Talk of The Villages Florida
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Talk of The Villages Florida (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/)
-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Dropping Home Prices in TV is a Good Thing (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/dropping-home-prices-tv-good-thing-344602/)

BrianL99 10-07-2023 05:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HandyGrandpap (Post 2263461)
This property at 6039 Swicord
purchaed 09/21 for $464K
Listed 4 sale 08/23 for $594K
dropped $30 now at $561

Still making a good profit, but not sold yet. Place is empty, suspect would take a lower price as still profit from paid $.

Pardon Our Interruption

Access to this page has been denied
With the lack of curb appeal, that house is going to be sitting until they make a drastic price reduction. U G L Y !

kkingston57 10-07-2023 05:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laker14 (Post 2263358)
Really? I have a comfortable 2.75% mortgage, while I'm making over 5% on CDs in my IRA with money I didn't have to distribute, and pay taxes on, thanks to my mortgage.

I don't feel sad. I don't think you need to feel sad for me either. It's working out OK.
Good moves. Timing this was good. Another reason that cash is king.

Michael 61 10-07-2023 05:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robbb (Post 2263492)
I maybe in the market for a new home, are you seeing those prices decline? I have not seen that but could be wrong. The problem I see with the new homes is there is nothing around them to go to without a long golf cart ride. Richmond is perfect but its all rentals.
Richmond is not ALL rentals, though higher in rental properties compared to some of the other newer villages, because of it’s proximity to Brownwood - will be interesting to see how many of the investments properties in Richmond will come on the market at the one-year-mark (Nov-Dec-Jan), and may flip to resident-owners.

The developer also is busy moving dirt on the east side of Meggison, and beginning to lay the groundwork for the final construction of Richmond homes (approx 85 new homes) — expect those to sell like “hotcakes”.

tophcfa 10-07-2023 06:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 2263471)
Mortgage rates don't really apply in the Villages, because the majority of homebuyers don't have a mortgage. This is their retirement home - which means they're moving from somewhere else. Supposedly selling their previous home, and using the proceeds to buy their Villages home, and living off their retirement income.
The problem with that is that many of the people up north who are buying those homes being sold by people moving to Florida are younger people who need sizable mortgages with low down payments.

Normal 10-07-2023 06:59 PM
Many Villages Salespeople Will Sell
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toymeister (Post 2263496)
Soon many Richmond homes will be on the secondary market when the speculators can sell them for a profit. Which you can't do in the first twelve months of ownership.
Many houses were likely bought up by salespeople working for the Villages. They have first dibs and it’s time to turn for profit. Look for more of the same in 115.

Randall55 10-07-2023 07:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263330)
Sad if a retired person purchases in TV and has a mortgage.

:popcorn:
Not if your mortgage rate is 2.5% and investments earn over 5%. I think this may be one reason people are not buying at the moment. Who can blame them?

I know several people who are waiting to buy homes near Eastport. They want to be closer to the championship golf courses and the square. They realize those homes will be a better investment than the surrounding preowned homes.

manaboutown 10-07-2023 08:02 PM
"In fact, although he was already very wealthy, Buffett himself used a 30-year mortgage in 1971 to finance the $150,000 purchase of a vacation home because he thought he could do better with the money than the interest he was paying for the house. (Note: Mortgage rates were in the 7.3% to 7.7% range in 1971)."

From: Here's Why Warren Buffett Thinks Using a Mortgage Is a Smart Move

Robbb 10-07-2023 09:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Normal (Post 2263515)
Many houses were likely bought up by salespeople working for the Villages. They have first dibs and it’s time to turn for profit. Look for more of the same in 115.
Are the sales people allowed to buy this homes as rentals? I was told they are sold to he first person who puts an offer in at 8am the day they go on the market.

Normal 10-08-2023 04:02 AM
Yes
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robbb (Post 2263534)
Are the sales people allowed to buy this homes as rentals? I was told they are sold to he first person who puts an offer in at 8am the day they go on the market.
Of course they are. They get the cream off the top. They know what is a good buy and what isn’t. In most cases they buy the homes and rent them for a year, then the home is resold. Salespeople just put their name in, if they want a house it’s theirs. Why would you even think otherwise? The investment corporate boogeyman exists, but holds nothing up to a certain group of salespeople who work for The Villages. If they want a house, you won’t have a chance at it. It’s a perk.

Just think of it as legal insider trading that hasn’t ever been addressed and few know the market as well as your “friendly” Villages salesperson.

