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Talk of The Villages Florida (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/)
-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   LPS -- Lightning Protection Systems -- Disappointed with Statement of Work (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/lps-lightning-protection-systems-disappointed-statement-work-351596/)

Altavia 07-24-2024 06:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2352345)
If we are just talking about houses, there are about 70,000 houses in The Villages. So, 1/100 would equate to about 700 houses with lightning protection systems. I have only seen one house with a system in my neighborhood.
Correct, need more coffee...

Post #12 contains an estimate from one of the local installers.

PhilR 07-24-2024 06:41 AM
FWIW I called Triangle and A1

A 1 returned my call last night during dinner. Very nice person apologized for late call. They had 63 calls yesterday alone. The estimator does a route rather than making individual appointments. I will receive a proposal via email and can call back for more info after.

Triangle also very nice. They have all the floor models and use satellite imagery of each home to prepare a bid rather than coming out. He spent a good 20 minutes on the phone w me and said call back if more questions after I receive proposal.

I have heard both firms are good.

Lightning 07-24-2024 06:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by villagetinker (Post 2352143)
If I recall correctly, the is UL requirement for the installation of these systems, I have never heard of the inside the attic arrangement, and I would have concerns about the use of aluminum cables. I would go to the UL website and see what they have available to guide the consumer on these installations.

I found a link to start with:
Code-Compliant Installation of Lightning Protection Systems | UL Solutions
The national standard on lightning, NFPA-780, permits either aluminum or copper braided cable with typically 28 to 32 strands. Copper is a better conductor. If you have to remove the system to re-roof it can be re-installed. This may or may not be true for aluminum depending on the age. If you have a lightning system and need to re-roof have your lightning system installer lay it back and then re-install it after the roof is completed. This is not the job of the roofer.

KJ Dave 07-24-2024 07:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSteph (Post 2352117)
After so many documented lightning strikes, I decided to research the installation and cost of LPS.

I initially talked to a neighbor and he described how they are installed, which contrasted with what I see around The Villages.

I watched some Youtube videos and saw the installation in the attic with the only protrusions being the Rod Thread through the roof and the connectors and wires running inside the attic in the trusses. I liked the concept of the clean and permanent install.

I even watched videos where it was done in existing homes in the Central Florida area.

I liked the idea of not having wires attached to the shingles -- potentially causing abrasions to the shingles in the wind, and also not being strapped down to the roof with screws through the shingles, membrane, and wood roof panels.

My spouse got quotes from the 2 major installers in the area, and 1 from Orlando that was featured in This Old House episodes.

They all want to do an On-Top Roof mounting of all items. They told my spouse that it limits protrusions into the roof. Maybe I'm missing something, but strapping down the Rod Holders, the Connections, and Wires seem to be holes in my roof -- each a potential for leaks.

Anyway, I like the idea of a Copper Install in the Trusses that would last longer than I will last.

Some of the quotes were for Aluminum and also an option for Copper.

One quote indicated that the Aluminum was a disposable item at each Shingle Replacement.

All quotes indicated Roof-Top install with required removal and reinstall at Shingle Replacement.

I just felt deflated that this didn't match the Youtube videos of the clean install in the roof. One of the vendors suggested that they could do an In-Roof install during New Contruction, but not afterwards.

For those of you who might consider LPS, and those of you with an opinion. Am I justified in being skeptical of an installation with All-parts on the shingles?

By the way, being skeptical of whether LPS is worth the expense is a whole other discussion.

Big Steph
It’s important to note that these LPS’s DO NOT prevent a strike, rather they provide a safe path to ground in the unlikely event that your home is hit. If money were no object for me, I’d have one installed for GP, but at this point the odds are with me. Some say that it increases the risk of your neighbor getting hit, but I can’t find any real documentation of that. It’s a crap shoot really.

Wondering 07-24-2024 07:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSteph (Post 2352117)
After so many documented lightning strikes, I decided to research the installation and cost of LPS.

I initially talked to a neighbor and he described how they are installed, which contrasted with what I see around The Villages.

I watched some Youtube videos and saw the installation in the attic with the only protrusions being the Rod Thread through the roof and the connectors and wires running inside the attic in the trusses. I liked the concept of the clean and permanent install.

I even watched videos where it was done in existing homes in the Central Florida area.

I liked the idea of not having wires attached to the shingles -- potentially causing abrasions to the shingles in the wind, and also not being strapped down to the roof with screws through the shingles, membrane, and wood roof panels.

My spouse got quotes from the 2 major installers in the area, and 1 from Orlando that was featured in This Old House episodes.

They all want to do an On-Top Roof mounting of all items. They told my spouse that it limits protrusions into the roof. Maybe I'm missing something, but strapping down the Rod Holders, the Connections, and Wires seem to be holes in my roof -- each a potential for leaks.

