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-   -   Are backup generators allowed? (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/backup-generators-allowed-70994/)

elizabeth52 02-23-2013 06:37 PM

Are backup generators allowed?
 
Hi, we just returned from a Lifestyle Preview visit and fell in love with the Villages. We have selected our home model but we are wondering if anyone knows if we can put in a back up generator for power failures?

Shimpy 02-23-2013 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elizabeth52 (Post 631582)
Hi, we just returned from a Lifestyle Preview visit and fell in love with the Villages. We have selected our home model but we are wondering if anyone knows if we can put in a back up generator for power failures?

I'm sure you can. I got rid of mine when I moved here 3 years ago from S. Florida. I had a portable one and I think you are probably speaking about an installed one. In my opinion you'd just be wasting your money. We have underground electric here and any power outages only last a few minutes and are rare.

elevatorman 02-23-2013 07:01 PM

Been here almost 4 years and have never been without power.

buggyone 02-23-2013 07:06 PM

Longest power failure in over 3 years here in The Villages was less than 30 minutes. One time. No others.

Rebel Pirate 02-23-2013 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elizabeth52 (Post 631582)
Hi, we just returned from a Lifestyle Preview visit and fell in love with the Villages. We have selected our home model but we are wondering if anyone knows if we can put in a back up generator for power failures?

Yes, you can put in a back-up generator, but the developer's builders will not build/include that as an original build/equipment option. There are many things you might think of that are 'good ideas' that are permitted, but that the builders won't do. But, the things that might be included on this list change over time.

As an example, when we were designing our new home, we asked about having a humidistat installed as part of the original HVAC design/build. We were told it could be done after the fact but that they were not permitted to even offer it as an option. Surprise...when our home was finished, a separate humidistat was installed and we were told that in the intervening three months that including a humidistat had become required by code. (Wow!!) Also, we were told at the same time that within the year, all newly built homes at TV would have an integrated thermostat/humidistat rather than two separate control systems as were installed in our home.

So, anything you'd like to have built into your new home, I recommend asking. If you really want it, ask several times. There were some items/changes we asked about three or four times that we were told could not be done and we gave up asking...and then later we were told "Oh, that (option you requested); they're going to do that."

Do lots of homework. You can't be too prepared if you're going to build new.

rayschic 02-23-2013 07:08 PM

Been here 7 years and never had an outage.

Rebel Pirate 02-23-2013 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shimpy (Post 631594)
I'm sure you can. I got rid of mine when I moved here 3 years ago from S. Florida. I had a portable one and I think you are probably speaking about an installed one. In my opinion you'd just be wasting your money. We have underground electric here and any power outages only last a few minutes and are rare.

A backup generator is a 'different type' of insurance policy. I've never experienced a house fire, but I still buy fire insurance. I don't have a backup generator installed - but when I move to TV full time we will probably have that done. I hope to never have to use it, but if 'the big one' happens, we'll be ready. If 'the big one' happens, it's too late to do anything about it. The fact that you've never seen a black swan should not be interpreted as evidence that black swans do not exist. (Read "The Black Swan" by Nassim Nicholas Taleb) I've seen enough black swans in my life to know that they do exist. Each of us needs to identify those black swans for which - if they ever fly into your yard - you'll be certain you want to be prepared. I prepare for some and not for others. Many people just assume they don't exist.

Chazz 02-23-2013 07:44 PM

I was effected by the tornado in 2007. Wished we had a generator back then. That said, we didn't get one after that event, either.

Jim 9922 02-23-2013 09:40 PM

No problem having one installed. A whole house generator came with our resale house. About the only use it gets is its weekly automatic 15 minute exercise run. In 4 years our neighborhood power has been out for less than an hour 3 or 4 times and once for 4 hours. Would I buy one on my own, probably not, but TV has not experience a big hurricane in many, many years. None of my meighbors have a large back-up system, so I assume we would have a lot of house guests if the "big one" hits TV. As long as they bring steaks and wine, it would be party time for all!

