[TrudyM]

Originally Posted by chachacha

the petition is on file with 175 signatures and bigfox was advised at the meeting last year that they had just completed a six month study on the issue and had decided against it. however, the issue can be brought up again
after one year, which will be july. perhaps if we all contacted our local board members from VCCDD or miss janet tutt, the director, we could revive the discussion. the survey ended on march 31 and i addressed this inequity on my survey but don't know how many others did. nothing will change unless we make a concerted effort.

As I said in the begining of the post the petition is asking for a special guest pass that is linked to the owners pass I don't see this as a problem.

Also I would think that if the rules have changed since people bought and accepted the restrictions, it would constitute a discrimitory practice that amends the rights of use and value of property without the permission of the minority group (singles).

I am not a lawyer but IMHO this should be acctionable. Am I wrong?
It is hard enough on a person when their spouse passes so now the rules make them feel like an outsider and exclude them from the fun.

Another question, everyone keeps saying resident,I don't think that is the correct term, allot of those in the villages are not residents. They are snowbirds. It is my understanding that many have purchased long before retirement and only come down occasionally they are not FLA residents.

Sorry if I seem miffed but any group having their rights to enjoyment and same value use of facilities being denied because they are a little different makes me burn. " The pursuit of happiness" its in the constitution remember.

[bkcunningham1]

TrudyM, please don't misinterpret this, but the phrase, "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" isn't in the US Constitution. It is a phrase found in The Declaration of Independence. Which is a document written by the representatives of the 13 colonies declaring their independence from the British Empire.


We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. — Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government.....

[Dynasty]

Are you suggesting that the guest gets free golf? Would they also be covered under my trail fees? If so can I trade my wife's resident ID for one of these special guest deals? Sure would be nice to be able to play free golf with my buddies outside of TV. The greens fees are a killer on the executive courses. We find it is cheaper to play championship or outside TV. I would support this cause under these conditions.

[TrudyM]

It has been a long time since civics.

Originally Posted by bkcunningham1

TrudyM, please don't misinterpret this, but the phrase, "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" isn't in the US Constitution. It is a phrase found in The Declaration of Independence. Which is a document written by the representatives of the 13 colonies declaring their independence from the British Empire.


We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. — Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government.....

[TrudyM]

Originally Posted by Dynasty

Are you suggesting that the guest gets free golf? Would they also be covered under my trail fees? If so can I trade my wife's resident ID for one of these special guest deals? Sure would be nice to be able to play free golf with my buddies outside of TV. The greens fees are a killer on the executive courses. We find it is cheaper to play championship or outside TV. I would support this cause under these conditions.

Here is the original petition from the begining of this thread:
To: Ms. Janet Tutt, Director VCCDD

Single residents in The Villages pay the same amenity fee every month that married couples pay, yet they are not allowed to bring a friend into The Villages to enjoy dances, swim in the pool, and play other games, golf, etc. unless they live outside the tri-county area. Specifically, we ask that single resident households be allowed the same opportunity to enjoy all the things that The Villages lifestyle has to offer married couples. We believe this is the only fair thing to do since single residents pay the same amenity fee as a married couple.

Proposed for consideration:

We the undersigned, call upon you to pass an amendment to the bylaws to allow a single resident household the same privileges that married couples have. Each single resident household shall have a special guest pass that is linked to the resident’s Identification such that the guest shall be in the company or presence of the resident at all times in order to use it. The guest pass shall be electronically linked to the resident’s bar code. This would ensure that the guest pass could not be given to someone outside The Villages for use by anyone unaccompanied by the resident. Our sense is that this is what the representatives are concerned about and we believe this addresses that concern.

As I understand it this is to address the inequity that, the limits on local people visiting the villages causes for singles in their social life. But it would seem to me that if a person who owns two properties can transfer the rights to golf for his rental to two people renting his second place then a single should be able to have permanent guest pass linked to their own with the requirement that they accompany the guest.


I haven't bought yet so it really is none of my business. I was just commenting that it didn't seem equitable. I would also bet that if most of those affected were men instead of women the petition would have been adopted.

[EdV]

I’ve always felt that amenity fees should be charged “per person” instead of “per household”. That would at least address the unequal monetary issue.

[zcaveman]

Originally Posted by EdVinMass

I’ve always felt that amenity fees should be charged “per person” instead of “per household”. That would at least address the unequal monetary issue.

I have posted to this answer twice and I have deleted both responses because I don't want to upset you like you have upset me. I also don't want to sound harsh or get reprimanded by the TOTV police.

I just want you to know that I do not agree with you.

[TrudyM]

Originally Posted by EdVinMass

I’ve always felt that amenity fees should be charged “per person” instead of “per household”. That would at least address the unequal monetary issue.

Unless I am mistaken: The rights to use of the amenities are deeded to the property. Because the fees are paying for not just the operating cost of the amenities but also the purchase and maintenance of the facilities and these costs are shared by the properties not the people. So the revenue stream needs to be stable. A person isn’t paying for using the amenities but for the right to use them that is attached to the deed. It is that conveyed right that I think is being abridged by not allowing singles a special guest pass for their date. A pass that requires the owners to accompany the guest to avoid misuse by those adjacent to but not living in the villages.

[Whatever]

You knew the rules and charges when you bought. STOP Whining!!!!
Your continued complaints along the lines of this thread will only give the powers that be an idea to raise the fees for couples. The fees go with the home and not the # of occupants.

[EdV]

Originally Posted by zcaveman

I have posted to this answer twice and I have deleted both responses because I don't want to upset you like you have upset me. I also don't want to sound harsh or get reprimanded by the TOTV police.

I just want you to know that I do not agree with you.

Your discretion in this matter is appreciated.

[EdV]

Originally Posted by Whatever

You knew the rules and charges when you bought. STOP Whining!!!!
Your continued complaints along the lines of this thread will only give the powers that be an idea to raise the fees for couples. The fees go with the home and not the # of occupants.

Oh, I knew the rules alright, and I didn't buy.

But what the heck, why stop there. Let's abolish income taxes and replace them with a household tax. Each household pays the same tax regardless of the number of residents and their incomes. Then we can really put the screws to single people.

[chachacha]

for the grace of God, may go and most likely WILL go unhappily someday many of the couples who think singles are whining about this issue. many have lost spouses since moving here and never realized how these rules would impact their recovery and reintegration into society. i must admit i do not give a fig about golf and am not personally well informed about golf issues and costs. i am sure the very imaginative minds of those who created our little paradise here can find a way to resolve this issue without threatening anyone's tee time. meanwhile i may have really enjoyed a game of water volleyball with my significant other last winter before he died, if WE had been allowed in the pool! please try to see everyone's viewpoint.