[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by John41

The Florida Impact Fee law states the increased services are to be paid through impact fees not property taxes. The law was passed because seniors were being taxed out of their homes by development.

So increased services COULD BE paid for by impact fees, not required to be paid for by. Big difference.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by GPGuar

I feel the same way, there is way too much development in just a very short period of time. There was a time when the developer built one village at a time, now its just an explosion of houses with not nearly enough stores or business for south of 44.

Is your home south of 44?

[Advogado]

Good news. The County Commission just turned down the Developer's offer. The Developer offered to "voluntarily" pay 56% of what he should be paying for Sumter County roads--so long as he is protected from paying for his other county infrastructure and the residents pay for it!

[nn0wheremann]

In Taiwan a property owner writes their own assessment on a parcel of real estate. However, that assessment is an option to the county to purchase the property at the self declared assessed valuation. Just a way to keep everyone honest.

[Villages Kahuna]

My emails to Gary Search and Craig Estep are on their way. I hope all of you are taking the time to let them know how you feel about them caving in to the Morse pressure so quickly. Only a couple of months since the election and those two already appear to be in the Morse’s pocket. Somebody has to feed that fourth generation of the Morse family. Based on the new commissioner’s campaign, I never thought they’d flip and vote to have it come out of our pockets so quickly. Disgusting.

We’ve been in The Villages for sixteen years and probably don’t have that many more to go. But I will say this to those of you reading this that may not have made up your mind to buy and move here — consider the opinion of a longtime resident.

We've enjoyed our first fifteen years living here. But in the last year or so it’s become very apparent that the relationship between the Developer and the residents is changing in a big way. The quick and secretive decisions to increase building density and grab for cash flow from many more apartments, the disgusting decision to shift the cost of infrastructure in newly developed areas to ALL Sumter County residents with a huge real estate tax increase, and the out-of-control pace of development.

This isn’t the same type of community as it was under the ownership of Harold Schwartz and his son Gary Morse. The three siblings running The Villages now are nearing retirement. Who knows who and how many of the incoming fourth generation of the family will be running the place for the next few decades? But one thing is for sure — there are a whole lot more Morse mouths to feed. And it’s pretty clear the money will be coming out of all Sumter County resident’s pockets!

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by Villages Kahuna

My emails to Gary Search and Craig Estep are on their way. I hope all of you are taking the time to let them know how you feel about them caving in to the Morse pressure so quickly. Only a couple of months since the election and those two already appear to be in the Morse’s pocket. Somebody has to feed that fourth generation of the Morse family. Based on the new commissioner’s campaign, I never thought they’d flip and vote to have it come out of our pockets so quickly. Disgusting.

We’ve been in The Villages for sixteen years and probably don’t have that many more to go. But I will say this to those of you reading this that may not have made up your mind to buy and move here — consider the opinion of a longtime resident.

We've enjoyed our first fifteen years living here. But in the last year or so it’s become very apparent that the relationship between the Developer and the residents is changing in a big way. The quick and secretive decisions to increase building density and grab for cash flow from many more apartments, the disgusting decision to shift the cost of infrastructure in newly developed areas to ALL Sumter County residents with a huge real estate tax increase, and the out-of-control pace of development.

This isn’t the same type of community as it was under the ownership of Harold Schwartz and his son Gary Morse. The three siblings running The Villages now are nearing retirement. Who knows who and how many of the incoming fourth generation of the family will be running the place for the next few decades? But one thing is for sure — there are a whole lot more Morse mouths to feed. And it’s pretty clear the money will be coming out of all Sumter County resident’s pockets!

Hopefully, residents will heed your request and encourage Commissioners. Estep and Search to keep their campaign promise and keep it NOW, not some time in the future. All three new Commissioners (the EMS Team) are under tremendous pressure from the Developer not to do so ever--neither now nor in the future. The Developer's pressure includes propaganda disguised as news in his newspaper, attacks on the reputations of the EMS team, packing the Commission meeting, and filling the meeting's parking lot with construction vehicles to crowd out the public.

The delay in implementing reasonable impact fees for the Developer and a corresponding property-tax cut for residents is putting millions of dollars in the Developer's pocket at our expense.

Hopefully, residents will also give Commissioner Miller an attaboy for trying to keep his promise to the voters despite the Developer's pressure.

[manaboutown]

Sumter County needed to get that $50,000,000 somewhere for the new and upgraded roads where the developer plans to build.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by John41

Do you know the developer is a billionaire and many seniors here depend on SS. Talk about reverse Robin Hood steal from the poor to give to the rich. Nice.

Did you know that the "developer" did not become a billionaire by living off SS?????
Just because "he" was very successful and earned lots of $$$ (over a 40+ year span) does not mean "he" should give it away. Typical "stick it to the rich" liberal class warfare.