UpNorth 02-23-2013 10:14 PM

Just because you haven't had a major power outage since you've lived here, doesn't mean that one is impossible. With hackers trying to get into our electrical grid, who knows when or if they would be successful. Now, picture The villages without electricity for 4 or 5 days - it can happen. When the power does go down in other parts of the country, the unprepared panic and quickly wipe out all available generators. If you don't mind the idea of having your food spoil and living in the dark (and maybe cold) for several days, keep telling yourself you don't need a generator backup.

graciegirl 02-23-2013 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebel Pirate (Post 631613)
A backup generator is a 'different type' of insurance policy. I've never experienced a house fire, but I still buy fire insurance. I don't have a backup generator installed - but when I move to TV full time we will probably have that done. I hope to never have to use it, but if 'the big one' happens, we'll be ready. If 'the big one' happens, it's too late to do anything about it. The fact that you've never seen a black swan should not be interpreted as evidence that black swans do not exist. (Read "The Black Swan" by Nassim Nicholas Taleb) I've seen enough black swans in my life to know that they do exist. Each of us needs to identify those black swans for which - if they ever fly into your yard - you'll be certain you want to be prepared. I prepare for some and not for others. Many people just assume they don't exist.

What is "the big one"?

Jim 9922 02-24-2013 10:44 AM

Gracie, I assume the "big one" is an all out hurricane that devastates the local infrastructure, at least it won't be a blizzard /ice storm.

One other thing to consider about whole house generators in TV. Many areas do not have natural gas service and so you would need an underground gasoline tank (probably prohibited and how do you keep all that gas fresh) or a propane tank. Then how big a tank and where do you get refills during a disaster? Hopefully the natural gas supply continues during a disaster, but who really knows. Never been there to try it.

billethkid 02-24-2013 10:55 AM

last summer I can remember saying that we had not had a power outage since living in TV....then 9 years.....the very next day our power went out for a couple of hours!!!!

Yes back up generators are allowed. There are the portable and the fixed installation (which is no more unsightly than pool and spa and waterfall equipment).

The fixed installation is more expensive, but can have significantly more power...as in whole house....and works automatically...the power blinks off then on comes the generator and a blink later back in business.

The portables are usually smaller in capacity and target specic circuits. Even if one does not own a generator, when building new, have a circuit put in place for a generator. Ya never know.

Regarding the "big one" getting ready requires more than being able to light the lights and watch television.....remember the better prepared you are the more you will find how many friends you never knew you had :)

btk

Trayderjoe 02-24-2013 11:12 AM

Insurance and Odds
 
IMO, it comes down to your own "comfort" level as to whether or not to pay for the "insurance policy" of having a backup generator. What is your goal for the generator? Are you protecting your home (such as in the north where you might want a generator so that you don't lose power/heat and have your water pipes burst)? Since the weather in the Villages does not get that cold for an extended period of time, no worries there. Do you have valuables in your home (paintings for example) that you would be protecting from heat/humidity if you lost your A/C? Are they easily transportable? Or is it that you would not have to worry about having lights, being able to turn your TV on (assuming that your service provider is still operating), throwing out spoiled food from your refrigerator, etc.?

I would submit that you could move to a hotel (yes it might not be in the immediate area), have some nice meals and, yes need to restock the refrigerator-but you could do it multiple times before you would recoup your return on the cost of purchasing and installing the generator. What are the "odds" that a significant power loss will occur that would trigger the need for the generator or to move to other accommodations until power is restored? Anecdotal evidence presented by previous posters indicates that power losses are very uncommon and not long lasting.

I'll defer on discussions of the "big one" scenario as I would presume we might have a lot more to consider than just power. Some people who lived through the tornado that went through our Village couldn't live in their homes due to the damage-if they had a generator, it wasn't doing them any good.

So if you have the money, and would sleep better at night by knowing that you have an "insurance policy" in your back pocket, "git er done". I think that I will use the money for wine, women, and song. Uh, check that, my lovely wife wouldn't like the women part of that........:duck: :)

:posting:

perrjojo 02-24-2013 02:28 PM

Atlanta is as far north as I have ever lived. Have never had a generator or known anyone who did. (Except for during the millennium scare. Thankfully We have never needed it.

batman911 02-24-2013 03:31 PM

Anyone know the price range of installed whole house generators? I would not rely on natural gas as a fuel source. Natural gas service can be lost in a wide spread electrical outage. Better to bury a large propane tank.

Shimpy 02-24-2013 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UpNorth (Post 631712)
Just because you haven't had a major power outage since you've lived here, doesn't mean that one is impossible. With hackers trying to get into our electrical grid, who knows when or if they would be successful. Now, picture The villages without electricity for 4 or 5 days - it can happen. When the power does go down in other parts of the country, the unprepared panic and quickly wipe out all available generators. If you don't mind the idea of having your food spoil and living in the dark (and maybe cold) for several days, keep telling yourself you don't need a generator backup.


