No one is saying that your choice is wrong, just you might have had a problem that caused the compressor to fail early that could have been corrected if other tests were done periodically. There is no way to tell now but that's the point of this thread.

I have. Two years ago, during a routine maintenance visit, our Munn's technician found the capacitor in our unit was out of spec. He replaced it with a new USA made capacitor at no cost to me.

How old was your system at the time? They probably changed it for free because the part was still under warrenty or did you have a "special" contract with them?

I just purchased my first ever maintenance plan from Sunshine AC after reading a few reviews of their business. I called them out just for some reassurance and to have them look at some work that was done by the installing company (no emergency).

The plan I chose was for 2 visits per year and I chose it after watching the technician do all his work and asking questions. My invoice was a few cents shy of $300.

The technician was here for a minimum of 90 minutes. He took before and after pictures of everything he cleaned and all readouts of testing he did on the capacitor etc. He cleaned the outside unit and the air handler unit in the garage including a thorough flush of the condensate line.

There was some “fur” on the inside of the air handler that really surprised me because I thought I was doing sufficient maintenance to keep that from happening (changing filters and treating condensate line).

Let me state that I know basically nothing about HVAC units but like to do DIY projects whenever I can providing that I feel I can do it without much hassle or questions about my results. To me, there are some things that I’d rather pay someone else to do and some things I would rather do myself. For instance, I won’t pay someone to mow my yard, fertilize it, treat it for pests or disease, trim my hedges and shrubs, treat weeds, etc.

The tech showed me the capacitor reading (41.42) and told me that it should be between 40-45 with a reading higher in the range being preferable. I chose not to replace it during this visit. He quoted me $141 to replace it and gave me the capacitor model number.

The plan I chose includes discounts on parts and labor for work done and some other terms I found beneficial to me.

My system is 5 years old and he sent me copies of every picture that he took and there were many.

I’m happy with all of it and I don’t have to mess around with something I know little about. That’s more free time for golf, fishing or yard work! 😎

We use Kalos and have been for many years. They have several different Service Plans. As for replacing the Capacitor they cost under $20 and it is very easy for anyone who can use a screwdriver to do it yourself. I recommend keeping a spare on hand because that is the most common item to fail.

Our original Carrier is 21 yrs old. Do the maintenance myself. Live in expanded Gardenia, just paid electric bill yesterday $199

We had a maintenance plan with Kalos for one year, then had them install mini-splits in lanai and garage and a year later a whole house dehumidifier in the attic. We were very happy until the dehumidifier installation which they screwed up badly even after having three different techs come out to re-work it because none seemed to know what they were doing. Even though it works okay now at keeping humidity low it came at the expense of one of our guest rooms being warmer than it used to be. For some reason the dehumidifier is affecting the temp of the air coming out of that one register. We lost all confidence in them and no longer recommend them to our neighbors and friends.

All this to say we no longer have a maintenance plan with any company because we don’t know who to trust, or whether we even need one. Our home is three yrs old, and we have a Carrier unit. Hubby does the condensation drain line monthly, and the filter every six months.

I'm 100% positive, they didn't install a $20 capacitor. The "good" capacitors that last the longest are made in the USA. Amrad is one. They cost $65 + and will last 2-3 times longer than the $10-$20 capacitor you get on Amazon.

You did the right thing going with a reputable company like Sunshine but you are wasting your money getting the 2x/year maintenance. 1x/year is plenty here in the Villages. They have the 2x/year plan for those that want it but it's not necessary. As far as the capacitor, it's still in tolerance but my guess is next year you will probably need to change it and $141 is a fair price because they use the $65+ Amrad capacitor and not the Chinese junk you get for $10 on Amazon or sometimes free from Ace Hardware.

Do you have any data for that or is it just your opinion based on the lower price?

What is the temp difference between bedrooms after dehumidifier? Compared to temp monitors prior

Our house At comfort setting 77.
Front south facing bedroom (16x16’west facing 36’window) consistent 75. Should be hottest.
Middle two bedrooms (12’x15’ windows 36” width facing west) 76.
Master northeast (18.5’x19’ window 72” width) consistent 77. Master is the farthest from HVAC.

We are block with 10’ walls interior and exterior and 8’ interior and exterior doors

Temps hold steady for the last two years no matter the outside temperature.

Considering a whole house dehumidifier because of sliders opening in and out to pool.

Yes, they do use the better capacitors. I have multiple reasons for taking the 2-visit plan, which I’m perfectly comfortable with. Peace of mind is one. Another is that I’m not wasting money paying someone to cut my grass! 😎

I’m also setting up a little test to see if the second visit is as comprehensive as the first and to see how much the capacitor declines after this summer’s power outages and going into the heating season. I don’t have to renew it so it’s money well spent in my mind. I’d only waste it on more bass fishing tackle or golf stuff.

Sounds good. Just let us know how it goes. Maybe we can learn something.

