Talk of The Villages Florida
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Talk of The Villages Florida (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/)
-   The Villages, Florida, General Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/)
-   -   Purpose of street easement (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-general-discussion-73/purpose-street-easement-114264/)

8notes 05-13-2014 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueash (Post 876788)
Florida Community Association Journal

I post this as it claims that xeriscaping is not Florida Friendly landscaping and has a great number of references as to what landscape provisions and goals are being regulated. Here is the law:

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

“Florida-friendly landscaping” means quality landscapes that conserve water, protect the environment, are adaptable to local conditions, and are drought tolerant. The principles of such landscaping include planting the right plant in the right place, efficient watering, appropriate fertilization, mulching, attraction of wildlife, responsible management of yard pests, recycling yard waste, reduction of stormwater runoff, and waterfront protection. Additional components include practices such as landscape planning and design, soil analysis, the appropriate use of solid waste compost, minimizing the use of irrigation, and proper maintenance."
blueash, this was a great post, thank you for the links. I was reading the first link from the Florida Community Association Journal, and it appeared the homeowner's association involved formed a team of experts - legal as well as horticultural, and came up with guidelines for homeowners: "Using suggestions from the horticulturalist and irrigation designer and the Nine Principles of Florida-Friendly LandscapingTM, the team designed several lawn templates for owners to choose from for Florida-friendly landscaping using turf and using no turf."

They also revised their guidelines to fall in line with the new Florida state law.

Interesting.

Jayhawk 05-13-2014 06:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonanza (Post 877010)
Rules, regulatons, by-laws, or whatever else you want to call them, are all written before one house is ever built within a community. They are usually taken from a compilation of other HOA documents and there are specific attorneys who often write them. Our documents are much more involved because the developer rules here and it is either his way or the highway.

However, having been in real estate for 30 years and been involved with many associations, I have never known an assocation that did not make changes to their documents, as the years went by. The proper word is "updating" and all documents need to have this done periodically.

It is not unusual for a homeowner to question or want to make a change that is not within the docs because, frankly, many of the rules are archaic and some never even made sense when they were created. Many times the rules simply have to do with the creator's ego.

I think your reference of people "pushing the envelope" to "curcumvent the rules" is a little exaggerated. Homeowners just want to make some changes to make their property reflect their taste, even though it may not be good taste in someone else's eyes. That's why we have the ARC.

No disagreement with what you wrote. But following procedure to make changes to reflect personal taste is not at all what I was referring to. That is EXACTLY what everyone should do. That is NOT what many of the posts in this thread are calling for. And yes, if you take the time to re-read, you will see some that specifically state they have or will push the envelope.

As for me, I knew this was a community with detailed and specific guidelines. It's why I bought, and it's why I remain. Trust me, if I didn't like it I would move.

As it applies to the dog issue, there are literally dozens of wildlife species in Florida that inhabit and poop in our yards (List of mammals of Florida - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). They are not all here in TV obviously, but some are. No one picks it up and I have yet to read a complaint about it. What I do see is 99% of the pet owners DO pick up after their pets. Those few that don't should be called out, no question.

I guess having lived in other large, relatively affluent communities and never having heard or read complaints about people who DO curb their pets (though certainly I did about those who failed to), this aggravation at those who do seems strange to me.

But it's another beautiful day in The Villages. Think I'll go play golf :a040:

Lovey2 05-13-2014 06:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdawg (Post 876827)
If they told me that I would be parking my golf cart on their lawn and driving my car across their lawn
Hahaha!! Let's just say I have some ideas percolating should it become an issue. Like where I'll empty my litter box. :1rotfl: This thread has been very interesting tho. Apparently the woman I spoke with was right in some respects. I'm glad Kitty asked the question...we've all learned a lot here I think. I think I'm on one of the smallest lots in TV, so I'm not even sure I own my front door, at this point!!

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 07:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovey2 (Post 877035)
Hahaha!! Let's just say I have some ideas percolating should it become an issue. Like where I'll empty my litter box. :1rotfl: This thread has been very interesting tho. Apparently the woman I spoke with was right in some respects. I'm glad Kitty asked the question...we've all learned a lot here I think. I think I'm on one of the smallest lots in TV, so I'm not even sure I own my front door, at this point!!
If we all have equal rights to the areas between homeowner lot and street, it solves parking problems for parties. People who come to parties can all parallel park on neighbors' driveways and turf. (This is a ridiculous idea, I know)...I think we should respect and stay off each others property that we don't own, period.