So what do you think, should I have a bomb shelter built just in case also? LOL To tell you the truth I lived in S. Fla. and recently 3 times had to throw away food in 2 years. The last storm I had a generator (portable). It made so much noise that I couldn't run it all night or the neighbors would complain not to mention that we couldn't sleep also. As far as TV is concerned it would be way cheaper to throw away some food than buying and maintaining a whole house generator. This area we live in seems to be fairly safe from hurricanes and doesn't warrant having an installed whole house generator which would be quieter and would be a good choice in more hurricane prone areas. Next time a storm approaches here, I'm going to fill my 5 or 6 five gallon gas cans and head for the mountains for a vacation if we loose power.

Mack184 02-24-2013 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebel Pirate (Post 631613)
A backup generator is a 'different type' of insurance policy. I've never experienced a house fire, but I still buy fire insurance. I don't have a backup generator installed - but when I move to TV full time we will probably have that done. I hope to never have to use it, but if 'the big one' happens, we'll be ready. If 'the big one' happens, it's too late to do anything about it. The fact that you've never seen a black swan should not be interpreted as evidence that black swans do not exist. (Read "The Black Swan" by Nassim Nicholas Taleb) I've seen enough black swans in my life to know that they do exist. Each of us needs to identify those black swans for which - if they ever fly into your yard - you'll be certain you want to be prepared. I prepare for some and not for others. Many people just assume they don't exist.

Nassim Taleb!?! Do you also read James Howard Kunstler?

Jim 9922 02-24-2013 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by batman911 (Post 632045)
Anyone know the price range of installed whole house generators? I would not rely on natural gas as a fuel source. Natural gas service can be lost in a wide spread electrical outage. Better to bury a large propane tank.

Not cheap. About $4,000 for a 16,000 watt generator with a 100 amp switch box which will only cover part of your house, maybe $1,000 to wire it all up and move the necessary circuts, and who knows how much for an underground tank large enough to run for how many days. You'd probably want a tank with 1/3 more capacity than you would need for the duration of your anticipated outage. The gererator exercises itself each week so it is constantly using fuel and thus your tank is never full.

Rebel Pirate 02-26-2013 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 631717)
What is "the big one"?

Ah, the big one?! (Sorry for leaving that hanging out there...) It is any event caused by (fill in your own preferred natural or man-made disaster) resulting in a power outage that lasts long enough to cause one to exclaim "Gadzooks, I should have installed an emergency generator last year!!" That event could range from the usual weather suspects such as hurricane, tornado, to the more exotic hacker-triggered electrical grid failure.

Let's not forget we're all products of our upbringing and our own personal experiences. Although I try to be rational when making decisions, I'm not unlike anyone else - emotions (based on prior experiences) are ever present.

For example, we did not buy owner's title insurance when we bought our property here in TV, and I suspect that is contrary to the VAST majority of other owners. Thirty years ago I lived where the title became clouded for all real estate in the entire community...even that real estate that was "covered" by title insurance. Title insurance covers against some - but not all - challenges to clear title. It became virtually impossible for anyone to sell their homes for years due to no fault of the owners. Although there are other considerations that influenced my decision, that experience certainly colors my decision making.

In contrast, I will probably will buy electrical-outage insurance (an emergency generator) since I've lived through a couple hurricanes, one of which resulted in no power for three weeks, which made daily life not only inconvenient but very uncomfortable. (During this period the propane trucks continued their deliveries.) We all make our decisions with both logical and emotional influences; I believe we are more confident in our decisions when we are able to understand and identify those influences.

gadaboutgal 02-27-2013 12:40 AM

We were living in Glenbrook when one of the 2004 Florida hurricanes (there were four in August and September) criss-crossed the state. One passed through Orlando as it crossed the state. One came across just above us by about 10 miles in south Ocala, and the brunt of it's winds knocked down a large oak tree on Talley Ridge. The oak took out the transformer for this area. Half of our street lost power for two days until they could repair it!

senior citizen 02-27-2013 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rebel Pirate (Post 631613)
A backup generator is a 'different type' of insurance policy. I've never experienced a house fire, but I still buy fire insurance. I don't have a backup generator installed - but when I move to TV full time we will probably have that done. I hope to never have to use it, but if 'the big one' happens, we'll be ready. If 'the big one' happens, it's too late to do anything about it. The fact that you've never seen a black swan should not be interpreted as evidence that black swans do not exist. (Read "The Black Swan" by Nassim Nicholas Taleb) I've seen enough black swans in my life to know that they do exist. Each of us needs to identify those black swans for which - if they ever fly into your yard - you'll be certain you want to be prepared. I prepare for some and not for others. Many people just assume they don't exist.