On the other side, if your retirement plan was to live solely off SS, you planned poorly, especially if that plan included living in TV

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Did you know that the "developer" did not become a billionaire by living off SS?????
Just because "he" was very successful and earned lots of $$$ (over a 40+ year span) does not mean "he" should give it away. Typical "stick it to the rich" liberal class warfare.

On the other side, if your retirement plan was to live solely off SS, you planned poorly, especially if that plan included living in TV

I don't think that many residents are begrudging the Developer's becoming a billionaire by building and selling houses, and this is not "liberal class warfare" as you allege. (Full disclosure: I am a lifelong Republican.) In fact, over all, I admire the great job that the Developer has done in planning and building a retirement community and think that he deserves to have become rich doing so.

Our complaint here is:
We do begrudge the Developer's using his former control of the County Commission to further enrich himself at the expense of the residents of Sumter County. We, the residents, should not be subsidizing the Developer. We are now doing that via the combination of his sweetheart impact fee and our 25% tax hike to pay for his county infrastructure.

That combination exists only because the Developer, after he pushed through One Sumter, was able to put into office puppet Commissioners who would do his bidding. We tossed out 3 of the Developer's 5 puppet Commissioners in the last election and voted in the EMS team. We will toss out the remaining two (Gilpin and Breeden) next year.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Advogado

I don't think that many residents are begrudging the Developer's becoming a billionaire by building and selling houses, and this is not "liberal class warfare" as you allege. (Full disclosure: I am a lifelong Republican.) In fact, over all, I admire the great job that the Developer has done in planning and building a retirement community and think that he deserves to have become rich doing so.

Our complaint here is:
We do begrudge the Developer's using his former control of the County Commission to further enrich himself at the expense of the residents of Sumter County. We, the residents, should not be subsidizing the Developer. We are now doing that via the combination of his sweetheart impact fee and our 25% tax hike to pay for his county infrastructure.

That combination exists only because the Developer, after he pushed through One Sumter, was able to put into office puppet Commissioners who would do his bidding. We tossed out 3 of the Developer's 5 puppet Commissioners in the last election and voted in the EMS team. We will toss out the remaining two (Gilpin and Breeden) next year.

Again, and for the 10,000th time----Whether county infrastructure costs are financed through the property tax or an impact fee makes NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER to the developer. Any additional cost will simply be passed on to the new home buyer.

PS: If this issue finally gets resolved, what will you have to post about?

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Again, and for the 10,000th time----Whether county infrastructure costs are financed through the property tax or an impact fee makes NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER to the developer. Any additional cost will simply be passed on to the new home buyer.

PS: If this issue finally gets resolved, what will you have to post about?

First, your statement that paying for his own infrastructure through a reasonable impact fee would make “NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER to the developer” is absurd. Why do you think he and his suppliers spent almost a quarter of a million dollars last year in a failed attempt to keep his puppets in office and he has launched a propaganda and lobbying campaign to stall and block an end to his sweetheart impact-fee deal?

Second, think about it: If, as you seem to indicate, the Developer could simply increase his prices in the amount of the proposed impact fees without negatively impacting his sales and profits, he should fire his CFO for not already having increased prices, thereby leaving money on the table. If businesses could simply pass on higher costs without reducing sales, no business would ever go bankrupt.

Third, from a policy standpoint, if the Developer passes some (or even all) of higher impact fees to the buyers of new homes, fine. The costs of the new infrastructure will then be borne by the people benefiting from it, not by the current residents, most of whom are only getting negative effects from the massive growth.

In summary, the Developer is lining his pocket at the expense of current residents via a combination of a sweetheart impact fee for himself and higher property taxes. As to your question about what I will post about if this situation gets corrected, I don't know, but I would be happy to see the present abuse of current residents ended. I try to limit my posts to subjects that I know something about and care about.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Again, and for the 10,000th time----Whether county infrastructure costs are financed through the property tax or an impact fee makes NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER to the developer. Any additional cost will simply be passed on to the new home buyer.

PS: If this issue finally gets resolved, what will you have to post about?

While this is true for homes would it be as true for businesses? A home might see an increase of up to $2,000 if the impact fee allocation was raised to 100% on the developer. On a $350,000 home this is a negligible 0.6% increase. Commercial properties pay considerably more. A 5,000 square foot restaurant would see an increase of about $90,000.

A developer could add $2,000 to the price of homes and still sell them as fast as he could build them. Would the developer have the same success selling the restaurant building at $90,000 more than what it sells for today? I don't know what commercial properties sell for or lease for but $90,000 doesn't seem like a negligible amount.

EDIT: I am not advocating for the status quo or a 100% impact fee. There has to be something in the middle that helps pay for more of the road impact without driving out new businesses entirely.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Advogado

First, your statement that paying for his own infrastructure through a reasonable impact fee would make “NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER to the developer” is absurd. Why do you think he and his suppliers spent almost a quarter of a million dollars last year in a failed attempt to keep his puppets in office and he has launched a propaganda and lobbying campaign to stall and block an end to his sweetheart impact-fee deal?