Lovey2 05-13-2014 07:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 877041)
If we all have equal rights to the areas between homeowner lot and street, it solves parking problems for parties. People who come to parties can all parallel park on neighbors' driveways and turf. (This is a ridiculous idea, I know)...I think we should respect and stay off each others property that we don't own, period.
Wish we had a "like" button on here.... :)

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 08:22 AM
Synopsis of thread:
-there is an area between street and house not owned by homeowner. in my case, 15 feet. (as Carl says, look at your site plan or plat)
-none of us who've posted so far know who owns that area or what rights pertain for the public or the homeowner.
-developer has an easement on 4 sides of most homesites, in my case, 10' on street side.
-easement legally means developer may access and utilize that area as needed in future for utilities, etc. easement does not convey rights to the public.

Questions we can't answer:

-who does own the 15 feet in front of my lot?
-does the public have rights as if they owned that area since I do not own it?
-what rights and responsibilities do I have for that area?

example of implications: I do not own the 15 feet of my driveway nearest to the street. Do both the public and i have equal rights to utilize the driveway between my garage and the street? (this question is posed only to get to the bottom of property rights, as a hypothetical)...

-subtopic...one poster says some dog owners claim rights of access and toileting dogs on the areas of turf not owned by homeowner. I'm against it, because my dog's urine is a weapon of mass destruction.
-subtopic...Fl has new law incorporated (apparently) into new Village deed restrictions to encourage Florida Friendly Landscapes promulgated by UF.

TheVillageChicken 05-13-2014 08:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 877066)
thread synopsis:
-there is an area between street and house not owned by homeowner. in my case, 15 feet. (as Carl says, look at your site plan or plat)
-none of us who've posted so far know who owns that area or what rights pertain for the public or the homeowner.
-developer has an easement on 4 sides of most homesites, in my case, 10' on street side.
-easement legally means developer may access and utilize that area as needed in future for utilities, etc. easement does not convey rights to the public.
-questions remain:
who does own the 15 feet in front of my lot?
does the public have rights as if they owned that area since I do not own it?
what rights and responsibilities do I have to that area?
example of implications: I do not own the 15 feet of my driveway nearest to the street. Do both the public and i have equal rights to the space between my garage and the street?
-subtopic...one poster says some dog owners claim rights of access and toileting dogs on the areas of turf not owned by homeowner. I'm against it, but my dog's urine is lethal.
As far as the dog poop goes, both Marion and Lake County have ordinances that address this.

Lake:

It is a violation of this section for the owner of any animal to fail to exercise sufficient care and control of his or her animal and the animal commits any of the following acts:

Deposits solid excreta on public or private property other than the property of the owner or person in custody of the animal, without the authorization or consent of the property owner, unless the animal owner or person in custody of the animal immediately removes and properly disposes of the excrement.

Marion:

an owner shall prevent a domestic animal from becoming a nuisance. The department of animal services may impound a domestic animal creating a nuisance. A nuisance includes but is not limited to:

A domestic animal that defecates on public or private property other than the owner's property.

Sumter does not address the issue in its County Code, so if you live there, poop away.

Warren Kiefer 05-13-2014 10:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 877066)
Synopsis of thread:
-there is an area between street and house not owned by homeowner. in my case, 15 feet. (as Carl says, look at your site plan or plat)
-none of us who've posted so far know who owns that area or what rights pertain for the public or the homeowner.
-developer has an easement on 4 sides of most homesites, in my case, 10' on street side.
-easement legally means developer may access and utilize that area as needed in future for utilities, etc. easement does not convey rights to the public.

Questions we can't answer:

-who does own the 15 feet in front of my lot?
-does the public have rights as if they owned that area since I do not own it?
-what rights and responsibilities do I have for that area?

example of implications: I do not own the 15 feet of my driveway nearest to the street. Do both the public and i have equal rights to utilize the driveway between my garage and the street? (this question is posed only to get to the bottom of property rights, as a hypothetical)...