I agree. We'd want a generator.........but I'm fairly sure I remember being told that they are not allowed.

I'm glad to read now that I was given the wrong information and that they are allowed. It would give us peace of mind. Everyone up here has generators......some are even investing in whole house generators.

In 1994 our home in Vermont sold to survivors of Hurricane Andrew in coastal Florida........she was so traumatized by the lack of electricity in the sweltering heat and humidity when their roof blew off........that they relocated to Vermont, only to complain about our climate.........but what she told me about the lines and lines waiting for water in the hot bright sun.........makes us want a generator "just in case" even if we never had to use it.

Just like we wouldn't want to go without heat up here.......living without air conditioning down there would be difficult, to say the least.

Anyway, I'm relieved to read now that people do have generators in TV.

Cantwaittoarrive 02-27-2013 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UpNorth (Post 631712)
Just because you haven't had a major power outage since you've lived here, doesn't mean that one is impossible. With hackers trying to get into our electrical grid, who knows when or if they would be successful. Now, picture The villages without electricity for 4 or 5 days - it can happen. When the power does go down in other parts of the country, the unprepared panic and quickly wipe out all available generators. If you don't mind the idea of having your food spoil and living in the dark (and maybe cold) for several days, keep telling yourself you don't need a generator backup.

:agree: Its like saying I don't need life insurance because I've lived xx years and have never died so far

buggyone 02-27-2013 09:12 AM

Don't forget that if you are planning to get that huge underground propane tank that it will need approval by the Architectural Review Board.

Personally, I would not be happy if my neighbor put one on his property. I would be concerned about an explosion.

batman911 02-27-2013 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 633546)
Don't forget that if you are planning to get that huge underground propane tank that it will need approval by the Architectural Review Board.

Personally, I would not be happy if my neighbor put one on his property. I would be concerned about an explosion.

I think you may be suprised to know how many you already have in your neighborhood if you live in one of the newer villages without natural gas service. I have one in the front yard, as do several of my neighbors. I see no more danger of explosion than having natural gas. Everything is under ground until it reaches the point of use. Most farm houses have propane tanks above ground and I have never heard of one exploding.

jbdlfan 02-27-2013 01:21 PM

Had a conversation just recently around this type of issue. When we were young, we had home canned foods in our basement, my dad had a gun rack in the house, we hunted in the fall and winter, fished in the spring and summer and always had enough around if we needed it. That was common sense when I was young. Be prepared!
Now, people think you should be wearing a tin foil hat and be called a prepper if you do any of these activities. If we lost the power grid, people around here would be in deep doo-doo.

mulligan 02-27-2013 03:04 PM

If we get a storm bad enough to cause that severe a power outage, we probably will have been given an evacuation order. I'm outa here in a heartbeat. Remember all the people stuck in Gulfport and New Orleans after Katrina?

graciegirl 02-27-2013 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by batman911 (Post 633661)
I think you may be suprised to know how many you already have in your neighborhood if you live in one of the newer villages without natural gas service. I have one in the front yard, as do several of my neighbors. I see no more danger of explosion than having natural gas. Everything is under ground until it reaches the point of use. Most farm houses have propane tanks above ground and I have never heard of one exploding.

I am not sure if this is relevant, but all eight homes that have burnt to the ground here in The Villages from lightning strikes in the last seven years had gas lines running through their attic. Running gas lines through the attic is code here in this area.

This area of central Florida is the lightning capital of the U.S.

There are pluses and minuses to everything. In five years living here in TV, we have lost power three or four times and the longest was a couple of hours.

We have never owned a generator and needed one only once in Ohio when hurricane winds somehow got inland and blew down a lot of stuff and we were without power for three days.

I guess you bring with you the ways you dealt with things back where you are from. Nothing wrong with that.

UpNorth 02-27-2013 04:32 PM

If cost is a concern, get a 2000 watt Honda for about $1000. Small, very quiet, and able to run your refrigerator, charge your cell phone, and give you lights at night. No, it won't run your whole house all at once, but it will keep you going with the essentials. You can run it all night on a gallon of gas or less. These are the small red generators that most of the vendors use on "Market Night". Extremely quiet and efficient, although "expensive" per watt.