Two Bills 10-08-2023 04:16 AM
Never been keen on personal debt, but a wise man once told me to never pay off a loan, if the amount was earning more when invested.
Lived by that all my working and earning days.
The advice never let me down.
Thanks Uncle Joe!

Jhnidy 10-08-2023 04:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263330)
Sad if a retired person purchases in TV and has a mortgage.

:popcorn:
You have to put the money someplace. Mortgages are cheap. The money can make more elsewhere

Kelevision 10-08-2023 04:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263353)
I did.

I said, "It's sad"

:thumbup:
Why do I want 400k tied up in a house that I’m not taking with me?

asianthree 10-08-2023 05:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall55 (Post 2263518)
Not if your mortgage rate is 2.5% and investments earn over 5%. I think this may be one reason people are not buying at the moment. Who can blame them?

I know several people who are waiting to buy homes near Eastport. They want to be closer to the championship golf courses and the square. They realize those homes will be a better investment than the surrounding preowned homes.
It’s hard for certain ages to see the bigger picture, of one can make more money by investing, and use OPM mortgages money.

My parents are that age bracket, use all your cash so you don’t have a mortgage. Problem is money doesn’t grow, until house is sold. Usually upon death, so one is sitting on debt free house, with no tax write off, and unless they take out a equity loan (which is 12.5%) money is stagnant.

Our financial guy for the last 6 houses, always has us take large mortgage, 30-60 days pay down 30- 50% or more, especially when rates are above 4%. All the while our investments are making us money, more that the interest debt.

So no matter what interest rate is, your monthly interest is reduced by half and then some. Re-amortization of payments for $175.

ROCKETMAN 10-08-2023 05:27 AM
I have a lot of friends who have mortgages. According to citizens bank approximately one third of villagers have mortgages for different reasons. Some people think everyone in the villages is a millionaire. Biggest reason some have mortgages is between 2011 and 2020 the s and p averaged 14.9 percent gain. In this time frame everyone got a 3 per cent mortgage or re financed their current mortgage to 3 per cent. Paying 3 percent and getting a 15 per cent return made sense. Now with the market and rates may not make that decision.

Rwirish 10-08-2023 05:39 AM
Retire with a mortgage? Not a good move.

BrianL99 10-08-2023 06:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asianthree (Post 2263556)
It’s hard for certain ages to see the bigger picture, of one can make more money by investing, and use OPM mortgages money.

My parents are that age bracket, use all your cash so you don’t have a mortgage. Problem is money doesn’t grow, until house is sold. Usually upon death, so one is sitting on debt free house, with no tax write off, and unless they take out a equity loan (which is 12.5%) money is stagnant.

Our financial guy for the last 6 houses, always has us take large mortgage, 30-60 days pay down 30- 50% or more, especially when rates are above 4%. All the while our investments are making us money, more that the interest debt.

So no matter what interest rate is, your monthly interest is reduced by half and then some. Re-amortization of payments for $175.
Some ages, just don't have a clue ... but they're never in doubt.

GizmoWhiskers 10-08-2023 06:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Vernon (Post 2263319)
The Villages success is based upon likeminded folks that save and move to a beautiful place to reward a lifetime of effort. The last few years have priced homes out of many savers range and moved sales into an elevated investment cycle that hurts the environment for snowbirds and full-time residents. As the place we love becomes a less desirable investment many of the problems that have come with it simply go away. This morning's listings Zillow 384, TV preowned 394, TV new 314 and growing. This is the largest number of listed new construction since I started keeping track in 2020 and just short of twice the number which was 199 in January of this year. I asked the Village Newcomers Jerry and Linda on their YouTube channel if they would or could have moved here if prices were where they are now. The answer was "No," and they are a prime example two retired teachers with pensions coming to their happy place. See you all in February. Have a Great Day!
The Village Newcomers are hardly new comers. 2020 they said "The wind never blows in The Villages". A neighbors outside grill was lifted up and hit the eve of the house. It was a beautiful day without a cloud in the sky. They lost all credibility in my mind lol.

I stopped watching their videos. They WERE "new comers". They are building an audience and with that revenue just like ToTV. Some stuff is informational but it's still opinion to be digested like a grain of salt.

As far as the pricing in The Villages... it's a sellers market where those in charge have not tanked their city/state economy. Interest rates have done the rest of the damage for buyers as many have better interest frates from the PAST. How to fix that, oh, dare I say elections matter... even at the local levels.

newgirl 10-08-2023 06:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263345)
I think my first mortgage was 12%. OUCH!!!!


In 1984 they were 24% when I bought my first home. We were able to do a wrap loan that brought it down to 13.5%

huge-pigeons 10-08-2023 06:32 AM
Not everyone needs to retire here. You are asking the residents here to sacrifice some of their wealth (home asset worth) to allow others to move in.
If people can’t afford it, then they need to look at places where they can afford it. I wouldn’t want to see people move here that then can’t afford to keep their house looking good because their mortgage is killing them to repay.
But if I was looking, I would like this downturn with higher interest rates because I would just pay cash, IMO, most retirees should pay cash for their home.

Mrfriendly 10-08-2023 06:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263330)
Sad if a retired person purchases in TV and has a mortgage.

:popcorn:
Unless the person wanted the 2.5% mortgage and choose not to liquidate much of their savings.

dewilson58 10-08-2023 06:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrfriendly (Post 2263591)
Unless the person wanted the 2.5% mortgage and choose not to liquidate much of their savings.
Again......................that is an investment decision.

:loco::loco::loco:

G.R.I.T.S. 10-08-2023 07:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263345)
I think my first mortgage was 12%. OUCH!!!!
First one was 8 1/2% and was considered “high.” Seven years later, our second mortgage was 11 1/2%. Our goal to pay it off was achieved in two years and we’ve never had another mortgage.

JGibson 10-08-2023 07:12 AM
No wonder TV residents get a snobby reputation.

If someone retires and takes out a mortgage because they don't have the cash who cares it's their business.

Not everyone is as fortunate as others in life or know what may have happened in their life that they don't have the cash for a house.

Stop being so judgmental and condescending of other's finances.

Rzepecki 10-08-2023 07:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263330)
Sad if a retired person purchases in TV and has a mortgage.

:popcorn:
Or wise. Why would I pay cash for my home when my mortgage rate is so low and I can make more by investing my money.

Rzepecki 10-08-2023 07:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263345)
I think my first mortgage was 12%. OUCH!!!!
Our first was over 13% in 1986.

RCMill531@comcast.net 10-08-2023 07:20 AM
Many people in The Villages have mortgages and could not afford a house now because of 7+ percent interest rates (double our rate in January 2022). Because this is such a desirable area, values go up. It’s happened since the beginning and of course nobody wants their values to remain the same as when they bought. I’m happy mine has gone up $100,000 since we bought and we probably couldn’t afford it at today’s prices and interest rates. Some retirees cannot afford to move here or need to buy a smaller home. That’s life. The same everywhere.

Mrfriendly 10-08-2023 07:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263345)
I think my first mortgage was 12%. OUCH!!!!
My first mortgage was a 10% seller financed 7yr balloon. I got the house one percent less than going rate and he made 10% on $180K for the 7yrs. We were both happy after crash of 1987.
I would consider doing same as a seller of up north property if rates continue to rise.

dewilson58 10-08-2023 07:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rzepecki (Post 2263604)
Or wise. Why would I pay cash for my home when my mortgage rate is so low and I can make more by investing my money.
That's called leverage..............that's an investment decision........taking a market risk......not what I'm talking about.

TeresaE 10-08-2023 08:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263330)
Sad if a retired person purchases in TV and has a mortgage.

:popcorn:
Why? Financial security is about cash flow not mortgage debt. I’ve met many homeowners over the years that are equity rich and cash poor. They can’t pay for repairs, taxes or insurance, even with a reverse mortgage in place. They outlive their money.

dewilson58 10-08-2023 08:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeresaE (Post 2263631)
. I’ve met many homeowners over the years that are equity rich and cash poor. They can’t pay for repairs, taxes or insurance, even with a reverse mortgage in place.
Yep....................that's sad....... a very sad financial position.

dewilson58 10-08-2023 08:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrfriendly (Post 2263611)
My first mortgage was a 10% seller financed 7yr balloon. I got the house one percent less than going rate and he made 10% on $180K for the 7yrs.
Oh yes, balloons...................probably become more popular now with slightly higher rates.

retiredguy123 10-08-2023 08:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeresaE (Post 2263631)
Why? Financial security is about cash flow not mortgage debt. I’ve met many homeowners over the years that are equity rich and cash poor. They can’t pay for repairs, taxes or insurance, even with a reverse mortgage in place. They outlive their money.
If you live your life debt free, you will accumulate enormous wealth. The worst advice some adults give to young people is that they need to "establish credit". The advice should be "don't borrow money".