-subtopic...one poster says some dog owners claim rights of access and toileting dogs on the areas of turf not owned by homeowner. I'm against it, because my dog's urine is a weapon of mass destruction.
-subtopic...Fl has new law incorporated (apparently) into new Village deed restrictions to encourage Florida Friendly Landscapes promulgated by UF.
That frontage area is a Right of Way, in our case either is or will be owned by the County in which you live. There are areas like this along State highways and of course is the property of that State. The public DOES NOT have any particular rights to this ROW. Property owners do have access and egess across the ROW to their property. Recently the big issue with the wall on the orginal side, the ROW played a role. To get back and forth people wre using the ROW property. It wasn't long before the State of Florida stepped into the fray and stopped the golf carts from driving down the ROW....

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 10:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren Kiefer (Post 877113)
That frontage area is a Right of Way, in our case either is or will be owned by the County in which you live. There are areas like this along State highways and of course is the property of that State. The public DOES NOT have any particular rights to this ROW. Property owners do have access and egess across the ROW to their property. Recently the big issue with the wall on the orginal side, the ROW played a role. To get back and forth people wre using the ROW property. It wasn't long before the State of Florida stepped into the fray and stopped the golf carts from driving down the ROW....
Warren, I would be grateful to have a resource supporting what you have said.
:)

Indydealmaker 05-13-2014 11:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 876975)
There may be, but need not be, an easement along the front of a piece of property. Easements are usually, but not necessarily, along the back of the property. There are also usually easements along the edge of the property abutting the neighbors property, which will also have an easement. All these easements are to facilitate getting gas, water, electricity, cable service, etc. into your house.

The utility easements are not available to the public for their use.

There may be an easement along the front of your property, but this is not the justification for the public walking on "your" lawn.

The fact is (as you note) that your front property line does not extend to the edge of the street. When a developer plats a new development, he retains ownership of the area from the front property line to the street (and the street) so that he may put in utilities before the utility companies become involved. Then, because at some point the developer wants to withdraw, he conveys ownership of that property to the County.

If, in your case the easement is in the front it may be that it was impractical to put the easement in the back. An example of this would be houses that back directly on a multi-modal path along Buena Vista. You will see houses that have birdcages built right up to the wooden fence that is probably the property line. There is no space for a back easement on those lots.

As I often say.........check your individual plat map.

The part that seems to trouble most people is that they are responsible for properly maintaining the strip of property from their front property line to the street and they cannot charge people with trespassing if they walk on it.

I can't answer your question about imperfections in your driveway that is not on your property. It may be that maintaining your driveway is in the same category as maintaining your lawn---you have to do it even though it is not on your property. See what your documents say.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, down in Tampa my front sidewalk suffered major upheaval from oak tree roots and the County came in and repaired the sidewalk because my property line ended on the house side of the sidewalk.

But, my only point, reaching back to my first entry in this discussion is that property lines do not extend to the edge of the street. The area from the property line to the street (usually 10 or 15 feet) is available to the public. Not because it is an easement, but because it does not belong to the property owner.

-----------

Incidentally, when the developer proffers the property, including the paved roads, to the county, the county is not obligated to accept the offer. The offered property must be up to county standards for the county to accept ownership.

My church in Tampa offered the county several hundred yards of paved roadway to be a connector between a dead end street and a major highway. The offer was initially refused because the very expensive and ornate street lights we had installed were too close to the road. We had to remove them all before the roadway was accepted.
Carl,
My site plan shows an easement on the front, the back and a special easement down one side. I am surrounded!

Indydealmaker 05-13-2014 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonanza (Post 877010)
Rules, regulatons, by-laws, or whatever else you want to call them, are all written before one house is ever built within a community. They are usually taken from a compilation of other HOA documents and there are specific attorneys who often write them. Our documents are much more involved because the developer rules here and it is either his way or the highway.

However, having been in real estate for 30 years and been involved with many associations, I have never known an assocation that did not make changes to their documents, as the years went by. The proper word is "updating" and all documents need to have this done periodically.

It is not unusual for a homeowner to question or want to make a change that is not within the docs because, frankly, many of the rules are archaic and some never even made sense when they were created. Many times the rules simply have to do with the creator's ego.

