Talk of The Villages Florida

Talk of The Villages Florida (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/)
-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Crosses (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/crosses-304905/)

mydavid 04-06-2020 06:40 AM

I see little white crosses all over, I don't give them much thought.

Bolsadd 04-06-2020 06:41 AM

Welcome! I can determine by the responses you received that people have forgotten their manners. I’m not aware of any restrictions However if you go north on Morse pass 466/to Madero left, about a mile down on right. They were there two days ago

theruizs 04-06-2020 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bmillard11 (Post 1740973)
We are new to the Villages and while we realize there is conflict about the white crosses, we’d love to get one. Does anyone know where we might safely secure one at this time? We are in the Tiera Del Sol area.

Check your deed restrictions. They vary by district. However, most have restrictions that limit lawn ornaments, which is what the cross will be considered. If you want to change that, get involved in your districts management or other group taking up such causes. But, IMHO, to sign a contract agreeing to them and then ignoring them is not a very Christian approach.

CS0711 04-06-2020 06:45 AM

Amazon has them reasonably. Query small white cross, yard

oneclickplus 04-06-2020 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DianeM (Post 1740989)
You state that you’re new. If you know the crosses cause conflict, why would you want to stir the pot at a time when many people have frayed nerves due to the virus and stay at home restrictions. You can display your faith in other ways in your home.

And, the cross is not a Christian symbol anyway. It's pagan in origin.

bhemingway 04-06-2020 06:54 AM

The haters
 
Wow, I now am finding out that a simple question brings out the haters who live in TV. All I wanted to know as a new owner to be was if yard sales were allowed. I was berated and criticized for my question. The same people that did that are the ones berating this poor individual about a question regarding a white cross. You people need to get a life and quit attacking those of us who are simply trying to figure rules and lifestyles out. I thought the purpose of this site was to be helpful not hateful.

Tripsite 04-06-2020 06:56 AM

Go to The Village woodshop and ask. They made most of the crosses, the woodshop is on Rolling Acres road.

skip0358 04-06-2020 06:57 AM

Crosses aren't the problem the people are. In my neighborhood there are very few houses in compliance with the Deed restriction IF you read them and want to be a jerk and start turning people in for the stupid stuff. I'd bet if people pulled their restrictions sheet and truly read it they'd see what I mean. They don't bother me and I don't bother them.

Gatorhutch 04-06-2020 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oneclickplus (Post 1741193)
And, the cross is not a Christian symbol anyway. It's pagan in origin.

Huh...the cross was a “torture” device (crucifixion) used by the Romans (and other cultures of the time) to slowly kill “enemies of the state”. The “criminals” were nailed to the device, that resembled a cross” and were hung on them till they slowly died of asphyxiation.

ladybugsmom 04-06-2020 07:16 AM

Yes! I want to know too! I think we should all get them and put them in our landscaping in our front yard! Then see if they could sue all of us!

You obviously don’t get it. People should be free to express themselves in the landscaping up their front yard. There are hundreds of various statues, etc. in the front yard of Villages homes. Why target a small 12 inch white cross?

If we all put one up, then they’d have to sue all of us.

HappyRetired 04-06-2020 07:21 AM

Part of Tierra del Sol is in District 1. They don't enforce lawn ornaments. OP should know which district she's in.

TandHSTAR@AOL.com 04-06-2020 07:25 AM

There is a gentleman on Madero Dr.. From your location heading towards Morse Blvd. on Madero his house is on the left coming in from Morse to Madero his house is on the right. They are out on his lawn. I assume he still has them out there.

Gerrys 04-06-2020 07:29 AM

There is a gentleman on Madero who makes them and always has several in his front yard. Traveling from Morse Blvd. his home is on the right side before you get to Augustine. Stay safe.

Love2Swim 04-06-2020 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ladybugsmom (Post 1741223)
Yes! I want to know too! I think we should all get them and put them in our landscaping in our front yard! Then see if they could sue all of us!

You obviously don’t get it. People should be free to express themselves in the landscaping up their front yard. There are hundreds of various statues, etc. in the front yard of Villages homes. Why target a small 12 inch white cross?

If we all put one up, then they’d have to sue all of us.

Sorry, but we are not "free" to express ourselves with lawn ornaments. There are deed restrictions, which vary depending on which Village you live in. If you are lucky and live in a neighborhood that doesn't care and no one turns you in, good for you. Other neighborhoods have people that are picky about the "rules" and will turn others in. And you have the people who don't even live in the neighborhoods who have nothing better to do than to cruise throughout the Villages looking for deed violations and turning in others, even though the particular neighbors in the Village don't care. Little white crosses are not my thing, and I wouldn't be caught dead with one in my yard, but I'm not going to turn in my neighbor who has one. If someone does get turned in, then you have to deal with the Villages, and I imagine you get a letter telling you to remove it.

