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-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Dogs in grocery stores!?! (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/dogs-grocery-stores-308650/)

Judy n Ron 07-06-2020 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 1797927)
There is a common misconception that there is some type of official certification, or vest required for service dogs. There is no such requirement. Anyone can have a dog, self train it to perform a task, and it will immediately become a service animal in full compliance with the Federal ADA law. The dog does not need to wear anything to identify it as a service animal. The only requirement is that the dog's owner, if asked, needs to say that the dog is a service animal trained to perform a task. If you ask anything else, you are violating the Federal law.



Wow! I'd hate to be sentenced to a stint at Leavenworth for asking the dog guy if he knows where the ketchup is!!:pray:

raney3099 07-06-2020 06:49 AM

I agree. I love my dog, but would never bring her shopping or visit to peoples home. She’s part of our family not everyone else’s. She’s still a dog.

EdFNJ 07-06-2020 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Girlcopper (Post 1798613)
Not true. You must have certification for the dog and it must be registered to be a service dog. And it has to be labeled to be allowed into businesses.


From the US DOJ:



Q8. Do service animals have to wear a vest or patch or special harness identifying them as service animals?
A. No. The ADA does not require service animals to wear a vest, ID tag, or specific harness.



Q17. Does the ADA require that service animals be certified as service animals?
A. No. Covered entities may not require documentation, such as proof that the animal has been certified, trained, or licensed as a service animal, as a condition for entry.



Q20. My city requires me to register my dog as a service animal. Is this legal under the ADA?
A. No. Mandatory registration of service animals is not permissible under the ADA. However, as stated above, service animals are subject to the same licensing and vaccination rules that are applied to all dogs.




Frequently Asked Questions about Service Animals and the ADA

shyrlburt 07-06-2020 07:21 AM

Service Animals vs Emotional Support Dogs
 
Emotional Support Dogs are not allowed in restaurants or grocery stores, whereas Service Dogs are. I daresay many of the dogs we see in these establishments are emotional support dogs.

II. Service Animal Defined by Title II and Title III of the ADA
A service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Tasks performed can include, among other things, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items, alerting a person to a sound, reminding a person to take medication, or pressing an elevator button.

Emotional support animals, comfort animals, and therapy dogs are not service animals under Title II and Title III of the ADA. Other species of animals, whether wild or domestic, trained or untrained, are not considered service animals either. The work or tasks performed by a service animal must be directly related to the individual’s disability. It does not matter if a person has a note from a doctor that states that the person has a disability and needs to have the animal for emotional support. A doctor’s letter does not turn an animal into a service animal.

Examples of animals that fit the ADA’s definition of “service animal” because they have been specifically trained to perform a task for the person with a disability:

· Guide Dog or Seeing Eye® Dog1 is a carefully trained dog that serves as a travel tool for persons who have severe visual impairments or are blind.

· Hearing or Signal Dog is a dog that has been trained to alert a person who has a significant hearing loss or is deaf when a sound occurs, such as a knock on the door.

· Psychiatric Service Dog is a dog that has been trained to perform tasks that assist individuals with disabilities to detect the onset of psychiatric episodes and lessen their effects. Tasks performed by psychiatric service animals may include reminding the handler to take medicine, providing safety checks or room searches, or turning on lights for persons with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, interrupting self-mutilation by persons with dissociative identity disorders, and keeping disoriented individuals from danger.

· SSigDOG (sensory signal dogs or social signal dog) is a dog trained to assist a person with autism. The dog alerts the handler to distracting repetitive movements common among those with autism, allowing the person to stop the movement (e.g., hand flapping).

· Seizure Response Dog is a dog trained to assist a person with a seizure disorder. How the dog serves the person depends on the person’s needs. The dog may stand guard over the person during a seizure or the dog may go for help. A few dogs have learned to predict a seizure and warn the person in advance to sit down or move to a safe place.

Jmforrester 07-06-2020 07:27 AM

Last year I saw a scared, shaking little puppy defecate on the floor at Walmart in the main isle in front of the registers. Not the puppies fault but the owners. Dogs do not belong in grocery stores or restaurants.

miharris 07-06-2020 07:29 AM

Nonsense
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JGVillages (Post 1797892)
In 14+ years in TV, and I shop at Publix, I have never seen a dog that wasn’t a service dog.