Normal 10-08-2023 08:40 AM
Real Crash
 
When The Villages starts discounting more of their new homes, you know the crash is here.

Randall55 10-08-2023 08:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2263648)
If you live your life debt free, you will accumulate enormous wealth. The worst advice some adults give to young people is that they need to "establish credit". The advice should be "don't borrow money".
Once you accumulate the wealth, you use the money to make more money. You shouldn't pay off debts that are lower than what you can earn. Keeping a 2.5% mortgage while earning 5+ percent in investments makes sense to me.

BlueStarAirlines 10-08-2023 08:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MX rider (Post 2263344)
You shouldn't paint with such a broad brush. Everyones situation is different.
We bought about 18 months ago when the rate was 3.5%. Our investments make more than that, so we decided to finance and leave our cash invested.

That said, some people may be able to afford a mortgage payment and not have enough liquid money to pay cash. There's no real right or wrong way to do it. If people can do this and find their happy place, good for them.
This is exactly right. We have a mortgage at 4% and funds that we could use to pay off the house earning 5.3%. Other investment funds are earning much more. The mortgage tax deduction plus earning a higher interest rate makes paying off our mortgage early foolish.

MX rider 10-08-2023 08:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2263648)
If you live your life debt free, you will accumulate enormous wealth. The worst advice some adults give to young people is that they need to "establish credit". The advice should be "don't borrow money".
Thats just your opinion, not fact.

The FACT is, there's many ways to live your life successfully and happy. There's no right way. What works for you may not work for others.

If someone wants to move to TV and mortgage their house, go for it. If they can afford the payments it's all good, imo.

You only live once.

Marine1974 10-08-2023 09:10 AM
Interest rates
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tophcfa (Post 2263340)
By all reasonable measures interest rates really aren’t high. Interest rates are supposed to be set so responsible savers and investors can earn a real rate of return above inflation. Since the housing market crash of 2007/08, the Federal Reserve long time irresponsible monitory policy of artificially low interest rates created a society dangerously addicted to unsustainable debt. Current interest rates are around long term averages if the period of artificially low rates are excluded. Housing values should adjust to reflect the Federal Reserve returning to doing their job responsibly.
Maybe you recall supply and demand ? When American oil drilling was restricted , oil prices shot up from $30 a barrel to $130 a barrel overnight.

Tell that to the people priced out of buying a home . 60 % of Americans can’t afford to purchase a home . The huge massive amount of national debt ,
printing of money and shutting off the spigot of American 🇺🇸 oil is driving inflation and interest rates higher . .

vintageogauge 10-08-2023 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marine1974 (Post 2263665)
Maybe you recall supply and demand ? When American oil drilling was restricted , oil prices shot up from $30 a barrel to $130 a barrel overnight.

Tell that to the people priced out of buying a home . 60 % of Americans can’t afford to purchase a home . The huge massive amount of national debt ,
printing of money and shutting off the spigot of American 🇺🇸 oil is driving inflation and interest rates higher . .
Historically interest rates are not high they were simply artificially low for a few years and are now back to where they were for decades. Buyers will have to get used to looking at lower priced homes if they can't afford a mortgage on the home they want. There are a lot of new pre-fab communities being constructed by smart builders where zoning allows them. Today's prefabs are quality homes with all the amenities and are quite affordable and the developers doing this found themselves a gold mine.

Birdrm 10-08-2023 09:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 (Post 2263330)
Sad if a retired person purchases in TV and has a mortgage.

:popcorn:
So what is your point, that those that don't have 300-500K in cash when retired shouldn't be moving to the Villages?

charlieo1126@gmail.com 10-08-2023 09:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rwirish (Post 2263560)
Retire with a mortgage? Not a good move.
I’ve owned numerous homes and condos since I retired including 6 , 5 new ,one preowned in the villages , I’ve never paid cash or have I paid the bond off on any of them ,it made no sense during these periods of low interest rates ,I bought my last one here a couple of years ago at 83, I know many others who do. the same thing . I realize many people like to have the peace of mind by paying off the mortgage and that’s fine , and there are many here that can’t afford to pay cash and others like me who don’t look at a house as a home but as an investment tool, there nothing wrong with debt , rich people use it all the time to get richer ( not me lol)FYI I do pay cash for my cars which I probably shouldn’t, but there’s that peace of mind thing I was talking about


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