Andyb 04-06-2020 07:35 AM

It is not a loss cause, it is a fundamental constitutional right that trumps any dumb deed restriction.

Michael A. David 04-06-2020 07:41 AM

I was told to remove my cross from the ground in front of my house. So I removed the spike from the cross enlarged the hole and put it on top of my lamp post.

michtofla 04-06-2020 07:44 AM

White Crosses
 
You can get the crosses on Madero Drive about three houses East of St Augustine on the North side of the street. There are always a half dozen of them at the end of the drive way. They are there for the taking. And Tierra Del Sol does NOT have deed restrictions about crosses in the yard. There is a paper with the crosses that explains the origin of the crosses which was in Frankenmuth Michigan.

dsettl 04-06-2020 07:45 AM

Call me 352 259 2746

Jtcoggin@bellsouth.net 04-06-2020 07:45 AM

You can get them at St. Timothy Catholic Church in Spanish Springs. Show your faith. Good for you.

karostay 04-06-2020 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bay Kid (Post 1741169)
All we need is faith. Love our neighbors.

Here in the Villages :1rotfl::1rotfl::1rotfl:

detch 04-06-2020 07:47 AM

Is this forum TOTV or GOTV (Gossip of the Villages)?

vitacr 04-06-2020 07:51 AM

They are still there for anyone to take.

Mumbles 04-06-2020 08:01 AM

Maybe but . . .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by karostay (Post 1740998)
Put up even an dozen..Freedom of speech

sounds more like exaggeration of speech. Ya know, it's like writing an emotional statement and ending it with too many !!!!!!!!!!!!

DianeM 04-06-2020 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 1741133)
If they bother you, then don't own one. Christians do not see it that way. Christians are reminded that Christ gave his life for them, so that they might have salvation and forgiveness for their sins. Christians look at the cross in a positive way. Heathens and (vampires:) ) fear the cross for what it represents.

I am far from a heathen and vampires do not exist. My crosses are in my home for me to view. I feel faith is a quiet private relationship between the Lord and me. I don’t need to jump up and down waving my arms about how pious I am.

Carla B 04-06-2020 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlcooper70 (Post 1741177)
If more and more put up white crosses .... does that make all non-Christians feel welcome? Or is the objective to make others feel unwelcome? I'm confused. Can we be Christians without the show on our front lawn?

Countless wars have been fought over religion throughout the history of civilization. Did some of them start over displays like this?

soniak4@gmail.com 04-06-2020 08:06 AM

If you want to “show your faith”, do it with your behavior. Putting a cross in your landscape does not make you a Christian.

Mumbles 04-06-2020 08:18 AM

Reminds me . . .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by John_W (Post 1741099)
I drove up to Chapel Hill, NC in 1986 to pick up a custom bike I had ordered at Performance Bike Works. After you leave I-95 there was a good distance to travel on a 2 lane country road and then all of sudden you're in Chapel Hill. What was amazing was about a mile before the town there must of been a 20' tall cross in flames, like it had just been lit. It was pitch black outside but that cross should caught my attention. I don't think I would mistaken these little crosses for one of those.



Actually on my street I think I'm the troublemaker for not having one. More than half the villas on my block have a cross. When they first started a couple of years ago, I had no clue what it was about, like some have said, I thought someone had died until I started seeing more and more.

... that, from about the early 50s (perhaps earlier, but I wasn't born yet), one was able to see M A N Y Mary, mother of God, statues placed prominently on lawns INSIDE old repainted bathtubs (to give a "grotto" effect maybe). I'd say by the 90s, it was only the rarest scene if somebody had one.

IMVHO, I don't think it's necessary nor helpful to proselytize one's faith in a way that causes conflict which cannot be resolved peacefully. Often, I think people who put up Christian crosses, (which btw is a symbol of torture considering Whom we refer to with it), either think everyone's OK with the sign of torture, OR they just want to "tell" others they are Christian.

Still, it is an expression of Freedom of Speech which, unlike screaming "FIRE!" in a full movie theatre, is generally but not always legal.

As Mr. C Himself once said, "Render to Caesar (government) what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's." And, never the twain should meet.:pray:

mikecarr 04-06-2020 08:19 AM

The white crosses are available at the Catholic Churches in The Villages. They represent opposition to the murder of unborn babies.

Mumbles 04-06-2020 08:20 AM

What's a heathen?

panamachica 04-06-2020 08:20 AM

I have an extra one if you would like it. Let me know how I can contact you off this chat If you’d like it. I live in Hillsboro.

Fred2016 04-06-2020 08:21 AM

Why don’t you make one. How hard can it be?

blueash 04-06-2020 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devorejh (Post 1741172)
Call some nurseries or lawn ornament businesses.. I am sure they will have something like this available to put up for Easter. It’s your constitutional right to put up A small white cross if you choose. Deed restrictions do not trump the constitution of the United States

Why do people keep repeating this claim? Sorry, but you are wrong. Anyone can voluntarily waive their Constitutional protections. We do it all the time. You give up your right to speak when you sign one of those NDA's. You give up your right to work where you choose when you sign an employment contract with a non-compete clause. You give up your right to not self incriminate when you waive your Miranda rights, and the police can legally lie to you to trick you into waiving them. You have no right to drive down my street at midnight yelling on your blowhorn that I need to repent because Jesus is coming, even though your content is religiously based.