Anyway, I like the idea of a Copper Install in the Trusses that would last longer than I will last.

Some of the quotes were for Aluminum and also an option for Copper.

One quote indicated that the Aluminum was a disposable item at each Shingle Replacement.

All quotes indicated Roof-Top install with required removal and reinstall at Shingle Replacement.

I just felt deflated that this didn't match the Youtube videos of the clean install in the roof. One of the vendors suggested that they could do an In-Roof install during New Contruction, but not afterwards.

For those of you who might consider LPS, and those of you with an opinion. Am I justified in being skeptical of an installation with All-parts on the shingles?

By the way, being skeptical of whether LPS is worth the expense is a whole other discussion.

Big Steph
Save your money!

PoolBrews 07-24-2024 07:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crash (Post 2352336)
They are allowed but yes you would need arc approval. There are ones you wouldn’t even know are metal if you didn’t see the install.
The only place that I know of that metal roof are allowed is over in Orange Blossom. I know they are not allowed in our Villas. In addition, while insurance companies will not drop you due to the age of the roof, they will charge you more due to the cost of the roof.

I had a metal roof in GA, and it was one of the best roofs I've ever had. We had a huge hail storm, and it dented the roof so bad that insurance replaced it. Looked like someone took a ballpeen hammer to the entire roof.

CybrSage 07-24-2024 07:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Altavia (Post 2352215)
Because?

This is one of the reasons they use braided cable as it will present the minimum impedance to the event.
Not to nitpick, but it is not impedance, it is resistance sometimes, depending on how it is stranded.

The main reason to use stranded in a LPS is for the much higher heat dissipation of it vs sold strand wire

Gettingoutofdodge 07-24-2024 08:04 AM
Get lightening rods
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crash (Post 2352333)
The systems don’t really stand out much for you to see them unless you look closely. I believe A1 told me they have installed over 3000 systems. If you have gas and the distribution header is in the attic in the garage strongly suggest you rethink not having lightning protection.
I used A1 and I feel safe during a thunder storm. Danny and crew installed them a year ago and I have never had any problem with roof leaks. He will come to your house and explain everything to you and answer all your questions and concerns.

When it’s time to replace the roof, Danny told me that they will remove and reinstall the rods for $500.

jrref 07-24-2024 08:05 AM
5 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by KJ Dave (Post 2352365)
It’s important to note that these LPS’s DO NOT prevent a strike, rather they provide a safe path to ground in the unlikely event that your home is hit. If money were no object for me, I’d have one installed for GP, but at this point the odds are with me. Some say that it increases the risk of your neighbor getting hit, but I can’t find any real documentation of that. It’s a crap shoot really.
At the end of the day, Lightning is unpredictable. There is no way to anticipate if your home is going to be struck, damaged or destroyed. The Villages Lightning Study group documents lightning strikes here in the Villages. We have data to show many strikes happening to homes near golf courses or in a general areas when you look at the strikes on a map. This data is not definitive but interesting to look at.

So here is the deal. Getting a system or not is totally dependent on you tolerance for risk. The typical cost for a system is $2,000 to $3,500 depending onthe size of your home and the number of peaks, etc.. If you feel it's worth taking the risk of loosing all your personal belongings and maybe even your life, then do nothing. If you have the money or can plan for the expense then get a system to significantly lower your chances of a life altering event. Also, since the address of the recent strikes in Sunset Pointe and St. Charles are listed in the Villages News, I strongly suggest taking a ride to take a first hand look at these now destroyed homes. Attached are some pictures of recently destroyed homes to put things in perspective.

LuckyS 07-24-2024 08:13 AM
Triangle and A1 seems like the way to go. Besides price what has been the reason to choose one over the other?

retiredguy123 07-24-2024 08:13 AM
I understand that a lightning protection system may save your life, but homeowners insurance will cover the damage shown in the photos.

Altavia 07-24-2024 08:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredguy123 (Post 2352423)
I understand that a lightning protection system may save your life, but homeowners insurance will cover the damage shown in the photos.
True, but it takes 2-3 years to rebuild.

Altavia 07-24-2024 08:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CybrSage (Post 2352388)
Not to nitpick, but it is not impedance, it is resistance sometimes, depending on how it is stranded.

The main reason to use stranded in a LPS is for the much higher heat dissipation of it vs sold strand wire
Correct from a DC current perspective.

But is the current induced by lightening:

1. AC
2. DC
3. Both
4. Neither

mrf6969 07-24-2024 08:35 AM
A-1 Lightening did our copper install in 2018. No leaks.

jrref 07-24-2024 08:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyS (Post 2352422)
Triangle and A1 seems like the way to go. Besides price what has been the reason to choose one over the other?
They both do basically the same quality work. I would go with the cheaper estimate and or the one that can install in your timeframe. Basically, no difference.


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