Most unprofessional experience trying to purchase my first home in TV.
 

So, I found a home on the VLS made an offer based upon agent video walk through. Seller stated original roof on 2008 home willing to offer 10k toward replacement. I offered 5k less than price. My VLS agent calls me and says they are only going to give rebate for roof with a full price offer. I submitted a full price offer with roof being inspected within three days as contingency to make sure the home was insurable. The agent calls me and says there is another offer both cash offers btw but they were going to counter my offer with removing the contingency. I disclosed to the agent that I couldn't buy a home that I may not be able to insure she stated that because it is a cash offer and that I could. I said well I cannot have a home in another state that may not be insurable. She said so you are willing to lose this deal? I said I guess I wouldn't have a choice but have them counter and I will respond. Agent two hours later calls back and says they took the other offer. The seller never responded to my offer at full list price or countered. I have purchased ten homes in my life and I know there are 1799 more to choose from on the market but...wow. Not feeling very happy with TV listing service or agents at the moment.. Have a great evening one and all!

Your Broker/Agent handled the transaction, EXACTLY how it should have been handled.

A Seller has no obligation to "counter" an offer. Your Offer contained a contingency that was unacceptable to the Seller, so they accepted another Offer that was acceptable to them.

Legally and ethically, your Broker/Agent did everything right and it sounds like the Seller's Broker did, too. Just because you don't like the results or someone else was more daring than you, doesn't make it wrong.

If you really wanted the home, you could have made an Offer without any contingencies and still have been prepared to increase it, if the Seller had another comparable Offer.

I agree. Time to move on to another property.

1st never make an offer without the stipulation of response by the seller in writing. I have actually had an experience with a realtor of an offer rejected and later found the offer was never presented to the seller. This is the oldest trick in the book. If the listing is new see what the market will bring.

2nd Do us a favor and publish the realtor you dealt with.

OP was not dealing with a Realtor. It was a VHS agent.

A Seller has no obligation to respond or counter any offer.

A Broker has an obligation under Florida Law, to present any offer to a Seller, unless otherwise advised in writing.

There is no such thing as a "realtor". It is "REALTOR®" (a Registered Trademark), who are legally & ethically bound to present any offer to a Seller and in 40 years in and around the real estate industry, I've yet to see a Broker not present an Offer to Purchase, to the Seller or their Broker.

If it was a VLS Agent, the Broker they are working under, is still required by Florida Law, to present the Offer. When selling pre-owned homes in Florida, VLS is bound by the exact same laws as an MLS Broker. It's only when selling the Developers own inventory, they have some discretion as to how they handle the sales process.

Personally would never bid on a house sight unseen. Also subject to inspection.

Too many dollars involved to buy a pig in a poke.

I wonder if the successful buyer knows that insuring a house due to the roof could be an issue.

well the good news is, you have hundreds of houses to pick from, good hunting.

What is the documentation under Florida law (which I am not familiar with) that gives proof the offer was presented ? Must be something in writing like I suggested.

This whole roof/insurance thing, is mostly a red herring.

Most insurance companies will insure a home, regardless of roof condition.

The problem is, people with 10-15 year old roofs, thinking they can get a brand new roof, if their 15 year old roof is damaged. That's just not reasonable. If a 15 year roof is damaged, your insurance should only be paying you 40%-50% of the value of the roof.

https://floridapace.gov/blog/home-in...f-requirements

Especially when buying pre-owned. The only big advantage of buying pre-owned is that you can see whether the neighbors have potential red flags and if they tend to maintain their homes and landscaping properly.

I had an acquaintance that bought sight un-seen in Southwest Florida and he was angry when the RE agent didn't mention that the home next door had violent hoarders living there with multiple broken down vehicles/boats on their property.

First priority of many agents is to sell the house, the buyer if not happy can always buy another one

Craig, you do not put your heart and soul on the first home you put an offer on. Simply make offer based on a full home inspection and deduct from there based on legitimate findings. As you know and have read on this forum there is plenty of inventory here to move on. You will not compete with cash offers and insulting them further with $5K under. If those cash offers people make stupid errors that is on them since you have done your homework. Do you have a VLS agent to work for you and not just the sellers? It’s summer now so consider renting for a few months while shopping here for a home since the rent is low. You will be better off and make the best on the ground decisions without stressing over the first home offer from afar while enjoying the dream.

You state you "have purchased ten homes in my life" so by now you should know how the process works. Win some, lose some. Learn and move on.

I’m confused. The realtor asked you if you’re prepared to lose the house and you said yes! So you lost it. This has nothing to do with your realtor and everything to do with the seller taking the best and easiest offer. It sounds like they did everything they could for you.

I'm not sure where you're getting this statement.

If the roof is 16+ most underwriters will not write a new policy. There are two that I'm aware of that will write a 20 year roof. None will write a 21+ roof.

Most sales of homes 10 years old or older require a 4 point or Wind Mitigation inspection (or both) before insurance will write the policy. Both inspections include roof information and condition.

I am a licensed, certified, insured and bonded home inspector. I deal with these issues for people every day. I don't make them get the inspections, the insurance company does. On many sales, If they want insurance, they have to change the roof covering. If you have an old or roof of an unknown age, on your home, they will keep raising your rates annually. When you call to complain, they say "get an inspection". When you get the inspection, if roof is 15 years or older, and does not have an expected life of at least 5 years, they can drop the policy.

I quoted the FL law and included a screen shot of what it says. That's where my statement came from.

That's been true in Florida for at least 15 years. How is that unreasonable?

& some how, that isn't reasonable? 60%-70% of the life expectancy of the roof has been used up and folks think an insurance company should pay the FULL VALUE of a NEW roof when their used up roof is damaged?