So yes, if you sign a contract that says you give up your right to place a cross in your front yard.. you give it up or don't sign the contract. Saying "I didn't know that what I signed meant no cross" is meaningless. If you are unsure about what the contract contains then get a lawyer to read it and advise you before signing. Contacts are enforceable even if they contain restrictions on your rights as long as both parties receive value. Just read your credit card rule about that Constitutional right to a jury trial. You waived that right when you signed up for a credit card.

If you don't like the no decorations in your yard rule, then you have a two choices..

1. Flaunt the rule and hope you get away with it, and deal with the consequences if you don't.
2. Don't sign the contract.

There is no choice 3 that says sign the contract but assume the Constitution protects you.

Challenger 04-06-2020 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skip0358 (Post 1741205)
Crosses aren't the problem the people are. In my neighborhood there are very few houses in compliance with the Deed restriction IF you read them and want to be a jerk and start turning people in for the stupid stuff. I'd bet if people pulled their restrictions sheet and truly read it they'd see what I mean. They don't bother me and I don't bother them. Turn me in for my cross and the war is on period!

Attitudes like yours are the reason that an anonymous notification system is necessary. (Period!)

Challenger 04-06-2020 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oneclickplus (Post 1741193)
And, the cross is not a Christian symbol anyway. It's pagan in origin.

You lie, you lie , Next thing you will say , Christ was not born on December 25.

Challenger 04-06-2020 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stadry (Post 1741166)
didn't know there are deed restrictions re the Cross so it must also include magen (star of ) David, whatever muslims use ( schmitar ? ), etc,,, is this a general clause for ALL tv residences properties or just by district ?

The restriction is for lawn ornaments . It does not refer to Crosses specifically. The argument that most who don't like the ban on ornaments try to make is that it restricts their freedom to express their religion. Courts have ruled otherwise as has common sense in most cases.

blueash 04-06-2020 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikecarr (Post 1741300)
The white crosses are available at the Catholic Churches in The Villages. They represent opposition to the murder of unborn babies.

Ah! Now that's an interesting post. So they are not an expression of your belief in a particular deity. No, you are telling me they are political speech opposing a legal procedure that is in fact, per the SCOTUS, protected by the Constitution.

Well now we have a whole new kettle of fish. Should we allow political signs in our yards as apparently crosses are political speech. And of course political speech is protected by the Constitution. Except when it isn't because you signed a contract or due to a reasonable local law.

Thank you for honestly telling me what those little crosses meant. That is wasn't burial spots for dead pets, or generic advertising of your adherence to a faith. No, the motivation is to make a political statement about abortion and the effects of Roe v Wade. It would be interesting to know how many homes with little white crosses have pro-choice Christians.

skip0358 04-06-2020 08:45 AM

Yea well mine was in my backyard surrounded by plants so how did someone see it IF they weren't in my yard Period.

shirleyjerez 04-06-2020 08:47 AM

Going into Santa Domingo on Madora on the right side down a little way.there’s a man who makes them and he puts them at the end of his driveway . Also a note on what it means. The story is very interesting. It’s not what you think

graciegirl 04-06-2020 08:49 AM

1 Attachment(s)
This goes on and on. Most Villagers are Christians. I don't think there can be more than 20 in all of Villages who are really, really, negative about the small white crosses. The fact is that we do have deed restrictions that we signed, that are very common in many communities like ours and they do have the desired effect of keeping a lot of "stuff" from being displayed in yards. One man's Flamingo is another person's cannon. Not every person is gifted with good taste in lawn décor. The deed restrictions keep a "clean slate". I know the value of the symbol of the cross and especially as we are older and closer to the "final reckoning" but there is nothing to keep you from placing a cross around your neck or right up against the house, under the eaves. Remember there are wonderful, good people living here who are not Christians. Some have no belief in a higher being and some practice other religions. Every good person I know that celebrates Easter would probably agree that Christ died for all of us and the big message of Christianity is to be kind. I believe there are all kinds of scripture that says not to pass judgement. I like deed restrictions. I like no crosses. I think we have too much time on our hands. But the thing is this...no one HAS to live here if living without a small white cross in their yard is too difficult there are places that do not have deed restrictions.

Here is a picture of my cross here in the kitchen where I am typing this very minute. Just slightly out of the reach of my right hand...

shirleyjerez 04-06-2020 08:50 AM

Boy how nasty . You don’t even know why ? These cross have nothing to do w/ religion. So try to be kind during these trying times.


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