I think your reference of people "pushing the envelope" to "curcumvent the rules" is a little exaggerated. Homeowners just want to make some changes to make their property reflect their taste, even though it may not be good taste in someone else's eyes. That's why we have the ARC.
Any provisions included as a deed restriction can only be changed by the originator of the deed prior to its first transfer. Apparently, state law can supercede that. However, I believe that is a slippery slope. Homeowners often make an investment decision relying on the deed restrictions as a primary factor in their purchase. When the state forces a change in deed restrictions, it is very much like exercising eminent domain.

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 11:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indydealmaker (Post 877130)
Any provisions included as a deed restriction can only be changed by the originator of the deed prior to its first transfer. Apparently, state law can supercede that. However, I believe that is a slippery slope. Homeowners often make an investment decision relying on the deed restrictions as a primary factor in their purchase. When the state forces a change in deed restrictions, it is very much like exercising eminent domain.
Oh there you go, thinking again and pushing our noodle buttons.Maybe the new law is grandfather thing? sigh...can somebody look it up?


Nevermind, I looked it up..my mother raised a monster. She sold encyclopedias. No grandfathering....law says adopt new ordinances or amend existing ones.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/.../0373.185.html

(2) Each water management district shall design and implement an incentive program to encourage all local governments within its district to adopt new ordinances or amend existing ordinances to require Florida-friendly landscaping for development permitted after the effective date of the new ordinance or amendment. Each district shall assist the local governments within its jurisdiction by providing a model Florida-friendly landscaping ordinance and other technical assistance. Each district may develop its own model or use a model contained in the “Florida-Friendly Landscape Guidance Models for Ordinances, Covenants, and Restrictions” manual developed by the department.

TheVillageChicken 05-13-2014 12:43 PM
Let's say someone exercises their right to enter the section which the property owner is responsible for but does not own. Let's say they get injured. Who do they sue?

mickey100 05-13-2014 02:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 877133)
Oh there you go, thinking again and pushing our noodle buttons.Maybe the new law is grandfather thing? sigh...can somebody look it up?


Nevermind, I looked it up..my mother raised a monster. She sold encyclopedias. No grandfathering....law says adopt new ordinances or amend existing ones.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

(2) Each water management district shall design and implement an incentive program to encourage all local governments within its district to adopt new ordinances or amend existing ordinances to require Florida-friendly landscaping for development permitted after the effective date of the new ordinance or amendment. Each district shall assist the local governments within its jurisdiction by providing a model Florida-friendly landscaping ordinance and other technical assistance. Each district may develop its own model or use a model contained in the “Florida-Friendly Landscape Guidance Models for Ordinances, Covenants, and Restrictions” manual developed by the department.
I contacted a legislator and was told the Department of Environmental Protection Welcome | Florida Department of Environmental Protection (DEP) has a 52 page booklet that outlines all the do's and don'ts on the subject. I'd contact them to get the facts.

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 03:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey100 (Post 877237)
I contacted a legislator and was told the Department of Environmental Protection Welcome | Florida Department of Environmental Protection (DEP) has a 52 page booklet that outlines all the do's and don'ts on the subject. I'd contact them to get the facts.
In my opinion, that would be a step backwards and toward generalities from what has been carefully crafted on the back of DEP guidelines and given us in the simple and understandable Nine Florida Friendly Landscape Practices.

Carl in Tampa 05-13-2014 03:53 PM
Plan your landscape.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 877133)
Oh there you go, thinking again and pushing our noodle buttons.Maybe the new law is grandfather thing? sigh...can somebody look it up?


Nevermind, I looked it up..my mother raised a monster. She sold encyclopedias. No grandfathering....law says adopt new ordinances or amend existing ones.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

(2) Each water management district shall design and implement an incentive program to encourage all local governments within its district to adopt new ordinances or amend existing ordinances to require Florida-friendly landscaping for development permitted after the effective date of the new ordinance or amendment. Each district shall assist the local governments within its jurisdiction by providing a model Florida-friendly landscaping ordinance and other technical assistance. Each district may develop its own model or use a model contained in the “Florida-Friendly Landscape Guidance Models for Ordinances, Covenants, and Restrictions” manual developed by the department.
You hit on the law, but that is not the section I would quote.

Your original intent was to learn what you can do about landscaping your lawn.

The pertinent section, it seems to me, is:

(b) A deed restriction or covenant may not prohibit or be enforced so as to prohibit any property owner from implementing Florida-friendly landscaping on his or her land or create any requirement or limitation in conflict with any provision of part II of this chapter or a water shortage order, other order, consumptive use permit, or rule adopted or issued pursuant to part II of this chapter.
(c) A local government ordinance may not prohibit or be enforced so as to prohibit any property owner from implementing Florida-friendly landscaping on his or her land.

Let's go back to your original intent. You wanted to know what you could do with regard to landscaping your lawn.

It seems to me that you might want to work up a proposal of what you want to do to landscape your yard, using "Florida-friendly landscaping" principles; submit it to the ARB and let them know up front that you know that the law allows you to do Florida-friendly landscaping.

There's lots of information on the Internet about what plants to use in Florida-friendly landscaping. There are also a lot of photos of what others have done at https://www.google.com/search?q=flor...iw=800&bih=499

Carl in Tampa 05-13-2014 04:29 PM
Make a plan.
 
To Kitty and everyone else interested in Florida-friendly landscaping. (FFL)

Years ago I was appointed by the governor to a term on the Southwest Florida Management District (Swiftmud) and as was pointed out by Kitty, Swiftmud was mandated by law to encourage FFL.

I decided it was a worthwhile initiative so I installed a lot of Florida-friendly landscape plants at my house at that time, and reduced how much I watered the lawn.

To me, one of the best documents being offered by Swiftmud is the brochure found here http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/public...tguide-web.pdf

It is incredibly detailed and is just one of many documents on the Swiftmud list of free publications relating to FFL. Free water conservation publications and materials

My favorite of the nine principles of FFL is Number 5.

Numbers 2, 4 and 8 brought me to the point that I hardly had to water the lawn at all.

A word of caution might be in order. Although the ARB cannot foreclose the use of FFL plants, they might still have a voice in the aesthetic application of the various plants. One shouldn't assume that they could just run over the ARB. Careful and artistic planning would be in order.

Indydealmaker 05-13-2014 04:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheVillageChicken (Post 877166)
Let's say someone exercises their right to enter the section which the property owner is responsible for but does not own. Let's say they get injured. Who do they sue?
Provided that the resident/owner of the home is required to maintain that strip; and provided they are negligent in doing so in such a manner that constituted a hazard; both the home owner and the statutory owner of the land would get sued, probably along with the Developer and God, Putin and Obama.

downeaster 05-13-2014 04:48 PM
Original post was "Purpose of Street Easement". It has morphed into "Florida Friendly Landscape".

Both are valid subjects for serious discussion. It may be worthwhile to spin off FFL into a dedicated thread.

Carl in Tampa 05-13-2014 05:01 PM
Natural Morph
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by downeaster (Post 877287)
Original post was "Purpose of Street Easement". It has morphed into "Florida Friendly Landscape".

Both are valid subjects for serious discussion. It may be worthwhile to spin off FFL into a dedicated thread.
It morphed as a natural progression when a poster asked Kitty for the motivation behind her original post and she replied that it was because she was wondering what standing she had for landscaping the area of the front lawn that was not technically hers. It was her desire to do landscaping that was "xeriscape and hardscape."

The wandering off subject has more to do with the preoccupation with dogs toileting on the lawn near the street.

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 05:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by downeaster (Post 877287)
Original post was "Purpose of Street Easement". It has morphed into "Florida Friendly Landscape".

Both are valid subjects for serious discussion. It may be worthwhile to spin off FFL into a dedicated thread.
FFL does merit a dedicated thread, indeed.

EnglishJW 05-13-2014 05:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa (Post 877281)
To me, one of the best documents being offered by Swiftmud is the brochure found here http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/public...tguide-web.pdf

It is incredibly detailed and is just one of many documents on the Swiftmud list of free publications relating to FFL. Free water conservation publications and materials
Thanks Carl but the link wasn't working for me. I hope this one does: Florida-Friendly Landscaping

I went back and tried your original post again and it did work - sorry.

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 06:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EnglishJW (Post 877317)
Thanks Karl but the link wasn't working for me. I hope this one does: Florida-Friendly Landscaping
That is one fabulous book!! I have a hard copy. Starts with how to plan a landscape then has oodles of plant pictures with info on specifics of what the plant needs, how big it gets, etc.

perrjojo 05-13-2014 07:15 PM
I think this whole thread has been convoluted and made far more complicated than necessary. It has added to confusion. Just submit a plan to arc and see what happens. Check with arc and cdd if you feel you have trespassing problems. As the ATT add says...it's not complicated.

kittygilchrist 05-13-2014 08:08 PM
at least my name is simple, perrjojo! the thread was indeed convoluted and it evolved and educated me far better than I imagined as the OP; however there was a master plan from the start to get that education, however sidestepping the original topic may seem, with a minimum of misinformation and the predictable fallout re: some things that got discussed. I appreciate your contributions. I think the plan worked nicely.

As to your comments about submitting a plan to ARC, I'm not one to submit a plan without research. I'm still gathering data.

tigger_kitty 07-07-2014 01:35 PM
We have a Villages installed water line pipe that is leaking into the street. We were told that the water line access runs under can run under driveway to the valve box. (easement)

We and many others have paid Thousands of Dollars to try and improve our homes and neighborhood with decorative coatings to our driveways. All "The Villages" is "required" to do is restore it back to grey cement, not match the rest of the driveway, thus negating our investment.

Just wanted to inform all of you people who have waterfalls on easements or decorative driveways what can easily happen. Be prepared!

I am furious. Any advice?

buggyone 07-07-2014 01:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigger_kitty (Post 903999)
We have a Villages installed water line pipe that is leaking into the street. We were told that the water line access runs under can run under driveway to the valve box. (easement)

We and many others have paid Thousands of Dollars to try and improve our homes and neighborhood with decorative coatings to our driveways. All "The Villages" is "required" to do is restore it back to grey cement, not match the rest of the driveway, thus negating our investment.

Just wanted to inform all of you people who have waterfalls on easements or decorative driveways what can easily happen. Be prepared!

I am furious. Any advice?
Check with your homeowner's insurance to see if it possibly might be covered - but it most likely is not covered. Try anyhow and you might luck out.

Other than that, you had improvement done over an easement. The Villages is entirely in the right.

kittygilchrist 07-07-2014 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigger_kitty (Post 903999)
We have a Villages installed water line pipe that is leaking into the street. We were told that the water line access runs under can run under driveway to the valve box. (easement)

We and many others have paid Thousands of Dollars to try and improve our homes and neighborhood with decorative coatings to our driveways. All "The Villages" is "required" to do is restore it back to grey cement, not match the rest of the driveway, thus negating our investment.

Just wanted to inform all of you people who have waterfalls on easements or decorative driveways what can easily happen. Be prepared!

I am furious. Any advice?
Thanks to you for a nugget of wisdom.

Polar Bear 07-07-2014 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by buggyone (Post 904007)
...you had improvement done over an easement. The Villages is entirely in the right.
I feel bad for you, but buggyone is correct.

tigger_kitty 07-07-2014 02:14 PM
How many feet is the front easement?

Polar Bear 07-07-2014 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigger_kitty (Post 904020)
How many feet is the front easement?
You should check your plat to be certain.

tigger_kitty 07-07-2014 02:38 PM
It shows 3', but the VCCD guy is saying it is 13'

tigger_kitty 07-07-2014 03:18 PM
The plot plan shows 3' but the restriction paper says 10'. HELP????

denise adams 07-07-2014 03:28 PM
Easements
 
OK, first my credentials. I bought right of way easements for GTE in Michigan. We bought easements to build our facilities (telephone lines) on privately owned property. Easements within TV are exactly as one post said, for the placement, maintenance, and repair of utilities (gas, water, sewer, power, etc).
The power company, gas, and other non-Village owned utilities must get permission to use TV easements. Almost everyone in most every State has a utility easement at least in the front of their home and may have one all the way around the home. Nothing permanent can be placed on that easement which is typically 5 feet from the property line between houses and may extend as much as 32 feet from the center of the road (not the edge) in front of the home.
And no, easements (once recorded) are not going to go away. Once the easement is obtained its a permanent access for the person/organization who obtained it.

downeaster 07-07-2014 03:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigger_kitty (Post 904020)
How many feet is the front easement?
The front of your house faces a right-of-way.
Easements are usually in the rear of your house. You own the easement but the utilities can access it and use it. If you were to build something permanent in an easement they can remove it.
The right-of way in front of your house is not owned by you. It usually extends in 13' from the curb.
See kittygilchrist's post (#39) at
https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...25/index4.html
It is the best explanation I have read on this subject.

Warren Kiefer 07-07-2014 03:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittygilchrist (Post 876131)
the question is what is the purpose of the easement in tv and facts about whether the easement remains the property of the homeowner. I don't mean to be mean, but only facts, and evidence of the sort that would hold up in court, please.
an easement as we have in the villages is not complicated.. The easement dimensions are not all the same, you would have to review the layout for your particular lot. The purpose is simple, it gives utilities the right to enter the easement area to install and/or maintain the utilities located within that easement. The only downside is, if the property owner has perhaps done extensive landscaping work within the easement ans a utility problem develops, that landscaping is subject to being destroyed without compensation to the property owner. You cannot receive and evidence from this forum that would hold up in court. That information can only be gleened from data that is part of your legal explanations contained in your purchase of the property agreement.

kittygilchrist 07-07-2014 04:26 PM
Oh dear, I am sorry for your trouble.
The street side of your property will have a right of way which belongs to the county. That is the part that is likely the longer distance. But that is not a utility easement. That is for the county to be able to expand the roadway.

On my property, the street side right-of-way it is 13 feet. Of that 13 feet, 10 feet is also a utility easement. The utility easement is available to the villages to repair or expand utilities as needed.

Unfortunately, many of us buy property with the assumption that we own everything that has grass on it, not realizing that we are required to maintain property which does not actually belong to us.

From my research, I've concluded that you do not own the property on which there is a right-of-way, you do own the property on which there is an easement with the exception of that on which there is also a right-of-way. Nevertheless, where there's a utility easement, The entity who have easement which is upon your property, has the right to make repairs and amendments as needed to accomplish their purpose of providing utilities to the whole community.

Your situation is a good reminder of the possibilities that exist for right-of-way and easement issues to affect the homeowner. Many of us choose to upgrade and enhance our properties, not realizing that situations such as yours could arise.

tigger_kitty 07-07-2014 04:35 PM
They violated their own right away/easement by building the driveway then!!!

mgcsooner 07-07-2014 07:01 PM
To the OP, I think the explanation you are getting is probably from a real estate agent re a preowned home. I'd also enlist a Village Sales agent as they are better versed on this, at least as it applies to the villages. I know becasue we just bought in the same area and had many similar questions. I'm not pushing them versus the other though.

Anyway, as far as the utility easements, these are civil (city) agreements for franchised utilities to utilize. You cannot put any vertical structures on them, although you can put landscaping on them. Living in four other states it has always meant they (the utilities) have a right to dig up the area to repair and in some cases install new services, such as fibre optic cables. I have NEVER seen where they do not repair the area to its prior state. They would probably not want to repair landscaping but instead drill under to avoid it. While they are not obligated to repair extensive landscaping, it't really rare that they would leave it damaged. Individuals can also grant other individuals legal easements, but there is no guarantee it will be grandfathered onto future property owners. Easements can also be vacated, even in unusual cases utility easements. One property I almost bought (we had a penning survey) found the corner of the house had been built by the original builder upon a utility easement. In such a case getting the city to vacate it was a simple matter, although I must say, we decided again buying that house.

Setbacks are more HOA/PUD etc restrictions that govern site building requirements for given lots for the purpose of maintaining homeowner value. In most cases they are defined in the covenants for the development, that guarantees they will be maintained for present and future buyers. Your HOA or in this case the ARC committee will go after you for violations as they would damage the property values of both you and your neighbors if they were not enforced.

Disclosure, I am not a real estate attorney, or attorney of any kind. This should not be thought of as any type of legal opinion. :)

Polar Bear 07-07-2014 07:06 PM
I suggest you figure out for certain the basic information you need. Right-of-way and easements over and adjacent to your property will be shown one of two places, possibly both...1) your plat; 2) a separate instrument that would be recorded in the county clerk's office.

You must have this information to know for certain your situation. These documents will include the layout (exact dimensions, etc.) of the right-of-way and easements and describe what is allowed in these areas. In almost no cases will the property owner be allowed to put anything in the easements, even though he owns the property "under" the easement. The right-of-way is not owned by the adjacent property owner, so of course the adjacent property owner can build nothing there.


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