You must not be very observant. A service dog is never on a long leash, and never rides in a stroller. Last week I saw a man enter Publix walking a small, scruffy dog on a long leash. I politely asked him if the dog was a service dog, and he replied "no, it's my pet" Infomed him that pets were not allowed in grocery stores in Florida, and he said that he was not aware of that, and that he sees people do it all the time. BTW, "emotional support" dogs are not service dogs. This trend toward taking pets everywhere is getting out of hand.

DameDiana 07-06-2020 07:48 AM

Why is this all being complained about here. Have you made your feelings known to the store manager? Owners? And why are you all surprised by this? This behavior is indicative of our society. Entitled, inconsiderate and irresponsible.

Veiragirl 07-06-2020 07:51 AM

How about screaming kids who's parents are oblivious to their spoiled behavior. Or the Hillbillies who's beards have more germs in them then the average toilet. I'll take a dog any day

retiredguy123 07-06-2020 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Girlcopper (Post 1798613)
Not true. You must have certification for the dog and it must be registered to be a service dog. And it has to be labeled to be allowed into businesses.

Wrong. See Post No. 162.

Tsmart 07-06-2020 08:11 AM

No doggie autonomous zones in the stores?

Debbraham 07-06-2020 08:36 AM

Anyone can get a vest stating service dog on amazon! They should have to carry dr order/documentation that the dog is truly a service animal!

nevjudbaker 07-06-2020 08:42 AM

No. They can get a EMS vest. A legal certificate has to be obtained by a legal mental health professional.

retiredguy123 07-06-2020 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DameDiana (Post 1798692)
Why is this all being complained about here. Have you made your feelings known to the store manager? Owners? And why are you all surprised by this? This behavior is indicative of our society. Entitled, inconsiderate and irresponsible.

The store manager or owner cannot change the Federal law regarding service animals. They have a legal right to be in a grocery store. Only Congress can change that.

sallybowron 07-06-2020 09:19 AM

Special
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fredman (Post 1797847)
Because they think their special

Many of the people in the Villages think they are special. The rules do not apply to them. Where is the grocery management in all of this. They should tell these people to leave.

carolandjohn 07-06-2020 10:09 AM

Just because it wears a vest doesn't make it a service dog. Look closer. Vests are available along with paperwork online for a few dollars.

Indydealmaker 07-06-2020 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjackson8 (Post 1797839)
Why must people bring their dogs into grocery stores?
It is disgusting!!! I saw one dog licking and sniffing unwrapped food items. Today a man brought in his big, wet, smelly dog!

I have seen a man open up a potato salad container, dip his finger in for a taste and place the container back in the cooler. So, what is worse? Dogs or humans?

LynnWM158 07-06-2020 11:46 AM

Add Sparr to the list of pet friendly establishments

Stu from NYC 07-06-2020 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sallybowron (Post 1798745)
Many of the people in the Villages think they are special. The rules do not apply to them. Where is the grocery management in all of this. They should tell these people to leave.

I think the vast majority of the people here are good moral people who follow the rules.

If the management of the grocery wanted no dogs they would make sure the store manager followed that..

Polar Bear 07-06-2020 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indydealmaker (Post 1798806)
I have seen a man open up a potato salad container, dip his finger in for a taste and place the container back in the cooler. So, what is worse? Dogs or humans?

Missing the point imho...

The human you describe and the human bringing his/her not-true-service-dog into the grocery are roughly equal.

Dogs only do what their human allows them to do.

ajsmithjr 07-06-2020 03:02 PM

On service dogs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 1797867)
Read the Federal ADA law. The dog is a service animal who performs a necessary service for the owner, who has a disability and cannot function without the dog's assistance.

Wondering how you know this particular dog is a service dog.
I have worked for years with an intern, who eventually became an employee,
who was fully blind. He had several service dogs and I know, from observing them,
they are well trained. I doubt that an actual service dog would behave that way in a grocery.
Too many people call their dogs service dogs when they are not-they are emotional support dogs, and I think it ridiculous that the owner cannot venture into a grocery without the animal.

retiredguy123 07-06-2020 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ajsmithjr (Post 1798894)
Wondering how you know this particular dog is a service dog.
I have worked for years with an intern, who eventually became an employee,
who was fully blind. He had several service dogs and I know, from observing them,
they are well trained. I doubt that an actual service dog would behave that way in a grocery.
Too many people call their dogs service dogs when they are not-they are emotional support dogs, and I think it ridiculous that the owner cannot venture into a grocery without the animal.

I was trying to be sarcastic. But, if you read the ADA law, anyone can take a dog into a grocery store and claim that the dog is a service animal. You can also train the dog yourself to perform any task that you want and no one can dispute your claim that the dog is a service animal. That is how ridiculous the ADA law is. The store management has no power to decide that your dog is not a service animal. Basically, if the dog owner says it is a service animal, then it is a service animal.

donfey 07-06-2020 06:55 PM

NOT service dogs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 1797867)
Read the Federal ADA law. The dog is a service animal who performs a necessary service for the owner, who has a disability and cannot function without the dog's assistance.

Well, there are specific requirements to be met before somebody's mutt qualifies as a service animal. Most of the critters folks cart around in strollers or pull along on a leash do not.

The problem, I think, is that store management doesn't have the guts to tell people they'll have to leave Fifi in the car. Pretty much a sign of the times - "don't confront anybody, don't cause a fuss." They get away with that because WE don't complain to management, we vote with our feet instead, and the problem persists. Sad.

banjobob 07-06-2020 07:14 PM

And I think a lot of that is BS.

TooColdNJ 07-06-2020 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Astron (Post 1798024)
You missed a key point or two. ADA.gov states “ Under the ADA, a service animal is defined as a dog that has been individually trained to do work or perform tasks for an individual with a disability. The task(s) performed by the dog must be directly related to the person's disability.” The key point Is “individually trained” . The animal “must be trained to take a specific action when needed to assist the person with a disability.” The other point is that emotional support animals are NOT service animals. So many people abuse the system, I think it should be scrapped and replaced with one that requires certification of training and medical need to be displayed on the animals harness. There are always a few that ruin a good thing for everyone.

Playing devil’s advocate here... What about for EMOTIONAL SUPPORT? Not everyone wears a sign, other in that commercial that’s on the TV where someone is holding up a smile.

On the other hand, if a < 5 pound dog is in someone’s purse, backpack, etc., and isn’t hurting anyone, why are they bothering you? I’m not an advocate for animals in stores, especially not restaurants, but it’s just another thing to complain about, even being contained in a closed/screened stroller. I think those strollers are ridiculous.

VApeople 07-06-2020 08:14 PM

I have never seen a dog misbehave in a grocery store, but if I see one doing anything that is disgusting, like licking or sniffing a grocery item, I am going to cause a scene.

I'm going to start yelling at the dogs owner and demanding to have a manager come rectify the situation. In a very loud voice, I'm going to put the manager on the spot.

Maybe the dog owner will be embarrassed enough to control his dog better.

Maybe I will get banned from the store.

We'll see how it goes.

Velvet 07-06-2020 08:31 PM

I think if you need an “emotional support” animal to go grocery shopping, stay away and have your groceries delivered.

Chi-Town 07-06-2020 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donfey (Post 1798969)
Well, there are specific requirements to be met before somebody's mutt qualifies as a service animal. Most of the critters folks cart around in strollers or pull along on a leash do not.

The problem, I think, is that store management doesn't have the guts to tell people they'll have to leave Fifi in the car. Pretty much a sign of the times - "don't confront anybody, don't cause a fuss." They get away with that because WE don't complain to management, we vote with our feet instead, and the problem persists. Sad.

The problem is if they leave Fifi in the car just wait until the next thread.

Velvet 07-06-2020 09:50 PM

Can’t leave the dog in a hot car - you have to take it home. If you are going shopping just don’t bring the dog, the cat or any other animal. True service animals excepted.

Marmaduke 07-06-2020 11:10 PM

Seriously, It was when visitingThe Villages about 6 years ago that I first saw the most peculiar oddity.

A baby buggy with a dog in it!

A healthy dog being pushed by a couple. When the dog barked, I jumped, i didn't know they were pushing a D-O-G-G-I-E BABY
I KNEW we were in trouble THEN!!!

Heaven Bound 07-07-2020 01:21 PM

It will b a while before I can bring my pet elethant "DOOFUS' 2 the store he has several n grown toenails.

VApeople 07-08-2020 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marmaduke (Post 1799027)
Seriously, It was when visitingThe Villages about 6 years ago that I first saw the most peculiar oddity.

