 09-28-2024 07:36 PM

Is it to much to ask to post actual factual data, when that is the issue?

Gas Density (molecular)
O2 32 grams / mole
N2 28 grams / mole
Oxygen is 14% denser per mole than Nitrogen

Gas molecular size:
Nitrogen 0.305 nanometers (nm)
Oxygen 0.299 nm
In their gaseous state, both nitrogen and oxygen molecules have an effective diameter of about 3 x 10-10m.
Nitrogen molecules are 2% larger. This is a result of their internal atomic structure.

OP
With respect to the OP (operating premise) that the tire pressure and atmospheric pressure have some relationship, that is bill shut [intentional]. The internal and external pressures are unrelated.

Tires
As to the tire temperature recommendations (ideal gas law), it is important to remember that the temperatures used must be absolute zero based, so Kelvin or Rankine. Did any of you, who posted those guidelines, ever check to see whether they were correct? It would be useful and instructive to do so.

Racing and nitrogen
Why would race cars, presumably cars racing long enough distances to make tire changes (?) use nitrogen rather than air. I have no idea. Thermal conductivity differences? Elimination of water vapor? Are brakes and wheels reasonably thermally isolated. After all, the tires are only used for minutes, not hours. They are put on "cold" and get heated up through tire friction. I have never heard a credible argument for it, but I don't doubt that it is important for some forms of racing.

Disclaimer
I have no automotive engineering background.
Physics, chemistry, math, finance, economics/behavior/game theory, and software have had my focus (other than sports).

JMintzer 09-28-2024 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2374556)
????

If they are not snuggly in place is there any air in the tire at all??

Methinks he means "valve caps"...

tophcfa 09-28-2024 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2374556)
????

If they are not snuggly in place is there any air in the tire at all??

No, valve stems can leak air very slowly if they are not tightened down properly. There is a rubber gasket in the stem that needs to be compressed to hold in air. Over time the stems can loosen and require being snugged down, typically only about 1/4/ to 1/2 turn. Sometimes the rubber gasket in very old valve stems can corrode and the valve stem needs to be replaced. A valve stem wrench can be purchased at any auto parts store, or in the automotive department of a box store, for less than $5. A package of replacement valve steams can be purchased on Amazon for under $10.


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