Second, think about it: If, as you seem to indicate, the Developer could simply increase his prices in the amount of the proposed impact fees without negatively impacting his sales and profits, he should fire his CFO for not already having increased prices, thereby leaving money on the table. If businesses could simply pass on higher costs without reducing sales, no business would ever go bankrupt.

Third, from a policy standpoint, if the Developer passes some (or even all) of higher impact fees to the buyers of new homes, fine. The costs of the new infrastructure will then be borne by the people benefiting from it, not by the current residents, most of whom are only getting negative effects from the massive growth.

In summary, the Developer is lining his pocket at the expense of current residents via a combination of a sweetheart impact fee for himself and higher property taxes. As to your question about what I will post about if this situation gets corrected, I don't know, but I would be happy to see the present abuse of current residents ended. I try to limit my posts to subjects that I know something about and care about.

In summary, you're wrong.

If TV was a development struggling to sell homes you would be right. Just look at the home sales around Juliette Falls. However, here they are selling as quickly as they can build them, so yes, the developer would have no problem passing on higher impact fees to the new homebuyer

And if you don't think residents of Sumter County get a huge benefit from TV, you're blind.
30 years ago Sumter County was the poorest county in Florida, now it ranks 10th or 11th. Better infrastructure, better retail, better employment---the list goes on

It is clear you care about this subject---but KNOW about if? That remains questionable.

[Advogado]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

In summary, you're wrong.

If TV was a development struggling to sell homes you would be right. Just look at the home sales around Juliette Falls. However, here they are selling as quickly as they can build them, so yes, the developer would have no problem passing on higher impact fees to the new homebuyer

And if you don't think residents of Sumter County get a huge benefit from TV, you're blind.
30 years ago Sumter County was the poorest county in Florida, now it ranks 10th or 11th. Better infrastructure, better retail, better employment---the list goes on

It is clear you care about this subject---but KNOW about if? That remains questionable.

As I pointed out, it is clear that the Developer cannot raise prices without taking a profit hit-- for the reasons I detailed. He certainly doesn't think he can. But, as I also pointed out, we shouldn't care if he passes along 100% of increased impact fees, because we, the current residents, will still not be paying for his county infrastructure.

Here is what most residents are getting from the massive expansion of The Villages now underway:
>an outrageous 25% property-tax increase,
>wear and tear on our roads,
>downward pressure on our home values from the ever-increasing supply of homes,
>pollution,
>more strain on a one-star health care system,
>draining of our aquifer,
>traffic congestion,
>food trucks (“roach coaches”) instead of country clubs with restaurants and championship golf courses,
>a vast expanse of tract houses instead of a bucolic countryside,
>difficulty in contracting home services, and
>crowding at our various facilities.

You have not said one word about the issue here: Why should the current residents pay for county infrastructure necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages? Somebody has to pay for it, and that somebody clearly should be the Developer.

In your reply, which I suspect will be forthcoming, maybe you could address this issue, which involves tens of millions of our taxpayer dollars, instead of merely complaining because it matters to me, as it does to all the residents who booted out the Developer's puppet Commissioners last year. You and the Developer seem unwilling to accept the fact that this issue should have been decided by the outcome of that election.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Advogado

You have not said one word about the issue here: Why should the current residents pay for county infrastructure necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages? Somebody has to pay for it, and that somebody clearly should be the Developer.

As I have CLEARLY pointed out in many posts in many threads on this subject, there are 2 ways to pay for COUNTY infrastructure (Infrastructure within the development is funded through bonds).

One is to impose an "impact fee", based on the additional costs of having more homes in the county. More/ better access roads, more fire and police protection, more maintenance, etc. In most areas of the country those costs are built into the home price and the buyer never sees them (although they pay for them). This puts the additional cost on the the new homeowners since those costs will be passed on to the consumer(as it is everywhere else in the country) But to think "the developer" will pay for them out of "his" profit margin is idiotic.

The other is to fund it out of the general property tax revenue paid by all county residents. This forces the financial burden of additional costs of new development on everyone. Is that fair????

The third way is a combination of #1 and#2.

I don't know the answers, but.......
To those that feel they should not be subsidizing new homeowners on their tax dollar, who paid when YOUR home was the new development?
To those that think no one benefits other than the residents of a newly developed area, I have already posted a list that benefits everyone.

Someone has made the argument that the "developer" will have to eat the impact fees otherwise they would not be trying so hard to "control" the county commission. Well, there are a ton of benefits to controlling a county government beyond impact fees, so that argument doesn't old water. Homes here sell like hotcakes so I doubt there would be any problem passing costs along to the end user.

Of course, there will be those (one) who will disagree and continue his/her crusade