USSGompers 02-27-2013 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadaboutgal (Post 633432)
We were living in Glenbrook when one of the 2004 Florida hurricanes (there were four in August and September) criss-crossed the state. One passed through Orlando as it crossed the state. One came across just above us by about 10 miles in south Ocala, and the brunt of it's winds knocked down a large oak tree on Talley Ridge. The oak took out the transformer for this area. Half of our street lost power for two days until they could repair it!

We also did not have power for 2 days during that time. I now have battery powered fans and a Coleman cook stove in case of another emergency.

It was Damn HOT!! We didn't have Wi-Fi then so we were out TV, computers, etc. We had our radio though and tons of candles and lantern lights.

Be prepared. It can happen again

janmcn 02-27-2013 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadaboutgal (Post 633432)
We were living in Glenbrook when one of the 2004 Florida hurricanes (there were four in August and September) criss-crossed the state. One passed through Orlando as it crossed the state. One came across just above us by about 10 miles in south Ocala, and the brunt of it's winds knocked down a large oak tree on Talley Ridge. The oak took out the transformer for this area. Half of our street lost power for two days until they could repair it!

I never lost power or cable during the four hurricanes in 2004 in Santiago, nor during the tornado in 2007 in Poinciana, even though my neighborhood was decimated, never lost power when my house was struck by lightning in 2006.

Rebel Pirate 02-27-2013 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cantwaittoarrive (Post 633466)
:agree: Its like saying I don't need life insurance because I've lived xx years and have never died so far

That's a perfect description, Cantwaittoarrive.

This reminds me of the story about the 75 year old man who was on his deathbed in the hospital with 2nd/3rd degree burns over most of his body after a gas pump explosion; he had been fueling his pickup truck while smoking a cigarette. He said "I've been smoking while gasing up my truck for 55 years; I can't believe this happened." (By the way, this was a Grampaw Pettibone story from a LONG time ago, so I don't have a link to it.)

Chellybean 05-04-2014 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 633546)
don't forget that if you are planning to get that huge underground propane tank that it will need approval by the architectural review board.

Personally, i would not be happy if my neighbor put one on his property. I would be concerned about an explosion.

wrong you don,t need approval, its underground!

mulligan 05-04-2014 12:18 PM

Chelly is correct. All you need is a permit from the county.

greg&sueby 05-04-2014 01:58 PM

backup generator
 
I had a whole house generator installed when i lived in Michigan. It ran about 7000.00, ran on natural gas. It requires upkeep every year. (tuneup, oil change, filter).
and ebout every 4-5 years a new battery. Having it done is about 200.00 per year. In mich. i was concerned about freezing in the winter. Here in the villages,
that is no concern. If you want it to run your AC, it will cost about 10,000.00.
A portable requires to much gas, or bottles of propane. If you add the cost of a underground tank, i believe the cost is to high. I have a extra freezer, and if i threw away everything i am out only around 500.00 or so. I just keep battery lights, candles, and a portable stove with fuel. and of course my bbq, with extra tank of fuel. :wave:

Halibut 05-04-2014 10:45 PM

As a sort of middle measure for short outages, we have a couple of UPS units that will keep the router, computer, TV, and lamps going for 2-3 hours, or let us charge the phones if we need to. Prices are around $100-$200.

Indydealmaker 05-05-2014 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halibut (Post 873138)
As a sort of middle measure for short outages, we have a couple of UPS units that will keep the router, computer, TV, and lamps going for 2-3 hours, or let us charge the phones if we need to. Prices are around $100-$200.

I would love to know more about your UPS units. Mine will only power the computer for a few minutes.

Halibut 05-05-2014 06:56 AM

Quote:

I would love to know more about your UPS units. Mine will only power the computer for a few minutes.
Wow, that doesn't seem right. Are they very old? We have two of the models I linked, one for the TV and satellite receiver and the other for the router. We've never run them completely down, but the display estimates how long you have left and they start at 2.5 to 3 hours. We've only had two outages that I remember, but I guess we did unplug the laptops and let them run on their own batteries.

I mostly like that they kick in for those transient outage blips that would otherwise cause the satellite receiver to restart. Heaven forbid The Good Wife is recording and we lose 5 minutes in the middle of a trial. :)

Fanman 05-28-2014 07:59 AM

I am going to have a stand-by backup generator installed and would like to here from anyone else who has. I'm looking for a good company to install and maintain it. Coming from New England I am all to familiar with power loss due Mother Nature. I hope I never have to use it but isn't that the way house insurance also, we buy but hope to never use it.


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