How is "income" defined ?
 

I will be retiring in a few years and I am just wondering how income is defined and measured at that point. I saw a demographic that the average household income in TV was 93K. My retirement plan is made up of 3 major components. They are my pension, Social Security and a 401K. Would my income be the total of the pension, social security and whatever I decide to take out of my 401 K per year ? Or, would it also include any interest my 401K earned that particular year when they are measuring household income ? I know I still wouldn't have to pay tax on the interest until withdrawal so I know from an IRS poit of view it doesn't count as income until distributed, but when they put together these demographics, do they include that interest ?

Just a guess, but I would think it is what is reported as income to the IRS. Any W2, 1099, SS, and other pension income.

First of all, I think it's been said in other discussions here that the 93K average or median includes a lot of people who own homes here but are not retired yet and thus still earning sizable incomes. That skews the average. I know for a fact that there are residents whose only income is Social Security. Let someone else answer the other part of your question.













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info not available?
 

I am not really sure from whence these statistics come. I don't remember offering such info when I bought 4 years ago, and even if they get it from Citizens Mortgage that would include only a fraction of buyers - many, many pay cash and many others use other banks/credit unions/mortgage companies for financing.

Anyone know where this info comes from? And I agree, many buy while still working, might be counting joint incomes, etc.

Not to dissuade anyone from answering the question but who cares about what is reported as the average TV income.

All any of us really care about is: Can I make MY retirement work? There are homes in TV from 100K to over 1M. There is something for everyone. And you know what? They all live the same basic TV lifestyle. So I wouldn't worry too much about your concern. It seems like you have a good handle on what your income will be and where it will come from. From there make a budget and see what that income will support.

My guess would be that since 401 interest is not reportable to the IRS then it would not be included in any average income calculation.

Just my 2C.

SS
 

I wonder what percentage of population in Villages rely on Social Security alone.

agree with Russ
 

Good point, Russ. As a matter of fact, one of the things we like most about The Villages as compared to other retirement communities is the variety.

Although I haven't lived in them, appears to me that many other retirement communities, particularly when they are built around a (single) golf course with 1 clubhouse/restaurant/rec center, are kind of like belonging to a country club.

Everyone knows, and some care, what job position you retired from, how much you made, what co. you owned, etc. I'm sure they're not all like this, but that's my perception. Maybe I'm wrong.

After 4 years of owning and visiting in The Villages, and talking to a lot of people I meet while golfing, at the pool, etc., seems to me that the major focus here is what activities you like to do, new restaurants, golf carts, new anything in the immediate vicinity of The Villages. I just get a different feeling here - and I think those who care about such status things aren't usually attracted to The Villages anyway - they might be looking for a more homogeneous community of only upscale homes and incomes.

I'm sure this doesn't apply to EVERYONE in TV, but at least the majority seem not to care, or even very interested, in what you USED to do or how much money you appear to have. Pretty refreshing.

Well said. People that live here or any other retirement community have worked to achieve that goal. Doesn't matter what you did in your life before moving here, here, everyone has the same standing in TV society. People have just taken different routes and had different adventures on their way to retirement in The Villages.

Good points everyone. Whenever I fill out a survey that asks for estimated family income, I always leave it blank. That comes under the heading of My Business ane None of Theirs."

Anything the IRS website attempts to explain is complicated. But scroll through this page and see if you can find answers to some of your income questions. Remember, the latest information on the IRS website is for 2009. In many discussions on these IRS pages; if the information for 2010 is known, it is shown.



http://www.irs.gov/publications/p554/ch02.html

I have been concerned about that statistic too. However, I was not taking into consideration how the people who have bought for the future and are still working now might affect the average.

Since I am still working, I don't have a good feel for what my retirement income should be. I'm not worried about meeting the everyday costs, but more about being in an environment where I can afford the costs incurred to be a part of the community - playing golf, eating out, traveling. I'm glad there appears to be a wide diversity of incomes which would govern one's lifestyle. It makes me feel more confident that I'll fit in.

Think of it this way - For your monthly amenity fee (which is basically the same per household) + a once a year cart trail fee (currently $141.24) you can:

swim at any of the pools
play any executive golf course
play tennis, pickleball, shuffleboard, boccie or join a league of same
join softball teams
dance or enjoy music every night at the squares
enjoy 100's of clubs, card games and other indoor activities
bike, run, walk or golf cart ride any of the golf trails

ALL FOR FREE (some clubs may have a fee like $10 a year dues).

I don't see social or income class being any issue in TV.

Thanks for the clarification. When I saw the 93K figure, I had to step back and wonder if I was going to be able to afford to live in TV after retiring. Looks like it is still a "GO" !

According to the US Census,

Sumter County, FL, median household income, 2008: $48,106
Sumter County, FL, per capita money income, 1999: $16,830


Lake County, FL, median household income, 2008: $45,517
Lake County, FL, per capita money income, 1999: $20,199


Marion County, FL, median household income, 2008: $40,266
Marion County, FL, per capita money income, 1999: $17,848


http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/12/12119.html

Once again I agree with Russ - I just looked at my 2009 spreadsheet where I keep/track all my expenses for our 3 BR CYV, which we're been renting out about 8 mos/yr for 4 years. When I take out Florida Hotel Taxes, cleaning fees, caretaker fees, and some improvements we did, looks like the fixed expenses are easily around $10-12,000.

If you're debt free, just add your other living expenses (stuff like medical and dental - the big ones depending on your coverage and your age - groceries, travel, eating out, haircuts, auto and golf cart repairs/gas/maintenance/insurance, clothing, hobbies, cell phones, etc) and there you are. I'm guessing many, many couples AND singles live on $30,000/year or less. And with so much to do, I bet you'll spend less time (and money) shopping just because you're bored (and also because you won't have any place to put the stuff you don't need anyway)!