As fas as the capacitor goes, the reason why these devices go bad is from heat. Eventually the heat breaks them down over time. You want to catch it because when they go below spec, the compressor and or the fan motor will be working harder shortening their life. So in the long run you will be damaging expensive components just to save a few bucks on a new capacitor. The Sunshine tech did the right thing letting you know the capacitor was on the low end of the spec but it's up to you to authorize the replacement and as I said, $141 is reasonable because the capacitor is probably $65-$75 to purchase then something for installation.

If the word on the street is that MUNNS is increasing their service price, is there another HVAC company that anyone uses where the price will remain reasonable and the service is dependable? Would appreciate any feedback.

I think better to say Munns is increasing their prices to better align with the competition being Sunshine and Sunkool. Any of these companies should do a great job with the price they charge and from customer reports, all are reputable and honest so no need to worry.

I have had no problem with the overall quality of the work that Munn's did just thought them telling me they need a 45% price increase with no prior warning was out of line.

Call Jeff Cabral, HONEST, great service, reasonably priced and very reliable. He's done annual maintenance for the last 4 years, very happy.
352-559-9558
Cabral Heating and Air Conditioning | Sumter, Lake & Marion County

Something happened at Munns because we recently found out they are also not doing HVAC installs in the new builds for the Villages any more.

I'm wondering, is it possible they had a lot of techs that didn't meet the new administrations requirements and now they have to hire more techs which is costing them more thus the price increase in-line with the rest of the industry? Just a thought.

You can also get a window AC from most places and return it within thirty days (depending on the place) even if you used it. Had this happen up north one time and did this.

Window AC units are not allowed in The Villages. Read your deed restriction document.

I have Munn’s come twice a year at any cost. They hook up their laptop to it and run diagnostics and email a copy. Plus they take the housing off and clean things and flush the drain system with a pump. Small price to pay to make sure my AC lasts and never breaks in this heat. My unit is 4 years old and started this proactive maintenance the first year. I’ve had to replace units in past homes and want to push off that huge expense as long as possible.

Wrong. Munn’s hooks up a computer to the system and runs diagnostics and emails the results. Plus they pressure pump the drain among other things. All takes about 45 minutes. Everyone I know has their’s serviced. The only difference is if they do it once a year or twice a year.

Nothing the technician does will ensure that your AC system will never break.

I have never had my HVAC system maintained by a technician. And, as far as I know, there is no way to connect the system to a computer to run a diagnostic test. What information do you get from the email that they send?

Thoroughly cleaning the drain line will greatly reduce the risk of it clogging.

Measuring the capacitor will determine whether it is about to fail and facilitate replacing it before it does.

Checking the delta temperatures will reveal if the system is functioning optimally and will initiate a conversation about replacement before a complete failure.

Inspecting and cleaning the evaporator coils will improve efficiency, reduce electrical usage/cost, and detect premature corrosion.

None of these will ensure that the system never breaks but they all lower the risk of it breaking suddenly in the middle of a heatwave.

Mine has no connection either but I am not at all surprised to learn that newer systems do. It's probably a very inexpensive modification to have a pressure sensor changed from a binary good/bad to be calibrated and report the actual pressure. Temperature sensors before and after the evaporator coil could report delta temperatures. Ammeters and capacitance meters could be added to check current draw and the health of the capacitor.

If you are only having maintenance performed once per year, that is not often enough to ensure that the condensate drain will not clog. And, you can easily clean the coils yourself. Also, I think the filter should be replaced at least every 6 months, and you can save money by buying and replacing your own filters. HVAC companies will charge at least $50 for a filter.

Sunshine Air charged mine. $164.00 for a capacitor while on a maintenance visit. It was supposedly under warranty.

You don’t do maintenance on your car till the warranty dies. Believe that would violate your warranty.

I change the oil, but that is all. I have never had a problem enforcing the warranty.

Exactly :icon_wink:

As far as connecting "a computer" to your system, what that person was referring to is they usually have a tablet device where they login for your visit and enter all the readings they are measuring such as pressures and temperatures, super heat, sub cooling, fan motor current draw, capacitor reading, etc... They are not connecting to any electronics in you system because there are no computerized electronics in it to connect to.

The only time they can "connect" electronically to your system is if you have a Carrier Infinity system. That system has electronics in it that enables the technician connect to it via bluetooth and gather all the readings, load software if necessary, etc... This system also has electronics that monitor's itself to help the technician determine if there is a problem and how to approach fixing it. Very cool.

Another case in point where you want a professional to put gauges on your system to measure the pressures, temperatures, super heat and sub cooling.

When the refrigerant as a liquid goes into your evaporator coil in your air handler, as the hotter air from your home passes over the coil, that cold liquid changes to a gas. If you have a dirty filter, fan motor not running at spec. so there is inadequate air flow, faulty TXV valve, etc., the refrigerant will not change 100% to a gas and a gas/liquid refrigerant mixture will go back to your compressor and make it fail prematurely. Your system will seem like it's running just fine but in reality it's slowly dying. The only way to detect this is by looking at the super heat when measuring the refrigerant with gauges and checking the airflow and current draw of the fan in the air handler. So while most think they are taking good care of their system by changing filters, cleaning the condenser coil and condensate line, not checking the refrigerant which requires specialized equipment and knowledge on how to use it, and not taking certain amperage reading of the fan motors is hiding potential problems that could be shortening the life of your system.

