Tell em
 

I get the general idea that most of the people on the forum really doesnt want Obama back in office. Just a minute before go off on me. I should be plain to see that it is time to commuicate with the younger votes if not everyone under 40 what the history and the way that dictators work . Alot of young people dont know or understand how these people work their majic. The young people didnt have a clue what hit them in Germany. Many didnt see what Castro was trying to do. Educate the young voters we are all teachers because the history that has been taught in school has been altered. We are all old enough to remember back in the 60's and before, our government told us that the USSR was bad and it was but we were told about the propaganda feed to the Russian people, this is happening and has happened right here in this country. If we have four more years of the current administration we will be left with no USA, I dont care about party I'm talking about the man. He has no party. This is not about what party to follow. And dont forget about the ones that are office that are following him. OK I'm off my soap box.

I have tried and it has surprised me on how disengaged so many of them are and worse yet that they have little if any education of history, civics and geograpy. However they know a lot about culture diversity, sex education,etc

If you asked the young people which newspaper their parents have delivered at home, most would probably say they've never had one delivered. If you asked what TV news networks the parents watch, it is probably abc, nbc, cbs or cnn.

Even if you can't stand Limbaugh on radio or FoxNews, there is a place for hearing an opposing viewpoint and then go reading further on other internet sites to learn more facts on both sides of an issue. Many people do not do that....they stick to only one network news on the net, even when they could read from 25 in an hour.

Also try reading non USA media/reports. Usually much more direct and uncluttered with partisan agendas.

btk

We need to educate what is happening . But above all tell them the truth not some fantasy that a politition wants them to beleive. Education of the truth is the strongest tool of life. TELL EM By the way I am neither rep. or dem. but if it comes to it I am rep. all the way. GET HIM OUT

Re-elect him!!!

Unfortunately, culture diversity, sex ed, global warming, save the rain forest, tolerance, etc are the subjects that have taken up the time in classrooms for the last 30 years that I know of. We were always shocked when the kids came home touting the last propaganda. It was a difficult struggle to teach them to weed out the facts and keep them focusing on the important things. Now we are reaping the crop of brainwashed adults who haven't a clue about how and why this country had worked so well for the first 200 years (if that many).

Just watch Jay Lennon's show when he does "the jaywalking" segment and see how little some of the younger generation DON'T know!

Joannel-

Of course, you know it is the Jay Leno show, not Lennon. Fingers slipped, didn't they?

The JayWalking segment is done for the "15 Minutes of Fame" idea. The producers do not show you the interviewees who know all the answers. It is my idea that the ones who give the stupidest answers and get on the segment are doing it just to be on television.

Can We Blame Them?
 

Sad to say, but it's pretty clear that the younger generations have quietly given up on the antics in Washington that we call "government".

That's not to say that they don't believe in a democratic form of government. It's just that what they've seen in Washington for the last 10-15 years isn't anything they want any part of. Remember, 10-15 years is a large propoertion of their whole lives.

Can we blame them?

Katz,

I can see and understand your viewpoint on education.

However, don't you believe it is very important to teach culture diversity, sex ed, environmental science, save the rain forest, and tolerance in schools in addition to the core subjects such as math, science, history, civics, English, etc?

I agree with you VK but the problem is they vote and not really knowing what they are voting for.

I asked my mother-in-law who she was voting for years ago and she said The Democrat. I asked then why, since the Dem running was way off target in my opinion and her answer was: Well, Jim always voted for the democrat. Jim was then passed husband. That is what made me begin to consider the person and not the party. I will vote for who I think is the best man even if it goes against my GOP roots.

TV II it is obvious you won't be voting for Obama....eh?

btk

Not likely, but there are a few in the race that would cause me to stay home that day and not vote at all. I keep hoping for a Rubia, Christie or even Romney to take the lead.

There are only so many hours in a school day for students, and TIME for teaching the classic core curriculum has been sacrificed to allow for TIME to teach the social engineering stuff.

Culture diversity, by the way, is best learned by studying and learning foreign languages and travel, and for the most part, our nation does ZIP for teaching foreign language before age 10 when kids' minds hear and absorb it best.

"Tolerance" does not need direct teaching about certain groups. Tolerance is learned from parents and teachers' and administrators' role modeling. If everyone is treated the same by the adults in charge, there is no need to teach "tolerance" in a classroom and textbook method. If the adult in charge does not show tolerance, they are pulled from duty.

The teacher in Mt. Dora who stated dislike for gay marriage on his personal Facebook page, on his personal computer and personal time, is an example of how swiftly "tolerance" is imposed. In the end, I doubt many student minds were changed by that incident, except that there's a lesson in it that censorship of your personal life is alive and well.

I do understand what you are saying about time constraints in schools for teaching the usual subjects as well as "social engineering" subjects. That is a valid point.

You do also make a good point about teaching tolerance toward others but that does not always work out if the parents themselves are intolerant of others. In my belief, that is one area that needs more addressing in schools.

Learning foreign language before age 10 has been tried through many immersion programs. It is a very interesting concept but difficult to continue.

Thanks for your viewpoints.

What if the best man is a woman?

LOL, My wife, my two daughters and my two grand-daughters will love ya for that. I try to watch my chauvinism, but it will come through if I let my guard down. :bigbow:

My hubby is having lunch with you on Tuesday...

No and further even if I did it's pretty clear that its all one sided. Further most of this ought to be left to parents whose obligation are to install core values. Take sex education as an example. So many schools hand out condoms obviously to promote save sex and reduce preganancy. Yet they don't place any or little value on restrain, respect for themselves and their bodies, and the potential for remorse because of acting so impulsively.

Why is virginity so badly debased in schools in movies on tv sit coms, etc.

To set such a goal takes determination courage, a clear view/vsion restraint individualism and a great self respect for oneself. But it isn't celebrated.
In fact romance is equated with immediate gratification with sex.

I feel so sorry for the last 3-4 generations whom many never had the opportunity to know the pure process of courting and the evolving of true love and friendship. Believe me it is a difficult process for young healthy teens but the end result has never ending benefits.

As for many of the other issues such as saving the rain forest, the environment etc they can be included in corse sciene courses, etc.

The fact is our society has subordinated parents responsibilities to schools. Schools by the way where we are now seeing more and more teachers who seem to have breach their trust and so many other infractions..

Then we can expect the Democratic party to give her the same level of support afforded Hillary.:icon_wink:

Rubicon,

You are spot on that environmental science should (as is) being included in the core science classes in school.

As to the sex education being left to parents - we have all seen how that works. Even a strict "family values" person like Sarah Palin has a daughter that got pregnant - in her parent's home. You say it is the parent's obligation to instill core values in their children. If a person such as Sarah Palin cannot properly teach core values and control of teenage urges to her daughter, what chances do other parent have? If Bristol and Levi had a school-issued condom, the preganancy might have been avoided.

I do agree with you 100% about the sexually charged programs on television and in the movies not stressing love.

We're talking politics here for crying out load not sex education get with it. This is the problem stay on course. Suppose you are going to twist that

Yes, we should all throw our values out the door because someone's daughter got pregnant. Your logic is suspect at best.

Sex education?-NOResponsibility of the family to teach their version of value attached to intimate personal relationships. As far as having your daughter (and son, I might add) be part of an unwed, unplanned pregnancy-you can lead a horse to water, but the choice to drink is his!
Tolerance in schools?-ABSOLUTELYSelf control and respect of yourself and others. Blind obedience to allowing yourself to be abused and others exalted at your expense, NO Accept mindset that it is your fault that others have bought the victim mindset, NO
Save the rainforest? NO There are plenty of "save the______" issues out there that should be chosen on an individual basis. What right does the public school have to use tax dollars to promote one over the other.
Cultural Diversity? NOAll people are different. All people have traits that are very similar too. Why not focus on those traits and practices that unite us instead of those that divide? Or at least equal time for both...Ever heard the saying "divide and conquer"?
Environmental science? SURE But the foundations of scientific method needs to be emphasized and theories need to be put to those tests, no just blindly believed because told to.
Excellent responses also were posted by rubicon, ilovetv, and villagegolfer also. There is only so much time for the education process to take place. It needs to be restricted to the 3 R's-Reading, (w)riting, and (a)rithmetic. After that people need to be taught to think for themselves with the information that they can gather and make rational, informed and proven conclusions. Not enough of that going on in schools for ages. Which is better, someone who can spit out the requested information or someone who can think on their own and invent and discover and make improvements in this world?

Katz and others:

Katz says, "Sex education?-NO - Responsibility of the family to teach their version of value attached to intimate personal relationships."

Once again, I have to bring up, "As to the sex education being left to parents - we have all seen how that works. Even a strict "family values" person like Sarah Palin has a daughter that got pregnant - in her parent's home. You say it is the parent's obligation to instill core values in their children. If a person such as Sarah Palin cannot properly teach core values and control of teenage urges to her daughter, what chances do other parent have? If Bristol and Levi had a school-issued condom, the preganancy might have been avoided.

If the FAMILY VALUES governor of a state can have an unmarried teenage daughter have a baby, it certainly shows that home sex education did not work.

1. we must teach our children that everybody in America is treated equally under the law. We are after all a nation of laws and not one of morals.

2. If you are of the Judeo-Christian culture may teach her children that homosexuality is a perversion in the eyes of God.

I see nothing wrong with that as long as you referred to 1 above.

Do we have our teachers teach our children that their religion is false? Do we teach them that their parents are wrong to follow the word of God? Should our teachers be telling our students/children which religion is the correct one?

Cultural diversity or the lack thereof should be taught at home. Cultural diversity has never helped any culture. Like a culturally diverse Europe. Cultural diversity has not been helping them very much.

In my personal opinion which may or may not meet with your approval is that as long as we teach number 1 above and live by it, we will be free to have teachers educate our children in more qualified things such as reading and writing and arithmetic.

Just an opinion you may accept or reject it at any time.