A baby buggy with a dog in it!

In The Villages, it is more of an oddity to see a baby buggy with a human baby inside it.

mermaids 07-08-2020 08:50 AM

Ok with service animals, like leading a visually impaired person. What about all those little dogs riding in grocery carts? Very unsanitary!!

retiredguy123 07-08-2020 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mermaids (Post 1799749)
Ok with service animals, like leading a visually impaired person. What about all those little dogs riding in grocery carts? Very unsanitary!!

Publix does not allow dogs to ride in shopping carts, even if they are service animals.

EdFNJ 07-08-2020 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 1799794)
Publix does not allow dogs to ride in shopping carts, even if they are service animals.

Never have seen them ENFORCE that rule. Have seen a number of dogs in shopping carts both in main section and "baby" seat.

retiredguy123 07-08-2020 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EdFNJ (Post 1799961)
Never have seen them ENFORCE that rule. Have seen a number of dogs in shopping carts both in main section and "baby" seat.

I haven't either, but it is their corporate policy.

BossLady 07-08-2020 01:48 PM

!
 
I could go on and on on this thread for infinity. It gets me to see a Pet Dog, out of his element in a public place. This is it. The people bring their dog (and let him smell onions or packaged meat Or feed him from the table at the patio restaurant) feel entitled to take their dog everywhere - you know who you are. Right now, reading this, YOU are justifying that you never “take Fluffy but don‘t “feed” her on the restaurant patio - well sometimes, but you’d never feed her, Fluffy might however be licking the floor or some such Dog thing, or we have to negotiate a leash or being sniffed in the crotch (true story), I could go on and on ad infinity as this particular issue... A lot of good sense is previous pages here. Sentiments of the majority follow.

Make a decision pet-owner that enhances civilized society, leave your pet at home, where it is happy and safe. If you don’t sense you are out-of-place, you are and may need to worry about being alone in public, you need a PERSON with you. Or look around At your fellow citizens. Do they all bring their pets? Is there a sign posted about your Pet like at the beach?? And then, question your own social-awareness, and rethink it. You’re not too old to change. You’re flexible and independent.

In the grocery, I’m the person, the one, who immediately has to make a determination about what to do about you and Fluffy your pet. P.S. Fluffy ~ I’m only sad for you; obviously you suffer the poor decisions of your pet owner, I’ll look for you in ”LOST PET” ads - sad). So pet-owner, No one wants to confront you because most of us are civilized and are trying to mind on our business until YOU bring another species, that requires a whole new level of PPE for doggy and us, into our communal public space (ie: Dogs shed hair, people shed hair, monkeys shed hair, all the more to land on my meat - I’d like the least amount of hair on my meat LOL - I crack myself up!)

And the leash, it’s a thing too. How often does the dog go one way, the owner go the other, trying to find a lane, and you get caught have to make a decision not to get your ankles wrapped? Our unfortunate OP who encountered the “sniffer”... yep, it’s bad dude. It’s real bad. This brings me to the Manager or Senior looking employee. Sad. They are rock-and-hard-place people at that moment. Here comes... “Emotional Support Animal”. What can they do to Mr. & Mrs. SelfishPetDependent? There is Orange Juice Concentrate melting... I feel for all of us, mostly Fluffy and my Filet Mignon.

My wish, my hope upon hope, is the Fur Baby Lover, and all pet-owners who like to shop, you know who you are, having read this Forum will understand the silent majority. We don’t want to have to figure out for ourself if your Dog is “friendly” in public places. It’s annoying. Barking dogs are like children, unless they are yours, they are absolutely horrible to listen to. I know FeFe’s mouth is not clean. And “Old Yella” sniffs his Balls all day (please people-social-distance Broccoli) Fluffy has eaten her Butt, probably earlier today.

I vote, “Leave Doggy Home”. If you’re a trademark Attorney, Message me.

kaydee 07-08-2020 10:49 PM

If the violator can’t leave fido home then stay home with Fido!!!

jimbomaybe 07-09-2020 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodneysblue (Post 1798038)
I have a pet cow I’ve trained her to give me milk when I’m thirsty. Can I bring her in too?

I was thinking about a cow as my emotional support animal but when I saw "baby" I knew he was the one "Baby" my emotional support bull moose

PLedoux 07-09-2020 09:08 AM

Both.One does not negate the other.


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