Don’t see an issue here except for a potential buyer buying a house unseen.

Trust me, this was a good thing. There are hundreds of other homes for sale. You’ll find something you like even better and don’t buy sight unseen. I’ve heard too many horror stories from people that have done that.

Red Hering! Not! Insurance companies ARE flat out refusing to insure homes that have roofs that do not meet their underwriting requirements.

Not sure where the unprofessional part comes into play. What you described is exactly how real estate transactions should be handled per my real estate retired wife who spent 35 years in the industry.

I purchased a home online through a Village realtor. When I arrived to my house from out of state the listing that I saw online versus what I got was completely misrepresented. I have owned 8 homes and this has never happened to me. Without getting into details I decided not to retain an attorney but just move on with my life. Totally unprofessional and they get away with their nonsense because they’re not affiliated with a professional realtor’s association. If people start posting snarky remarks to you on this feed just ignore their remarks and know that your opinion is valid and true. You have to watch it here as it’s different than other areas of the country.

Insurance fraud
 

Most homes that are uninsurable is because of the roofing scam that is causing the insurance industry to walk away from Florida. The scammers check your roof for free (sometimes doing damage ) causing a claim. Florida law states that if 25% of the roof is damaged the entire roof must be replaced. The insurance companies pay the replacement cost because the cost of litigation makes it a losing proposition for them.

Craig, I don't see the problem here, other than you didn't get the house at the offer you made. You knew there was a better offer on the table, and you had an opportunity to improve your offer (which frankly, IMO would have been a mistake on your part) and you chose not to. You invited a counter offer that you verbally indicated you wouldn't accept, so the seller went with the offer already on the table, but wasn't your offer.

Having been in TV now off and on for many years, I have seen some houses planted in locations I would never want to buy. I encourage you to not buy a house without being there in person to evaluate not only the house, but the specific surroundings. You are lucky that right now there are many to choose from. If you are definitely ready to buy, take a couple of weeks and be patient and look around.

Good luck!

Very true, we all know by now where a Realtor's loyalty lies. They are all very entitled, but times change and so do markets. Don't ever buy a home without an independent home inspector checking it out first. ( I mean NOTyour Realtors recommended home inspector )

I agree! So many amazing houses to look at...treat this as a sign it wasn't meant to be and move on...

The villages makes their commission on the full price with a rebate on roof instead of lowering the price by 5k on the house and taking a loss on their commission. Its all about The Villages not the buyer.

A basic principle of contract law is that, if an offer is made, it must fully comply with the seller's conditions. If it doesn't, the deal is dead, and the seller has no obligation to make a counteroffer.

I'm doubt the additional $300 in Commission attributable to a roofing allowance, would lead someone to break the law and put their livelihood at risk.

I'm sorry your experience was poor. I would recommend Shalyn Barker as your VLS agent, she's phenomenal. She listens and is not at all pushy. I would also recommend thinking of purchasing a new or newer home if insurance worries are a factor.

We had two home sales fall through due to insurance issues. We are in a new home and could not be happier. The Florida insurance market does seem to be improving but there is still a long way to go.

I also hope you enjoy your new journey in buying a home. I think finding a better matched VLS agent will make the process more enjoyable for you and it should be enjoyable.

An early 'welcome to The Villages' from me.

Cash is King...they don't have to worry about insurance

The VLS agent did the same thing with me. They are shoddy (not all) and in my case I don't think the offer was presented to the seller. Another buyer came along 2 days later. Then she said I had to pay full price to get the home. I did but WOW!

As others are saying here I'd, I just move on. In my neighborhood in the north of the villages, there are three homes for sale just on my street alone. All of them have been sitting for a long time and the prices keep dropping. This is a great time to buy if you're patient. I bought in 2023 when the market was still strong and prices were still high. I wish I would've waited two years before buying but hindsight's 20/20 I guess. It's also approaching summer now and things will slow down even more. Spring is typically the busy time in real estate so prices are gonna be higher.

Have you thought about doing a long-term rental down here, like say maybe a month or two? The long-term rentals over the summer are substantially cheaper. When I rented for the whole months of July and August (2023) I got a very nice villa in Pennecamp for $2200 per month. That's like half the cost during prime season. This would give you time to see places in person.

I envy you, you're sitting in a very good place.

No there is no written proof that the offer was presented if the seller rejects and does not counter. An offer is written into a contract, so the contract is proof of offer being made by buyer, but if seller reads that contract and disregards it there is no proof that the buyer received that offer. E.g. Seller may be thinking over an offer and then another offer comes in that is better and decide to deal with the new offer. Then first offer is rejected and ignored. There is absolutely no reason or obligation for the seller to sign anything on that rejected offer.

I do not understand what the problem was. The Seller chose to sell to someone else for whatever reason. That is their choice. Move on. Best wishes

You can make any offer you want to a seller of a used house. 4 years ago when things were selling in a couple days, I offered $60k less from asking price and they countered to $50k less. Now, with houses on the market for months (used houses now), depending on what the owner paid for the house, how desperate they are, and how much I wanted to spend or how bad I want the house, you might pay full price or offer hundreds of thousands off the listing price. I would always get an inspection and have a clause to back out of deal or have seller fix the repairs needed.

As for roofs older than 15 years old, yes, an insurance company can refuse covering you unless you get a new roof. I’ve never encountered this in other states, but in Florida, insurance companies require this.

You said:

>>>>>Most insurance companies will insure a home, regardless of roof condition.

This is simply NOT TRUE.

I made no comment on whether an insurer should pay to replace an old roof. I don't believe they should. Anyone that gets a 10ish year old roof replaced for free because of some walk-up roofing dude says it has "damage", likely just cost the rest of us money.

dont let them pressure you there are thousands of homes for sale here, market has slowed down