But many will say "Wait a minute, I do minimal maintenance and my system has been running with minimal problems for 15 years". That may be the case but it may last even longer if you detect and fix some of these other common issues which can shorten the life of your system.

I am not saying that regular maintenance does not help to diagnose some issues. But, in my opinion, regular maintenance is not worth the cost in terms of return on investment. It benefits the HVAC companies way more than the customers. The same AC systems are used around the world in countries that have worse weather conditions than The Villages, and most of those systems are never maintained. I lived in Saudi Arabia where the average daytime temperature was about 115 degrees, and they did no maintenance whatsoever. I think that spending $100 to $200 every year to have a technician spend an hour checking gauges is a waste of money. If the unit is running and I am comfortable, I'm happy. Can you provide any benefit-to-cost data to justify the cost of a regular maintenance program? I would also add that none of the HVAC companies who promote these maintenance programs offer a written guarantee of repairs or system longevity.

Let me ask you, can you provide any benefit-to-cost data that doesn't justify the cost of a regular maintenance program?

But I see your point. What I disagree with is when you say spending money on having a professional check your system periodically is a waste of money.

I would have to go look for studies but you can go on Youtube and see tons of videos of HVAC repairs where the homeowner did no maintenance and the results.

Regardless, you just have to look at the science and engineering on how these systems work and how they typically fail to determine whether you think preventive maintenance helps prevent a failure and or prolongs the life of your system.

We can argue over preventing failures and I don't disagree, that's a whole other discussion but what we know for sure is depending on the maintenance you do or not, will have an effect on how long your system lasts. You can have what you think is a perfectly running unit, cooling the home just fine and have an electric bill that "looks" good but your system may not be running not as efficient as it could so you may be wasting money on excess energy exceeding the $200/year you could have spend making sure it's running efficiently. It's possible. I think out of all the discussion we have been having, this is the main point. And you can't know for sure unless you take some measurements because If your not testing, you are guessing.

There is no end to the amount of money you can spend on periodic and preventive maintenance. If 12 months is acceptable and six months is recommended then three months is better yet. I can clean my own drain line but if it is not *professionally* cleaned then I'm at risk of it clogging within the next week. The washable filter I use is certainly not as good as the expensive filter on Amazon but even that is not as good as the OEM version. I could wait 20 years for the unit to become degraded but rather than take a chance that it is going to fail I should replace it at 15 years. And it goes on and on and on.

Benefit-to-cost when cost=$0 is immeasurable. The unit *is* going to fail sometime but I'll bet there are is no data to show how much time you will gain by spending $3,000+ on professional inspections.

These units require some minimal care and feeding. Replace the filter at recommended intervals. Flush the drain line once per month or be prepared to vacuum out a clog when it occurs. Have a spare capacitor ready or replace it every few (3? 4? 5?) years before it fails. Perhaps open the unit and spray cleaner on the evaporator coils or put an algicide tablet in the drain pan.

Beyond the steps above, the cost of inspections (not even maintenance, just inspections) increases greatly with little to no return. My unit is now 11 years old. If I had paid $150/year for inspections I would have $1,650 worth of assurances that the unit is still running fine. Yes, I was told once that the capacitor was out of spec but even had I not replace it, it still might be running fine.

Peace of mind is worth something, perhaps $150-$200 per year. If it makes you feel more comfortable to have someone check the unit, great, there's nothing wrong with that. But your fears are not my fears and while there really was a zebra running around downtown Murfreesboro that doesn't mean I should expect to see one in the Villages.

You are correct that I am guessing. But, as an engineer, I do a certain amount of inspection and maintenance. If something doesn't seem right, I would call a technician.

I have a vehicle that cost 6 times as much as my HVAC system. I change the motor oil, tires, and brakes. That is all. To me, preventive maintenance is designed to make money for the people who sell it, not the customer.

There was another thread where people were recommending maintenance on a water heater. This is an appliance that costs about the same as a microwave oven. Definitely not worth maintaining.

M&S Air Conditioning is running a promotion, $59 for a A/C tune up. No description of what they do for the $59 but that's the cheapest I've seen here in the Villages.

It's interesting, yesterday I saw a YouTube video of a HVAC tech who does some side work for his neighbors. This guy seems to have a lot of experience in the industry. He told a story of when he serviced his neighbors system which was 8 years old. He measured the capacitor and it was good. Just a little rusty. He did all his work then 2 weeks later the neighbor calls that the system stopped running. He goes back only to find the capacitor failed and he had to replace it. He was very upset because the system was 8 years old with the original capacitor, so he wanted to recommend that it be changed. But because it tested good he didn't try to convince the neighbor to change it. So now after a couple of cases like this, he tells his residential customers to just go ahead and change the capacitor and contactor every 5 years whether they need it or not. I forget which area of the country this tech was working but I feel here in the Villages where we use our A/C most of the year either for cooling or heat that this may be good advice to prevent an unexpected outage on the hottest day of the year.

Well, this thread has prompted me to buy a spare USA made capacitor to go along with my spare Tankless Gas Water Heater Ignitor Coil.... :loco: