Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

I agree, but as the CDC recently ( in the past couple of days) pointed out,

And heaven forbid a new variant (Delta?) comes alone, changes everything, and they have to somehow report those changes - while governors are shutting down testing, denying DELTA even exist, and under-reporting infections and deaths, so their "policies" look good to their base "See, I did good and the virus is under control". How many times have we heard that one in the last 18 months? Or it will magically disappear by April - and it didn't so, it has to be CDC that is lying...

And those who DENY illegal immigrants are seeding the DELTA virus throughout the US because of THEIR politics.

[kendi]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

I don't recall what post I was responding to, so I will go with your answer. Thank you.

For the rest of your post.

My wife and I are both double-jabbed and were early on at the recommendation of our PCP's at the VA.

I had two reasons for wanting it -
1. I am a candidate to die if I get it, I check all the right boxes.
2. Unlike many here, I DO believe I am my brother's keeper. I am also my grandkid's keeper and my wife's keeper. I will do whatever my PCP recommends is best. And at the time there was no doubt me getting the jab would help reduce the spread of the virus.

That said, the new Delta variant has me worried. Most of the same reasons for getting the jab still apply. People conflating viral load with contagiousness are making mistakes. My concern is there is growing evidence that the Delta may defeat the vaccine when it comes to stopping the spread. If so, we will need another vaccine. But, if that is the case, the current vaccination definitely still reduces death rates, and even with break through it still provides excellent protection.

Nothing is perfect, the scientists are doing the best they can do. It is sad to me that American's have become so self serviing.

I read the delta variant while being more contagious is less severe. And that as the virus mutates it will continue to lessen in severity which is typical as a virus goes. Is this true? I don’t know but if it helps to ease your mind it’s worth checking out.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by bluedivergirl

Hepatitis C is transmitted through bodily fluids.

Hepatitis A is the fecal/food-borne virus.

The two are distinctly different.

Gee whiz---I wish I had said that. Oh, wait, I did---post #88

[Altavia]

Originally Posted by Buckeye Bleau

Does anyone find it peculiar or even curious that they are diagnosing the “Delta Variant” when there is not even a test for it?
Hmm, curious minds want to know.

Viral mutations and variants in the are routinely monitored through sequence-based surveillance, laboratory studies, and epidemiological investigations.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

I agree and will add, it is not just up to the doctor or hospital to pick a cause, any cause of death. There are laws governing how to determine the cause of death and comorbidity. ANY doctor that draws outside the lines can be sued and lose the license to practice medicine that they spent half their life earning.

Well, yeah, EXCEPT it IS up to the doctor to choose a cause of death, there is no law governing determination of cause or comorbidity, you cannot be sued (well, yes you can be sued for anything these days, but the case would have no merit and no damages), and you cannot lose your license for it. And I've signed hundreds of them, so want to rethink that post?????

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Leadbone1

The CDC is not in charge of this country and certainly not in charge of my life. There will be no mask ever for me and hopefully other Americans that are tired of government trying to control us.

A Democratic country like the US or (say Canada) does NOT want to CONTROL its people - it wants to PROTECT them. All of us LIKE the protection of pure, unpoisoned foods and drink. The individual IS NOT a King who can have someone taste his and his queen's food and drink. The individual needs Federal regulation to put seat belts in every car. Most people today do not object to the car manufacturers supplying seat belts with the vehicles. if I gave 10,000 more examples - then the sum total of those would be the security blanket of PROTECTION given to us by the Government. So, basically, the CDC is something that we ALL REALLY want if we are honest with ourselves! The CDC and other Government Offices post new information like "new Delta evidence" for our information, benefit, and ultimately, PROTECTION.

[Altavia]

So many unknown unknowns...

" All those people who say they know, they actually don’t know. Many of them don’t know, and especially those who say that they know, don’t know, because those who do know say that they don’t know. "

[GrumpyOldMan]

Originally Posted by John41

And those who DENY illegal immigrants are seeding the DELTA virus throughout the US because of THEIR politics.

Lets see, "those who deny" and "because of THEIR politics".

Not to prejudicial is it. You have decided that it is denied, and why.

I completely agree that people coming into the country should be tested and vaccinated. I disagree that it is a "big deal". Until you can show proof that it is impacting the number of infections or the number of deaths, I will worry more about things we can do something about - today.

But, If you can find the data, I am certainly open to reading it, until then it is nothing more than supposition by you as far as I can tell.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

Actually, they are very similar.

Both are viruses.
Both are extremely contagious.

One has laws governing behavior in the workplace, and a social norm (washing hands) has become "the norm".

In one case people mostly follow the recommended prevention methods and the virus is limited to about 30,000 deaths per year.

The other one many DONT follow the recommended prevention methods (by god I got rights!) and about 600,000 died last year.

Actually, Hepatitis is not EXTREMELY contagious and the method of transmission is quite different from COVID.

Yes, they are both viruses, just like an amoeba and an elephant are both animals

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by sail33or

99% of Posters do not have a clue of what was injected into your arm.

You just trusted and obeyed.

It could be good it could be horrible.

It was a synthetic engineered substance (not natural) that causes your natural defense system to recognize Covid 19. Many scientist have stated that all those who took the shot NOW have no ability to ever fight off a different type of virus. Just saying you do not know what they put in your body but you, of course, now it all.

Really? Care to provide some of those names or a legitimate reference (not a conspiracy theory website) that states that?

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

In my opinion, you do not have a very good doctor. My doctor asked me why and then we had an in-depth discussion of why I should. I normally don't say no to my doctor when she makes a recommendation.

Finally, we agree on something

[GrumpyOldMan]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Well, yeah, EXCEPT it IS up to the doctor to choose a cause of death, there is no law governing determination of cause or comorbidity, you cannot be sued (well, yes you can be sued for anything these days, but the case would have no merit and no damages), and you cannot lose your license for it. And I've signed hundreds of them, so want to rethink that post?????

Actually there is a very detail set of instructions on how it is done. And yes, a surviving spouse can sue. Nice thing about the US anyone can sue for anything. And if it can be shown that the doctor falsified the cause of death, they will loose their license at the least. If it can be proven (as so many say here) that the reason for the lie was to profit them or the hospital, then it just escalated to a federal offense of defrauding the government which is a felony.

And yet, despite that, every day we hear claims that the deaths are intentionally misdiagnosed in-order to get federal monies - and yet, not one single case has been taken to court. Hmmm.... Not to be too political, but that seems to be a trend with one of the parties today. Lots of finger pointing, no (or very limited) wins in cost.

[Escape Artist]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

Are you serious? I mean seriously, they have answered this question numerous times.

The reason, assuming you are serious, is that vaccination, social distancing and mask-wearing are the 3 best methods available to reduce the spread of the virus.

NONE of them are perfect.

The mutating virus is a moving target and they constantly have to update recommendations as conditions and mutations occur.

And they have to do all this while struggling to get actual real data from states that do not report accurate data - some have even stopped testing, so there is no reliable data on infection rates, only on death and hospital admissions of people that have symptoms. The CDC itself says these numbers they are getting are no doubt seriously underreporting the actual number of infections. Without that number all the other numbers are questionable. And, just to inject a little politics, which states are underreporting, and bragging about it - well, Florida for one.

Scientists are doing the best they can do. The virus is new, never seen before, hard to predict, but just as serious, we have not had this much misinformation being spread ever - and they have to fight that also.

Yes, I'm totally serious. What's the point of getting one of the three available vaccines if there are constant mutations and variants? There's no incentive if you can still get COVID. Isn't that the endgame - not to get it in the first place? But now there are reports that those fully vaccinated have gotten it to varying degrees of seriousness. Those unvaccinated will shrug their shoulders and say "forget it, why bother?" It reinforces the fear, skepticism and distrust.

Also, we were all masked, locked down, etc. before the vaccine was readily available in order to slow the spread and protect the vulnerable and those at risk of serious complications. But now the vaccine is available to all so why are we going backwards? If some choose not be vaccinated, that's their funeral, perhaps literally. Why should we suffer and be inconvenienced and our children/grandchildren because some have chosen not to get the vaccine? That's a risk they are willing to take and they have to accept the consequences but don't make ME pay the price!

[chriskean82]

I don’t believe anything anyone says anymore. Everyone and everything has an agenda. I make decisions for myself. This way I can only blame myself.

[GrumpyOldMan]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Actually, Hepatitis is not EXTREMELY contagious and the method of transmission is quite different from COVID.

Yes, they are both viruses, just like an amoeba and an elephant are both animals

Well, sort of:

"Infectious causes of hepatitis usually are, but not always, contagious. For example, hepatitis caused by viruses usually is contagious, although many types of hepatitis are transferred mainly from person to person by blood-to-blood transfer, for example, individual sharing needles, acupuncture, sexual contact, and organ transplantation."

And my point was that the number of potential deaths are significantly reduced by laws and social norms put in place to contain it. (mostly hand washing)

There are obviously a lot of "other" types of Hep and different spreading vectors.

But, then have you ever tried a metaphor and found it was not a perfect fit, but sort of demonstrated the point?

My point was social norms (masks, distancing, hand washing) will reduce the spread of COVID, and vaccinations will reduce the deaths from COVID.