I have many wonderful friends with strong family values who have had great success with the abstinence based sex education they taught their children. Their kids are all now young adults who value their virginity. On the other hand, had Miss Palin not gotten pregnant, we would never have been able to witness the loving acceptance of the child and his father into the Palin family. I would say that they walk the talk. Kudos to the Palin's. No abortion necessary, love is the answer, Bristol is now speaking out against pre-marital sex...I could go on...We all make mistakes. None of us is perfect, but it is certainly nice to know that there are places where we are forgiven. I think that is the ultimate value lesson!

Man, calm down. Please go back and read what you just said. Do you sound like a compassionate liberal? I think not, I feel you are rather narrow in your thinking.

Damn straight....America for Americans. Oh that's right; Americans came from Europe...Africa against their will....and then, doggone it they started coming from Asia and South America....and flooding across the Mexican border. Oh what are we to do? :cus:

I am still so PO'ed about that....

If I might take a stab at what he was saying. Of course all our ancestors came here from another country. They came to this melting pot to be part of America. They came to America for the freedom we have. Most of them even took to the english language and abandoned their own. America as one is strong.

Katz, very nice posting you did. I only have one area to take issue with and that is "had Miss Palin not gotten pregnant, we would never have been able to witness the loving acceptance of the child and his father into the Palin family."

Yes, everyone in the family did accept the child - and Levi - at first. Bristol and Levi were paraded around as an engaged couple with their baby. Sarah then lost her race to be VP. Engagement was quckly off. Levi writes a tell-all book about the Palins. The sugar-coated lovey dovey act of Levi and Bristol (and closeness to the family for Levi) probably was just an act while Grandma Palin was running for office.

Bristol's now preaching abstinence as the proper birth control procedure. Basically, isn't that sort of like Lindsay Lohan preaching about dangers of drugs?

My grandmother arrived in America as a toddler. She and her parents taught us that America is a melting pot! They celebrated the fact that they could come here and start a new life and live as richly or poorly as they wanted, dependant on the amount of work they put into it. Americans ARE Americans by the melting pot definition. Africans were brought here against their will but many Americans died to release them from the bonds of slavery and we continue to make ammends via affirmative action and welfare. (I personally could not and never have bought or sold another person) If a person feels the need to continue to identify with the land from which they came instead of embracing their American identity, they are free to return to the place that holds their allegiance.

I do understand your point of view and as we have all witnessed many politicians actively attempt to skirt family value issues, etc. because their focus is on foreign policy, economics, defense...However, to counter a country without a moral imperative will simply flounder. Many Americans born in the 1940-50's no longer recognize their own country. Baseball fans would say as batters we have stepped out of the batters box causing our averages to drop.

Core values, our beleif systems determine whether our elected officials utilize their power properly (Hitler v Lincoln). so too many this is about politics.

My friend buggyone believes sex education is essential and should be taught in schools. Yet statistics to date indicate that teen pregnancy and single mom's are at an all time high. Worse yet STD's among teens is also. so that begs the question How effective are the school programs? And if they are not why are they failing?

Katzpajamas is so on point. If only schools would go back to teaching students how to think, how do make logical choices. for example do you know how long ago kids no longer had to diagram a sentence . It has gotten to a point that jouirnalist majors need a remedial course before they can enter college. Listen to the news casters and you will hear that say Its "so fun"Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Schools should also get up on the two hind quarters and explain to parents tha education is a priviledge to be earned year in and year out. and if their child does not want to learn then s/he neeeds to experience he consequences. When my kids came home and complained about a teacher I listened careful to make sure it wasn't more than just a personality clash. Upon which I explained that it was my childs responsibility to find a way to work with that teacher,,because the rerality was that teacher had sway over that class. By accomplishing a truce of sorts would bode well in future years
I'm certain many reading this post are nodding their heads in agreement

But schools cannot do that along and now we are back to politicians

Most of us learned that life is not fair but many us of us had parents realisitic enough to simply say "that's life" make the wisest choices you can then hang on for the ride. And has I recollect DDoug started a thread with "Tell Them" and that is good advice.

The "Melting Pot" really is not so much of a melting pot but rather a stew pot where the various ingredients blend in the stew to make it taste very good but the ingredients still hold their original flavor

Most large cities such as New York has sections such as Chinatown, Little Italy, Little Saigon, an Orthodox Jewish area (Boro Park), Brighton Beach (Russian), and so forth. All of these have separate entities but then blend together for one great city.

If you just have cultural diversity taught at home, there is a possibility the parent might be a bigot and pass that on to the child. This is something that must be dealt with in schools and through community action programs.

Good post, especially those mentions of family responsibility instead of public schools. My wife taught for over 30 years and thus am very sensitive to what you say

You may find the attacked link from todays NY Times of interest..an editorial on the teaching profession which I think you may agree with.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/03/op...=1&ref=opinion

And thanks for not using the Palin family for any example !

Charter Schools
 

Whether you are for or against unions, this is a great article to read.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...066414112.html

47.4 million: Students in public schools*
3.3 million: Teachers in public schools*
1 million: Students in charter schools
72,000: Teachers in charter schools